Rape Survivors Say Brigham Young's Honor Code Kept Them From Speaking Out

Two female students say they were afraid they would be expelled if they reported their sexual assaults but decided to share their stories.

[@ladze77]

Am so proud of these ladies for speaking out.

[@BrookieLikesCars]

ladze77 YES!!! I was sexually assaulted in high school and it sucked not being able to go to the cops because I didn't want to go to court. So brave to go to the cops

[@rileyscott5827]

Infuriating to hear this story. The school is being supportive?! Bullshit. Their behavior is outrageous and disgusting. That police officer should've been fired.

[@leftcoastgal5134]

Brave woman, honorable father!

[@liyaadam2226]

Brave women but not honorable father, that’s what a father is supposed to do.

[@SparkzMxzXZ]

what kind of cult university is this.....? downright disgusting.

[@wotmot223]

It is an accredited University. There is a contractual agreement to that code when you go there, it applies (and is applied) equally to all student, Mormons, non-Mormons, male and female (despite what this story has to say). The first young woman was already in violation before she was raped ( compromising pictures). And who the HELL cares more about going to a University than brining a rapist (your own rapist) to justice? It is to bad she didn't go straight to the police, and to the University authorities. Having said all that, there is no excuse for the University to allow ANY information exchange between the title nine office and the honor code office, especially in the case of a police report. And the woman who told the second woman that they couldn't help her because there was no proof of rape should have been fired on the spot, and not allowed to hold a job there again (IMO). Hopefully either BYU will change its policy, or people will stop going there. I used to belong to that church, I even went to BYU for a semester, and there was a joke going around that most people went there to find a husband or wife, rather than for the education. I wouldn't recommend that anyone go to a church owned, and controlled by a religion (personally).

[@israrhussain7701]

SparkzMxzXZ I think that when you go there you know the terms and conditions of it. Then you sign a contract having read the terms and conditions. So there is no need to break them. Properly behavior is required from YOUNG MEN AND WOMEN. BUT BUT IF RAPE HAPPENS THEN IT SHOULD BE dealt with effectively and quickly. But I do know of cases where the girls weren't raped and said that she had and course put the men through hell and they have lost every thing until they were processed and proven not guilty. So I think that young people need to be told about what will happen and be told not to brink to celebrate their end of exams incase this happens then you will lose your place are scared for their future. In case they lose their place.

[@LeonardoDiax24]

SparkzMxzXZ religion is disgusting ???? Stop being disrespectful stupid Bitch

[@alexandriacandler2877]

Mormons...

[@madalice5134]

Leonardo Diax Respect is earned, asshole. And Byu is a disgusting, shameful place where people use their religion to excuse crimes and silence victims.

[@BrianCheng24]

This university needs to be shut down.

[@israrhussain7701]

Brian Cheng Yes but it is a Christian school. But know that it is coming out may be it will get better.

[@numba1dds]

Mormon school

[@jizzythefroggy1108]

Mormon is not Christian you genius.

[@jennhoff03]

Shantra Mulani- It actually IS Christian. Its full name is The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-Day Saints, but that's a mouthful. :)

[@RaachelGail]

+Jenn Hoff that's mormon lmao

[@maddiebest414]

I can feel that there are so many girls out there right now, in this moment... who feel like they can't speak up. And BYU has shown that they punish for not speaking up. This needs to change.

[@Clifford95998]

For the second girl, her attacker was given no jail time even though he admited it on a police recorded line...both the justice system and schools do not do enough for sexual assualt cases..also this video said that less than 40% of rape kits actually gets sent to crime labs...in many of these cases it looks like the LAST thing the court wants to do is punish the rapist

[@nancygodsey8312]

If that 40% number is true, rape is condoned, almost like it's celebrated.

[@hannahlouise8348]

As a former member of the Mormon church. They do not care about their members. They care about their reputation. Inside of the church there’s more abuse and nothing is said. The families are abusive. The people who attend are abusive. The entire program is not healthy. Leaving that church was the best thing I have ever done.

[@helenclark3627]

it reminds one of winston blackmoore case who was tried and found guilty of incest, rape, and coercion of minors. he was from that church of latter day saints in Creston BC

[@jeffsmith9420]

Its simpler than that: They care only about money and power.

