Retro Video Game Market EXPOSED!

The graded video game market with Wata and Heritage Auctions has had a light cast upon it in an investigative Karl Jobst video, revealing a seedy underbelly.
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➡Watch Karls video @ • Exposing FRAUD And DEC...
#wata #gamecollecting #retrogames

[@PatTheNESpunk]

What do you think about Karl's video? Are you surprised or shocked by the info revealed? ➡Watch Karls video @kzbin.info/www/bejne/qKevd3iebLtkbqM

[@ruffnekchicken7862]

Karl's video is very informative. The fact that the people behind the 1980's coin bubble are also behind the 2020's graded game bubble is astonishing!

[@mirabilis]

...not that shocked.

[@MrMegaManFan]

I watched Karl's video earlier this week and I thought he did a fantastic job. I was very pleased to see your appearance near the end giving your thoughts about how these shady operators were abusing our love of retro and trampling on the hobby to make a buck.

[@joshuaupham5993]

You have been taking about this for awhile Par.

[@officespace7777]

Not surprised. I believe it. All of it.

[@lostevesy]

Yep .. the people grading the games, auctioning the games and buying the games. All the same people

[@pbailed8007]

And they’re all slimy scumbags and apparently when he got screwed from the “coin bubble” of the 80’s , we didn’t screw him hard enough.

[@devilmikey00]

@@pbailed8007 He probably didn't even get screwed. He's the guy who probably laughed all the way to the bank while everyone else was left holding the bag when it crashed.

[@juhomantynen4638]

@@aceone2156 the problem is much larger than that. I'm a victim of this even though I haven't spent a dime on sealed retro games. I mainly buy games for my casual collection through ebay, sometimes I might throw in double the money for a cib. The result of this market manipulation is that people flood ebay with ridiculous pricing on complete in boxes and even individual cartridges. It's way harder to find affordable retro games now than it was 2 years ago. Obviously I can find them, but it's tedious and more often than not I end up overpaying for a game I want in my collection because I actually want to spend time playing it. The manipulation has made the whole market just insane and it's totally manufactured and not organic. I want to pay market price, not some tycoon's inflated price.

[@ReservedInvestments]

The fact that we have a million dollar video game means absolutely nothing. This is 100% correct! Well said, Pat!

[@danhalo1405]

especially when people that graded and auctioned this game are also the same that bought the game this has nothing to do with actual real value but rather pure artificially inflationing

[@SlipKnoTfreak1456]

look at some rare games, some go for STUPID amounts of money but so many people don't care cause it's a bad game

[@justsayin4632]

@@SlipKnoTfreak1456 Hence the reason I have no desire for a Stadium Events😂 It’s an objectively bad game! (Rarity be damned)

[@SlipKnoTfreak1456]

@@justsayin4632 DOOD RIGHT?! like fuck that, I'll buy a heap of GOOD GAMES

[@knalleballkalle8365]

It's fucking ridiculous like any collectible item that sells overpriced. If I wanna listen to a music album i'm not gonna pay 6 figures, if I wanna play a game i'm not gonna pay 1.5 fucking million...thank god for internet and piracy. I'm always supporting the artist btw if I like the art I'm always paying the artist, they also need to earn a living.

[@Grindhead_Jim]

Never once have I felt that you were out of line, insane, or incorrect in any way whatsoever regarding this artificial inflation of the perceived value of video games. I have always appreciated you and Ian pointing the finger in that direction, because this practice is a gigantic tumor on the collecting community/hobby. Kudos and respect.

[@dkres82]

Agreed. I always agreed with them too that the prices never made sense.

[@ufcrampage]

I can't believe someone would pay 1.5 million for a game that sold over 12 million copies

[@Faber0k]

I know, theres probably thousands of sealed copies out there.

[@WhatAboutZoidberg]

Karl is an absolute legend for this video. Its very well researched, edited and really shows a scummy set of events that is happening in the retro scene.

[@stickjohnny]

Also just a great education on how speculation bubbles are formed and manipulated by a very small number of individuals. I loved Karl before but the enormous balls it took to expose these people is legendary. I hope he doesn't get sued.

[@juhomantynen4638]

He's an absolute legend, and always has been.

[@maxamillion2140]

I always thought the first game to hit a million would be some crazy obscure Stadium Events sealed 9.8 WATA A+ type of deal another decade or two. Not regular Mario games, not now.

