Putting an Orangewood guitar on the PLEK machine!

In this video I play some varied styles on my new Orangewood Mason Live guitar. I then take a little road trip over to Mass St. Music in Lawrence, KS where we evaluate the build quality of the neck using their PLEK machine. Come along and let's spend over half the price of the guitar to evaluate it and see if it's all it's cracked up to be!

[@69indian70]

I have only heard of the PLEK process. It's very impressive. Seems like it would be a great benefit for a manufacturer to offer as part of their factory setup. Thanks for doing the video.

[@snoozedoctor]

If you have a special guitar, it's worth the PLEK setup. I did on the Orangewood for demonstration, and because I wanted to see what an inexpensive guitar looked like under the microscope. Cheers!

[@AlphaAmigoFilms]

I have had the Orangewood web page open since Steve shared his guitar with us in October. You have just convinced me to pull the trigger on that purchase. Thanks Mark!

[@snoozedoctor]

I was so impressed, I went ahead and purchased the Florence (parlor guitar) as well. It's a little stiff and not as resonant, but still a value considering. Lowering the nut height, like I described above will make about any guitar more enjoyable without causing buzz issues if done properly. Jim was laughing as he filed out the nut saying "these files alone cost half of what the guitar did."

[@joemassey1338]

You are a wise man. I got mine last month and I’m definitely getting another one ASAP.

[@artrogers3985]

That was fascinating. I have seen videos of the PLEK machine in action before but this was great looking at the neck in depth. I bought an Orangewood a month or so ago. Got the less expensive Oliver as I am primarily a bass player. Very happy with my Orangewood. Very much looking forward to the Tull videos. Ian has been my favorite since 1972.

[@snoozedoctor]

I was skeptical but have become a believer. The guys at the store said the material alone would cost more than the guitar here

[@artrogers3985]

@@snoozedoctor I believe it. And they don’t have brick and mortar stores or resellers so there’s no tax. Always a plus. In your video you didn’t mention that, for that price you get a nice gig bag. I was surprised when I opened the box. The KZbinrs had said it came with a gig bag but this one was as nice as one I paid $40 for. I really enjoy you channel. Thanks

[@larryferguson1547]

Thanks Doc. Very interesting!

[@Antakenyam]

Amazing machine !!

[@jimcrowell5093]

I have an Orangewood Echo live sunburst just love it i will be getting a Mason torrified when they become available they're out of stock atm😞excellent review and the Plex way 😎👍

[@snoozedoctor]

Great guitars for the price!

[@daveshearer1961]

I have the Orangewood echo live in both the natural and the vintage sunburst. The natural model is quite possibly my favorite guitar. I put brass bridge pins in it and the tone and sustain is amazing!

[@jimcrowell5093]

I've added ebony pins to mine it added a bunch of sustain and mids pretty much the volume is equal across all 6 strings way better than the pastic pegs. I've replaced a few others with bone and have much the same results

[@thelasttimeididthis6671]

That is amazing. I had no idea. Thanks for sharing! But I thought you might play that buzzing G chord after the fix😊

[@snoozedoctor]

The PLEK is amazing. I took my Collings over and had it scanned recently. The neck is perfect of that thing, as you would expect. The frets were worn down so much, I've played it many, many hours over the 30 years I've had it, that I think I'm going to have to have it re-fretted.

[@stanleykostrzewski7222]

That's really interesting, never seen a plek machine in action.

[@snoozedoctor]

they are fascinating machines. and I can tell you, the setup it does is as good as it gets.

[@snoozedoctor]

expensive though.

[@barbmelle3136]

From Leo: Thank you for posting the experience. It is an interesting machine. I spent part of my life repairing CNC machine equipment. I also spent the last 45 years repairing Amplifiers and guitars for several shops as a side business. I have made necks and done plenty of fret jobs. It would be fun to put a fresh fret job by a skilled luthier on a machine to measure the accuracy of a traditional fret job. How long was the process?. PS, nice playing!

[@snoozedoctor]

Thanks! The process takes about 20 to 30 minutes. My friend Jim that owns the store is one of the top dogs for vintage Martins. Has a tremendous collection of prewar and does all the restoration and repair. He says the PLEK is more accurate and way faster. I'm not sure he has done a comparison though, hand versus machine. That would be interesting!

