Repertoire: The BEST and WORST Sibelius Symphony Cycles

Having already put together an IDEAL Sibelius cycle, here is a survey of individual sets of the complete numbered symphonies--and a ton of them there are! Out of the more than two dozen boxes considered, I whittle the choice down to seven extraordinary versions (and as many lousy ones to avoid!)--but there's a lot more choice besides. Get ready: this is a long talk about some really great music.

[@dic081211]

I play in the Vänskä/Lahti recording! Was a nice experience. Provincial orchestra but very motivated!

[@ctfamily40]

Rozhdestvensky: all the charm and subtlety of the Finnish hinterland as viewed from the inside of a T-34 tank.

[@DavesClassicalGuide]

That about sums it up.

[@mattestabrook]

I listened to a couple dozen Sibelius cycles a few years back and took notes on all of them. My favorite note regards Rozhdestvensky's performance of Symphony No. 2: "It’s like listening to Tchaikovsky’s 4th as played by a Mariachi band."

[@colinwrubleski7627]

@@mattestabrook : Thank you for sharing that line, which is a true gem--- I have not read anything quite as funny in a long time... (Speaking of mariachi, though, your comment also strangely causes me to think of the scene towards the end of the perverse film "Mars Attacks", wherein a mariachi band plays the 'Star-Spangled-Banner' to celebrate the US surviving the attack of the villainous Martians. One of the few nice touches in a dismal film in which the trailer promoting it gave promise the movie was going to be hilarious, but sadly turned out to be an irredeemable mess.~)

[@aatim2308]

Can you imagine though that it was the only one complete cycle made by a Soviet conductor? So ordinary people only could afford him, couple of Mravinsky's recordings (3 and 7) and probably Sanderling. Not a wide choice.

[@bradleykay]

@@mattestabrook this makes me want to listen to it immediately.

[@mattestabrook]

This is no slog, this is a delight--thanks very much! Here are the ones I return to most frequently--I'm surprised that there is so much overlap with you, Dave! 1. Berglund/Bournemouth--This was put on sale just after Berglund died--I was instantly blown away. 2. Davis/BSO--My first encounter with Sibelius was this recording of the 2d. Still terrific, if not quite Szell! 3. Segerstam/Helsinki--Bought on your recommendation--thank you! 4. Maazel/VPO--Really enjoy his 1st and 3d. 5. Vanska/Lahti--The speedy 1st riveted me and was worth Amazon's bargain download price. 6. Gibson/RSNO--Never noticed the imperfections until you mentioned them! 7. Bernstein/NYPO--I always forget how good this cycle is until I go back to it. 8. Davis/LSO. Really, I just love the disc with the 3d and 7th, and Kullervo. 9. Abravanel/Utah. What it lacks in technical, makes up for in character. 10. Blomstedt. Yep, one of the most consistent cycles--no weak links.

[@dennismaurer9672]

My first cycle as a teenager was watanabe. My dad did the record cover design. I was lucky. He brought home all the promotional copies from epic and Columbia and I got to hang out with McClure and Paul Myers, to great producers.

[@pauldavidartistclub6723]

Thanks for sharing! What other covers did your dad design?

[@anatolygrishin4234]

Akeo Watanabe produced a very interesting set. Japanese are northerners too.

[@Gcbyvr666]

Great review David. We absolutely love your honesty and strong opinion on the quality of the performances. It's so refreshing to hear someone so transparent and honest rather than being tainted, or shall I say "bought" to give a glowing review of a performance that is clearly anything but great, and that's what I don't like about Gramophone Magazine reviews, and most others too. Love your sense of humor too (I agree with your cat's review lol), and your colorful adjectives to describe your feelings as I'd do the same if I was a reviewer! You are a very funny guy, and this review is not only very informative, it's also hilarious!

[@DavesClassicalGuide]

Thanks very much!

[@matthewv789]

I keep forgetting that Vic Firth was timpanist in Boston. It reminds me there is a quite incredible piece (“Pneuma”) by a prog/rock/metal band (I know, a different world) called Tool featured in a live “drumcam” video put out by Vic Firth (the market-dominating drumstick company) that is not to be missed. Not just because it’s practically a percussion concerto full of polyrhythms and uneven time signatures (but nevertheless always solidly in a groove), but also the song has unusually good structure and fundamentals from a classical perspective, with great buildups, almost Sibelian at times. Very powerful in a symphonic sense and very unlike other rock or metal music.

[@alvinwyllie8502]

What's that got to do with Sibelius symphonies??

[@LukeSt93]

the video i've been waiting 6 months for :D

[@jimjudkins1715]

Great reviews! Thank you for this most valuable service! You mentioned re: the Colin Davis/BSO offering, the importance of the "Vic Firth" tympany in the overall recording. An observation: My initial exposure to these recordings (in the 80's) was on vinyl. Not being a vinyl fan, I was happy when this cycle was eventually released on CD. However... On the vinyl recordings, I was used to booming tympany, about 10½ minutes into the 3rd movement of Symphony #4. Sadly, the engineers chose to deemphasize the tympany when they "remastered" for the CD release; to the degree that I no longer desired to listen to this version; it had lost its punch! Beware of remastering! My 2¢.

[@guyot1979]

Just before I found your excellent videos, I splurged on a several box sets. One of those is the BSO Sibelius cycle mentioned here, chosen because it was the BSO and Im provincial about my home town orchestra. 😊 Glad to hear that you didn’t trash it! Entertaining and informative review, as always.

[@sydshrimp]

Phrase of 2020 from a music critic, "A simmering cauldron of blandness!" Brilliant!

