Proper use of a Hydrostatic pedal - TMT

www.messicks.com | 800.222.3373 | Parts Hotline - 877.260.3528
Kubota Parts - www.messicks.com/vendor/kubota
New Holland Parts - www.messicks.com/vendor/new-holland
Case IH Parts - www.messicks.com/vendor/case
Service - www.messicks.com/schedule-service
Sales -www.messicks.com/attachment/category/136/tractors-equipment

[@ForensicPI]

Thank you for this new learning curve. I bought my first tractor at a different place. When their delivery person dropped off my tactor, I told him it was my 1st tractor, but he still did a quick overview. He never told me about this. I’ve been using 'full throttle' as I drive into my load in the pile. Looking forward to my next load of dirt or rocks to see how much better it works doing it the right way.

[@tangoseal1]

Ive been using mine wrong the whole time ... thanks Neil ... even 4 years later your videos are digital farmers gold

[@PrincetonBrat]

I beg to differ. The HST pedal does not affect any gear ratios, nor does the relief valve "steal power" from the system. If the pedal was like a transmission, there would be no justification for the the dual range gear selector. The ONLY thing the pedal does is control how much hydraulic FLOW the transmission receives. Less flow, less wheel rotation per second at lower torque at the selected range. The beauty of an HST is that ALL of the pressure at a given THROTTLE setting is available, regardless of how much pedal you use. All the relief valve does is LIMIT the maximum amount of PRESSURE the transmission can have, protecting the pump. Too much hydraulic pressure from heavy load, unbridled, would be hard or destructive to the hydraulic pump. The THROTTLE controls how much PRESSURE is available to the transmission. Low throttle, less pressure available. If you ask for too much FLOW (with the PEDAL) at high PRESSURE (full THROTTLE) without movement thru the transmission (due to heavy load), the relief valve will release unused flow at the predetermined fluid pressure. It will not REDUCE the available pressure, unless it's defective. It will merely set a limit as to how much pressure is allowed at the pump. I can add that this is true for the PTO and the loader, as well. If you overload at high throttle, it may cause the relief valve to limit what's available, usually with a howl. THROTTLE - Pressure available PEDAL - Pressure demanded RELIEF VALVE - Pressure limit RANGE SELECTOR - Transmission torque at the wheel Of course, I don't have the black, lettered shirt. But I DO read the manuals, and I've worked on mine long enough to understand how the BX series hydrostatic drive system works. It's not much different from any HST, even my Scag Turf Tiger. I am prepared to be educated, if I am all wet.

[@tighelandentertainmentllc1849]

OMG...thank you so much for the video. I have looked at manuals, watched videos for over a week on a Mihindra tractor. From my research I now know looking up the exact models or brands isn't always the best. When you mentioned moving a load of dirt and how to do so without even demonstrating was mind blowing. Im a 5ft tall woman in a field with people who have lots in ideas on how to do it.. but they actually don't know how to do it either. So now I'm bout to teach em and show out.. Thanks again!

[@GPOutdoors]

Hey Neal. This was a great lesson for us new compact tractor owners. I wish you put it out 6 months ago. I learned this over time from advice as I had no idea. Thanks - great video as always!

[@leedawson8301]

Not only is this tip good for using your loader but it's also good for bush hogging on steep slopes. You'll notice on a 1 to 1 slope if you crowd your forward peddle your rpms will decrease dramatically. Lesson learned.... Those types of slopes like I have never try to turn around, go straight up and straight back down. Regardless of your choice in tire fluid your tractor will turn over. The awesomeness of the hst is the fact you'll almost never need to brake. Using the bucket to dig or move material can work best for your tractor if you don't try to take the whole pile at one time. As you start in the material pick up on your bucket while your loading it, rolling it back at the same time. This gives you a full bucket faster and won't crowd your transmission at the same time. Never lift a full bucket more than a few feet off the ground while driving, it makes a mess and could turn your tractor over.

[@jamierapp8060]

Thank you for the info Neil! I recently purchased the BX2680 (love it!), & didn't realize how the hst works. I've been a forklift driver (material handling, loading/unloading trucks, etc.) for years, & I'm used to pressing on the gas to make the mast rise faster, barrel clamp rotate faster, etc. Its been ingrained in me.

