Ray Un-Alives the DS18 12" w/ a Rockford Fosgate T2500, Refuses to take Responsibility.Is he right?

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[@justloudcustoms]

Ur a hard headed guy patrick..u need to build the guy a new sub.. if you made the suspension softer and change the thiele parameters his box and power change correct isn't that what you always preached I've been in the audio industry for 20 years I watch your channel and subscribed and I agree with you on a lot of stuff especially industry issues what is it really cost you to rebuild this guy's sub

[@wesleynelson8263]

Patrick, I am a follower of your channel and have also done business with you. In this case, I believe you should have made this right. I think you may have misled this guy (intentionally or not). Make it right and just chalk it up. You got more important things going on, bro. 👍

[@bobbyackerson4125]

Yup he changed the ohms on the sub from dual 4 to dual 2 and used a softer spider with out telling the kid it was different. He had no problem taking his money though

[@TheSara200424]

@@bobbyackerson4125 I believe that was the issue then not providing guidance of how to retune the subwoofer to optimize the performance burnt the subwoofer. If the guy wanted back to original specs and he gave him that it's on Pat to make it right or he's going to lose customers in the long run by not doing on a agreed upon service. I believe Patrick is a good guy but this one could of been prevented

[@TheGodofSEO]

You’re in the wrong. He’s right.

[@1ohmwrecker]

Cant lie, I feel for the dude

[@jeanious2009]

Especially when he said he known him for 10 years that says he is not just any ran down person

[@Justthemow]

I don’t understand you say all the time you give a three year warranty on rebuild this guy made it three blocks maybe I’m misunderstanding the 3 year warranty but I think his right

[@coronicus6681]

warranty of defect not your dumbass pushing the woofer too hard and burning it up.. sundown is the same way, you burn it they say buy a new one.

[@dizzydezel9899]

Was it torn down to check if there wasn't a defect? Is the question?

[@funfun8095]

"His right"?? He's right. Learn English!

[@Bigislandguy]

@@dizzydezel9899 that’s what, subwoofer autopsy

[@Justthemow]

@@funfun8095aww I didn’t realize the English police were gonna audit my comment, I made a mistake I was tired I apologize Mr English professor.

[@eddieyocom5140]

At 7:41 dude is 100% right

[@liveryt3506]

I don't watch this channel that much anymore for this exact reason. I was once gonna spend money with this same guy that claims to warranty his products. Now it's time to show up, and he once again show's America why we should NOT spend our hard-earned money with him. This guy that he has known for a decade and remained totally respectful throughout the video. Sat up and took all that disrespect from the channel owner, and all he wanted was his "warranty" fullfilled. Glad I saved my

[@RobotUnderground]

Nobody asked you to visit also put some clothes on

[@nathanpressler9790]

Yeah i think the 3 year warranty should be honored

[@bkh5746]

Wheres pictures of coil?

[@clittle1559]

​@@bkh5746 real shit pat won't show it cause shit was probably a cunt hair from rubbing

[@clittle1559]

atleast 3 hrs

[@hispls]

It doesn't matter. This is an issue of "implied warranty of fitness of purpose". This is a concept from the common law and codified in the uniform commercial code. The basic implication is the person selling merchandise is meant to be the expert and the customer is assumed to be completely clueless (that's why they're coming to the alleged expert) and if the buyer tells the seller "I'm trying to do X, Y, Z", if the seller then sells them a product the buyer should have the expectation that the product is fit to perform that function.

[@RobotUnderground]

Have you ever read a warranty?

[@barryneville9713]

Why couldn't it handle the same amount of power as it originally did if you made it better? You didn't explain to him that it couldn't. I would have expected it to at least be the same. It's your responsibility to inform the customer of the changes he needed to account for. You're the professional. You can't claim common sense. That's just crazy.

[@bobbyackerson4125]

He changed the ohm load to dual 2 from dual 4 and used a softer spider without telling the kid.

[@williamblackwell9558]

@@bobbyackerson4125 BS ... It's his job to know what will kill the sub, He abused the sub and blew it. His fault 100%

[@bobbyackerson4125]

@@williamblackwell9558 B.S. he obviously doesn't know that's why he had a shop tune the system, then gets the sub back and the amps now at 1 ohm without knowing and it's his fault. You sound just like Fatty Patty

[@williamblackwell9558]

@@bobbyackerson4125 BS...I run a 8k on a 300w peerless xls12 with no issues because I don't abuse it. You can easily tell when your pusshing it to hard.

[@Ron-Webster]

Patrick if you made it better why wouldn't you make it the same or as close to the same as it was. Same stiff spider or close try to match the coil. Etc. And he claims that you made it better but did you actually let him know that the sensitivity was way more than original. ???? I don't understand why you didn't inform him that it wasn't the same he expected that. Your gonna make enemy's and for no reason. He probably would have paid to redo it or most of it to make it right. This upset me. I think your wrong because I'm not professional either but I think you should have worked it out. He needs bass.

[@dizzydezel9899]

So your saying DS18 makes better/durable products then yours? Did you inform him it will not handle the original rms power with softer parts? I think most people would honor on working something out if it only worked for a few minutes.

[@funfun8095]

YOU'RE! HANDLE! LEARN ENGLISH! TARD!

[@fusion82]

He builds subwoofers with junk he has laying around the shop. Probably recoil sub coil or jensen.. something weak. Patrick is all about saving money

[@bobbyackerson4125]

It only worked for a few minutes because the ohm load on the coil got changed from dual4 to dual2 without telling the kid. The amp was putting out way more power than it was previously tuned too

[@georgem6359]

My 2 cents, Patrick. Whenever your repairing of a sub alters the subwoofer's specifications (moreover when reducing power handling), record the conversation when delivering the unit and clearly stating the changes and what their implications are.

[@raylott9413]

Crazy thing here is when the police came they talked to me and were really respectful understood why I was clearly upset etc asked me politely to leave and what but before that a officer pulled me to the side and explained to me that this happens with Patrick often nowadays and that he’s sorry it happened to me but for people to simply not do business with him anymore. (I have this on video as well) I sat around for 3 hours waiting to have a conversation with him and he just straight disrespected me the whole time. His wife who has also seen and met me the last 10 years sat with me and explained how sorry she was and thought that we could get it figured out because she has seen me around since I was 19. Reading these comments and understanding now what happened, I had no clue he turned the sub into dual 2 rather then 4 but I didn’t want that from him I simply wanted the sub to perform at what it was performing at previously. I told him had I knew the sub wouldn’t perform at what it was previously I would buy something else as I wanted to use the same power so I was 100% clueless in this move regardless I wish no ill will on him Nor did I want a refund I simply wanted to make the situation right. Unfortunately, we didn’t come to that conclusion. I appreciate those who understood where I was coming from in these comments as well!

