I spent 20 years during the 80's and 90's operating with and on various carriers. I was an Operations Specialist (AIC) attached to VF-142 Ghostriders F-14 squadron . We trained quite often on this exact scenario (not always Iceland of course). The standard procedure would be to launch two E-2's each offset from the loa (so if detected wouldn't point right back to the BG), about 200-300 nm from the battlegroup. There would be two F-14s stationed about midway between the E-2s and the BG. The E-2s would be radiating and the BG would be in EMCON. Two missile frigates would be stationed about 50nm in front along the loa. The Tico's would be around the carrier about 10nm away (in case of a nuke). The rest of the warships in one of various AAW formations. As soon as the Soviet recon aircraft were detected most of the remaining F-14s would be launched carrying Phoenix (to attack the bombers if possible) and a standard AAW loadout. The two E-2s would buster back to the BG missile envelope and the two forward F-14s would launch their Phoenix at the bombers and assume a loiter orbit waiting for the additional F-14s. Once the missile launch was detected from the Soviets, all the F-14s would launch their Phoenix at the bombers (if within range) then prepare to attack the incoming missiles. After the F-14s shot down what they could they would be cleared from the SAM envelope so the ships could fire at the remaining missiles. In the meantime the forward frigates would launch their helos with radar reflectors and the frigates would commence launching chaff. The hope being that a large amount of the missiles would home in on the frigates and helos. They were considered expendable to protect the carriers. Then after all this hopefully the remaining missiles would be few enough for the battlegroup to handle.
@levimadoff5283Сағат бұрын
We going full war thunder with this one
@andreamanninfiaschi1679Минут бұрын
Typical US Navy thinking...so much for those frigate crews!
@StephenDavidson535917 сағат бұрын
It’s been a year or so, time to read Red Storm Rising again.
@BenjEe-v1c16 сағат бұрын
It's a smaller scale, but try Team Yankee as well. Right now, I am reading OPPLAN: Fulda as well. It's the same idea, but different take from Clancy's.
@gilraine122515 сағат бұрын
@@BenjEe-v1c harold coyle is a severly underrated author
@anathardayaldar3 сағат бұрын
I listend to the audiobook during my commutes a month ago.
@ldkellandshaw17 сағат бұрын
Not seen the video yet, but know it will be good. That chapter is one of the best in fiction. RIP Tom Clancy. Your military fiction was unparalleled.
@GutkowskiMarek15 сағат бұрын
The second guy in the tail can also control the remote controlled guns turrets. Tu-94/142 had at least 4 of those. Similar setup to what B-29 had.
@christopherchartier30175 сағат бұрын
Well the Tu-95’s origins can technically be traced back to the Tu-4… which was literally a B-29 with different engines and turrets
@mcelravys14 сағат бұрын
Larry Bond made a set of wargaming rules called Harpoon. Clancy and Bond wargamed the scenarios for the book. I met Bond at a Wargames convention in Kingston, Ont once. He’s one of those intel types that makes sure you know how much smarter he is than you are.
@stefans.22610 сағат бұрын
I loved the Harpoon series. H1 was bad, but they really nailed it starting with H2. H3+4 weren't that much of an improvement for the average gamer, but I think they had extensions for more professional (=defence) users. Today's state of the art (at least for civvies like us) is Command. It's crazy what they've implemented there.
@infinity964617 сағат бұрын
Blufor definitely felt that slow rate of fire with those arm launchers, shows how much more efficient the VLS upgrades were, I bet they would've intercepted at least 75-90% of those salvos, but with an onslaught like that, survival would be very difficult
@yourfriend805214 сағат бұрын
It’s a misconception that VLS completely solved the slow rate of fire issue. You still have a maximum guidance limit, there’s only so many radar mounts and channels you can use to guide missiles, even with early aegis systems. While you may have the capability to launch all of your missiles in under a minute, you could only accurately guide up to (for example) ten of them, though often times the number was lower than that.
@Fatallydisorganized12 сағат бұрын
@@yourfriend8052SM-2 solved that problem, it only requires a full FCR channel in terminal.
@gruntopolouski591915 сағат бұрын
So cool to see something I’ve suggested - not knowing y’all had done it nor that you ever saw my request.
