Rebuild a laptop battery pack

[@FennecTECH]

"ultrafire" probally not the best brand name for lithium batteries"

[@consolehacker54]

A year or so ago when e-cigs first became incredibly popular I repaired them for people a lot, and most of them use an 18650 battery or two. The Ultrafire ones are complete trash, and that specific brand is known to actually vent/explode a lot in ecig/vape setups because of the insane current draw

[@chrispychreme02]

Fennec Fox So that's what the Note 7 used XD

[@ryuranzou]

This made me look at what model my e-cig battery was and it uses that same model. Didn't realize that laptop batteries could use the same model. That's neat.

[@robitaill3]

neither is Samsung. take their Note 7 for example

[@evknucklehead]

The Note 7 didn't use this particular model of cell, as it would be nowhere near small enough to fit in their phone. As for who made the batteries used in the Note 7, I don't know, but could possibly find out with a bit of research.

[@IIGrayfoxII]

I got 4 of those 6,000 mAh of those ultra fire batteries for an LED torch The capacities were tested with a Foxnovo F4-S 136mAh 272mAh 409mAh 351mAh

[@IIGrayfoxII]

+JuriePie I knew they would be shit, but hey they cost $5 for the 4, they run the LED torch for 10 min at full brightness before the torch starts to dim which is not a bad thing as the torch gets very hot

[@kleavenae]

+IIGrayfoxII I have one 6,000 Ultrafire that has 286mAh actual capacity, too.

[@AlAminIsmailDaily]

+IIGrayfoxII wow.. just wow.. 1/5 of advertised capacity

[@IIGrayfoxII]

+Ismail Mohd Yusof you cant even get 18650s in 4000mAh let alone 6,000mAh. I checked on ebay, they are now claiming 9000mAh

[@leocurious9919]

+Ismail Mohd Yusof 300mAh * 5 = 1500mAh. Not 6000mAh. 300 obviosuly is 1/20 of 6000

[@Sefilenginar]

One tip: Adhesive copper tape does wonders - adheres very well and you don't need to heat up any part of the cell, and they are very thin meaning they're good for confined spaces (like these laptop batteries) where soldering adds unwanted thickness. Less messy too, and no need for extra wires or anything. I used them for two separate batteries that I refurbished a while back and they work seamlessly.

[@Kit-lb6tr]

I'm going to try this for testing purposes. Sounds like a good idea for non permanent projects too.

[@cheezyfriez12]

@@Kit-lb6tr I'm assuming the adhesive side is non conductive right?

[@sanibelt]

@@cheezyfriez12 Depends what kind you get, some are conductive on both sides some aren't.

[@ikhsanmaulana8660]

Nice idea but i found it in wrong time, arghhh

[@UnulOarecare]

Adhesive copper tape...hmmm...interesting...I'm curious where I can find that in Brasov, Romania - will try online as well but thank you for this useful tip - trying to repair a laptop battery from 2012 for an Asus x54c Romanian - romana: banda de cupru autoadeziva...hmmm...interesant...sunt curios unde pot găsi așa ceva în Brașov, Romania - voi căuta și online dar mulțumesc pt această sugestie folositoare - incerc sa repar o baterie de la un Asus x54c

[@saintsainty1178]

Hello guys, this 2024 September 24. I used to have that laptop many years ago, i bought it as a used laptop. I was happy to own an apple laptop, and learning how ox work, since i am a windows user. My battery was bad, though as a computer technician, i was able to rebuild it, and go about three hour from it. Was mainly using it to watch movies. Those days was fun. The battery, you bought the capacitance or power was low.. mine i later used the battery pack to build and laptop battery backup. I was just tired of mac, because of the software i had was on windows pc. It was really fun building battery and pc in those days. Thanks man.

[@JakeJoris]

"ultrafire" batteries have capacity from 50mah to 400mah.

[@xXxmlg_vacxXx]

The name ultra fire means that they are ultra flammable

[@Gigidag77]

#oof

[@brahmanandadas729]

Like refurbished battery

[@Broadcast1Channel]

When getting lithium cells make sure to get the tagged ones if you are going to be soldering them. Applying a soldering iron directly to the cell is very bad as too much heat is transferred in to the cell which can damage the cell or even trigger a thermal runaway. Permanent connections made directly to the cells should only be done with a tag / impulse welder to minimise heating to the cell.

[@zen4realfightman426]

Well he like a lot of us probably doesn't have a place to use a tag for impulse welder and does not own one

[@garyhanson655]

@@zen4realfightman426 if you don't have the correct tools to do the job safely or properly than maybe you shouldn't be doing it.

[@zen4realfightman426]

@@garyhanson655 well not in this specific scenario but sometimes you have no choice but to do the job with incorrect tools but desperate times call for desperate measures

[@KrotowX]

Nowadays DIY people can buy very compact and affordable handheld spot welding kits and metal strips for 18650 cell terminal welding. Check Banggood and Aliexpress for portable spot welders. Requirement for room venting during use is still in effect.

[@shawnerz98]

@@garyhanson655 I've done 2 laptops (12 cells + other connections) with a soldering iron set to about 700 degrees. No issues. Scuffed up the tips of the batteries and used flux to minimize contact time and heating. You work with what you got to get the job done. Not buying a tack welder such a small, temporary job.

[@brandonlehman7440]

The old intro is quite nostalgic, can't believe the growth this channel has had!

[@taikomotionanimations1089]

DID HE JUST SAID HIS FIRST BAD WORD ON HIS VIDEO?!

[@elliottsimmons9024]

This video is from 2015.

[@Yeen125]

To be fair, my only and major concern about buying cheap batteries from China is that they may explode after a certain period of time.

[@TheDragonballboy]

Like those old dell laptops

[@The8BitGuy]

***** Admittedly, I had that concern myself. I guess I'll let you know if they explode.

[@Wiejeben]

The iBookGuy +Gage M. You will probably notice a burning smell before they do. But don't take my word for it :D

[@sausagedog52]

***** theyre actually fairly safe, just terrible quality

[@MikeyLovejoy]

The iBookGuy get it on video lol man i wish u were still selling ibook g4

[@10100rsn]

Great tutorial. I've done this a lot with older laptops and it works great, but there are a few things to watch out for. 1) Don't buy cheap batteries from eBay. Buy them NEW from a reputable source. 2) Buy the batteries *with the tabs*. YES! You can buy them brand new with the tabs welded on them. If you try to solder to these batteries directly like that you can damage them and even cause them to catch fire or explode. In properly made 18650 batteries, that top button tab that you soldered to is not actually connected directly into the battery. It would be connected through a PTC+CID device (which sometimes is that top tab) that can fail at high temperatures or over-volt/over-current conditions. So soldering directly to it can actually kill the battery or even destroy the protection device making the battery very dangerous. 3) This simple method will not work with most newer laptop batteries. Most newer laptop batteries require you to reset or reprogram the charge controller. Some even lock you out once you remove the old batteries and so you need to replace _and then_ reprogram the charge controller chip to make it work properly. So if you're really determined it can be done, but you can save yourself the time and money and just get a new one...

