Né en 17 à Leidenstadt (Clip officiel) - REACTION

[@eliseprevost2233]

FIRST !!.We can say that it is one of the most beautiful songs in his repertoire. A bilingual (French-English) version Born in 17 in Leidenstadt was released in the UK, as well as in the US, in which Fredericks and Jones sing in their native language. The name "Leidenstadt" was invented and literally means "city of suffering": it is an imaginary city that symbolizes all the suffering associated with war. THe 2 others singers are Mickael Jones and Carol Fredericks.

[@nicfit9928]

Pour moi, la plus belle chanson de Goldman Tellement vrai

[@fevesvfr]

The comment has been made in french but let me reiterate in english. The song is also built on the personality of the singers. The part on nazism is sung by a jew, on irish oppresion by an irish man and the one about segregation by a black woman "If we had been born on the powerful side, we don't know if we would have been strong enough to not act as oppressors" is what they are saying

[@LePierrackOfficiel]

wrong : michael jones is welsh. The purpose of his part is that he is british therefore in the british doxa, the IRA is "terrorist" and killed british soldiers and civilians. But he said, if he would have been a kid in the catholic ghetto of Belfast, he would have been possibly a member of the IRA as the kids of the video rioting against the police (there are not members so young but sympathisers and future members of the IRA)

[@blaisecarrensac136]

Thank you, dear, for your empathy in your videos

[@Rapoutch]

Masterpiece " But if possible, spare you and me for a very long time From having to choose a side " So actual...

[@Horusisone]

Choose your side comrade !!

[@maloryp4]

I think the whole point of this song is that it's easy to blame the people who are in the "bad side" of the fence but if we had been born in their side of the fence, in their shoes, would have we been better than them, would have we acted better? Maybe, maybe not. So after all, we can't blame too easily the others, because the circumstances are often too complex to acted good or bad, especially as a part of a whole country, people, cast or system. This is such a profound message indeed.

[@pierre.from.france]

I agree, it's a very deep song about the contradictions of human beeing. There's reasoning and empathy, but there's also personal experience, trauma that affects our decisions. The fact that the song is not only about Germans after the war but also about different cases like the conflict in Northern Ireland and the apartheid in South Africa shows the universality of this question. We are being blown away by the wind of History...

[@capueli6987]

Les deux chanteurs qui accompagnent jj Goldman sont Mickaël Jones et Carol Fredericks Ils ont je crois repris la chanson dans leur langue maternelle en anglais ils sont formidables un chouette trio avec de belles voix

[@vanessaferey5286]

This is one of their most beautiful powerful and meaningful songs This song should be teach all around the worl to make children understand that we have to not repeat the past ! That hate is more easy than love but we have to fight for love The three singer make a trio called "Fredrick Goldman Jones" they have lot of song together they had sung together between 1990 and 1996 Carol Frederick was one of Jean Jacques Chorist and Michael was his guitarist Sadly Carol had passed away in 2001

[@aerocap]

* Fredericks

[@franckrichard225]

Great question for Germans during the 20s and 30s (prequel of the great disaster of WWII), but also this song talks about the struggle between Pro british protestants and catholics in Northern Ireland (Michael Jones's part) and South Africa's racial segregation (apartheid, Carol frederick's part). Each singer tries to question what would have been his position if he had to choose a side, simple follower or resistant. Great singers, great song. Great chain also. Greetings from France

[@LePierrackOfficiel]

it's not a struggle between protestants and catholics but a national liberation struggle from the irish colonized people

[@cmoiden37]

la chanson dit " si j etais né en 1917 en allemagne qu est ce que j aurais fais le 2 eme couplet c est le britanique gallois michael jones qui dis "si j avais grandis a belfast" qu aurais je fait " 3eme couplet c est la chanteuse noire americaine qui dit "si j etais née blanche et riche a johanesbourg (afrique du sud) aurais je entendu les voix des noirs

[@desvauxsylvain6824]

One of my favourite teenage years songs. It tells all about mankind and its dilemmas? And the singers are just so great !

[@TerabKult]

Français, Anglais, Américain ou Allemands. Même combat. Tous envoyés à la mort par des élites, mais pourquoi ? J'y ai perdu tous mes arrières gd pères, 2 à Verdun, 1 dans la Somme, et 1 à Salonique (Grèce). Magnifique chanson de JJ Goldman.