@grimreapers14 сағат бұрын
Pleasure
@san499316 сағат бұрын
America can absolutely handle aerial refueling operations for 80 bombers. You would be shocked, but it’s more likely Bombers would take off with a lower fuel load when fully armed and then topped off immediately after take off and later refueled closer to the objective with enough gas to make it home after having spent all munitions. It really depends on the take off weight of the bomber including payload. America perfected aerial refueling in the days of the Strategic Air Command keeping B52s in the air as a deterrent. Aerial refueling capabilities of Russia is likely not capable of supporting such an operation.
@tomsoki573812 сағат бұрын
80 bombers being refueled 2+ times in the middle of an ocean WHILE WW3 is going on around them which also needs LOTS of logistics. Are you joking? Not possible.
@san499312 сағат бұрын
@ absolutely possible… it’s called an AR Track, and if there was a need they would find a way to make it happen much like how everything becomes possible in war.
@san499312 сағат бұрын
@ my earliest Tanker I worked on was built in 1957 and was designed specifically to refuel Bombers. The Logistics of AirPower is only possible with tanker gas, and… there were many more tanker aircraft built than bombers. In reality there are not so many bombers in service compared to WWII, but almost all the tankers were still in service well over 60 years. The fleet was built to support bombers and believe it or not we’re not expected to survive getting bombers to their target which is why there were so many of them built. Aerial refueling is actually more about getting cargo and fighters to the action since the end of the Cold War, but every bomber is built to be refueling in flight and would have a multi tanker escort to extend their range.
@dogekoko986512 сағат бұрын
@@san4993 do you understand how much logistics it would take for this all other operations are off the table. what airbase could even pull this off in ANY theatre
@san499311 сағат бұрын
@@dogekoko9865 yes sir… it was my job
@craigjewkes13 сағат бұрын
Love this series of re-runs of Tom Clancy's novel. I know the book inside out. Blinders weren't used in this attack, they didn't have the legs to make the journey. As the guy who set up this session Badgers sent Kelts in first. The Bears ran without radar and used the Hawk eyes to locate the Carrier Battle Group. Keep up the great content Cap
@SolNacht9 сағат бұрын
I loved the Harpoon board game, definitely took a while but hugely detailed compared to most of the games at the time. It was interesting as the updates came out, especially after the gulf war and having a much better idea of how the systems worked.
@stefans.22610 сағат бұрын
You know that you can merge groups, right? You can drag the groups together in your group list on the left. Much easier to handle, and time on target is grouped more closely, too. Also, 48 Backfires in a line abreast is a sight to behold 😎
@andyf42929 сағат бұрын
thats how i use em!
@Blueorange2214 сағат бұрын
great battle nice work. i love these
@Hail_Full_of_Grace17 сағат бұрын
that was some good boom boom , thanks guys
@preude19 сағат бұрын
This reminds me so much of the simulator game Harpoon for DOS that I played a lot in the late '80.
@strambino110 сағат бұрын
It would be interesting to see the blue side play while utilizing the F-14.
@jovianr949817 сағат бұрын
As usual, a very good job guys :)
@Orieni15 сағат бұрын
The unlisted collaborator was Larry Bond.
@Davros-vi4qg14 сағат бұрын
I got there eventually
@Orieni14 сағат бұрын
@ indeed. He eventually wrote his own technothrillers but not so much naval action. Though perhaps the Franco-Euro alliance vs the US and UK might interest. A non-Soviet attack on a CVBG.
@SteveConrad-l9j13 сағат бұрын
Bond wrote a great scenario with south Africa having a nuke great book can't recall title
@Orieni13 сағат бұрын
@ Vortex. I quite liked how he portrayed the differences between the South African, Cuban and US methods of war. Though the final thoughts of the enemy general were pretty irrational. Cauldron is the one I was trying to think of. An attempt at a post-Soviet thriller.
@NASWOG10 сағат бұрын
The single “Papa” was featured. Absolutely insane speed, only to be sunk by a seahawk lol
@brian_sipe8 сағат бұрын
Hey, you know what? I am doing very well, thanks for the well wishes, SuperCap.
