Psychological Helplessness and Deepnest

[@DarylTalksGames]

Hey guys, hope ya like this one. Even if ya get bored and don’t finish it, at least watch 12:15, by far the most toyed with I’ve ever felt in a game. 😅 Thanks as always for being here!

[@cleoharper1842]

My crippling arachniphobia was actually overrode by your ability to analyze the unexpressable part of me. I'd take this video to my therapist if I wasn't considering firing him. As for you, I'm getting feelings of transference... ;-D Amazing what you said about Spiderman. When I was really small I used to walk around holding his imaginary hand to keep me safe. I feel no connection to him now but man! I couldn't go anywhere without him. Excellent video, thanks so much for doing this.

[@victormorais5867]

In this part I entered the room, and walk around, so I saw a bunch of friendly guys, so I just cracked all the jars in sequence, and got really pissed after that, it was infuriating, but fun hahahaha

[@snail8720]

I used to work with rescued dogs from abusive households. You could feel the helplessness in many of them after years of unwarranted and unpredictable punishment. Dogs especially seem to take helplessness very harshly, and some never recover from it. They do however recognize your sympathy and your feelings, and I treasure the happy moments I had with them. Happiness is much like sadness in this sense, you can't avoid either. Take deep breaths, it will get better.

[@cleoharper1842]

@@snail8720 I have a rescue beagle, quite by accident. When he was brought home I was told he'd been through 5 homes by the time he was 13 months. He has scars all over his legs and stomach (vets think boiling water or chemical) & thyroid problems from throat damage. I was so mad about the dog until I heard his story and I just couldn't pass him to another house. Within a week I was totally in love and now he's the dog of my life. I suffer from depression, anxiety, ptsd but this dog saves my life, every day. How could anyone hurt such a loving, gentle animal? I thank my lucky stars every day for this Cooper wandering into my life. Thank you for doing what you did with rescue dogs. It really matters.

[@scroopynoopers.]

More than worth the wait and most certainly not a bore. I lack the eloquence to adequately express how much your insight and deeply comforting explorations of the human psyche mean to me. I understand myself better after encountering your content. So much of it speaks to the twisted and hurt pieces of me hiding at odd angles inside me. My most sincere gratitude to you, my guy, you are the cat’s pajamas. I hope y o u are having a damn good one too. Thank you for being you and doing what you do so well. 💕

[@sofer2230]

Something I found darkly funny: Deepnest is the only major zone that doesn't require a boss fight to complete. Deepnest *is* the boss. Everything else is optional.

[@Messilegend1000]

I knew everything about Deepnest before going in. I studied the map, and I was terrified but I knew. I finished everything I could before I went in. I was deathly scared of that massive room on the left, because I thought a giant monster lives there. Like a massive spider on the ceiling. I woke Herrah, and got out. Then after THK fight, I went for Nosk, Galien, and Tram Pass. I have finished PoH but I refuse to discover all of Deepnest. Some parts are still not visited.

[@yeahkeen2905]

I can name a lot of areas that don’t need bosses to complete. Depends on what you mean by complete.

[@Pedro_eqw]

@@yeahkeen2905 He said major zone.

[@skiara8152]

I spent all of Deepnest terrified partly because I expected a boss fight at the end, and this zone already felt so scary, i just couldn't handle the idea of a boss fight

[@skiara8152]

@SATURN13 Ah yeah i did and hated every second of it lol, but since it's an optional boss fight i don't consider a region boss

[@jamesburk8145]

"When you accidentally stumble upon... yourself." I was having none of it at that point. I chased that little me bastard into the dark as fast as I could KNOWING I would be horrified. Did not disappoint.

[@GippyHappy]

I got excited, I was like "ooh a friend! come back!" I was expecting another Hornet. It was not a friend.

[@_leaf-3525]

@@GippyHappy Haha same, I just kind of stared at it in confusion for a moment before being like "Oh sick, someone else like me!" and chasing it. And this was after one of my friends had already told me about Nosk

[@memeuz8882]

@@GippyHappy HAAAAHAHAHHAHA

[@obsessionsofthevoid]

I chased that little bastard into the darkness not knowing that I would be scared shitless. I died. Multiple times. After his transformation scene and the first fight I wasn't scared, just pissed off because the little fuck was copying me.

[@TrueNamelessOne]

Ghost was probably traumatized from that annoying freak.

[@archdruidbookwalter951]

"What did you do to protect yourself and the seal?" Lurien: "I assigned 6 of my best knights to guard me." Monomon: "I made a big jellyfish to protect me, and put a seal on me that only my most loyal servant can break." Herrah: *"I structured my entire kingdom to psychologically torture everyone who dares even attempt to come my way."*

[@sandrols7]

and then, an emotionally hollow vessel comes along and undoes it all. Truly large brain think on behalf of the Pale King

[@periclescomoeddie5215]

This comment is perfect.

[@alexandershea2418]

To be fair, Lurien actually assigned like thirty knights or something if you look at the background, there's just only six in good enough shape to reanimate. But to circle back to Deepnest, pretty much all the Weavers are dead. Imagine how much harder it'd be to get to Herrah if they were still alive and trying to keep you out.

[@essneyallen6777]

@@alexandershea2418 oh god, Hornet-style combatants savvy enough to use all traps against you? Nobody would survive.

[@alexandershea2418]

​@@essneyallen6777 I presume the Weavers were the ones responsible for filling the area outside Hidden Village with all those collapsing floor traps, yeah. The terrain is bad enough as is, imagine if the Weavers were actually making a concerted effort to corner you instead of just rushing you because they're mindless infection-zombies. Do you want to run into the spikes, run into the Stalking Devouts blocking the tunnels, or go up into the Weavers coming down on your head?

[@grfrjiglstan]

6:03 The map he gives you is the clue. The only rooms he has mapped out are the ones leading directly from the alternate entrance drop to where he is now. He fell in through the trap floor by mistake, and you find him right as he's running for the exit.

[@zamalamahama4894]

That’s really cool using the premade map you buy as a form of storytelling. It also lets you learn about Cornifer as a character. The ground fell from below him and despite the terror that he has found himself in, he continues to draw up his map because of how committed he is. Team cherry continues to impress

[@5001Fergies]

While that is definitely what they were going for, i really like to imagine cornifer pulling up on the mantis lords and going “you fools, the quill is far mightier than the nail” and proceeding to one-shot them while his eyes glow red for a brief moment, then immediately going back to his normal persona and being like “why thank you kindly, i will be sure to share the maps i draw of this new place with you”

[@Captainpepper]

@@5001Fergies all i can see is cornifer: "Omaiwa mo shinderu" mantis lords: "nani?!"

[@Dashmaster305]

How did the breakaway floor repair itself?

[@mailcs06]

@Dashmaster Spider Silk, maybe. Stuff’s stronger than steel.

[@clowelle6221]

Team Cherry saw arachnophobia and went "ah yes, lets make an entire area out of this." I wanted to cry the entire time.

[@euchre90]

Exposure therapy, innit?

[@clowelle6221]

@@euchre90 not sure what I expected going into a game about bugs

[@matiaspereyra9392]

I'm generally a "bugophobe" exept for like butterflies, the one version of moth that you can find in my country (basically the little ones) mosquitoes, ants, flies and ladybugs I'm terrified (in different levels) of every bug and I was doing great, specially because they are soo cartoony that I didn't care, the sounds of deepnest were the worst tho, I had to stop playing the game with headphones

[@CodeDonutz]

@@clowelle6221 dirty liar!!!!!!

[@gentlesin1301]

@@matiaspereyra9392 i have a deathly fears of insects, but hollow knights bugs are cartoony enough to not creep me out.

[@longbeing]

Another really cool touch: in the distant village stag station, there is no music. Another subtle reminder that Deepnest is not a friendly place. When you talk to the old stag, he's unsettled too, and wants you to leave.

