Raptor Lake Mobile on an ITX Motherboard - 10729 13900H ES Review

[@CraftComputing]

Dang it.... 6P / 8E core, not the other way around. That's what I get for writing the script after midnight.

[@marcogenovesi8570]

"how dare you"

[@pinsandscrews6459]

but did someone get you wet, and did you eat after midnight?

[@ghomerhust]

ill forgive you if you send me one of those cool stone coasters ;)

[@Personalinfo404]

the 12900 ITX combo you mentioned shows "pcie 2.0" on the photo. Hoping its typos.

[@edwald4056]

The number of threads should have been a giveaway. Nice video.

[@MegaKrustyman]

Dude, wireless power! The red light from the set shining through the heatsink mounting hole had me going for a minute there...

[@CoalitionGaming]

My erying 11850h mini itx + RTX 3070 build kicks ass. Love that these things are becoming more common.

[@ghomerhust]

i bet that boogies, quietly

[@CoalitionGaming]

@@ghomerhust and it looks good too!

[@FilippoCarrux]

erying has solved the thermal throttling with the new vapor chamber on the cpu. My 11850H stays at 4,3ghz all core with -70mv on the core and -50mv on the cache. in gaming I stay around 50w of tdp at 60°. I have a Noctua Redux Uh 12S - 1 fan

[@SimbaSeven.]

Built our VR/Steam/Emulation rig using an Erying 11800H with 32GB of RAM, a FE 3070, a pair of 4TB NVMe SSDs, and a pair of 22TB spinners. It did not disappoint.

[@danandrei96]

you should absolutely re-do the thermal paste under that IHS or even replace it with liquid metal. It made a huge difference on my erying board

[@RootSwitch]

Agreed. I did the same to my Erying 11900H that I got last year. The copper shim and metal plate both had a a layer of grease/grime, presumably from manufacturing, that I cleaned off which I'm sure wasn't exactly helping the thermal paste either.

[@CraftComputing]

I repasted with Arctic Silver before the video. The issue is more in the BK034, not the shim. I'll likely be doing another video on cooling performance.

[@vlmxs]

@@CraftComputing please do :)

[@JBrinx18]

​@@CraftComputingMX6 would likely show better results, unless you can show that cooler is maxed out

[@mikeymaiku]

@@JBrinx18 ptm7950 with the vapor chamber upgrade from erying! outside of the io ports the board i beleive is nearly identical to the erying counterparts (erying has a more up to date rear io as the 10729 boards still use the older erying 11th io board layout.

[@FLECOM]

link to the board is dead, would love to see some proxmox tests with it, seems like it would make a nice little home server

[@Ben79k]

Videos like this are a good reminder that you don't need top of the line brand new hardware to build a sweet rig and have fun with modern games at a lan party. Nice work

[@romanrm1]

Ah, 10729, the name you can trust...

[@LucienneGainsborough]

I had the same thought at first. Apparently their actual brand name is "Flash Technology" as flash in The Flash. 10729 is the sku name. But that's still bad int the same way as if apple called their phone "15".

[@paulbrooks4395]

For those feeling a bit more adventurous, lapping down the IHS, die, and applying liquid metal TIM with a copper heat spreader will get both better temps and performance.

[@mikeymaiku]

why bother? Vapor chamber from Erying for 20 bucks. you actually get clearance for some older lga 1700 coolers (noctual l9i is a example where the base of the coldplate is too thin and comes into contact with some motherboard components. only the lga 1700 fit and its still about 1mm from making contact due to the increased thickness. the use of PTM 7950 is good at this point too or using the included TC-5888 grease for die to coldplate / vapor chamber, TC-5888 apparently has pretty good performance on the laptop scene and both have very good use until replacement is needed.

[@multimediaman374]

love this kind of videos... THANK YOU

[@Dom_Mason]

Makes me unreasonably excited as well. ;-) Looks like a cool mobo to play with with. Thanks m8.

[@BrunodeSouzaLino]

6:27 You're saying that as if the 12VHPWR line wasn't able to cause fire hazard issues by itself without the help of adapters....

[@marcogenovesi8570]

more adapters more fire hazard

[@KiraSlith]

This is why I'm still hesitant to get a 4070 Super despite being the current price-performance leader on the nVidia side. That connector is a high voltage hazard by design, they can't fix it by improving the manufacturing spec, it needs to be replaced entirely and the signal line integrated into the main connector pinout.

