Pathfinder 2E - How Spellcasting Works | GameGorgon

[@kwagmeijer26]

You guys missed rituals!

[@Althaven_]

SUPER surprised it took this long for someone to point that out, lol! The video got too long, but we haven't forgotten! :)

[@kwagmeijer26]

@@Althaven_ haha, good, cause I think its the one part of spellcasting I'm most shakey on.

[@Barrlounge]

@@kwagmeijer26 Rituals are a bit weird as you don't actually need to be a spellcaster to be the primary caster in a ritual. So I kinda get why they left it out of the generic spellcasting.

[@jasontheconner6120]

@@Althaven_ "nate this map" on the shirt?

[@NecroDevistator]

Yeah I am a little confused on rituals. Is there a place to find an in-depth explanation?

[@boswcheydoesart1314]

On my character sheet, I'll write the page number in the rulebook after a rough description of the spell. Really helpful. Highly recommend.

[@Oneiroclast]

Enchantment has always been way more evil than Necromancy, but seems to get a free pass.

[@Razdasoldier]

If it was Harry Potter the quote would be "Never an evil spell that was not from Necromancy" while enchantment would have all the unforgivable curses.

[@natanoj16]

@@Razdasoldier Only 2 of them. The Death curse is 100% Necromancy ^^

[@jackeldridge4225]

Great spellcasting tip... When you play a spellcaster get a notebook. Each new spell you learn copy the entire thing down in your spell book. Not only will you know where it is easier, it will help you remember the spell.

[@Althaven_]

That's also pretty flavorful if you ask me...like you're literally roleplaying your spell book, lol. Well, if you're a Wizard it makes sense. :)

[@JacksonOwex]

I was actually going to start printing the pages with the description from PDF versions of the books so I didn't have to write them out. Though I suppose you could type them and then just print the words and get the same effect as writing them would. Printing the actual pages can get pretty ink intensive!

[@jackeldridge4225]

@@JacksonOwex The writing them down is a memory technique. Write them down you tend to remember them better making book search easier.

[@nocteexmortis979]

You guys missed an important note on Focus spells: They are always heightened to half your level, rounded up, like Cantrips.

[@kaibeasley5965]

Really liked what you did with divination where you showed the next school. I know it’s a little thing but I just really liked it

[@Althaven_]

Super happy the little things are appreciated sometimes. :)

[@g2e1d1d2y]

Your videos are so well-spoken and put together, and just so easy to watch... Loving your content!

[@Althaven_]

1. Thank you. 2. I love your name. :)

[@MagnusMendax7]

Glad there’s a video format for spell casting, been waiting for this so my players aren’t confused by my 40 minute ramble which ends with “just read this chapter.” You guys are a real help in providing concise information in an easily digestible way.

[@Althaven_]

I am so happy this video helps! We are never going to tell you not to share! lol!!

[@MagnusMendax7]

QueueTimes the content you guys make is exactly what Pathfinder 2e needs, 5e is so popular because of the strong brand and new player friendly approach. You guys take what can confuse newer players and condense what they need to know AND offer opinions on how to improve it at the table. Super excited whenever a new video comes out great work!

[@JB-yg3ew]

It certainly can be helpful. But I'm not so sure about the concise part.

[@bobr4024]

My comment is about House Rule/simplifying the structured play of PF2. I use your simplifying the process of Identifying magic etc as a base. PF2 is a VERY STRUCTURED game. When we start to dilute the structure of PF2, we get D&D 5e. (I play both BTW). The Structured design is the BIG difference. There are enough rules in 5e but much of the process is IMPLIED rather than STRUCTURED. In short, if we are going to embrace PF2 then LOVE the STRUCTURED play or we might consider playing a different, LESS STRUCTURED - Rules heavy, game. My 2 coppers. AND... I truly enjoy your videos! Thanks for your hard work and lighthearted approach. Happy gaming!

[@andreaferrari1308]

In my opinion, with the change in the spontaneous heightening (now signature spells) class feature, I don't feel the need for a homebrew option for spontaneous spellcasters. One spell per level to heighten freely, plus the freedom to cast your spell without needing to prepare them is just good enough for me

[@Icanhasmovies]

Awww man that loud noise at 4 minutes woke up my cat!