[@sbnsbaker1]

As an LDS woman and as a mother to 2 daughters who have already graduated from college, I can tell you that BYU or any college, would hear about it from the rooftops and the newspapers and the cops and social media......I have NEVER heard of such a ridiculous code of having to be silent in a situation like this......I can't think of any other mother who would let this happen to their daughter and not be ENRAGED!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[@devincampbell5007]

I would make sure the College doesn't even have that kind of bullshit honor code before i take my son/daughter there that way they won't have to be even more afraid of saying they were raped

[@obeyjesus1973]

Would anyone like to hear Gods word?

[@ash12317]

As a Mormon I can testify that the when religion is based on blame and guilt. Especially when it comes to sex. Women are taught at an early age that their body is sinful and needs to be covered up ( or else they are sinning). If a man rapes a women. They ask her what she was wearing, doing or if she orgasmed to make sure they can shame her... I mean " save her" through Christ

[@carlasullivan3637]

Mormons are straight up freaks in a cult.

[@markrichards4505]

@@carlasullivan3637 I agree.

[@florah78]

Grateful these two lady pioneers helped pave the way, since this video has been posted a formal amnesty clause has been added

[@mjohnson1741]

Too little too late and that does not address the massive pedophilia problem in the church that's been covered up too well. How the HELL and why would ANYONE stay in a church that BACKWARDS and EVIL.

[@penpaper2989]

How is it that a person thinks it's okay to force someone to have 'sex' with them when the other person does not want to? Why are prison sentences for rape such a short amount of time in many states? I'd like to see life sentences for rape but that may be unlikely to happen anytime soon so at least mandatory minimums of 20 years.

[@woolfulrebellion]

👏👏👏

[@gabrielas3793]

Also what heck kind of honor code is that????????? How is this even real? Are we not in 2017? HOW IS THIS ALLOWED?????

[@codename495]

It’s a collage run by the LDS church. That whole cult is wrong.

[@kjohnson4556]

Alright “code name”. Chill out. As you can see the comment section is full of these “cult” members also agreeing how wrong it is. The school’s honor code office has been under reform the past couple of years because of how many mistakes it’s made and how it hurt many of it’s students. I am a faithful member of the church myself, went to BYU and experienced the wrongfulness first hand. Thankfully while I was there there was alot of changes made, and the excuse of “well you chose to come here” is FINALLY being put to rest to protect victims as well as LGBTQ students.

[@thechariotcard]

Sometimes I wish there was a way for these MEN to figure out what rape and it’s consequences are all about.

[@hansboersma4354]

I’m encouraged to see that BYU has stepped up and made changes in 2017 and 2018 to support victims and provide honor code amnesty, and have a sexual assault survivor advocacy for those students victimized. Just make sure there is continued support and follow through for the these programs by BYU to ensure our youth are treated with respect and sensitivity during these crisis situations.

[@hansboersma4354]

The human factor will often stifle even the best intentions. Better training and follow up must be included for those who may have to make judgments and recommendations.

[@thechariotcard]

I am so proud of those women who spoke out! What bravery!

[@PavusthePug]

I really hate living in this state in 'happy valley'. It's like a twilight zone here of insane stuff like this.

[@ash12317]

And they are ironically the most depressed, drug dependant and suicidal people in the country

[@damnedyankee946]

Like the Stepford Wives ( circa 1972 )

[@twiston43]

It sounds like Switzerland.

[@woolfulrebellion]

Have you read,Under the Banner of Heaven?

[@AlexZ-lc6nl]

That’s why I hope to move away when we graduate BYU next summer

[@enigmaticvaran6597]

"Do you prioritize the safety and support of rape victims?" BYU: Well, yes, but actually no.

[@martinaskupin9549]

Studying a university without caffeine? How do they control that? They go from room to room and make tests, what students drink?

[@technerdchic]