[@mrmurphy8609]

Wow that was cool never heard of that before

[@snoozedoctor]

Fabulous piece of machinery. I believe they run about 100K so that's why it's not too cheap to put your guitar in one.

[@billpiotter8190]

Thanks for the video. That’s the first time I’ve seen a Plek machine operate. As far as fixing the string buzz, wouldn’t the average person return the guitar for one that worked properly?

[@snoozedoctor]

The PLEK machine is amazing. It costs quite a lot for setup on it but the machine costs $100K so it's to be expected. Yes, maybe what happened is the guitar was setup properly but the neck wandered just a bit as they often do when moved to a place with different temp and humidity. Clearly from the PLEK profile, those few frets right above the G note on the low E were responsible, them being too high. I don't think the average person would put an Orangewood on a PLEK but I wanted to for the video. You can return if not satisfied so that would be the rational thing to do. Stay tuned for a demo of their parlor guitar, the Florence. I'll be getting to that soon.

[@jefbugle6072]

Perfect👍

[@baddhorsie8318]

Excellent review, Mason Live it is then :)

[@snoozedoctor]

Really nice instrument for the money!

[@jt4339]

Imo, the fret buzz on the low E string and the nut height are pretty significant setup issues. I question whether they actually set it up as advertised.

[@jt4339]

As a ballpark figure, how much does a Plek setup cost?

[@snoozedoctor]

@@jt4339 I agree. Although as I mentioned in the video, almost every guitar I've owned I've had the nut filed slightly. There is no reason to have the nut height that high. As you know, it doesn't cause buzzing once a string is fretted since that takes the nut completely out of the picture. I hate struggling with open chords near the nut. The buzzing was only at the 3rd fret of the low E string and that was caused by the rise in the frets immediately above. I think I paid $225 for the setup, almost as much as the guitar cost! Really worth it if you want your guitar set up perfectly though. It allows you to really go low with the overall action without buzzing. Important to me as mainly a fingerstyle player with weak hands.

[@snoozedoctor]

@@Mr.PhatsVarietyVibesShow It does have a very bright sound that I would not call 'warm' at all. Admittedly, I bought the guitar out of curiosity. I also bought their parlor guitar, The Florence. It is quite stiff and doesn't sound too good. Keep tuned and I'll be doing some tone comparisons on many various guitars!

[@Arcturian1111]

8:14 Plek machine, very cool.

[@snoozedoctor]

It's an awesome device. And the setup it produces is as good as it gets.

[@krisrodriguez8452]

Hey man how you describe the sound of the mason live, you feel the bass and mids ?

[@snoozedoctor]

Not much bass. This isn't a guitar I would use to record a solo acoustic piece. However, it plays nicely and doesn't sound too bad. I use it fairly frequently when recording an acoustic guitar into a band mix. You're typically gonna EQ out the bass anyhow and it's easier when it's not there.

[@batman48195]

How did it play now? Better!

[@snoozedoctor]

Definitely better!

[@pmscalisi]

Is Orangewood the new hype guitar of the moment?

[@snoozedoctor]

I think it is amongst the entry levels. I first played a friend's Orangewood and I knew nothing about them. It was pretty nice, a little stiff, but nice. I was floored when he told me he paid $125 for it, new. So I got this one out of curiosity. I'm playing it right now, as a matter of fact. It plays nice and I think it will be a good guitar for strumming parts in a mix because it is so bright. With a Martin, or similar, they sound better on their own but in the mix I end up rolling off so much of the bottom end. Long story short, it has a 'stiff, bright' sound to me, is well crafted and is easy to play, particularly after a good setup. Cheers!

[@PaulEmmanuelMusic]

Are you certain the back and sides are laminate? The website says layered Pau Ferro. From my understanding this literally means layers of the actual wood. Not solid wood, but thin layers of it.

[@snoozedoctor]

Laminate is a general term that just means "layers." Yes, it is layered Ferro. Layering makes the wood extremely firm and hardy. It's not a guitar you'll have to worry about forming cracks. That firmness lessens the resonance though.