[@TacticusPrime]

So instead of having spell lists for each class, they can just have spell lists for the traditions and assign classes to the traditions.

[@Althaven_]

Correct! It's more flexible this way, since in some instances, a caster can potentially choose from a variety of traditions (sorcerer, for example). :)

[@Mittens_McG]

@@Althaven_ Divine casting healing Sorcerer is a dream come true. Makes me wonder how the Oracle is going to stand out from it.

[@jeffnorton8428]

I’m trying to run a one shot in a few weeks and these types of videos are very useful for a 5e player trying to switch! Thanks guys!

[@elischrock5356]

You guys brighten my day. Thanks.

[@jeremymerkt3526]

I knew there was a reason I stayed up till 3am. This better be good because work today is going to be rough.

[@Althaven_]

Tell me about it, I edited it. GL tomorrow morning. ;)

[@SerDerpish]

In response to 14:26, this also applies to any feat which gives the user a cantrip; ie, the elf’s otherworldly magic. So NOT just for monsters, even if using just the core rulebook 😊 Just thought I’d point that out. Great video! Cheers 🍻

[@Ozmeth]

This also Innate Cantrips always heighten. It specifically says this on the feat Otherworldly Magic but in the description for Innate spells it also says it. Arcane Sense which also grants an Innate Spell only allows it to be heightened with your skill level (Expert, Master, etc)

[@cz1822]

The reason charisma is the default stat for innate spells is the same reason it's the stat used for sorcerers to cast spells.

[@BestgirlJordanfish]

I like PF2E more than D&D 5E in almost every single way, but god I feel spells were easier in that game for me to understand. Super dupes thanks for the vid!

[@Althaven_]

You're quite welcome! If 'ya have any specific questions, feel free to send 'em!

[@Mittens_McG]

As a person that has played both, and really doesn't enjoy most aspects of D&D 5E: Yes absolutely. D&D 5E magic is easier to understand and more versatile and fun for the players. You could argue it makes the casters a bit stronger than other classes, but I would take stronger caster classes if it meant my players would play casters. In two games with 5 people each I have 1. They're very casual players so I get it, but with no healer classes it makes setting up combat interesting.

[@BestgirlJordanfish]

@@Mittens_McG Yeah. I think PF2E's biggest problem is that they didn't push accessibility and partnerships. So much could have been made a little faster and easier in formatting and play. I like casters being marginally weaker or at least less overtuned, since they generally have more "controller/leader" effects in debuffs, buffs, heals, area of effect, range, versatility, utility powers, and problem solving environmental options.

[@pascalviens927]

You can cast spells at lower levels via Bard Signature Spells! You can choose a spell per level to know at heightened levels, above or below.

[@shock_n_Aweful]

Spell casting in PF2e is where you wait/hope/pray for just the right conditions to present themselves for your spells to be worth using your very limited spell slots on and hope for a crit success for them to work well. Otherwise play a martial character if you want to be effective in most situations

[@iquaniqua]

I'm gonna GM my first game in a few days and I think I'm gonna handle identifying spells something like this: Anyone can identify common spells of a level equal to or lower to player level/2 rounded up (will refer to this as *X* ) without rolling. For people with access to spells slots, if you have access the the tradition of the spell that's being cast you can identify what the the spell is being heightened to up to *X* and can identify any common spell in your tradition higher level than *X* without rolling, but have to roll to identify heightening beyond *X* (on a failed roll you know it's at least *X* ), for spells outside of traditions you have access to you have to roll for the stuff your tradition knows for free. For uncommon spells people with access to spell slots people with access to the spell's tradition can identify spells up to *X* without rolling, but have to roll for any identifying heightening and spells higher level than *X* , others have to roll to identify the spell. Of course if you have access to an uncommon spell you'll identify it by virtue of having access to it's tradition and then you can say you have it and get any heightening knowledge up to *X* without rolling and rolling for info on heightening beyond *X* just like with common spells.