@jamison8849 сағат бұрын
As you noted, I'm glad we never had to find out in the real world. This video had me thinking about the Cold War and some similarities to the situation we see today between the US and China. The Cold War represented the most recent period of time where two military powers had a level of parity, where one side could essentially wipe out the other side in huge numbers based on the scenario (just like this book-based war game). The US/NATO had various technologies that weren't advanced enough yet (early Aegis and prior to the mass deployment of VLS). This is, after all, why Sea Power is set in this time period. Meanwhile, the Soviet's still had some "time left on the clock," as they were maintaining a huge military with an adequate number of weapons that were still effective against the aforementioned level of US/NATO technology. But they didn't have the economic strength to support the peak of their military strength, and NATO essentially waited them out. The Soviet collapse represented the clock counting down and hitting 0:00. Since then, the US & NATO have gained the technological advantage while leveraging their strong economic health to properly maintain defensive readiness and their military equipment. We've seen where Russian equipment and technology are at today, and as you'd expect, the lack of economic resources has resulted in a generally weak air force and navy, unable to go up against the NATO numbers and tech. They will always be willing to sacrifice their actual population (sadly), but even on the ground, their general level of technology is a guy with an AK variant, no/poor-quality body armor, a minority percentage with even an optic on their rifle, and armored assets that have severe weaknesses and no tech advantage (such as modern infrared, digital magnification, and active protection systems). A recent US poll has 83% of active-duty military members and their families and 67% of the general public anticipating a major war beginning in the next 3 to 5 years. This is the result of both Russia showing aggression in Ukraine and China's significant moves in Asia. However, I believe that poll is much more indicative of the threat from China. It appears China and the US (and perhaps NATO by proxy) are entering a new Cold War. I believe, when we look back at history sometime in the future, we will probably assess that the Cold War with China had already started many years ago with their aggressive military build-up and development (plus military espionage), while the US was drawing down from the Middle East conflicts and looking to upgrade/replace many of its most significant weapons systems with a re-focus on near-peer threats. The USMC even pursued Force Design 2030 in response to this new situation. The difference between the Soviet Cold War and the Chinese Cold War is, first, there's essentially an inevitable hot spot per Taiwan, and second, China has a much more significant economy to support its military compared to the Soviets. In both cases, an oligarchy with a dictator in charge provides the Soviets/Chinese a certain advantage over the US to help them make up for disadvantages in other areas, as they essentially have access to nearly free labor and have virtually complete subjugation of their populations, resulting in the power to use absurd percentages of their GDP on military spending. Many think the US spends an insane amount on their defense budget, but when normalized as a percentage of GDP, it really isn't that wild (3.4%). China is reported as spending only 1.8% of GDP, but there's an important factor there; China isn't famous for its transparency. Also, this amount of spending still doesn't factor in the cheaper cost of labor and the Chinese government's ability to acquire raw materials at cost versus the US economy, where defense contractors would be paying for all resources at cost plus margin and in turn, whatever they manufactured with that steel, is also sold to the US government with a further margin (for example, manufacturing an aircraft and the US DoD purchasing it is much more expensive in the US vs. the Chinese economy, where the aircraft manufacturer is partially or fully owned by the government). I believe the one advantage the US still maintains in this second Cold War remains an economic advantage. I don't mean simply based on the size of the respective economies or some blind faith in the US over China due to bias. If you look at both countries and their relative amounts of critical natural resources, their trade requirements to sustain a lengthy war, and potential allies, the US has the advantage in each area. For example, the US is currently the #1 producer of oil/natural gas, has an abundance of most resources within its borders, and has strong alliances in both NATO and Asia (Japan, South Korea, Australia, and the Philippines). If a hot war with China began tomorrow, trade within the Asian region and Chinese ports would shut down essentially in an instant, and China simply doesn't have the reserves of several critical resources required to sustain a war, with the most significant being oil (40% of daily usage is imported via the Malacca Strait; there are alternative trade sources, particularly with Russia, but the US would also use economic sanctions) to outlast the US once you slow their trade. On top of that, trade within US ports wouldn't be impacted beyond direct trade from China, as China doesn't have the blue-water naval capabilities to swing such a conflict towards the US's side of the Pacific. Ultimately, I hope we're watching another simulation video in 20 years from now regarding a "what if" video on Taiwan, rather than a recreation video of the actual conflict.