I was raised in the mormon church... I always felt there were "unspoken" rules that were expected to be followed. Sexual Assault is not viewed as the victims fault - at least, OFFICIALLY... But, the general underlying feelings I'd say many mormons have about sexual assault do fall in line with blaming the victim... Not said openly, of course, but that is the underlying feeling surrounding it for sure. I believe many members of the Mormon church subconsciously, and even sometimes consciously believe that in gods eyes, they are somewhat superior to non-mormons because of many vague implications found within the teachings of the church... Sunday school teachers encourage children and youth to strengthen friendships with mormons, but to just "be a good example to non-members" and even discourage friendships with non-members all together. They teach that Mormons are elite and special and on this earth to help christ guide all of his other 'lost' sheep back home (to convert non-members). Although these particular teachings weren't originally meant to say that as a Mormon we were somehow better than others, one can see how easily these could be misinterpreted. And the real tragedy is that these "you're a little better than others" messages that are taught to kids as young as age 3, during their crucial development years. Undoing these subliminal messages that were firmly anchored in the subconscious at age 3 or 4 years old later in life is near if not absolutely impossible. It becomes a part of their identity... "I am superior because I am a mormon". They live by high standards, with strict guidelines, which although is noble and respectable often times can serve to feed their "closer to god" ego. Since they are (at least on a subconscious level) superior to everyone else and somewhat elevated and closer to god, they naturally feel they are somewhat immune from the more severe evils of the world. Of course this is a completely false sense of security. So when something bad such as a sexual assault happens to a fellow mormon, rather than realizing they're godlike identity maybe skewed, to say the least, they chose to instead assume it must have been the members fault if something that bad happened to them. Its just far easier to silently blame the victim than to re-think one's entire identity as well as become aware of one's own vulnerabilities to danger. I don't still attend church, but I am still a member. I don't have any problems with the church or its teachings really, because, for the most part, the teachings are all noble and promote love and goodwill, and the people, in general, are good people. They are upstanding individuals who value qualities such as service to others, honesty, integrity and love. They really do have the very best of intentions, its just that a few got the wrong message while learning about these Mormon standards and those wrong assessments quickly spread like a virus. This a major problem that the Mormons really need to address... I know many, in fact, EVERY Mormon I know who no longer attends church, states that this is the one and only real reason they no longer attend. As a member who is definitely NOT superior to being human and who definitely knows how to mess up royally, the judgement by other members is unbelievably cruel. Rejection and even abandonment from Friends I had had my entire life we're just a couple of the repercussions of screwing up as a member of the church. Judgement is something the church teachings say is wrong. But again, the underlying reality is that the Judgment within this church is so bad, it's intolerable for many. And its a tragedy to know that it's all really due to their inability to restructure their entire identity. There are victims on both sides of this - its just that one is more obvious to people than the other. Sorry, I didn't expect my comment to go so long! Guess I had a lot of feelings on this subject that needed to come out. And hopefully, I was able to shed a little light on this issue based on my experience. Anyway, thanks for listening!:-)

[@kerrymarris4260]

Tammy J represent.us.com

[@kerrymarris4260]

So you must have... Joe.

[@GlennaVan]

@Joe A. it is information for people who want to read it. If the person chooses to write it, that is fine; if you choose to not read it, that is fine as well. Often, others are genuinely interested in what others think and why - it's part of the learning process.

[@nordicpandi]

When I grew up in the mormon church they would say things like "you don't want to even have the appearance of evil, so you don't want to be seen being around non-mormons" It was only ok to be around non-members if you were actively converting them. If they can't be converted they should be shunned. The mormon church also very much discourages learning from outside sources or questioning things in the church.

[@tofumar]

Sheriff's deputy needs to be dealt with. Harshly. Without mercy. In a way that leaves permanent, visible marks.

[@mitziclarendon6354]

I’m so sorry to these poor victims. I’m grateful that their parents helped them and didn’t turn away from them. My daughter attended BYU and I would have been so angry if she had to endure this kind of trauma and incident. She did go on a few dates with a guy who was (many months later) arrested for felony rape (not her, but she was so sad for his alleged victim ; it certainly hit very close to her heart), and he faced 15 yrs in prison. He was later released on house arrest with ankle monitor. He had the nerve to send her a picture of his monitor when he got out!! Sick, sorry monster that he is! Not sure how much time he actually served but it was several years. That being said, this piece also bothers me because the parts of it that show students walking around on campus were obviously not filmed at BYU.

[@rogerlundstrom6926]

Such honour code where a school think they can decide for what their students do outside of school hours is appalling to begin with.

[@maddymorgan850]

Right? And how would they know what they do outside of school??

[@mitchellyoung8561]

It's a private school, no one is forced to go there. If you wanna smoke, drink, go to Starbucks and get laid, go to Fresno State!

[@InterestingMK]

@@mitchellyoung8561 Sounds about right.

[@mitchellyoung8561]

@@maddymorgan850 The whole point of an 'honor code' is that you voluntarily obey it.

[@scottcharney1091]

That's Mormons for you.