[@nathanaeltaylor1234]

What I do for heightening on spontaneous spellcasters. That if they want to cast a spell at a higher level they must use that higher level slot.Ex: they want to cast a lvl 2 spell as lvl 4 they use a lvl 4 spell slot. When it comes to signature spells I allow them to highten it for “free” once per day. Ex: they wanna cast a lvl 2 spell as a lvl 4, they can use that lvl 2 spell slot instead of their lvl 4. However if they want to heighten that signature spell again it will cost them that higher lvl spell slot.

[@victoirevim9698]

I love your videos. Pathfinder 2nd edition is very exciting, it breaks conventions, so you have to re-learn everything. You guys are making this easier. Thank you!

[@Althaven_]

Ohh!!! Thank you!!

[@FTGxSoJuFoRcEs]

Around 13:20, Croog talks about focus points coming back through refocus. Later on aroind 12th level in most caster classes there is a feat that will let you regain 2 focus points during refocus instead of one.👍

[@GroundThing]

Since you talked about homebrew rules for spontaneous heightened spells, I figured I'd pipe in, even though I know this is a few months old. Here's how my group does it: You can heighten (almost) any (+x) spell to any number below your max spell level for free (so, for instance a 9th level sorcerer could cast a 4th level fireball without knowing it at 4th level, or selecting it as a signature spell, but couldn't cast a 5th level version without knowing it as a 5th level spell, or selecting it as a signature spell). If it's a spell with a specific level of heighten, you can select one level, at daily preparations, that that spell is, but you can't cast it at a higher or lower version, unless you select it as your signature spell (so, for example, if you know Resist Energy, and you don't choose it as a signature spell, you have to decide at the beginning of the day if you want it to be a 2nd level version, a 4th level version or a 7th level version, and no matter which slot you use, it gives the effect that you chose, assuming you could cast it in that slot). Otherwise, you have to choose it as a signature spell.

[@GroundThing]

Also, I haven't run 2e yet, but based on my 1e GMing, and my experience with 2e, I'd agree with your stance on players knowing their spells. Something I expect I'll carry over from 1e to 2e is mandating that players have an index card for each of their (at least most common) spells, that includes everything about that spell, so it is easy to reference if anything comes up.

[@alananimus9145]

There's two ways to homebrew a spell for a lower level. Increase the DC, or half the effect.

[@driftinHank29]

I could be wrong, but I'm pretty sure there are some instances were you can get a focus spell, but not a focus point. For example: If you play a Champion, you get a focus point for your initial devotion spell. The ability states so, and it qualifies as the first time an ability grants you a focus spell. If you later take the Champion version of Deity's Domain which states, "You embody an aspect of your deity. Choose one of your deity’s domains from those listed on page 441. You gain the domain’s initial domain spell as a devotion spell." This feat does not state that you gain a focus point, nor is it the first time an ability gives you a focus spell, thus you would gain a focus spell but not a focus point, if I am interpreting the rules correctly.

[@manituan4956]

I couldn't have explained it better. Now I can send this to my friends, so I don't have to :)

[@XxLasTxReBeLlioNxX]

The thing about occult magic that’s bothered me is the fact that its not consistent across classes; take bards for instance, bards and sorcerers almost sound like Warlocks now, mostly sorcerers do, but the occult magic for bards is mostly they draw upon legends associated with things (items, tall tells and legends, or even songs) in the world, to me they sound more like arcane instead of occult spell-casters, may just be me but sorcerers depending on your origin are either sorcerers or warlocks practically. Like I said consistency is the hard thing for occult, i like the idea but I feel like that school or domain was kinda last second, how is occult and divine not polar opposites? Also arent demonicd blood sorcerers considered divine instead of occult? Idk Occult i think should be polar opposite of divine and its not used like that imo or its not differentiated, I mean i think itd be cool if clerics could gain access to Occult magic if they worshipped dark or evil deities instead of divine. Thats just my opinion idk if anyone agrees with me.

