Retro Computer WARS! 68060 Motorola Power!

Star Trek IV Render benchmark in Lightwave3D!
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[@BracerJack]

The quality of your video is just getting better and better.

[@paszTube]

I was thinking the same! Great work Q!

[@HoldandModify]

thank you both!

[@lanatrzczka]

Never did it with an Amiga, but I took an Apple IIe to the max with 8 mb ram, 16 mhz cpu, internet-enabled networking card, ssd hard drive, a sound card, MIDI card, windowed desktop, all the stuff. Incredible experience. The thing I find though, is that the harder one pushes the old machines the quicker the power supplies burn out. I can read wikipedia, check the weather, play MIDI songs, all kinds of stuff on the IIe. And then the power supply burns out a month or two later. I don't know if it happens in the Amiga world, but in the Apple IIe world the power supplies just can't keep up over time when you push it all the way.

[@HoldandModify]

Yeah I have had to deal with the PSU nightmares. I keep all my actual rendering for emulators at least.

[@Pink404]

Back in the 90s I had an A1200 with a 28mhz 020 and FPU expansion, my much simpler renders at 640x512 were overnighters. (I said had, I still have it)

[@HoldandModify]

Yeah back then I had a PP&S 25mhz 040 in my A3000. Was the slower of the 040s since it used the A3000s onboard memory. Renders were still over night. :)

[@JS-wl3gi]

I am still amazed at all the graphics you can do

[@HoldandModify]

It's a job. A fun one. Sometimes. Thank you by the way!

[@SeanCC]

Accelerator cards can be weird. I remember feeling almost incredulous when sometimes you'd see results from an accelerator in an A2000 that was faster than the same speed chip in an A3000 or A4000. I'd be so aggravated, hah-hah. At least this time it's favoring what you might intuitively expect.

[@jerrywatson1958]

Another great video. Thanks from Baltimore.

[@HoldandModify]

Fans from Baltimore! Caw caw! Thanks!

[@ChrisEdwardsRestoration]

no unboxing, no fpga, no clocks? no chocolate? hmmph

[@HoldandModify]

This channel sucks

[@retrosalvage]

Fun video, thank you 👍

[@SJSsesco]

Other than Light wave stuff I love this stuff Q❤💾🤟💪

[@HoldandModify]

It's fun!

[@TheSudsy]

i used to have so many of those switch boxes back in the day

[@cullmaster7361]

I still use one that handles video, keyboard and mouse 👍🏻

[@HoldandModify]

They are as legendary as these old computers. :)

[@TheErador]

...and they were always that colour

[@ChronicleMove]

Love you staff!

[@HoldandModify]

Appreciated! Glad you enjoy.

[@peder6199]

Really fun to see your comparison, I moved over to the dark side (PC) just a while after the 060 where released. But seeing things like this makes me miss my A3000@16 that at the end where expanded with a 040@35 acc card, 2Mb of chip, 16mb fast and 32mb on the acc.card, merlin gfx, golden gate 2 with a isa network card, 52mb + 105mb + 1gb hd, 3.3x cd-rom, everything inside the box (except the cd-rom) so had to changed the psu fan and add a 40mm fan between the zorro compartment and mb/acc area to keep the inside temp down.

[@HoldandModify]

Back in the day I was nearly ready to spend $2000 upgrading my A3000 with all this shown in video. Instead. I sold it and built a Win95 PC. Just the times it was for aspiring 3D artists.

[@Terminally_Single_Beta_Male]

That's a great haircut, sir!

[@HoldandModify]

Thanks! It's called...not having your hair cut. :)

[@cullmaster7361]

Thanks for the video “Q” 👍🏻 Would be good to see this demo with a TF4060 or even the Z3660. Cheers from the U.K 🍻

[@HoldandModify]

It would be. Could you send me them? :)

[@pepinw]

How about with a pistorm ?

[@O5-XIV]

2:25 is that a MittensSquad Fork Barbarian? "This is where the real game begins"

[@HoldandModify]

Yes. I honor him with that and I miss him. :/

[@O5-XIV]

@@HoldandModify I Miss Paul as well. i wish i could have gotten Either run of them. But RL she is a Harsh mistress sometimes. Great video BTW

[@tfksworldoflinux]

My first knee jerk reaction on the render times was: not that bad actually.