[@womaninthewave]

So you can get kicked out of BYU for having a cup of coffee??? What planet is this school on cause it’s not earth

[@kennak5984]

They call the valley happy valley because everyone is on prescription pills

[@woolfulrebellion]

Yeah I lived there, they should mention that. The Mormon women avoid caffeine etc. But are doped to high heaven on anti depressants because their main job is popping kids out. Also I have some kids myself, so I understand.

[@eeeeggnog._.]

@@woolfulrebellion very few Mormons really avoid caffeine

[@woolfulrebellion]

@@eeeeggnog._. Obviously, they love the soda

[@woolfulrebellion]

@@eeeeggnog._. I am so ridiculously addicted to the black gold 🤷‍♀️

[@gregphilipmusic]

Those two guys come across as such ghouls.

[@SouthernSpice_MamaBear]

Being a victim of rape in no way violates the honor code!!!! :(

[@cocolime6496]

The problem is that these people see no difference between sex and rape :/

[@bob15479]

coco lime, this video is misleading. they make you think they got kicked out for rape and that they don't see the difference between sex and rape when really they were kicked out for infraction that ACCOMPANIED the rape. like in this case the porn/sexting the girl was doing or in other cases getting drunk which is against the rules.

[@jryj0913]

i agree with you

[@alishabielak6643]

@@bob15479 which means that those who have broken the honor code won’t report and rapists use that to their advantage. Don’t you think that it’s more important to hold rapists accountable than expel a rape victim for a honor code infraction?

[@bob15479]

@@alishabielak6643 I agree that was 3 years ago and I freaking hate mormonism and byu now

[@whhe11]

Religious extreamism is bad in any form. Even buddists have violent extreamists some places. Maybe an extreamist jane would be pretty chill but even then give them a utilitarian mindset and an explication of the damage man causes the earth and see what happens.

[@Danielito9320]

Mormonism is not extremist. BYU has nothing to do with the religion if something bad happens. The church does provide help but the school is different. The honor code was created by a group of students which every universities have. I like everything on the code but I don't like how two policies contradict each other. I don't like byu (mainly because I am not a fan) and I am Mormon who loves the gospel. Education is a place to gain knowledge and succeed not to go to parties that provides alcohol and drugs and sex. If you're going to school for fun then your wasting your parents money. I heard that they are actually trying to come up with a better plan for rape victims.

[@kera9389]

I hate the “honour code” … I wasn’t allowed to wear ducking flip flops on campus. It’s ridiculous!

[@alexforce9]

No one forced you to study there tho.

[@kera9389]

Hah no , so I quit . Went to a normal university

[@Getyourown216]

Happy you found your way 💜💜

[@gabrielas3793]

Father of the year.

[@valiciaayze539]

A lot of sexual stuff happened to me, being threatened with pictures and harassed and stalked, I never told anyone and I just let them all go. I thought I was doing the right thing, honor code and all. And all the abuse and ppl I never met blamed me and put so much shame in me. Still to this day I haven't told anyone and I'm pretty sure no one would believe me. I'm a Mormon to so idk if that might have a lot to do with my life cuz it's been extremely hard on me. Thank you for sharing and I appreciate your bravery.

[@Overthetop242]

I would say that by posting this, you are speaking up and that is such an important first step. Maybe you can find a confidant or trusted therapist to continue with that. It is so important to have support and validation for these crimes, and I pray for the return of your happiness and peace. That belongs to you.❤

[@LathaLukose]

So strong these girls are

[@marisolpalaciostrejo7764]

Those rapist need to be in jail and victims helped. The school needs to do a better job of paying attention to their students. Everyone needs to pay attention to what everyone is doing.

[@drewzifer]

The broadway play "Book of Mormon" now has another act to add to the show.

[@RingoHalliday]

The fact that they only helped her re-enroll after proof her rapist was convicted adds an extra layer of madness to this. For those who do not know, sexual assault cases are among the least convicted cases of all crime. This stems in part from the unwillingness of many prosecutors to even try the case to begin with. They often feel there is not enough evidence, and/or it's just "he said she said" and a jury is left to decide who is more believable. Of the cases that DO make it to trial, many of them fail to convict, once again often due to a jury having to decide in a "he said / she said" trial. You add to this that the defense will often paint the victim/survivor in as negative a light as possible, making it very difficult for a survivor to even want to go through with the trial themselves. In the end statistics show that only 1 out of every 1,000 sexual assaults leads to a conviction. Tying up her ability to return to class on those odds is just not right.

