Kickstarter has a major problem . . .

[@aaronarnold6444]

Don’t you think that if you’re going to hit on this very important topic, you should have at least acknowledged your role in creating FOMO and hype videos? Content creators are a piece of the puzzle that has led us to where we are. But ultimately it’s our fault. If we’d stop letting the big companies turn Kickstarter into something it wasn’t original designed to be, then it wouldn’t happen. Looking at supporting Cysmic, talk about a passion project with a creator who’s attempting to do it right this go around. I like where you’re headed here, let’s get some truth telling in this hobby space and let’s take some ownership where we’ve messed up, cause we all created this monster.

[@sethwinslow]

So there have been a handful of games that I have backed based on Quackalope videos, some by Jesse and some by West. Some of these I have played and loved (Oros, I’m looking at you) and others I have yet to table (such as the more recently arrived An Age Contrived). Given that, I hear what you are saying. But I also think there are levels/types of “roles in FOMO,” to quote you. I see “creating FOMO” as a deliberate attempt to manipulate people into backing. That sounds more malicious than I mean it to sound, although it can be malicious and deceitful. But I see that as different from “contributing to FOMO,” this is my phrasing/category, not yours. Contributing to FOMO occurs when a content creator gushes about a game that they believe in and are often backing; it occurs when the content creator is often also feeling the FOMO. I cannot think of an instance where I have felt that Quackalope created FOMO, although I have felt that they felt they were feeling FOMO and their feeling was infectious. Bottom line, creating FOMO is different from spreading/contributing to FOMO. I’m sometimes bothered by the first, never the second. IMHO, Quackalope has done the second, which is shared their enthusiasm, not the former. YMMV, respect.

[@Quackalope]

We had our personal lines established and have continued to refine and adapt them as time has gone on. Early on we refused to charge first time / small publishers. We did not and don't feel right taking money from someone who is risking it all just trying to make a dream come true. We have chosen who we have worked with carefully with as much information as possible (we could have done this better certainly - but no one foresaw the last few years in our space). We have turned down thousands of dollars on multiple occasions because we could not determine a worthwhile audience for a game. While we have seen other creators happily charge and promote what I would consider bad games at best and scams at worst. We have continued to promote indi publishers and have had an open door policy for creators to visit and join us on camera. Despite the impact low views from smaller games has on the channel as a whole. Comparatively, Quackalope over the years has been one of the largest voices for smaller creators and publishers. We are now shifting our focus back to evergreen games. In print games. Fun. I started full time job outside of the industry this month so we can do that ^^^ Sure, we have used some click-bait style titles . . . KZbin's whole system is built on getting someone to click. I have addressed where we overstepped in the past and we will continue to figure it out. The reality is, I would rather be riding that line and crossing it sometimes, over being dead in the water as a channel with no views, no engagement, and no ability to continue making content. We are doing our best. I am not going to apologize for our free content or for our attempts to grow and find a voice in this space. This last year - I have done enough "let's talk about the past" videos.

[@gowest7797]

Cysmic is so great. Aaron, I hope if it makes sense for you that you do back it. It's a true passion project.

[@DennisLHubbard]

@@sethwinslow This is a really well thought nuanced perspective. I'm here for it

[@sethwinslow]

@@DennisLHubbard Ty

[@TONAH]

I feel like this is the 5th you done this exact video with slight variations on the title and thumbnail

[@Quackalope]

Maybe so, I have had and express my frustrations often enough. Granted 5 times in 6 years and 1000+ videos . . . idk. Seems reasonable.

[@thegamesninja3119]

There is a joke about the preacher who kept preaching the same sermon 4 straight weeks. When asked why, the preacher stated that he didn't need another one if people didn't get the one he kept preaching.

[@ViscountCharles]

Pretty sure that a big part of the problem with Kickstarters is FOMO and hype. Although the largest part of the problem is when shills come along and ramp up that FOMO and hype with paid-for reviews, previews and opinions - which in many cases have been entirely influenced by the amount of money the publisher was willing to send the shill's way. But we don't know anyone like that, do we?

[@Quackalope]

Hey Richard, go bother someone else. I’m just a dude with a camera who has been in love with and obsessed with this hobby for the last 5 years. I put 80+ hours a week into making the best content possible for 5 years straight. I slept on a pullout couch in my dad’s house so I could film in my bedroom. I’m not perfect - I’m also not a shill. I have turned down thousands of dollars because games were bad when others took the contracts. I didn’t and don’t charge small publishers because I think it’s wrong to take from those who are struggling already. You don’t see that. You don’t know that. You just see and listen to everything Reddit says. So go nash your teeth somewhere else and find kid dancing on tic tok to bully. Just because your life sucks - doesn’t mean you need to share it with me.

