Removing Antihalation Layer Before Shooting

[@sirdolphinbubbler1505]

babe wake up attic darkroom posted

[@mcflirty]

Me to my mental illnesses

[@residual]

i honestly love the fucked up holga images. the waviness turned out really well for them, combined with the the slight halation and botched processing it does really have a dreamlike quality i think

[@atticdarkroom]

That's one way to see it. I appreciate the positive spin.

[@ranian02]

I love the waviness too! It's really surreal. Now I need to figure out a way to mess my film up on purpose.

[@jacobchappell2197]

i thought i was alone when i thought some of the holga images were cool, not so much in a dreamlike sense but more like a bad nightmare

[@speakertomeat]

@@atticdarkroom oh, it's sincere, there's some of us who like this kind of thing. True clean well done images are fun and important, but this kind of stockpiled screwups is something I've experienced from my "punkish" developing tendencies, and something I like from film since trying to reproduce glitches on digital feels off most of the time for me. I loved the results from that poor roll of film on the Holga, it's beautiful.

[@xander1052]

@@atticdarkroom it also adds to the holga shittiness, with a holga you go full shit or go home

[@psajgal]

5:24 are probably my favourite sets of trichromes you ever did. They look awesome! That holga film is just pure mess, but somehow that shot at 8:02 still looks alright

[@atticdarkroom]

I'm glad those trichromes turned out. I was kinda disappointed to roll up and seeing that sunset and only have B&W film. So I'm just happy it came out.

[@stratocactus]

5:54 Those bridge trichromed shots are out of this world. Amazing results !

[@primepiplup]

Holy hell I love those pictures near the bridge, that's gorgeous.

[@atticdarkroom]

Me too. I'm glad those turned out.

[@PinebrookPictures]

The excitement I get when I see you've uploaded is unhealthy.

[@izzieb]

What amazes me about Attic Darkroom is that he manages to get out and takes photos, despite only being a pair of disembodied hands.

[@gonzounderscore]

✨movie magic✨

[@teotirn1]

He is the equivalent Dankpods but for photo instead of audio

[@adnamamedia]

those Holga pics with the light leaks, scratches, and waves are actually kind of amazing. pure vibes

[@Logic44]

If I saw a channel like this when I was maybe 14 I'd be a lot more inclined to give film photography a shot again, now I'm 19 and weird shit like this makes me live for the magic of film and home development. It's so fucking rewarding to show someone a scan and know you put your own hard work into it...

[@ziorxkomtuper]

Something that I thought about is making the plane behind the Film in the camera really reflective, like putting aluminum foil on it. Maybe the light would bounce back onto the film and make the anti halation less effective by over powering it? This will obviously only work with 35mm or 220 film. Loved the tri chromes of the bridge!!

[@atticdarkroom]

🤔

[@jcbacardi]

I wonder if u build a mirror like backing plane u would get a red scale on overlay

[@ziorxkomtuper]

@@jcbacardi haha a mirror would be next level. I wonder if you would have to under expose your film because of the "extra" recycled light

[@redmanion2193]

I'd be interested to see how the angle of incident/reflected light would affect which areas of the film receive the bounced back light

[@ziorxkomtuper]

@@redmanion2193 I think it does not make nuch of a difference because the reflective surface is very close to the film. I've just taped some aluminium foil to the back plane of my ae1 so sooner or later I will know if this works.

[@michabutkiewicz702]

I just want to sincerely thank you for all of your wild experiments. I don't see myself ever trying to attempt anything close to this but I find every episode both entertaining and educating.

[@marianoguy]

if you want this look with color, this is what cinestill sells: kodak motion picture film that they either strip of the antihalation layer or that kodak sells to them without it. if you are washing it out yourself, I would recommend to dry it by hanging it in a darkroom

[@chrn5207]

I'd love to see you mess with some rolls of colorplus! You're only supposed to be able to push it to 400, so there's really not a lot of people that have tried going beyond that. Very curious what the actual usable limit would be.

[@av.punk.801]

attempted 800 once, verry blue/green scans, maybe i undershot my dev time but I got the idea from someone trying to get cloud shots trying this with similar results, though, so maybe that's just how it acts

[@toasty2324]

Our favourite film torturer is back at it again.

[@wolfgartom]

Dude. Some of the shots in this are rad as hell. I reeeeeally hope you do a follow up for this. I recently ordered some Kodak 2383, which doesn’t have a halation layer (I think). It’s super freaking slow, but I’m hoping I can get some cool bloomy results with it. Again, great video! Always look forward to your stuff!