[@HoldandModify]

:)

[@plechaim]

The hair is fine but Take care of your health man, keep well, concerned you are gasping here. Nice video 👍🏻

[@HoldandModify]

A lot of folks freak at the gasping. I have scarred lungs. Like shotgun pellets. No they aren't growing so that's good but it makes my breathing very wheezy.

[@Checkmate1500]

Swap boards round and try again lol.

[@HoldandModify]

lol yes then the other would win! (for real it should, same cpu bus and all)

[@jkdsteve]

The longer the render, the more the faster memory speed of the BFG shows it's strength.

[@HoldandModify]

Yup, seems so. It's quick!

[@anti-cmos1349]

I couldn't begin to afford a Amiga now days. things are made from gold. I do emulate one on a Pi 4/5 at 42x (Pi 4) or 69x (Pi 5) the speed of a A4000 040 system.I want to try one of my Pi Zero 2W's, think it would have more than enough. A modern calculator can emulate a Amiga faster than they could ever run. It's fun. I'd like to see that 4000 against Amiberry emulation on Pi, that'd be a cool compare. Both renderings, maybe even pick something that favors 060 CPU too ro make it interesting. Amiberry can only emulate 040 with the Pi version that supports JIT.

[@HoldandModify]

Haha yeah I hear ya. Even these 060s for all their speed pale to what they can do emulated. The hardware and software handle being accelerated very well too.

[@pauledwards2817]

Did have both the Cybervision 64 and the Cyberstorm 2. Yes as with others it probably is the memory in the 060 that is slowing it down. 60s never got hot on my CS2 so never considered heat something that could stall a 60. I am confused about the Cv64. I am sure it had passthrough, you take the VGA flicker fixed video from the 3000 in to the card and out it comes from the CV64 when no RTG screen in front. Perhaps the monitors drivers don't support this in P96. I certainly had that on my 3000 because I had VGA card for the golden gate bridge board. I never used native amiga VGA output so used the switcher to switch to the bridge board VGA card by putting a ECS public screen to the front.

[@pauledwards2817]

Oh in addition, I don't know how well P96 supports the CV64. I used the supplied RTG system supplied by Phase 5 and after using previous RTG cards the CV64 was superb at promoting applications because of the Roxxler chip able to show correct output when other cards just rendered garbled lines and random stuff or worked but incredibly slowly. If the Roxxler is not utilised in P96 a lot of the plus side of the CV64 is lost. At the time I was running the post Amiga bust time released 3.1 in the black retail boxes. My curiosity would get me going back to a 3.1 install when the CV64 and CS2 were fresh on the streets.

[@HoldandModify]

My C64 lacks the flicker fixer. Prior owner(s) removed it long ago. It's detachable much like the PicassoIV for use in A2000/2500.

[@pauledwards2817]

@@HoldandModify No flicker fixer on the one I had but it came with a short cable connecting the 15pin VGA output from the A3000 to the CV64 card, and then the driver flipped a switch on the CV64 to send the A3000 VGA output through the CV64 and out to the monitor connected to it when a native Amiga screen was in front, when a RTG screen was in front you see the CV64 output.

[@pauledwards2817]

@@HoldandModify Sorry, you have the 3D, my bad, missed the 3D, temp. ear blockage.

[@michac3796]

Your hair is fine, don't worry abt it. ;)

[@HoldandModify]

Haha, thanks!

[@PATTHECATMCD]

@@HoldandModify Ya got more than me bro. Count your blessings. :)

[@mikedefoy]

My Amiga setup had at least 3 switch boxes. The PI sadly put my Blizzard 060s in their place.

[@HoldandModify]

If we ever get a PiStorm for 3000/4000, I'd be interested!

[@ErazerPT]

Are the 060's same clock speed? Would be interesting to see some Sysspeed memory speed numbers if so, because that SMD SDRAM can hit far highers numbers than EDO/FPM SIMM'S would ever hope to. Theoretically, the last EDO could run at 66Mhz which was more than the 060 needs (@50Mhz), but there's always missed cycles, and the SDRAM being 133Mhz (quite likely) just might bring down those "near misses" to the point where it adds up to a real difference.