[@RobotUnderground]

People want to give you free stuff. Just keep up the victim stuff and you'll get all you want

[@raylott9413]

Didn’t want anything free from you brother I offered to split the cost. You came on here and asked your viewers if I was in the wrong even they didn’t agree with it but you don’t seem to see that so now at this point I don’t see the reason you posted this. I’ve never asked you for anything free I’ve always paid my way lol I’m not a bum man I work etc. so i don’t see the reason for bashing me like I am trying to scam you or something.

[@raylott9413]

In this video you hear your wife ask “is there something we can do to make this right” you cut her off even though she is trying to plead with you as well. No hard feelings that you don’t as I said I have money that I’ll happily go spend I just didn’t wanna ruin what I thought was a good 10 year friendship.. I apologize for that

[@robertdenaro3514]

@@raylott9413 Patrick is a big dickhead he screws over a lot of people

[@RobotUnderground]

@@raylott9413 Yep. She's not me and she doesn't do this for a living. Everyone loves her because she allows herself to be a doormat.

[@jenidamon8670]

Still a fan and I know you are a smart man when it comes to sub’s. That being said, I would never have you do any work on my equipment. That man has known you for a decade a you stuck it in his butt the second he turned around. You were at least partially wrong for not explaining it to him. Most people don’t understand the science and physics behind subwoofers and you can’t/shouldn’t assume they do. You could have $1 million company if you would just a few aspects of your personality. That man was not trying to get over on you and anybody that watches this will be able to see that.

[@fusion82]

True 💯 % Patrick was wrong

[@Bobbystilz43]

Even your wife knows your wrong.

[@anthonyviau1]

You’re big wrong for this one guy. To think you known that guy for ten years and treat him like that. He was totally justified you were acting unhinged, which is usually entertaining, but don’t treat your friends/customers like that damn bro.

[@713Clown]

Damn, rebuild a sub to make it perform worse than original. Then blame the guy you have know for 10 years for his sub being less durable. You are wrong on this one pat.

[@bobbyackerson4125]

The coil ohm load got changed which made the amp put out way more power than it was tuned too.never told the kid,that's why it only made it up the street

[@cin5cin1nat3i]

@@bobbyackerson4125I’m pretty sure the Rockford 2500 puts out the same amount of power at 1 and 2 ohms dude used shitty parts to rebuild the subs.

[@lee28.78]

How many times does it take for you people to understand that this guy rips you off every chance he gets !!! do not go to him,, do not buy a single thing off of him,, avoid this guy like he's the goddamn plague! Buy nothing from Patrick or anything that has a robot underground decals on it !!!

[@bobbyackerson4125]

Same, I've seen enough of these videos with the same outcome to know better lol

[@FrankStPeter]

No no no no no no Patrick you're wrong this time, if I bring you a subwoofer for a Recon and you change something that causes a failure that's your fault,, you change the Dynamics,, that's like going to a mechanic with a blown V8 motor you putting a 6-cylinder in it and saying well it gets better gas mileage now I made it better

[@RobotUnderground]

The subwoofer to worked just fine

[@mr.18s73]

Seems unprofessional bro , your running a business . You can’t treat a customer good grab his cash and if you have a problem you screw him over 😢

[@RobotUnderground]

I'm sorry you don't understand that I'm not running a business and I'm not a professional

[@hispls]

@@RobotUnderground If money is changing hands here you're certainly engaged in commerce and I'd guarantee almost every body doing business with you, watching your channel or any court in the land would consider you an expert or professional in the realm of mobile electronics. Be honest here. What did you really think was going to happen when that guy walked out the door with a 3" 4 layer coil sub and a RF2500BD amp in his car? I've done business with you here and there myself since the first TC bankruptcy and I don't believe you're stupid so this almost looks like you're being malicious.

[@RobotUnderground]

@@hispls Well it's not money, it's debt instruments if you want to get into that situation. There have not been any courts in the land for over 100 years. Everything now is commerce and I don't have to participate in that. I am not a professional, I am not an expert. Thank you for taking the time to comment.

[@hispls]

@@RobotUnderground Story time: I sat in on some meetings with some "free man" group many years back. Saw a handful of success stories, but most memorable was the dude who didn't have a driver's license and got pulled over. "I'm not in a boat, I'm not engaged in commerce". Guess what happened? The cop threw him a beating and took him to jail. He stews in holding for a few days gets in front of the judge "I'm not in a boat, my name isn't all caps".... whatever, judge throws him in the nuthouse for a week to evaluate if he is competent to stand trial. Eventually they threw out the charges, but he still got roughed up by a cop on the side of the road, spent a few days in jail and another week in the state mental hospital. The moral of the story is: "You may beat the rap but you can't beat the ride." None of the "wins" I saw these people get were anywhere near worth the trouble and effort they expended and the fails were painful to watch. Good luck with this, but regardless of gold trim on the flag, a dollar bill not containing 375.5 grains of fine silver, or you not being on a boat you screwed up by giving this guy a 3" 4 layer coil sub to put on his 3KW amp. Just give the guy back his "debt instruments" or tea leaves, or seashells, or whatever and apologize. Playing dumb or playing word games doesn't make any of this look any better, it just makes you look unhinged.

[@stevenlangston8519]

I don’t see how people still buy stuff from this guy!

[@RobotUnderground]

Maybe because I'm right.

[@fusion82]

One thing I learned from this video is buy a subwoofer from a reputable company that honors their warranty. That dude got screwed with no greese on that deal. He should've just bought a new subwoofer.

[@DavidMiOo]

His points are all logical and solid. Who wants to start a go fund me for the NEWER AND EVEN BETTER'ER DS18" fund

[@RobotUnderground]

I agree. The idiots that think he's right, should pay for a new sub for him. This is a great chance to show me how much fellow idiots are loved by brands like Sundown. @JacobFuller where you at?