[@olddoug8945]

WHY THE HELL WOULD ANY WOMAN EVEN THINK OF ENROLLING THERE.

[@kevinraymcgaugh7164]

She shouldn’t get into trouble because she reported a rape

[@genellecampbell5378]

As a Mormon, this is especially disturbing. Guess I have a new project to work on.

[@Qaill1]

Genelle Campbell Your new project young lady, is to see that Mormonism is the Occult. The brainwashing that happens to naive girls like this one, is birthed in Mormonism's brainwashing foundation to exist as an Absolutely Ridiculous cult. Please stop the brainwashing within yourself and those around you.

[@genellecampbell5378]

Qaill1 There are 2 groups of Mormons. The Fundamentalists, (the FLDS) and then regular Mormons like myself & my family. I'm not brainwashed at all, I live my life the way I want it, just like every other denomination of Christianity. That was a very ignorant statement you made, especially because you had no clue what you were talking about.

[@bob15479]

Genelle, Yes BYU did a bad job in general dealing with rape issues but this news report doesn't give the full picture. The girls didn't get kicked out for being raped, it was because of other infractions of the honor code that led to the rape. For example, the girl in the video was evidently sexting or something like that. And others have willingly gotten drunk, then gotten into trouble etc. So then when they go to report they also have to admit to breaking the honor code. It's much more nuanced than the video makes it out to be.

[@nauasipesiopalanite6004]

I grow up in the church n yes I am not brainwashed by the church n hearing this is make me so angry coz you hater take it wrong

[@rangergun]

Why would go to that type of school?

[@danthedoozy9472]

That honor code creates a safe environment for people who hold similar values. Doesn't mean incidents like this shouldn't be rethought.

[@whhe11]

Daniel Keith Driskill Its such a bad idea put someone in a cultural, political and religious echochamper in the most important stages of their mental development tho.

[@einc70]

William England William England nope. 90% of students that go there were raised Mormon. It's like they were "oblivious" of the honour code. That's the first thing that pops up in the brochures and application. Those kids were at fault once they knew they were bridging the Honor Code. Getting in a lewd relationship with an online stranger, a "twice the age" guy might excite teens that's perfectly understandable that they want to discover and experiment life. But not without consequences. That proves. Promiscuity, pre marital sex, narcotics, alcohol, porn, anything DUI related that lead to "dependency" is a no no!! to the Church. There is a perfect reason for it. Those Mormons girls knew that from day one. HOWEVER, I reckon that the school system can be intimidating in certain situations especially when a school environment expects its patrons to a high standard of "self worth" by the end of their graduation. Which creates the illusion that those kids are "perfect" which they aren't. The school needs to step out their comfort zone especially certain people in position. It's not the "school" per se. I'm also an alumni myself. Half of morons commenting in this entire thread are weebs and know jack about what's going on. Nuff from me.

[@saradanser894]

einc70 , you are NOT OKAY Those girls are NOT AT FAULT FOR BEING RAPED!!! GOING ON A DATE IS NOT A SIN!!!!!! THE ONE GIRL SAID THE MAN --LIED-- ABOUT HIS AGE AND BEING SINGLE. THERE IS NOTHING LOGICAL ABOUT BLAMING THE GIRLS WHO WERE ASSAULTED!!!! They wanted to go to a school where they'd feel SAFE!!!! THEY NEVER THOUGHT THAT AFTER BEING VIOLENTLY ASSAILED THAT THEY WOULD BE GONE AFTER AS IF THEY WERE THE ONE AT FAULT. DISGUSTING FILTH

[@heyRolleen]

@@einc70 Maybe if they had been wearing their magic mormon underwear it would not have happened. Or a prairie dress perhaps...or maybe if they had married warren jeffs before they turned 13 it wouldnt have happened.; einc...what a douche nozzle you are

[@olddoug8945]

"at byu we feel legally and ethically obligated" TO BURY YOU.

[@Me97202]

The university IS called Bring-em-Young after all.

[@elliecallahan5874]

I lived in Provo for a year when I was in rehab. I plan to move there when I graduate this year. I really hope these creeps are going away...

[@jstu45]

Strong ladies! Why go to a school that doesnt support you?