[@KNURKonesur]

Clicked the video cause I read the thumbnail text as "removing ANNIHILATION layer" and got intrigued :D

[@campfire2953]

with how simple the premise of your videos are, theyre always a barrel of laughs. something about the dryness and plain-ness of the narration hits me just right sometimes.

[@forindooruseonly646]

That's next level Holga-ing. You're gonna start a trend amongst all the lomo hipsters.

[@NorbiWhitney]

6:02 that bloomy bridge shot is incredible. Thanks for taking us on the journey.

[@wanderbolt9498]

Your content on trichroming has tempted me to try doing it in my nishika n8000. My idea was to put color filter gels over three of the lenses so i could take all 3 images for the trichrome simultaneously and also have a B/w version too... only issue i can think of is getting enough light in the thing, and dealing with parallax caused by the slightly offset lenses

[@don8635]

oh shit bro these are some of the most real looking trichromes you made

[@SinaFarhat]

The expression "I do this so that you don't have to" comes to my mind! I have some rolls of polypan f 50 in 35mm in my freezer, a film with no antihalation layer so I get to play with the halos in the highlights.

[@heatonize]

i did this with vision 3 500T on 35mm and it gave me some pretty unique results. The hardest part about this is drying the film in the dark and making sure all of the anti-halation is washed off

[@tasost2161]

Hello there, I would like to ask you, did you wash the film before shooting it? And how did you wash it? If wipe it with fingers or fiber clothe could it damage the emulsion? Thank you

[@munkieluva]

That wavy distortion is pretty cool

[@gadler8482]

Absolutely loved the bridge pic. The trichrome and the halations looks so good

[@bumi5178]

Fomapan 400 in 135 naturally has a fair bit of halation, so the effect might be even more pronounced with that stock. From what I recall, the 120 version has a stronger halation resistance

[@jarno674]

Ooh now im gonna try this i have a bit of bulk left over

[@ivostunga]

Yay, a follow-up! And I made the same mistake by applying rinse aid - result was full of uneven development. The next time around I just washed for longer and results were better, but still - spots and weird darker flow patterns here and there - probably where the remaining particles of said antihalation layer got accumulated the most. This gave me a cancerous idea the next time around - to squeegee it. Squeegee is a big no-no for slide shooters working with Permanganate bleach, but after simple water baths any film should be fine to handle squeegee - this could make the washed shots spotless, perfect. Will try when the sun returns.

[@elk3407]

The ones from the holga actually look incredible. Objectively not good, but they hit the exact vibe of album covers from 90's Midwest Emo and late 2010's emo revival, just missing band and album name written either in cursive or comic sans

[@TheParker567]

I get so amped when I see your post notifications

[@mrca2004]

I am getting ready to try a softar filter that adds glow and also to use my mamiya rb67 150 mm soft focus lens with the largest disc that creates a glow around the highlights. Washing seems like a real PIA with all sorts of logistical problems.

[@minimuffinsxxx3486]

The Holga pictures kinda look interesting, the wavy distortion is intriguing.

[@MrSaraveno]

I've watched all your videos already, I need more 😁

[@arachnenet2244]

Yep. Screw it I'm trying this! I might see if I can dig up some silica gel packets to dump into the tank after it's been drying for a few hours. Maybe that way It absorbs the last bit of moisture. The trichrome of that bridge is just mad! And I think this can get really close to HIE when you give it another go! Well done!

[@dotz0cat]

I don't care what you say, that c41 stuff had a vibe to it.

[@PhotographerRoman]

I think you should consider trying motion picture film like Kodak Vision3 250d or 500t. There are a lot of things that can be done with it. Ecn-2 vs C-41 development. Removing remjet before shooting. Pushing/pulling. It could be bought in meters so there are a lot of flexibility with bulk loading. Because of price increase for color 135 film, bulk loaded motion picture film is a viable option. And thank you for the content! It is really good.

[@AndrewJacksonSE]

Isn’t that just Cinestill?

[@PhotographerRoman]

@@AndrewJacksonSE we can't say for sure without an experiment 🧐

[@Francois_L_7933]

Easier way to get glowing highlights: black pro mist filter 😁 And if you don't want to buy one, think UV filter and black spray paint. A slight mist from far away is enough. Easily removed with nail polish remover in case of a mistake.

[@danielhanslik4112]

Or white mist.

