Project Ten Dollar - EA Campaigns Against Used Games - Extra Credits

EA announced a "Project Ten Dollar" initiative that discourages used game sales, but this actually hurts consumers rather than used game-retailers. How can we fix the problem of revenue distribution to benefit players and developers alike?
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(Original air date: September 29, 2010)
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[@JamesR624]

"The problem is that they're going about this like an evil empire." Well, how do you expect EA to go about it other than doing the only thing they know?

[@Sharkakaka]

They are not acting as an evil empire... They ARE an evil empire.

[@WrathOfMega]

The problem with that is that, even if it is cheaper, people are just going to hate paying for the game twice.

[@coollary1]

WrathOfMega Nah! Look at Last of us. A lost of people bought it even though it cost 60 on launch. But less then 30 percent played the multiplayer when it came out. It's an option you don't need to complete the game's main story line. But the ones that did pay would be directly supporting the Developers

[@nomadicvoxel5670]

+WrathOfMega Well, kinda. I wouldn't mind actually. Take the guy who doesn't even know if he wants the game, for instance. Would you rather pay $30 and then maybe pay $30 more to play more, or $60 if it might not be all that awesome?

[@Interesting_Failure]

+WrathOfMega Good advertising can mitigate this. Sure if it was just announced out of the blue it might seem annoying, but publishers have a huge "this game is now cheaper overall" angle they can push when advertising the change.

[@mcmurray121]

+WrathOfMega Plus in this way, it is more economic for the few that intend on just playing the campaign in turn of the multiplayer, or even the additional offline modes. Just paying to unlock the online mode while keeping the game a little cheaper, but in turn gaining mildly more profit than you would by pumping the retail price, you allow for higher budget games and allow for people to have more free will.

[@Ratty524]

+WrathOfMega What EC is proposing, however, would be a lesser of two evils. As long as the bonus content you get for a game is optional, you could easily save up and pay to unlock that bonus content at a later date. That way, you'll feel like you haven't forked over an arm and a leg just to buy one game while still giving money back to the people responsible for getting games out there to begin with.

[@CowfaicdRealm]

Probably one of my favorite endings ever to an EC episode xD

[@jan_h]

The pencil should look out of place! Like 3D or Realistic

[@CowfaicdRealm]

Jan Hasebos I agree!

[@BedlamsStudios]

BIGGEST LOL EVAH!!!!!

[@CowfaicdRealm]

I see it as a funny way to end a short episode, even if he didn't have anything more to say.

[@Wintercat1]

***** The artist, Alice, is the one who has the greatest workload per minute of video out of the three of them. Once James has the research done, writing another few minutes on a five minute video isn't really a big deal. Obviously it's fairly easy for Dan to talk longer, and from personal experience I know that the main thing increasing video length does to his editing time is increase render time and whatnot. Alice has to generate something to look at for every additional frame in the video, however. So, they try to keep the videos short for her sake.

[@FUNKe]

But this is one of their shortest videos which is what confuses me

[@SrSeed]

You should make TF2 content, you might get somewhere

[@Splicer-lb5xb]

​@@SrSeed His latest video has 1.5M viewers lol

[@linkxsc]

"Professional Sales Analyst" *Shows picture of Eve Online*. I see what you did there. Don't think I missed that.

[@cowponySyfexou]

+Linkxsc I don't get it

[@linkxsc]

cow pony Eve Online is relatively known for its vast complex economy and how far players will go to get an edge. Its also highly realistic (ignoring the whole, spaceships part) when compared to other MMO economies also, because theres just 1 server, and aside from limited specific things, the severe majority of items in the game come from player production (and mining and such). "Professional Sales Analyst" might actually be an understatement by what some groups do in game.

[@cowponySyfexou]

Linkxsc This fanbase is awesome.

[@AlexaDeWit]

+cow pony Spreadsheets Online is a pretty excellent MMO.

[@abculattera4446]

+Alexa DeWit Spreadsheeeeets!

[@Antenox]

Man, I love Extra Credits, but these early videos had SO MUCH MORE personality

[@JonatasMonte]

+Antenox That's the course of things.

[@Milkra]

Yeah. The new extra credits feels so robotic :(

[@018712470]

2-6 years. Maybe they're out of joke.

[@Homiloko2]

I disagree. These early videos to me look more like a bunch of ramblings and opinions rather than facts. Newer videos provide much more solid content.

[@coryray8436]

I am of the opinion that "ramblings and opinions" have more "personality" than "facts" do.

[@lunavarion]

The ending alone is worth a like. XD

[@JonatasMonte]

+Lunavarion That's not why I gave you that pencil.

[@lunavarion]

JonatasMonte I was actually going to give this video my first dislike for this channel, but that ending saved it.

[@Fritzafella]

Ha Haha ikr

[@tasoganedude]

+Lunavarion Yup, I missed the days where the Extra Credits team were fun people...

[@zyaicob]

ADORABLE!

[@Levian-Durai]

Ugh, I hate this topic with a pasison. Yes, game developers are getting severely screwed over with used games. Hell, even us gamers barely get a deal, with used games now being literally only $2-4 cheaper than a brand new game here at Eb Games in Canada. So yea an unlock code or something makes sense. But think back to the days of SNES, or N64. What happens when they no longer sell those games? Eventually, online service for our PS3's and 360s will stop, I mean look at the Wii store shutting down as proof of that. When this happens, all of our games that you need to download a patch to fix a game breaking bug, or download a Day 1 DLC so you can play the full game that you paid for is no longer available. I don't know about everybody else, but I have a SNES, NES, N64, Gamecube, Sega Genesis, and I LOVE playing those games to this day. I want to be able to do the exact same with my PS3 10 + years from now, when PS5 or PS6 is out

[@davidgzmn12345]

Then buy physical copies new when available or the game used when its no longer available for legal purchase.

[@OatmealTheCrazy]

***** That's asking a bit much for average consumer.

[@TNickGuyPerson]

im still trying to wrap my head around that EB games is still here in the world

[@Spaghetti775]

-"money they deserve" -"EA" jokes here on extra credits

[@Siliccan]

Money they deserve.. nope they dont you would be paying them twice if thats the case

[@epicfurry2127]

This is downright ridiculous. Why do game publishers get to be special snow flakes and get a cut of a used product, when literally no other industry does that? Why don't I give a movie publisher money every time I buy a used movie? Why don't I give money to a musician when I buy a used CD? Lets also remember that I can go buy a used copy of any game basically before the PS3 era, and get a full game. Even with your proposed "solution" you'd kill used game sales in the long run and in the end destroy gaming older than one or two generations for good. A game needs to be released completed, finished, whatever. DLC needs to only be extras that aren't required. Game publishers aren't special, they're in an entertainment industry just like those that publish books, movies, and music, they don't deserve money from gamestop because gamestop decided to sell some of the games the STORE has gained ownership of and has nothing to do with the publisher anymore.

[@Microsizeme]

+Epic Furry Books, music, and movies cost nowhere near as much to create and have significantly more negotiating power over their distribution retailers than is the case in the video game industry. Not that it really matters these days, since online distribution has rendered most of this moot.