[@tigerbalm666]

Is the detailing around the hole a sticker? Are thsoe inlays on the fretboard?

[@snoozedoctor]

They are inlays on the fretboard but I think the sound hole is a sticker. Good one though. The nut is real ivory and not plastic. While not an inspiring guitar, I still think it's a bargain. Played it some today.

[@evakufac]

Based on your last comments in the video you are implying that this guitar is easy to play. However, earlier you pointed out that the string height at the nut is too high making it difficult to fret, therefore, making it difficult to play, especially for beginners. So which is it?

[@snoozedoctor]

Having a high nut is a common issue. Companies want to make sure the open strings don't buzz. Because beginners are usually playing open chords in the first position, lower than the 5th fret, a guitar that's difficult to fret in that area is going to be tiring. I would say, overall, this guitar was easier to play than others I've played in this price range. I like my action very low on my acoustic guitars so they are similar to an electric guitar. With that you're always balancing string height with buzzing. I think these are good guitars for beginners.

[@evakufac]

@@snoozedoctor Thanks for your reply. Have you by any chance tried the OW Ava solid mahogany wood? Wonder what you think of that one. Thanks.

[@snoozedoctor]

@@evakufac I haven't tried that one. I love that body size though. I own the guitar above and their Parlor, the Florence. Not too crazy about the Florence. I would like to try one of their solid guitars. The laminate back and sides of guitars are stiff. You can feel it in your chest when you play them. Either the guitar resonates and vibrates against you, or it doesn't.

[@trevino37]

How much does it cost to plek the guitar and get it fixed?

[@snoozedoctor]

I think it was about $225. It might not be worth it unless you have a guitar that you really like and the frets need dressing, or it's buzzing. Most problems like that can be solved with cheaper measures, but if you want it really accurate, the PLEK is the way to go.

[@VenancioPortalatin]

Very cool video. Enjoyed seeing in detail how the plek machine works. I gotta say every video on the Orangewood guitars blows me away at the tone you get for the Money. The end when you played it back to back against a Martin was shocking to say the least. Did the Martin sound better? Yes, but I'd say by a narrower margin then I expected. I'd say overall my only issue with the sound of the Orangewood was the plugged in sound. Even with a decent brand like Fishman, the Piezo pickups just sound so quacky and fail to every really capture the beauty of an acoustic. If I were to buy and Orangewood(well any acoustic really) I would get one without a pickup system installed and put something better in there like a K & K pure mini.

[@snoozedoctor]

I agree. I don't like the pickup sound. The low bass string is way louder than the other strings too. The Mason guitar is better than I expected. Out of curiosity I bought the Florence too, the parlor sized. It's not so stellar sound wise, but would still be a fantastic beginner guitar.

[@dino335]

The higher end "live" models come with the L.R. Baggs Anthem system. I have an Orangewood Hudson Live, it does not have that Piezo sound. They are on sale right know for $895 -- $100 less than I paid for mine....

[@gregoaks4413]

hey snoozdoc are U in kansas city ? I am Grego

[@snoozedoctor]

I am. You as well?

[@ScottHz]

I’m from Independence originally - might take a day trip to MM on my next trip to visit family! ;)

[@Jasper_Yay636]

Was the Plek expense worth it $?

[@snoozedoctor]

I think it is if you have a nice instrument that is your main and beloved guitar and it needs a fret job. A reputable shop could put it on the plek, scan it, and if it didn’t need the frets done, just charge for the scan. That should be under $100.

[@snoozedoctor]

I’ve had 3 guitars done and the frets are perfect afterwards. No buzzes or dead notes.

[@scottsmith4145]

Ok, but I wonder how much extra expense the PLEK would cost? Probably could just pay a bit more for a better guitar and not have to do the PLEK in the first place.

[@snoozedoctor]

In the video description it says the PLEK was over half the price of the guitar. The guitar was $365 as I recall and the PLEK was $215 or thereabouts. Can you find a better guitar for $580? Probably. I wouldn't buy a cheap guitar like this and put it on a PLEK. Mainly I was interested in how precise they made a cheap guitar like this. It's one thing to look good and entirely another to play well. I've put my Collings and a Martin on the PLEK and the necks were perfect on both. If I had a nice guitar needing a fret job and a PLEK was near, to me it would be better than a hand finish.