[@BrunodeSouzaLino]

@@KiraSlith They fixed it on their workstation cards by using the EPS connector instead. The EPS connector has 4 12V lines instead of 3. A single EPS connector can provide up to 336W of power.

[@mikebroom1866]

Would really enjoy another video on this motherboard as a VM host. Would have been perfect for my NAS/HA/VM hypervisor, just unsure about the power draw.

[@DLTX1007]

The 12th gen ES boards have only pcie 2.0 on the main slot by the way. (A problem shared with the Alder Lake-S ES as well but that's ES in nature of course)

[@harrybryan9633]

That is why people should spend a couple dollars more & get the regular CPU, rather than the ES.

[@Anomyzer24]

They updated the BIOS now runs pcie 4.0 x8

[@coverromeo3727]

​@@Anomyzer24 really?

[@Anomyzer24]

@@coverromeo3727 Yes, you need to talk to the seller and he will provide you with the bios update

[@BudgetGamerz]

Do you know what cooler mount this board use?

[@ReQuiem_2099]

Personally I'm eager to see Meteor Lake get ported over to a proper desktop/ITX platform. The potential for kick ass NAS/Server functionality with the added I/O options of a proper motherboard could really make for an amazing system. Desktop Lunar Lake as a potential local AI dev platform sounds even more enticing...

[@kevinpitts3548]

I am in the process of building an itx system. I just found a great deal of 64gigs of ddr4. Now i have to find the rest... Man this would be awesome. Keep up the great work!

[@Viking8888]

Any of these mini-itx board/cpu combos would be awesome for a home server in a Jonsbo like case. Run proxmox and you have a setup that can run a NAS, OPNsense or PFsense and a bunch of other VMs/containers.

[@oscarcharliezulu]

Bloody interesting little motherboard. Also - this has to be one of the more informative and interesting computing channels. Must be a huge amount of work.

[@CraftComputing]

I appreciate the compliment. It's definitely a lot of work!

[@ChrisKadaver]

Aaaaaand it's gone! But damn! That's a sexy build. XD What memory speeds does it support?

[@pyroslev]

Should pick one of these more budget boards for a nice NAS build. Missus wants me to sidegrade the NAS/Server we have into something easier on the light bill.

[@ghomerhust]

a hefty mobile chip is just right for that, methinks. you could stuff a wicked NIC in place of the GPU if you needed big bandwidth, and it would be whisper quiet

[@povilasstaniulis9484]

Thanks for the review. Wish these mobile chip mainboards were more mainstream. They are really great for low-power yet still high performance builds. I have just recently grabbed an Erying with a 13980HX, which is an 8P 16E core chip. Want to do a sleeper server build in an old case. Well, if I can get the cooler to fit, that is...

[@TC-hl1ws]

How is the onboard graphics on this motherboard? What desktop cpu would this processor be equivalent to.

[@marcogenovesi8570]

It's comparable to AMD Ryzen 5 7600X or a Intel i7-12700

[@mikeymaiku]

My current board. Love it so much i got two

[@stoffes]

Beautriful system! and what a processor ! its a beast love the itx gaming setups

[@MultiDark2012]

Well Jeff you certainly have peeked my interest, I've been contemplating an upgrade but can't justify the stupid high prices of hardware these days, this MB/CPU Combo option is a steal in my opinion, cheers 🍻4 sharing this little gem of info. The only uncertainty I have is most of the combos only list the main PCI-E slot @ 8X, I did manage to find one that listed it as having a 16x slot in the specs, I'll list it below for any interested parties. ' Motherboard with Onboard 13th Kit Interposer Core CPU Q1HY ES 0000 ' I did notice the max memory is listed as 96GB, LMFAO, my OCD wouldn't let me get away with installing a 64GB stick & a 32GB stick.

[@EchigoyaHonpo]

I have built tons of SFF with this exact unit. You will need to fine tune this unit. Also, this unit is full of ram compatibility issue. 105 tdp cpu cooler will not be able to release its true potential. If you want to release full potential of this unit, go flash 11.29 bios released by Leo. Once you fine tuned it at sweet spot, this unit gets 13600K or 14600K stock performance. The value is extremely goooood.