[@mewantbrains]

+Epic Furry Exactly it would be like me buying a used car and having to pay Holden if I want the steering wheel to turn

[@mewantbrains]

It was an example of the logic they are trying to use in this video

[@mewantbrains]

As I said Still an example of the logic used in this video Once someone pays for the game then the company doesn't deserve to get paid for the same game twice Fuck that

[@HighSkiez]

You shouldn't compare other industries to the gaming industry. Games are an entirely unique product. A game company has to keep its servers online. If people are going to leech off their servers for YEARS with used copies, they're gonna lose huge amounts of money. Also, those game companies have customer support. They need to get paid too. Why the hell should customer support help you when you're not even paying them in the first place? Games are more of a service than a product. Netflix is a service, Hulu is a service, cable TV is a service, and Steam is a service. The term "used" doesn't apply to services. You can't get a "used" Netflix. Why should you be allowed to get a used game?

[@notbobby125]

Alright Extra Credits you need to do an update on this topic, particularly covering the replacement of "project ten dollar" with preorder bonuses. Now, instead of customers who bought the game used are having a chunk of the game locked away, now anyone who didn't buy the game BEFORE IT WAS RELEASED. Some just lock away special cosmetic skins with preorders, which is annoying doesn't actually effect the game in anyway. A few games bundle in previous games in the series, such as the new Rise of the Tomb Raider having the previous installment as a bonus, which I think is fine, although of questionable worth to the people who would likely preorder Rise of the Tomb Raider, I.E. people who already played and enjoyed the last game. Then we get into the problem area in what I like to called "time exclusive content." You preorder to get some exclusive right to some piece of content first. Preorder to get a pass to the beta, or this "free" piece of DLC before anyone else wants to. The worst was in the new Star Wars Battlefront. If you preordered the game, you got the same blaster pistol that Han Solo used in the movies as soon as you boot the game up. This blaster also happens to be the single most powerful gun in the entire game, being a sidearm that does immensely lethal damage at close range. While it could be unlocked by everyone, it sits at the very bottom of the progression system. For the first day or so, the only people with this massively overpowered weapon were those who preordered. Finally we have the lowest tier, the outright exclusive preorder content. Characters like Goro in Mortal Kombat X, mission pack in Arkham Knight, even special exclusive gun in Assassin's Creed Syndicate. More and more, it feels like you cannot buy a complete gaming experience for $60, unless you buy it blind before any chance of reading reviews or hearing word of mouth.

[@brodown64]

+notbobby125 dlc's are the new super mario bros reskins

[@LexiLunarpaw]

Then you get ripped off with the Pre-Order skins... i remember i actually Pre-Ordered JWE2 because they had Vehicle Skins based off of The Lost World and i was hoping for the actual Vehicles from the movie... instead i got green Jeeps and Helecopters with The InGen logo on the side...

[@JoelJames2]

Favorite ending to an Extra Credits video. I also like how the Technical Difficulties slide has each person using a "weapon" associated with their role: Allison has a paintbrush and palette for her role has the illustrator, James has two pencils for his role as the writer, and Dan has a...microphone...thing...for his role as narrator.

[@helpfullprogrammer]

I don't agree with the idea of a 'tax' to the game developers for used games. You don't expect it when you buy a new car, you don't expect to pay VAT (in England) twice. Double taxation is actually refundable! I just get the feeling the game industry is becoming greedy in this respect. If they spend so much money on a title and complain they don't get enough revenue, that's their business model that is flawed, it isn't our fault. It's almost on par with victim blaming. Spend less on development, or put prices up. Easy? Or am I missing something?

[@libinwang2267]

helpfullprogrammer Personally, I think that companies spend too much on development of games in many cases. That's not to say that some games would be as good without that focus, but that many could be made without focusing on that extra amount of graphic quality. Indeed, there are many indie game companies out there with very little revenue, but that doesn't really apply to AAA games or any really big company, really. However, the prices on games in many areas is already extremely high, like the Modern Warfare 2 example at $60. Do you really think raising the price would help to increase revenue? In my opinion, any above that would result in a decrease in people buying that, because spending that much for a single game is somewhat ludicrous in reality. Who wants to spend $80 for a game that could potentially be in the used isle for a lot less. Do game publishers really want a $x increase per purchase that could result in hundreds, maybe thousands of people not actually buying the game or buying the used version with $0 given to the publishers instead? I probably wouldn't do that. Also, for your point about a tax for used games, well, when they sell a used game, the producers get nothing. To me, it's more of paying respect to the game producers. Since the prices are lower, then more people are inclined to buy used as time goes on. That translates into less funds overall for the producers. Admittedly, the games are overpriced, but that only means more would be willing to buy essentially the same game for a lower cost, supporting my point previous. Since we are buying the producer's game, regardless of used or new, shouldn't we pay something to the producers? Well, another way that this could potentially be resolved is if retailers gave some money to the producers when people buy used games, but this has not occurred as of yet. Also, the economy and market are focused on greed, so saying a certain market is becoming greedy is a little redundant, if you ask me.

[@Khrene]

+helpfullprogrammer _If they spend so much money on a title and complain they don't get enough revenue, that's their business model that is flawed_ whuch is literally what is being suggested a change in business model. Sell a game at 35 bucks, and on disc dlc for 20 bucks. now only 35 bucks is being split with gamestop instead of 60. The gamers then save 5 bucks and that extra 20 all goes to the game devs and publishers instead of to gamestop _It's almost on par with victim blaming_ Which is why EC said dont take it out on the customer, that we aren't stealing from them. _Spend less on development_ See Watch Dogs, Assssins Creed Unity, and Sonic Boom _or put prices up_ Do you really want to pay 70 or 80 bucks for a single game? Also they have to split more with gamestop. Why raise the pricepoint 10 bucks to get back 5 or 6 when you can cut out the middle man, lower the price and make the same return of 5 or 6 bucks, therefore sslling more units due to a lower price?

[@getlost8027]

>"Do you really want to pay 70 or 80 bucks for a single game?".....................Do you think we aren't? After DLC costs for stuff that probably should have been in the game, 70 or 80 dollars is CHEAP. Hell, I've paid that much for a couple of collectors editions at LIST.

[@lonewaffle231]

the ending ahaahahah😂😂😂

[@jacobpridgen2145]

ikr

[@claytonanderberg9118]

ya really lol

[@starfyre59]

I miss alison

[@yaumelepire6310]

Yep!

[@vulduv]

did you notice that james had writing pens, daniel had a... thing. that shoot a sound ball? and allison had a pensil. funny lite refrence to what they do.

[@TheRedneckGamer1979]

If I buy a used car from a dealership zero of those dollars go to the company that researched developed and made that car, and cars cost quite a bit more than games to develope. Why is this even a thing?

[@jaimytourigny3027]

Intellectual property vs physical, education PLZ

[@jesternario]

out of all of the vids I've watched from these folks, this is the one I've watched most often. I've done so because the ending is hilarious.

[@leonidas14775]

Day one DLC: Making paying customers PAY for paying

[@maxcoseti]

"When you go to Gamestop and buy a used game, 0 dollars go to the publisher" If the game is *used*, then the publisher already got that money, because someone had already bought it, what happens afterwards shouldn't concern them really Also, you believe them giving free DLC on day 1 feels like a ripoff, yet suggested that they should charge extra from something that's already *on the disk*? how does that work exactly?