[@Arcturian1111]

1:12 Nice Keltic riff. Mines coming soon. Used on Reverb. I subbed, plz do same.

[@snoozedoctor]

Thanks! Which model did you get?

[@whatwouldhousedo5136]

Very surprised that a guitar maker who is trying to build their brand, and claims to "professionally set up" their instruments before shipping would have such a noticeable buzz.

[@snoozedoctor]

The inconsistencies in the neck around the 3rd and 4th frets of the low E would have made it difficult to keep the action low without buzzing there. The 'set up' can only fix so much.

[@kevinbrooks1104]

Not for nothing but I would like to know what this service cost would you private message me with the cost and who to contact

[@snoozedoctor]

On PLEK's website they have a 'finder' tool to find the closest machine to you. The cost will probably vary with the location. If my memory serves me, I think the price of an evaluation is around $80 and a full fret grind, about $225.

[@snoozedoctor]

plek.com

[@kevinbrooks1104]

Boy thier ain't one tree in the Midwest highway

[@snoozedoctor]

Very few out that way!

[@scottsmith4145]

Wth?? They didn't crown the frets???

[@stevenhaywood1195]

You play beautifully and so perfectly! Wow! Awesome! Methinks the gods of music doth smile most benevolently upon thee. 😛cttgaegoaktd

[@MOAB-UT]

It was way off spec until you paid to get it corrected. I would get a Taylor 100 series any day over this. To compensate for a poorly machined neck, you had to damage some of the fret by grinding them down. This dramatically decreases the frets lifespan. I also doubt that machine can nicely round the corners. Buy quality, get quality. You should don't have to try to fix a new guitar.

[@snoozedoctor]

Yeah, I paid to get it fixed so I could do the review and see what the quality of construction was. You pay a little more for the Taylor but it's worth it. Definitely a better guitar.

[@MOAB-UT]

@@snoozedoctor I just bought a Taylor 110e the other night. $799-15% off. They also threw in a ~$150 hard case so the guitar itself was about $500- and Taylor quality all the way. It has a solid spruce top and layered walnut sides and back. It sounds and plays like a dream (no PLEK needed.) The neck and fret finishes are 1st class. Bolt on neck will also be very simple to adjust in the future should it be needed. It's perfect right now. Best of all, the tone is incredible. This one does not have a gloss finish which helps. It sounded more alive than the DLX 110e model next to it (w/gloss.) I planned on buying the D-18 when I walked in. I A/B'd them and the Taylor stood out. I also saved $2,000 but that really was not my deciding factor at all- I had the cash ready to spend. It's important to note that the 110e features their older fwd shifted X bracing which is great. The new V bracing destroys mids and lows. I was looking forward to buying their $3k 714ce but it had the V bracing (since 2018) and I could not deal with the tinniness. For a cheap $200 guitar, I might try an OW but not for much more than that. I have no time of patients to fix a new guitar and remove fret material to compensate for a poorly machined neck. I know several people who returned their OW's for just this reason.

[@snoozedoctor]

@@MOAB-UT Glad you found a keeper. I bought the OW Florence (parlor) guitar, just for the heck of it. Really sucks. I will say, this OW sits in the mix pretty well because you don't have to EQ it much. It doesn't have much bass, the mids are scooped and it overall sounds compressed. Would never record it where the acoustic guitar needs to stand out of the mix though.

[@MOAB-UT]

@@snoozedoctor Thanks for sharing. For a cheap, camping type guitar or a persons very first guitar I think an OW guitar could work. For anything else, go with something better. Ideally one with a solid top. I always recommend trying it in person first. As I like to say, "Grab a bunch of guitars and play them all. Buy the one that grabs you back!"

[@ComicKish]

Looks.like.a.xheap fender or Mitchell or

[@snoozedoctor]

The workmanship is surprising good for such a cheap guitar. Is it a great guitar? No, but it's very playable, and that counts for a lot.

[@staylofordo7111]

I watched the whole video to hear the stupid thing AFTER the plek. Ugh. People