[@TripleBeeFresh]

David, I truly cherish your video reviews. Thank you for putting them together and sharing them with us. You're very clear about why you do and don't like certain recordings with enough qualifiers to make a good point.

[@DavesClassicalGuide]

Glad you like them!

[@stephenbaluran3298]

This is awesome. I was introduced to Sibelius' music during the pandemic lockdown of 2020-2021, and I'm glad I was introduced to Segerstam's recording of the second symphony. Beautiful, beautiful music! I'm gonna go look for his Sibelius cycle right now.

[@ВячеславШеститко]

Thank you for the wonderful review for novice collectors! Three box sets have already been ordered!

[@bencosh]

I have loved this music my whole life. The Davis/Boston cycle being the mainstay. Have seen Davis and Saraste perform 5. Played 2 once myself. Vanska conducting Lahti in 3 at the Proms was spellbinding. Fell in love with that cycle. Saraste - solid, bit safe. Maazel - quirky. Gorgeous string moments. Berglund - stately, but glorious. But the Blomstedt… I’ve leapt out of my chair at the 7th. Spent a whole day listening to 2nds and Blomstedt won. Have just listened to 5 and it’s everything I’ve ever wanted in that piece. If you can find it. Get it. It’s incredible.

[@Don-md6wn]

I bought the Blomstedt Sibelius cycle based on a previous video you did and love it. It really elevated my view of the Sibelius symphonies. But since they're practically giving away the Berglund/Bournemouth set and it has almost 80 minutes of tone poems included, I ordered it too.

[@DavesClassicalGuide]

Can't go wrong either way! Enjoy.

[@playandteach]

Nice to see Segerstam up there in the top few. He was much liked in the Philharmonia, but of course liked conducting his own works too. I've certainly loved playing Sibelius with him. I love big personalities when we often just get big egos. Of course, big personalities can have big egos too, but it's nice to see the flair first. Less popular with some of my colleagues over the years were people like Lazarev and Simonov - possibly having more flair than respect for the sanctity of tradition - but I loved playing with those conductors.

[@amdir7902]

Funfact: there are 44 existing cycles ;) As a huge Sibelius geek I do own 43 of them, the only one missing is Arvo Volmer/Adelaide SO. So maybe a few additions to your list: Sixten Ehrlings cycle in my opinion is a quite good cycle, (it was the first cycle at all) even though it is mono. Paavo Järvis recent cycle also is a really nice one. Watanabes first cycle is also not bad, his second one falls a bit behind. I liked Ashkenazy's second one as well, Inkinen's both cycles are good too, even though they fall a bit flat in terms of emphasis. An insider tip is Tadaaki Otaka's cycle, while hard to get and rather expensive, really surprised me in a good way, especially for the 4th and 5th symphony. Hannu Lintu's cycle (even though only available on DVD/BluRay) is great for the bonus documentations, the symphonies are nicely played but a bit mannered. Two of the cycles that didn´t got mentioned here are Mark Elder's and Sakari Oramo's, unfortunately both are more of a snooze :/

[@DavesClassicalGuide]

I found Paavo Jarvi to be pretty disappointing. I was expecting better from him.

[@MarauderOSU]

Glad to see your praise of the Davis/BSO cycle. I have that, but I also wouldn't want to be without the Bernstein/NYPO recording of the 5th. :)

[@BobTaylor-tx6ql]

I ordered the Leif Segerstam--Helsinki set today to get rid of the bad taste left by Makela's pretty-pretty performances. It's a treat to hear him conducting the Turku orchestra too.

[@ianbarbarafry575]

Great review! Most enjoyable - thank you.

[@marnieesjolander1831]

Great talk as always David! Cheers!

[@mentor3144]

My pared-down list of favorites; 2: a Tanglewood performance, vintage 1976 or so, of Davis and the Boston. The animal response of the audience could only be compared to a Callas opera performance. Also, Barbirolli's Chesky version. :5: Barbirolli/Halle and Davis/Boston (the Phillips recording). 7: Ormandy. There are many great versions with which I supplement these, including Sagerstam.

[@איילבראון-ס8ה]

Thanks, a great survey. I have five of your top recommendations in my collection.... (Vanska\ Lahti, Berglund\ Bournemouth, Segerstam. Davis\Boston and Blomstedt)....

[@willemrm4033]

I have the Berglund, symphonies (Helsinki) and the tone poems ( Bournemouth) in one EMI box (2001). Never compared them to other versions, so I'm glad to hear they are pretty good I'm not that much of a Sibelius fan, but will listen to the favorite box if I can get a hold on it.

[@milfordmkt]

Gibson is a nice pick, maybe overlooked by some folks. Loved his account of the third (bought on fine Chandos LP years ago) and the tone poems.

[@salt_cots]

So true about orchestras playing loud and conductors getting in the way.

[@JamesAdams-ev6fc]

Dear Dave, On your recommendation, I purchased the Segerstam-Helsinki cycle. It is really wonderful, and its trip to my location was an adventure in itself. It came from Athens, Greece by surface mail, and the box was in mint condition upon arrival. I note that Segerstam has this Santa Claus look about him. This is consistent with a Swedish-Finnish family that I used to know. They all sat on the lawn on one fine summer day, and all the men looked like Segerstam. But we were discussing Finnish music, not the appearance of Finnish people. Sorry.

[@Plantagenet1956]

Thank you so much for this survey! A truly magnificent magnum opus video! I haven’t the Blomstedt, but will buy, plus the others, in the great pile, also I have one.