[@blaisecarrensac136]

So true...

[@franny6591]

Bonjour cher Mr D ! Merci pour tes réactions de Goldman. S'il est une chanson que j'aime ici bas, c'est bien celle-ci ❤❤❤ merci beaucoup

[@benjamin_barbe]

Goldman est une machine à tube.

[@fabrice9252]

Une très belle et émouvante chanson en plus de nous amener à une réflexion philosophique, intéressante et profonde. Une réflexion sur l'Histoire d'abord, sur les conséquences des terrible réparations imposées à tout un peuple et qui a conduit au ressentiment, à la misère, à la haine et à l'extrémisme et les terribles conséquences que l'on sait sous le joug d'un fou. Quid de nos choix, du libre arbitre, soumission au système ou révolte, lâcheté ou courage ...comment nous comporterions-nous ou nous-serions-nous comportés dans des situations complexes, extrêmes et difficiles... Interrogation sur l'éthique, la morale et le jugement. Nous connaissons-nous vraiment? Ne nous révélons-nous pas véritablement, non par nos paroles mais par nos actes et actions quand la réalité et les circonstances font que nous ne sommes plus en représentation et qu'il faut faire des choix tant moraux que cruciaux et importants ... Une importante et grande chanson de Jean-Jacques.

[@nanahermar6129]

One of my favorite of Goldman’s songs

[@ameliehohweiller7981]

for those who don't understand french: JJG: what if I was born in (19)17 in leidenstadt, on the ruins of a battlefield would I have been better or worse than these people If I had been German? Shaped by humiliation, hatred, and ignorance, fed with dreams of revenge would I have been one of these impropable conscience a tear among a flood? MJ: If I had grown up in Belfast's docklands a soldier for a faith, for a caste would I have had the strenght against my own (people) to betray, to reach out a hand? CF: If I was born white and wealthy in Johannesburg between power and fears would I have heard these cries the wind carried? Nothing will ever be the same again. All: we will never know what we really have in our guts hidden behind our appearance, the souls of a brave, or an accomplice, or a torturer? either the worst or the better? would we be with those who resists or sheeps amongst a flock, if it took more than just words? JJG: what if I was born in (19)17 in leidenstadt, on the ruins of a battlefield would I have been better or worse than these people If I had been German? All: but let us be spared if possible for a long time from having to chose a side. Michael Jones and Carol Fredericks formed a trio with Jean-Jacques, and they did a few song together. Goldman and Jones did a song you already reacted to: "Je te donne".

[@marie4905]

Totalement d'actualité, je pense qu'on ne devrait pas tarder à tous savoir ce qu'on a dans nos ventres malheureusement... 😢

[@SkullManDu59]

Et qu'on nous épargne à toi et moi si possible très longtemps... D'avoir à choisir un camp 😢

[@maverick68000]

For Doug: you have seen the other guy in your reaction of "Je Te Donne " from Goldman too... 😁 And after some research in your archive you have seen the three of them in your reaction of "Juste Apres"

[@cleiophane2287]

C'est le groupe FREDERICKS GOLDMAN AND JONES. THEY MADE FEWS ALBUMS TOGETHER. Carol Fredericks is a very famous international vocal for a lot big english stars (like Duran Duran) .. and Sardou, François Feldman in France

[@seysselan7480]

Le plus étonnant avec Jean Jacques Goldman, c'est de se dire que c'est Céline Dion qui est venu le voir pour relancer sa carrière ....... Cela m'épatera toujours de voir que les nord Américains apprécient nos chansons 😀 Merci pour vos réactions et vivement qu'un jour on vous fasse découvrir Nilda Fernandez " Nos Fiançailles " !

[@cynthiagauthier8897]

The best song ever. I always cry a lot while I am listening to this one. Now that we have to choose a side again, it is even sadder.

[@pierre.from.france]

Michael Jones, who is Welsh, has been close to Goldman since the very beginning of his career, he played in his first group Taï Phong (which sang in English, you reacted to Sister Jane).