[@дигл_лайв]

Just found your channel and binged all the videos in like 2 days. I was never interested in film photography and I don't think I will do it myself, but it's very captivating to watch whatever you're doing with it. You have a nice tone to your voice, and you're funny. I just like your narration even if I don't understand what you're talking about :D When I first saw you trichrome in one of your videos, I was like "Wow, that looks amazing, I would like him to do it more". And then it turns out you trichrome everything, and that made me very happy :D Even though your channel is very niche, I think it deserves more attention. You make videos entertaining even for people who know nothing about the subject, without dragging the pace down. I'm subscribing and gonna watch everything new. Hope you get tons of views ASAP!

[@atticdarkroom]

Thank you, it's cool to hear that someone who isn't into film photography is enjoying the videos. I really appreciate it!

[@primulavulgaris]

omg I've been looking up how to do this all this week and this drops 🖤 legend

[@mcb187]

Hey! I have some experience rolling my own 120 and 220 film. Too tight is not a problem with clean film and paper. I haven’t seen any scratches on my film, and as far as I know, neither have my customers. But, number 1 thing when rolling film: KEEP DUST AWAY! NO DUST!

[@baristabro2236]

Gotta love Oregon weather 🙃

[@elyas_the_unwise]

just try washi F, might be close to what you are looking for

[@pnwsnewton]

I love how you are able to say "this was a complete failure and here's why"

[@EliasH-video]

Dr. Filmenstein has blessed us once more

[@tazmon122]

that screwed up roll of color were my favorite shots. photoshop wizards take days to recreate those effects digitally that you half-assed analog. it's an aesthetically cool approach that captures the REAL identity of nostalgia. a high level of emotional response from a memory of a more innocent time, that has with age and abuse been distorted and twisted to reflect something closer to dream than memory. sure you can list technical problems like bullets, send those final images to the firing squad...but the audience doesn't see the process. the audience doesn't see the list of issues...those with a keen eye can try and recreate that list on their own...but the gestalt of those problems ends up with capturing true nostalgia. personally i get sad in a happy way. i have no association with the compositions, so as an audience to discover the wistful sadness of nostalgia through these alien objects is a good feeling. it's not that i like to be sad, it's that i like to feel different feelings. it's cathartic. at least that's why i like the screwed up color roll the most.

[@TheFinnGamer]

The wavy car and the stairs are quite cool though

[@gianmarcomaioli]

those hola shots could easily be album covers from the 90s

[@jaczech_2876]

bro trichromes everything, nice video btw

[@andrewbroekhuijsen6770]

Dude 2:15, 5:25, 5:37 are all sick shots. IMO it totally worked. Just gotta dial in on the best way to get the film good and dry and then spooled up tightly. If I ever try this I'll start with 35mm, that seems way easier haha. Remind me how you got the colors for 2:15? I've never shot Rollei Superpan, but it looks like it's sensitive up to 750nm so kind of infrared. Did you just shoot all three trichrome shots through an IR filter? Or just replace red with IR?

[@atticdarkroom]

Yeah Superpan has extended range. Those were shot with an R72 filter. Although if you shoot Superpan in bright light and use a red filter it'll capture a decent amount of IR as well.

[@patrickrostker6693]

I love trichrome! Any way to combine that and halation is so good! Love that shot of the old mill place and the rainbow sherbert sky, yummy stuff! Nice little experiment my dude!

[@bazdesh]

the question i now have is if there would be a noticeable difference between using a halation filter (like a promist or whatever) or removing the antihalation layer on black and white film. id guess on color film (like cinestill) the halation hits a certain color layer more and thats why its mostly orange/red, but on black and white...

[@atticdarkroom]

Diffusion filters tend soften everything whereas no antihalation layer only blooms in the highlights.

[@darrengomes2203]

I always wondered about removing the anti halation layer on Rollei Infrared. I might try it in my Lab Box, but drying it in the Lab Box could be a problem.

[@SuperTantePeter]

I kinda dig those messy Holga shots. They are very lomo-artsy if you know what I mean

[@randomstuff-cu4of]

I mean you could try combining this halation removal with the fog filter and scuffed up lens from the last recreation and on top of that overexpose the film a bit, might be able to finally get the HIE look like that lol

[@lolomg42]

8:03 it’s called vibes

[@jkerman5113]

Holga shots are out of this fucking world.

[@dsikid3]

What if... you made the pressure plate on the camera extremely reflective with reflective tape or something, and have it reflect back on to the film? I can imagine most anti-halation layers might not be able to cope

[@KristsOzols]

Thanks

[@atticdarkroom]

Thank you so much. I really appreciate it!