[@paulpellay3755]

I've lost count of the number of CDs of Sibelius symphonies in my possession after 40 years of collecting, but the cycles I have are very consistent to my way of thinking: Berglund/Bournemouth, Vänska/Lahti, Davis/Boston and yes, Noddy too ('Noddy' being the nickname the BBC SO players gave Gennady). All have something to say about this music that's been in my bloodstream since for ever, and all the better for being so contrasting.

[@carlnilson273]

I just listened to the Berglund recording of the fifth symphony. A real knockout! My favorite to date. Thanks, Dave! I'm really looking forward to the other six symphonies in the set, and to the top two cycles on your list. (Could there be a better fifth in the offing? Doesn't seem possible.)

[@nirgoldenberg5624]

Thanks for another great discussion. I simply love sibelius. He's really one of my favorite composers. I got introduced to him via sanderling, so this is my reference set. I especially love his third symphony, one of the fastest tempos I heard, along with gibson and kondarshin. And I realized I really like my sibelius on the fast and upbeat side. I have no patience for conductors who drag him along. I thank you for introducing me to gibson. His set is really wonderful in my opinion. I don't know about buying it, but it is on the streaming apps. And how about discussing Scandinavian composers who are not called sibelius, Nielsen or grieg? I would love such a discussion and recommendations.

[@DavesClassicalGuide]

I have done several talks on Nielsen, Grieg and other Scandinavian composers. Just have a look.

[@mattestabrook]

Sanderling's third is among my favorites.

[@williammorrison4262]

Loved this review as Sibelius is my favorite composer. Interestingly, one doesn't have to listen to the "best" to learn to love a piece of music: for me the door that opened an appreciation for Sibelius symphonies was a 1930's Beacham recording of Symphony #4!

[@stephenconnor1744]

Same story! For me it was the 1950s Sir Malcolm Sargent & BBC SO Symphony # 5.

[@alexanderberry4097]

I like to think those people who organise the BBC Proms heard your Sibelius talks David! His 2nd Symphony is the centrepiece of the opening night! Great stuff!

[@neilbullock4760]

The Maazel box was my baptism into Sibelius 30 years ago (followed shortly after by Esa-Pekka Salonen’s Kullervo and Lemminkäinen Suite). It got lost in a move before I could compare it with any others (though Neeme Järvi has been a decent replacement), so I was glad to hear that I got lucky in my initiation!

[@baltoman24]

Thank you David for this informative examination of the various Sibelius symphony cycles. It brought forth a memory from when I was at Cornell University in the late 1960's- George Szell and Cleveland Symphony came and played the Sibelius Second Symphony- what an unforgettable performance! We were fortunate at Cornell, we were on the tour circuit for many great artists, another one that I remember vividly was Regine Crespin. I expect, and hope that Cornell continues that tradition. I now live near Johns Hopkins University and they continue a wonderful chamber music series at Shriver Hall, to which I subscribe. best wishes.

[@DavesClassicalGuide]

Thanks. I sang and played in Shriver hall and saw many fine chamber music performances there (including the Emerson Quartet and the Beaux Arts Trio). It's good to know the series is still running.

[@mangstadt1]

Very enlightening. I have Davis with the BSO on two double cds, including the other works mentioned here, plus the Barbirolli box (I'm not an expert in Sibelius, so I'll still listen to it), and a double CD of Berglund and Bournemouth playing Kullervo and other works, but not the symphonies. It's good to have an expert's recommendation of 7 excellent sets and 5 very good ones.

[@francescofurlan3098]

I owe one not complete cycle (Karajan, divided between EMI and DG recordings) and two complete, which I have always considered really beautiful for different reasons: Davis/Boston and Sanderling (I like so much that "German" approach). I am happy to have my impression confirmed! 😊 I will try for sure to grab Blomsted and/or Segerstam. Thanks for your always interesting and useful videos!

[@MD-md4th]

I learned how important timpani parts are in Sibelius symphonies at a Maazel/VPO concert at Carnegie Hall in 2012. It was 1, 5, and 7. They were performed in reverse order, which kind of irked me! Anyway, I was mesmerized watching the timpanist in Sibelius 1. We all know there’s lots of timpani in that symphony, but it was a big “Whoa!” experiencing it first-hand.

[@RepertoireSharer]

Great material, David. Thanks!

[@carolleenkelmann4751]

Love your introductions., "..for reason I can't explain." I don't think I have even one cycle of Sibelius Symphonies.

[@therealdealblues]

I have Berglund I & II, Bernstein/NY, Davis/Boston, Blomstedt/San Francisco and Mazzel/Vienna. Honestly haven't felt any need to expand my collection. (I also have the Barbirolli but that's only because it came in the complete Warner box set) But with any or even just a couple of those top choices for variation I don't see how anyone could be unhappy.

[@DavesClassicalGuide]

Neither do I!

[@joewebb1983]

Entertaining video, Dave. Enjoyed the categories too. My senior school music teacher introduced me to Alexander Gibson's recordings back in the early 90s and he made a lot of good records with the Scottish National Orchestra, his Sibelius really is excellent and you are right to give it a recommendation as I think it is often overlooked, especially these days. I totally agree as well with your high praise for Maazel/VPO and Berglund's Bournemouth cycle... Let's be honest, he inherited a great band from Silvestri and he made the most of it! I was aware of his Helsinki cycle but you mentioned a third cycle, was this with the Chamber Orchestra of Europe? I may have a listen to it to check it out. I also don't mind Sakari Oramo's cycle from Birmingham, it's not the best but I think it is "good" throughout. Vanska's Lahti cycle is up there for me also, your point about them being more of a chamber band absolutely comes through with the extreme dynamics in the final movement of #2.