[@kevinbarnard355]

Are you familiar with the Occult Adventures book from 1ed that this magic type was introduced in? Many of the classes were based around "the power of legends", the history and importance of items, and resonances with spooky places. Bard totally fits that model. Historically bards were also part of the Druidic orders of ancient Celts. Priests who were tasked with remembering the oral traditions of their people, and using those myths and legends to teach later generations.

[@VioletMoonfox]

I think it's weird that spontaneous spellcasters have to learn each heightened version, when a wizard can do just know the base version. Seems counter-intuitive when a spontaneous caster has fewer spells known.

[@kevinbarnard355]

It isn't unreasonable to argue it should be the opposite, at least from a logical perspective (which doesn't necessarily belong in a fantasy game). Prepared spellcasting is meant to be formulaic, planned and rote. It would make sense to insist a wizard knows each altered formula in their book. Spontaneous casting is meant to be impulsive, repetitive, and second nature. It could be thought of as more likely to be heightened with ease as they are more practiced with a few spells, "innately" knowing the limits of their personal magic and how to stretch them. My guess is because many spells based on enhancements or hexes have dramatic differences when heightened. going from 1 target to 10 is the equivalent of a "mass" spell in 1ed. This would qualify as a different spell back then, so that might be part of the reason.

[@zoulsgaming9455]

One of the ways that i could imagine using a lower level spellslot thematically would be to summon a spell at an even level, say a level 4 fireball, and then while you have it in your hand drag half of the spell into the other one, so you have a 2nd level version in each hand, that each takes the appropiate action to cast, and whatever you get with heightened +1 you get as -1, so you deal 4d6 with the level 2 fireball, and you still need to spend 2 actions on each throw of them. Or mechanically you could reverse the wizard "spell blending" thesis which sacrifices two lower level spellslots to gain one of 1-2 above, so instead you sacrifice a level 3 spellslot to do as described above but in a single action. Slap it into a feat and voila.

[@geswut3144]

I’ve always seen occult as drawing from the energy of collective thought. Bards draw upon legends because they draw upon the psychic energy that the audiences of those legends produce. An occult sorcerer would have enough of that energy in themselves to cast their spells from their own psychic energy whereas bards draw upon an ever present aura of all living creatures’ psychic energy. That might be completely off the mark but I feel it fits since the psychic classes in 1e were called occult classes.

[@diamondportal77]

Your interpretation would help occult symbols have power too. Like a rabbit foot giving you good luck.

[@dimitriid]

For identifying (Out of combat) I set up a DC fairly high for the party then ask the relevant skill check tied to the type of spell depending on who's casting (Religion, Arcana, Nature and Occult for Divine, Arcane, Prime and Occult) . Only on a critical failure they do not learn anything useful (Which is going to be common since I am setting up DC way above their level) on a failure I usually describe it as if they were detecting magic, a success accurately describes the spell and a critical success accurately names it and can give em a general idea of how to go about obtaining it if they want. I feel this keeps within the spirit of the basic skill check or basic saving throws of the game while still keeping some important, plot related spells and effects at least theoretically accessible but in practice it's just going to entice em to find more: a spell or effect just turned into a story hook and that's the beauty of it.

[@ArBee123]

For identifying spells I tell them the spell as metagame knowledge, if they have it prepared, they know it. If they dont, the characters dont know whats happening but the players understand.

[@DJchilcott]

You pet the cat until the cat is done to refocus.

[@simonburling3762]

Some ancestries also have innate spells, usually cantrips. Elves and Gnomes have ancestry Feats.

[@Joseph-wc6qd]

I appreciate the videos. Thank you

[@truebeliever320]

I like the action economy of spell casting in Pathfinder but overall I like spellcasting in 5e. Having to select slots for different spell is just to restrictive compared to just having a pool of prepared spells.

[@bosshogg8447]

Then just pick a spellcasting class that doesn't have to prepare spells?

[@kevinbarnard355]

@@bosshogg8447 It's not quite the same. A prepared caster in 5e can still swap their spells everyday yet doesn't have to lock them into specific slots.

[@Eduardo-ns1yu]

if im for example a necromancy wizard may I cast spells from other schools? or I am able to cast only necomancy's spells?