[@AlpcanAras]

This is Cinestill with some extra steps

[@danielegerussi7453]

Love the longer videos

[@killpop8255]

Think i did similar and tried to back the film with aluminium foil with the idea it might enhance any light energy that makes it through, and maybe bounce it back.

[@bakeee]

how do i replicate the wavy look? its gonna be the next trend in film photography. love it

[@raptor1jec]

Holy crap, I can't believe we're cold, wet, rainy PDX neighbors. I feel so lucky 😆.

[@ahaco8734]

Fomapan 400 has poor antihalation layer, so halation around point of light are visible

[@NiGauBech7]

This makes me want to remove the remjet from some Kodak vision 3 and see how good it will be

[@vonantero9458]

You gotta try to boost the halation with something reflective behind the film. With 35mm a piece of foil tape on the pressure plate could do it. For 120 you'd need to cover or replace the whole backing paper.

[@serhiirudenko6183]

Just discovered your channel- awesome stuff here! Especially trichrom videos. I'd never do that- takes too much effort, lol. So far I shoot only b&w and develop it in a stand development process. So far results are great. And btw how do you scan your films? I use an old nikon d5100 with a manual lens with some macro attachment, and put film in a 3Dprinted holder from thingiverse.

[@atticdarkroom]

I used an Epson V850.

[@dylan.thissen]

I recently found three rolls of Kodak HIE and one roll of EIR (aero chrome). The HIE expired in 1992 do you think I’ll be able to get anything? The EIR expired in 2002, would you have any tips or suggestions for how I might go about shooting either of them? Thank you I love your videos ❤

[@atticdarkroom]

It all depends on how they were stored over the years. If the three HIE rolls were from the same batch and stored similarly, I'd use one roll to test the exposures. HIE doesn't have a box speed, but ISO 400 is a good place to start. Bracket a few exposures starting at 400. And then cut the film, develop it, and reassess. Remember that HIE needs to be loaded and unloaded in complete darkness. If you cut the film you can probably get several good test strips out of the roll. With the EIR I'd do something similar, but sparingly since you only have one roll. Also use a yellow filter.

[@dylan.thissen]

@@atticdarkroom I’m pretty sure the HIE was badly stored so I think it will be fogged tbh. Do you recommend the yellow filter for EIR? Or was that a general statement for both stocks? Is there a reason yellow helps? I found a simple infrared filter and was going to use that.

[@BarbasMinecraft]

Removing the anti halation layer is the same thing of removing the remjet of the ecn2 film?

[@atticdarkroom]

Conceptionally yes, practically they're a bit different. The antihalation layer on Superpan is water soluble so a water bath is enough to remove it. Whereas remjet can be softened with water and then physically removed with your fingers otherwise it needs a chemical bath to remove.

[@MattCicciarelli]

Love this! So for 35mm, would you say, spool it, was it with water until it’s clear, and then use the fan to dry? I didn’t quite grasp if you thought the photoflo helped or not. Thanks for your help and amazing work! Such a great project.

[@atticdarkroom]

Photoflo will leave that splotching on the film. If you want clean looking film avoid using Photoflo as a pre-rinse. You probably don't need a fan if you live somewhere warm, or are willing to let it air dry for a week or so. I'm impatient so I used a fan.

[@MattCicciarelli]

@@atticdarkroom gotcha. Thank you so much for the tips

[@hattree]

I don't think you like Cinestill, but since it's ECN with the remjet removed so it usually halates.

[@qhgabriel1]

Would we be able to follow these steps to recreate Cinestill look with the Vision T stock?

[@LPSminecrafter]

holy hell that color roll is the epitome of Murphy's law. my god literally every step of the way went wrong!

[@kbmats]

That whole 4th test on color was a bruh moment + Holga curse lol

[@atticdarkroom]

At first it was disappointing, then as it got worse it felt cursed, but by the end it was hilarious. I was kinda disappointed I didn't screw it up further.

[@Mayankgupta0809]

what a series of unfortunate events the 4th test

[@horatiueduard]

Did you ever try Foma Retropan 320? I think that has glow around highlights and lower contrast.

[@TrueCA7777]

is it possible to stack two rolls of Film on top of each other and expose them at the same time? For example an ortho film in front of a infrared film.

[@givemesucc214]

More videos love it

[@lazarj]

Test 4 is hilarious. Just the number of things that went wrong 😂

[@JeffDvrx]

dude... reeling wet film with plastic reels... we all knew you were masochistic, but that's a new standard

[@SamCyanide]

I wish we could still have IR film

[@jakewestbrook3214]

thank you for trying the thing I've been thinking about for way too long but never bothered to try. I've heard that soaking the film in an alcohol solution is another way to avoid water spots. ALSO... I'd reccomend trying Shanghai gp3- because that film has some seriously thick dye on it (the pre wash is INTENSE).