[@mjcook3922]

The auction/graded collusion f-ed up and exposed that the retro game market as a whole is manipulated and prices have been driven up in a similar manner

[@timedasher]

Agree, I noticed that those auctions were from popular franchises and it's very suspicious that games from very rare consoles like Atari Jaguar or Turbo Grafx CD doesn't reach those prices or make any headline news when a game is sold as only hardcore old time collectors have interest in those console or know it's existence

[@PatTheNESpunk]

One important note: I state that the coin market has never returned to the heights it experienced in the 1980s. I meant to say it never returned to its heights even counting FOR inflation, not without. It means that even by pure numbers and not taking into account inflation, the 1980s speculative coin bubble prices have never been reached again.

[@TRKTKO]

You're so right Pat it's crazy how intertwined everything becomes, I feel like corruption is unavoidable no matter how nobel cause. Do you think we as consumers should still participate in these markets or is that just contributing to the problem?

[@ReservedInvestments]

Correct!

[@jamesgoss1860]

A lot of this coverage over the past year really spoke to me because I'm into coin collecting and familiar with the history and the current market structure, so the business practices in the video game grading immediately jumped out to me as a scam, largely due to lack of population reports and the obvious self-dealing between WATA and HA. PCGS and NGC are not perfect, but the market is more transparent and they do not control the pricing. There are annual/monthly pricing guidelines published based on the market both from the graders and externally, you can go on eBay and look at the history of sold prices, and you get a guess as to not only the graded population, but also the estimation of how many ungraded exist as well.

[@alexanderh.2604]

Its all about getting EVERY bullshit graded. That’s where the big money is.

[@MyPixelatedPast]

Topic of the week for next Tuesday.. should WATA rated games now be discredited??!!

[@worldsheaviestjamband93]

Pat, are you telling me that my sealed Pilot Wings 64 isn’t going to sell for $185,000? Man my wife is gonna be pissed…

[@g10118]

Was waiting for this one! You guys have been calling this out for YEARS!

[@TheVoidofNothing11]

This is why I still listen to them when so many people give these two crap. They call stuff a lot.

[@devilmikey00]

Most journalist's in the 21st century aren't doing investigative reporting, they do access journalism which is glorified stenography. It's especially bad in games journalism where most larger websites rely entirely on the marketing dollars game publishers spend. They've been trained to never ask questions, just regurgitate press releases in a more digestible way and when you have an opinion make sure it's neutral or positive. That's not to say there aren't any good games journo's but they are few and far between and usually independent. So, when stories like what's been happening in sealed graded games comes across their desks, they do what they know. Take it at face value and stay neutral or positive. You never know if heritage or wata or some rich dude involved might spend some ad dollars, you know?

[@brandname6]

Dude look at afganistan! How was there not more reporting leading up to this disastrous exit? Even here in canada , no reports of the Taliban re emerging. Then its just like bam! Oh yea we got this going on here , but we didnt think it was good enough to report on ?!

[@socializard1]

@Hamburger Stalker project veritas is a trash outlet for brainwashed suckers. all you have to do is read about who their major donors are and how they operate. people don't go to them to learn anything, they go to have their hairbrained conspiracies verified by manipulative reporting.

[@AnonymousGentooman]

That's an inherent problem of monetizing journalism, a corporate news outlet will never report on something that could contradict corporate interest. State owned journalism is not the answer either, as they will never report on something that could put the state in a bad light. Independent journalists are an interesting case, they often rely on donations, so they can't report on something that would make them lose donors, if the donors mostly fall into one quadrant of the political spectrum, they will not report on anything that could go against the interest on said political quadrant, this is why it's so common for independent journalists to push either a far-left or far-right agenda instead of just reporting the truth and letting people come to their own conclusions. In my opinion, the only way to somewhat guarantee someone is telling the truth, is when they do it for free, as they can't lose anything from doing so, this isn't flawless, as people still have personal biases, but if they twist the truth to fit their narrative it's actually *their* narrative, not the corporations', not the state's, not the donors'.

[@socializard1]

@@AnonymousGentooman or maybe a peer review board of sorts with representation from various spots on the political spectrum. Eh... you're right, no perfect way about it. You just have to gather what you feel are three sources with the least bias, with at least two being generally considered slight left or slight right, try to cut through the bull and get a sense of the meat of the story. Maybe hard to do since no one likes to think their own news sources are too biased. Real news would be dry and sterile. As you said, that doesn't sell and sadly I wonder if people want to be sold more than they want an unbiased opinion. Actually, that's not it and is too cynical. Probably corporate news doesn't care what we want, they just want to sell us. I believe it'll change eventually. It'll have to.