[@TheMisteriousX]

Ok lets see if i can explain the logic in this video to you first of yes the publisher already got the money for the copy from customer number 1 but if customer number 2 now buys the copy customer number 1 bought preaviously then that means the publisher just halfed his actuall profit of that copy if you scale that up and say 1/10 of all gamesales are used sales than the publisher effectifly lost 10% of the profit he could have made with that game to the 2nd point DLC on day 1 requires you to download the DLC whether you like it or not while the original customer that bought the game "just" needs to put up with the code and the time it takes to install the DLC the person that bought the game used also needs to pay extra to access the game he just legally purchased it like sayingthe new car cost 10000 dollars and the used car costs 5000 dollars and you only get the keys for it if you pay 500 dollars extra to the salesman the method EC proposed would leave you feel less bad about it since the game itselfe would be cheaper (and almost half price if you only play singleplayer) and everybody has to pay the same amount to access multiplayer whitout adittional downloadtime i cant really think of a good analogy for that one but im sure you get the idea^^

[@Cudgeon]

Yeah, but why do you want to pay money to gamestop instead of the gamedeveloper? If you want to pay the gamedeveloper nothing you can already pirate it. Or buy it from a friend..

[@maxcoseti]

TheMisteriousX Oh, thank you for your mansplanation, what exactly prompted you to explain in such detail such irrelevance to my point? "sayingthe new car cost 10000 dollars and the used car costs 5000 dollars and you only get the keys for it if you pay 500 dollars extra to the salesman " It's not like that at all, and even if that were the case, how is locking the passenger and rear seats in a new car, then charging the customer if he wants to use them (when they are already on the car) any better? If anything, your dumb analogy resembles more Extra Credits' proposed "solution" than day one DLC

[@maxcoseti]

Cudgeon Do you know what I DONT want? It's corporations, regardless of how much I love (or sometimes hate) their products, trying to redefine and restrict what ownership means, and that type of talk does exactly that, yeah, I dislike my money going to Gamestop as much as everyone else, but to use that to justify anti-consumer ideas and policies is disingenuous at best, buy from a friend? absolutely, I would even prefer trading games with friends, because we are sharing more of our common interest that way, but the type of policy you are defending wouldn't even allow for that, and no, pirating is *nothing* like buying a used game, because, like I said in the beginning, developers already recieved money for that particular copy of that particular game, and ownership of that copy had to be renounced in order for me to have it

[@tentavision13]

He TOLD YOU how it works, why don't you WAIT AND LET HIM EXPLAIN BEFORE HUMPING ON HIM. Jumping, I meant to at jumping, I swear!!!!

[@VideoGameFreakW97]

I get his ponint, but this is all pretty much a non-existent problem now that we all use Steam and shit.

[@sheepdefence2935]

KC97 don't forget, this is made 2 years ago

[@herogamer555]

foong kok jun Steam existed before 2 years ago.

[@herogamer555]

But a large majority of game sales are for consoles so...

[@VideoGameFreakW97]

herogamer555 Yeah, I get that. But the 'problem' with used games is going away - everything is going to digital purchases now, so it won't ever be 'worse' than now.

[@TooCooFoYou]

Not all, keep in mind that there are people who don't play PC and prefer to play consoles than PCs.

[@JRRacing64]

"Physical" used games are like most everything only made once. The value of the "object" changes over time. Like a used car. No one cries that car makers are loosing out on profits because people buy used cars instead of plopping down money on a new car. Clothes makers to cry that thrift stores steal a bit of their market because people choose to buy their old products there. So why should game makers expect to gane revenue back from a product that is produced once. If they want to control the market they should just go all digital.

[@armoureddanger]

well, because you don't have "car DLC" now, do you. And yes, care companies ARE lsoing money, because so many people buy used cars, personaly I don't give a shit, but the people losing thier jobs, do.

[@fredriklindof8608]

armoureddanger Well, no cars do not have DLC (as of yet). However, cars break down and need spare parts. In fact used cars are statistically more prone to break down, and when they do the consumer has the choice to either switch car or buy spare parts. The manufacturing and distrubution of these parts are what enables the car industry to earn money even on cars already sold. Now this comment is in no way intended to defend the game industries choises. I do not game much and I do not keep up with the gaming world, but i felt compelled to point out this unseen part of your argument.

[@OatmealTheCrazy]

Welp, cars are more a necessity nowadays rather than a luxury so it's already nearly a guarantee you'll buy one (assuming America here), and, as someone mentioned, they keep making money off of used cars from parts sales, so eventually they can make even more money from the used car than the new one. For most cars also, designing doesn't cost millions. They have a lower overhead from that. The fashion industry has sheer rapidity/rabidity going for it along with the necessity factor. (See how well not buying clothes instead of not buying video games goes for you.) There are millions of people who just go around buying anything recent for thousands of dollars sometimes on name alone.

[@NochEinMensch]

***** then write them that they should make games with kickstarter or open a donationsites...or even better write them that you love there game, talk with others about that game and increase the fanbase instead of throwing money out of the window because the developmentteam will not see alot from you 10 dollars

[@DarkKnightofHeaven]

An interesting statistic is car dealerships don't make most of their money selling cars. I can't find where I got it but its a single digit number where like 9% of what they make is through selling cars. They make all their money on parts which you have to buy from the dealer regardless. That's why you get some deals that seem kind of crazy and you can get what are like 50,000 dollar vehicles for free. They want you to have the car so they can charge you for parts to the car down the road. It doesn't always work 100% of the time, hence your new engine costing what may be a fourth of what you paid for the car and half of its current value despite only being a single (albeit important) part of a machine with hundreds of parts. They get their money as long as you have the car basically.

[@johnjohnson3457]

Kill the retailers. Sell the games directly. It's not that difficult with this medium, you can sell it cheaper, and make more money.

[@myrec8883]

+Stephan Phillips Look, you just found Steam. Have a nice day.

[@johnjohnson3457]

Steam is still a retailer.

[@myrec8883]

+Stephan Phillips Ok, so Origin, Battle.net, UPlay etc. ok there are these platforms from publishers.

[@johnjohnson3457]

Yes, and lets take the absolute worst of these for example. Origin sells the entire Mass effect series for 15 bucks, 35 bucks after buying DLC (more than you get on steam), they keep 100 percent. Steam sells 1 and 2 for 35 bucks (sales excluded) and keeps 40 percent after cost, which means EA gets less on every sale, and we pay the same cost as 3 games for 2. Now of course EA sucks in everything it does, but that's just EA. I buy their shit on steam, if at all, because I know it fucks them over.

[@lancelindlelee7256]

+Stephan Phillips Steam is a ot better than Gamestop though. Let's say both are $60 at launch. 40% to Steam will be $24. Dev will get $36. No platform royalty, CoGS will be $1 and will likely be part of the $24. Returns will have no cost as well

[@derlukas8182]

i don't think that the extra payment for features that are allready on the disc i a good idea: if a game gets old, and u only can buy an used version of the game, it might be possible that the publishers allready shutdown their servers, bc servers eat money

[@ev3rything533]

omg, I laughed so hard at that ending, please do more funny stuff like this in your vids. I loved it

[@Paelidore]

I don't pay for a car company to re-install a new specialized ignition. If I buy a used car, the dealership doesn't owe the car manufacturer anything. Why is this different for games?

[@Paelidore]

I can compare how products are priced, but let's use a similar idea. I buy a used computer with, say, Windows 8.1 already installed. Should Windows charge for my not buying their product but still legally owning their software? What if I bought a copy of it from a friend with a legally reuseable key to activate it? The product was sold. That copy of the product is no longer the developer's but the consumer's.