[@ghosttheoremproductions5469]

Would be interesting to see how she does with the E-Cores disabled.

[@RussellBaker]

Would something like the Noctua NA-FD1 fan duct kit help the cooling, by only drawing in cool air from the panel rather than form inside the case?

[@estebanguerrero682]

I just wanted to comment this video, because I love this type of builds where you can push performance being wise with hardware choices and having fun with small form factors. Showing my appreciation to this content that I truly much love and want to support more, also hi youtube algorithm

[@CraftComputing]

Response both in appreciation of you, and for the algorithm!

[@BuzzKiller23]

I have absolutely no use for a system with one of these boards, but damn they are really cool!

[@JohnDoe-i8d]

Did you consider doing scalping with liquid metal? Would you use that MB + CPU combo in a real world life?

[@jeremyjedynak]

Thanks for doing reviews of non-mass-market boards like this one. These are super interesting, and hopefully inspire some people elsewhere within the industry.

[@chromerims]

The planning you put into the 'right mix' of Erying 13900H and other parts 👍 that complement each other at this price point could not be bested by AI or anyone. A superbly "crafted" video.

[@CraftComputing]

Craft doesn't mean beer 😉

[@chromerims]

@@CraftComputing 👍 "Craft" is in the eye of the beERholder . . . er . . . (?) Erying-holder.

[@chromerims]

​@@CraftComputing Realizing the mobo-cpu brand is 10729. Got that mixed up w Erying. Oops.

[@zodoGames]

How did you attach the cooler?

[@Renzsu]

Hopefully this can be done again with a Meteor Lake processor at some point. The low power consumption is quite attractive. edit: The Aliexpress link in the description no longer works.

[@dakoderii4221]

RDR2 is 6 years old and still taxes the crap out of the latest hardware. The level of detail in that game is incredible.

[@jdl3408]

Would love to see this tested with proxmox.

[@DonaldMolter]

I’ve said it once and I’ll say it again. One of the latest gens of these boards and mid range latest gen graphics card would be a solid mobile rig

[@humboldtoregonian9400]

Silverton you say? I might have to keep an eye out for that beer. The brand of coffee I drink is also from Silverton. They make good stuff I guess...

[@yukiseekyo]

Apparently they released an bios that allows pci-e 4.0 for the 12 gen ES chips and it works but unfortunately it only runs at gen 4. Gen 3 risers doesn't work right now and I'm also going to assuming anything that is PCI-E gen 4 or lower wont work, I cant test it since I don't have any Gen 3 cards ATM.

[@tinayang3902]

Which Bios is better? 0729 or Eryings?

[@empedance1933]

Does it support PCIE bifurcation on its 4.0x8 slot?

[@ingmariochen]

Can you do a review taking the IHS and cool in it with the same cooler. thanks.

[@ext87]

This is pretty cool! I have no need for one, but want to do a build

[@tomasnorre]

Whatever do you use to Measure and display fps in games?

[@nickxcom]

Shoot, listing is completely gone. Im cursed haha

[@allesbelegt]

@0:20 : Retro PC or even Jeffs first ever self built PC from back in the days video incomming?

[@ChrisN069]

@CraftComputing - Jeff - The Ali Express MB link is bad. TIA

[@CraftComputing]

Sold out and pulled by the seller. Out of my control at that point.

[@kimjensen3868]

I'm in love with the idea of getting one of these, but which one is the best buy right now? I'm trying to build a gaming rig on a budget, but I'm a bit confused about all the options. Also I saw the review of the RX580. Is that still a good option, or whats the new cheap best GPU? Please link to any recommendations on Aliexpress.

[@shepardcoronel1980]

can u use a m2 riser to pcie 3.0 x8 ? you could attach a 10gb to it in a microatx case

[@markyoungkush2925]

Hi, can you try running “oxygen not included”? I know it’s an older title, but I would like to see if more CPUs or a stronger GPU will be able to run it and be playable, later on in the game my current laptop struggles at cycle 50 with all the different things going on.

[@g.s.3389]

if i do not need a graphic card what do you suggest as small power supply for this board?

[@leonlionheart5504]

Jeff! I only just got an Erying 12th gen ITX board! You can't be doing this to wallet man!

[@GustavoDupont]

@CraftComputing Can you check the if XMP above 3200 is supported?

