Reverb ruins your music

[@JamesonNathanJones]

For more details on the composition concepts that have helped me the most over the years, here's a free eBook➡bit.ly/FREEcompositionguide

[@Centomila]

"Reverb is the sustain pedal of sound designers" - Gandhi

[@MisAnnThorpe]

I think you'll find that was actually Michael Mertens of Propaghandi.

[@Daumat_]

-Gandhi - Michael Scott

[@jakestewartmusic]

Long, cavernous reverb is a wonderful thing. Bone dry, in-your-face sounds are wonderful, too. Knowing when and how to use either, and the many gradations in between, to your creative benefit is an even more wonderful thing.

[@JamesonNathanJones]

Well-placed contrast is a hell of a drug

[@jamesspyder]

A single reverb on a send for (nearly) everything to run through has to be a journey of discovery that every producer goes through at some point. Appreciate your content this year Jameson. These little nuggets of knowledge have helped me get better at writing and how I approach my compositions.

[@VinceFinemMusic]

It's crazy that just yesterday my untrained self was looking up if every voice should be sent through their own reverb or all mixed down into one. I'm very glad you monitor my Google searches and created this video reply in such a timely manner!

[@TheLetterH111]

It really does depend on what you're after. A single reverb on a return track or bus that all your instruments run into is a very simple way to make your music sound 'natural'- i.e. make all the instruments sound like they are all creating sound in the same room. It's certainly not the only way to go but it is by far the easiest way to approach reverb in the mix

[@hermestrismegistus3417]

"Guess what! I've got a fever, and the only prescription... is MORE REVERB"

[@connor_flanigan]

I think if hermestrismegistus3417 wants more reverb, then we should probably give him more reverb

[@nickcarbone8492]

reverb is life...

[@krnflks]

David Byrne talks a lot about the way in which a physical space provided to a musician often times shapes the kind of music produced, very worth looking into if you're a huge nerd.

[@dirtycelinefrenchman]

This is what road musicians battle on a nightly basis

[@Recloh]

May I remind you that a big jumbled mess due to reverb is actually a genre of music and some of us love it

[@RAndrewNeal]

Lol shoegaze

[@Christian-op1ss]

Hi Jameson, I really like your videos, not many people give compositional advice, and in such a clear way. A suggestion for improvement, you often tell about the changes to do, but I think it would make things much clearer and fun to follow along with if you show these improvements on a track. For example in this video if you took one of your old tracks and showed how some concise steps would clean it up and then A/B it. All the best from a fan!

[@craigsurette3438]

I love that organists are functionally playing the building as an instrument.... It was realizing this fact, that made me start to feel less that artificial reverb on synths was a crutch

[@rick49]

Reverb IS my music. I dont play very well, so I need reverb. 😂 Good pointers though. Thanks.

[@marslightsnoise]

Composition is the best arranging tool, arrangement is the best mixing tool, mixing is the best mastering tool, etc. ❤

[@kaitlyn__L]

Nice mantra, gonna steal it 😊

[@luxanmusic]

Adding on to the idea of using a reverb as a send to get everything to sound like it's in the same room, using multiple copies of the same reverb, but with different pre-delay and mix levels can help place instruments at different depths within the same room.

[@ReasonanceHead]

if you do three, and pan them hard , thats also cool. I think waves has a reverb plugin that does that, chris lord or something its called.

[@alecdurbaville6355]

If you think on a more modular fashion you only need the one reverb to have different pre delays. Either by using something modular or using a standard mixer arrangement by using delays on sends and then sending the delay returns 100% into the reverb return.

[@Aerie-Music-Official]

Subbed halfway through the video, I can tell you know your stuff. Keep it up man, thanks.

[@DerekPower]

My name is Derek Power and I have a reverb problem. And I love it =D

[@JamesonNathanJones]

Same

[@Reg-Edit]

Just like any special effect, it no longer becomes special if it is overused

[@rick49]

I love how you dont say, "See you next time!" Very refreshing.

[@leestanford2452]

As a lifelong classical pianist with a penchant for Chopin Nocturnes as well as electronic music, I think this is the best channel on KZbin.

[@serratusx]

I’ve noticed that a lot of bedroom pop producers often choose some very weak sounds and swamp every layer in this fog of reverb obscuring any punchiness or energy, unlike all the classic hits from the same genre. In fact it’s so common I think it’s almost become a style or genre of its own 🫤

[@regularmenthol]

Super, super helpful thank you!

[@croay]

Many thanks, my mixes are too perfect and well made. I needed a way to ruin them and make them sound like something made by a human (not a god) and you helped me a lot with that. I appreciate it.