[@atherisGAY]

Yeah! He says something along the lines of "I sense danger.. let me quickly take you to a safe place."

[@matthewbernal8079]

Me: *beats the mantis lords after many attempts* “Hurrah! I shall proceed and reap the rewards for my challenges!” Me: *sees deepnest* “Wtf...”

[@headachepuppy]

Oh shit, the mantises weren't trying to stop me... They were protecting me

[@gunnarschlichting9886]

@@headachepuppy They were testing you, making sure you are strong enough to survive. That's why you don't kill them, its a challenge not a battle to the death.

[@infinitetaquito4484]

@@gunnarschlichting9886 or they were just looking for somebody to get rid of the creatures there

[@gunnarschlichting9886]

@@infinitetaquito4484 Nah, definitely a test. The Mantis Tribe is big on honor, that's why none of them attack you after you've won unless it's in self-defense. You clearing out part of Deepnest is definitely a nice bonus, but that's all it is. Enemies never stop spawning after all, so it's just a temporary reprieve either way.

[@infinitetaquito4484]

@@gunnarschlichting9886 I can see that being the case

[@reijerboodt8715]

I love, too, how this is weaved in lore-wise. Deepnest is hostile to the bugs of 'civilized' hallownest, and resisted its influence and control for the entire length of its existence. You, as the knight, are a child of the pale king, an outsider of highest degree. The dominion you have over the rest of hallownest does not apply here. This place is not yours, and you are not welcome. And even though the lore in this game is told very indirectly and you are unlikely to know this context when you first arrive there, you can feel this hostility and alienation with every inch of your body. Team Cherry really did an amazing job with this game's atmosphere.

[@cicadaenthusiast3954]

heheh. "weaved"

[@iampie6954]

Interesting

[@Zeeboklown]

Very well said, my friend.

[@vizthex]

really hope Silksong has something similar to this.

[@vkyal5810]

​@@vizthex Yeah exactly what I was thinking as well. I wonder if Silksong will have something as ambient as this

[@DenesL27]

The worst part is going through the dark corridors and dead ends hoping to find Cornifer as soon as possible, so you can at least have some sense of control about what is happening to you. Finding Cornifer in Deepnest feels like finding water in a desert. Except the water is terrified too.

[@hilfemajster4234]

At least this is optional if you got through mantis lords.

[@jameslenze64]

Even finding Cornifer only helps somewhat, given how mazelike many of the rooms are, all filled with narrow passageways and shit.

[@4ncientGu150]

I didn't find Cornifer the first time. Not until I was basically done, and had to look him up.

[@jonahweiss2124]

Yeah I got clapped by mantis lords first time so I gave up till after city of tears, however I had the claw and while exploring the fungal wastes I fell in. And then I died in there before finding a bench and gave up till I had the light.

[@yeahkeen2905]

The funny thing about my first experience playing through is that I had no idea how to find Cornifer. I somehow missed him when I entered the area from the Mantis Village even though he was right there. I travelled through the entire area without a map. Fml

[@nemanjaz.9113]

A design choice i like about Deepnest is that it is represented as a small area when you first get Cornifers Map But when you start exploring, only then do you realize that this place is ENORMOUS. It adds so much to the feeling of being helpless and lost, and you never know how much deeper this place goes, or how far you have to go to reach the end of it, or if you even WANT to know what's at the end of it.

[@InconspicuousFruit]

I didnt think deepnest was that big, but when i saw where the dreamer was on the map, damn

[@BAVy11037]

as the other commenter said, I think most people heading in there already have the dreamer icon which indicates how big it actually is. So the feeling they get when seeing the map is just another confirmation of how scared Cornifer is of this place

[@Not_Aaron_]

I feel very bad for the doggies they just learned to accept the state they were in :( I also feel like this what a lot of people do too.

[@DarylTalksGames]

Oh it’s a huge problem, there is a reason so many people have trouble “getting out of a rut”. Enough failure really can beat you down.

[@sikorsky99ew17]

@@DarylTalksGames ⚡️🐕🙁

[@GoreWizzard]

That's the point

[@sikorsky99ew17]

@@GoreWizzard I am Sad that they were shocked not the dogs

[@raph2550]

Yeah, I also feel like this is something important is the realm of school and education.

[@iangaffaney]

In my opinion the greatest part of deepest is a room where you get locked in but there are a bunch of dead bugs around you. At first I thought it was just a room I had been through but then they all came alive and all you could hear is the cracking and scuttling of the zombified spider-bugs

[@mauz791]

Agreed, at least you get a King's Idol and meet Zote

[@mailcs06]

That room was awful lmao. It almost killed me, too.

[@fermatt]

The first time i entered Deepnest was actually through the trap floor thats in 11:47. I was minding my own business, exploring a bit and suddendly BAM. Fell down to Deepnest and had to fight my way out agains multiple enemies and the anxiety of losing everything i got up until that point. It truly was scary.

[@sarahferenc5440]

SAME, and since I fell in that way, I never found cornifer and was stuck in a loop of getting lost, almost getting out and then dying.

[@yamaha94O]

Same. It was the worst because I could not find cornifer for the map so I was in there completely blind. I managed to get to the failed tramway which was terrifying. Then I eventually crawled down this tight corridor just to fall down this hole where I surely thought I was gonna die, just to end up at a hot springs with quirrel. That was the most relief I have EVER felt. Lol. Then I found the tram and got the hell outa there. Lol.

[@NikozBG]

I honestly believe that this is the natural (and probably the intended) way to discover deepnest, since every damn npc and monument in the fungal wastes tries to make you as scared as possible from the mantis tribe. Then you encounter them and probably get beaten really hard by just one mantis at a time and when finally see the Mantis Lords, most people will be like, no fam, I'm outta here! If that is the case, that fall through the floor have two advantages. First it makes for a very sudden change of pace and raising the stakes, because you probably have some geo on you that don't want to loose. And the second thing is that it basically makes for you a new objective. At least for me, once I crawled back up I was like "I would get stronger just to came back and kick this place''s ass".

[@strangething7379]

LMAO me too! I knew about Deepnest from reputation and quickly googled the fastest way to get out of there. It was only till the end of my time with Hollow Knight did I go in and experience Deepnest blind

[@kkTeaz]

Same but I was like "alr time to commit genocide"

[@tomtheravenclaw8661]

I vividly remember my experience with Deepnest, and quite possibly one of my favorite experiences in gaming So there I was, stumbling through the dark corridors with danger lurking at every turn, just about wondering whether it was too late to turn back. Then, after the final pitfall in the final corridor, I found the Hidden Village. And I was like, "Yes! I found what I was looking for! Story progress achieved!". I was right, but also wrong. So I went into the cult-house thing and found the group of robed bugs greeting me. I saw the bench and a couple of things went through my mind: A: I had just seen a Stag Station sign before this point, meaning a stag station is nearby. Ergo, there is a bench nearby in the Stag Station. This game places benches very sparingly, so why would there be a bench in this house? B: All of these bugs seem a little too enthusiastic about "sit and rest". They don't cycle through any other dialogue. With these observations, I actually was big brain enough to leave the house. I was like "No, game. I know what this place is. This is some trick that'll lead to some boss fight or some other bullshit I'm not ready for. I decided that instead, I go to the Stag Station, sit on the bench there, refill my health, save my progress etc... Then, I'd go back to the cult house and investigate further. Made it to the Stag Station, wouldn't you know it, the bench is broken. And I was like, "Crap. I did not forsee this.". So at this point I'm thinking, "Maybe the broken bench was a design choice to make this place more eerie. They didn't want to leave such a major area without a bench though, so they put one in cult-house". So, returning to cult-house, I'm relaying my observations in my head, and having a "What's the worse that could happen?" moment. Maybe some boss drops through the ceiling or I have to fight these robed dudes. No big deal, I know where the exit is, and I've got three masks. And so, I made the decision you NEVER make in Deepnest: I let my guard down. I sit. The game, doesn't save. I try to get up. Nothing happens. I mash my keys. Nothing happens. The robed bugs close in. The music distorts. And I remember the last thing I thought before the screen went black: "crap"

[@bluescreenl]

i remember finding the stag station and feeling so relieved when i found it (i didnt trust cult house bench either) and then i entered the room and realized: i needed 250 geo to open the station and leave, which was what i wanted to do. i had 10 because deepnest sucks and kept killing me. i still didnt trust the cult bench so i ended up grinding geo on the foreground spiders in the room over for about half an hour

[@iurigrang]

The most fucked up thing is how it then saves the game once you're in beasts den. The strongest recourse I had against being stuck in a unfamiliar area is saving an quiting, but now saving and quitting doesn't let you escape, it just puts you back on beasts den.