[@sonixthatsme]

Just stay away from sealed games and graded games, easy. And as a bonus you can play the games.

[@DanielRivera-on5qh]

They're making it harder for people to afford the games

[@ScooterinAB]

People who are smart will. People who aren't won't. The latter is the problem, as they just fuel these prices.

[@neoasura]

@@kylemears9356 Thats what Im doing, I'm playing the long game, I'll wait for the crash, which will happen. Then I'll start collecting the games I enjoyed.

[@richardtheconquerer]

Another thing pointed out in Karl's video is so much of the "value" seems to be tied to the grading which is sketchy at best. He showed one game that basically got a perfect score but you can see an obvious rip in the shrinkwrap

[@madhighgamer1386]

karls video was one of the best youtube docs ive ever watched and blew my mind how much info was just public waiting to be put together and he effing crushed it and them!!

[@GenerationDown]

My father in law found a sealed NES Mario Bros stashed away in his closet since Christmas 93 when he realized the system bungle he purchased for under the tree had included a Mario/Duck Hunt cart. He didn’t know it was worth anything and just gave it to me to open when we started playing the old NES again. I was shocked! I put it on eBay and after a few auctions received a total of $1000 on auction. This was about 8 years ago. The condition was flawless. Complete with toys r us sticker and all. Seeing these million dollar listings made my stomach drop. Thank god this all came too light. I don’t have to be depressed about it anymore!

[@buttguy]

I’d bet good money there are at least 100-200 sealed SMB carts out there. Probably more. There’s absolutely no logic behind paying that amount of money for such a common game that they sold so many copies of…except the instant recognizability of “super mario brothers”, the one NES game that every person on the planet knows of. They did it because it was good for news articles to have such a well known game. If it was something obscure (to the average person) like NWC or stadium events, the articles wouldn’t have gained traction.

[@GenerationDown]

@@buttguy you’re so right. nailed it.

[@buttguy]

@@GenerationDown it's the whole "mom digging through boxes in her attic now because her son definitely had that damn mario game" syndrome. That's what makes these articles spread. Hence the insanely pricey mario 3 and mario 64. All Mario games for name recognition.

[@benjammin8184]

Karl did such a good job collating all the evidence. He's really stuck his neck out and we should all be behind him.

[@mccarthy5825]

Well said mate.

[@benjammin8184]

@@mccarthy5825 I mean when the inevitable slander suits come in. I'm still waiting on Billy "the bully" Mitchell's comeuppance. RIP Benjamin Smith!

[@colonless7512]

Good thing is Karl has the support of some game devs if he does get sued to help with money for defense

[@mccarthy5825]

@@colonless7512 id definitely be putting a few bob into the defence fund for this. I can't stand the fact these rich scumbags are pillaging a beloved hobby to just get richer. It's repulsive.

[@benjammin8184]

@@colonless7512 Yep and he has a legal defence Kickstarter from back when Billy was threatening himself and others with frivolous bullshit.

[@brendanroberts1310]

Most people in the retro game scene knew these auction prices were shady.

[@slimthumbtak]

Definitely. All this is well known by those who know. But the video is a great resource for having it all presented in one place, clearly and effectively. Great tool for those not in the know as well as those in the know.

[@mjcook3922]

The overall high prices of the retro game market in general is shady and questionable. We shouldn't be surprised that this crap has been going on for years with rare games.

[@Xyspade]

"Wherever there's money, there's corruption. 100% of the time." -A friend of mine, 2020

[@dfchang813]

Karl is literally a thousand times smarter than 99 percent of video game “journalists.” I am not surprised at all nobody cared enough until Karl turned his attention to this.

[@buttguy]

I have been telling people this was exactly what was going on for months and months now. Seeing Karl’s video was satisfying since I was going with a gut feeling from what I’d been seeing and not actually doing any research into it. It was pretty obvious this was the situation.

[@MrMegaManFan]

I need a drop board where I can hit a button where Pat says "IANNNN!" and another where Ian says "Big big BIG news!!"

[@ericstephen1318]

BIG BIG BIG news was read in Ian's voice btw! lol

[@antaviaclefbass3011]

Rich people ruining things to make even more money, what a big surprise 😑

[@godzillagorilla986]

As a fan of speed running and GOLDENEYE 007 I've followed Karl for a long time. He's a gifted and talented person. (An absolute legend) It's great to see him use his powers to do something that may help change the world as we know it for the better. Karl is a beacon of light in a dark world of collecting.