[@supernova6486]

Save yourself the time and money and just get a new one... Not if they don't make them anymore as is the case with my Gateway/Acer MD-7818U. You could say why not just get a new notebook well the answer is that I have upgraded the notebook and still use it because it still runs windows XP and windows 7 X64 in dual boot. I will not touch windows 10 because of the system bricking forced updates and will not use windows 8 or 8.1 because of the metro theme or rather those blasted live tiles that look like a child's toy and or no desktop.

[@mescko]

Unless you were stupid enough to buy a laptop on CL that no one makes batteries for anymore 🙄 "Why was it so cheap?"

[@10100rsn]

@@mescko I hope you don't expect a serious response to a question on a comment from 9 years ago. But the answer is that it was cheaper before batteries came with locked down BMS chips. Now you also have to have a programmer and possibly a blank BMS chip to program and have the skill to solder the new chip.

[@robertnoble3733]

Soldering directly to the cells is NOT a good idea. To be safe, you should buy cells that have solder tabs welded to each end. Then make solder connections near the end of the tabs away from the cell.

[@stuvs830]

I did blanch at seeing that. But my Macbook battery suddenly bulged one day so I'm apprehensive. They weren't yet engineered to quit accepting a charge when plugged in.

[@OpenGL4ever]

+Robert Noble Exactly. What he does in this video is wrong and a high safety risk. Especially when using Lithium battieres. It's okay to solder NiMH batteries, it will of course harm them, but NiMH batteries won't explode when soldered. Lithium batteries will explode and that is the danger in doing this. That's why manufacturers only weld them together.

[@asusphoebus2114]

+OpenGL4ever In case of explosion he would get few millions of youtube views in 2 days :-)

[@thysonsacclaim]

Do they actually "explode"? I've only ever seen them get hot and start to take off thermally and start a fire. Didn't know they could explode. But then again, a battery is basically a controlled bomb. The more energy you pack into one, the closer you are to having an explosive device.

[@OpenGL4ever]

Adam Lawson Well it's a question of how you define explode. For example, It the seal is broken, lithium will react with the humidity in the air, this will cause a fast chemical reaction heating and building up hydrogen gas and this gas is not only expanding but if it gets mixed with the air and catches fire it will also explode. If this happens within the enclosure of the battery, pressure increases to until the enclosure rips suddenly apart then followed by the ignition of the hydrogen with air and eh voila you have some sort of explosion. But of course, it is not a reaction like TNT.

[@s0nnyburnett]

Spray can extinguisher. For a lithium fire. I wouldn't even feel safe with a real ABC extinguisher.

[@AmyraCarter]

Either that, or a very cold environment, especially if the change is sudden and sharp. The fire will flare up but quickly lose its' fuel. Tossing a lithium fire into a wet snowbank? Yeah, it'll work. It'll also melt a good portion of the snow in the process.

[@eduardoavila646]

So you're not felling safe with your iphone/ipad/android/windowsphone/laptop device?

[@VerstehenSieMathis]

Those batteries contain lithium compounds instead of the bare lithium metal, so it's not thaaat bad... the extinguisher might be able to prevent the other stuff on the table from catching fire :)

[@eduardoavila646]

Mathis Bü If it doesnt contain water or dont make water condensate in there its ok. Lithium really doesnt like to be punchtured or being in direct contact with water, causing some flames. But it isnt as dangerous as its fumes.

[@thatsunpossible312]

There's not enough metallic lithium to worry about. Even water is fine to quench a LiIon or LiPo fire.

[@codebeat4192]

Notice (and warning): This will only work for dumb/dolt battery packs (for example the battery pack of the IBM 2141). If there is a circuit board included inside the battery package, for example to charge the batteries balanced and/or a chip (IC) to report the health of the battery, a 'smart' battery (not only just a simple current protection IC), this might not work and could be dangerous. The problem is the health data stored/recorded inside the IC. It is not calibrated like you noticed, well, it actually is, however with old batteries in mind. Some IC's use also a charge counter to determine the health status (lifetime) of the whole battery, after X charges it needs to be replaced and/or it will use a modified charge/operating scheme. This is for safety but also to sell new batteries. If you replace the batteries with new ones, the IC 'thinks' these batteries are still the old ones and charges the new batteries like the old ones (for example at higher current). Result: The batteries will last a little longer however not as long as should (like you noticed - no evidence the batteries are of bad quality) and the batteries could be damaged earlier, can get very hot, start to leak or even explode. You are warned, do not underestimate batteries of this type or caliber. You can only do this when you can reset the chip (must support an extended battery protocol) however only a few support this. In this example it is Apple, I am sure that is not possible. Don't waste your time and money to such revive projects, it won't last very long and could be (very) dangerous. Also solder the joints is a pretty bad practice but that's another story. No blame at all, hopes it helps by experience, by being informative to avoid unnecessary dangerous situations to other people.

[@dieselgeezer18]

oof

[@FeelingShred]

probably he doesn't care about getting full time from the batteries, he just wants some backup power for when he needs to change room or when there's a power outtage so the thing just doesn't shutdown immediately (causing harm to the hard disk for example) What I really wanna know is why my Samsung phone's batteries were working fine one day lasting for 2 hours charge and then suddenly one day it would not last over 10 minutes without being connected to the charger, that was annoying.