[@ViscountCharles]

@@Quackalope so the previous humility when called out for shilling turns out to have been an act all along ….

[@Quackalope]

@@ViscountCharles For sure. Since online text based communication is the best way to know someone.

[@billcaldwell7904]

I got to meet the team from Rove with my family and they were a great bunch. Crimson Scales went beyond my expectations and I believe Rove will also.

[@Quackalope]

[@mohnkern]

Kickstarter has really become nothing more than a pre-order site now for board games.

[@Quackalope]

That’s what the consumer thinks and feels - however, it’s not how the publishers are often using it.

[@FoeJred]

Not the case! As Jesse pointed out, unfortunately that's just the stereotype that Kickstarter is getting nowadays because of the small minority of massive games that take up most of the conversations across social media. For every massive game that could have been pre-ordered off Kickstarter, there are hundreds of smaller self-published games that would never exist without help from KS backers.

[@Quackalope]

It is easy to look at it this way - but the platform operates very differently from a pre-order.

[@mohnkern]

@@Quackalope I don't disagree, but it's what creators are using it for, square peg and round hole stuff.

[@sidneyleejohnson]

@@Quackalope Jesse, I agree completely. We have ZERO consumer protection from pre-ordering on a crowdfunding platform. Not even CMON's The Dead Keep offered consumer protection for pre-orders (not that CMON consumers need it (knock on wood)). You can do a charge back on your credit card if you pre-order something and have a fail to delivery in the retail market space. This is a HUGE difference.

[@Krimson62]

I dont see a problem with bigger companies trying to gauge interest and using the money to improve production. For example i backed the yokai septet reprint, because it is probably the only place it will be sold (i tried it while it was unavailable and wanted it too lol) I wont spend 100+ on a game anymore. I wont back games with more than 1 box. And i wont back games that dont fit on a normal table

[@joeymckinney7310]

Bro I agree with what you said at the start but this is an infomercial

[@Quackalope]

Maybe, maybe not - What small pub games have you backed?

[@Mike_James]

Twoid games. (Two-id). Fall of Lumen and Legends of Void reprint. games arrive tomorrow, ahead of schedule. cant wait Gravity Games. Utopia. top notch components and unique worker placement Black Moon Books. Champions of the Hundred Halls. Coop card game in the world from the novels from the same creator OneMoreTurnGames. Ascendancy. 4x worker placement and a ton more. tts mod is excellent still time to support these are just a few. id rather support a NEXUS or a Chaosium game than anything CMON regurgitates. not all are hits, but neither are the games from the big boys. still, i do enjoy seeing what indie creators take chances on. that sense of discovery is great, plus youre supporting real creativity

[@sirguy6678]

Great video and analysis by a influencer and leader of kickstarter FOMO-

[@Quackalope]

Haha “leader” see long winded response by me bellow. How about an excited fan who has ebbed and flowed right alongside the community. I have backed 200 projects, lost on some, spent 6 years filming and obsessing over the industry - but sure . . . FMO leader am I ;)

[@adamnikles7335]

I love these new discussion type videos! Keep up the great work, Jesse! 😊 I am also backing Rove and have stopped backing as many games as i once was. A lot of games that are coming out that have caught my attention lately are sequels so i ask myself - how much have i played the original? If only once or twice, i dont back.

[@Quackalope]

Awesome! Thank you! We have too many games XD

[@BoardGameCasualChannel]

While I appreciate the opportunity Kickstarter gives to smaller game publishers, I've just never been a "kickstarter guy" and prefer to wait for the retail version of a game.

[@Quackalope]

See, I have been a back everything addicted kickstarter . . . So many times

[@BoardGameCasualChannel]

@@Quackalope Come join the "retail only" crew! Things are a lot more casual and relaxed here. 😎😅

[@tadej.vengust]

I like your videos, but..... Everytime when I come to video about Kickstarter, I see that you guys (big KZbin channels) don't do your homework properly. In USA many things are so much simple. You have large retailers, who actually get good prices and can offer discount. And you actually don't need Kickstarter for preorder. But outside. I live in Europe, and Europe is not one big country like vast majority thinks. I live in country with population only 2milions. Yes whole country not one city. We have 3 retailers, who sell up to max 10 copies of best selling games. But usually up to 5. So for us Kickstarter is important because games are delivered from HUBs in Germany, Netherlands, France.... . There are not many publishers that has theirs own HUBs in Europe (Stonemaier is one of a few), so they or don't ship from USA to Europe or shipping is extremly costly (like 100$). And the we must pay import cost (10-15%). And many of publishers cant afford to build their own HUB on every continent. But for Europe it is still somehow OK. But when we come to South America or Australia..... Shipping to those are even more costly, and games harder to get. So maybe you should check how important is Kickstarter to countries outside North America, and make video for that.