[@Faber0k]

Same here! Goldeneye speedrunner in my spare time as well, I too have followed karl and his up and coming youtube channel for a long time. He really has been killing it lately.

[@anthonyxavier6300]

Saw his video yesterday and I got to say eventhough I am not shocked about the news because I thought it was shady when the sealed NES Mario went for millions but the fact how Karl went in depth with his theory and backing up with evidence. He really did some amazing research.

[@marklehman5272]

I live in Lancaster PA. Just press play is my local gamestore. The collectors here have been aware of zacks involvement in this behavior for a long time but could never prove it. This was incredibly vindicating.

[@josechai4082]

Finally this gets exposed, in all the reseller groups everyone keeps saying “get those games graded” they really hyped up and manipulated the market. A great doc as well. I also think RETRO RICK has fallen victim or is in it with them with his latest Mario 3 graded game that he received in weeks when people have been waiting over a year and the game gets a 9.4 kind of how they used pawn stars for their propaganda. kinda fishy and he compares prices only on heritage.

[@josechai4082]

@@realpoopypants may I add that, that video also was made into a raffle were you comment the nostalgia or whatever to win a ps5 kinda made on purpose to hide all the comments questioning any involvement or anything in relation. I’m sure there are but they are buried in all the participant comments.

[@MrWolf12000]

Karl's video was fantastic, this was a nice companion to it.

[@MB-bt9km]

New subscriber, learned about you from Karl's video. I'm a video game enthusiast 35 years with an interest in collecting and the rich assholes rolling in to scam honest collectors and suck the life out of the hobby are the worst kinds of leeches. Hope the SEC investigates and the law comes down on them. Great show!

[@scotthelgert6473]

I always liked and respected the conversation about these shady market maneuvers made by people. Good looking out for people.

[@Krushak8888]

It makes me smile see my youtube filled up with this... and come full circle between you, Karl and many others

[@damienater]

Thank you for speaking out RESPECT. I collect games for the love of gaming and hate this bs activity.

[@mjcook3922]

The part that mystifies me is that everyone immediately notices how the graded/sealed auction market seems fishy....but they deny or find it hard to believe that this type of price manipulation has been going on in the overall retro video game market over the past 4-5 years with the rapid rise in prices.

[@neoasura]

The manipulation started when they posted that Yahoo article about Stadium Events years ago.

[@alicesavage69420]

Think of this, though, if the market crashes, the rest of us can finally afford some of the good shit!

[@GustavoValdiviesso]

Karl's video is amazing. Everyone remotely related to game collection should watch it.

[@ThePaulWeber]

I appreciate your coverage over the last few years on this topic. Game collectors will continue to collect. Speculators will be caught holding the bag.

[@ViViDG]

I’m glad these crooks are getting exposed.

[@EmeraldLavigne]

I'm excited for our neo-liberal regulators to at best fine these crooks a small fraction of the profits they've made & for everything to just go back to trundling along as business as usual!

[@bassguitari928]

Something smelled fishy the moment a copy of SMB sold for more than a CIB Air Raid.

[@matthewbryant2972]

I "investigated" the collectable scene when it began booming during lockdown and found a FBI action agains Beckett Grading's CEOs in 2019... investigating bribes to state politicians in the companies state; related to legislation allowing banks to give loans on graded collectables...

[@PatTheNESpunk]

Wai wha

[@michael_stout79]

We need to expose these people on card collecting, damn these collectionist are getting out of hand

[@scotthelgert6473]

The sill bidding has gotten out of way out of control in the card market and unfortunately for TCG's it looks like there's a lot of counterfeiting that is still passing by unnoticed.

[@shaman666]

Karl did one heck of a job in his video. Here's hoping they don't go after him after that.

[@FlyingV555]

I love his videos about speed runs

[@lordrayden3045]

Go ahead and go after him The truth is an absolute defense in any court case brought…… and better than that would be the discovery

[@Ry22futbol]

Thank you for contributing to Karl’s video! I’ll be interested to see the updates on this story!

[@retromegabitsegadude]

Pat and Ian thank you very much for shining a light on this massive scam. May this mark the end of slabbing retro video games.