[@DavesClassicalGuide]

Yes, with the COE.

[@joewebb1983]

@@DavesClassicalGuide thanks, will have a listen...

[@jimcrawford5039]

I am very fussy about Sibelius symphonies, I can’t stand 2, 4 & 6! I just love 1, 3, 5 & 7. The Davis/Boston set is great.

[@colinmaynard2879]

Ah that’s rather odd! When Sibelius was in his prime. ☺️

[@michaelmyers2757]

Dave!!! Your comments on the composers are even more valuable than the reviews, which are themselves an education....”tone poems” like symphonies. Soviet brass is “lacerating”, not “assiduous “-wrong word...Your work is a treasure!

[@ftumschk]

To be fair, Dave said that Soviet brass is acidulous - meaning "sour, slightly acidic" - not assiduous.

[@johnfowler7660]

Herbert Blomstedt is 93 years old (born July 11, 1927). Still waiting for a complete Blomstedt/San Francisco box. I hope Decca isn't waiting for an In Memoriam box. I know you liked the 15 CD box, but a lot of the items not in that box are hard to find and/or expensive.

[@DavesClassicalGuide]

I agree. Don't hold your breath

[@OuterGalaxyLounge]

You have an overflow room. I have an overflow cabinet. I intend to keep it that way.

[@artistinbeziers7916]

We all say that, in the beginning !

[@mikeos1]

I have two overflow hard drives!

[@tbridge001]

David, I think you are a bit harsh on Davis with the LSO... I was the tape editor on this set, so when you talk about the orchestra getting lost and 'a bar out for the entire coda of the first movement of the 5th', I thought, 'OMG, did I mess up an edit?'. I went back to the original marked-up score, which I still have after all these years, and there is no edit for the last 10 or so pages. And as far as I can tell, the timpanist and everyone else are rock-solid and on the beat. Great impression of Robert Leyton...

[@DavesClassicalGuide]

Sorry but you are quite mistaken.

[@jeffsummstl]

I have the cycle with Colin Davis and the London Symphony, the one from the LSO Live series. I absolutely love it.

[@john1951w]

I also enjoy it but Davis grunting ruins it and the Barbican acoustic is a bit cramped. Davis knows his stuff though!!

[@artistinbeziers7916]

Another superb presentation. Thank you, David. Have to disagree about John Barbirolli ! Colin Davis set a very high bar with his peerless Boston set on Philips Duo. I've owned it for many years, and it still sends a thrill and a chill down my spine. May I just ask if you have any thoughts on Neeme Jarvi's RCA set with the Orchestre de Paris? I ask simply because if I'm not mistaken, you are (as I am) rather partial to French orchestras. I look forawrd to your forthcoming presentations. Maybe a Sibelius violin concerto...?

[@DavesClassicalGuide]

It's Paavo Jarvi, and it's pretty disappointing--full of odd little manipulations and lacking cohesion and cumulative force.

[@artistinbeziers7916]

@@DavesClassicalGuide Many thanks. Of course it's Paavo. A stupid mistake on my part.

[@leslieackerman4189]

Like very much you lexicon, which is an obvious condition to be a critic. Very good take on box sets I mostly have! (And in spite of disagreements.)

[@WMAlbers1]

One culprit is also that you really get too much glued to the first recordings you listened. So, later recordings are usually experienced as worse if they sound different.

[@DavesClassicalGuide]

Actually, I never felt that way. I was just curious about what made them different. Most of the time, I'm not overly attached to those first versions, but there are a few exceptions. I guess that's why I became a critic!

[@WMAlbers1]

@@DavesClassicalGuide Well, I've listened Sibelius now for 40 years and are amazed (positively and negatively) by some of the newer recordings. Blomsted ranks very high indeed, especially in the third symphony he attains that radiant optimism that is so difficult to reach. Somehow, when Sibelius was in the process of moving to the countryside, he found this new fountain of inspiration and a more objective, yet personal style. The hallmark was the third symphony, and I have never really found the ultimate recording.

[@DavidJohnson-of3vh]

Excellent review, thank you. My sentimental favorite (because it was my first) is Akeo Watanabe/Japan Philharmonic on Epic lp.

[@JXS63J]

Wow - Mine too, with the white cover; but I never felt they were that good.

[@vinylisland6386]

Gibson is a musical Anthony Collins? To paraphrase Beecham, who famously described Karajan as "a musical SIr Malcolm Sargent", a priceless put-down which manages to insult both conductors equally.

[@dmntuba]

Just wanted to add this... A few weeks ago I watched your discussion on Taneyev. Recieved my CD Taneyev 4/ Jarvi/ Philharmonia...WOW!!! This afternoon is first chance I've had to sit down with it, and it has been a Fantastic,Musical Joy...Can't thank you enough. Now I need to decide what of his to get next 😁 Thanks again 👍

[@DavesClassicalGuide]

Wonderful!

[@theosalvucci8683]

What happened to Neme Jarvi's cycle of the entire Sibelius orchestral works?

[@josecarmona9168]

Well, Järvi recorded the complete non vocal works (except for a couple of pieces) for Bis. And as long as I know they are yet available separately. I think these recordings are amazing.

[@theosalvucci8683]

@@josecarmona9168 No shit. I have the complete set. I just wanted David to comment on them. But don't let me stop you from being condescending.

[@josecarmona9168]

@@theosalvucci8683 , well, I wasn't. In fact, I try never to be condescending. I simply thought you were asking for this information. But well, I know now that perhaps it's better to keep quiet.