[@Althaven_]

You can put any spell but your signature spell needs to be necromancy if I remember correctly

[@Eduardo-ns1yu]

@@Althaven_ okay, thank you!

[@000Dragon50000]

My houserule is that "spells" per se don't REALLY exist in-universe, so without a feat you can only really roll for a general impression of what a spell might do based on indicators you can observe, with an easier DC to anyone who matches the general casting method (A Divine Sorcerer would get this advantage watching an Oracle cast a spell but not a Cleric, for example). However, since Counterspelling is dependent on knowing what a spell is, the feats which help one identify spells still work more or less as RAW, just that out of character I will tell them what a spell is and let them attempt to counter it if they so choose..

[@MrAsymo]

Undercasting most likely won't make a return, since a lot of the "Greater X" have been just... merged into the original spells with heightening.

[@allan67]

You really make the magic simple. well done. Makes me think about how I run magic in my own game. especially re: magic combat between casters. love your work guys. Informative & funny. Just a shame you guys love alchemists so much. Bleah.

[@Althaven_]

Hey! They are fun and unique lol

[@Althaven_]

Excuse me? We don't BOTH love the alchemist. Those icky, sticky, swill-slinging pyromaniac drug dealers have got NOTHING on monks.

[@allan67]

@@Althaven_ Yeah.... they nique up on you. Where are they pulling all those ingredients from anyway?

[@allan67]

@@Althaven_ FIST! the spell that keeps on giving.

[@divinkitty9452]

Occult is definitely a weird one, so I mostly grab from other sources for where it comes from, specifically the Occult Adventures book from 1st edition where it was from a sort of eldritch... psychic ability that they possessed, or would take inspiration from other sources like Drakengard where, for example, a Bard kind of uses the very fundamental rhythms of the universe and at first it sounds like music, but as they gain in power their spells cast with music take on this sort of... eldritch sound to it, and then by 20th level you're basically doing 5's boss fight opening cutscene level stuff from Drakengard 3. Edit: now, after finishing the episode, one thing I house ruled was... I don't have my rulebook on me, but spells like Colour Spray where it "doesn't affect stronger foes" I house ruled where instead of it not affecting anything as well beyond... third level I think it was, I have it where it and similar spells with the trait I'm thinking of instead has it where it works normally on things your level and lower, but it doesn't work as well on things higher level than you, simply because of the way encounter building works in 2e and the fact that players will liiiikely not be fighting level 3 creatures at level 15, so I wanted to make that spell and spells like it not be a dead spell after a certain point. Additionally, I never house rule the heightening thing with spontaneous casters because a) ruins the point of Signature Spell, and b) I like having my players really think about their choices and make meaningful choices that go with their character, rather than being like "oh I nab the best spells for each level".

[@kevinbarnard355]

I was under the impression that was how "Incapacitation" spells worked. If the target is higher level than your spell's level x2 , it's success is one tier better (crit failure counts as failure). Are you suggesting using the Character's level instead of the slot's level x2? This means it (potentially) works on targets of any level, but you can't use level 1 spells to knock out weak will save mid-level baddies. I think that's the point behind using the spell's (slot) level as the check rather than the PCs level. I feel like the game intends for you to use low level spell slots for buffing and exploration, while combat scenes rely more on offensive and control spells from higher tiers of magic.

[@RagingWyvern]

Awesome thanks

[@Althaven_]

You're QUITE welcome. :)

[@Rocksteady72a]

I'm a total newcomer at tabletop RPGs, so this helps! One question about spellcasting, can a sorcerer learn and cast a cantrip from outside their tradition? For example, an Aberrant bloodline (by my understanding) can only cast from the occult spell list. So can I learn the cantrip acid splash, listed as under the Arcane list, or just the Occults?

[@Althaven_]

Just Occult by default but I believe there are ways to learn outside your bloodline with feats and archetypes

[@Rocksteady72a]

@@Althaven_ Okay, thank you! I was under the impression that the Crossblooded Evolution feat was for standard spells only, I guess, so I was confused about the Cantrip side of things. Thanks for such a quick reply!