[@ES-qm5hr]

People wanted to make money from their collections, so they were happy to see others build up the bubble. I saw plenty of people saying they were going to get their games WATA graded and flip them. If they were collectors, then they would have known that the auction prices were bullshit. The week that Mario 64 sold for a record price, I found a mint sealed Mario 64, Banjo- Kazooie, and Kirby: The Crystal Shards in a local classified for like $50 each. And I don't even live in the United States! These are not rare, or difficult to find games, most of them sold in the millions, and many are still being pulled out of basements every week.

[@Alex-jk1dp]

Lol you better bought them for that price. They are maybe not rare in general but super rare for that price - if real.

[@DutchGameHunter]

Hopefully wata will lose a lot of customers now this has come to light. This story should hit the front pages as fast as possible.

[@_NoDrinkTheBleach]

It's clear that this is a bubble that will burst in a huge way. But it's also going to ruin the vintage/classic gaming market. Because of these ratings and such, people will forever assume their CIB copy of Jekyll and Hyde is worth way more than it actually is. I just hate the idea of collecting games for anything but playing or preservation. I was excited to see Karl's video on the subject and was pleased to see a certain NES Punk make a few appearances.

[@kage5439]

Let it crash and burn the disgusting greed is out of control.

[@quibquatch3975]

Imagine buying video games for clout and status loooooooooooooooooooooooool, showing off sealed games for so much pussy bro. Shits a fucking joke now

[@bowserjr.4789]

I say let it burn, I’m sick of the ridiculous prices.

[@SwissArmyTin]

Let it burst, absolutely tank the market and drive out everyone who isn't passionate about the games themselves. Then those of us who do can have fun again without having to break the bank

[@skins4thewin]

You guys have always given smart, accurate & experienced information as long as I've known you. You guys CLEARLY know this market as well as anyone & there are not many individuals I'd trust more than you when it comes to the video game scene & the happenings within it. Anyone not smart enough to realize this and actually thinks that you're a crazy person when you discuss this stuff is simply too dumb to recognize the truth. Most of the time ppl are in disagreement with the things you guys say not because they think it isn't true but because it goes against their interests in some way, often over something as petty as it being something they purchased & they vehemently want to defend said purchase. Some ppl are literally blind to the fact that they could ever make a mistake. Those sorts of individuals are honestly not even worth paying attention to.

[@EmeraldLavigne]

Good on you guys for staying on top of this!!! Thanks, Pat & Ian!

[@pissedvideogamer]

Thank you for calling out the greedy. Now how can we punish them? Grifters gonna grift.

[@SgtSega]

Don't pay overpriced games and wait it out. Emulate them if you have to.

[@jengelenm]

It’s devastating they abused the video game collectors market and took away the fun for all the collectors. Maybe it’s even worse for all the hard-working honest auction houses, who are passionate doing a job, loving art and everything collectible, cars, comics, coins, antiques,...it’s a smash in the face for everyone!

[@DenkyManner]

All Karl's videos are great. They are usually about speed running but he's developed a sideline in in-depth investigations. His stuff on Billy Mitchell is also great. As for this topic, I was surprised just how deliberate every facet of the market manipulation was. Nothing about this boom was accidental, planned years in advance. I hope the chief architects face punishment and get banned from running companies in the future.

[@blakethorn1953]

This is proof that game journalists need to do actual journalism instead of writing click bait articles and trying to gin up controversy by taking every hot take and trying to politicize everything in gaming...

[@quezcatol]

This is what we all suspected BUT graded, sealed and unique games will climb into insane prices even without these scammers.

[@PatTheNESpunk]

Yes, but now this ruined any "natural" market price progression that existed.

[@dennismcdonald2607]

Same crime as insider trading in my eyes. Should be frog walked to jail!!

[@themegaman91965]

Walk into any retro game store and you are almost guaranteed to leave sourly disappointed. Retro game stores are no longer the same as they were 10-15 years ago. Go to a Gamestop in 2003 and there were classic SNES and NES games galore. Nowadays you're lucky if the nearest retro store isn't full of disposable sports games.

[@DanteFeraco81]

I knew something shady was going on with all this, I had a feeling something was also fishy with the grading as well I always go with my gut feelings. Good show Pat and Ian always a joy watching you guys!

[@Blue-zw8er]

One would have to have brain damage to NOT think something shady is going on with all this. It is fairly obvious.

[@mjcook3922]

These auctions made it uber obvious some kind of manipulation was going on and I have a feeling the retro game market in general has been affected by these shady practices.