[@j.lietka9406]

so if you determine that 1, 2, or more, 18650s are bad, the best practice when rebuilding the pack, is to have the same brand & capacity cells to replace them? thanks & great response have you made a mini tac/spot welder to tac on the nickel strips to the terminals? thank you

[@j.lietka9406]

code beat hmmm thought i just posted a reply here. so the best way, and safest! to replace bad cells is to use matching brand & capacity? and properly tac the nickel strip to the terminals. is there a way to reset the battery pack monitor PCB? thank you for the great info

[@so_many_women_so_little_ti2833]

Thanks I appreciated. I sent same question to him before I sent you (I saw your comment after I sent him) I have no knowledge and I took my battery to special technician (I don't know if he's good or no). I have few questions: 1- How about if I change all 6 cells one time just to make sure I have all cells are new? 2- What is the different between cells color (Green, Blue, Orange,....)? 3- If no Difference, my laptop is Acer Aspire 2920z, battery color is green, can I change them with example blue, Purple,.... cells? 4- If I change all 6 cells, do I need to make like recognize/setting between the new cells and the circuit? (I hope I made it clear. I don't know how to explain it). or 5- Should I just forget it no need to change the cells? Advise me please.

[@wonton8983]

To get an old laptop working that needed a bios update, which requires at least a 20% battery charge as well as mains supply. With the laptop battery removed, I connected my old 9v battery drill battery directly onto the laptops battery pins for the +- -, did the bios update, which fixed the battery charging problem and as a bonus it fixed the RAM issue that had more than 1/2 the RAM reserved. Job done.

[@no-damn-alias]

Would've been interesting to see the internal resistance of the old cells and what their capacity still is

[@AlanNg1202]

Straight to the point addressing the pros and cons of these El Cheapo batteries.

[@Landrew0]

"You get what you pay for." Nope, not always. Ask those guys in the white vans who are selling audio cables for $500 apiece.

[@user-tt6ct4ii8t]

I got a laptop for 550 dollars.... It broke just when the warrenty was out.... Never buy HP....

[@jacobbutler7942]

@@user-tt6ct4ii8t they all do that. Especially because Norton Security

[@PunakiviAddikti]

@@user-tt6ct4ii8t Did it break or did it just get so slow it was unusable? You can repair the OS with a new copy of Windows 10, available for free.

[@user-tt6ct4ii8t]

@@PunakiviAddikti No the whole display is broken.

[@mwbgaming28]

@@PunakiviAddikti why would anyone use that cancer? windows 7 is far better (and before you mention security, just use a good antivirus program dumbass)

[@iammeena6945]

If anyone wants to follow instructions like shown in this video always make sure You Don't Solder The Two Vent Holes Closed (Positive End Of Each Battery) Because If You Do, Your Batteries Will Explode. Vent Holes Are There For A Reason!!

[@scorpionbradford]

Vent holes ? Please give me more details on this. He nvr mentioned any caution about this !

[@HungPham-ki9wu]

what you mean those vent holes are even connected together (parrallel circuit)

[@THEtechknight]

You actually got really lucky that it took off and worked. I have seen more often than not, the controller's EEPROM needs to be re-virginized and have all the "battery dead" flags reset. Dell batteries are notorious for that, same with IBM.

[@THEtechknight]

***** There are actually software packages that will do that, you do need a programming adapter though, once you remove the eeprom. Some batteries have a backdoor where you can use the existing SMbus. Some dont.

[@pyroslavx7922]

You do it like disarming an IED bomb ;-) Connect aligator clips (if you feel brave today ;-) or solder temporarily some random old li-ion cells to all contacts, no cell connection to protection board should ever get disconnected. If it does, protection circuit of some batteries, (but not all), will raise a tampering/catastrophic failure flag in its MCU software, and will appear dead. Then you remove old cells and solder on/install new cells, then you disconnect temporary connected cells. (voltage difference between new and old cells does not really matter, as long as they are somewhere between fully charged - 4.2v and fully discharged - 2.5V, there will be no damage connecting the two together in parallel temporarily, current between them will be few amps for some seconds and slowly taper off, this is still within specs) This is considered a "safety feature" (i guess coz it protects laptop company from money loss from lower replacement battery sales).

[@tyronenelson9124]

Pyroslav x your right the eeprom within the battery pack records charge miss balancing between the cells then sometimes it can suddenly permanently disable the whole battery back even when you replace the cells, so you end up purchasing a new one from the manufacturers, i think its abit of an intentional money scam

[@ChintanMeena]

The connection of 2 batteries are in parallel and then they are made into series (3x) , there is no way for controller in this particular circuit to know which cell died (in parallel connection) it can only detect potential difference across *parallel unit as a whole* if it marked those set as bad cell then current will fail to flow from those cell and the potential drop of 11.1 is really hard to maintain if this happens basically it means whole system is dead ... and probably the controller will flag whole system as dead Pardon my ignorance but i don't see any reason "software controlling flow of current" just by flagging cells as good or bad .. as you can't really deactivate single unit connected in parallel connection (for a unit that is connected in parallel in order to deactivate would need to be short circuited (risky)) or it need to be physically removed from circuit that is open circuited) can you point out how exactly controller deactivate (that is, put batteries in open circuit ) I'm asking this out of interest ...

[@TheSpotify95]

Packard Bell battery packs tend to completely shut down (and never recharge again) when the voltage gets below a certain level on even a single cell. That's how my BP-8050 battery packs have failed.

[@wateringcan2]

For anyone reading this, you need a class D fire extinguisher in order to stop a lipo fire. Regular ABC extinguishers won't work, and they can actually spread the fire. I couldn't find the extinguisher in the video online anymore, but I found similar ones from the same manufacturer, and I am nearly certain they wouldn't be effective against a lipo fire. Sorry for being critical, especially on such an old video, but I had to mention it since it's a matter of fire safety.

[@Kotesu]

There might be a secondary issue with the short run time of your batteries: internal resistance and brownout. As your computer pulls current from a battery, the chemical reaction that occurs can - if they're old or poorly constructed - not be able to react fast enough to push more electrons through. This manifests as a dip in voltage until the action that's pulling extra current ends. The problem is that most battery monitors use voltage to determine the state of the charge, so your laptop suddenly freaks out and thinks the battery is dead. Putting cells in parallel does two things: 1) they offer greater capacity, but equally as important 2) increases the maximum current output of the pack. Given the cheap Chinese cells, the electrolyte inside might be contaminated or more likely that the electrodes have less surface and reactive area.

[@DoctorBlankenstein]

TIP: Rough up the ends of the batteries with a file or sandpaper before tinning them with solder. The solder will stick a lot easier, and better.

[@daishi5571]

Also use flux.

[@paijoaoxxi1873]

I love your videos! They're always so creative and different from other Tech channels out there. I don't see them making iMac G3 Cathouses or replacing Laptop Battery Packs. Even older videos from 2012-2014 are still relevant and cool. Good Job! (I do like other Tech channels. I just enjoy your creativity!)