[@moo2k4]

I personally don't back indie publishers (or at least indie publishers making their first game) because I've heard too many horror stories of games from smaller companies simply not delivering. Is that a bit presumptive of me to assume that they won't get the game out or won't get it out in something close to a timely manner? Absolutely. But when I'm spending north of $100 on a game that doesn't exist yet, I want to ensure that it is eventually going to exist. So as much as companies like Awaken Realms or Chip Theory or Cardboard Alchemy don't *need* my money, I at least know that when I give it to them the game is going to arrive, even if it's a few months late, because they have a track record of delivering on those games (and also not asking for more money after the fact). For the smaller companies with the especially ambitious game? I can't guarantee that, unfortunately. Capitalism is a rough thing, and I have to make sure my very finite money isn't being lit on fire for something that may never get done.

[@ragrayspace]

Grown men complain about a platform for their slow realization they should be careful how they spend their money. Like what?

[@Quackalope]

That’s all I’m complaining about . . . Absolutely :) you got it! Good on you! Keep it up!

[@quashmonkey]

I have historically backed most awaken realms projects however the games have fallen a bit short of my expectations. I really like IV studios and how reliable they have been and really enjoy their games. Orange nebula have also been good. I have tried keeping my collection small so normally back more mainstream games so haven't really backed any first time indie developers. Played skyrise recently and keen to get it retail once available from roxley games😊

[@burgsrus]

Kickstarter the company just does not care about these knock off companies/failing companies. Because they have gotten their money. This is why I have stopped backing games on Crowdfunding in general. While I get that you are pushing Rove, it just does not appeal to me. As I was not a fan of Gloomhaven.

[@Quackalope]

Yep, totally makes sense :) this is not about pushing Rove it’s about supporting the small and indi pubs who invest everything in our space - and often get burned up and pushed out in spite of it.

[@burgsrus]

@@Quackalope I think the issue is people just have lost faith in Kickstarter as a platform. I know I have. They just don't care once they get their cut of the pie. So, if a project is funded it just becomes a slog to get your game. As the other issue is many designers are coming to the platform with less than half baked ideas that they are asking for money for and then basically taking the funds they get to send prototypes out to content creators to beta test ideas and push hype. Then and only then will they move the game to development. So, we are paying them to develop the game. I've backed out of two games in recent years because of changes on the "fly". One more major and the other to include solo play. This is why I've moved to more of a retail strategy. There are plenty of great games out there and I don't need to fund these Crowdfunding platforms. Yes, this might hurt the small indie dev's (though this is kind of a hard term to define as many game companies are small) but I've just been burned too many times. I mean Garfield Games is basically two guys. But I'm sure they are not considered indie.

[@JacobPorterLadder]

It's a double edged sword. If the CMONs and Steamforge leave to do direct to retail. Then the eyes aren't on the platform to highlight the other developers/publishers. If Kickstarter like Gamefound did a legit Pre-order option that might be a good work around. But I agree in general that CMON and the other giants shouldn't need to go the FOMO route with their games

[@Quackalope]

It’s been a system that has worked - but with more and more companies failing to deliver and using backhanded tactics to “keep the ship afloat” the ones who do it legitimately . . . Are going to pull the short straw sooner or later.

[@binnieb173]

Kickstarter has 2 huge issues. 1. Lots of crap. 2. The gems don't have large enough runs to print... So when you do get an amazing game on kickstarter, their print is finite and we can't get more games out there. By they time it's all done and the game comes out, and people like you tell us to buy it... it's sold out, won't print again, and you can't find the game anywhere for under $150. Kickstarter has given us some amazing games. But those are far and few, and only like 10,000 copies are ever made. Which doesn't really serve the gaming community all that well.

[@sidneyleejohnson]

I really want to support Rove, it looks amazing but I have a huge back log in this space (not just playing the campaigns but physical space) but I like the suggestion that you could just donate a $1+ pledge to the cause. I've actually NEVER thought of just dropping a $1 into a campaign that I had NO intention of being able to back. Sure I've dropped $1 into hold a spot just in case a couple times but it for whatever reason never occurred to use as a tip jar. Well said. Now I really wish I had donated to a bunch of other projects that I thought were cool but didn't think I could fit into my space (time, and shelf). I think the other downside to tossing a $1 into it is you do really create a spam effect in your email. Would be nice to say take my donation but leave me out of the communications. lol. I guess donors can't be choosers.

[@raider363]

you're right. I don't need Rove but I backed for $1 because they deserve it.

[@TimYoung1984]

Have you heard about what all Funforge has done in the past 18 months to backers of the Monumental reprint and expansions?

[@Quackalope]

Nope, please inform me?