[@Idontknowwhattowrite150]

My worst experience in Deepnest was the Corpse Creepers. I kill husk, husk go down. My journal says “you completed a journal entry”. I try to read the journal entry for the horned husks and I hear bone-crunching and tick-tick-ticks, I keep reading. I vividly see a thing run to the right, I keep reading. I stop reading and find no husk corpse, I take a moment to think “why husk gone ? I kill husk, but husk gone”. Then I see a spider charge at me at Mach 2 and I kill it, it disappears and I stop playing for like 20 minutes to contemplate whether I was losing my mind or if that series of events just occurred in ever-so perfect succession that made me fear spiders more

[@radiridel7737]

I had the same experience and thought process, however, upon reaching the stag station and finding the bench broken, I thought "doesn't matter, I'm getting the fuck out of here, save at other station, and then come back". Even if it wasn't really useful once I entered the Beast's Den, it gave me a little mental rest.

[@marshcarcass]

@@radiridel7737 Yeah I did the same thing. My thought process was basically: fuck this. They're creepy, I'm taking the Stag and saving in another area before coming back

[@terdragontra8900]

Deepnest is a brilliantly awful experience. It feels weird to call it "good game design" because its meant to feel awful, but it really is ingenious.

[@hylianmage413]

This was the level that made me realize "Good game design" doesn't equate to "enjoyable game design"

[@goatgang6461]

@@hylianmage413 very true

[@meganinja456]

@@hylianmage413 It's almost like when you watch a super depressing movie and it gets to you, but it's just so brilliantly made that at the end you're still like "That was an incredible movie".

[@Summer_Tea]

A streamer once said in reference to Blighttown and Deepnest: "Intentionally bad game design is still bad game design." And I couldn't disagree more. What you said here makes sense, that game design may not directly relate to the actual enjoyment you get from playing. Sometimes the idea of something in a game being cool, interesting, or unique overshadows the fact that it's tedious in the moment. There's actual moment-to-moment gameplay, and then there's the memories you form of playing the game and looking back on what you went through. Sometimes bad ephemeral gameplay can lead to great memories, and other times really streamlined and non-intrusive gameplay can lead to a game being forgettable..

[@Kidneyjoe42]

@@Summer_Tea Blighttown and Deepnest aren't even bad game design, intentional or otherwise (well except the framerate issues in the former). No one considers it bad game design when a horror game is unnerving and makes you uncomfortable. And that's exactly what both of those areas set out to do. It's not even like they aren't enjoyable. The first time I went through both I was terrified and I loved every second of it. While it might seem paradoxical fun can and often does come from fear and discomfort.

[@Calophon]

I remember being physically, mentally, and emotionally exhausted upon exploring maybe half of deepnest for the first time. And my friends in discord went “yup, I know exactly where you are” when they heard just my exasperated sighs and “wtf”’s

[@nuclearcicada8192]

the part with daryls thoughts when he gets to hornet and dies, and then theres a long pause and then just, "...........anger" that had me wheezing so hard

[@NoiseDay]

It reminded me of this channel I found where a lady teaches her cat to communicate by pressing buttons, which say a corresponding word. In one of the videos, the cat repeatedly presses "mad" because she's not being given more food.

[@trickytreyperfected1482]

@@NoiseDay I need to know what the video is now lmao

[@lapislazuli9126]

@@NoiseDay oh, billi speaks?

[@pinkajou656]

When is that?

[@Sophia-we6yh]

lmao same

[@junebug413]

one thing is that deepnest still does the whole "keep going down" theme that the entirely of hollow knight follows. if you keep going down, you find a safe spot in the form of the hot spring, and from that you can feel a little more confident in exploring, because you have that safe haven. from that you can slowly make ur way through the rest of the area.

[@gamingkids8262]

the hot spring is in fact another trap since as soon as you sit on the bench you realise you are trapped in deepnest forever

[@FruitOfTheFold]

@@gamingkids8262 i had this exatcly feeling when i sitted on the bench, only to notice the crap i've done

[@Leon-k3t]

@@gamingkids8262I always wonder. If a player without a lama-fly lantern, fall from the trap floor and maganed to reach the spring spot(which is almost impossible), sat on the bench and ohhh f**k.

[@Flymerick]

"psychological helplessness and deepnest" Why did you use the same word twice?

[@marqod1437]

"It is the same picture."

[@Alchemyst326]

One thing you didn't mention that I think also contributed to the disorientation of Deepnest is that, if you find it first through the primary entrance behind the Mantis Lords, as you did, you enter it having just beaten the most technically challenging and strategic boss fights so far. Most bosses before the Lords (well, Ladies technically but that's not what they're called) has been against monstrous brutes and various beasts, with the exception of Hornet, and beating them was simply a matter of learning their attacks, then avoiding them and using the windows of safety between to either attack or heal. The Mantis lords step up the difficulty in more than one way. They move quickly, they attack frequently, and perhaps worst of all, they simply vanish between attacks. You can't attack them between their attacks, you can't anticipate where they're coming from, and you never know if where you're standing is safe to heal until they come at you again. And then the second phase ramps up the difficulty, with two lords attacking simultaneously, often staggering their strikes so that you have to keep moving continuously to avoid being hit. You only get brief moments in certain attacks to heal, and you can't even tell which lord is which to focus one of them down. This is to say that, after you beat them, you're feeling pretty good about yourself. You've learned to fight strategically, to not simply react to various tells but to anticipate various future moves, and to seize tiny windows of opportunity. If you, like many would, go back to try and save your game, you'll find that the previously hostile mantis folk even bow to you and let you pass, as if congratulating you on your victory. It's a good feeling, and a big boost to your confidence. Then Deepnest happens. I think that's what brings everything you talked about to even higher heights of nervousness and helplessness. All of the things you talked about, all the despair and lack of control, comes right on the heals of one of the highest moments of confidence and rightful pride in your skills. You've conquered Lords, and now you're being absolutely wrecked by crawling, mindless insects and spiders. That sudden shift and contrast is what makes Deepnest that much more jarring.

[@nyfarious]

Daryl Talks Games: "I want you to think about being helpless" i am four parallel universes ahead of you

[@TheAtb85]

*virtual hug*

[@bearianna]

Same, having chronic pain seriously prepares you for that feeling. 😒😔

[@onyourleft9273]

@@TheAtb85 *Virtual group hug*

[@aturtlethatisred]

@@bearianna so freaking true, and exactly what I thought watching it; gentle hugs ❤️

[@tboyjaydee]

for me, the most betrayed I felt, was once you find all the grubs and go back to the grubfather later. the ONLY spot of light in the game and it gets ripped from you 😭

[@Brizzle12341]

That's how I felt at first and then I learned that it sort of works like a cocoon for the grubs to transform into grubberflies

[@ricardobr1493]

The grubfather became a cocoon for the grubs He's gonna burst into an explosion of grubberflies

[@paultapping9510]

Happy!...Happy!....Happy!