[@kypsalis]

No time to watch at the moment, but I've already clicked subscribe 2 minutes in. You guys are entertaining as hell.

[@raymuniz3841]

How about homebrew a shield spell that explodes against an attacker. Can that belong to evocation school?

[@Momoryuto]

Expected the opening to be one of yous saying "It doesn't" and then cut to the ending. But yes, please read your spells... please!!!

[@marc-antoinegirard2103]

The rarity of the spell for me determines the DC of the arcana/religion/occultism/nature check

[@freeadvice1695]

I am Nate son of Nate. My spells are in me. 😶

[@zamba136]

Nate Nateson, welcome

[@melorbode]

longer casting times may allow you to cast a higher spell at lower level..and rituals..

[@brothermutant7370]

How to use a spell at a LOWER level than you can cast it? You use the "Lessen" or "Diminish" metamagic feat. Lessen/Diminish metamagic allows you to use any spell of a level higher than level 1 at a LOWER level using a lower level spell slot. Its effect is to lessen the effect of the spell by decreasing the spell's effects/duration/area of effect/range/etc. By how much you might ask? Glad you asked. You lessen or diminish these stats by the new spell slot level number DIVIDED by the original spell level (rounding down). EASY PEAZY. You're welcome.

[@dicemediagroup6374]

Ok...need to do an example of spell heighting.. NEW ERRATa old players. SO I can cast 7th level spells and my cantrip is auto hieghtened to +7 ?

[@aamirhussain26]

Is there a problem with house ruling free undercasting for spontaneous casters? So if they know fireball at level 6 or we they can cast at level 1 if they want to.

[@Althaven_]

I can't answer specifically if this is going to be "balanced" or "fun" for you and your group(s). What I CAN say is that if 100% of the people at your table find that a house rule makes the game more fun, nothing else matters. :)

[@aventuraenlafogata649]

I just checked because I recalled that bards and sorcerers had something like this. Their signature spell feature says that if you know a spell at a higher level (fireball lvl 6) and you have it as signature spell, you can undercast it, but only as low as its original spell level (so fireball lvl 3) I can imagine a fireball lvl 1 doing just 2d6 damage. But other non damage spells may be a bit of a mess to balance in lower levels than originaly intended. But hey, if players are on board, it could be interesting :)

[@kevinbarnard355]

@@aventuraenlafogata649 you would do well to dramatically restrict the area of effect too if you allow fireballs in 1st level slots. That is WAY more effective than a burning hands spell.

[@Metal-Spark]

Hey guys, I'm completely new to PF and was hoping one of you (or the folks in the comments) could help me out. I could be wrong but it looks like Rogues can't cast spells because there's no spell table in the CRB for them - if I have a concept for a character who is a Rogue but I want to use magic either for flavour or to provide some extra utility, how would I go about doing that? Is my only option to multi-class?

[@Althaven_]

Basically and Archetype is your best bet. You are correct, a Rogue can't cast spells because of a specific class ability or feature, but there's lots of Archetype options that'll give you spellcasting! :) Is there some reason you don't want to take a dedication feat? :)

[@kevinbarnard355]

There are 3 ways to do so without multiclassing. Any character can cast Ritual spells, whether they have spellcasting ability or not. This still requires you to be trained in the appropriate skill for the ritual casting. The other way is with the "Trick Magic Item" skill feat. This allows you to use your training in one of the knowledge skills relevant to a tradition to fake being a caster. You can then use scrolls, wands, etc and feel like a "caster". As a third, rogue specific option, there is also the 2nd level feat Minor Magic.

[@CraigSteinhoff]

Great video....so you never really discussed what disrupts a spell...it seems like a few examples might help. Is there something like "concentration" to prevent spell disruption? Also currently we have no home rules for heightened spells.

[@linus4d1]

"Various abilities and conditions, such as an Attack of Opportunity, can disrupt an action. " (CRB pg462). It does not say that there is any save against the disrupting action. As far as I can imagine, the disrupting action will need to be a triggered action or reaction. For example, the fighter readies an action to shoot the wizard with a crossbow if he starts casting a spell. On the wizard's turn, he starts to cast a spell. The readied action is triggered and a bolt flies toward the wizard. If the bolt hits, the spell is disrupted. At least, that's how I understand it.