[@dipinmylip1171]

​@@RobotUnderground If you were any harder on Jacob Fullers dllck, you would be his nut s4ck.

[@BobBasshead]

Well.... I can see his point of view, that being he been banging on this woofer for a year and it finally burned up. Apparently he thought that he can bang on this speaker just as before, but he was sadly mistaken. You did mention the fact that you used softer parts didn't you? We all know what happens when you use softer parts, that being more cone excursion, voice coil extending past the pole piece and damaging it. None of my business but I would have met him halfway and rebuilt his speaker for the last time with NO warranty and to never return again.

[@clittle1559]

This dude said how was he suppose to know u upgraded my subwoofer now I have to lower my amp???

[@benjamincollins6553]

Changed the spider and didn't tell him made it take less power didn't tell him all the other vids all the other guys was in the right you owe all of them you just showed you ripped all of them off with this video

[@BeetleJuice00]

I'm surprised people actually wanna do business with you 😂😂😂😂

[@joaquinaguilar5942]

I Would advise people to stay away from his business, just to watch him get evicted from his landlords property and have him on the crying side of the camera. Karma is a bitch Patricia

[@fabeybaby8213]

omg y'all r just retarded

[@fusion82]

Patrick doesn't deserve any business. I hope nobody does business with him after this. He builds subs with junk he has laying around the shop. He'll put a $10 coil from recoil in your $2,000 subwoofer and tell you it's better 😆

[@johnnysix7162]

yeah this dude is 100% a joke, all those long rants about these companies "ripping you off" and here he is ripping that dude off. no wonder he has trouble paying rent. all his bullshit ramblings about how he can do shit so much better, with 0 proof. he'll say he has nothing to prove, but that's because he can't prove anything lol dogging on all these other youtube guys saying they're this or that, pretty much just projection because he's a useless dickbag. and it seems like every single video of customer builds, he's always fucking something up. and funny he always tries to dig on sundown all the time, because i ran a USED nightshade v4 18 on a DC5k at half ohm. sub rated for 3k... but seeing 6k+. and who knows what the person before me done to it. so yeah, dude wants to dig on sundown... but can't even make a woofer to play down the fuckin block. when sundown's are taking twice their rated power in a daily... this guy is 100% a fuckin clown LOL. he wants to call the guy a dumbass, but patrick's supposed to be the pro, he should have advised him instead of "let him learn a lesson"... nah bro it's not about teaching anyone a lesson, you did a trash recone and you can't afford to give the money back. plain and simple.

[@clittle1559]

ive never seen a bisness owner have weekly problems and name drop throwing shade on names and companies as much as robotunderground... its unfortunate because you have the talent and tools inside to crush it ,but your narcissistic/socialpath mind set blocks your success

[@kewlbug]

No no, you must be stupid because Patrick assures us this is not a business, and you are stupid for thinking so.

[@ryanamen6397]

At least hes honest...ive never seen another buisness owner be honest..ur all crooks

[@moasto02]

Libertarian calls the police and claims to "hear violence".

[@dipinmylip1171]

A raging liberal is not a libertarian. This guy is a 100% Democrat liberal, and that is the furthest thing from being a "Libertarian".

[@mosessalazar7818]

I honestly feel he could have met him halfways rebuilt the subwoofer with no warranty

[@RobotUnderground]

Let me know next time someone has rude to you and they demand that you pay for their mistakes. I mean if it was a hot chick that would be totally different

[@melissathompson7229]

This is why real companies charge more for their products, so they can swap out a product and take care of the customer. Pat Smear is 100 percent wrong, but he will just talk shit about everyone and say were stupid.

[@SlamryCamry19]

And even if you don't have the paperwork for 35$ to take him to court you can't loose any more than he already took from you

[@williamoliver7891]

Patrick no no no I like you but that is not right

[@CRXUGLYKID]

Understand both sides,but you should be the better person and repair it and one step farther charge for retuning. He was polite thru out situation apologizing toYour wife. You have to understand his point of view. He was very respectful and yet you continue to badger him calling him names etc. That's not cool. Your getting rude cursing etc. Not professional. Threatening him, calling him dumb, his dad dum. You want to punch him in the face,calling his dad dum etc. He never cursed you or anything. If anything if you put a softer set up then it's not gonna handle what he had. He wanted a rebuild not for you to make it better and because of you doing this making it uncapable of handling his setup. That's definitely your fault. Just show your viewers your better than that, he's a you tube follower. Don't treat the people that follow you that way.

[@joaquinaguilar5942]

When they guy brought his woofer inn to patricia 😂 blown or worn out, you state whats pushing it. Power wise if its a high power woofer you rebuild it with quality parts not cheap parts. And yes being poor making ends meets, scraping by means he is not buying quality coils to rebuild subs with. He is sourcing cheap, bet he bout the last batch of coils from Rockville that cant handle what they claimed😅. Even the soft parts stack 4 spiders to stiffen up the subs. Peirce audio sold me some nice woofer parts that are quality and been playing for years underrated quality.

[@RobotUnderground]

It says in the description of every video that I'm not a professional. Thank you for your comment though

[@TowGoat]

Rebuild the SUB Pat!!!

[@RobotUnderground]

Nope I don't give handjobs to rude people

[@dagorodriguez5265]

I feel bad for the guy, Patrick you called him names and belittled him thats not cool, never heard him call you names or talking down on you. Sounds like he just wanted his sub working again.

[@RobotUnderground]

Buy him a new sub then and you can both be dumb together.

[@dagorodriguez5265]

@@RobotUnderground If he can get a hold of me I have subs I can give to him that will handle that amp all day.

[@RobotUnderground]

@@dagorodriguez5265 I will not give anyone his personal information but you may be able to contact him through the Google review. His name is Ray Lott. He's probably on Facebook.

[@RobotUnderground]

He did respond on here if you want to text him. Just search the comments.

[@jimbobdobbs1597]

Outside looking in, i think you are just stressed to the max recent. Decompress, crank out the production and keep up on your rest brother. 10 yrs is a friendship, you are too damn talented to waste energy on negativity.

[@daddy_shark82]

fix his subwoofer patrick ,

[@MrBooMY3]

I had an RP 2000.1D on the 10" EVL for about a year and still sold the sub in perfect working order minus a wrinkle in the dust cap from me getting my hand too close when it was doing it's thing. If he COOKED the voice coil, that's on him. That's entirely too much power for that speaker even without clipping. If he killed it once already and needed it fixed then he doesn't pay attention to smells. If I smell voice coil I turn my system down immediately. I have never blown a speaker without doing it on purpose.