[@nuttynutsnutstache]

​@@ricardobr1493 But then... Why isn't he a grubberfly? Are all the grubs females? Do grubberflies mate with male grubs, and it's the male's job to become the cocoon after the grubberfly gives birth? Aren't all the grubs children? Grub PEDOPHILIA???

[@Woopor]

@@ricardobr1493that’s not very happy either. For the grub father at least. At least the grubs are fine

[@AgentMonochrome]

Team Cherry: Let's put a critical element to the plot of Hollow Knight in the most terrifying area of the entire game where no one is safe, things aren't what they seem, and where spiders just show up out of nowhere to attack you. I have a feeling we're going to deal with something similar if we're going to play as Hornet too.

[@kylehart8829]

That's why deepnest is such an excellent area. It's supposed to be oppressive, and it does that job perfectly. I would say it's the closest to perfect of any of the areas in the game.

[@anakin148]

Deep Nest 2: this time, YOU are the spider

[@Hehe-nt4oe]

Team cherry isn’t releasing silk song so we have enough time to mentally prepare ourselves and maybe book a therapist

[@hilfemajster4234]

@@anakin148 *prooceds to go into foreground*

[@potatoman6556]

This comment made me realize something. I might me some kind of masochist, because some of my favourite games force you to go to unnerving and deadly places in order to progress (Hollow knight, Don't Starve together, Subnautica)

[@Ash-bn8xy]

the buildup to the nosk fight was genuinely one of the most fear-including parts of the game

[@angeldragonsky6622]

Honestly, the nosk buildup wasn't scary for me. I was just really curious

[@froog2]

@@angeldragonsky6622 i was mostly like "hey give me my body back you fuckin doppelgänger"

[@kungfuzing1018]

Spookiest part for me was just the other day. I'd already played through the game many times and had clocked in over 200 hours. I got the speedrun achievements, the 100% Steel Soul achievement, the whole nine yards. I'm heading through Deepnest and pass through the area above the hot spring where there are basically no enemies. All of a sudden, I notice a little Ghost staring at me that I'd never noticed during any of my other playthroughs... It was beautiful

[@user-jm8ur5jh5k]

@@kungfuzing1018That happened to me too! Now just knowing that Nosk stalks the player for so much longer than I initially thought has made Deepnest even creepier for me every time I replay. Like I’m constantly being watched

[@samt3412]

Daryl: "I want you to think about pain" Me: *Starts hearing buzz saw noises*

[@venuskaida]

you know what they say. no cost too great

[@FoxDawn]

@@venuskaida especialy when it's cost of buzz saws, especialy when you are pale king

[@edgarperez9949]

Just to get the ‘Seal of Binding’ journal entry :(

[@tobitt8157]

I assure you pale King. ░░░░░░░░░▄░░░░░░░░░░░░░░▄░░░░ ░░░░░░░░▌▒█░░░░░░░░░░░▄▀▒▌░░░ ░░░░░░░░▌▒▒█░░░░░░░░▄▀▒▒▒▐░░░ ░░░░░░░▐▄▀▒▒▀▀▀▀▄▄▄▀▒▒▒▒▒▐░░░ ░░░░░▄▄▀▒░▒▒▒▒▒▒▒▒▒█▒▒▄█▒▐░░░ ░░░▄▀▒▒▒░░░▒▒▒░░░▒▒▒▀██▀▒▌░░░ ░░▐▒▒▒▄▄▒▒▒▒░░░▒▒▒▒▒▒▒▀▄▒▒▌░░ ░░▌░░▌█▀▒▒▒▒▒▄▀█▄▒▒▒▒▒▒▒█▒▐░░ ░▐░░░▒▒▒▒▒▒▒▒▌██▀▒▒░░░▒▒▒▀▄▌░ ░▌░▒▄██▄▒▒▒▒▒▒▒▒▒░░░░░░▒▒▒▒▌░ ▀▒▀▐▄█▄█▌▄░▀▒▒░░░░░░░░░░▒▒▒▐░ ▐▒▒▐▀▐▀▒░▄▄▒▄▒▒▒▒▒▒░▒░▒░▒▒▒▒▌ ▐▒▒▒▀▀▄▄▒▒▒▄▒▒▒▒▒▒▒▒░▒░▒░▒▒▐░ ░▌▒▒▒▒▒▒▀▀▀▒▒▒▒▒▒░▒░▒░▒░▒▒▒▌░ ░▐▒▒▒▒▒▒▒▒▒▒▒▒▒▒░▒░▒░▒▒▄▒▒▐░░ ░░▀▄▒▒▒▒▒▒▒▒▒▒▒░▒░▒░▒▄▒▒▒▒▌░░ ░░░░▀▄▒▒▒▒▒▒▒▒▒▒▄▄▄▀▒▒▒▒▄▀░░░ ░░░░░░▀▄▄▄▄▄▄▀▀▀▒▒▒▒▒▄▄▀░░░░░ ░░░░░░░░░▒▒▒▒▒▒▒▒▒▒▀▀░░░░░░░░ building an entire area out of buzz saws, sharp lances and endless pits is crusial to protect you. I sure hope you have fun leaving your palace from the throne room.

[@xshullaw]

*Thinks about Radiant Zote*

[@hizkiahl8316]

Combine not having the lumafly lantern, a crawling skin feeling for the next 2 days, and extreme arachnophobia, and that's roughly what my first experience with deepnest was like.

[@c_brigante]

When I found the fake bench and got kidnapped reminded me of Bloodborne, when a certain type of enemy puts you in a sack and you wake up in a new and dark place with no idea of what is going on

[@mistydayremainsofthejudgment]

Soulsborne games are the masters of this sort of thing.

[@snowdust1105]

Ever since I learned I could dream nail enemies and dead bugs occasionally, I dream nailed whatever I could. Outside the place where they kidnapped you is another cocoon with several bug corpses tied up in string. I dream nailed them and they all had text saying things like "Dont trust them." So I didn't and saved before sitting on that bench. The same applies to the grubs too, but I fell for it the first time since I didn't expect to NEED to dream nail a grub (plus I've already dream nailed them before and mobs usually only have 2-3 dream nail texts).

[@blackrose_k8062]

@@snowdust1105 I also dream nailed the other corpses and clearly saw the "they lied" and I still sat on the bench like a dumb dumb, as he said *bench good*. And got kidnapped, I actually enjoyed that moment so much and was on a mission to hunt those bugs down to wack their asses, sadly only saw their disguise skin left behind 😂

[@aiodensghost8645]

Snatchers. I actually liked that segment

[@xshullaw]

Reminds me of the first Seath "fight", where it's impossible to kill him and when you die you get taken to a completely different, _and you're stuck._

[@doo_lissdu_lighost6133]

I'm honestly surprised Daryl didn't go into more detail on Nosk. When you see what appears to be yourself, you are intrigued. It feels like you've found someone that could be friendly. Then they run from you, which most likely reminds you of when you first found Hornet back in Greenpath. Naturally you follow them as they continue to run away. You follow them into a narrow hallway. As you follow, doors shut. You realize what's really going on, but you can't stop it. You can only go forward. You've been toyed with, lured into an inescapable trap. As Nosk shows his true form, all you can do is try to fight back against this horrifying spider and get out of this web. The buildup to Nosk's lair enforces that feeling of helplessness, punishing your curiosity with an inescapable hallway to insanity.

[@baconarmy123isthebest8]

I think it's sort of to avoid too much spoilers and let the people who haven't got to Nosk yet experience this helplessness first handed

[@shfhsvomvolakis2318]

the part where you discover yourshelf in the Deepnest and then you folow it only to find out that is a boss that lure you into a boss fight is what truly hit me in this.