[@mickeythompson9537]

Back in the day, when we only had one reverb, this issue didn't arise! :-)

[@LifeOnHoth]

It is also true that most people that worked with sound and mixing bitd was professionals. I have mixed and produced with one reverb (two at most for special cases) for as long as I can remember. I aint a pro, but it's fairly obvious that it's wrong to insert a reverb on single tracks just by using the observation you made here hehe.

[@THR-zf6ti]

Super tip! Thanks! No mish mash mixes in Ambient Music

[@AndrewEccles-l3i]

Great advice. Thank you.

[@pejicandrej]

Thx for that video. It's something that, while already knowing, I still struggle with, and a factor that differentiates so much of the bad ambient from the good that's floating around. I'd argue people see ambient as easy cause you can get there by your initial case (lots of reverb on everything), but they always lack the clarity and intent of good ambient music.

[@swanofnutella4734]

I advocate a single reverb 98% of the time. Although you can adjust the decay of the same type of reverb on different instruments and, used tastefully, it will still feel cohesive. As though some instruments are 'accessing' different, more cavernous areas of what remains, the same space. If you're using a boutique pedal/unit, you can run individual "passes" on different instruments or groups of similar instruments, then adjust how those "passes" are mixed with the dry tracks. In this process you decide where instruments exist in the virtual space. If you do this, I suggest using a VST until you're almost done with your mix, so you're really happy with what you're doing before you create what are now sound files instead of a "live" processed effect. Being thoughtful of how many "passes" you're doing, how loud you'll likely mix them will help keep them tame. As suggested, things can get muddy if you're not careful. Great video, as always. Cheers.

[@WhoDarez]

I use a long reverb on ONE track. Preferably a root note that i can play around. Really sets the mood.

[@EricRaymondSF]

Very helpful. Thanks for taking the time to put this together!

[@cranklabexplosion-labcentr8245]

Me (who’s been writing atmospheric black metal the past few months): ohhh… gotcha.. I’ll stop using reverb for every instrument I guess..

[@marcus_ohreallyus]

When I started (only recently)...I drowned everything in reverb with Valhalla Supermassive. Each subsequent song I've made has had a little less until there's almost none and it's really helped with clarity in my layering. But I still think there's a place for it here and there.

[@brianbergmusic5288]

Funny you should also mention guitars after that pipe organ point. Electric guitar can be similar to that pipe-organ analogy; namely the solo lead guitar with: boost >> amp with gain >> cab >> delay + splash of reverb (that typical 80s guitar hero sound). Common advice is to practice guitar on a dry+clean amp so that "you can judge the playing without the effects covering up the mistakes. However, I believe that the vast majority of that "covering up" is actually the delay and reverb. Practicing that solo on a harsh *distorted* tone with NO time based effects/reverb is very unforgiving if you have poor string muting, etc -- the distortion amplifies the mistakes as well as everything else. Thanks for this helpful reminder... which is unusual coming from someone of the 'ambient' spectrum. I also use that "send" advice... ... primarily because my computers are usually mediocre for specs.

[@johnd7564]

Your mention of altering your organ playing style based on room size reminds me of a guitar truism: play the effects. It rarely makes sense to record dry and effect later, and your video is a good reminder that this applies to reverb as well as more tone-centric tools.

[@JamesonNathanJones]

Very true. Applies to synths as well. Good point.

[@0lgarythm]

It also applies well to synths. Switched my beloved and long time owned prophet rev-2 to a single jack a year ago after spending good time with the p5 which is mono. I'll never switch back. Mixing has become dramatically much easier. It even feels more powerful and present, less blurry and spectrum eater, as the sound is now focused and gets more clarity overall. I realized very soon after the switch the spread pot is a trap 90% of time. Post processing gives me any stereo field I could be missing sometimes

[@nanocyde_artist]

I have both jacks of my Rev2 going into the mixer but if I keep the pan knobs in the same position as each other, no stereo field. I agree that it can sound very nice in mono.

[@jeremyjohnson7676]

Vangelis used A LOT of Lexicon 224 Reverb for his Blade Runner Soundtrack. And it sounds AMAZING. Because he knew exactly how to use it and how to integrate it into the mix. And of course, the Lexicon 224 is just legendary because it never ruins your mix. Try it by yourself, there are many great emulations out here. ReLab is awesome. As for the Blackhole.... it sound great on single sounds but it will ruin your entire mix.

[@LifeOnHoth]

With all due respect, Blackhole is a freaking legend. Based on a legend. :) If you ruin entire mixes with Blackhole - you are using it wrong. Many do.