[@jsteiman1]

Thank you for producing these! I have 0 tractor background and just bought my first (a Kubota). Tuning in and learning a ton!

[@davebarnessr.5805]

I am relieved after watching this Vlog, I just knew you were gonna say, don’t use your elbows .

[@wrenchmanhotrods1247]

Thanks Neal , I have a new L3560 and this advice really helped , I have been moving a lot of dirt around and I don't push my forward Hydro pedal all the way and it works much better when loading the bucket .

[@Farmer-zx5in]

Finally! I was waiting for this video!

[@williambrown4415]

Thanks AGAIN Neal for the additional info. Sorry Messicks is eight hundred miles from my home. Just took my M62 home tuesday, two days of work/play. Your videos are a big help. Thanks again!

[@artschulte1897]

I enjoy your informative videos I have a kubota L 3200 and have received an abundance of great information from tuning into your videos Thank you

[@amdvideos3610]

A simple video to understand and very informative.

[@bruceingram3439]

Thanks for the video! Before I bought my tractor I pondered the difference between a hydrostatic it a manual transmission. I did not understand the hydrostatic but was completely comfortable with the manual and bought it. The hydrostatic may be easier and simpler to drive but I understood the workings of the manual. For me it was the best choice. Thanks for the good videos!

[@wildbill23c]

The only downfall with a manual that I know of is when the clutch needs replaced you have to split a tractor in two in order to replace it, other than that the manual is far less prone to having any problems.

[@justsumname]

Thanks for all these, I am learning a lot.

[@cpasciuto]

Your videos are great! Thanks Neil.

[@treylem3]

Excellent info on hydrostatic pedal use. Thank you.

[@twinbrookacres]

This older video just popped up in my feed. I guess I've been using my pedal properly. But, I have always been gentle with any of my vehicles. I drive them all like an old lady! :-)

[@MJADoingStuff]

I Just watch this for the first time Great information I recently was having a problem pulling a tree and knowing this would have helped thanks for the tip!

[@chuckquinn8026]

Great explanation Neil!

[@guy5322]

When I first got my tractor I would haul butt as fast as the tractor would go and hit a big hill wide open, high range, full speed and pedal buried to the floor and I was surprised that I could not make it up the hill. Then I learned that if I would let up on the pedal as it started to bog down I could make it but if I held the pedal to the floor it would kill the engine. At first I was surprised that the tractor didn’t have enough power to make it up a big hill. This video helped me determine what I was doing wrong.

[@dawdsmail]

I borrowed a neighbors backhoe to dig a large hole... had issues coming up the hill. Now I know.

[@pyroman6000]

The only hydro I ever used was on a lawn tractor- and it was a hand lever! Still made that annoying whine, though. Never really thought about what it was actually doing. We just ran the throttle all the way up, and then used the lever to control ground speed. Don't remember the model # but it was a JD from the late 80's/early 90's w/a 17 hp Kawasaki engine, and a 42" deck. Did what we needed. Only issue I ever had was having the elec PTO clutch die 10 minutes into cutting a 3 acre lawn... simple fix.

[@lisajohnson8566]

Great advice and I will make sure to use the pedal correctly.

[@fredjjrmuller1957]

You aree the best! Thank You for sharing your knowledge...

[@molethai]

That was very informative. I have been doing it wrong. Thanks!!

[@akbychoice]

Learned something new today.

[@tonymcclendon-hobbytime7727]

Thank for the info, I am guilty of flooring my pedal, and I did notice that it did reduced the power. I thought something was wrong with the hydraulic system. Now it all make sense now. Just take it easy on the pedal. 👍🏽👍🏽

[@jamierapp8060]

Kubota & Slayer!!

[@stevesamoffgridsmallholdin5378]

Hi tony I have just done the same thing with my new kioti and stalled it now it runs unevenly & makes weird hydraulic noises. Did yours sort itself out?

[@erickstiner1668]

I did not know this at all....thanks for the 3 minute education...

[@russvtguy]

This is your best information video to date. If it is OK , I would like to play this for my crew at a golf course.

[@MessicksEquip]

Hey please do

[@SteveSnowman]

Great tips, I’m subscribed. Thanks. - N Idaho -

[@wolfmaan]

Damn! Thank you so much for making this video! I learned a lot!!