[@Paelidore]

Again, it doesn't matter that it won't "affect" it. That's how it's currently done. Buying used products with pre-installed software (in this example, Windows) is almost identical to buying a used game. You don't need to re-install the key to use Windows. Or, heck, movies, are yet another example. Used video stores of old never had to pay any special royalties to those media companies, why are games different? Why isn't selling regularly new content just a normal thing for video games as it is for other media? What makes it special? The answer is nothing, really. Charging someone extra for a used game is much the same as demanding royalties for buying a used copy of The Godfather from a garage sale. I'm sure had those companies had the technology, they probably would have done it, but at the same time, it doesn't mean it's okay nor should it be accepted. EA, the game company discussed in the video, is one of the largest grossing video game companies on the planet, if not THE largest grossing video game company on the planet. It has absorbed countless major selling titles and holds the exclusive license for several franchises. It makes millions in profits annually, so why wring out the extra ten dollars for the product they've already gained profit on? There's not really a solid reason that doesn't fairly fit as it would with other media forms. You are correct that video games are a unique form of media, but then again, so is radio to television to movies to plays. These forms have adapted and made large profits as well as making titanically successful industries that video games are most assuredly also becoming. They don't need the extra money, they just want to be rewarded multiple times for the same initial transaction. That's called double dipping, and it shouldn't be smiled upon.

[@spsproos]

Vincent Morebucks Then comes the time you want to re install Windows and you need to type in the key.... And the parts last as long no matter who owns them. I would never buy a computer used, because some assembly errors can take a long time to manifest. Cars have first-party parts, Microsoft has a market orders of magnitudes higher than games and the prices about double. Movies? Cinema, larger market. Music? Live performances. This isn't just apples and oranges, it's the whole fruit basket.

[@MrMarinus18]

+ObviouslyARhino What about other IP based product looks books and movies? I do believe they can be sold without further payments to the publisher.

[@jameskearney2507]

I don't think publishers deserve the money from the purchase of a used game. They have already made the money for that specific copy and therefore don't need it when it is resold.

[@KjdInTheHouse]

That ending though

[@christiannorton9400]

Ladies and gentlemen, THAT'S how to end a video.

[@JonatasMonte]

+Christian McCoy I need someone with a pencil.

[@Obbliteration]

You forget one thing. Not everyone buys used games from gamestop. Their prices are terrible. I always buy from ebay from private sellers.

[@yaumelepire6310]

I mostly buy games through Steam Sales? So... is it any better?

[@MrSeventyAce]

Yes, it's much much better. Games on sale give the normal ratio to everyone, just a lesser amount. You get a cheaper game, and the dev's/publisher actually end up with more money because you weren't going to buy the game anyway. One of the ways digital distribution is saving the industry

[@yaumelepire6310]

Jacky Adcock, Good, now I can sleep on both my ears.

[@spiffersthegrand]

Not to mention the fact that the Publisher saves money as well by you buying any digital copy, because they don't have any additional costs on their end for selling you the game - they didn't need to make a CD/DVD, Case, Instruction Manual or anything else that goes with selling a game. They just let you copy the information that's already there, and Steam (or GOG or Humble or whatever online distributor you're using) keeps track of what games you own and can download in the future

[@deafweasel99]

I love the friendly fun atmosphere you guys had back when you started like this, you still have it, it's just rarer these days.

[@gabrielphillips5338]

I am fully prepared to listen to you talk for another hour on this subject.

[@sciverzero8197]

Costa del Sol was a perfect choice for the technical difficulty music.

[@lunarahunter4870]

Often times $10 is the entire discount I get on a used game, or even less depending on how recent the game still is.

[@JonatasMonte]

+Lunara Hunter That's why I love steam, you buy the game brand new in a sale instead of a little bit cheaper for being used.

[@GamingVel0city]

steam is a good example of new games costing less, with no cost to produce,distribute,platform cost. im not sure but i think steam only takes 30%

[@mcpepa]

best ending in all episodes XD that was priceless

[@stealthbeastgaming]

"Now, hang on just stick with me" Me: (sprinting in the opposite direction)

[@JovialSkunk]

>Not enough time >Episode ends in under 5 minutes >Fucking wat

[@notsocoolguy9551]

That ending had me laughing so hard XD

[@Yabe_uke]

Whenever I see this topic I always find there's one thing missing that people seem to forget' if the game is second hand, that means it was bought brand new at one point. Then resold and put on the used section of a store. So, the developers already got their money for that copy of the game. I don't think it's morally ok to get money for something you already got paid for. I see your points, they make sense, but trying to get infinite money for a single copy of your game is just being greedy.

[@jaimytourigny3027]

In facts, you are the one missing out some informations. Most of the profit on first buy goes to their affiliations, like transportation, CD printing, advertising, and even the retailler. Little profit actually goes to the team. Second, the game itself is an intellectual property, while you talk about the physical support (cd), the profit that goes for the team doesn,t correspond with the CD at all, but with his CONTENT. So maybe the CD has been paid first, but the intellectual property is never paid with second hand resales, only the retailer does make a profit. Therefore, the team must pay their affiliates for EVERY COPY PRODUCED, wich mean that unsold new copy are a waste, and every copy only pay once, whatever how many people use it, wich is NOT how intellectual property works at all. Therefore, you can make a calculation of a team profit like this : Profit = New copy solds - Cost of total copy produced. This has NOTHING to do with how many people actually played the game. And you dare saying infinite profit? The team only get a fraction profit (sometimes around 15$), and that profit is actually divided by the number of time this game is bought used. Buy moving the team profit from retailing price to unlockable content, not only the retail price drop by the team profit, but that profit become relatable and accurate to the actual player database. Where in your calculation did you count infinite people would buy the game? Each player has only to buy it once, no matter how often the game is bought and sold again, while still only having to pay for the CD production once if brand new. Your point is completely irrelevant :/

[@Talonrod]

love the "Allison Diaz you put that pencil down no GET AWAY!" gets me every time

[@0x777]

Sorry, but nope. Just no. Games are now the ONLY medium where the manufacturer deems himself entitled to getting any money out of second hand sales. If I sell my car, Volkswagen will not see a cent of that money. Why? Because they already got their share when I bought it from them. Same for everything else, or do you think your architect or bricklayer gets anything out of you selling your house? And don't think it's any different for any other content. Me selling one of my old music CDs gets the artist how much again? How much did Lucas get out of me dumping my remastered Star Wars collection (thankfully zero, what I gave them for it was already more than this redone rubbish was worth). The point is, why should games get special treatment here? If a game maker tries to circumvent the first sale doctrine, I will eliminate them from the pool of companies I buy from. And I neither buy used games nor do I sell games I own. I just hate it when companies try shit like this.

[@0x777]

Garrett Thomas Since when do I have to use a sleazy used car vendor? I can advertise my car and sell it myself. Why shouldn't you do the same with games? Actually I would simply watch the ads and wait for "my" game to show up. That's basically what I do on Steam now. I put games on my wish-list and as soon as there's a sale, I buy it. Yes, that means I wait a month or two sometimes, but then again, why not play something else in the meantime? I can resist the urge to HAVE to play something RIGHT NOW.

[@0x777]

James Coleman Take any other industry. Take music. They are basically in the same boat, a product that you can use for a while without causing reasonable wear and tear. What about them? I can't remember them getting the idea to demand a cut of used CD sales, and let's be honest here, the music industry has not been shy when it comes to trying to fleece its customers.