[@MrBooMY3]

I would have fixed it again personally and then made sure he was aware of any limitations from the rebuild and let him know if he cooks it again, I'm voiding the warranty.

[@joaquinaguilar5942]

Honor your work, you just said you made it better. Guy paid for your service you promised. You put inferior cheap parts inn. That dont hold up. Your issues. This is wrong business.

[@jeremynelson8496]

I got a RF 1500 bdcp, 4 gauge cca, no extra battery, and a 13w7 in a sealed enclosure. The gain is only a quarter of the way up and it's too much for the sub. Dam unleashing all of a RF2500 into a sub seems excessive.

[@Bigislandguy]

The gain is there to match the input voltage. It’s not a volume knob.

[@clittle1559]

do you have your sub hooked up 3ohm or .75 because .75 will def make the make a popping noies or bottom out ez

[@jeremynelson8496]

@@clittle1559 3 ohm. I'll say this when I turn it up some frequencies either the sub or the cabin doesn't like. Let me ask you this, Why is Ray relying on everyone else to work on his car, his stereo?

[@JrGarcia-dn6mp]

GOT A 13W7AE' powerd by aHD1200 shits slaps hard 😂got another HD1200 & 13w7 sitting in my rm waiting to pull back seat out of g37 sedan ..

[@hispls]

@@jeremynelson8496 Ray is probably paying others to work on this stuff for him because he doesn't know enough to do it himself. It is the job of the people taking his money and giving him merchandise to make sure what they sell him is fit for the purpose.

[@DJTJ13]

Im sorry Patrick but I have disagree with you on this one. If he is a friend then that comes first before any amount of money. Second you "made it better" but failed to fully expain and help setup properly. So this should be a leaning experience for you and chalk it up to that. Rebuild it to what the customer expects not what "you" think is better. Next stand behind you work. I loose money all the time bc my reputation it worth more than a couple dollars. You are a smart man. Do the right thing by him.

[@RobotUnderground]

I'm sorry you don't understand the situation

[@forsale313]

Once it's re-built....It's a different sub.

[@JrGarcia-dn6mp]

Not really brotha only if use different parts to build it 💯

[@forsale313]

@@JrGarcia-dn6mp He did use different parts and He told dude that when He gave it to Him! He paid NO attention to that, hooked it up and Blew it out!!!

[@fusion82]

Patrick uses cheap junk he has laying around the shop to rebuild subs. That guy would've been better off buying a new ds18 that would last another 5 years instead of 5 minutes

[@forsale313]

@@fusion82 Actually, he would have been better off buying the same thing He had because His system was set up for that specific Woofer.

[@remdawg4771]

Description on the rebuild states Rebuild D2 by Robot Underground. What does the D2 mean?

[@RobotUnderground]

Dual 2 ohm

[@remdawg4771]

That is what I thought but that shouldn't matter has far as wattage. That's when Rockford did that stupid constant power thing. 2ohm and 1ohm both rated at 2500 watts. Man if he had wired in series to 4 ohm (1500 watts) that would have been perfect. Wonder if something is wrong with his amp. Pro tuned - that Rockford amp has a clipping light on it.

[@RobotUnderground]

@@remdawg4771 Exact-a-mundo as Fonzi used to say. They ripped him off but I just loved hearing him say, "Pro tuned", as if that meant something. He could have also wired it in series and used it as a 4 ohm load with good results but he chose to DIY and not ask any questions.

[@hispls]

Shame on you, Patrick. If you know this guy is running a 3K+ amp don't build him a sub that won't survive what he's attempting to do with him. Either build it to survive (if you think you can), refuse to work on it, There's a concept in common law and codified in UCC section 2 called "implied warranty of fitness of purpose". YOU, the seller, are supposed to be the expert using common sense, not some local kid who pays a shop to gain his amps. If he comes to you and shows you his amp, box, install and asks you to build a sub, the onus is on you (the expert) to sell him something that will be fit for the job. If you didn't know what he was planning to do with that sub, double shame on you for not figuring it out before attempting to sell him a rebuild or """upgrade""", and if you knew what he was intending to do with it, built it anyway, and didn't even bother to set with him in the car for 5 minutes play a couple songs and explain to him where safe levels are and how to watch for thermal and mechanical limits triple shame on you. You failed as a merchant and as a person who claims to be in this to help or educate people. Take the L on this one and either rebuild the sub to hang with his install or just give him his money back and apologize. He came to you because he doesn't know what he is doing and you let him down.

[@txpate2009]

Let's rip it apart and look at it is it warrantable

[@hispls]

What is "implied warranty of fitness of purpose"?

[@djloveattack]

Dam this is all bad, you wanted to give him “something better” did not deliver. I pat And robot underground. But you should of just ate the bullet and gave him 100% customer service. Even if he drove down the street and blow the speaker/sub. Not way it should of happen that fast. Love you robot underground. Eat it on this one and make it right Patrick😎 show us all the words you stand by😎

[@pillcosby9106]

Patrick, if you told him the new rms power of the sub than i agree with you. If you just told him that you built it better why wouldnt he assume that he could play it how he played his factory sub for the last 5 years. These kids dont understand how subs work and using a softer spider makes the sub more efficient which requires less power. If you didnt exsplain any of that to him and you just handed him a sub and said i made this better you owe him a recone and this time give him a rms number to play it at. Thats the right thing to do.

[@yeahididit9054]

Or idk maybe set his damn amp up accordingly any number of things a “professional “ would have done to prevent this

[@SteveTheCanadian]

Patrick you're argument doesn't make any sense. Like 0. You made his woofer worse and then complained he used it as intended. Make it right man. What kind of game are you playing with people?

[@JohnDoe-fk5fr]

Patrick you don’t give him a softer suspension on a sub in a vented box. 2000 watts rms or peak that sub? If it’s rms it should of taken all that power, not all day but for for peaks in bass it should be fine for that amp. I have a jp63 on two twelves right now that are 1000watt rms each. Just my opinion.