[@mikeymaiku]

3200 is max you can select in the bios.

[@CraftComputing]

There is a 'Max speed' setting in BIOS that tops out at 3200. However, XMP does enable 3600, and was verified after booting.

[@GustavoDupont]

@@CraftComputing that's interesting, there little to no more information about the 13th gen . If you plan to do a follow up video I would love see what are the limitations or even if it's possible to change some of the cpu clock ratios.

[@BReal-10EC]

I am still wary of these "no support website" computer parts. Where do you get a new Bios if something needs to be updated? Do you even trust the Bios pre-installed on the board?

[@BReal-10EC]

@@wojtek-33 What do you mean "have no choice"? You mean like you live in a country without affordable options?

[@mikeymaiku]

​@@wojtek-33naw man im ok with 5.5 alll core at 1.24ish volts. Chinese garbage? Litterally most of your pc components today are made in china.

[@marcogenovesi8570]

what needs to be updated? The CPU is soldered.

[@marcogenovesi8570]

@@BReal-10EC An example of those countries is Brazil or Russia.

[@marcogenovesi8570]

if you think normal motherboards get bios updates for security you are sorely mistaken. The only ones that care about CVEs are businness OEMs (Dell/HP/Lenovo/Fujitsu/whatever)

[@FSK1138]

you got to mention the box it came in is a atx case 😅

[@justinknash]

I have a Ryzen 5700x cooled with a slim Noctua NH-l9a-AM4 in a 2u server chassis and also see thermal throttling but not in games, only in Cinebench and synthetic load tests. Wondering if applying a phase change thermal pads will make a difference instead of the Noctua thermal paste I am currently using.

[@marcogenovesi8570]

phase change thermal pads don't give better performance than thermal paste. They are similar performance but they don't dry up over time so they are good for embedded or laptops where you are shipping an item that won't be serviced. In general any thermal paste is good enough if you are not into hard OC. If you see throttling the cooler is too weak. Noctua themselves in their cpu support list for that cooler say that it's "compatible without turbo/overclocking headroom" which sounds about right.

[@justinknash]

@@marcogenovesi8570 thanks for the reply and appreciate the info. I think also because I enabled precision boost is why it can run a bit toasty. Like I said, only see it throttling during extended load testing (like Cinebench). It's mostly a gaming PC and honestly mostly Flight Simulator (which is heavy on the cpu) but nothing like Cinebench.

[@mikeymaiku]

@@marcogenovesi8570 ptm outperforms all paste on my 13900hk ES board from 10729. it made my noctual l9i not thermal throttle and stayed at 90 running 5.2 ghz all core at 1.24v (ish) my guess is the material is actually better for die - colplate surface rather than just the layer between the IHS / cooler. i have now moved to a axp-90 x47 all copper and now run 5.5 all core at the same voltages. :D

[@chrishase92]

Wohoo, this sounds superb 🙂 @CraftComputing: Could you find out if this motherboard does support Non-Registered ECC DDR4 sticks? Thanks mate 🙂

[@marcogenovesi8570]

The CPU does not support ECC, so the answer is no. The non-Xeon Intel CPUs that support ECC are rare

[@sentyuk5322]

How well do these work with proxmos and gpu pass-thru, since the Erying failed?

[@slavkorulit]

6:02 - you forgot to open one of usb2.0 port on i/o shield:)

[@CraftComputing]

Hades.gif 🔥🔥**I KNOW** 🔥🔥

[@Nick-zb4yo]

You should also take a look at the minisforum bd770i/bd790i and the Ar900i with an i9 13900HX

[@mikeymaiku]

13900hx is not the same as the 13900h (the 13900hx is 8p/16e)

[@Nick-zb4yo]

Yes but the AMD version could be really interesting with 16 normal cores and 32 threads

[@jordonlabbe9455]

are we sure the 13900h you got is not a 13900hk? (bios unlock?)

[@EchigoyaHonpo]

it is unlocked. you can tweak anything you want. But power limit needs to be unlocked first as well

[@marine1718]

link for ali express board not working

[@greenprotag]

I don't need it... I don't need it... I NEED IT!

[@CraftComputing]

GET IT

[@greenprotag]

Does anyone need a 13400f? lol

[@JohnDoe-i8d]

At the exact moment of 12:53 my OS crasher and repeatedly was playing "running this well". First I thought you did a joke... but suddenly I realized youtube progress bar isn't moving.