[@alfredwinchesterjr]

Because buying the music puts the music in a more convenient and legal format than how you probably discovered it. You cant really listen to a game on the radio and wanna go out to buy it since a game has alot more than audio to discern it's quality,And is hopefully longer.

[@0x777]

Beastwolf1 ERh... nope. Sorry, but no. No content is easier and more convenient to use than content that has been stripped from the limitations its maker has put upon it. I still have to find a single piece of content that would not gain in convenience from being pirated.

[@Homiloko2]

+0x777 Well, as you mentioned Steam itself is convenient. Most of the time more convenient than pirating, since you need to go through the hassle of finding trusty links, downloading the installer, cracking the executable, then deleting the installer files, whereas steam does it basically with a single click. And they even have great sales. And I believe piracy has reduced a lot since Steam expanded the digital market, and it's saving the industry. Because the retail option is MUCH less convenient than the other two - I'd never go to a store just to buy a game nowadays, and then have to put the disc in to install, and then store the disc somewhere in my house, then put the disc back in whenever I want to play it. It's just a huge hassle compared to digital distribution.

[@zyrchin1192]

THIS IS WHY I LOVE THIS SHOW. Informative, hilarious, and smart back to back to back.

[@intensitydigital]

I don't follow his logic. Yes it is important for a game developer to make money off their game but think of it in a different way. Gamestop isn't doing the wrong thing either. Lets say I built a car and sold it to someone. When he was done he sold it to someone else for $10000. People would be appalled if I went to the person he just sold it to and said "hey you owe be $2000 for buying the car I built." Or if i did the same thing to a used car sales place. After sale the product becomes the property of the consumer and should they choose to sell their copy of the game the money they get is completely theirs and ownership transfers to the next person. Game-stop is just like a used car salesman. It's not their fault they have overhead on the game too. They purchased it from someone else. They don't get these used games for free. It's not "pure profit"

[@markkeilys]

you haven't "sold" a game to gamestop... GS: so you want to sell that game to us? $5 you: but it just came out yesterday! GS: oh in that case $15. so yeah they get like 50-80%profit...

[@intensitydigital]

***** Usually they only sell used games even new ones for 20USD. That is a 75% profit but you also have to consider worker pay, cost of renting the building, franchise fees, cost of merchandise real estate(cost of holding an item), and taxes. They probably only make 30ish % profit.

[@markkeilys]

***** true, but i said profit not net profit, so that is back up into the range i gave... i know technicalities. I only put the 50% for the new ones because i thought they sold those for $30,but if it is $20 thats a 25% profit significantly better.. if i'm right about them buying them for $15. If we were to actually do the math for it all average profit per used game would be ~1.5 times of the cost to get them in stock. -the price of holding the item which is an unknown puts the total % of the sticker price thats profit per used game sold (at this point) at anywhere from .000000% to 59.9999999%. Calculating any further can't be done without considering the sale of new games and new/ used accessories.

[@iHeardYouLiekThem]

Games do not depreciate.

[@intensitydigital]

iHeardYouLiekThem some games do. If a games core feature is the online multiplayer after about 2 years usually the community has left and the game is worthless

[@antoninuslucario5560]

Best ending ever. Changed this early episode from an enjoyable discussion to much more fun.

[@ettinakitten5047]

Why should the developer get money from sales of used copies? They already got money from that copy the *first* time it was sold! Unless it's something that takes ongoing maintenance, like an MMO, but many MMOs are selling game time or are free-to-play. And Extra Credits' 'solution' really changes nothing. It gets rid of a loading bar, that's it. That's not going to make me, as a user, any less mad about getting an incomplete used copy.

[@kameoosama]

Basically, every used sale is a lost new sale, even though the game provided the same value to both users. While I believe that the first sale doctrine is important and there's no reason why individuals should be sending a portion of their sale to Square or Capcom or whomever, it is in the best interest of companies like GameStop to do so voluntarily. Big AAA games like Call of Duty or whatever cost more than a hundred million to make, and that's whether they print one copy of that disc or or 10 million. As it currently stands, Activision or whoever can only make that 100+ million back in development costs back in sales of new copies. Which means as soon the people who've spent 4-6 hours playing the story mode and brought it back for trade-in credit (and there are more people who only play Call of Duty's singleplayer campaign than you think,) start flooding the Gamestop shelves with used copies, those copies basically have to compete with new copies and often the used copies get sold instead. I mean you save like $5, the one "new" copy (if they have one) has been played by the staff anyway and has been gutted, and you get all those stickers to peel off! It's a no-brainer. This all cuts into Activision's profits. Now with Call of Duty it obviously doesn't matter because that thing makes a profit off pre-orders alone, but a lot of small to mid-sized publishers actually feel the squeeze when one of their primary sales outlets is a glorified pawn shop. Lots of developers and publishers like THQ have closed their doors, and while we probably can't pin all of that on used sales, it certainly isn't helping. So if Gamestop wants to get in a wide enough variety of stock to keep people coming into their stores between the new Call of Duty and the new Madden, then it is in Gamestop's best interest to make sure its practices aren't putting undue strain on its supply chain whether they're legally obliged to do so or not. And of course, other large companies that have a used section like Best Buy or Wal-mart should probably do the same, but they don't seem to be pushing used over new to quite the degree that GameStop is.

[@kd7fkd]

kameoosama I understand your reasoning, but I disagree that every instance of a used game purchase results in a lost new game purchase. I don't purchase new simply because I cannot afford it. If I can't pick up a game used or on a steam sale, then I don't buy it.

[@kameoosama]

kd7fkd usually in the period where there's actually new copies of a product to be had the difference in price between a new and a used copy is around $5. If you're actually buying it used to save money you're either not saving all that much or you're buying a copy way later when there's no new stock to be had anyway.If you're doing the former then I sincerely implore you to reconsider (I mean man, $5 more and then the profits go toward a potential sequel right?) If you're doing the latter then that's something totally different and not really an issue. Although if you REALLY like the game then buying something new that developer has out would probably be doing them a solid.

[@Siliccan]

xD this my friends is why i pirate DLC. i buy the game but will always pirate DLC.

[@jaimytourigny3027]

Intellectual property, the game is not the CD, even if the CD cost are refunded on first buy, the team should be acknowledged of their property from EACH PERSON USING IT, wich is not the case when people buy it used, no money ever get the the devs, same for musics, and it is ILLEGAL.

[@TheYoshiOverlord]

There seems to be a pretty obvious logic in this that a lot of people that support used game sales are missing. Selling a used game is NOT like selling a used car. Yes it's been bought and you own it but when you buy a game you are not buying the physical ware, you are buying the EXPERIENCE, an experience that hundreds of artists and coders have put their lives into creating. When you buy used you are gaining access to that experience by buying the physical ware that it's hosted on, without paying the person who crafted the experience. That's why a lot of developers aren't developing for physical media anymore but going straight to Steam or online access, so they can sell what they made without getting sharked by gamestop. Games are a new and emerging media and they can not be compared to selling cars.