@5Andysalive14 сағат бұрын
3:00 i heard S4-B (S-IVB) there. That would be SOME missile.
@dentonDixon18 сағат бұрын
LOVE YOUR STREAMS DEFO THE BEST ON Y/T!
@ka747 сағат бұрын
Keep up the good work GR. For the mission and as stated in some of the comments below, it would be shocking that : 1. Russia (USSR) would be able to get that many bombers to station without significant forewarning from NATO and intel sources such that the task force didnt have a meaningful intercept airwing waiting in ambush and on standby. 2. The non fault rate for 60's and 70's tech on both sides would be insignificant... I would have to guess that there is a meaningful fault rate in some of the munitions and planes - just see the Libya attack in the 80's and the simple mechanical failures that whittled down the air wings. Clancy's books were and remain well researched and good novels, and it is a trip down memory lane to see the recreation of this so thank you!
@scottdelorenzi351316 сағат бұрын
How can this be realistic if there's no F-14 CAP, especially with hostilities imminent???
@TheNotoriousENG15 сағат бұрын
The decoy “ruse” from the book was omitted, which depleted the phoenix missile intercepts, so theoretically it’s a close simulation of the scenario in the book.
@grimreapers14 сағат бұрын
I thought that at first, but to be fair to Fly, the F-14s were essentially not used in the book either as they were duped by a decoy force.
@FleetDefenderRA55 сағат бұрын
@@grimreapers Truly! But I would still like to see that problem grappled... although you probably would have need to do so at a smaller scale.
@DaFinkingOrk17 сағат бұрын
Well the RN went for a more traditional rotating radar for the 45, which are much newer than the Burkes - so maybe there is something to be said about them being better than phased arrays for ships.
@Fatallydisorganized12 сағат бұрын
It’s not capable of guidance, it’s only for early warning, which is why it is in a lower frequency band to improve its range but lowers resolution of the track. Aegis and by extension SPY has the benefit of being completely unidirectional, it could care less about multiple attack directions. And actually multiple attack vectors makes Aegis’s job easier as it can use more of the radars on the ship. If you look at the TYPE 45 it only has a couple FCRs capable of providing guidance to missiles making it very vulnerable to a Soviet style attack.
@Luke-Boombke17 сағат бұрын
Man I would love to have this game, I wonder if it will ever go on sale
@elemar517 сағат бұрын
I got it free by searching the net. It's probably cut down or something but it's a taster.
@DevilsAvacado6915 сағат бұрын
50:00 that's the truth I think. I was told by the captains steward who was on board one of the two ships. He talked about the Ghallahad (sp?) And I believe the Coventry. One of the captains ordered the helm to close the gap to the other friendly ship and the CWIS couldn't fire because of the restrictions from being to close to the other ship. The captain was devastated after being pulled out of the water and put in a hot bath. He knew his mistake and was in shock. The other captain who's ship survived was deeply upset at him for doing this maneuver which resulted in a loss for the navy and a big knock to morale. I believe he intended to get his ship between his friends and the incoming attack but this caused the above to happen. Had it worked his actions would have been considered heroic. Life dealt us a blow that time instead. There is more minute details like the actual feeling in the air and how they interacted while one was in a hot bath and the other was checking on him I remember the steward saying names like Bill or Bob to do with the captains or stewards and a cold stoic interaction over one of a more concerned friend because the action caused a loss of lives it was explained like this to me. After the captain of i believe the Ghallahad was rescued from the waters, and was warming up in a hot bath with his steward just outside but in ear shot. Cpt 1 "How is he?" Steward "in Shock but ok he wants to speak with you" Cpt 1 "Not now let me know if there's any updates make sure he gets some scran" Cpt 2 "Bill I'm so sorry!" Cpt 1 walks away. Thats about it. I haven't embellished this is the closest to memory it was described by the man that was there, I was working with him in G4s. Of course these types of jobs are crammed full of walter Mitties but something told me this was potentially a real one. For historic reasons (even super shakey ones) i want you to know. I hope I got the ship names the correct way around but if its obviously wrong just switch them around the point is the attitude of the ships captains after this happened and to support what was said about the incident on this video. We live and learn, thanks again GR! (If any researcher wants to zero in on this guy he was working at Rosyth Dockyard in G4s in or around the years of 2014. A researcher may get permission to have access to names and backgrounds of employees at the time and be able to find and interview him.