[@shaunlavoie6183]

Your eyes were getting heavier as your glass was simultaneously getting more and more empty 😋

[@fpvrc-fly7163]

I have the 12700h/12900h and 13900hk non ES from Erying and the all unlocked on the wattage.

[@daymianhogue1634]

Hmm, any idea what the on board nics are incase anyone wanted to use one of these for messing around with some virtualization?

[@CraftComputing]

^^ This is correct. Both are Realtek chips. Worked great in testing.

[@huggi2]

I use a Eyring Mobo combo board for my HTPC. Looking to replace my old Xeon Nas Server with another one these but the lack of sata ports is preventing me from taking the plunge. If they added just one more sata port i could run a server in raid 5 mode. i would at least prefer 4 sata ports for my setup.

[@zeroturn7091]

m.2 to SATA adapter?

[@TheWebstaff]

Raid 5?.. 😂 I assume you have low Tb drives then? Just get a pair of high Tb drives and mirror them.

[@erikrquezada]

Could you tell me where else I can get it or fix the link. It goes nowhere now.

[@mikeymaiku]

sold out, by the time the video was up there was like 2 in stock

[@agame-jv6zv]

good job measuring the GPU performance and not the CPU. Is there a reason every reviewer loves to max out the gpu performance on cpu benchmarks?

[@corymatthewmouser1543]

Anyone know if these types of boards typically support rebar?

[@CraftComputing]

This board does support ReBar.

[@corymatthewmouser1543]

@@CraftComputing Hell yeah!

[@Technocrat.]

I bought a Hiananzhi B660M mono, it came with i312100f, This mini runs the locked cpu at 124% woohoo Blazing fast.

[@BuzzKiller23]

"I wanted a potential fire hazard instead of using a series of adapters leading to a potential fire hazards"

[@Karti200]

A bit sad they only gave it an DDR4 version and not DDR5 one too :/ imagine this running at DDR5 also curious about temps - wouldn't it be better to take off this "cooling plate" and just go bare die cooling with the CPU?

[@Ray88G]

Try the DDR5 board

[@CraftComputing]

If you take a look at a past video, I did some content with the i7-13620 w/DDR5 when looking at Hybrid CPUs in Proxmox.

[@computersales]

Cool board but I would be sketched out that there might be something malicious in a no name board like that.

[@TC-hl1ws]

Yep, me too. Unfortunately it has happened with other similar boards. Usually not from the manufacture but hackers. Probably fine for gaming but no banking or personal information should be used with this product.

[@mattotto9949]

if they upgraded the vrm to support 105w sustained and robustly built for low temps, couldn't you be able to set the CPU to that and have it perform at its best all the time? Especially when coupled with a decent cooler? 105w seems like a low power draw that a lot of coolers should be able to handle easily. The question for me is, if this is the case will the CPU go to 100c+ anyways because that's the nature of the chips, or can they be "tamed". A side note, while it is correct that CPU's these days can handle more heat, more heat just makes it uncomfortable for me.

[@rayproductionsbackupchanne3862]

i love these mutant systems. i am currently testing a bunch of QTJ1 cpu's since they seem promising for 110 bucks.

[@bhume7535]

The 6 core variants are also amazing. I got mine for like 40 bucks on Black Friday last year and smacked it into a Z170 itx board.

[@rayproductionsbackupchanne3862]

@@bhume7535 i currently got 2 QTJ1's. 1 of which still in the mail. one with the IHS and one without the IHS. the one with IHS has filtering capacitors which will clock higher likely. QTJ1 is also only 110Euro's so that's dirt cheap

[@swirrllfolfsky9803]

It'd be awesome if Intel officially supported and sold motherboard and CPU combos like this.

[@MajorBuzzKill]

I bought a 13900hk one for 181$, now im waiting. ( it has ddr5 which i didnt liek but had the best price)

[@jackgrahn5206]

Do you have a link to the one you bought?

[@ryannnn_nelson]

when is the craft computing screwdriver and underwear getting released?

[@marcogenovesi8570]

mmh, I look forward to laser-etched underwear, for HIM and for HER too

[@CraftComputing]

I have other ambitions. Homelab gear coming soon.