[@gNa_0000]

Where is this footage taken? Some of it is recognizably at BYU campus, where I went to school, but im pretty sure it's not actually all in campus. The Honor Code also states you cannotnwear shorts that short. I too was a victim of sexual assault, and my perp actually called the Honor Code office to report that I was breaking the code, and I actually dropped my classes for the next semester for fear of being kicked out for violating "the code"!!! Luckily, the people are not the religion and I am still a believer in the LDS church, but not so much the members or the culture!

[@nordicpandi]

I used to be in the mormon church. I encourage you to look into and understand things like what covert abuse is, covert narcissism, misogyny and internalized misogyny. Also watch videos on the BITE model and how mormonism fits into the definition of a cult.

[@lauragadille3384]

What a shame. And that's why we don't report it.

[@vpstumpy]

Put this guy in prison for 40 years

[@SparkzMxzXZ]

and after all this i'm just shocked at the rule against caffeine. what??

[@musicdreamer149]

SparkzMxzXZ It a Mormon rule. No use of stimulants including caffeine and alcohol.

[@converselover12]

SparkzMxzXZ that is actually not a rule. That is a huge misconception. Coffee and black tea is off limits but not caffeine in general. I know plenty of mormons that have to have their Coca Cola fix. My drug is Dr. Pepper haha

[@gbpdrum45]

Britney Wilson what's the difference between coffee and coke? What makes tea a sin and not Dr Pepper?

[@converselover12]

Hannah Helton it has something to do with the amount of caffeine. It's like the difference between energy drinks and soda. I'm not saying I agree with it at all. I'm a coffee drinking Mormon and I don't think I'm damned to hell. I was just clearing up that misconception. We are allowed to have caffeine just not black tea or coffee. Silly but true

[@hannahgmuse]

Caffeine is a drug and drugs aren't allowed

[@OGKILLa9365]

This is so messed up

[@tommygarcia7406]

That code ,they probably break themselves.

[@BijinMCMXC]

Why the hell would she want to re-enroll after that?!

[@thecreativemillenial]

I'm from the UK and a church member. I chose not to apply to byu because I didn't see the point when there were so many universities and single wards closer to home. Now, I'm glad I didn't apply for byu

[@bradjennings8714]

There is no code, all assaults should be reported.

[@kera9389]

Going to byu is just NOT worth it, take it from someone who knows… seriously the honour code is a joke . And I don’t believe in it

[@knjmoorhouse5093]

It is so pathetic how easily rapists can slip through the cracks. It is a reflection of how society does not value women nor the value of human life and integrity.

[@helenclark3627]

Rapists are pukes and should be exterminated

[@Loveroffood41]

Rape kits are so hard to deal with. And BYU is beyond guilty for putting girls through hell.

[@Eme80865]

This is the second time I'm watching this, and I still don't understand how both women were in violation of the honor code.

[@missmahinay5297]

As a child of a strict Christian parent, for her father to not only believe her but to stand beside her is outstandingly beautiful. That’s exactly how you show God’s love. Not judgement and condemnation but love and acceptance. 💛

[@michelleh9215]

I'm so sorry.

[@philbottjen2196]

I use to love byu and everything it stood for. BYU...shame on you. You care more about reputation than helping innocent victims. Such a shame

[@aliseaskevas1556]

So your most loyal students are treated like they can’t be trusted? This only adds to the reason I left this religion 20 years ago.

[@sj1997]

Her father a hero 🙌

[@keegangraciekemp6574]

I live in Utah and I hate this but I'm not Mormon this makes me so angry and BYU has no respect for sexual assault victims

[@cybergrail]

She did a great job speaking out. BYU does not Deserve students like her. I think she should have gone to some other, better university.

[@marysawyer4041]

These bully’s / ego maniacs / glad these young girls are getting g the courage to Speak Up. Wish I would have . So many years ago.

[@vpstumpy]

The school should be fined 500,000 for its policies.

[@sonpacho]

Are they (Mormons) brainwashed? The craziest part of this story for me is that both of them still wanted to go to the school. They gave her police report to the school! WHAT!? It didn't even seem to upset her that much...I could be wrong... That they would still want to associated with BYU after the treatment described in this video is...inconceivable.

[@tjones5522]

Please support those victimized, not systems that support victimizers.

[@bob15479]

The honor code does not forbid caffeine.

[@jonjahr3403]

It no longer forbids caffeinated soda. Back when when this was made a few year's ago all caffeinated beverages were banned. I would think coffee is still banned. If not well good for them.