[@medmusic7977]

You forgot to tell that the batteries should be at the same voltage before getting assembled! It is important, if they’re not at the same voltage that what can happen. 1. Extremely heat and no charging . 2. Very slow charging . 3. No charging at all. They all should be at 3.7 Volt at least and you discharge them after assembly not charge them at first.

[@blank.e5plus]

and whats a good way to discharge it fully?

[@medmusic7977]

sdfxcv blank use a 18650 power bank case theres plenty on ebay or aliexpress just type “Power bank case” and then use something on the usb port of the case

[@Raprada]

You need to upload more often, I really like your videos!

[@OpenGL4ever]

+Riswan Ahmad P This video is a high safety risk. You mustn't solder Lithium batteries, they will explode. Only welding is okay.

[@BenTheTechGuy]

+Riswan Ahmad P same here bro

[@bairfamilyfarm1336]

+OpenGL4ever So... I put myself at risk of death or serious injury at least 4 times already?

[@SofiaFox]

+OpenGl4ever Then why didn't it explode in this video and the one of the four time +zappy bear did?

[@kentuckywildcatgobigblue7190]

Most likely has a life and a family outside of KZbin.

[@skorpius752]

Just what I needed. I am getting ready to refurb my Sony Vaio E series laptop and it is impossible to buy a decent battery pack these days. I have a couple of battery packs for it, which will be nice for portability. Well, insofar as you can be portable with an 8lb monster.

[@skat3stepvirgo]

One thing I have found is a lot of the batteries in those packs are still good so you may want to test them to see if you get better results because they run independently. In the packs that have bad batteries they're usually all bad but most of the packs still have good cells.

[@Fendibson]

You got some balls doing an experiment like this.

[@Valveman11]

Thanks for the video! I have a Toshiba T1100 Plus that was given to me. Of course, the old NiCad battery pack was dead. I went to a battery store and obtained some new cells, rated at 5000mah instead of the original 4000mah. All I can say is that the run time is incredible! I used that laptop as my school laptop in college, and I used it all the time. I would get about 10 hours of run time on it, and only had to recharge it once a week. Keep in mind that I was using this computer at school just a few years ago, not back in the 90's or something. It turned out to be the most reliable computer I have ever owned. I got a lot of looks with that old dinosaur :)

[@pyroslavx7922]

Rather keep clay bucket/pot (as it's non conducting and heat resistant) and bags of fine sand you can throw over flaming battery, as it won't mess up electronics as water/foam extinguisher does... and those dust extinguishers make way more mess than a small fire, and li-ions keep re-igniting after you extinguish them. I tried it ;-)

[@fabts4]

Soldering onto Li-ion cells, I wouldn't do it. You can have an online shop weld the nickel plates for you.

[@supercrazymario404]

I’m going to rebuild a PowerBook G4 Titanium battery with 8 genuine 3500mah 18650 cells from Panasonic and this video sure helped me!

[@superluig164]

My ASUS ROG gaming laptop only goes for about an hour 30 on a charge, and this laptop was only released LAST YEAR. Trust me, you can live with that on an only iBook.

[@consolehacker54]

An old iBook doesn't exactly match the power of your Asus though, if you could connect the Asus battery to the iBook it would probably run for a week lol

[@josemuygay8851]

+Jason Grimm bruh not really, that shitty ibook uses 8 battery cells, back then processors were a lot more inefficient

[@dhdhlee9449]

You really should try to spot weld the batteries. I never thought it be a good idea to buy a battery spot welder separately. So I just modified my good old trusted Telwin modular 20 TI sheet metal spot welder. Worked like a charm for all the battery taps.

[@filds1]

Im pretty sure you need to test all the batteries and see the voltage. And then pair the batteries with closest voltage possible to get the best result

[@whitenorthstar]

Flux the battery terminals first as it makes soldering the wires on that bit easier, You can also reuse 18650 batterys from old battery packs as long as they look and test ok,

[@marcusdudley7235]

+john porter Fine grit sandpaper, then flux, then solder.

[@whitenorthstar]

Marc Dudlee the fine grit sandpaper goes without saying Marc...but in a lota cases the flux is enough to remove the oxide coating on the metal as thats whats its job is to do...remove the oxide coating,

[@JesuszillaS]

Also I'd recommend Mouser or DigiKey over eBay for parts.

[@jedblow]

I did not have any extra room to use wire. I took a tin can and cut the lid into strips. I used a butane soldering iron and flux. I placed a lot of heat on the batteries. I purchased high quality Sony batteries 9 dollars each. It was still difficult to fit into the pack by just a few mils. I took a Dremel tool to further grind down the solder joints. I got it all in and used rtv to reseal the case in case I ever need to reopen it. And it works great. It was a Sony Viao laptop from the year 2000. I installed Windows xp on it to run old games and other software.

[@abbas1967]

Thanks for the video , i have a question: they told me if you want to change the battery you must not remove the old one before you connect the new one to the electronic circuit because it will lose their memory and it will not work at all even if the new battery is good ! Is that true ? Is it a successful process to change the the battery ? Can i remove the old one without losing the memory of the circuit ?

[@xaer0knight]

instead of applying so much heat to be battery to get the solder to adhere, just file the terminals down to make a rough service, clean terminals with rubbing alcohol, apply some flux, then solder. A rougher surface can help solder stick.

[@friedrichsinofzik5969]

itś not so easy. Most of battery packs have an internal controller that you need to access by manual to change some parameters when you exchange the batteries. Like maximum charge, reset the charge count and minimum and maximal voltage charges.

[@BavarianM]

More modern ones have that problem

[@alexandrecouture2462]

Great video! I am currently rebuilding a battery pack for my little Mitsubishi Amity CN laptop-netbook from 1996. I use a lithium battery pack from ikea, made for their bluetooth speakers.

[@betariffs]

1:43 The closest we ever got to him swearing.

[@josetorrealba1887]

hey ,if anyone else needs to find out about restoring a battery try Jadonite Renovate Battery Buddy (do a google search ) ? Ive heard some extraordinary things about it and my buddy got amazing results with it.

[@gasoares85]

Really good video. I've never imagined how a laptop battery looks like inside.

[@TechWalker]

You should have a list of things you need before starting a tutorial.