[@sisisit10]

It wasn't even that long compared to other videos

[@MurderousJohnny]

Artist lady is mean

[@nervaaugustus7089]

Look EC, the problem isn't "hey I feel punished for buying used" it's "hey I don't want to pay for my game twice." The thing to remember about any used unit sold is that the developers *already have* their share of the money for it. They got their pay for that unit and if Gamestop or some other used-game retailer resells it, they aren't entitled to any more. They need to either take used game sales into their figures, or they need to go after used game *resellers* - not those who buy used games, so that they can get their profit from the resell. Project Ten-Dollar is just taking those of us who buy the game used and gouging more money out of us, and what *that* does is simply encourage us to not buy the game at all, even new. See, more often than not, those who buy a game used are hedging their bets; waiting to see what the game's like by letting the day-1 hype die down, and trying to reduce their investment to get into it by buying used. This game is their evaluation-point for the game, the series if it has one, *and* you as a company. You treat these buyers well, give 'em an awesome game experience and treat them fairly, and who knows, they might have enough good-will and trust from that to get hyped for your next release and buy new. You treat them poorly, by trying to bilk them out of extra money with day-1 on-disc DLC, then it doesn't matter if your game's good; you're a scummy company and the gamer isn't going to want to deal with you. Your next release is probably going to end up cracked and pirated, so that they can play it full-featured without paying you a single red cent. See how that works? Goodwill and trust means a lot in the game industry. You're not dealing with blind sheep; the stereotypical gamer is a savvy buyer and informed about the industry. If a game screws them over, they're going to look at the CD case, figure out who the developer and publisher is, and mentally blacklist their products. Moreover, *they tell friends.* You screw over one gamer, and I guarantee you that you've lost future sales from ten more. EA, in particular, owes its bad reputation in the games industry to this exact phenomenon. Hell, you don't even have to mistreat your playerbase; a publisher mistreating a beloved dev is enough. Hey there, Konami, how's Metal Gear Survive working out for you? Noticed that you deliberately *avoided* mentioning it in your sales reports. Point being, act like a scumbag company, get treated like a scumbag company, and watch your sales plummet as a result. Project Ten-Dollar is definitely acting like a scumbag company, and it's no surprise that EA came up with it.

[@liamborella8977]

It's going for too long? I scrolled down and the first like 6 videos I saw that you made were 7-10 minutes long

[@matteogenoese-zerbi3063]

The issue isn't the company doing it, it's us for buying it.

[@Lugmillord]

Well, having to pay twice would really annoy me, especially when I have to pay digitally. While not a big deal for people who do it often, I hardly ever do that and don't have a credit card so base line, that's very unconvenient for me. And I'm in that category that usually buys the games when they are new, so I don't really want to have that extra effort even if it saves 5 bucks. (Yes, sometimes laziness is worth the money ;P)

[@Homiloko2]

+Garrett he meant the idea from the video where you get the single player game for 30 bucks and then unlock the multiplayer digitally for another 20 bucks.

[@akhannar9368]

Years later, and I still love the ending gag here XD

[@Ashaira]

I miss Alison :|

[@semibiotic]

The problem is, the disk must be enough to play the final game, even years ago. So they *must* provide their DLCs on disks for initial disk owners. Because that is not physical release, if each new disk owner should pay for additional download to get final game. However, even digital release must be able to be sold.

[@Spitestar]

That ending was the best. Omg lol!

[@thriller2910]

that has to be one of the best endings to an extra credits episode i have ever seen.

[@therealbahamut]

just getting around to watching the archives on this channel. Best. Ending. Ever.

[@silvershocknicktail6638]

A lot of hyperbole aimed at Gamestop, exactly as I expected from someone on the developer side of things, but no fair discussion of why Gamestop does what it does. When publishers and manufacturers make it so that Gamestop can't be profitable off new games and consoles, used sales happen. Plus, the automatic entitlement that you so readily assign developers to a cut of used sales exists in no other industry - *why* are developers automatically owed a cut? You never explain this beyond "games are expensive to make", which is a budgeting concern, not a moral or legal one.

[@darkartsdabbler2407]

Silvershock Nicktail ...Why are you siding with Gamestop? What have they ever done for you(besides rip you off)? Obviously you've either been brainwashed or have never been swindled. If it's the latter, well then, you're one of the lucky ones.

[@silvershocknicktail6638]

"Obviously" is such an over-used word, isn't it? I'm not "siding with Gamestop", I'm pointing out that EC's argument is one-sided. The video simply assumes that developers deserve a cut of second hand sales without adequately justifying that viewpoint, and lambasts Gamestop (as a representation of the used games industry) without once stopping to consider why those stores do what they do, or that they basically do nothing on a larger scale that gamers don't do (and demand the ability to do) anyway. In turn, you've done nothing more to address my questions than the video, instead deciding to dismiss me as "brainwashed". How exactly would I be brainwashed by a used games store I never visit, as it doesn't exist in my country? Do you actually have an argument to make, or is the ad-hominem your go-to tactic?

[@darkartsdabbler2407]

Silvershock Nicktail Rather long-winded reply, mate. I have considered why they do what they do, the answer: money. And what do they need it for? to line their pockets and underpay employees to stock shelves. Developers use funding to undergo projects and create new things. Gamestop is not an innocent local small business who believes in treating the customer fairly. They deserve no sympathy. I don't know how you expected me to know where you're from, but as a denizen of North America, I can assure you that they revel in screwing over customers.

[@silvershocknicktail6638]

Again, you're putting forward a one-sided argument. I deliberately said that I was referring to the used sales industry as a whole, not the one company you have a beef with. Yes, they are in business to make money, and so are developers. Please don't pretend that that is not the case to make developers seem like starry-eyed wonderchildren, especially when those pushing hardest for used sales to die are the biggest, nastiest publishers who want that money lining *their* pockets and underpaying *their* employees. You still haven't addressed the moral argument - why does a developer in this industry deserve a cut of a used sale, a cut of a private sale of a purchased property, when this exists in no other industry? You also didn't address why used sales are the focus of a store's sales attempts, rather than new games.

[@darkartsdabbler2407]

Silvershock Nicktail Ever hear of Redwall? It's a series of novels that was converted into an animated television series. Your picture reminded me of it. Anyway, I can't generate a long winded debate about business practice right now as I am thoroughly exhausted. What I will say is this: the people making the games need to say a profit in order to invest in future projects. It doesn't help when one side tries to cut out the other. Ideally they will adopt a superior system in which they can better coexist.

[@mewantbrains]

This DLC crap must die DCS world is the future of this business model the base game is free but if you want the full game you will be paying approximately $700AUD would you pay $700 for a game that cannot be played offline PAID DLC MUST DIE BEFORE IT TAKES HOLD!!!!!!!! KILL IT WITH PLASMA FIRE IS TOO WEAK WE NEED PLASMA TO KILL THIS ABOMINATION!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[@whyeven16]

+Lightning SFTT I don't think it's that bad. Although i have never experienced other countries, except having to pay $29 for a $20 steam gift card.

[@mewantbrains]

You don't think it's that bad? Look at DCS world Look at FSX SE The full game is insanely expensive I remember buying FSX boxed edition and paying $45 for the game plus acceleration pack Now the full game of FSX will net you a few hundred bucks now that dovetail has butchered it DLC should be extra content that is developed and added to the game after its release date Not built into the base game and simply removed and sold for an additional fee on release day

[@JonatasMonte]

+mewantbrains ::| ? Well are you some kind of anarchist communist gamer? Just asking

[@mewantbrains]

I do have some communist ideals but I am not an anarchist All I'm saying is a game should be sold with ALL the components included Not ripped apart and sold separately as DLC Refer to my FSX example above if you don't understand what I mean

[@barkingdoggo3331]

my childhood was watching these. I miss yall

[@pd3331]

I kind of like F2P. Look at What Valve did. Tf2 is free. But they make a shit ton of money of things you don't need like hats.