[@vpstumpy]

Close this school down it will close if everyone stops enlisting

[@ramonpunsalang3397]

Honor Code is a sick joke.

[@kevinjackson7125]

I think Mormons are getting a bad rep for this but the religion isn't the problem. The honor code has probably reduced incidents of sexual assaults because in theory it reduces alcohol consumption. Yes people will break the rules and the law but the honor code reduces the chances.

[@codename495]

Nope. The religion is absolutely the problem.

[@Dclxvi6x3]

Mormons in general just give me the creeps.

[@hollybigelow5337]

As a member of the church, I have always felt the BYU Honor Code was in direct conflict with church doctrine. And those at BYU that pathelogically investigate every tiny little possible honor code violation and who treat all suspects as guilty until proven innocent are not only unamerican in their approach, they are also unchristian. By far the most important doctrine of the church is the doctrine of the atonement and of forgiveness. The Honor Code is not even remotely in line with that doctrine, at least not in the cases where I have seen it applied. I'm having trouble finding the reference right this second, but I have also been told many times that Joseph Smith was a solid proponent of the Blackstone ratio that says, "Better that ten guilty persons escape, than that one innocent suffer." This is likely because Joseph Smith's enemies were constantly dragging him into the court house on what on at least some occasions were trumped up charges. But this becomes particularly damaging in rape cases. Some of these women didn't do anything wrong and were raped, but were treated as guilty until proven innocent. Some of these women may have been doing trivial honor code violations, but the rape is so traumatic saying that the person needs an additional punishment for the honor code seems very over the top to me. Plus, there's always the practical side of do you really want to disincentivize people reporting the rapes? Finally, yes there are occasional people who will use false allegations of rape to take advantage of immunity, but you can write the immunity rules to say if the woman is found guilty of false reporting of rape in a court of law that she loses immunity for an Honor Code violation at that point. You can also be assured that anyone who is willing to make up an allegation of rape to cover up an Honor Code violation will commit more Honor Code violations, and it will eventually catch up with them. The positives of Honor Code immunity for rape reports to me far outweighs the negatives. And it's also time BYU started treating people as innocent until proven guilty as well.

[@kennyl215]

Why even go BYU if their honor codes is that strict. If the school is that strict on victims than the best thing is transfer out of the school.

[@GlennaVan]

I have watched the video and read all the comments. I still have no understanding why being raped is a violation of an honor code while the rapist is blame-free! If a person is murdered, has that person violated some honor code as well? Tragically, the Bible itself is behind this. In the Bible, if a woman has committed adultery, she is to be stoned to death. However, there is no consequence to the man involved! Considering populations of communities, the man knew she was married as well as there being a good chance he is married and committing adultery. In this modern age, in some cultures, a woman who has been raped is killed under the guise of "honor killing" - no consequence for the man.

[@helenclark3627]

thanks for seering insight into a modern malicious problish

[@alexforce9]

Coz the video is misleading. Those girls are afraid to report coz they broke the code in some way before the rape, and keep silent so they dont get expelled for that, not for the rape itself.

[@GlennaVan]

@@alexforce9 In other words, to keep them silent about the violence against them, they are threatened with expulsion for something they did prior to the rape? Yet, it is okay for the rapist to go free? Yeah, that is justice!!!

[@alexforce9]

@@GlennaVan Thats bullshit and you know it. No one is forcing them to go there for school, to drink, or whataver they did brake the code. The only one that is forcing them is the rapist - and they can file a report AT ANY TIME. The code have nothing to do with the rape. Two separate issues. Its the victims CHOICE to not talk. Why we always act like women have no agency in anything? No matter the issue we treat them like children. They are the victim of a rape, but everything else - they did voluntarily and from their own free will.

[@stephwiller9089]

Seriously though, no victim blaming, but why would you want to stay in a University like that?

[@guytoe]

Old Brigham and Joseph Smith had an honor code. They'd corral a young lady in Smith's Nauvoo office while Brigham Young proposed she become another one of his wives. Joseph chimed in that if she tired of Brigham he'd take her in. She made up an excuse that she'd need time to consider their proposal(s). They wouldn't let her leave the locked office until she promised, on her HONOR, not to tell family or associates what had transpired between them - The Brigham Young Honor Code was born.

[@SrChalice]

Bring-Em Young University...

[@heyRolleen]

hahahahhaa bring em young university! Good one!