[@douggale5962]

Well, it's a stretch to say they are lying. Those junk batteries really do have that much energy, if you trickle discharge them at 50 uA or so. The good (Panasonic etc) batteries have far more capacity than listed, they just include the effect of internal resistance and put a decent load on it to provoke more resistive loss, and they list the energy you get after typical losses. It's the equivalent of saying a phone has two weeks of battery life, without mentioning that it is in airplane mode with the display off the entire time.

[@stonent]

The correct term is toilet-seat ibook.

[@TechnologySpotlight]

Stop hating on Apple.

[@dufftheduff7335]

+Technology Spotlight it still looks like a toilet seat

[@TechnologySpotlight]

Still, stop hating on Apple. The iBooks are beautiful computers :)

[@aretard7995]

@@TechnologySpotlight toilet seats are beautiful.

[@aretard7995]

69

[@jaymoreno8469]

Your love for technology really shows! Great channel, and video. I hope you keep producing quality content.

[@FurEngel]

Pro tip: make sure to apply a drop of liquid flux to the battery terminals before applying solder. Also, solder paste may work better than solder wire.

[@craigbuzan]

Fantastic video. I've always been just one step shy of doing this (worried about soldering LiON batteries). This gives me all I need to get it done now!

[@Chevroldsmobuiac]

Is there any concern about damaging the cells with the heat from the soldering iron?

[@OpenGL4ever]

+W Sears The instructions in this video are wrong. It is very dangerous to solder lithium batteries, they can explode by doing so. Lithium batteries must be only spot welded with the right welding tool, but never soldered.

[@mikejones-vd3fg]

COuld it be just 1 battery? From my understanding in series the voltages stack but the capcity is that of the lowest pack, maybe theres just one battery that cant charge fully and its dragging the capcity down? Maybe it would be wise to do capacity test on each battery and perhaps you can get some good cheap ones if you dont mix any bad ones in, your pack could be fine. Just speculating here but yeah you get what you pay for, but im still interested to know the capcity of each battery, and maybe even the soldering onto the ends could have damaged one's capacity? I heard heat isnt good for lithium batteries im sure the video maker knows now, most all are spot welded togher, which leaves me skeptical if those spot welds can even transfer enough amps given their small size, a solder joint should make electrons flow easier, theres no gaurantee the other tin will contact the battery other then where the spot welds are , which are small. So im not totally discounting soldering onto battery for other reasons, but heat cant be good, but im not sure about that either, what exactly the heat tollerance is and does it permantly damage the cells or just for a moment or what. Anyway thanks for the video im thinking of doing the same and wilil go ahead, trying not to solder onto the batttery but ont he the nickel that hold them together from already spot welded pairs. Recycled of coure, but i think if you match them all up nicely you can make a good pack out of some bad ones without the need for new batteries. Its usually just 1 that ruines a pack and is thrown away while the others remain good.

[@mrlithium69]

Reminds me of what Austin Evans dad would seem like

[@jhonwask]

MY HP notebook battery finally failed the other day. Thanks for the information, as I will attempt to repair the battery pack. Love your channel.

[@ihaveriffs8261]

So is this project economical if you buy better and more expensive batteries? Or am I better off just buying a new battery pack? I've looked them up before and it's only like $20 for the one I need.

[@The8BitGuy]

Ihaveriffs - In the case of the computer I did this for, the OEM battery packs are no longer available and the few aftermarket batteries that are still being sold are old-stock so they probably don't have much life left in them either. If it is a newer computer, you are probably better off buying an OEM battery.

[@tokeeptrackofrandomsubs5899]

+Ihaveriffs The way I look at it when buying 18650 batteries to replace the one inside the pack there are two possible solutions: 1. Buy new batteries from a name brand through a proper source. 2. Buy a few extra of the cheap ones or maybe scavenge some from other sources. With method 1 the trouble is finding a reliable source that is somewhat affordable, for my purchases usually to power either a project or a torch I generally use a webshop named NKON (based in the Netherlands and this gives me convenient 1 day shipping, outside Europe it's probably better to use another source). Haven't had a bad battery from them yet but I'm sure there are many other good places, in addition to the warning that was in the video also be aware that there's a lot of battery rewrapping going on.. if it seems too cheap to be true it probably is. Panasonic high capacity batteries go up to 3400 mAh (perhaps a bit higher now? it's been a few years since I investigated stuff) but it'll be in that order of magnitude. High drain batteries typically go up to 2900 mAh and not much higher, but I found that Panasonic NCR18650B 3400 mAh batteries will hold up pretty well up to 5A discharge currents. Now when you opt for method 2 and buy cheap batteries I suggested to get a few extra because you'll have to charge and test the batteries and balance the whole pack somewhat and perhaps dump one or two of the really bad ones. The bottleneck for this design is when one of the pairs that is chained up in series gets drained, then the microchip will notice that the voltage over those cells drops too low and shut down. So in order to avoid this you should first upon arrival check if the batteries have a sane voltage (if they are below the recommended voltage charge them with caution or not at all). Then once they get to a full state of charge using a proper CC/CV charging system run a discharge test on them, it can be whatever really constant resistance with a power resistor, running a light that'll do okay in the 2.90V-4.20V range or if you have it a fancy electronic load that can be set to constant current, constant power, constant reistance etc. Then discharge them with that method of choice and take note of how long each takes to drain to your cutoff voltage (don't discharge them too deep or they might be damaged by it!), match the pairs up well enough so that two cells combined are roughly similar for all 4 pairs in series. This should give you the best result while sourcing cheap batteries. If you don't have a lot of fancy electronics tools the most economical way is probably to find a lightbulb that runs well on the voltage range or power resistor and while its discharging it monitor the voltage over the battery with a multimeter, doesn't have to be expensive. To charge the batteries you could use a charger designed for 18650 batteries or a lab powersupply that you can set to both a constant current and constant voltage limit. Set the charging limit to something sane (don't go above 1C, aka filling up the "rated capacity" in one hour) and set the max voltage on 4.20V. While they are charging in the constant current stage I'd recommend to keep an eye on the temperature of the cells too, if they get a lot hotter than normal good cells its a sign those have high internal resistance and probably shouldn't be included in the pack.

[@power-max]

+The 8-Bit Guy Those cheap batteries tend to be all over the place, i have had some that worked pretty well (for a short time), and others which did not hold any charge. They definitely would not stay well balanced in series like that. I have heard that they actually are often recycled batteries, ones that are name brand but have been pulled out of (you guessed it) things like old laptop batteries!!!