[@CraigSteinhoff]

@@linus4d1 so it appears that regular attacks do not "disrupt".. Only action like the fighters "attack of opportunity" can disrupt. An interesting fact...spells that are "verbal" only do not trigger an "attack of opportunity" since they are "concentration" actions. There is a fight specific feat to trigger on "concentration"...i do not remember it. That is why there needs to be more discussion on the subject. :)

[@linus4d1]

@@CraigSteinhoff good to know. Thanks for the info

[@thrawn82]

evocation: RIP my ears

[@gmphiljuth]

Clutch video

[@JoshTheValiant]

I need to reread this section, but my understanding of how Identify Magic works directly invalidates Counterspell. Which seems like a huge oversight, and makes me think either I missed something or the developers play faster and looser with these rules than I assumed (which moves back to oversight territory, but I digress). I would prefer to make spell knowledge easier with less rolling necessary, especially in combat. There's enough that can slow down play as it is.

[@crashinworld14]

Identify Magic is an exploration activity, so it doesn't interact with spells like Counterspell does. You're thinking of Recognize Spell, the skill feat. Both Recognize Spell and Counterspell are meant to deal with spells as they're being cast, while Identify Magic is meant for long-term effects (potions, glyphs of warding, dominations and charms, that sort of thing). Recognize Spell and Counterspell work separately. Recognize Spell requires that the spell being cast is not in your repertoire or in your list of spells prepared. Counterspell is the exact opposite. The only time the two interact is for the prerequisites for the Wizard's Clever Counterspell feat. At that point, it's implied that you're such a good wizard that you can recognize a spell as long as you have it in your spellbook and could prepare it at all--that's just how good with your spells you are. Recognize Spell is still good for such wizards, too, since there are spells that wizards won't ever have in their spellbooks.

[@rayeaton37]

So at roughly 7:43 you start discussing prepared casters, but don't say what "list" they use exactly except what class they have. In other words, so Clerics & Druids get to peruse the whole Divine or Primal and then put what they want from that list into their prepared group for that day? And if so, since Wizards get the same amount of slots, but are limited by only a list consisting of only what's in their spellbook, why play one? I don't exactly get it.

[@aotrom]

Can you prepare or cast a spell at a higher level that has no increased effect or isn't quite high enough to gain additional benefit?

[@aventuraenlafogata649]

Yes

[@Althaven_]

Would love to know where you see this written! :)

[@aventuraenlafogata649]

@@Althaven_ sure. Page 299, spells. Heightening spells. Any spell can benefit from heightening because counteracting effects depend on spell level. So, a lvl 5 Bless is equal to a lvl 1 Bless in terms of its effect; but the counteracting DC to, for example, trying to Dispel a lvl 5 Bless would be higher than a lvl 1 Bless.

[@kevinbarnard355]

@@aventuraenlafogata649 glad to see that pointed out. I've seen lots of people unsure if upcasting is possible at all without a "heightened" entry

[@buronix]

hey I have a question about swapping spells from a repertoire in downtime, I see nowhere to find about specific times to swap a spell in your repertorie during downtime retraining.

[@Althaven_]

That's because there is no pre-defined time. Check pg. 502 under "Retraining". It basically says "the GM gets to figure it out based on the situation". :)

[@buronix]

@@Althaven_ Thanks for the amazingly fastest response time known, I will talk with my table.

[@Althaven_]

Good luck! :)

[@scrip3799]

If your GM would like a guideline to start from, Pathfinder Society Organized Play chooses to have it take 1 week to swap 1 spell!

[@cultofthebloodgod429]

I actually prefer the understanding of occult and divine as occult being old mysterious knowledge , or ancient power but is not derived by an ancient god and for divine I see it as just your faith or belief and not given by a god

[@devontravis7768]

How long does persistent damage last?

[@kevinbarnard355]

Until you overcome it with a Flat DC 15 check (30% chance) which you attempt each time after taking the damage. You'll see that in the Persistent damage entry of conditions on page 621.