[@TimYoung1984]

@@Quackalope They said they would deliver in 2023, then said they’d deliver before summer 2023, then they said that some backers may be on vacation during the summer so they would not deliver in summer 2023, then they said they’d deliver in fall 2023, then they said they’d deliver in waves in 2024 including one large wave in which North American backers in January 2024. Their final update was November 2024. This is the update they said the game would deliver in waves, and the US backers would get the game in January. There has been no update since November 2023. They said they’d only post updates in the official KS update section, but repeatedly posted in the comments section where their comments would get buried amongst the comments: Their only communications employee left the company on April 15, 2024. They have not updated any of their social media sites since April 16. They have not responded to anyone on KS since November 2023. The CEO did an interview with Boardgamewire about a month ago and called backers fantastical. boardgamewire.com/index.php/2024/05/10/three-years-late-and-months-without-an-update-funforge-ceo-expresses-frustration-that-monumental-kickstarter-is-still-not-ready-to-deliver/ In the interview, the CEO said that Funforge would update backers any the end of May, but that never happened. It would seem that Funforge took the money from the Monumental KS and used it to pay to deliver Namiji and they fund other aspects of their business. This is what the CEO calls fantasy, but Namiji didn’t deliver until well after Monumental’s campaign. And, to run salt into the wound, Funforge announced they are releasing Monumental Duel, a new game, and it would seem that it may very well release before anyone gets the KS version of Monumental: And, lastly, Funforge promised they would not be releasing Monumental into retail, which is why so many people backed the project. They went back on their word, and released it into retail. The game has available in retail for over half a year now, and has been discounted at times by 60%. The only content creator or person in the industry that has reported on this mess is Boardgamewire. Some, including me, reached out to Alex Radcliffe and he mentioned it in a video, but really, there is little to no pressure on Funforge to fulfill the project that raised over half a million dollars.

[@saveversus]

Like plenty of things (stocks, right now crypto), there's little regulation, and people are bending the hell out of the rules without breaking them (if not outright breaking it).

[@Quackalope]

The market is new and the "boom" we have seen in the space is new. So, even well intentioned actions will lead to a lot of damage.

[@andrewclifton185]

Still awaiting Adventures in Neverland (The Irony) - 4 years since funded!!!

[@Quackalope]

I have a pile of them that will probably never show up. :)

[@GameStorm68]

Where did you get those player Organization wooden things?

[@Quackalope]

Gloomhaven player dashboard by TowerRex

[@GameStorm68]

@@Quackalope Thank you!

[@Quackalope]

Go ahead and get a set for me while you are it . . . XD they are so beautifull!

[@mohnkern]

I've actually yet to have a game fail, and I've backed well over 1000 games. Really late? Sure, not very good, absolutely, but not one game that I think I've backed has failed.

[@Quackalope]

That’s a good record and some smart backing :) I think I’m on game 6or7 that looks like it will never arrive to me.

[@mohnkern]

@@Quackalope I had one game, Manhattan Energy Empire , where the creator died right after then end of the Kickstarter. I was sure it was dead but the estate sold the Ip and $ to a publisher who finished production and delivered the game to backers

[@carlking9088]

Kickstarter not going after scammers is a joke, they get their cut then do absolutely nothing if the creator just disappears. Also, major companies like CMON, Warlord Games shouldn't be using Kickstarter when they vod easily just put out the game themselves. Also, companies like Mythic Games should feel ashamed of their handling of their Kickstarters.

[@Quackalope]

I think the platform(s) should do more policing of the big guys in the space. The mythic debacle could have been predicted and avoided if anyone at KS saw their books.

[@Dianikes]

Greed. Pure and simple.

[@mohnkern]

THe game I think best typifies what's "right" about Kickstarter was Dwellings of Eldervale, and what's "wrong" are the endless series of Cmon projects. Doesn't Cmon have enough money to make their own games without crowdfunding?

[@Quackalope]

Dwellings is a funny one but that’s a different conversation. It’s been completely bungled at the finish line with no reprint insight and a painful delivery.

[@mohnkern]

@@Quackalope hmmm I was part of the first release and don’t recall any significant problems. But it’s been years. I got my game and it was amazing (and still is)

[@Quackalope]

The game is amazing :) that is accurate. It's the post KS handling thats been a bit of a mess.

[@Corey_Adler]

Happy to see I'm not alone in the CMON disdain!

[@mohnkern]

@@Quackalope Weird, I haven't had any problems at all.

[@nicholasteller6574]

This was a 20 minute ramble of nothing.

[@RiHa_Games]

I tried to back the 🐦 but she still hasn't shown up😜

[@Quackalope]

Haha she is working and sleeping :)

[@mlg4lyf]

speaking of kickstarter have you seen The Wayward Realms on kickstarter, it looks extremely promising but I do agree with the overall topic Kickstarter has changed for the worse over the past few years