[@theosalvucci8683]

@@josecarmona9168 I'm sorry if I overreacted. Don't keep quiet on my account.

[@josecarmona9168]

@@theosalvucci8683 , don't worry. We all have our moments 👍

[@chrisvershaw774]

My vote is Lorin Maazel and the Wiener Philharmoniker. Just bought and listened to Blomstedt and San Francisco. When comparing the two cycles, the WP's brass , wind wood, and string sections are very cohesive and exuberant where they need be. They crescendo where there supposed to and are quiet where there suppose to. It all seems in place. The SF and Blomstedt set just seems sluggish and unexciting in places. I know you said the WP's No. 5 pace is too fast. But its fast where it need be compared to SF. SF is too slow in places. It reminds me of Maazel with Pittsburgh, it just lies there like a dead fish you caught an hour ago and left at the bottom of your boat. In conclusion, I think WP has just better players than SF and it shows in the performance and recording. Sonics: I have the older and the newly remastered set of Maazel with the WP. The remastered set sonics are better and bridge the gap with the digital Blomstedt recording. But, the older set is pretty damn good considering it was recorded in the 60's. I have been listening to and collecting classical music for over 20 years. You tend to learn some things after awhile. I played the guitar while growing up and know the basics of music. I don't play anymore because I have a real job. So, I am aware that I know a thing or two. But for the record--after listening to your reviews, I acquired some of your suggestions because YOU KNOW GREAT PERFORMANCES AND RECORDINGS AND TRUELY KNOW YOUR MUSIC!

[@DavesClassicalGuide]

Thanks for listening and sharing your feelings. If you prefer Maazel to Blomstedt, that's fine. What matters is that you took the time to compare and draw your own conclusions.

[@kend.6797]

I applaud your efforts in this expansive talk! I have never heard the Anthony Collins recordings, buy have seen them reissued and talked about many times. It would be easy for someone to accidentally and unknowingly fall for the hype. Fortunately I did not fall for it!

[@mattestabrook]

I certainly did fall for it--what a let down!

[@cartologist]

Wondering about your views on Jarvi père (Neeme) - he did two with Goteborg: first on BIS, second on DG.

[@DavesClassicalGuide]

Both have good bits and less good bits. You can find some reviews on ClassicsToday.com.

[@shantihealer]

Maazel's cycle with the VPO, 'wonderful' indeed. Tried Blomstedt on your recommendation and was very put off by his heavy-footed prosaic sixth, Maazel's sixth is just magical. DAVE ... is there any chance you can do a survey of the Mount Everest of solo violin works, Bach's Sonatas and Partitas?

[@DavesClassicalGuide]

Probably not. There are too many good ones, and too many questions of personal preference.

[@dreic16]

imo the 6th is the low point of Blomstedt's cycle. For a replacement try Karajan on EMI, I think it's a dark horse

[@robertgruver9613]

My favorite had been Segerstam with Helsinki. I recently bought the Paavo Jarvi with L'Orchestre de Paris and was completely surprised and pleased. The recordings of 1 and 2 are romantic and dramatic and just knocked my socks off. The later symphonies are really well played, too.

[@DavesClassicalGuide]

No, they are not. The Jarvi is rather disappointing, both as playing, recording, and interpretation. It's full of odd mannerisms and a strange sort of poking and prodding at the music. Should have been much better.

[@davidowen9308]

@@DavesClassicalGuide Paavo Jarvi is always full of mannerisms and prodding isn't he? One of the worst of the the current crop of superstar conductors who can't simply conduct without having to make artificial interpretative points all the time. Other than the fact i'd definitely put Sanderling in the top 7, I think you did a pretty good job here!

[@DavesClassicalGuide]

@@davidowen9308 Not always, but perhaps recently, as so often happens.

[@davidowen9308]

@@DavesClassicalGuide +1 -- very pertinent point

[@bombayteddy]

You mentioned Neeme Jarvi. How would you rate his cycle with the Gothenburg SO? I have their collection of tone poems and find it decent but not particularly inspiring. And Bernstein’s VPO remake of Sym.1 is really something special. NOT slow and ponderous like the 2nd but with wonderful Romantic sweep and passion. Great sound too.

[@DavesClassicalGuide]

It has some great things (No. 6 especially), and some pretty slipshod work too. The Bernstein 1 is a powerful performance, but the sonics are dry and unpleasant (the tone of the horns sounds as if they are using stopped tones throughout). His NY Phil recording of the work is far superior in all respects.

[@bombayteddy]

@@DavesClassicalGuideThanks. I must listen to the NYPO recording again.

[@AlexMadorsky]

The Berglund is my very favorite of these and I got it for a song back in the day. I don’t think anyone sympathizes with refined yet soaring Sibelian strings better. I will admit this video almost makes me want to run out and buy Noddy’s take on Melodiya. Boisterous brass slicing through my brain would be a welcome antidote to some of these cycles; Sibelius can turn into a somnolent snooze fest easily under the wrong baton. Unfortunately (or perhaps fortunately), the online prices for the Rozhdestvensky cycle generally appear to be a massive ripoff.

[@DavesClassicalGuide]

The brass isn't boisterous. It's just painful. Don't rush to get it.

[@AlexMadorsky]

@@DavesClassicalGuide copy that, thanks. With Berglund in my collection, I’m not in a rush to add anything else. The Segerstam intrigued me most.

[@matthewv789]

Karajan did the 6th very well back in the 60s for DG I thought (and the 5th and 7th, and 4th I guess), but never as far as I know recorded the 3rd at all. But he did the 1st and 2nd on EMI at another time. The 1st was good, though with curiously thin sonics, but I wasn’t as convinced by the 2nd. (I wasn’t convinced by Bernstein Vienna either. Blomstedt was my “ah, so THAT’s how it goes” moment in the second symphony, just as he was in the Eroica.)