[@ItsaboutMakingnotBuying]

Great video, thank you for this information!

[@jimdandy7772]

Always great learning videos

[@Bob63198]

Excellent. Thank you for this.

[@Spacebadboy]

Did not know this until I seen this video thanks for the information would like more like this.

[@AximusPrime33]

Hey Neil, can you you do a video of swapping front attachments on the f series mowers. Love your vids man!

[@chadz2143]

Depending on what your picking up. Like soft and loose driving into pile fast letting off when you get into pile then ease back into pedal curl and lift to eliminate wheel spin. Granted I'm using a Cat 950m wheel loader, NH 7740 FWA w/fel and bobcat's at work. Be amazed how many people @ work in drive loader full boar into pile and keep spinning the wheels on concrete trying to get more in bucket

[@AndyGarcia-ch1ci]

I agree buddy this was more interesting than I expected lol

[@johntaylor1310]

Great vid. Never knew that about the pedal

[@jim5870]

Should remind folks to engage and disengage the mower pto near idle speed instead of full rpm. It makes life easier on the clutch, pto drive parts and mower gearbox.

[@manofausagain]

Torque stays the same in stall so your tractive effort does not deminish. When you mash the pedal you are sending excess oil over a relief at the stall pressure rating of your hydraulics. Heating up the oil and burning fuel. Unless the tractor has torque control on the engine in which case the rpm should drop.

[@brucelabarron9789]

Good information, thank you. I have a small Kubota BX1500. I was plowing snow with it, made some clicking noises backing up. It then stopped moving and no hydraulics. I took the HST off, I had to replace the bearings and a shaft on it. I think I got the hydraulics back, but still wont move. Any ideas. Thank you.

[@dmmartin1958]

Didn’t know, thank you for the info.

[@kirkmccracken3481]

Good and informative Video, thanks. Just subscribed.

[@StefanBacon]

Great video! Depending on how sturdy your loader is, you may want to roll in at a moderate speed to get the momentum of the machine pushing in but start to lift as the bucket enters the pile to gain grounding force, taking up slack from the waning momentum. Or it's just a tractor so drive it however you want, just don't make overly rapid pedal movements if it's mechanical.

[@hammer95diesel]

Great videos.Do you ever do any videos of new holland vs Kubota?

[@rclamb04]

Good stuff, Thank you!

[@talanpomeroy4475]

Wish they’d bring back the old GST trans. Thing is awesome.

[@dangoldbach6570]

It's an easy trap to fall into, we're so used to a foot pedal controlling the throttle from driving cars and trucks that it seems like the right thing to do to bury it but with a tractor you set the engine speed with the hand lever and the foot pedal controls speed only. The exception being the hst transmissions have the option to link engine speed to the pedal, with that enabled and the high-low in Auto it will drop down into low when it encounters a load, effectively doing the same thing as just creeping the foot pedal as you described even with the petal buried.

[@StefanBacon]

I like to say as you push into the pile, you should be lifting up as you feel/hear the resistance. Go in with *some* speed and lifting off the pedal will gear it down as your bucket fills. you can always give it more again as you lift and crowd the bucket.

[@66Oliver]

I’m pro John Deere (not one of those hardcore my crap is the best kind, I really don’t care the brand) but this is a very informative video!

[@Azone14]

This video will help me allot on my new L2501 after changing from a clutched Massey

[@nbragtop]

Great video. Thanks

[@koleguerin1324]

Do you have a video on using Hydrostatic with individual brakes ? It seems almost impossible:

[@red_jeep4.0]

One of the things my grandpa always told me with HST is on our small farm (70 acres) was to always keep it in low and mash that pedal to the floor (no front loader) all the time except when going up a hill with PTO mower engaged he told me when going up a hill the tractor will bog out so you ease off pedal keeping the RPM the same

[@sunalwaysshinesonTVs]

Wow, I totally did not know that. Explains a lot from my other day working a pile.

[@FergusonRW55]

We have an LA524 loader and bucket. Somehow we have broken the steel pipe that runs between the two "quick attach coupler" mounting plates. The pipe is cleanly broke loose at the weld on the inside. Is there anything important we should know before welding it back in place?