[@marcoasturias8520]

Deepest was the boss fight all along

[@GBlockbreaker]

Ngl Nosk only scared me until i got to his room and he transformed

[@Buglin_Burger7878]

I mean I wouldn't say it lures you into its fight... it appears for a few moments for seemingly no reason and is just gone... and unless you find a secret passage then you get lured... down a linear path.

[@c0v3n43]

I remember finding the Nosk for the first time, what really got me wasn't that he looked like me but when I dream nailed the corpses and seeing their last words being things like "Why", "Come back darling." and "I thought you died." I realized what it was doing and for some reason that made it personal so I killed the Nosk with nothing more than just raw fury.

[@katsucandy]

@@c0v3n43 same hat 8) dream-nailing the corpses by nosk's lair is just......horrifying. and then you get to the lair itself and see there's VESSELS in there and just,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,, a n g e r (and let's not forget, the absolute devastation at later realizing that nosk took your own form because the knight at that point of time doesn't really have anyone they're close to, but in godhome nosk's second form is of fucking *hornet*, your half-sister and the one who's low-key guided you as you uncovered the secrets of your past as you looked for another way to put an end to this nightmare other than 'prolonging the inevitable'. just. o o f)

[@Donagalthegamer]

Spoiler warning What messed with me was after finding myself, finding out i'm a lie, finding myself more metaphorically by beating Nosk and Galien, and then going to Stag in hidden village, having him so excited he found the Stag nest, I thought screw this, my best buddy want's to show me his crib, sidequesting to do that, finding out all his folks aren't in the best state, then going back, and tripping the trap that I thought the bench was, doing beast's den, the thrill of getting to Herrah, only for Hornet to tell me that I just murdered her mum and she knew there was nothing I could do about it. Man there is no happiness in deepnest, even your triumph is a failure

[@Fretfulglaze]

I remember seeing the bench with all of the people around it and I said "YES A BENCH ILL TALK TO THESE PEOPLE AFTER I SIT"

[@soph1.1]

Heh...... yeah I did this my first play through. Felt very betrayed by the bench

[@Fretfulglaze]

@@soph1.1 same 😭

[@testerfox6998]

also the part when you thought you can trust the banker

[@Predalien3001]

@@testerfox6998 Up to 2250 Geo you can, after that it just multiplies your money once and dissapears.

[@masonjones7777]

I saw the building, had already been betrayed by deepnest in a million ways, and thought the building itself was going to kill me, so I opened up the stagway first. I still was scared silly by the betrayal though

[@isaakvandaalen3899]

When I found the town at the end of Deepnest I was like; "Wow this looks like a trap or something I'd better rest at this bench before I talk to these guys I bet they're secretly evil". Well I *was* right.

[@doritos4956]

Bro I was sus as shit of them so I dreamnailed them thinking I was smart the fact that the they had no dream dialog made me pretty scared ngl

[@doritos4956]

Bro I was sus as shit of them so I dreamnailed them thinking I was smart the fact that the they had no dream dialog made me pretty scared ngl

[@vizthex]

"you may have outsmarted me, but *I* outsmarted your outsmarting!" - the game when you did that

[@ace-smith]

after they all told me to sit down i was like well i am not sitting down there bestie im gonna go do something else. turns out there was nothing else to do lol

[@BrazillianCara]

Not the most original thing, but my reaction seconds after first entering Deepnest: "I hate this place already."

[@romilrh]

Deepnest is one of my favorite levels/areas in any videogame ever. Despite the psychological torture it put me through, I just couldn't help but appreciate how amazingly executed it all was. The way it plays with your expectations, makes you feel unsafe and on edge, and the way the sound design combines with the music to provide a genuinely unsettling atmosphere... It's a masterpiece. A sick, twisted masterpiece

[@theantgre]

Lol I still remember when Joseph Anderson said that he was stuck in Deepnest with no torch and no map, that must have been a nightmare

[@meganinja456]

It happened to me too... It was awful and I loved it.

[@narwhale922]

Oddly enough, Deepnest was therapeutic to me. As a person living with a severe case of OCD for years and emotional manipulation(alongside many more issues I'm not going to get into), i for some reason felt oddly comforted by Deepnest. Because i was so used to feeling helpless irl, i kinda knew how to handle it. I pushed on, even farmed geo down there. Because i knew how to deal with helplessness, and i knew that ultimately i was still in control. Something about living with mental illness teaches you how to deal with certain emotions out of necessity, and well, Deepnest helped me remember that I'm gonna do okay. EDIT: spelling, English is not my first language

[@agt_pendergast8899]

I should probably get back into this game some day.

[@Leo-qk9mk]

It is such an experience. Totally worth getting back into imo

[@swarth8632]

Today

[@drewnitz7968]

Today

[@jackbartzen9133]

Just started again today, forgot how amazing this game is

[@AzuRemilia]

This day better be today

[@moppermop5287]

When I first saw the trick bench, I was so tired of Deepnest that I didn't even hesitate. Didn't even bother to talk to anyone or question what was happening, I just saw a bench and sat on it.

[@dragoniraflameblade]

Yeah, Deepnest is always emotionally draining familiar to emotional abuse. It's scariest to me that it gets that feeling. But I also love it for that. PLUS did you notice there's 8 of those "nice folks?"

[@dudep504]

Like a spider's legs?

[@dudep504]

@@nalsium2828 its funny AND terrifying. You would be terrified if you see that and its near you, but after you survived the encounter and think about it, you would realize "what the fuck? Thats kinda funny"

[@DerGyrosPitaFan]

@@dudep504 as the saying goes, comedy is simply tragedy plus time

[@miguelbustiogarcia7629]

I remember getting done with this area in my first playthrough and then discovering that I missed the tram pass and just getting that feeling of "Ah shit, here we go again"

[@phillywoody]

"Bench hype"? Well I havent heard that for a looong time...

[@Oneiroclast]

Another thing that adds to this feeling is the fact that a few minutes into the area, the only way to make progress is to fall down a shaft that you can't climb back up. Once you do, you can't just leave. You only have two ways out, so until you either get to the Distant Village stag station or find the tram pass in the Failed Tramway and then find the tram station, you're trapped there. This isn't a new trick of course, Super Metroid did it with the first visit to Norfair, but combined with all these other aspects of Deepnest it really amplifies the effect.

[@noatrope]

(I love your username)

[@Stirdix]

For me it came across more as "anxiety" than "helplessness" although perhaps that's because I got there later in the game than some. (I faced the Mantis Lords rather late, I think.) At that point, it was similar to the feeling of anxiety of the Giant's Lair in Bug Fables - a feeling of "I can make it through this, but it'll require constant focus and willingness to spend my resources."

[@fancyhat_]

are anxiety and helplessness really that different, though? when i’m feeling anxious i’m usually also feeling helpless

[@santaclaus634]

Can relate

[@VolcaronaMain]

I believe i didnt feel anything because i went to the dreamers very late.

[@pinkajou656]

Yeah, you can be helpless without being scared, I don’t think it’s connected with fear.

[@almostirrelevant9181]

The worst part of the first dive into deepnest is going in too deep and trying to get out again. Especially if you miss Cornifer. By the time I realized I wanted out it was too late to retreat.

[@jon9828]

I remember getting lost my first time through Deepnest. Was dropped in from above via fungal wastes. Had no map. The overwhelming feeling of hostility is what stands out in my memory. The game had been pretty cosy up until then. Charming even. But Deepnest was actively trying to ward me off. No orchestral music, just skittering spiders and enemies constantly nipping at my heels. Bugs reanimating was a stark unsettling contrast to what I'd seen so far and the tight pathways felt real claustrophobic. Deepnest was hostile. I did not belong and the denizens there were very actively trying to drive me out. It was a damn cool experience, worldbuilding through mood. I love it.