[@DavesClassicalGuide]

Yes, I have discussed most of these in other videos.

[@artistinbeziers7916]

I think I have a Karajan 4th (EMI) knocking around on my shelves, which I recal as being very good. But as we know, Karajan can be a rather 'hit or miss' conductor. I have a couple of his DG Sibelius recordings ; 'variable' would be my comment.

[@lucbenac9756]

​ @DavesClassicalGuide Would you kindly consider a review of Paavo Jarvi cycle with l'Orchestre de Paris on RCA? Using your book as a listening reference, I am on a Sibelius binge working my way through the dozen or so recordings of the first I have (single or part of cycle) and doing the same for the second, before getting to the Third later this year.

[@DavesClassicalGuide]

It's pretty mediocre. Skip it.

[@lucbenac9756]

@@DavesClassicalGuide Thank you. I also found Berglund last cycle on Qobuz and based on your description will give it a shot as potentialy the easiest to follow the details and structure that you note in your book. I find that it is a good way to get familiar with a symphony before listening to the various interpretations on offer and often ending up with a couple of favorites out of a dozen......For example, not all recording let you hear most of the harp parts in the First equally 🙂

[@lucbenac9756]

Listening to No.1 and it is absolutely perfect to follow your comments markings on pages 73 and onward.

[@davegarciaofficial]

I’m a bit surprised a review like this didn’t include the Jarvi/Gothenburg?

[@DavesClassicalGuide]

Why should it?

[@davegarciaofficial]

@@DavesClassicalGuide because it’s a fairly popular set that many people stumble upon and may like to know if it’s worth it. Sheeeez sorry for asking

[@DavesClassicalGuide]

@@davegarciaofficial You can always ask. It's no problem. I just like it when you do as you just did--explain the reason for the question. The fact that something exists doesn't mean it has to be discussed. So now that you have explained your rationale, I can answer the question. First, it's not there because , while it has some good things in it, it's not one of the best (I assume you refer to his DG cycle, and not the earlier BIS recordings, which are more interesting on the whole). Second, I see no evidence that it is more popular, relatively speaking, than the sets that I did mention. "Fairly popular" is a fairly meaningless description. Third, as I always note, there are also many, many reviews on ClassicsToday.,com that provide information supplemental to the videos. You can always go there to see if the performances in question have been reviewed. In this case, they have: www.classicstoday.com/review/review-12090/?search=1. If you read the review you will see exactly why it's not included in the list as a cycle, despite some fine individual performances.

[@merino_and_tomatoes]

Hello Dave, Thank you for infotaining with knowledge and humour! Even more thank you for providing a personal opinion in these days! :-) Any thoughts about Hannu Lintu's cycle with the finish RSO from 2015 (on DVD/bluray/youtube) ? Thanks a lot!

[@DavesClassicalGuide]

Thank you for your kind remarks. I haven't heard that cycle.

[@morrigambist]

After years of waiting I finally found a copy on CD of the Ehrling set (issued here by Mercury back in the day). It was much too expensive, and the recordings are mono, but I was pleasantly surprised by the performances, and the sound was fairly good.

[@mancal5829]

Wow! Blomstedt is the one I have.

[@piano2750]

Mr Hurwitz, are you aware that in the Fourth Symphony of your "best of best" cycle of Sibelius under Blomstedt, the solo cellist spoils things (for me anyway) by his loud sniff/intake of breath before he comes in?....and not just once.

[@DavesClassicalGuide]

Not a problem for me.

[@robkeeleycomposer]

David: so you were also at Tanglewood in 1988 in the Shed to hear Leonard Bernstein's unconducted Haydn 1988 finale? :-) That was amazing! Really enjoyed this - my first of your KZbin talks.

[@muslit]

I agree with the later Bernstein recordings with the Vienna Phil. - not as successful as the first set. However, No. 1 is terrific.

[@DavesClassicalGuide]

Bad sonics though. Dry as dust.

[@amdir7902]

@@DavesClassicalGuide This is true, but Bernstein's Vienna recording of the 1st remains my favourite recording of this symphony simply for him being the only conductor who really lets the timpani go wild in the "poco a poco piu stretto crescendo"-section in the middle and at the end of the first movement. There are so many recordings of this symphony out there where you can barely hear the timpani in this section, but he lets them whack the daylights out there :D The only other recording I can remember coming close is Segerstam (Ondine), but the timpani sound is much darker.

[@DavesClassicalGuide]

@@amdir7902 That is fine. You like it for that reason, but all I am suggesting is that there is more to the symphony, and that recording, than that favorite moment. I heard Bernstein and Vienna do the First live at Carnegie Hall and it was fabulous. I was very disappointed by the quality of the recording in comparison.

[@djpb67]

@@DavesClassicalGuide I was at the Carnegie performance as well, and I concur. A shame DG couldn’t capture that sound.

[@theodoremann1461]

Because I happen to own the set, I was hoping that you might make a comment or two about the old Adrian Leaper contribution with the Slovak Philharmonic (Naxos). I enjoy it, so I guess I didn't exactly waste my money, but I would value your opinion.

[@DavesClassicalGuide]

I think it's pretty mediocre, which of course isn't to say that you shouldn't enjoy it.

[@mikakangasaho1236]

Excellent review, thank you, David. And Happy Jean Sibelius & Finnish Music Day today 8.12. for everybody :) On the home audio sofa: Some Sibelius Solo Piano Works played by Marita Viitasalo (Finlandia Records, now Warner) , to start with the celebration.