[@MetaView7]

Good Good Good Tip ! Thanks !

[@botabob]

Good info video Neal

[@sherischneider2672]

The old IH Hydro's used to have an optimum range on the hand hydro control. You would only go above the optimum range under light load. A trick I was taught was to speed up before you approach the hill, dirt pile, or the end of the nylon tow rope. When the engine starts to load up you can rapidly decrease your speed as the engine loads up and keep your engine from getting lugged down. With a little practice you can make your small tractor work a little bigger without stalling it out or working it too hard. I have also done this with a powershift as it starts to lug down in a tough spot or get stuck.

[@fleadip1047]

I have had mine for years and did not know this. I went back to my manual, and I don't see this mentioned anywhere.

[@hydraulicshop69]

Cause it's not true

[@sunalwaysshinesonTVs]

So yeah... I keep getting John Deere commercials when watching older TMT vids.

[@shanemcmillion159]

thank you for that info

[@Ellenslife851]

Was wondering if you can buy just these parts by themselves that make up this forward and reverse pedal set up I am building a homemade dump truck rig and would like to have that as my set up for my forward and reverse so I have it all on one pedal and it would be easy enough to hook up the hydraulics that’s nothing to me

[@1958johndeere620]

You would be surprised how many ( professional ) guys load their bucket with inertia. Fill the bucket with speed. Real good for the machine.

[@trumpzilla4193]

Any solutions for hydraulic line wear/rubbing on a B2650 loader?

[@Migman2020]

interesting i assumed the tractor was essentially driven on a large internal hydraulic geroter motor inside the main transmission case thats filled with hydraulic oil along with two smaller geroter Motors on the front axel for your 4WD. there is gearing but its on the geroter motor thats changed through your range speeds.. its why if you try pull something really heavy in the high speed aka travel speed the rpm of the engine drops dramatically because you not giving the motor mechanical advantage in the application. i use a oldish B series tractor and everytime i use a implement driven through a pto i put it in medium as most of the power is there from what ive found.. then if i got to tow something really heavy up a slope.. i put it in the low range with rpms at the pto speed so that i know im giving the engine maximum mechanical advantage through the gearing. the peddle from what understand is it just controls the speed of the motor through the flow rate.. we have the same thing that drives out heavy roller for cricket prep work.. thats driven through geroter Motor the same way.. id love to hear back from you on this

[@greensfarmland]

Nice!

[@bguen1234]

Great information! Along those lines, what range and where should the throttle be set for common pushing, towing, lifting when not using a 540rpm three point attachment?

[@MessicksEquip]

40-60%

[@daviddewilde8041]

Hello, Doen't that model have a variable flow with pressure compensation? (Sorry I don't know the exact name in English) Cheers from Belgium.

[@xcape2usa]

Great video. Which is why I love manual transmission. Think manual. Thank you. Would not have thought of it while I should have!

[@demolitioncam6519]

Could you please do a video on putting a post hole digger on the loader of a Kubota tractor

[@MessicksEquip]

There are only very specific models that will work properly. Will need to keep an eye out for one.

[@johndarezzo3953]

Hey 1700 series Kabota tractor as I was using it for about eight hours trying to go forward and reverse with the hydrostatic started to make a banging chattering noise could just barely get it to move any ideas of what it could be

[@michaelchason7863]

Ty

[@dronepilot2740]

If you know how to operate a piece of equipment you know you let the hydraulics do the work not the engine....as always messicks is awesome....

[@HarryHound1]

Hi Neal I am never really sure what engine RPM when just moving around my yard with a hydrostatic gearbox? Your suggestion would make a great 3 minute video Michael

[@leedawson8301]

In my tractor it's recommended to run it at no less than 2500 rpms.

[@hphillips7425]

Good video 👍I am guilty as charged. I hate having the brakes on the right side. If I was good at heel - toe it might be ok

[@chandlerayers4477]

Can you do a video how to properly to load netwrap in a kubota baler.