[@HoldandModify]

They're the same speed yes, but you can bet the ram onboard the new BFG is probably faster. Also, don't forget the RC5 is potentially faster even at its same 50mhz speed.

[@SledgeFox]

@@HoldandModify 👍

[@shadow4evr]

Posted 8 seconds ago? I’m suspicious of that. 😁

[@HoldandModify]

YT has this video stuck in potato mode. Lovely. 360p?!

[@shadow4evr]

@ when I post videos, the higher res versions always come along at a later time, with the 4K versions being last.

[@richardnixon8795]

Okay, I'll bite. I know *of* Amigas from back in the day but not much *about* them. I see three renders - a b&w low-res, a color low-res, and a high-res HD full color render. Is the HD just a frame grab? Or is it on one output going into the switch box? Cheers!

[@HoldandModify]

The black-and-white render is a preview of the actual render it shows you this is more of a gimmick, but it can also be useful so that you can see if something is wrong while it's actually rendering.

[@richardnixon8795]

@@HoldandModify Thanks very much! That's pretty slick nonetheless.

[@ultrium2000]

I wonder how long would it take a Raspberry Pi 5 to render it.

[@HoldandModify]

Not long. Has to be 10-100x faster right?

[@jimmay8627]

I'd be curious to know the fastest result under emulation, just for comparison.

[@HoldandModify]

Like an earlier comment about the RasPi, I'd imagine 10x to 100x faster. Something like that.

[@boydpukalo8980]

So you overclocked both CPU cards? I thought you said both had 50MHz 060's? Maybe it is memory bandwidth/speed on the accelerator cards local RAM that is the difference, not the CPU frequency?

[@HoldandModify]

I did not overclock. I mentioned they are 50mhz. That's how they come. I mentioned the RC6 can be overclocked to 100mhz. But I do not have one.

[@hackbuildrestore]

Can’t see join!!

[@HoldandModify]

You have to be signed in. What I don't know is if you also have to be a premium member. That would be a bummer. It also might only show on the desktop version.

[@a4000t]

what the heck is rc5?? you mean rev5,rev6 060s? Which phase 5 card is in the 3000? Mark2 or mark 3?

[@HoldandModify]

Ah ha! Someone caught my flub. Yes Rev not RC. I was using the words printed on the chip I believe. Getting that mixed up. The silkscreen on the cpu. I think it's a first gen Phase5. I haven't been in there too see it in a long time. I do recall it being an early version.

[@SledgeFox]

Yeah! Benchmarks of 060s! I loved my Cybervision 64, regretfully I also didn't have a flickerfixer for it, so I had to use 2 Monitors. I noticed, you did not show the PCB of a Cybervision 64, you showed a S3 Virge board while the Cybervision used a S-3 Trio 64 and it's famous Roxxler chip. I know, I know... I shut up. 😁 Have a great day and thank you very much! I can't get enough of your videos. And in 4K... It's amazing.

[@HoldandModify]

The screenshots were from the web. I may have grabbed wrong ones. The flicker fixed is missing from mine sadly.

[@SledgeFox]

@HoldandModify 🙂

[@Daimo83]

I forgot to say last time, get a camera with a wider fov or stand further back.

[@HoldandModify]

You don't like me RIGHT IN FRONT OF YOUR SCREEN. :) (yes I need to be further back, a lens one day!)

[@Daimo83]

@@HoldandModify Nothing personal just feels awkwardly intimate haha

[@thebigmoa]

Thanks Q for the head to head. I really find these video's informative. I've got an Amiga 600 and would like to upgrade it so I can do this kind of stuff on it. What upgrade would you recommend? I was thinking a Vampire V4 Mandrake as an upgrade? Does anyone else have a suggestion? I'd very much appreciate it. Cheers.

[@HoldandModify]

PiStorm should work in an A600. I think there's a TerribleFire product for it too. If I recall I might even have a video for one of those 030 cards for it. I think they have FPUs now too. I'd have to search back through my own videos! lol

[@thebigmoa]

@@HoldandModify Cheers mate, I'll search up what you've suggested. On a side note, the video series and channel is great. Awesome to get some Jedi tips from someone that is a master of their craft. Looking forward to the next video, "now I'm done with this reply" :)

[@HoldandModify]

@ haha thanks!