[@taylorjensen3000]

Great explanation, but the music under the entire video is extremely distracting.

[@lloydgush]

There no map, 10/10, great for a cosmic horror campaign!

[@middlemonster]

I mean, couldn't you just say any spell with Heightened +1 can have Lowered -1? Just apply the bonuses as penalties.

[@kevinbarnard355]

not always. The benefits of heightening are sometimes spiky. Power Word Stun wouldn't scale down well. a 2nd level spell that can autostun a 1st level creature for 1d6 rds

[@jhyarellesilver8397]

Occult can be thought of or as Gnostic. Gnosis is the common Greek noun for knowledge (γνῶσις, gnōsis, f.). ... It is best known from Gnosticism, where it signifies a knowledge or insight into humanity's real nature as divine, leading to the deliverance of the divine spark within humanity from the constraints of earthly existence.

[@adrianpintea9675]

The soundtrack seems to not match the tone or speed of the speech. Too techno for the subject matter too. :)

[@Arcsecant]

Arcane = science Divine = gods Primal = the Force Occult = Cthulian powers

[@kevinbarnard355]

Primal is also Elemental Bending or "Captain Planet". Occult is also "Gypsy mysticism", and shamanistic traditions.

[@clanpsi]

7:24 Not at my table! This is definitely one rule I very strongly suggest everyone house-rule out of their games. It's a ridiculous, pointless limitation and there is no legitimate explanation for its existence other than to make the game less fun.

[@cowmanthe3rd]

They mention this at the end

[@michaelrubino5897]

I disagree. Spontaneous casters would be far better than prepared casters this way.

[@clanpsi]

@@michaelrubino5897 I agree, which is why prepared casters should be able to do it, too.

[@chipperdrewski]

The rule that a prepared spellcaster has to assign a spell to a spell slot when preparing spells and has no freedom to reuse previously used spells doesn’t match the lore of spellcasting at all. It also is the most intrusive element of PF 2e when it comes to player choice. Stupid idea. I’ll never do it that way. The D&D 5e way is so much better for making things fun for your players.

[@stepsonstevic964]

Thanks to Dr olworo who helped me bring back my ex after many months of sepreation with no cost

[@dicemediagroup6374]

Everything is good except...so please talk about cantrips about hieghting

[@Althaven_]

They are auto heighted to your highest spell level. So if you can cast 7 level spells your cantrip is 7th level as well

[@Arshoon]

What I don't understand is why after 45+ years of D&D and it's "children" products we are STILL using the horrible Vanican magic system. Spell slots, memorization and preparation are horrible, illogical systems for magic. Just because something has been around a while doesn't mean its good and we should keep it. Its high time for D&D, Pathfinder and all the D&D clones to adopt a more fluid, dynamic and logical magic system.

[@kevinbarnard355]

There are many systems that have done away with Vancian magic. There are often optional rules systems even in p1 or D&D to do just that. Words of Power, True Naming, Binding, to name a few. Fate and Mage come to mind for non vancian systems.

[@PoppaRocks87]

Dislike solely for the eardrum blowout

[@cydthemagi]

I will be making people roll for every spell, but the DC will vary. Will most likely use Caster Level + spell level, with +/- for rarity, and you must use the Skill associated with the Tradition. The reason I am making PCs roll, is magic is not a perfect science, so how one culture learned to cast Arcane Fireball may be different than others cultures. Also sometimes you see sometimes people have brain farts and don't know easy info when they need to.

[@BLewBerriez0]

You mean rolling to succeed in casting the spell? If so, be very careful about this rule. If you were a player and lost a spell slot simply because you failed that roll, you'd probably be pretty salty about it. This rule is a nerf on all casters, and paizo was careful to close the gap between martial and caster encounter endurance and this idea widens that gap. Plus, it doesn't really make sense for spontaneous casters because they're channeling it from their core, like muscle memory when trying to balance on a small beam or any reflexive behavior - people don't just "forget" how to use their legs.

[@cydthemagi]

@@BLewBerriez0 I meant identifying spells