[@Oolong-Dong]

I felt waaaay more betrayed by the occurence after freeing all grubs. I routinely checked the grubs home during my first playtrough and those little fellas made me really happy.

[@TheAlpacalypseIsUponUs]

Your probably aware now but the grub father acts as a cocoon for his children.

[@500werewolf]

Everytime I think about Deepnest I wonder how many first playthroughs ended there and never continued.

[@Player-si5rx]

im guilty of that. It just breack so much the rythm and makes me feel so uncomfortable that i just don't wanna go forward into that.

[@ARCHIVED9610]

im stuck at mantis lords and broken vessel..

[@500werewolf]

@@ARCHIVED9610 My best tips I can give for those two is: 1. For Mantis Lord's have a certain rhythm to them, you'll have to watch how they telegraph their attack and strike while dodging them. Side step and slash when they appear above you, jump and down strike (aka pogo) off them when they dash across. When they throw their projectiles try to remain in the middle and avoid by jumping over or focusing soul under them. 2. Broken Vessel loves telegraphing what he does so he can be easy to predict what he does. One charm that help most is Defenders Crest you get from the Sewer area below City of Tears as it kills the infection balloons upon contact so you don't have to worry about them. Focus on watching the Broken Vessel and hit him as often as you can. Getting the Shade Soul upgrade helps as well to do a ton of damage along with Shaman Stone (which you can get in the Crossroads area). If this doesn't help I would recommend checking Perpetual Noob's channel for his boss discussion videos for more tips. He has some very useful charm combos that can help and goes into detail on help strategies to use.

[@ender_expert1391]

Mine ended for 3 months until I realized that I can just go do literally everything else. Afterwards I just kinda ran through deepnest while constantly panicking

[@floatingpasta8099]

"I want you to think about *pain* " Not being able to finish the game due to godmaster

[@mothgosally9333]

*gross sob*

[@legrandliseurtri7495]

I mean, I don't think you're really meant to do pantheon 5 with all bindings at once lol.

[@yarn2350]

pantheon of hallownest and hall of gods isnt necessary for 112%

[@chaoscontroller4489]

>You're too young to remember this meme. You underestimate my power.

[@TRak598]

Curiously enough, Deepnest has never evoked such feelings of dread to me. When I first played, it struck me right away how different this reaction was to most people's. Then by the end of the game, specially with "Embrace the Void", I finally understood. But going by parts... First, I found the whole game sad right away. Before I knew a thing about the lore, anything. The art and soundtrack always conveyed this feeling that whatever I encountered by going down that well at Dirthmouth, it all would be covered in disgrace and shame, and with exception of wild creatures (sometimes including these), I would feel sad about them. As being technically the first one you "talk" with, I sympathized with even the Pale King, the Elegy for Hallownest was an awesome insight on one of the Dreamer's Mind (later, I found all of their DN dialogue amazing), and everyone I was lucky enough to encounter with life was somewhat sad and full of regrets. So yeah, I knew the game was not about jumpscares or shit like that. All in all, I knew I was just digging the grave of a lost kingdom (and its neighbors'), and the more I learned about the character I played with, the more I realize how ridiculously strange, cruel, and brutally strong I could be. I also knew I had a soul of some sorts, but whatever raw power was embedded within me made the character nature so eldritch and cold that it felt inadequate to be fearful of what lies bellow. Yes, Deepnest ambiance did make my skin crawl, mostly because it references some horror media (I suppose), and I could feel the temperature drop around me when going there. But that's it. Other than avoiding certain enemies due to dying to them constantly and having total aversion to how hard it is to navigate the area (specially without lights), the area itself felt normal compared to the wildlands of Kingdom's Edge and Howling Cliffs. Desolate, sad, somewhat filthy, but not scary at all. When I reached the Abyss, it all started to click. What lies on that dark pit was what one was indeed supposed to fear. Unknown powers that can't be fully controlled, which were still sought for being a seemingly convenient source of unlimited power. That may fail you not because they lack any strength, but because they care not about your intentions (and you screwed with the "integrity" of the being you created to make use of them). And then, after all your dreams are gone, decides to kill your enemy, not for you, but just because. Well, that's the Knight for you. A hero to many, a prodigal child by soul, disowned by tragedy, and a monster by heart.

[@edwardbo4666]

Etac shadelord: Did you just call me a monster? DO YOU WANT TO DIE!

[@Orynae]

"imagine the state of mind you'd have to be in to not even try to make that pain go away, just give up, accept that the pain is going to happen no matter what you try to do-" Ah, yes- me every single month when I have my period 😂

[@lucyandecember2843]

lmao

[@josoares2478]

Oof

[@carljohan9265]

The difference is that a period is a thing you don't have any control over. The truly tragic thing is accepting pain when you not only have the means to make it stop, but when said means are really easy.

[@dopesickdog]

@@carljohan9265 well, theoretically you CAN control a period, to varying extremes.

[@jordanp4987]

Lol

[@marsupialmole3926]

I never found deepnest to be scary like this, and I think it has a lot to do with when I found it. I didn't explore to the end of the hall when I fought the mantis lords, so I didn't see the door. Instead I looped back and explored elsewhere, coming across the city of tears, the crystal peak and the resting grounds before returning to deepnest. When I did go to deepnest, I had already encountered a false grub, and the hunter's journal told me that there would be more, so I was expecting that. I didn't find the collapsing floors and spikes, or the various ambushes from dirtcarvers or parasite husks to be unnerving because I just internally viewed it as a difficulty bump, testing my reflexes and skill as I moved further into the game, and the false bench in the distant village didn't catch me off guard, because I already had the dream nail and was in the habit of using it on every friendly NPC, so when I used it on the bugs near the bench and it didn't even hit them, I knew I was in for a trap. One I had to trigger, because I knew that the Beast was there and I needed to find them. Only thing that caught me off-guard was the Nosk, not because I believed I was chasing a friend, just because the ceiling attack the Nosk has kept catching me because I was trying to remain above it with nail bounces. It's fascinating how different the experience of an area in Hollow Knight can be depending on when you find it.

[@wahlex841]

Daryl: I want you to think about pain. Me: *distant buzzsaw sounds*

[@mothgosally9333]

*SHAW!*

[@ladyellen7993]

I think my experience with deepnest on my second playthrough is quite telling. It was about a year later, and I had forgotten about the trap in the fungal wastes that sucks you in. The sheer panic I felt was pretty intense, since I knew how bad deepnest was :P

[@JustPhasingBy]

I am a bit of a exploration lover. When I play this kind of games I like to look at every nook and cranny to find secrets or any interesting thing the devs might have left behind for players. But this area changed the way I played the game. For the first time I saw myself looking desperately for a bench, avoiding combat so I wouldn't have to stay longer in that place. The atmosphere, the weird enemies, the constant sound of bugs on the background, all of that made me hate the place but love the experience

[@moth7776]

thinking i was done with deepnest and then having the realization i missed going through a part of it because i was like "eh ill come back to it" and also remembering i wanted to go get a pale ore from nosk was very annoying .

[@ted4979]

As someone with arachnophobia, Deepnest was- a trip. And Jesus Christ, I absolutely pooed myself when I fought Nosk for the first time.

[@santaclaus634]

Yeah, holy shit - that thing was fucking terrifying (and I don't have arachnophobia)

[@ender_expert1391]

I also have arachnophobia and to me nosk wasn't terrifying. At least compared to the foreground spiders which made me cry

[@Brizzle12341]

I had heard of nosk before playing the game so he wasn't too scary for me, but goddamn the corpses that turn into spiders got me so bad.