[@atticdarkroom]

I've shot GP3 once before and all I remember is the backing paper having an awful chemical smell. I'll have find some more because now I'm intrigued.

[@legomasterj]

Could u do a video where u ignore like every instruction for developing and so something wacky like develop for half time, then 30 seconds of fix and then throw developer back in for the other half or something like that

[@devdeev3675]

Awesome video

[@av.punk.801]

why did I read that as "annihilation layer"?

[@oggepogge2038]

What scanner do you use?

[@atticdarkroom]

Epson V850

[@johnkaplun9619]

Awesome video. Kinda random but how do you dispose of your c41 chemicals? Don't really wanna dump mine down the drain but I have like 3 gallons at this point and I can't find anything online local to me.

[@atticdarkroom]

For developer and stab it depends on local regulations, depending on where you are it might be ok to pour down the sink (for sewer, not sure about septic). For bleach/fix I take that to a local lab and they dispose of it for me.

[@johnkaplun9619]

@@atticdarkroom thanks!

[@Aar69]

in this household, we're not anti-anti-halation layer. We are proudly pro-halation

[@MrRom92DAW]

I think you inadvertently just saved my ass from 120 scratches… I’ve been trying to experiment with 3D printed 122 film adaptors to use 120 film in a vintage (circa 1912) Kodak 3A. It *should* give me these rad 6x14 panoramic shots. The problem I’ve been having is that after shooting a roll, I open the camera to find the film spooled very loosely on the take up. Too loosely - I’ve destroyed at least 5 rolls in the process (I’ve since gotten smart and stopped wasting Ektar on these experiments) My next idea, which I haven’t tried yet, was to just open the back and quickly pull on the paper to tighten up the spool and prevent any light leaks at the edges. But I see now that’s a pretty bad idea and could scratch the film. What exactly might you recommend to correct this loose spooling?

[@andrewbroekhuijsen6770]

Just don't open the back until you're in total darkness (darkroom, closet at night, whatever). Then you can carefully wind it on tight without scratching.

[@MrRom92DAW]

@@andrewbroekhuijsen6770 it’s an idea, though I think ideally I’d find a way to remedy the loose spooling altogether so I can change rolls in the field and stuff like that. I haven’t heard of anyone else having similar issues with those 3D printed adaptors so I’m not sure if it’s just a “me” thing. I’m hoping to travel with the camera soon and I probably won’t have access to anything even remotely like a darkroom… at home, I manually load it with paper or sheet film in the dark, single shot. And the camera works GREAT for that!

[@andrewbroekhuijsen6770]

@@MrRom92DAW A dark bag would probably be the most direct solution. Though I agree with you if I was experiencing this issue, it would drive me crazy until I figured out how to get it to go onto the takeup spool properly in the first place.

[@uwew.4206]

Does using tape to hold two or more short lengths of film together effect the developer or other chemicals? I want to load a couple of test rolls (10 frames) each onto one Patterson reel instead of developing them individually.

[@atticdarkroom]

It might, depending on tape. I think most masking tape should be fine. Same goes with whatever tapes film manufacturers use to stick their film onto the spools and backing paper. That stuff goes through lab machines all the time and nobody ever complains about it messing with the chemistry. If you want to go all legit you can get some photographic splicing tape. That's the stuff labs use in their minilab machines.

[@uwew.4206]

@attic darkroom Thanks, I'll give masking tape a go. I enjoy your videos and hope you keep producing them.

[@thedingoplays1835]

It’s a good day

[@NiGauBech7]

Hey! I have a 3d printed light tight enclosure to dry it, if you are interested in it. I can send you the file

[@Leotheepic43]

Great video as always :?)

[@crazymanmars]

Smooth brain

[@turdledive927]

I kind of hate to admit that I like the wave in the holga, its weird.

[@krisdavies6873]

Don’t know what I’m watching but cool

[@gusatvoschiavon]

smooth brain gang

[@wandering_seconds9741]

AD: These Holds photos f***ing suck. Holga and Lomo users: 😯

[@footrotdog]

What a cluster fuck. It's so awesome! Thank you. You've made my day. :)

[@chrishendrickson1042]

Next the people need to see how to wash the anti-halation layer off off ECN-II film

[@besimai]

Did not know about this. Whoever...i don't think I'll be doing this soon 🤣