[@thierrydagain682]

Good ti listen this song with you, thank you

[@glambertini4709]

Yes, Goldman is Jewish through his father and mother. His familly suffered much during the war.If he had been born in 1917 in Germany and not Jewish, he would have been old enough to fight in the war in 39/45 on the German's side. Would he have been a nazi monster? Would he have been a German resistance fighter like there were? Would he have simply gone with the flow without asking too many questions? In France, during WW2 we had French collaborators who did horrible things to other French people, we had French Resistance fighters (women and men) who gave their lives and were heroic to liberate France or saving Jewish people and we had people who were just busy surviving during this time without worrying about one side or another. In short, the worst and the best. And if we found ourselves in this situation, we all want to think that we would be heroes, but the truth is that until we are confronted with these situations, we do not know and we will never know who we really are. That to me is what the song means.

[@pierre.from.france]

In my opinion, the question posed is not to be a Nazi monster or a resistance hero, but rather to be part of the flow of ordinary people who voted for Hitler. That is to say, the not very politicized majority rather than the extremes, that's how I understand the song.

[@chloemazier1704]

Hello ! The song is more about : if I had been boorn in their shoes (germans, IRA members, White south Africans) would I have been better than them or would have I choosen the same side in these conflict. That everyone is not born a hero or a villain but circunstaces can force you in a side and whithout living their life, you cannot know if you would have choosen differently.

[@frenchpatou]

Jean Jaques Goldman writes a LOT of songs for many famous and not so famous artists alike, plus for himself of course ....

[@virpierbapt2178]

Magnifique chanson de J.J Goldman écrite en 1990

[@stefblt5771]

Carole Fredericks, Mickael Jones (JJ's best friend, you heard him in "Je te donne") and JJG. They did albums and good songs the three of them Fredericks-Goldman-Jones. Try "Nuit", it's beautiful.

[@EyeOfTheTGar]

Beautiful song by Goldman. Actually, I think the message of the song is : if I was placed in that context of having born in Germany and having suffered all my childhood, what would I have done in their place ? Everybody likes to think they would have had to courage to resist against nazism and been the good guys, but nobody knows for sure what they would have done placed in this situation

[@emmanuelfani5385]

Probablement ma chanson préférée de JJ Goldman/Michael Jones/Caroline Fredericks

[@NanouPeb-vy3ug]

Superbe chanson et tellement vraie ❤❤❤❤

[@ThierryFOCH]

Frédérics/Goldman/Jones was great. You can listen "Rouge" ;)

[@pouchmi1]

merci ! goldman the boss

[@monpotagerdanslassiette2419]

You saw her in "juste après". the song with le little baby

[@fredfeydy2579]

Rip.caroll Frederick's

[@aerocap]

Thank you! Fredericks Goldman Jones (US-F-UK) ❤

[@ragekit1482]

Cette chanson elle fout les poils j'ai juré

[@Marvailh]

Carole Fredericks was the sister of Taj Mahal, famous american blues singer.

[@EvaHellN]

Mickael jones his father was a soldier in Normandy during the landings

[@frederic4844]

If I had been born in 17 in Leidenstadt On the ruins of a battlefield Would I have been better or worse than these people If a German I had been ? The song is about how unsure it is that we’d do the right thing in a difficult situation.

[@franckrichard225]

Or if he was born in the other side (Non Jewish German, the other religion in Northern Ireland, White Afrikaaner). At the end of the song he said that he hopes never have forced to choose side

[@Arthur-tn8yf]

Il serait grand temps que tu découvres CHARLES AZNAVOUR !!!! 😂

[@pierre.from.france]

C'est vrai que dans les grandes figures de la chanson française, il manque. J'ai prévu comme request patreon "Emmenez-moi", mais comme d'habitude ça va prendre du temps 😐

[@olivierferfache5346]

@@pierre.from.france ou "la Bohême".

[@pierre.from.france]

@@olivierferfache5346 Oui j'y pensais aussi 😌

[@antoinebeaulieu2017]

Hey ! For once I think you missed the mark here : maybe you wanna pick a translation of it because it is even deeper than you though ;) It's an appeal to tolerance and refrain from judging others, or to refrain from considering ourselves morally better than them, because if WE had been in THEIR shoes, maybe WE would have become the bad guys. Goldman, as a jew, is saying plainly to the world that had he been born german during WW1 he might very well have become a nazi come WWII. Michael Jones says that had he been Irish and born in the ghetto of Belfast he might have turned IRA terrorist, and Carrol Fredericks says that if she had been a white young girl in South Africa, she might have considered black people inferior and supported appartheid. The question is not "would I have been better of as a german than as a jew" but rather "would I have made the same choice as them if I had the same life" (because white people in South Africa had it better than black people on every point of measure so that's not the question ;) )

[@arnault-d]

Great explanation! That's why he choose born in 17 in Germany. You would have been 22 in 1939. The question being, at 22, with this heavy history you already have, would you have become a nazi or not... The fact that he's jew and he raises this point make the song even deeper indeed. "refrain from judging others" that's exactly it. Especially today when we judge history so promptly. I think it's also an invitation to think about ourself, living in peace for long time now, learning WWII history and all thinking: "Yes, I would have been in Resistance, I won't have been a nazi, not me", while the experience shew that most people didn't make that choice. No judging here, as the song shows, these choices can't be obvious.