[@labillustration]

When I encountered the foreground spiders, that was far too much for me. I found my way out as soon as possible and went and explored the other half of the map before I went back. My legs were weak lol

[@ted4979]

coming back to this comment, ive just played through an area in Dark Souls 2, and good lord arachnophobes beware if you play that game. Absolutely terrifying lmao

[@beatfromjetsetradio8239]

11:50 gave me tangible flashbacks to the visceral fear that meme originally imparted in me as a child, and then I laughed the hardest I have in weeks. *CLASSIC meme.*

[@genesischaparro8954]

Everytime I entered Deppnest, I felt like cockoraches were crawling in my skin and when I was out, I felt like I needed a shower rimchild was a god sent, I finally had a companion to watch my back

[@Bacony_Cakes]

Deppnest: Deepnest but every texture is Johnny Depp.

[@ayushwardhan7663]

literally god send lmao

[@themockingdragon135]

Plus the Grimmchild can tell you which corpses have Corpse Creepers in them, because it will continue to attack the corpse even after it's been killed.

[@rosefairy4447]

i also had grinmchild it made it so mych better

[@frostyvoid827]

I deleted the Grimm troupe so my company in deepnest are some locals: the weaverlings

[@deuceditton8831]

The most evil part of Deepnest is the bench at the bottom. Why is it evil? Because the game has you climb up the entire huge height of Deepnest, and just as you are nearing an exit, it drops you all the way to the bottom. Clearly, this is a good time to panic, right? Nope. Bench. Oh, good, I’ll sit. Congratulations, you’re stuck here now, at the absolute farthest possible point from salvation. It goes from “oh good I think I’m almost out” to “ah fuck what’s at the bottom of this hole” to “phew, it’s a bench” to “wait, that might have been a mistake” all in about 2 seconds.

[@goblingoo8061]

Well pain is hitting pretty close to home considering I just dislocated my kneecap 4 hours ago

[@DogeMcShiba]

You could say you were... knee-capitated haha Hope you get well soon

[@onyourleft9273]

@@DogeMcShiba Lol

[@omnitroph1501]

So basically the psychological study was: give the subjects a standardized test. I can corroborate the results of that experiment.

[@Uberransy]

great vid but hey man there's no need to be afraid of bugs, especially spiders. we're not even able to harm you! yet

[@DarylTalksGames]

Ah yes, perfect way to start a Saturday morning. Reading unsettling spider comments 😅

[@SpiritOnAdventure]

W "We're"?

[@arturomacor3615]

Ominous... I like it.

[@ladylad2763]

don't worry though we make improvements everyday won't be that long now

[@greenflavored]

[through tears] dumb spider i bet you typed that with your dumb little spider legs didn’t you

[@i8chocolatecake995]

As someone who recently developed a few chronic issues that cause me a lot of chronic pain, that intro hit harder than the last time I watched this video- helplessness is now a part of my daily life. The doctors have no idea what is causing my pain nor how to treat it, so I'm stuck just trying to cope with it day after day. Being unable to do *anything* about it- being left helpless as my body screams at me that something is wrong, and I can't make it stop. I am not completely helpless- I take my meds, I do the exercises, and eat the foods I need to, but my illness doesn't care. It keeps getting worse over time and nothing I can do will stop it- nothing I do will help with my pain, not pain meds, not any kind of therapies, nothing. It fucking sucks- and I am still struggling with the idea that my body is going to be like this forever. TL;DR: the intro hit me like a 20 ton semi-truck and now I am thinking thoughts :fr:

[@ASquared544]

God I hope we get a Deepnest 2 in Silksong, cause I went into Hollow Knight not blind on my first playthrough and knew what to expect, so I never really went through what anyone else went through.

[@ryanrochon8891]

for your sake i hope they do that too. I really just started playing the game a few weeks ago after leaving it for a while. I had watched enough content that i knew what the deepnest was about, but it still had the scary, anxiety-fueling atmosphere that it would on a blind run. everybody deserves to have that feeling, its so unique.

[@ender_expert1391]

I am hoping they don't do that with spiders. I am arachnophobic and deepnest made me cry multiple times. I don't like that

[@7616lydeth]

Just to give you some idea: Your survival instinct really kicks in. You learned that dying once is okay, as long as you can come back to kill your soul and get geo back, but dying twice means losing all your geos. You don't have a map of the place. The place looks darker than you ever experienced. You don't see any benches. You can't go back (up). The only option is to find the exit, alive. I kept crying internally, saying "I just wanna go home (dirtmouth)". You somehow get to the hot spring and the bench, but there's no stagway station, so you gotta keep going. And reaching that bench where you got stuck and things get creepy? You feel completely lost and hopeless.

[@ricardobr1493]

Same here and i completely agree

[@mercy2572]

Hornet would have an idea on what to do if she were stuck in an area like deepnest, so it'd be cool if this were to happen, the game would take away the things you've come to rely on (like taking 3 masks, putting a binding on soul, and taking the mothwing cloak from the knight before entering deepnest.) so you'd have to work without them maybe facing you with scenarios where you could easily do something with the thing that's taken away, so you have to move an object to cross the path. But a different solution, I'm just not very creative.

[@heliphino]

One aspect of Deepnest I found punishing on my first visit that you didn't mention (and now that I think about it, is in a way a critical piece of reversing that learned helplessness) is that one of the only benches you get, in the absolute safest seeming place at the bottom of that long drop into the hot spring, is actually a spawn-trap. It feels like such a relief to hit that hot spring and feel the relief as you mindlessly hop on that bench, only to realize that you're now TRAPPED very deep into Deepnest, and that your only way out of it is now through it.

[@victormorais5867]

The last bit about inconsistent feedback reminded me of one time playing a guessing game with my friends called Stalin or Tree Basically, you think of something and people guess what you thought by comparing two thing and you select the closest one, to which your friends make another comparing guess, so "Stalin or Tree?", Stalin, "Stalin or Russia?", Russia, and so on So my friend thought "Speed Running", we started guessing, Stalin, Russia, Tetris, Video games, gameplay videos, and we got stuck here. We were pretty close, but my friend got bored because no new guess was closer than "gameplay video", so he started changing the response to it new question, "hoping you guys would get the hints", BUT IT'S NOT A HINTS GAME, IT'S A COMPARISON GAME, so we just passed trough a bunch of gaming terms, without ever getting any closer to an answer, and I swear it was one of the most frustrating experiences of my life when he explained what he was doing

[@metametodo]

I never heard of this game, I liked it, gotta play with my friends.

[@bongibot1104]

My brother who was dashing through the game didn't bother to speak with the cultists bugs in Deepnest before sitting down. I did. I left, found the nearby broken stagstation and sat down. I didn't know what would happen when I sat, but I wanted to be prepared for I sat down. Hell I was so scared I looked at the map seeing where the benches were. Deepnest, while unfun (on purpose) is so fascinating and horrifying to move through. Cool, but even going back for Nosk was spooky. Seeing myself was a mindfricc.

[@_chadrose]

The timing of this is exactly perfect because I've been chronically procrastinating, and am feeling very helpless

[@savannahlevy97]

Yeah...

[@EGRJ]

Make it easier to take the first step, whatever it is, no matter how small. Even if it's just picking up a pencil, or opening Word. Even if you don't go any farther.

[@_chadrose]

@@EGRJ what I hate about it is the more I try and finish some work, the more work gets added and it gets piled up . -.)

[@dustinbaird1158]

You might have executive dysfunction

[@_chadrose]

@@dustinbaird1158 I'll look more into it, thank you

[@LostnWings]

I feel like a handful of us are suddenly learning we've experienced learned helplessness

[@strawberrylatta4234]

this is why deepnest is my favorite area. it’s so mean to the player. there are two areas that trick you into going into spikes- one is a passage going up that looks like a new area, and the other is a pit RIGHT NEXT TO the pit that leads to the hot springs. i really wish i could erase my memory and then play the game again, deepnest was so much fun to go through the first time. and terrifying!