[@RobotUnderground]

The volume knob is always the user's responsibility

[@JohnDoe-fk5fr]

@@RobotUndergroundlol your one tough sob Patrick! Bottom line is your right about that volume knob. Softer suspensions are only acceptable in sealed boxes. Go harder per back pressure on sub. Good video brother! Some people would have went hamds on after he didn’t leave and shout out to ya for not.

[@RobotUnderground]

@@JohnDoe-fk5fr Not true about soft suspensions. That mystery 12" I just reviewed would do wonders in 3 or even 4cf ported. As for being hard, I do my best to let science and logic do the talking. It's just my job to do my homework and be aligned with the facts. I watched Thilo of TC Sounds get really upset about that same argument he's had a million times with idiots with money. I feel it'll never change until someone stands up to idiots that throw tantrums. Ray was the one in that video. I just recorded another idiot yesterday.

[@FUBuddy]

i can get the coil on my rs platinum 15 a lil stinky with no clipping playing certain songs. just pushing it with a jp33

[@Bobbystilz43]

You’re wrong. You have a really backwards way of thinking. He seems like a genuine kid. This is why you have all the problems you do.

[@jarrodbrennan121]

idk pat.....i think you could of handled this better.

[@RobotUnderground]

Let me know when someone blames you for their problems

[@jarrodbrennan121]

@@RobotUnderground happens everyday. im foreman everything is my fault at the end of the day.

[@RobotUnderground]

@@jarrodbrennan121 That is correct and that's what you get paid for. You also get to fire idiots that act like idiots. He didn't pay me for installation, nor did he ask for help. He acted like a responsible adult until he killed it.

[@bruiserdickerson4039]

That’s a chance you take with rebuilt things.. in my opinion that’s like a motor in race car just a chance u take imo

[@jeanious2009]

This is the very REASON why I don’t do installs and have slowly refused to do repairs on amplifiers (especially if they have to be mailed in and out, that cost more than the repairs).

[@SlamryCamry19]

In all honesty your completely in the wrong you changed the specs of the subs and not in a good way if you lowered it literally 95% of the audio community uses higher rated amps then there subs because of impedance and voltage fluctuation if you change the specs to lower than the original rms rating you need to explain that in detail and why you did it so he would know you were saying something in the beginning about his amp and that you recommended something else it sounds like you were trying to get him to take it easy on the sub and if i had owned a sub for 5years and slammed on it with the same amp that was used before giving you the sub then it is 100% something that you changed about the sub are you saying that is was built better by the original manufacturer if I give you my sub for an repair and or upgrade why would you make it less than what it was im just trying to understand why a repair or upgrade would make it handle less than the original build do you honestly think that kid don't look up to you it was obvious he was sick over his equipment and the fact that he has known you for over 10 years and being done like that and from the sound of it he had all the lady's sympathy you may want to make that all the way right you really look bad in this video sorry to say if I was you I would be making it right and some trying to save face after this video not cool bro i was literally told to contact you yesterday for a sub build this video just made me rethink messing with you what are you thinking posting something like this bro you got to swallow your ego do you honestly think anyone cares about the man you want to be it sounds like you did the kid wrong because of your ego of thinking your builds are flawless NO manufacturer on the planet has a 100% quality rating it happens bro it was defective you even said the epoxy wouldn't take right instead of rushing it you should have just told him hey it's going to be a few more days need better weather there are numerous things you said that could have been done differently on your part you really need to just sit down and think about this situation this video and the way you are doing that kid could potentially cripple your business people don't like stuff like this bro just saying

[@julesbruchez-theartofgrapp9646]

My car stereo system was when I was 15. I am now 46 years old. I never have blown any speaker

[@RobotUnderground]

Maybe you're not dumb enough. Keep trying

[@julesbruchez-theartofgrapp9646]

@@RobotUnderground lol 😂 that’s a good one .

[@RobotUnderground]

@@julesbruchez-theartofgrapp9646 Yeah, I know this video is not in my best interest for money, etc., but that of course is not the point of posting it. I do appreciate martial arts and those that practice them. Not for the real life skills they yield but by the mental discipline they reveal.

[@julesbruchez-theartofgrapp9646]

@@RobotUnderground Patrick I love your videos. Most people in this world are incredibly softhearted and other things i can’t say because my comment will get taken down. Regardless if I don’t agree with you sometimes I still watch out of respect for your craft. And the fact that YOU TELL THE TRUTH NOT WHAT IS SO CALLED RIGHT THING TO SAY

[@RobotUnderground]

@@julesbruchez-theartofgrapp9646 "Without the truth we are all just blind." - Unknown man that jizzes

[@ryanamen6397]

Key note to learn here...always retune ur system when swaping any kind of speaker..even if its the exact same kind

[@RobotUnderground]

Well your best bet is just to use common sense

[@elguerocomentero]

Customer has a valid point. On the bright side he still has a killer amp. Get new sub and chalk it up to experience

[@Gagethestudman]

Ngl this was hard to watch. Not because of what was goin on with the sub just that you'd put this up. I can tell the dude was more than just a customer and thats the worst part. Its unfortunate what happened. Yea he blew it. The human part of you should have helped and guided especially if you let him assemble it on your property. I dont let just anyone use my tools so he had to be a decent guy. You know you can salvage everything and replace the coil at cost plus a bit of labor. I understand its a grey situation and as a company standpoint you arent necessarily in the wrong, all evidence isnt available tho. Just a sour situation that could have been handled differently. I want to like you man but you're really making it hard to. Hope it comes to a resolution

[@RobotUnderground]

Or he can learn a really good lesson at this that maybe you shouldn't be so rude that maybe you're not always right

[@Me-bf8bz]

On the topic of not always being right, did you perform a subwoofer autopsy to see what actually happened. If he installed it there is always the chance he decided to murder the poor thing by wiring it incorrectly, but there is also a chance he was just unlucky enough that he got one of the defective coils that come with manufacturing.

[@RobotUnderground]

@@Me-bf8bz He was so rude and defensive, we never got that far. That would have taken time to troubleshoot and to make sure it wasn't just a loose wire on the remote, etc. That could still be the case. That's one of the reasons I make my installations serviceable. If you're going to do show quality, you can be in charge of that shit. Also, he could have wired the coils in series until he felt how the sub would perform. He didn't. I assume everyone has learned the hard way like I have. Some things are just a guy thing I guess. Like proper gun safety / etiquette. Shit, you guys all gave me a hard time when I didn't know how to undo ratchet straps. I took it like a champ and learned how. My dad wasn't there that day for me but I didn't blame him, nor did I feel sorry for myself. I allowed and even rolled around in my shame and sorry for not having a dad to teach me something like that. I endured so that others wouldn't feel shame about the same situation. Everyone can do this.