[@DanteFeraco81]

@@mjcook3922 most deff has affected the general retro game market, for games that are so common selling for crazy amounts of money, I’m only buying from actual collectors and video game conventions, I see Pat all the time in Pa at Too Many Games!

[@hellboundTX333]

The tip off was that real collectors don’t buy sealed games, and most could care less about the grading altogether.

[@TheVoidofNothing11]

I just got a limited run game in the mail today. A lot of people buy them to keep sealed. I opened that box and tore off that seal right away lol. I will say I wanted to get my final fantasy nes graded though, but not with the intention of selling. Other games I don't care. I open and play.

[@hellboundTX333]

@@TheVoidofNothing11 I’ve got a lot of CIB stuff I’ve owned for 20 years, but i traded off all my sealed stuff a while back simply because i don’t need a game i can’t open and play. If they make s big profit off them, good for them.

[@TheVoidofNothing11]

@@hellboundTX333 I just don't understand not investing in something with actual equity. Yeah I get the not being able to open and played. I still have a lot of sealed games, but it's all stuff I plan on opening and playing. I had traded all my older console games years ago now I want it all back lol. Especially my SNES and Gensis games.

[@neoasura]

I had no idea the same people were involved in the coin bubble in the 80s, my old man was a huge coin collector back then, only to give it up in the 90s, it was kind of sad.

[@maxxam3590]

I explained this issue to my wife two days ago, and to my dad yesterday. Their jaws dropped, mostly because they think video games are all about friendly fun, cool characters, smart coders and sweet artists. They didn't think the industry would have corruption, scams, ties to organized crime, etc.

[@EmeraldLavigne]

You tell them about Actiblizz & Ubisoft's history of actively protecting & promoting sexual harassers and abusers and predators yet?

[@GawainSSB]

All these game "journalists" are in on it too, I'm sure. Pay em money and they'll say whatever you want, that became extremely obvious over the last 10 years or so.

[@jamiehakesley3156]

Wata the worst thing to happen to this hobby

[@madjoe8622]

When you think about it. In a 100 years, when the wrapping on these boxes fells apart in the case. The only difference between these "millions" $ item and a nice unsealed box (that will worth maybe a thousands $ at this time) will be the WATA case. It's insane when you think about it.

[@theshep]

Oh by the way, a good point about a hobby not needing to have "value;" right now I'm a diecast collector, and often what I see is a lot of people out there asking "what's this worth," "is anything you have worth a lot?," etc. The first question my day job's CEO asked was "Do you have anything that's worth a lot?" I mean, maybe, but again that's whatever someone is willing to pay for it. And it has to be actual rare stuff... most diecast models are made by the millions... very little of it is actually rare. I'm not interested in buying a pink beach bomb prototype or a purple Olds 442, or a 1995 67 Camaro Treasure Hunt. I just do this for the enjoyment and variety. And it gets me out of the house once in a while.

[@BryBry2ply]

Thankyou Pat and Ian for exposing this over the years.

[@sjm4306]

Wow, there needs to be a criminal investigation and prison sentences issued for those found guilty.

[@devilmikey00]

Problem is that there is a better than solid chance this is all technically above board because it the US and it's never not shocking what is and isn't legal when it comes to white collar crime.

[@worldsheaviestjamband93]

Every dislike is from people that loaded a bunch of money into OTIS. You both have a lot of integrity not shilling that garbage. Thanks for the great podcast.

[@richardpena6836]

Islands in the stream... That is what we are... Thanks for continuing to follow this topic!

[@byteme6620]

Pat, time to sell that atari winter games.

[@TeeVeeGames]

The hostility Karl received is by means no surprising. Even just going on Twitter and off-handedly mentioning "um, someone needs to explain this a little bit", you'll find plenty of people who will defend the seven figure NES game sales tooth-and-nail, presumably while lighting a cigar with a twenty. What I've seen, between dismissive insults, was a handwaving of "precedence and history" behind these going prices and zero links to back it up. I have to watch his video, curious to learn more. It's in my queue.

[@tr1bes]

FTC and FBI will take a quick look on this.

[@roundearthvideogamer6039]

Jim Halperin isn't going against Wall St. this time with their high priced lawyers, that's why they chose to manipulate the video game collecting scene.

[@SgtSega]

It's new and a lot of boomers don't look twice at em.

[@Easyflux]

Karl Jobst brought me here, more than happy to sub. Thanks for sharing your knowledge in his vid!