[@fkujakedmyname]

+Ihaveriffs that has the cheapos in it so yes

[@roborovsky6950]

+Ihaveriffs No , it's not better to buy some shit oem battery pack. You can invest a little more and get panasonic 3600mah cells , wich will in most cases almost double the run time , since most laptops got 2000-2400 mah cells in the factory battery. Those panasonic cells really hold 3600 mah's though.

[@eduardoavila646]

3:24 It's way better to buy a super capacitor and use it as a safe pinpoint welder and weld thin steel plates into the batteries (like the originals) than soldering it. Also way easier. A supercapacitor with 500f capacity at 2.7v is totally safe (as 2.7v is a low voltage and wouldn't be able to electrocute anyone) and its also cheap. It doesnt heat up badly the battery, as a soldering iron, so it doesnt have the risk of loosing maximum capacity because of heat damage, nor it has risks of overheating and shorting out.

[@MrCoffeeman58]

wow, the first time david "swore" in a video, that was funny as hell though! 1:40 Btw: Do you think you could do a iBook G4 battery rebuild?

[@ParadoxdesignsOrg]

I've been wanting to try this as I fix laptops all the time. Great tips!

[@oo0speed0oo]

Your the man bro. Great job. keep up the great work.

[@TipsterLIVE]

I dig the new intro!

[@eduardoavila646]

And a warning so people dont waste time and money: -Not all lithium batteries can be fixed like that, some have a cycle count in the micro controller, wich prevents the battery from working again after its supposed lifetime has been achieved. A good example is a dell inspiron 1545 laptop wich can't have just the cells replaced, the battery still reports to the bios "battery life bad" and and laptop wont charge nor use their stored energy.

[@WildMidE]

Exactly its happened to me after replacemet the cells, my laptop inspiron 3421, so how I can fix this problem please tell me if you know, Thanks

[@flameshana9]

Why not just reset the controller?

[@WildMidE]

@@flameshana9 some battries controler cannot reset

[@flameshana9]

@@WildMidE That sounds like a purposeful limitation. Like how cell phone batteries are hard to replace nowadays.

[@linksmith1057]

Sorry David, utmost respect for you, but soldering to a lithium ion battery is the tantamount to setting up a time bomb. When these batteries build up pressure, there is a vent on the top under the positive terminal. This valve is actuated by a spring with very specific tempering. Heating up the battery to solder on it ruins the tempering of this spring. If the battery has a "non-passive failure" (in other words, starts venting flame), the damaged spring may not relieve pressure, so instead of a small jet of fire, you could have an explosion. It's like using a recalled airbag. It won't hurt you until you are in a car accident, but when you are in a car accident, it could be a lot worse as a result of this. Just buy a third party replacement battery.

[@RetroMMA]

",8" would result in "PRESS PLAY ON TAPE", no?

[@The8BitGuy]

RetroMMA no. Device 8 is usually your first disk drive. If I left off the 8, it would ask me to PRESS PLAY ON TAPE.

[@DobleWhiteAndStabley]

Oh sweet! I have some spare cells after building my powerwall. Now i can rebuild a pack instead of just buying a new one which would cost me upwards of 30 bucks. This is awesome. Now that i think about it this option was so obvious but only now do i understand that this can be done.

[@nickguy6820]

This is really not a good idea, for several reasons: 1) Soldering Lithium batteries is a catastrophe waiting to happen. Most of the chemistries used in 18650 cells release oxygen when they hit thermal runaway. That means, if something catches fire, they provide their own fuel. An extinguisher will be next to useless. Thermal runaway might occur somewhere north of 150C, but... what's the temp on your iron again? 2) You don't know anything about the charge controller. Does it assume the cells are pre-balanced? If so, top or bottom balanced? Or does it actively balance them? If it balances, then your first few charges might just take a long time to get from 90-100%. If it doesn't, then it's up to you to balance them appropriately, otherwise you end up with a "fuel gauge" that is way off. (Speaking of which, is that fuel gauge self-calibrating, or hard-coded?) 3) What was the chemistry of the original cells? The new ones? What is the recommended charge current? What is the low-voltage cutoff, and at what load? What voltage should you charge to? Most common chemistries don't differ by much, but some can be charged to 4.2V while others will get very cranky above 3.6. Chances are you'll be close. However, things get really ugly when you're not. (Keep it off your lap for a while.) 4) As others have mentioned, some charge controllers have cell state memory. This isn't as much dangerous as a waste of time and money, as it would just mean it won't work. I'm all for DIY, but Lithium Ion cells are temperamental and the risks should not be taken lightly. If you don't know what you're doing, this is a job best suited for a battery specialist. Or just pony up for a genuine replacement pack. Cheaper than new nads.

[@yourick1953]

You just spend 1 hour on writing that

[@nickguy6820]

Nah, I type fast. Absolutely no more than 55 minutes. 57, tops.

[@williamd7161]

Nick Guy. Looks like you know well about batteries? Why don't you make your own video on why not to rebuild your loptop battery!

[@davideil.]

Nick Guy here to second what William d said. You should make a video. More knowledge in the world is only better. You might even save someone a hospital visit.

[@Explore531]

I love the beginning of your video because of Defender sound effect

[@polixstar8249]

i though this was a kipkay vid

[@polixstar8249]

***** indeed

[@gandalfwiz20007]

Kipkay sucks now, all he does is advertise loads of shitty producs

[@5.43v]

True, its sad

[@Nubyrc]

buy lipos for RC aircraft and cars, they even have the wires out for charge cycle testing. You can get a lot MAH for a small package.

[@XTHHedgehog]

First and last time I've seen a swear word on one of his videos

[@thohangst]

Yeah, I'm kinda in to content that is safe for the whole family. I'm glad to hear this was a one-off.

[@aidancommenting]

Timestamp? Edit: never mind

[@ChaseMC215]

@@aidancommenting Where was it?

[@aidancommenting]

1:40

[@calolbest4202]

1:44 the 8 bit Guy only curse word

[@quaditz]

I exactly did this like 2 years ago for an Acer notebook and then it did not recognize the battery anymore (altough I soldered everything perfectly, all voltage levels where correct). The reason was, that the controller was "resetted" when I desoldered the old ones. So if you want to be sure, first apply a power supply (with the right voltage) in parallel to the battery pack (and apply all voltages to the 3 or 4 voltage levels). Then desolder the old ones and solder in the new ones, then you can disconnect the power supply.