[@keithcollier9320]

You can’t expect your customers to take the hit on your incompetence. You rebuilt the sub out of parameter. You’re in the wrong period. He paid for fixing the sub and you gave him a sub that performed subpar. If his system wasn’t professionally tuned, you might have a leg to stand on but your shit didn’t last a drive home. Your reputation will take a hit if you don’t fix the problem.

[@RobotUnderground]

Well I'm willing to take that hit even though I'm right

[@keithcollier9320]

@@RobotUnderground you don’t have to convince me, you have to convince all the other potential customers that are going to see this and think you might not be worth the hassle if you treat people like this. As I watched, I was thinking he has valid points and you went off the deep end when you call him stupid and retarded. I see this and think to myself, you’re taking advantage of people who may not be able to spend top dollar on new equipment. If you can’t guarantee your work, the customer needs to know it’s “as is” and explain they take all the risk.

[@hershelbrowning3533]

If its been days or months i could understand not wanting to fix the issue because user error but he came back to you in like 10 minutes so yeah. You owe him one besides you have been doing good business with him for years so your going to let a good client go over this. You might have 30 dollars in parts. I am sure you charged him at least double if not triple that .just make it right man.

[@RobotUnderground]

Again, you can mind your own business. You make something for someone and watch them destroy it in front of you and then DEMAND a new one. For you to, "Make it right"!

[@splitrockfence]

Give him his money back

[@RobotUnderground]

No thanks.

[@irodimusprime]

If you knew he was putting it back in the same exact set up… Mannnn I hope Ray gets a good sub. You just grinched him

[@RobotUnderground]

Well if you remember the story, The Grinch is actually a good person that people misunderstand because they're all selfish pieces of crap.

[@irodimusprime]

@@RobotUnderground oh wow how clever. Ok I have it backwards then. Either way Ray paid for a repair, not a weakened sub. Keep being lazy tho 🤙

[@daminhansford755]

Ouch this hurts

[@rmcarter79]

Make it right

[@matthewwatson9286]

Patrick, that was wrong, you were in the wrong.

[@elcaminosupersport]

Guy had amp adjusted to old sub. Although its same sub its considered a new sub since now its a d2 & previous was a d4.

[@bobbyackerson4125]

Exactly and the amps gonna put out way more power,that's why it only made it up the street

[@z1berzerker]

Bro... I would make him pay for parts or 50% 50% the deal. He realized he messed up, even though I have not heard it about half way through the video... He is & was ignorant to the facts, his break in seems to be full tilt volume. Just kind of WOW 😯 Should have kept it around 1500 rms. You handled that better than I.

[@Me-bf8bz]

If this was originally a D4 he would have been running it at 2 ohm. It was rebuilt to a D2 so it was probably wired down to a 1 ohm at the amp making it easy to kill that sub by overpowering it. The amp settings should have been set to match the new 1 ohm load.

[@Bigislandguy]

Guys I understand Pat sounds like a d. He should have investigated more. Maybe meet the kid halfway. If it’s a dual vc sub? What’s the odd the kid reverse the polarity on one coil. It would last about a block before burning the coil.

[@bobbyackerson4125]

Changed ohms on the coil from dual4 to dual2, that's why it made it 2 blocks

[@johnnyh127]

Love you Patrick, but this guy obviously just wants to figure something out. Even offered to split the cost to fix the woofer, and if the gains need to be adjusted just adjust them for him. People bring their vehciles to professionals because they are just a consumer and don't understand enough to do it on their own. You pride youeself in teaching people and helping them learn and this could have been a perfect situation to help someone learn and maintain a relationship.

[@SlamryCamry19]

Also if you win in court you can ask the judge for reimbursement for filling fees ,court cost, time out of work, everything file the claim against his business not him

[@RobotUnderground]

I haven't paid for anything and that's not my concern. My concern is the violation of my rights and judge and police taking retaliation. That's where thousands upon thousands of dollars. I'm going to give a shit about no filing fees

[@SlamryCamry19]

@@RobotUnderground you wouldn't have to worry about paying for any of it if you would just do people right that simple grow up and take responsibility for your actions just one more thing that clearly makes you look like a man child

[@RobotUnderground]

lol..... and thank you for SHARING your opinion.

[@bigshaggy6163]

Yeah that's messed up.. it couldn't handle 1500watts? But rated for 2k?? Because the softer spider..

[@RobotUnderground]

You could argue that it's more sensitive, so it's more efficient. Either way, always use your equipment with common sense.

[@JrGarcia-dn6mp]

Damn I don't know brotha I usallay agree with u on these but this one I can't.. SMH damn 10yrs of knowing someone then to do this.

[@coronicus6681]

LMAO he blows the first woofer with his professionally tuned BS and is surprised when he pushes it to the limit again.

[@forsale313]

Not to mention that.....Physically it's NOT the same woofer anymore (after a rebuild w/ different parts).

[@chrisnorrell7489]

Hasn't had heat cycles through it before he throws max volume to it

[@cin5cin1nat3i]

He blew it after 5 years. Then paid this clown to recone it didn’t make it 3 blocks dude is a clown 🤡

[@travisdilligaf3544]

Not right pat. Handys not hate bro

[@funfun8095]

Don't give a warranty, to locals, unless you set the gains! Sensitivity effects the gain!

[@RobotUnderground]

The people would just take the time to read the warranty would let them know that it never covers burned coil or tinsels

[@cgpitbull34]

This seems to happen a lot i notice.

[@abelscaliber7969]

Both of you guys are in the wrong. You should have told him to turn his amp down. He should have had common sense to turn it down on his own. That’s if you told you him it was a softer suspension. Patrick did sell him a perfectly good subwoofer. I mean this is comparable to someone building you an engine and you pull out the shop dogging the shit out of it and blow up the motor.

[@RonnieMacJr69]

I think the best solution here would have been him realizing, yes he blew the woofer himself. Then paying you for another recone and maybe just work a deal that you’ll do a quick gain, hpf & lpf adjustment.