[@pd3331]

How about... Hats in every game?

[@doct1400]

Priceless Persuader You're gonna need some damn good hats.

[@halfhalo33]

But look what Valve also did... Steam. Its like Gamestop, but better. Most of the money when you buy a game goes straight to the dev/pub, while some goes to Valve. And there are no used games on Steam, only very cheap games.

[@davidgzmn12345]

MilesFan100 I wish there was a vast and plentiful source of free reviews, lets plays and commentaries on games that you could somehow see on a net of interconnected devices on which you install steam. Oh, wait...

[@davidgzmn12345]

MilesFan100 >only works on mmos >TF2 gotta love that questing on TF2

[@mosnii]

"Price and Cost of Orcas" - I love you for choosing that reference

[@Redd2D]

Yes yes, Gamestop is a horrible beast that should be shut down. Now let's make exclusive game DLC and let only Gamestop sell it. Pure genius!

[@Redd2D]

Stratelier You can't complain too much? Why not? That's just as bad!

[@Redd2D]

Stratelier I'm sorry, you're actually in FAVOUR of pre-owned games being banned? You shouldn't be. Also exclusives aren't good things.

[@ralien3066]

Stratelier i know i got gta v it was like 3 pages of licences and technical stuff 1 page of controls and a notes section thats fucking useless has anyone used a notes section before they were probably pretty useful when your save was a password but there not any more a notes section is useless

[@79centsoutofadollar]

Hi. I found your channel about a week or two ago. Since then I've been watching one or two videos every day, starting from the beginning. And so far, yours is the only channel (of about 80 channels I'm subscribed to) that I've watched EVERY SINGLE video of, with the exception of AllTimeNumbers. Your and their channel I've seen every one, from the beginning.....although keep in mind, I've only seen about eight or nine vids total. This very one is the last one I watched, just for a reference point of where I am. Anyway, great vids, great channel! Great job in creating very intelligent, funny, interesting vids.

[@halfhalo33]

This is why I love PC gaming. When we buy something on Steam, most of the money goes to the developers/pub, while some goes to valve, unlike GameStop. Note: Also, buying used is the same thing as pirating, since both of them the pub/dev gets no money from it (and news flash, most people buy used games than pirating them). I'm just putting that out there, before somebody replies to me saying something along the lines of "4l1 PC G4m3rZ P1rat3!".

[@ScipiPurr]

I would argue against that. When it comes to Piracy, everytime someone pirates there are more copies of the game being played. With used, in order for someone to purchase a used game, another must have sold it and stopped playing. With used there is a fixed amount of copies of the game being played. In that sense, it is little more than giving the game to a friend with a middle man (Gamestop) in between making money off of it.

[@LunaLuckyLight]

Scipi That is well and all, but it sounds to me like a lot of this is a misleading argument. Piracy is wrong because developers will never receive any money from a pirated unit, yet the user still receives all the benefit. This is theft of service. Buying used might not give money to the publishers, but they did receive money for the unit at one point in time. Thanks to DLC, players can receive additional content, and publishers meet their quota. To me it sounds like those who receive content for free are committing a very selfish crime.

[@halfhalo33]

Scipi Ahhh, but consoles can also pirate. If I remember correctly couple days after GTA V came out, the X360 version was the most pirated.

[@ScipiPurr]

halfhalo33 I never made any statement saying consoles could not pirate. Only that buying used is not pirating.

[@halfhalo33]

Scipi Well still. One thing they both have in common is that it doesn't give money to devs/pubs. And ppl can copy the disc.

[@erenyeager5480]

6 years later this channel is still going strong.

[@agentdelta569]

instead of having a funny moment you could have quickly summarized (which you almost did) an idea and said something like and i only thought of this over a few weeks im sure you can think of more

[@FUNKe]

Why wouldnt you have time to make the video longer?

[@SrSeed]

At least they dont post once every 3 months like some people am I right ;)

[@webhobo7786]

I play on pc so no used games m8.

[@thecaucasianasian2171]

Just don't buy from G2A or other key resellers

[@webhobo7786]

^

[@sUmEgIaMbRuS]

What's wrong with key resellers?

[@hawkince2130]

My friend you have much to learn

[@sUmEgIaMbRuS]

Teach me then

[@jeremyquentin42]

Wait, so should we go back and add DLCs in books too? I mean, when you buy a second hand book, $0 goes to the publisher/writer, soo... Same for DVDs, CDs, Vinyls, maybe paintings too? Why has it never been a problem for centuries but suddenly it is for video games?

[@assajitjahjadi942]

This episode is great! I like the ending :)

[@vegaman1]

The Technical Difficulties screen may be one of the most awesome things I've ever seen

[@blueokapi8841]

Yay for da humorous ending

[@SteelsCrow]

It was about the artist's workload. Some of their other videos talk about it and make this ending even more hilarious.

[@sawyerpatton2932]

I liked the little skit at the end of this episode. You expressed the concern for time even though this is the shortest episode at this point in the playlist.

[@leatherDarkhorse]

Im not going to pay twice.

[@ashleythomas5420]

5:00 This is the best picture ever.

[@ImTabe]

I like roads and schools too, especially if they are paid for by money taken at gunpoint.

[@ImTabe]

lProN00bl Hey I'm gonna build a skatepark in your backyard, I've sent you a bill for 100 000 dollars. You are free to leave, but I'm still gonna need that money. Oh and when you sell your house I'm gonna take about a third of the money you get. See ya later!

[@shropshirec]

Im Tabe May I also remind you that your tax dollars are helping in feeding murderers sentenced for life imprisonment.

[@WonderTuff]

shropshirec In America, a lot of prisons are privatized. And even if they weren't, holding them in prison for life actually helps our economy too. Someone had to make that food, so those people got pay. Someone has to make the clothes they wear and the beds they sleep on, so they get pay too. It helps the economy, so its not pure evil.

[@WonderTuff]

***** Again, the people who make the things the prisoners need to survive have a job because of that.

[@dakunssd]

+Im Tabe Would you prefer the Russians or Chinese (or ze Germans, ja?) taking your slave labour at actual gunpoint? This can be arranged, dear sir.

[@MrHarumakiSensei]

There's nothing wrong with a second hand market. Gamestop wasn't screwing anyone out of their money. If people know something has value second hand, people will be willing to pay more for the new version. If you know you can sell the game later for 30 bucks, you are more likely to pay 60 bucks on launch day.

[@joncalvert4690]

lol 5 years, and now game stop is dead lol

[@bobbyferg9173]

Just like how Netflix and Redbox killed BlockBuster, Steam and other online game purchasing platforms are slowly degrading the power of GameStop, possibly till death.

[@gamezoid1234]

Jon Calvert eh, I would disagree that it's dead. there are still game stops in ask the same places I used to see them, they're just mostly focused on the console end of things. I'd describe their situation as on life support.