[@MessicksEquip]

Probably not quickly enough, Slide the roll in, pushing out a foot long tail back into the net path, close the bind system. It's pretty easy really

[@James-fs4rn]

👍thanks

[@UNKNOWN-le2tu]

i love your videos. if i ever get the chance to purchase some land like i want i want to get me a subcompact. i would buy from you but driving from California to PA is just not feesible. so tell me. do you offer used tractors that are maintenanced? and can i get financing. i learned so much about subcompacts from you so far.

[@MessicksEquip]

no way to make it economical over such a distance, but if you end up with parts needs we will be glad to help.

[@RehoKevin]

Great video, thanks for the explanation. Do you know if Kubota has any plans to switch to side by side pedals for the hst rather than the rocker pedal. I'm in preliminary stages of tractor shopping and I really don't care for the rocker pedal. I have one on my garden tractor and find it awkward. Thanks.

[@MessicksEquip]

Every time this has come up and they survey a customer's, it's either been a 50/50 split, or a slight preference for the single pedal treadle. They absolutely would not change. After all, most all of the industry has historically used a single pedal. It wasn't until Deere started telling everyone else that they are wrong, that opinion started spliting. Marketing is funny like that. Hop on another tractor and give it a try first. It's not like a garden tractor.

[@RehoKevin]

Thanks, I am still open to it and will be test driving models with both types of pedals.

[@Tierarzt77]

So, with this information, I’m assuming it’s a bad idea to go from Forward to Reverse on the hydrostatic pedal without first stopping the tractor with the brake? (Bad habit from smaller, lighter riding mower before getting my new 1880). Also, would increasing engine RPM (along with a light touch) increase that torque / pushing power? Keep up the great work, love your videos!

[@wildbill23c]

You don't need to hit the brakes but pausing between forward and reverse will definitely keep your tranny working for a long long time. Its like shifting an automatic transmission from reverse to drive or drive to reverse while moving you wear out the clutch surfaces in the tranny, but in a hydro you wear out the valves and other nice expensive parts.

[@brianfitzpatrick9189]

Can you or do they make these videos in Spanish? Great video. Thanks

[@msgt1942]

Neal my new b2601 treadle seems a little stiff forward and even a little stiffer backwards only 3 hours will it get easier as it breaks in thanks

[@RichardGilbert2727]

I just got a new B2601 and am just learning to use the pedal. I would appreciate knowing this too!

[@justadbeer]

I kept trying to get that little spot of dirt off my screen and then realized it was a bird on a wire in the background...sigh. Guess it's time to get my glasses updated.........

[@MrTks1959]

Really good video but I still have a question. I'm new to hydrostatic transmissions pedals, and I'm not sure what I'm supposed to be doing when the tractor slows down but maintains the same RPM while plowing? Is it hard on the transmission to leave it in M so should I be shifting down to L ? Kubota B2650. My other tractor (Kubota M9540) has a clutch which is what I'm used to using.... Also, I'm hard of hearing so it would probably be difficult for me to hear the relief valve opening. Thanks

[@MessicksEquip]

You don't hear the relief open, but you can feel it. Back off the pedal when it happens, go to a lower range if you doing it frequently.

[@MrTks1959]

@@MessicksEquip I've only had my new tractor since November (2019) and so far I haven't 'felt' the relief valve open, so that's a good thing. Based on your reply, I don't think I'm causing excessive wear on my transmission. If I feel the bypass valve opening, I'll down shift. Thanks for getting back to me so quickly!

[@YourLocalIceMan]

Great video, totally makes sense. The Zamboni is set up a little different. There is a transmission control level and a pedal. Along with engine rpm control. Seems like with tractors, etc. the pedal and lever on the Zamboni are combined as one. The transmission control lever seems more like the pedal. One pedal for forward and one reverse. The lever on the Zamboni controls forwards and backwards as well as power. I am using the word power loosely. Then the pedal "activates" the transmission. Our Zamboni has a Kubota motor as well. I am doing a video on the hydrostatic transmission on the Zamboni and looking for some additional info. Not finding anything like what the Zam is set up for.

[@TheUKNZ]

So just to confirm, should I have the revs up on the tractor but only push the pedal down gently? Makes sense as I bog down going uphill and my insitct is to push pedal to the floor so compeltely self induced stalling.

[@MessicksEquip]

correct.

[@paftaf]

Thanks. A related question: I have a magnatrac, it uses hydraulic motors, and a regular valve. Similar to the valve used for a piston. Would the same advice apply?