[@RobotUnderground]

Well the sad part is I would have totally worked with him had he just had a better attitude

[@ericmarshall8269]

Yeah Patrick I am a follower of yours on KZbin you should have made that right and you should not talk to your customers like that in my city you would have got your ass beat not inciting violence but the way you talk to that man was very disrespectful

[@fusion82]

You got so much crap around that shop you could fix his woofer or replace it

[@TBO207]

pat dropped the ball unfortunately. the guy still has no in depth knowledge of what a softer suspension ment, without him acknowledging the fact that yes it will have less power handling, he was sent home with a sub that wont handle what he was going to preciously put to it. pat is selling to alot of people that arent super in depth knowledgeable and just like the sound these systems create. with that being said he should be the mediator in explaining that this sub will be different, will have more or less power handling or it will sound different instead of just saying what he modified on the sub, cause alot of people are not going to know what hes talking about. i love the subs this guy builds but he doesnt have very much patience with his audience ecspecially with some that need more explaining, sometimes the best customer service is just being a honest person and treating people with respect, which was not shown in this video. im sure this video will make alot of people who are thinking of buying some of his subwoofers look elsewhere. not saying i dont agree with pat 95 percent of the time but this with the exception.

[@waltlivernois6241]

That amp does 3200 to 3400 watts

[@hershelbrowning3533]

And you need to stop putting sherry through this kind of b.s

[@RobotUnderground]

lol. And you can mind your own business. Sheri needs training on how to be strong and aware of her surroundings. She failed when I got arrested and she failed in this video. We had many long talks after this. This is not bullshit. This is REALITY. This is what I've encountered dozens of times. It was a good opportunity for her.

[@hershelbrowning3533]

Patrick. You put it all out there asking what the people thought. Seems to me the people say you owe him one. I like your content and the brand bashing I like to learn and don't want no salty shit with you bud.

[@RobotUnderground]

@@hershelbrowning3533 lol. Please watch the follow up video. kzbin.info/www/bejne/omrYg2iXZbasl5osi=8JjANoLZF2TKyx1D

[@josephrabant7432]

I can't watch the video but.....I don't think the original or rebuilt sub was made to handle 3500watts rms from that amp.

[@hispls]

Don't watch the video, it's painful. The kid really doesn't understand any of this so pays "experts" to do the work for him. Patrick let this guy down big time by not building a sub that would handle what the buyer planned to use it for or just refusing the job and explaining what kind of sub will handle that amp/box without breaking or setting the amp appropriately so as to not break the sub.

[@hopskustomaudio]

If you didn't tell him that you changed the coil to a D2 then he was expecting it to work the same or better than it originally did. It sounds like you only told him that you made it better. So how was he supposed to know that the amp needed to be adjusted? I agree that he should have left when you asked him to but if you never told him about the changes then what you done is wrong man. If you did tell him and he knew that the amp needed adjustment then its completely on him. The video never showed that information tho. Also he was trying to be cool with you about the situation. So there was no reason for you to blow up on him like that. Imo.

[@RobotUnderground]

He was not trying to be cool with the situation You only saw the video that I filmed. Also it's his responsibility and you're missing that part if you've gotten this far in your comment. I suggest you watch the newer video where I go into that. You might want to start selling some subwoofers to know what it's like to be me

[@m3rk201]

I like patrick alot but good god you cant deescalate situations for shit. All avoidable. Build this guy a sub and be done with it.

[@joeyanglada1275]

Not a single company will warrantie burnt voice coil.

[@Gagethestudman]

Yea they will tf 😂

[@hispls]

That is not true, but regardless this situation is absolutely a breach of warranty: § 2-315. Implied Warranty: Fitness for Particular Purpose. Where the seller at the time of contracting has reason to know any particular purpose for which the goods are required and that the buyer is relying on the seller's skill or judgment to select or furnish suitable goods, there is unless excluded or modified under the next section an implied warranty that the goods shall be fit for such purpose. This kid in the video is so obviously "relying on the seller's skill or judgement" and Patrick did him dirty in practice and in the eye of the law. I'd bet very highly that any judge would make Patrick refund this guy's money if this made it near a small claims court.

[@joeyanglada1275]

@hispls user error. It's like you go to the dealership and buy a fast car and because you crashed the car you are going to blame the dealership because they didn't show you how to drive it. Makes no sense. BURNT coils 100% user error.

[@hispls]

@@joeyanglada1275 No it's not. If you want to use a car analogy it's more like you go and tell them you need a truck to tow a 40 foot 30,000 pound trailer cross country and they sell you a new F150 instead of a 350 and the transmission explodes. § 2-315. Implied Warranty: Fitness for Particular Purpose. Where the seller at the time of contracting has reason to know any particular purpose for which the goods are required and that the buyer is relying on the seller's skill or judgment to select or furnish suitable goods, there is unless excluded or modified under the next section an implied warranty that the goods shall be fit for such purpose.

[@avac4312]

I got a TARAMP 15k smoked my 6k 18 inch sub 5 min

[@cin5cin1nat3i]

That’s sounds like you own fault 😭

[@BericBuilds]

You should ask the gentlemen at Recoil if they would send me a DSP to review (while actually installed in vehicle). I could put a little more effort into the editing as well if they were willing.

[@nathanjames4242]

I would personally really like to see some actual SQ reviews of the Recoil amps. Their S/N and efficiency numbers are making me think twice about using them.

[@Bigislandguy]

@@nathanjames4242 bass amps are okay. The 1200w 4ch amp gets loud not the best SQ, running recoil mids.

[@RobotUnderground]

I think you can afford the $150. Plus they want me to charge $200 for them

[@kewlbug]

had to go back to figure out what the deal was w all the b s TLDW Robot modified a sub and "improved it" by decreasing it's power handling (drastically?) He might not have been articulate enough to navigate the situation in his favor, but to treat him like that and not work something out was outside of his reality (and the kind of person he previously thought you were). Why won't this guy leave? Poor guy thought you were friends.

[@RobotUnderground]

Friends don't burn up subwoofers and then want new ones for free

[@kewlbug]

@@RobotUnderground I can only assume his initial reaction was an overreaction causing your defensiveness. Worst case scenario... It was both your fault. He wasn't asking for a complete hand out, but he didn't have another solution to suggest. poor guy was freaking out about the loss. A reasonable person would work something out w the guy. Especially if he is a repeat customer. To me this guy was a calm and respectable as can be, compare that to the guy on the phone? Which guy would you rather deal with? The pure arrogance from your side is astounding. Even the cops were like uhh ok. one of these guys..(you)

[@RobotUnderground]

lol. That's your opinion. If you think I should have done something different, you can foot the bill.