[@the_last_raposa3810]

Jon Calvert and cex is much more responsible

[@OscatJ]

They aren't suggesting on disk dlc as it is today, they are suggesting that you almost only buy the important part of the game for a reduced amount and you can pay for extra features like multiplayer if you want to, with it ending up cheaper for you and more profitable for devs, it will also drive down the price of used games so they can compete with new releases, this system is a win for everyone

[@PabloNeirotti]

HAHAHA best ending ever

[@polytongue5714]

There was an ad for an EA game before I started this video.

[@Sindroms23235]

It is rather interesting to see how the environment changed since q1 2012. I came back to look at this video after watching the one where you guys discussed how games should not cost 60$ anymore and I am glad that you did not remove this episode due to its now outdated information because of it. Cool beans.

[@powerbot2001]

Gonna be honest, the stuff that happens in the USA also affects me and people from other countrys. Where i live, there's like, next to none used games. And we also get screwed over...

[@SapphireLeto]

I love those last few seconds. I watch the funnier ones when I'm having a bad day and this is my favorite.

[@eddinged3284]

well, GTA V has sold 34 million units on PlayStation 3 and Xbox 360 combined. current-gen GTA V sold 1.84 million units in November alone. my guess is that PC numbers are going to be even higher then current-gen consoles. Activision Blizzard, Inc. has a steady profit around 500M$ per year. good games and profit, maybe there is connection somewhere.

[@FerralVideo]

I find a certain irony in "games should cost less but have more DLC" alongside "games need to cost more" in the playlist.

[@JadeyCatgirl99]

GameStop having to give some of the money on a used game sale to the developer would be like a car dealership having to give some of the money from a user car sale to the manufacturer.

[@jarrod752]

A note on roads and schools, we had those before the 1900's when we didn't actually have any taxes paying for them.

[@docpepperclassic]

I work at Gamestop (don't throw rocks quite yet, my store's actually pretty cool and filled with helpful employees) and I can't tell you how much "Project $10" is hurting us; including our employees. Since we're taking in less profit (new games cost more, but 75% of the cash from a new game sale goes to the publisher, as opposed to the 35-50% we pay customers for their used copies), we have less money for payroll. Most of our employees now have to look for 2nd/3rd jobs to supplement their income

[@direwoofles9857]

4:50 really good voice acting. 4:54 EXTREMELY GOOD VOICE ACTING.

[@yvendous]

I don't understand why this episode wasn't as long as it could've been. I was listening.

[@zombiehamburger]

This is a prime example of why digital retail is genius not only do you avoid losing profit over creating/shipping a physical product, you can buy it DIRECTLY from the developers unless using a client (such as steam, which still takes less profit than physical retailers) This also allows for easier distribution of patches, new content, potential community contributions and free TRIALS for people rather than used games. Seriously buy stuff online. Especially for indie devs

[@romanhuczok1474]

The innocent world of 2012, when EA wasn't fully recognised as the evil empire, when games had to be called 'video games' to distinguish them from board games, when Steam evidently wasn't as big as it is today so everyone got their games from Gamestop, when it was actually true that single player games ran out of content, and weren't endlessly given new DLCs... A simpler time, perhaps a more beautiful time

[@kingnothing3523]

4:42 That was hilarious! I was suffocated by the crumbling fourth wall. Seriously, though, may wanna lock that eraser off until an episode needs to be made.

[@MutantAnomaly]

I think incentivizing "new" purchases is one thing Nintendo is doing really well with their games right now. They have the Club Nintendo program plus the Deluxe Digital Promotion for owners of the Wii U Deluxe system. With Club Nintendo, registering new games gives you coins which you can then use on whatever games or exclusive goodies are being showcased on the website, last month I got Super Metroid and a few months before I got some really beautiful Zelda: A Link Between Worlds posters, and sometimes there are incredible deals like March's promotion to get Pokemon X/Y for free with certain product registrations or this month's Mario Kart 8 promotion to be able to choose one from a list of Wii U games for free. And the Digital Deluxe Promotion rewards real eShop credit for purchasing from the eShop through a deluxe Wii U, which can be used cross platform with the 3DS (all of which lead to even more Club Nintendo coins). Basically for purchasing a couple games new, you can get several more for free through their promotions, and it's lead to me purchasing many more new copies for my 3DS and WiiU than I ever did for any device I've owned before.

[@ChrisAndCompanyFilms]

This ending was so great. I was laughing so hard my roommate came over to see what I was laughing at.

[@Ash_Yu]

The problem to consider if doing a "pay $35 for the game and $20 later for multiplayer" type module is that the customer will still feel like they are being ripped off, even if they're really saving $5. Whatever the retail price is they will think is value of the game. Remember the JCP experiment? Even though their $20 jeans were the same as their competitors' $50 jeans being sold at "60% off", people thought JCP's jeans value was less because of the smaller displayed retail value.

[@writerbyfire]

The simple truth is that without used games the industry wouldn't be as large as it is today and without used games today there probably wouldn't be as much interest. I can only speak for my self, but I expect many people feel the same as I do. I don't have the money or time to buy every game I might like to on launch. There are many reasons for this. I am on a limited budget and plain and simple just can't buy every game I want to. The industry releases a lot of crap games, especially on launch. The risk that a given title is going to under-perform greatly lessens the perceived value of every game you buy. Some genres of games are more appealing to me than others but I still want to play those other genres occasionally. Sometimes the quality of a franchise is getting worse and worse. The value of those games is worth no where near $60 but I still want to keep up with the franchise because I like the past titles. There are many many reasons but they boil down to the fact that about 90%-95% (for me personally) of the titles released today are ones that I would never pay full price for. However only about 50% of major titles are games I would never consider playing for the right price. The fact that I am able to get those titles used for much lower prices get me invested in those franchises and their publishers. I talk about them online. I recommend them to friends. I help create a market for those games long after release which does continue to bring in revenue for publisher. Many if not most gamers who buy most of their titles used, simply wouldn't purchase those games at full price. However because they buy them second hand for less they continue to grow the title and the publishers reputation and create profits through DLC purchases and through increasing demand for those games post launch and for future iterations. Many people are into certain franchises or gaming in general because they are able to invest less and get more out of the experience. As a kid if I weren't able to buy used games with the very little money I had then it's possible that I wouldn't take nearly as much interest in the industry and the games that I purchase regularly. It's really hard to see the attempt to restrict 2nd hand sales as anything other than a greedy money grab. Every time I go to an online venue and see a 1-2 year old title for $40 when I can buy it used for $10 (and even physical copies are $30 at retailers) I lose all sympathy for those publishers. The cost to sell that title is little to nothing at that point. You could sell it for its true market value but you don't because you think it should be worth more. In reality too few people want to play your game any more so used copies flood the second hand market and reduce the cost. This is basically supply and demand. By restricting the sale of the second hand market publishers essentially just want to artificially hinder the supply of their game to maintain an artificially high price. If it was just about getting a cut then the cost of purchasing directly from the publisher would resemble the true market value of the game and used copies would not be able to compete. As for DLC incentives I don't care as long as they abide by the same rules I use to evaluate all DLC. If the game seems incomplete without them then the value of the game goes down, and likely below the threshold of being worth it to purcahse. In that case we're not talking about the value of the game itself were talking about the value of the DLC and if it's worth $10 then it's worth $10 and if it's not then it's not worth having in the first place. As long as you're creating games and DLC that meet the value of the purchase price then just as with all DLC its just a good way to increase the profit margins of your games.

[@rosegrimm1912]

Plus, whenever Bethesda releases a title, they also give out a rarer special edition later om with the DLC on a seperate disk.