[@fofie63]

Les parents de Jean Jacques Goldman étaient juif allemand pour l’un et juif polonais pour l’autre. Ils ont été déportés dans les camps. Michael Jones lui est gallois mais ses parents étaient irlandais. Et Carole frederiks est Afro américaine mais elle est issu d’une longue lignée d’esclave d’Afrique du Sud qui a émigré aux usa pour fuir l’apartheid. Chacun dans cette chanson raconte son histoire et se demande comment aurait-il réagi s’il avait été dans le camp adversaire. Et la morale est « si tu ne veux pas avoir un jour à faire le choix douloureux de choisir un camp sachant la menace que ca exerce sur toi et ta famille, évite de provoquer le destin »

[@nicolehenry6938]

Leidenstadt "city ​​of suffering": is an imaginary city which symbolizes all the suffering linked to war.

[@damienfritz]

Looks like we'll have to choose a side real soon... Let's hope not...

[@hellemarc4767]

After WWI, most of the Germans weren't better of, on the contrary, which is why they voted for the guy with the moustache, who promised jobs, a stable economy, etc. People had no idea of what was going to happen.

[@Cascas422]

N’importe quoi

[@ferguy72]

Leindenstadt is not a real place in Germany, it''s like suffertown in English

[@thaeros]

it's and it's not a JJ goldman song, YES he was the composer of that monstruous song BUT it's a band he created with an english guitarist mickael johns and an american chorist "claudia fredericks" until... the death of claudia fredericks... mickael johns after that continued to play with him as his guitarist! it is " said" that the 3 was friends... i don't know if it's true but i think!

[@olivieretcecilepineautexie9351]

@@thaeros they were Friend, Indeed. Carol Fredericks died few years ago. She was already the Goldman's chorist on all his tour, and his guitarist was Jones.

[@thaeros]

@@olivieretcecilepineautexie9351 thanks, i'm french but not a goldman fan ( but i really respect his work) it's just that many peoples said he was an " exelent singer", i'm not OK with this statement yes he have a very good technics ( of singing) but by itself his " natural voice" was " normal"! but i will said YES if peoples said he was a very good composer both music and lyrics! Goldman fans ( like any fans) are... hard to speak with even more if you don't think the same way than them on their favorite artist lol!

[@natinatiouchka7173]

💖

[@edutilos1]

@Reactions by D : La chanson décrit que les soldats Allemand de la 2è guerre mondiale étaient pour beaucoup né pendant la 1ère

[@florian3111]

You already saw them, Michael Jones and Carole Fredericks ! (Juste après, Je te donne...)

[@LesCimes]

Hope you'll listen to "J'aimerais vous revoir" one day.

[@SébastienAuteza]

Look Frédérics/Goldman/jones

[@heyles4394]

Hello D, j'ai une suggestion pour toi Daniel Balvoine - SOS d'un terrien en détresse Merci :)

[@hochardvalentin7418]

J.J. Goldman is more writer them singer. He wrote many wonderful songs for many signer like Jonny Halliday, Lara Fabian...

[@crowblank1]

N'est ce pas le visage de Zouk que l'on voit à 1:22 ?

[@pierre.from.france]

À 1:22 t'es sûr ? Je ne vois pas de visage 🤔

[@crowblank1]

@@pierre.from.france A 1:02 pardon 😑. Besoin de binocles moi 😄.

[@pierre.from.france]

​@@crowblank1 Peut-être je ne saurais pas dire, j'ai vu cette grande artiste en spectacle quand elle était beaucoup plus jeune donc j'aurais du mal à la reconnaître 😁

[@davidrol5939]

J aime bien gooldman un des meilleurs mais ya Michel berger qui est du même genre.

[@mariolamazur9814]

🧡