@andreamanninfiaschi16794 минут бұрын
Now THIS is a naval battle!
@kroskilly17 сағат бұрын
Love these vids based on Clancy’s books. Is there anyway you can do The Frisbees of Dreamland or a variation of please?
@FlybywireTheGerman17 сағат бұрын
its a good idea i will put that in to a mission in the Future
@haroldhughes126116 сағат бұрын
Americans should arrest Fly for treason!
@FlybywireTheGerman2 минут бұрын
@@haroldhughes1261 I love to be on the Dark Side😂
@t.r.449610 сағат бұрын
If this happen IRL, the US still has 6 more Aircraft Surface Fleets to contend with.
@tetraxis30119 сағат бұрын
Yes but they are deployed else where and this is still a massive loss of life.
@jeremyaudet38109 сағат бұрын
I'd like to see you guys do a video of the temper temper incident that the Wisconsin is famous for in the most GR way possible 🤣
@hollyzuehlke850517 сағат бұрын
Thank you for the video nice take care
@FleetDefenderRA55 сағат бұрын
Good simulation. Would have liked to see a great need for a search pattern... but I know that takes time. Thank you for a good simulation.
@williamfarley62808 сағат бұрын
All US carriers, including the light carriers used by the Marine Corps, have their own CWIS their own counter missile batteries. This made no sense why they weren’t firing their own defensive weapons.
@Ken_Koonz15 сағат бұрын
41:27 it's not about where tte missile is, it's about where it was.
@stevebarnett-f5o15 сағат бұрын
This should be a good one
@pacocinco10 сағат бұрын
I've faffed about in-game with dev mode a significant amount to see fuel efficiency and other statistics, every plane I tested had maximum fuel efficiency at their second-highest altitude.
@cesarespinozaspain17 сағат бұрын
Will there be a US Air force ferry flight of F-15's in the sim? Perhaps a Major "Buns" Nakamura cameo?
@GreyWraith10016 сағат бұрын
I remember, that Clancy in his last novel predicted war between Russia and Ukraine. But he overwhelmed the power of Russia, because in his novel the US forced Russia to stop it's offensive, when theн captured Cherkasy. But I treat with great respect to his "Red Storm Rising". I mean, why he decided to neutralize US Navy carrier group by excellent aviation strike. In real life Russians are not dare enough to challenge US Navy, so they use their Tu-22M3 with H-22 in order to demolish Ukrainian residences and trade centers.
@andyf42929 сағат бұрын
in harpoon I always used Tu95s sneaking around to do a bad thing from weird angles
@Robert-pl1gd13 сағат бұрын
As much as I enjoy hearing your insights and experiences, this was 40 min of taking and 5 min of smackie-boom-boom.
@Pablo66816 сағат бұрын
I'm loving this game. I gotta say though that with bigger battles with more components, it gets on your nerves having to micro-manage to correct the AI doing stupid things. Still fun though.
@TheNotoriousENG15 сағат бұрын
Just the other day I had THREE aircraft fly into the land/sea while engaging defenseless, non-maneuvering targets. Three separate incidents. Takes a bit of fun out of it, to say the least.
@grimreapers14 сағат бұрын
Yeh the aerial AI drive me nuts. Ships not too bad.
@jasonverhagen525315 сағат бұрын
Awesome ❤
@mfreed40k17 сағат бұрын
Fly not talking and butchering English is the best gift ever.
@gilraine122515 сағат бұрын
id be willing its not his native language
@FlybywireTheGermanМинут бұрын
@@gilraine1225 that doesn’t matter for some ignorant people around , I try my best 😕
@davidhines759214 сағат бұрын
so... when are we going to get the modern version with the ballistic missiles as mentioned about 30 minutes?