[@CreatureWillis]

Great exposé! If you were disappointed in the reaction to this story at large by journalism, consider reading Carl Bernstein's 1977 Rolling Stone article "The CIA and the Media". This is not to fully answer all of your questions... just FYI.

[@CreatureWillis]

Also, Pat and Ian are definitely not crazy.

[@stlbarbie]

I was one of the first collectors in 2019. They took me for over 400 games. I have a true story to tell in all documented. I confronted them about it. I confronted WATA and HA.... I tried to get them to address my concerns with not having live auctions at the time because of the virus, I was concerned about advertisement, I was concerned because they were selling my games and Big lots during covid when nobody had money, they actually sold a sale game in a CIB lot... I have all documentation. A lot of the games that are selling for top dollar are my games that I got screwed on. I need advice please. They need to be exposed. I would love to talk to a lawyer about this. Thank you

[@thejackal007]

Karl's video was really expertly done. He's a real stand-up guy and I hope that between your efforts and his, some of this shadiness can be brought to light.

[@Jono1874]

I don't always agree with you two. That being said, I never doubted you for a second in regard to this. Thank you for having the integrity to speak out. You are profoundly appreciated.

[@rilonius2865]

I miss the good old days when retro video game collecting was an affordable hobby. I really hope legal action is taken against those illegal practices.

[@Ammothief41]

Just give it some time, the bubbles gonna burst one of these days.

[@poopy_fingers3324]

What is illegal? Nothing is. Yes, there are some unethical practices going on, but by and large what pat is hinting at is all speculation.

[@rilonius2865]

@@poopy_fingers3324 Market manipulation and shill bidding is illegal.

[@Ammothief41]

@@poopy_fingers3324 kzbin.info/www/bejne/qKevd3iebLtkbqM The companies involved have already been in legal trouble over the coin collecting market.

[@poopy_fingers3324]

@@Ammothief41 and how does that relate to this? Again, all speculation.

[@citypopFM]

Even to me, someone way more familiar with high-end auctions of comic books than games, instantly knew that Super Mario 64 copy that sold for $2 million made absolutely no sense. It shouldn't make sense to anyone but it was so egregious in its ludicrous price when no "collector" claimed the purchase. I watched Karl's video a couple days ago, it was very well-made, well-researched, makes complete sense, and was glad to see Pat be a part of it. These grifters pushing this speculative rigging need to be held accountable.

[@ThomasHostvedt]

Great work guys, thank you!

[@ThomasHostvedt]

I’d love to think my collection is worth several billion dollars but people need to know the truth!!!

[@msamiullah001]

Patt you are the man. Really love you and very glad found your channel although I found it late (like 6 months ago)

[@Drawkcabi]

Great segment guys!

[@zg-it]

What cracks me up is how my friends who aren't interested in video games keep sending me articles about these ridiculous sales. The strategy definitely worked. Until the fraud got exposed LOL

[@oafkad]

Rich folks ruined modern games and now they are going back to ruin collecting the old ones.

[@mehmeh5471]

Right thats why Pat keeps his NWC cart in a bank.

[@thetony5474]

Karl has gone to an insane level with his videos…impressive…

[@juniorsanchez7441]

Im a huge fan of his from his Billy Mitchell/Todd Rogers vids they are so well done

[@TravisSurtr]

Spot on about the money not mattering. For me, the $$ is just an annoying barrier to acquiring the rare items that I want to collect. I wish games (loose, CIB, and sealed) were "worth" only a penny, and I say this staring at my nearly complete CIB N64 collection..

[@kicapanmanis1060]

If the market crashes below what it was before the "pump" it's good, cheaper retro games in the end. And the collectors with huge collections who aren't speculating wouldn't care anyways since they just want have good collections and not make a profit. It would make the hobby more accessible to others who haven't gotten in yet.

[@SgtSega]

I want every generation to be able to experience these classics.

[@jaredcody6869]

A Fantastic video Pat and Ian and i will have to give the video you mentioned a viewing as it sounds pretty damn important for this obviously fake market.

[@zackschilling4376]

Pat has been ringing the alarm for years! Glad people are starting to listen! Those sealed Atari games were the straw that broke the camel's back for me at least. You re talking about something that flamed out at the peak of its production or at least close to it.

[@petertreglia9947]

Loved the part when Pat was giving his 30 sec speech at the end with the background music just like the “for 5 cents a day, you can save this puppy” commercials.

[@SelectaBwoy]

Everytime I look on ebay for certain games and I see the prices and I'm like "are you serious?"