[@mikkkeh]

OMG! A curse word on this channel,I thought he never said any!

[@IMDYT420]

Vadim Gaming he didn’t say it he put a image in so technically he did say it

[@SenileOtaku]

As an alternative to soldering to the batteries themselves, how about making something like the battery holders you would find in your typical portable tape or MP3 player? Spring-metal tabs that you simply snap the rechargeable batteries into, and you simply wire the contacts up in the appropriate configuration. That way you're not risking fire/explosion from soldering to the batteries, and you can change the individual batteries out. The other thought is, if you have a machine you want to be functional without needing to look original; get some of those rechargeable USB power packs and make up an external pack. You wouldn't be able to charge the packs with the computer, and it would depend on the original battery pack having a power output readily divided into 5v increments though.

[@djmips]

Interesting idea but there is generally not much room in the battery packs to allow for battery holders so it would be a bit tricky - might require 3D printing a whole different case.

[@BavarianM]

Most laptop batteries stop working if you remove the cells

[@JakeJoris]

nope they don't.

[@BavarianM]

@@JakeJoris they do Unkes it's an old laptop Inna try doing this on my 98 compaq armada

[@JakeJoris]

@@BavarianM I've replaced cells in at least 10 laptop batteries, they all continued to work, except the t60 one.

[@BavarianM]

@@JakeJoris I’ve never been lucky with it Have you tried on a Compaq Armada 1750?

[@MrWhitetrashbob]

That is a very well produced video...thank you!

[@mattypants]

As someone who's worked in this industry for years and has hundreds of hours of training both in classroom and hands on with engineers, this is incredibly dangerous and irresponsible. There is no guarantee the protection circuitry is still functional or functioning properly and no guarantee soldiering the battery won't rupture the pressure seal. Rechargeable packs of any chemistry should always be spot welded to avoid damage. Take a look at the Hoverboard meltdown videos if you want to see what an inappropriately constructed lithium battery will do. I would strongly recommend spending some time looking at videos and reading literature on what happens when lithium batteries go critical before you do this. In any case, a regular fire extinguisher wouldn't work to put the cell out once it ignites, you would need a dry powder extinguisher specifically designed for metal fires.

[@zedalert]

Just did it today, soldering acid did it's job - I have had soldered wire to the battery within 1 second with standard 25W soldering iron.

[@brentblackwolf6325]

It doedn't look like a good idea to heat up litium batteries

[@brentblackwolf6325]

So a misclick on the keyboard means that i don't know english? By the way, i'm italian, that's not even my mother tongue, or maybe you are convinced that only english speakers are allowed on youtube?

[@brentblackwolf6325]

What?

[@brentblackwolf6325]

Whatever

[@kosztaz87]

Yeah was thinking about the same thing. I guess if you are really quick it's ok. But I know most guys (supposed experts on stackexchange and such) don't recommend it. Still, I think I will try my luck sometime.

[@umageddon]

how do you suppose the batteries were soldered in the first place? With ice?

[@Thomas5937]

Your solder and wire method of connecting the batteries may also have introduced more resistance than the original welded clips that were used, which could also contribute to the battery life being shorter than expected

[@djmips]

Since copper is way more conductive than nickel, I'm pretty sure it won't add appreciable resistance as the gauge he used is a decent size and the solder joints are not going to add appreciable resistance unless they were done extremely poorly.

[@RynardMooreVstar1]

Folks, please do not attempt to rebuild a laptop battery as suggested in this vid. The method of connecting the cells using solder is wrong and highly dangerous. The cells need to be tack welded together. Tack welding batteries of any type requires a spot welder and knowledge of how to use said equipment. Additionally, lithium ion battery fires are very hard to put out once they get going. You are better off letting a professional battery rebuilder handle the task or just buying a replacement battery pack from a reputable seller -- if you don't know what you are doing. In any case, again, don't follow the instructions in this vid because they are completely wrong.

[@SoundToxin]

Rynard Moore Can you give us a source on this information?

[@RynardMooreVstar1]

SoundToxin​ I did battery rebuilding for years but if you don't believe me look up someone who does this as a trade -- they will tell you the same thing.

[@nayeemakhtar1]

thanks... background electric wire (on wall ) management is awesome

[@gonigeena]

don't buy chinese batteries! they will set alight

[@Kippykip]

Don't the Chinese ones use some kind of liquid? I might be wrong

[@domnulvlad4471]

ᴵ ᵈᶦᵈ ᵃ ᶫᶦᵗᵗᶫᵉ ᵐᶦˢᵗᵃᵏᵉ ᵇʸ ᵇᵘʸᶦᶰᵍ ᵃ ᶜʰᵉᵃᵖ ² ᵈᵒᶫᶫᵃʳ ᵏᵉʸᵇᵒᵃʳᵈ ᶠʳᵒᵐ ᵃ ᶜʰᶦᶰᵉˢᵉ ˢᵗᵒʳᵉ⋅ ᴺᵉᵛᵉʳ ᵈᵒ ᵗʰᵃᵗ ᵐᶦˢᵗᵃᵏᵉ

[@technologyproductions-ye3px]

Src Dgyg theres nothing wrong ekth a chinise keyboard and mouse

[@cynic5581]

Its a shame China gets such a bad rep for their knock offs. Just FYI some of the best 18650 batteries from Samsung, Sony etc are also manufactured in China. They are indistinguishable from their Korean manufactured counterpart in quality, reliability, durability, etc.... Peoples persistence for being cheap is why this stuff exist. If we all stopped buying 1 dollar 18650's (because they suck and that would make sense right?) then they would stop manufacturing such cheap batteries. But instead lets buy them then pretend to be surprised they suck and complain about the country that manufactured them ignoring the reality of the problem....

[@kayak347]

All batterys are Chinese lol

[@dash8brj]

I have a battery spot welder - I know this video is a bit old but do not encourage people to solder to lithium ion cells. It only take one to have the soldering iron on the cell for just a bit too long and they can go nuclear. spot welders are great, fairly inexpensive and make the connection in a split second, not heating the battery anywhere near as much as soldering. I repack laptops with Panasonic 18650's which usually end up running longer than the original battery.

[@IoRobot_98]

your channel speaks almost exclusively of apple products, why you not tell us what you think about the apple today, with all the defects that have HUGE ... I'm a fan of the apple, but today makes unacceptable things like staingate, problems with the assistance, the way it behaves with the employees, the poor quality of the products ... i'm curious to hear another opinion.