[@ns2940]

'until they saw evidence he was convicted they didn't offer me any help' --- sweetheart, the world isn't going to drop everything at the first claim of a rape. You should be grateful you live in a society where evidence is cherished.

[@vpstumpy]

Close this school

[@laughalotitsgoodforyourbod7627]

Shut this fucking place down how is this even possible in this day and age.

[@cmeVermillion]

And peoples in USA dissing Sweden about their high rate of reported rape. Sad, very sad.

[@annajames9682]

They women HAVE to sue

[@danmeek928]

I knew there was a good reason I left the Mormon church. There was so much hypocrisy I couldn't stand it any longer

[@hebercloward1695]

There are hundreds of documented cases of this sort of thing over the past few decades.

[@hebercloward1695]

"you dont want to ruin this poor mans reputation do you?"

[@clarinet108m]

BYU has changed how they handle reports and such. Also I noticed that ABC news gave some false information about BYU in this short report, making me wonder if they're really trying to report truth or just trying to smear a school for some views.

[@SuperSasha1969]

BYU???? Are you serious?!?!? Can't believe your policy appears to blame the victim but not the rapist

[@mm7365]

I went to BYU. I was born and raised Mormon. this is not a BYU are Mormon problem this is a Utah problem. only 2% of the women who are raped will have their day in court. out of that 2% less than 1% go to trial. the court system in Utah is a complete failure. I have a close friend who was brutally sexually assaulted in 2009 buy a Salt Lake County deputy . after her rape you told her that if she reported he would make her life a living hell she tried to commit suicide. she survived a suicide attempt and when she was asked why she tried to kill herself she said because she was so ashamed of being raped. the case was turned over to West Jordan Police Department but they never interviewed her. 3 months later she tried to commit suicide again. she reported that she was so ashamed and she could not go on because of her rape and the internal injuries caused her a lot of physical pain. she was having nightmares and she trusted no one. the West Jordan police were contacted again. when they interviewed the guy and he raped her and he claimed it was consensual. he also told investigators that she only claimed there was a rape after she found out he was married. my friend told me that he had told her that he got divorced 8 years earlier so his claim that she was making up a rape after discovering he was married was a lie. the assault was so brutal she describes as laying there in her pool of blood. the detective took my friend into a separate room and told her, I believe you were raped but you need to move on and forget about it. a month later she was arrested for stalking her rapist. she had not been stalking him in fact she was in hiding afraid of him or what he may do to her. it was the rapist wife who filed the complaint because she was so angry that this woman accused her husband of sexual assault and her husband admitted having sex with her. it took four years for my friend to clear her name. she was brutally raped the physical events proved it and yet she went to jail 4 times and it that cost over $20,000 to clear her name. the guy who raped there was never charged. his wife was never charged for filing false police reports. her advice to rape survivors, did not go to the police, you will only be shamed and not believed. you find a trauma counselor, and do your best to move forward. your hope and believe that telling the truth will get the guy arrested and prosecuted will likely not happen.

[@olddoug8945]

"incredibly supportive." what the hell is mormonism about? how would he NOT be supportive.

[@tomlangford5251]

"Honor Code" Not much of an Honor Code.

[@julieh.9826]

It’s a hot button issue? What an odd choice for a headline regarding rape.

[@Dafrogie]

again.. guilty by association

[@lkemccl6180]

ok wait she needs to go to police. byu is not the police . just because you go to school there doesn't mean they have to babysit you. byu is not a babysitter. report assualt to police, plain and simple. ...

[@madcowgirl0131]

Lke Mccl she did the school got ahold of the police report.

[@martinaskupin9549]

That honor code sounds like from bad sci-fi.

[@edwardbarnhart1698]

It is to keep the people out of jail and to avoid germs, the gov't does know, and the members know too

[@picklerick2718]

BYU is a joke latter day saints are a joke.

[@samuelcolt1505]

There is an exception to No Premarital sex if you are raped. It's not your fault. No, consensual premarital sex.

[@Avby81]

Why the fck does this colleges have so much powers yet they are the ones shaming students. Colleges have so much power that it feels as if they are their own government it’s shameful.

[@edwardbarnhart1698]

this is not true, those Church members are supposed to tell their church leaders, as well. What is written does tell them to report.

[@carolholiday930]

Sad. Just very disappointing.

[@kevinraymcgaugh7164]

She needs counseling from the school 🏫 to help her.