[@SgtSega]

Konami and Capcom especially. SHEEEEEEESH

[@cabbusses]

It frusttrates me that these people would throw around this kind of money on throwing plastic slabs on top of common NES Mario copies while unreleased games and interesting prototypes are still in vaults.

[@juannunez5767]

Coins were and still kind of are big with baby boomers. Gen X, Millenials, and Gen Z should look up that history because that's basically the future of videogame and trading card collecting.

[@johnpenguinthe3rd13]

The comic book speculator boom of the early 90's is another one similar to the 80's coin collecting phase. While SOME (not all, just some) comics from the 30's, 40's, 60's, 70's, 80's and even a FEW modern age comics are worth money, the vast majority of comics from the 90's are worthless (with only LESS than a dozen exceptions). During the early 90's, thanks to speculators, comics were artificially ballooning up in prices. Speculators / investors, most of whom didn't even read comics, were artificially increasing the prices of many early 90's comics. Comics that were going for inflated prices during the early 90's ended up plummeting hard in value a few short years later to the point where comics that were being sold for over $100 could then be found in $1 discount boxes. When all of those comics plummeted in price (with a FEW exceptions), I went crazy buying most of them for $1, NOT because I wanted them for investment purposes (I knew they plummeted in prices and were going to remain worthless) but because I wanted to READ them. It was a HORRIBLE time for speculators / investors who had $100 comics which plummeted down below $1, but it was awesome for kids like me at the time who wanted to READ them. Something similar will most likely happen with video game collecting.

[@ReservedInvestments]

Correct, Juan Nunez.

[@chrissawyer1484]

@@johnpenguinthe3rd13 This is how I collected Valiant and Marvel around this time.

[@thechaosmachine2575]

Been talking a bit about this in the comic book community and speculating is there's been any of this drifting into other collectibles. Could explain all of the weird crap going on in collectibles, maybe not just outside investors.

[@jamesm1]

Coin collecting is the granddaddy of collecting, and its history is full of lessons and trends present in collections today.

[@chaospoet]

My grandmother was big into coin collecting. Even up to 2000 when all the 50 states coins came out and despite the fact that the bubble had long burst but kept saying they'd be worth something. Still not worth shit. But people who "create a market" should be illegal. Coins, video games, the fucking housing market, or trying to make businesses like Gamestop go out of business to make a fortune. And God knows what else I'm forgetting. Enough is enough! To be honest I've always been shocked no laws were ever made to prevent this sort of thing after The Great Depression. Pump up the stock market and create a bubble known as the roaring 20s then obliterate the entire goddamned country. But let's let shitbags who should be behind bars have the legal ability to pull this kind of stuff. It's stupid.

[@JamesLewis2]

I got into coin-collecting in 1993, when I was 8 and didn't realize there had been a bubble; I didn't go further than collecting random old US and foreign coins that people gave to me, and I just remembered that the guide to coin-collecting that I had was from 1989, just before the peak. I partly got that interest from Dad, who liked to collect the old Eisenhower dollar coins and bicentennial quarters (he turned 18 in 1976, and that may have been the year he started going steady with Mom, while I know they first met in 1975). I always saw the slabbed coins as something aspirational, and the same thing happened with the 50 state quarters; nearly every coin I have that isn't current ordinary US coinage was given to me in 1993, with the main exceptions being the Euro coins I kept from a high-school trip to Spain in 2002, a British decimal penny I found a few years ago, and a few Canadian coins over the years.

[@limen008]

Thank you for spreading awareness of these money hungry investors

[@bryanobrien2726]

That video is nuts . It needs to be a miniseries on Netflix .

[@SgtSega]

Next Wolf of Wall Street? lol

[@treyprice04]

For a $1.5m game they have to grade 7,100 copies at $200 each to get their $ back. With the huge news on the game they will make way more than that. Then factor in the Heritage fees and it gets paid back quick, but also consider this was bought to sell out as shares of an investment.

[@shoked99]

We live in a very different age than we did the 1980s, hopefully that means something actually happens.

[@brady9592]

The point that Karl shouldn't have been the first person to connect these pieces is an important one. There's a shortcoming of journalists for not being more researched in the pumping articles they produced as well as not doing any investigative pieces into the rapid rise of prices.

[@MyPixelatedPast]

I’m not into sealed or graded games but if were…I would only turn to VGA knowing how shady WATA is. Will be very interesting to see what games will go for at the next auction after the fraud has been exposed.