[@michaelbrindley4363]

My 10900k/3090 combo can't break 100fps @ 1440p on Helldivers 2 same settings in a mission. Is this combo you're using really that much faster? I mean gd.

[@mikeymaiku]

single score the 10900 only does like 550 on cpu-z, the 13900h does 900 when clocked to 5.4 all core

[@Waldherz]

Helldivers 2 has been broken since the 01.000.100 patch in terms of performance. Its just a trash game in that regards.

[@TheAsjdj]

I never understood "the lack of usb ports" but i am also the weird one that only need 4 usb ports and i'm good keyboard, mics, soundcard (dac) and webcam. I don't need anything else

[@seethruhead7119]

i was thinking this board might be interesting as a plex server with an m.2 to sata or external (or internal) sas controller but i think it would have to be cheaper to compete with the minisforum ms-01 for that duty as a budget itx gaming pc tho this is pretty interesting though not having the ability to upgrade your cpu might put some people off

[@cinemaipswich4636]

Since the rise of the M1 Mac Minis, that small form factor has come of age in the Intel/AMD/ARM world.

[@thatbritishgamer]

for ultimate gaming youd never use the 7950x3d or 7900x3d they have the 2 ccd problem youd get a 7800x3d

[@spicyandoriginal280]

8P / 6E cores ? Nah. Other way around.

[@CraftComputing]

...I really wrote the script that way the entire video didn't I.... Dammit.

[@milescarter7803]

This is a hard sell with the 12700KF going for under 200 brand new. Add a $75 B660 ITX board and its pretty much a wash. I'd guess losing 2 E cores *might* hold it back, but the 2 extra P cores will probably help out. And you still get 20 threads either way. That said, over clocking support minimal on a B660, and maybe a second M.2 would be hard to come by. I'm not sold on E cores yet for gaming. Just shut them off and let the P cores rip. Also x16 slot probably would help performance. I'd go for a single Silicon Power US75 NVMe (2tb or 4tb when you can get them on sale, and Amz n will give you $60 off for opening a "store card"), so a single drive doesn't hurt so much. The US75 will hold 2-3,000MBs speeds for an entire drive write. Impressive.

[@fenturi]

Link to the board is a 404 error now.

[@GaahlDukat]

These deals may wind up getting more and more costly and harder to find with these gen cpu's being discontinued now, grab em while you can folks

[@OldColar]

SFF is love, SFF is life

[@raimor1811]

Says 523 euros on store now...sigh

[@SoraIroNaKISEKI]

The price for the 12900H already goes up after the video posted 😂😂

[@tobiasit1743]

The operating temperature of the chip is 60 degrees Celsius. Higher temperatures result in higher resistance, causing efficiency to decrease accordingly. 104 degrees is far too high, as materials expand and contract with each load and unload. Over time, the CPU will deteriorate.

[@feminaproletarius7815]

>what more could you ask for for 280 dollars for both CPU and motherboard >no ram >no ssd >no psu >no cooling >barely able to hit GH rates of CPUs a few generations ago.

[@TC-hl1ws]

That's a big discount going with the 12900H over the 13900H. What would I be sacrificing? Is this an ITX or a mini-ITX sized motherboard?

[@Azlehria]

There is no "full-sized" ITX: Mini-ITX is the largest size in the family. Next down is em-ITX, which shares one dimension with Mini-ITX (170mm) and one dimension with Nano-ITX (120mm), both of which are square. The two smallest are Pico-ITX (100x72mm) and Mobile-ITX (75x45mm).

[@TC-hl1ws]

@@Azlehria Oh OK, thanks. I knew there are ITX variants and I was a little confused not seeing the usual mini prefix.

[@Froggie92]

the pcie lane is only 2x8

[@thirdwheel1985au]

11:50 for managed democracy!

[@vincentj1916]

this mb manufacturer was the same as the 9th gen mobile mutant on lga 1151, i would prefer erying and they're generally cheaper

[@mikeymaiku]

erying also sold thier products at a point too, they still had some BGA cpus for sale in jan 2024. no joke erying is expensive, a 13500 board is still 400 CAD i got this particular 10729 13900h ES board for 380 cad

[@Technocrat.]

Why do they even bother putting in USB 2 on mobos? Just need 1 for keyboard/mouse receiver, rest should be usb 3.2 or higher.