@michaelgeary272713 сағат бұрын
Seapower doesn't struggle with that many weapons, its the ships that are limited to only a hand full of weapon engagement channels on their guidance radars. Have a look at one of the cheat mods on the steam workshop and you will soon see that limitation. 1 cheat CG vs 10 CG VLS 2003 variant, cheat CG is able to intercept it all because of the absurd amount of weapon guidance channels and missiles available. From memory, I belive its around 1000 engagement tracks and 1600 missiles available.😅
@MonarchNF14 сағат бұрын
I know this is supposed to be an impossible mission, but how would NATO retake Iceland and/or strike the Kola airbases in the mid-80s? Sturgeon and Los Angeles class boats could only launch 4 TLAMs at a time toward airfield hangers. Even using extended routes on the first volley, you can only get 12 missiles per boat in a ToT strike. B52s out of Thuul would have the range but a significant chance of interception.
@lohrtom4 сағат бұрын
He is correct. SPS-48 radar best radar.
@stenus_337111 сағат бұрын
Hey cap, can please you do for one of these live battles a hunt for the Red October situation from either the crew of the Red October (plus maybe the Americans) or from the Soviets hunting them? Also love the content.
@KepeskUrthalre-h6r15 сағат бұрын
There are so many kinds of missiles these days that if you try to invent a new one you will likely come up with something that already exists, so its best to just take 3 concepts and combine them. I usually give things a RPG for a tip, but that would be next to useless in today's low armor world.
@turktownblue7010 сағат бұрын
The soviet titanium hull were single skin as it was so expensive
@Doodelz025 сағат бұрын
Biggest boom boom eva~!! Yes, I'm 66 yrs old. Turns out I'm also 4 yrs old, depending on content! 😊
@Doubledeepfried13 сағат бұрын
Did fly had a small schnapps before the start ?
@FlybywireTheGerman4 минут бұрын
A Bier but that’s ugul when I’m coming form work😂
@ColdWarriorGamer6 минут бұрын
Did the Tico not shoot?
@JvianneyTankumi071716 сағат бұрын
Big boom booms 🤩
@ohiobrian89932 сағат бұрын
Good, but once again, you left out the A6 EW aircraft that would jam the incoming missiles. This capability is a major component of fleet defense, and Clancy left it out of his book for this attack on purpose. 😮 Today, the job is performed by the f18g growler. The EW capability of the US carriers set it apart from all other nations' carriers, which do not come close.
@Jack_Over900013 сағат бұрын
Thanks Fly, great mission!
@Wolfe351Сағат бұрын
which ships survived??
@Dingin414 сағат бұрын
Why not have some F14s in the air?
@drupiROM9 сағат бұрын
What CPU and what GPU did you run this mission on ?
@GreyWraith10016 сағат бұрын
And NATO should remember the lesson from "Red Storm": Iceland is the key to Northern Atlantic and hence to US sea logistic to Europe.
@TFY-v8l15 сағат бұрын
Yeah in the 80s... not so much nowadays
@garydterhune83923 сағат бұрын
What hardware are you using for the PC’s?
@andyf42929 сағат бұрын
make the planes in line abreast formation,, seems to work better
@nolefan8717 сағат бұрын
Looks like you have a bot problem in the comments, cap.
@elemar517 сағат бұрын
Any idea what the purpose of these bots is?
@Jack_Over900016 сағат бұрын
@elemar5 Sexbots and a scambot.
@grimreapers14 сағат бұрын
Here's the stupid thing - YT deletes well over 50% of the real human comments on GR vids. But doesn't delete the bot comments, in fact it hides the bot comments from me so I can;t delete them. I'm sick to death with it all.
@RogueKnight4234 сағат бұрын
Tom Clancy was a jerk...he attacked authors that he felt were a threat to him...
@Thomash613a16 сағат бұрын
Love you guys, but 30 minutes of staring at screen, listening to rambling, before any action....
@scottdelorenzi351316 сағат бұрын
2x playback speed is your friend
@jesuschrist716916 сағат бұрын
More Power 🔥
@theiracible99937 сағат бұрын
No more Fly during these live battles. His incessant yammering is so grating. Love the live battles. Hate fly constantly talking. And then, during the climax when 85% of the video is through and we're watching the beginning of the defense... "Yeah so in all of my testing, the missiles get through."