[@kewlbug]

@@RobotUnderground Definitely should have done something different. I'm not going to solve the problem for you. I do commend your unwavering commitment to the "non-profit" model.

[@RobotUnderground]

Tell what model there is available? Like that of the NFL?

[@robbiewilson157]

What is missing is video of the delivery/discussion of how much power to use etc. Seemed like you were busy and youngun didn't listen so I get your side. However sometimes as the guy offered it can work out better to be diplomatic and negotiate. This video could have been so much better with an autopsy and could have gone positive instead of just an overall negative. Maybe the coil was defective for instance its not like they test them...

[@RobotUnderground]

Correct. He just was a bit rude and on the phone while installing it. He didn't ask for help and didn't ask me to go through it or set anything. He could have wired in series to test the waters, he didn't. He could have even been nice or assume the best about me, he didn't. Nothing was defective, I fully tested the sub, broke it in and did TSP's. kzbin.info/www/bejne/qZLHZWZqbZWooZYsi=M3i6yh6SWdoa4gcm Also remember that ALL power handling numbers are bullshit in one way or another. robotunderground.blogspot.com/2013/04/power-myths-and-maths-series-part-1.html That's why I was glad when I met Dan Wiggins that wanted to set CEA standards for subwoofer testing. What voltage would make the sub reach Xmax?? What voltage would make the sub reach Xmax in a box the size of the Vas?? The smaller the box, the more power the sub can handle at the compromise of the sub being able to play low. Same with a stiffer spider. web.archive.org/web/20060211224751/www.adireaudio.com/Files/BrahmaPowerHandling.pdf This is all the stuff I know and this guy didn't ask any questions. Just took off and started jamming. The only way to get experience is to mess up and then NOT feel sorry for yourself. Pick yourself up, re-trace your steps and TAKE RESPONSIBILITY to prevent the same mistake twice.

[@robbiewilson157]

from what i can tell the RF2500 doesnt even have a clip light seems dumb on an amp that costs that much- but yeah he put over 2k to the sub without even questioning if the sub could handle it (it couldn't) whoever he took it to that 'tuned' it for him were dicks too for not warning him that the sub would blow. Maybe they think a RU sub is immortal or something??

[@RobotUnderground]

@@robbiewilson157 I get a kick when people want a, "Robot Underground", subwoofer. I'm like, "I don't build them any better than anyone else. Just cheaper."

[@cubanman2009]

Why didn’t he lower the gain on the amplifier knowing that the subwoofer was @ 1ohm ? Clearly the old setup was “ProTuned” for a 2ohm subwoofer 🔊. I agree with Patrick clearly user error!

[@RobotUnderground]

He could have wired in series to try out the setup first... But only an EXPERIENCED DIY guy would know to do that. How do you get experience?? By messing up and NOT felling sorry for yourself. How did I find inspiration to absorb laws?? I kept getting FUCKED by the Popo and judges.

[@BudgetGroundPounder]

Wow! I don't think this video is helping your case at all. Because unless you didn't record the part were he was being crazy, if he was? I just watched a guy who was being respectful of you & has "known you for 10yrs". Being talked down to & be littled by you on video that you posted for the world to see. Then you even threatened to punch him. Because you didn't like what you heard the other person on the phone saying. Whether or not his father was telling him to be violent with you. Means nothing in the long run. I saw someone that was upset with what he got. When it would have taken you a minute or two. To say to him when he picked it up. Now remember to take it easy with it, for the first few days. Oh & It has a softer spider in it then it did before. So its not the same sub as it was before. So it might not be able to handle what it did before right away or at all. I mean shoot if that's how you treat someone you've known for 10yrs. Saying you won't even sell him anything else because he's to dumb to own "your" equipment. Then lying to the cops, saying it was really scary. Because you were dealing with someone you've known for 10yrs. That we all watched you threaten. Has that person ever been crazy with you in the past to make you have cause for concern for your safety? Saying to the cops thanks for being professional. When we all just watched, someone who is supposed to be a professional. Not act like one. Also if you're not a business, why are you making & selling things? You have things listed for sale in the description. Sorry but thats a business. What you finished off the video saying. Was so two faced. You contradicted yourself so badly. Saying your not in it to just take peoples money. To say that you should just shut up & take there money. This whole thing was over a subwoofer that probably cost you less the $50 in parts to fix.

[@RobotUnderground]

Wow I didn't even have to call my mother to be judged awesome thanks You might want to watch more videos and you also might want to learn some things

[@323hamstr]

I'm a fan of yours, but you're wrong bud.. these are things you should've let the customer know. you cant change something and make it "More efficient" and expect him to know what YOU changed and how it made things different..

[@floydwilliams3321]

Yeah buddy, I think you should’ve just taken care of the sub and been done with the situation to avoid all this drama even if you actually feel you weren’t in the wrong to not have all this negative stuff attached to your shop. It would’ve been well worth it because a lot of people who are going to see this video probably won’t have you doing any work for them, you may not care about that then again five years down the road things are a little bit different for you financially you may actually care who knows but in the end, probably should’ve just taken care of it because you didn’t properly explain to him what was capable and what was

[@RobotUnderground]

Well I see a bigger picture but thank you for your business advice. I didn't have to share this and I did and I'm aware that it doesn't make me look very good and I'm okay with that. I'm not a business and I'm not professional And that is all okay.

[@floydwilliams3321]

Probably should’ve had a little bit more communication between both of y’all

[@RobotUnderground]

He didn't want to listen.

[@danperez69]

Make it right, you know it won't cost much for you to repair.

[@RobotUnderground]

You're missing the point

[@RobotUnderground]

Without logic I should just give everything away because I'm rich right? Poor people can just be dumb and it's okay right?

[@curtisnavarro7098]

Oh Patty Danger...

[@avac4312]

Just turned his amp down for him. If you did change his spider then the amp has to be changed

[@fabeybaby8213]

he shouldn't have to..

[@bobbyackerson4125]

Changed coils from d4 to d2. Amp put out way more power that's why it only made it up the street

[@waltlivernois6241]

At 20ms and 1 ohms