[@IoRobot_98]

him expresses his opinion on Apple... did you read the comments?

[@IoRobot_98]

***** XDDDDD np :)

[@chrisshaw1294]

+Lorenzo Balivo Apple doesnt make the screens, there suppliers do. staingate is not a reflection on apple, they didnt make the screen. they stepped up and will replace any bad screen for free immediately.

[@IoRobot_98]

+Chris Shaw but they didn't want repair it...

[@jameskatt1]

+Lorenzo Balivo No one would want to repair it. But Apple is. So there.

[@CharlieQ7400]

The IbookGuy? this is the first time I know that, this video was surprisely recommended.

[@luclu7_]

It was his old channel name

[@OpenGL4ever]

NEVER EVER solder wires on Lithium batteries! Soldering on lithium batteries is a high safety risk, only welding with the appropriate welder equipment is okay, because this works a lot faster than soldering, minimizing the risk of exploding Lithium batteries to a minimum. In short words: "Don't solder, weld them!" I really hope no one follows your false teaching video. If your batteries are NiMH batteries, only then it is okay to solder, but with Lithium batteries, never solder them!

[@DFX2KX]

+OpenGL4ever You mean like a spot welder? Yeah, that's the safest route. However, if your soldering iron can melt the solder fast enough, your risk of thermal failure's pretty low. I've seen people do soldering jobs on the cells in 3,300 mAh R/C Lipo packs without problem (I wouldn't do it, mostly because I wouldn't want to be cutting that pack open myself). You do have to be aware of the dangers if that battery gets heated too much. That being said, you can find many a cell with a terminal already welded on, which is the route I will go with when I go and replace the cells in my Fujitsu's batteries (How I'll get the CD-slot battery open, though, is a mystery)

[@griml0gic420]

+OpenGL4ever Its not really an issue. If you are quick as stated by DFX2KX it wont thermally fail. What I have heard most is that it damages the batteries capacity. So if you were to not solder that is why.

[@technologyproductions-ye3px]

what happens to the battery

[@griml0gic420]

***** I do it all the time. I just don't hold it to prolonged heat. Prolonged heat for a coin cell, however, is much less time than a much larger 18650 cell. "It explodes, sending burning shrapnel all over, including your eyes..." That is also why you wear proper PPE

[@OpenGL4ever]

***** I do always wear eye protection when soldering or welding. I do highly recommend that.

[@MarionetteKazuko]

A bit off topic, but I use 18650s for my vape mod and there's quite a few shops that actually carry ultrafire batteries still. One shop, the owner was clearly aware of how crap they are and kept them in an "unofficially" (hand written) labeled case "Ultrafire 18650 3000mah". From my understanding, some of those cheap brands also misrepresent the amps for them as well, although I can't say for certain if that's true. Point being is if someone wants to do a project like this, I'd recommend going for good batteries (sony, samsung, etc) and not take a risk with rip offs. That aside, this was a good video. Something to keep in mind since I have some extra batteries, although no laptop to test this with haha.

[@CoherentPhoton]

those efest batteries if they are genuine are pretty decent batteries for the price. the ones I have are pretty close to the stated mAh rating. The IMR type are also pretty safe and durable too.

[@whocares3900]

8 bit guy I really like your video's. They are very entertaining.

[@RebusForever]

Would love to have seen a like for like with cheap and expensive batteries. nice work as always.

[@Slot1Gamer]

Some laptop batteries have built in battery management, if it goes dead flat it will disable it's self, so even if you replaced the cells it won't charge

[@BavarianM]

Most*

[@WildMidE]

Exactly happened to me after cells replacement, my laptop is inspiron 3421, so how i can fix this problem? Please tell me if you know. Thanks

[@brucewrigleysgumchewz4667]

Sounds like something Apple would do. 💩

[@skyem5250]

I have several things to say. First, DiodeGoneWild tested many of those fake cells, and many of them were around 500mAh. Second, a lot of people are saying that you should spot weld the batteries instead of soldering them. I agree that spot welding is better than soldering, but soldering is still fine as long as you're careful not to heat the battery too long. Fire is highly unlikely. The worst thing that would realistically happen is that the battery loses some capacity.

[@kurtlindner]

Great video. I guess the price has dropped alot by now because Panasonic 18650 are only $40 total to redo that, and you get the proper life.

[@rohitgprasad1993]

loved the video, amazing way to explain dummies , simple and informative and very very honest , thanks a ton for the video.

[@Liquidmin]

I tried to find any information about this issue and I founded it!! You are cool dude!

[@VSigma725]

I've heard old NiCad batteries can actually be restored to part of their original capacity with something called a bench power supply. You run 30V through each cell for just a second, do that 10 times, and you get a battery that works at something like 80% of what the battery originally did. Sounds dangerous, but exciting!

[@warrenmcclure7819]

Nice video 8 bit guy. I am debating on rebuilding the battery for my epson action note 660c laptop because as you can tell its dead. The laptop was made in like 1997 and so the battery is totally dead. I know a good amount of info when it comes to computers, I have rebuilt MacBooks and other laptops but this is my first time rebuilding a battery pack and first time soldering anything sooo my question to you is what should I watch out for? I dont mind having my old ass laptop only get 2 hours of battery life, I just want to make sure I dont blow my face off in the process. Thanks for this video by the way!

[@raafmaat]

After this video I decided to set out an experiment to make a super battery pack for my laptop, since my laptop uses 4 pairs of these batteries in series, I decided to try and make a huge battery pack using 40 of these batteries. Ofcourse i had to make sure that it would still output the same voltage as 4 batteries in series, so i had to make clusters of 10 batteries each, wich then all connect in paralell . meaning each cluster of 10 had all the minus connected to eachother and all the plusses to eachother, if you have these 4 clusters complete then you finally connect each cluster from minus to plus, this way it keeps the same voltage but increases the time it runs. Now i have a battery pack that lasts arround 12 hours, and it only took me 12 hours to make!! :P Down side is that the batterypack (encased in dukttape) is bigger than the laptop itself (i shaped it nicely to kinda look like a docking station to place your laptop on)

[@ilcool90]

Nice video. I really need to start learning how to solder

[@griml0gic420]

"No matter what I do to this battery I'm not going to make it any worse of than it is now." It could explurd! Even a dead 1860 battery pack still carries power. Be careful!