[@marnieesjolander1831]

Love the solo piano stuff! Highly underrated.

[@blakesorenson8766]

Hi Dave, curious as to what you think about the new Klaus Mäkelä cycle with Oslo?

[@DavesClassicalGuide]

Watch the video.

[@donaldjones5386]

An entertaining analysis. You're tough on Collins. His mono cycle, from the 1950s, may have been the only one in its time. He made sense of #3, delineating a great work. He never expected to be put up against a thousand versions 70 years into the future. About the first two symphonies: You seem to favor the majority view: that they must be romantic. I think Brahms composed Brahms better, which is why I dislike Barbirolli and other ultra-romantic views of 1 and 2. I like a bit more "icy Northern quality" in all the symphonies. Thanks for articulating why I prefer the Vanska Lahti set to the later one. Too bad Szell didn't do them all! In concert I heard a talented young conductor do #2. He got it all but those pauses in the second movement. Before that I hadn't realized how difficult those are to bring off.

[@DavesClassicalGuide]

You don't know what Collins did or did not expect, but for sure he didn't think, 'I guess this is good enough for the period!"

[@donaldjones5386]

@@DavesClassicalGuide Well, technically he couldn,'t have peered into the future. But if 1950s standards were low, as you say, there was no alternative. I bought my first Sibelius discs around 1960: VC with Stern and Beecham and Symphony 2 with Ormamdy. The quality was much higher than Collins, I grant, but these weren't complete sets.

[@DavesClassicalGuide]

@@donaldjones5386 Of course there was an alternative. He could have been a great conductor who demanded superior results, but he wasn't and didn't.

[@johnmarchington3146]

Perhaps it's a good thing that we don't live close to each other!! If you saw my Sibelius symphony collection, you'd be appalled.

[@cstamitz]

The Collins set is very fast. I got it from a free download. The playing is a little rough. However, IMO, it is not as bad as Dave says it is, especially when it costs nothing. Back in those days, just about everything was played faster. Maybe the musicians needed some good scotch and were in a hurry.

[@DavesClassicalGuide]

In other words, crap is OK if it's cheap crap? I don't think so.

[@matthewv789]

Speaking of chamber orchestras (Lahti), there is a quite nice video here on KZbin of the River Oaks Chamber Orchestra (ROCO) of Houston Texas (who?) conducted by Michael Stern (who?) doing the 7th quite surprisingly wonderfully.

[@yaoser]

Hi Dave, what’s your opinion on the Karajan/Kamu set?

[@DavesClassicalGuide]

See review at ClassicsToday.com.

[@judsonmusick3177]

LOL - kudos to Pipo!

[@matthiasdieterkuster696]

Did i miss Neeme Järvi?

[@DavesClassicalGuide]

I didn't.

[@colinwrubleski7627]

Curious why Herbie von K. did not do a complete cycle, since his BPO 4th through 7th, coupled with a variety of the tone poems, are excellent. Any thoughts / comments?

[@DavesClassicalGuide]

He didn't like No. 3, I guess.

[@PaulBrower-qr8hf]

Should Svetlanov have done Sibelius and Rozhdestvensky have done Mahler? Maybe the recording assignments were wrong.

[@johnmarchington3146]

I did ask you about the Sakari Iceland Cycle but I note that you don't think much of the first two symphonies, so I think I'll give it a miss.

[@DavesClassicalGuide]

Check out the reviews of the rest at ClassicsToday.com.

[@lteiflhhdj5047]

Vous avez oublié Okko Kamu et Kajanus

[@DavesClassicalGuide]

Je n'ai oublié rien.

[@olivierbeltrami]

Vänskä’s Mahler 10 is fantastic IMO. What’s your opinion ?

[@DavesClassicalGuide]

We're talking about Sibelius.

[@brucknerian9664]

Thanks for this review ... I've ordered the Colin Davis set; couldn't get the Blomstedt even through Amazon ... not available. Any idea where you can find it?

[@DavesClassicalGuide]

I'm sorry. I have no idea, but I'm sure it will be back.

[@cartologist]

I got my Blomstedt from *bay, making sure they used actual rather than stock photos. The individual Decca releases are a mess, and difficult to find, to boot.

[@shingosanada4396]

Mark Elder's great live recordings of Sibelius cycle is missing in this review.

[@DavesClassicalGuide]

With good reason.

[@stevenmsinger]

I agree that the Anthony Collins cycle as a whole is not anywhere near the best - and not just because of the antique sonics. However, I still think his recording of the first symphony is special. I think that piece can fall apart into little episodes if the tempo isn't right. Collins keeps it all together and logical and he hits the climaxes very well. It's one of my favorite versions. Nothing else in the cycle comes close. The rest is a mess.

[@DavesClassicalGuide]

That's very fair. The First is the best thing in the cycle, I agree.

[@warrenpyke813]

Just listened to symph 1 to 3 in recent release by Orchestre de Paris under Paavo Jarvi. I'm not sure on a first listening, have you reviewed it?

[@DavesClassicalGuide]

Not formally but this has already been discussed here. I find it disappointing.

[@howardsimmons4577]

You should play some excerpts to illustrate your points.

[@DavesClassicalGuide]

You get permission from the labels to do it and you've got a deal.

[@howardsimmons4577]

@@DavesClassicalGuide You'd think they'd be keen on the exposure. But I suppose it would depend on whether you gave them a thumbs up or a thumbs down!