[@MessicksEquip]

If it's a gear pump, no.

[@paftaf]

Messick's Thanks for your answer. I will look up the pump make and model and get back to you. Thanks.

[@hydraulicshop69]

Every pump has a pressure relief and will bypass at certain pressure. These pumps are no different just piston style pump rather than gear.

[@FM60260]

Is it true that if you use too much power when trying to get over something it will keep powering forward when you release the HST pedal due to excess pressure?

[@MessicksEquip]

No.

[@marcmartin8022]

What about Kubota Auto-Throttle ? And by the way nice channel ! Bonjour de France !

[@MessicksEquip]

I've done videos on them, search the channel

[@spudgamer6049]

I've a question about hydrostatic transmissions. I've not get been able to figure it out for myself. With a manual transmission, if you're in a situation where traction is the limiting factor in pulling something say in muddy or icy conditions, you can shift to a higher gear and run at a lower RPM to reduce torque delivered to the tires, and hopefully avoid them breaking loose and spinning. (I realize it isn't ideal for the engine, but within reason it isn't going to really harm it) Do hydrostatics have a similar mechanic, and if so, what is it? From my limited experience with them, it seems they deliver pretty even torque unless you do what you talk about in this video, and I'm unwilling to intentionally make one whine like that. Plus, it isn't really a controlled situation like with the manual.

[@wildbill23c]

Yes, well kind of, just limit your speed and throttle. If you are in slippery conditions and are spinning your wheels you'll spin your wheels regardless what transmission you have, but limiting the amount of wheel spin can be done by slightly applying the brakes and/or reducing your engine speed and, reducing the amount of power to the hydrostatic tranny depending on the tractor...you just want to cut the torque, so by lowering your engine speed it will slow down the hydro pumps thus lowering the amount of torque to the wheels...gotta be careful though you may slow yourself down to the point you get stuck.

[@mhayes22167]

I guess that’s the same for L 3950?

[@ea32da32]

I was told when mowing with the hydrostatic transmission you want to select the lowest range which allows you to depress the forward peddle completely which allows the hydraulic fluid cooler to operate effectively. Is this not true?

[@MessicksEquip]

kinda. If you go into relief that creates a lot of heat.

[@YourLocalIceMan]

Although different, with the Zamboni we are told to set the transmission control level is such a way that when making your passes up the ice you want you foot on the pedal all the way down. So for us I set the lever like 1/3 the way up and when coming out of the turns I ease my foot down on the pedal. This way one is laying the same amount of water while going up the middle. I am sure it is totally different on a lawn mower though.

[@gordbaker896]

Great Info. Is there any way on a BX 250 Kobota tractor to stop the rear 3ph from moving when the belly mower is moved up or down? Poor design if not.

[@MessicksEquip]

they are tied together, most all tractors are done that way with very few exceptions.You can lock the deck up, but you can't lock the 3pt.

[@gordbaker896]

Thanks for the confirmation. Very annoying if you have the Chipper mounted and want to mow the lawn.

[@MessicksEquip]

Yea, stuff like that is normally the concern. With a 3pt quick hitch you can drop it very quickly. Really, you should not have all that added weight rolling back and forth on your yard.

[@dalec919]

Hi - hoping someone can help me with a question. I don't have a left leg from an accident- I use my right leg to drive with. Are there any tractors- I want one with loader and maybe backhoe, that are all right side pedals?

[@svtirefire]

I think older Kubotas with hydrostatic transmissions have both the hydro pedal and brakes on the right. Most people complained about that feature but for you it would be ideal. John Deere also had some models like the 4600 HST that had split brake pedals on the left, but a master brake pedal on the right that operates both brakes. Sorry I can't be more specific on model years and such.

[@flynryan3053]

Is there any kind of speed or cruise control with a hydrostatic system? Besides your foot.

[@MessicksEquip]

cruise control, yes.

[@BradleyStoneV]

Does the same apply when using the FEL? The further you push it in a direction the higher "gear" it is? So take it slow when scooping a large pile?

[@MessicksEquip]

No

[@BradleyStoneV]

Thanks!

[@mhayes22167]

Damn I didn’t know that