[@jamesa8619]

I am always surprised by how much people found Deepnest messed with them. I get that the ambience is very creepy, and there are all kinds of subversions of previous expectations the game has built up, but it's pretty easy to learn those quickly (okay, so enemies come back when I've killed them now, gotcha; okay, so there are spike traps everywhere, got it; okay, so little assholes pop out of the ground, so wait a bit to see if they do before healing), and then it's just a new area you've adapted to. My partner had a different reaction, but that seems to be because she went in thinking "Oh crap, this area is horrible, I need to leave", whereas I went in thinking "Oh, this area is nasty, but I need to explore it, so I'll adapt". Ultimately, I didn't find Deepnest very disturbing or difficult or surprising, and I think it may be that initial attitude you go in with, but I'm not sure.

[@Not_Aaron_]

Amazing editing on this one Daryl, loved all the special effects!

[@VictorbrineSC]

The Mantis Lords, and pretty much all the mantises, basically "warned" you in a way by fighting you until you beat the Lords. After that fight, they all just respect you. In return I respect them, especially after seeing the bugs they stopped at the Deepnest-Mantis Village border. Seeing a high number of those corpses at the entrance, I realized that something really wrong happened and that Deepnest won't be a happy pink place or something regal or ancient like the rest of Hallownest. After venturing inside that place I wanted to get out IMMEDIATELY. I did everything to recover my shade and just get out and never come back. I was legit scared and felt so small, way too small, giving me an entirely new impression on Hallownest, the Eternal Kingdom, left in decay and ruins. It's not a place you can conquer, it's a kingdom that was once thriving and welcoming but now has become a shell of itself in which you can kinda get lost. Hallownest conquers you. I never saw those grubs, Nosk or other of those traps so this video spoiled me but I don't care, because I absolutely never wanted to go back... *that is until I reached the Dreamers, and saw to my horror that one of them lied deep inside that hell hole on the map*

[@evanswindells5519]

Me: Man, 2020 was a terrible year, hope 2021 is going to be better: Daryl in his first video of the year: I want you to think about pain. Edit: Glad to see I wasn't the only one that felt Deepnest was exhausting. Also that betrayal at 12:15 resonates so strongly with me.

[@emiliohernandez3166]

My first time in deepnest was through Queen's Garden, and I entered thinking it was some hidden part of that zone. Then I notices that it was deepnest, but couldn't go back because I didn't have Monarch Wings, so I ended up exploring deepnest from the back (don't take that the wrong way). That being said, I didn't want to take the Stag Station because I thought "I'm already here, let's explore it all at once". That ended up being a bada idea.

[@legrandliseurtri7495]

Oh wow, I've always wondered if anyone's ever found and explored this area throught Queen's gardens on their first playthrought. I guess I have my answer. Btw, you can go back even without monarch wings if you bounce on one of those ''flying'' spiders.

[@emiliohernandez3166]

@@legrandliseurtri7495 I did think of using the spiders, but my logic was the same as for the Stag Station

[@Garfieldcfc]

I was immediately on edge when I heard the music and the bug spikes. Everything I knew immediately went out the window and was replaced with "trust nothing in this area"

[@braingravy3430]

The spontaneous betrayal, uncertainty, and reversal almost is what made this one of my favorite games. It turns everything suddenly upside down and on its head. Its so well thought out and so clever, yet so manipulative, that it turns it so engrossing and brings your brain in further

[@GavinsCold]

When I first saw the strangers and the bench I IMMEDIATELY thought "Frick" because I knew it was too good to be true lol

[@klosnj11]

No kidding. You get there, take one look around and go, "oh, COME ON!"

[@timpize8733]

For my part, I didn't share this sentiment that much while playing Hollow Knight because I had already played another Metroidvania which feels very similar on this "helplessness" aspect, but ways worse and during the whole game : Rain World. This game is so frustrating because of how both punishing and unpredictable it is, that you often feel there's just no way to go through (which there sometimes isn't but the game doesn't tell you). You don't get to experience the fun exploration first in this one though. But I do completely get the point, and very interesting as always.

[@Lotus_Juice]

When I first went through Deepest, the constant bug sounds were freaking me out so much I had to keep scratching myself as if there were actually bugs on me, and eventually I just took off my headphones

[@aturtlethatisred]

You have described living with a chronic illness. Great video! I feel validated and I understand myself better.

[@kukuhimanputraraharja8084]

conclusion: when you feel helpless, always try to feel in control instead. who knows, maybe in some helpless situation there's actually room to find the solution.

[@goatgang6461]

I love how you always sound so factual. When you do something comedic it makes it that much funnier

[@Hi-yt2xk]

I wonder about how the White Palace effects players, idk, even though I haven't beaten it yet, and there is a really awkward jump I'm stuck at, I still really want to keep going.

[@Hi-yt2xk]

@Verserer Gred Yeah at the end of White Palace I actually shouted with joy "F the Pale King" It was really rewarding.

[@icyleamon]

I remember the feel of betreyal I felt when in Crystal peak I saw a bench sign, and than proceded to fight a boss at the room with the bench. Expiriencing this, I knew something is wrong with the bench in the Deepnest. Great vid, mate!

[@pika4668]

not deepnest not deepnest NOT DEEPNEST NOT DEEPNEST AAAAAAA you can't make me go back there mr daryl man

[@that1guy138]

I feel like the majority of the stuff explained in this video could be used to summarize my Mario Party experience

[@ZMan778]

Literally the fist time I got to the distant village I was so worried cause there hadn’t been a bench for a long time and I didn’t want to die and do it all over again, so when I saw that bench I didn’t even get a chance to talk to a anyone in that room. I had so much anxiousness about wanting a bench that the moment I saw it, that was literally the only thing I could see… Then it wasn’t even real

[@phillywoody]

All this talk about psychological pain and you didn't mention the one enemy that made your voice crack. The Primal Aspid. Good video tho 👍 I havent seen a good 11:55 meme in a LONG time.

[@finallychangedmyname3614]

Me while hearing about the dogs: **Instantly loses faith in humanity for the 100th time**

[@reck7346]

this channel teaches me more than language arts ever did

[@thattimestampguy]

0:54 Hollow Knight challenged Daryl 3:41 Games set expectations and teach how they work 5:02 Deepness 9:49 UnSolvable Problems -> Helplessness -> Lack of will to try again 13:13 So much inconsistency 14:14 1990 Poland Study 🇵🇱 [Lies hurt people] 18:23 Repetition helps 19:32 Happy New Year

[@Duck-re3tm]

I still remember deepnest. I fell into deepnest through the hole. The only game where I felt more helpless was when I fell into the catacombs in darksouls underleveld and had to foght through the wheel skeletons

[@EmeralBookwise]

Deepnest made me more profoundly uncomfortable then anything in any other game I've ever played. It was made all the worse because the way I discovered Deepnest was by falling through that one breakaway floor. With no warning whatsoever I'd become stuck in this unknown pit surrounded by all these unsettlingly creepy noises, and with no clue how I was supposed to get out. Seriously, the soundtrack alone is still enough to set me on edge.

[@ashfur6719]

Deepnest was so unsettling, I loved that area a lot for exactly that reason That Quirrel encounter felt very welcoming lol

[@fubu72]

I also never felt a rush of emotions and betrayal unlike that of the grub trap, it played me like a fiddle done and through, exactly as intended. Needless to say I lost my shit in the process

[@ShikimaKun]

legit got chills from that ending. you did a very great job

[@badishi6807]

I remember the first time I discovered those fake grubs. Can't remember a time I was more terrified when playing video games. AMAZING video!