[@DavesClassicalGuide]

@@howardsimmons4577 No, it's a copyright issue. They want their trillionth of a cent of potential ad revenue.

[@howardsimmons4577]

@@DavesClassicalGuide This seems like a strange attitude on their part. If you just played excerpts from the good ones, one would think the positive exposure they would get would be worth much more than the 'trillionth of a cent'.

[@DavesClassicalGuide]

@@howardsimmons4577 Yes, one would think that, wouldn't one? Logic is not their strong suit, and classical music doesn't rate with them.

[@charlescoleman5509]

I like Segerstam's cycle. But he occasionally has the basses play an octave lower than written in spots. That's a wee bit of cheating, don't you think?

[@DavesClassicalGuide]

Nope. Not if it works.

[@Jpicsbass]

Wait until you find out how often bass players actually do this, especially in Brahms!!! Sincerely, a bass player 😁

[@robertmckelvey5394]

David, I've just listened to the Moscow Sibelius 2. Oh my GOD the BRASS! Unbelievable! They break phrases in the middle to take a breath to further their ASSAULT on the music! Jeeeeezzz!!! If you're interested in more incredibly over the top Russian brass, have a listen to Rozhedestvensky conduct the Moscow Radio Large Symphony Orchestra (MRLSO for short!) in the Tchaikovsky First Symphony. All seems well until the horn section melody in the second movement then OMG! My conducting teacher listened to the Kondrashin Melodiya recording of Mahler 5. I asked him what he thought. He said (with a Romanian accent) "Strings excellent. Woodwinds and brass - Disaster!"

[@TimSwensen]

Perhaps I missed it, but I didn’t hear any mention of the Ashkenazy/Philharmonia cycle, which I enjoy for beautiful sonics. I also love Blomstedt’s work on these symphonies, as you do. Having been privileged to share a meal with Blomstedt many years ago, he is so knowledgeable, yet genuinely humble. He lets the music speak.

[@DavesClassicalGuide]

You didn't miss it. Ashkenazy's cycle has it's moments (a great First), but much of it is mediocre and rather glassily recorded to boot.

[@stephenconnor1744]

Thanks for Ashkenazy-thought I might be solo on his cycle.

[@MD-md4th]

I have always thought Ashkenazy’s Sibelius too slow and slack - especially the 2nd. I think his conducting is too slack in general. On the other hand, if I had to pick a “favorite pianist” it would probably be Ashkenazy.

[@matthiasdieterkuster696]

Sorry I have no Party records😊

[@bernardohanlon3498]

Dave - greetings from the Penal Colonies. Again, thanks for a highly entertaining and insightful talk. Your references to Simon Rattle - V1 - are right on the money - but what about his V2 effort with the Berlin Phil . . . . . A prime example of someone who does not connect with the Romanticism of S1 and S2 in any way. Best wishes, B

[@DavesClassicalGuide]

I agree, but the Berlin cycle is, in my view, unworthy of notice. It is so expensive and unnecessary.

[@artistinbeziers7916]

@@DavesClassicalGuide ...very much like anything of Rattle that I've heard, EXCEPT for some of his early career recordings - a superb EMI 'British Music' series CD of Britten, which is great, for example. He had more spark and fire then.

[@maudia27]

I must confess I feel so guilty to find Sibelius so boring...from time to time I try but my mind cant keep focus. Let´s go again.

[@DavesClassicalGuide]

It will either hit you or it won't. Try one of the lesser-known works. Sometimes the most obvious route isn't the best. For example, check out Pohjola's Daughter or the Seventh Symphony if you don't know them, and ignore the fact that it's Sibelius. Just listen to it like a new discovery and see if it strikes your fancy.

[@maudia27]

​@@DavesClassicalGuide I like some pieces (love the violin concerto) - the romantic phase is OK. I will try the 7th again as you said. Love how you are so open mind to the different tastes and the way you answer so fast. Keep recording :)

[@amdir7902]

@@maudia27 My first touch on Sibelius was the 3rd movement of his 5th symphony, I was immediately in love with his music. Maybe it will work for you too. Davids suggestions are nice as well.

[@Don-md6wn]

It could be the recordings you've listened to - Sibelius can be snooze inducing if the performance isn't good. The Blomstedt symphony cycle did it for me, and the 4 disc cycle from Berglund/Bournemouth (which has a full disc worth of tone poems included) seems to be virtually universally highly regarded and is available for less than $20.

[@hwelf11]

@@amdir7902 I good choice - I'd suggest trying the Bernstein version. If that still leaves you cold, you may well be immune.

[@stddisclaimer8020]

I am guessing that the not mentioned Simon Rattle cycle (with the City of Birmingham SO) is neither in the worst nor the best group, but in between.

[@Don-md6wn]

He did mention it, said he had it in the big Rattle box and it belongs in the dog pile.

[@DavesClassicalGuide]

Yep. Woof.

[@stddisclaimer8020]

@@Don-md6wn in the "dog pile"? I have that cycle, but haven't listened to it in years. Will get back to it and try to see why he might feel that way.

[@christophercurdo4384]

Listen to David's comments at about 31:15. Methinks he doesn't like it!

[@sbor2020]

The Berlin cycle is better. I listened to the live performances

[@Ira5208]

For me, having 10 different cycles, Barbirolli Halle is in its own class.

[@DavesClassicalGuide]

I agree. Maybe fifth or sixth class.

[@mistywalters]

@@DavesClassicalGuide Hallerious!

[@petejilka968]

But, never forget that Gennady Rozhdestvensky was a People's Artist of the USSR and a Hero of Socialist Labour.

[@DavesClassicalGuide]

Wasn't everyone?