[@telumatramenti7250]

Well, I ended up getting Eventide "Space" pedal which sounded awesome. It does have a Black Hole preset. Now, I didn't try to send "everything through it, especially not drums but I still consider that pedal to be totally unique among algorithmic reverbs. I always took it with me to indoor live gigs. Synths sound awesome through it, and Black Hole preset with its alien strangeness still has a special place in my heart. All of my synths do go through various reverbs, I find the trick is whether to turn any of them on and by how much. But when I do certain types of drones, - the entire thing is often put through just one type of reverb, and honestly, it sounds way better that way.

[@Mia1Goth]

my favorite reverb is Blackhole, the new Immersive version is even more impressive

[@markkilley2683]

What happens if music ruins your reverb?

[@martingoldmannmusic]

I always turn my reverb to eleven - can’t help myself :) But seriously, I agree.

[@LifeOnHoth]

Hehe right. And it is with great sorrow that send level is going more and more down as u create. :P

[@ChunterInfo]

Blackhole because you got sucked in and couldn't get back out I remember taking a peek at music "from the time fifths were considered dissonance" and realized those monophonic or near monophonic sounds are awesome in big reverb

[@jaixiviii]

Mono a Mono!

[@Zaccyonline]

This cleared my skin, clipped my nails, washed my hair and whitened my teeth. Thank you. Off to play my moog.

[@sapinit4322]

+ Abbey Road trick: EQ before sending and EQ the reverb as well to filter out the mud. Another experience - try to use delay (or better delays) instead of a reverb and you will be surprised that sometimes works it even better

[@JamesonNathanJones]

Absolutely

[@kaitlyn__L]

Yeah, delay first and then reverb to taste after works much better than dry right into reverb. Chorus and delay, often doesn’t need reverb at all.

[@michaelkonomos]

Love it! I think what often trips me up is thinking about an instrument in isolation, effects and all, when I need to think about it as a player in the larger “orchestra” of whatever track I am creating. It’s so difficult to EQ out really lovely low end from a synth, or reduce or even take out some reverb sends in the interest of overall clarity in the track, but sometimes it has to happen!

[@JamesonNathanJones]

Part of the reason I think my mixes got better when I started using more hardware synths is a would turn a filter knob further into extremes than I would an eq plugin or something with visual feedback. Once I started cutting mercilessly just to see what would happen, I started to notice a big difference both in and out of the box.

[@michaelkonomos]

@@JamesonNathanJones Yes! I watched a video a couple months back on NIN production and the guy talked about EQing the lows completely out of the guitars. There would be all these guitars and they were basically high-passed with SO much distortion. My brain was like, "no! that will sound terrible! The low end it the best part. I hate hi-pass!" But I tried it and sure enough, that's the trademark NIN guitar sound. It's awful on it's own. But mixed in with everything else it sounds amazing. I feel like there is just such a different approach when you are playing one synth with an effects pedal vs. trying to actually compose a track. The latter is what I am mostly interested in, so I am learning all I can to "play the studio as an instrument" like the man says.

[@kaitlyn__L]

Yeah, this. My synth has a preset low-cut shelf on its HPF, I like to enable that (unless it’s a bass part specifically) so there’s less EQing to do later - even though it sounds slightly “thinner” on its own.

[@michaelkonomos]

@@kaitlyn__L That's smart. It sounds scary to my bass-loving mind but I need to try this!

[@kaitlyn__L]

@@michaelkonomos haha yeah, when I was just building patches I never wanted to put it on but it’s a real brain-saver for layering-in parts :)

[@Jiman-f4r]

Thank you very much🙏

[@thejontao]

On the creative side, particularly if you are using analog/organic instruments, putting your instrument through a rather short all-wet reverb is one way of making your guitar or piano not sound like a guitar or piano. When I started making ambient music in the 90s without synths or samplers, that was how I created new sounds. Back then, I was using an old rack-mount reverb and a 4-track Tascam, so I had to bounce everything multiple times. I’d bounce a long forward reverb track, reverse my tape and bounce a long backward reverb track, reverse it again and bounce a medium length forward reverb of the backward reverb track, and reverse it again and bounce a medium length backward reverb of the forward reverb track. Only keep the reverb on the reverb, and use the two remaining tracks for something else. For the reverb tracks, I’d do everything with a rather hard pans, and I’d get these amazing rotating notes and chords slowly emerging from one another while spinning around my head. I miss the old days sometimes. Part of the fun of ambient music and massive reverbs is hearing one chord slowly arise out of another, competing and maybe conflicting for a bit while they are similar volume… like abstract expressionist painters did with paint: let the sound just be sound… let go of the desire to make it into something else…

[@G.Man-]

Wow, your technique sounds promising, do you have any audio examples / tracks?

[@thejontao]

@ I don’t keep any of my 90s music online, but if you give me 48 hours, I can post a couple examples of the technique and send you some links.

[@tetkiktedavi1674]

​@@thejontaocan you link it here?

[@G.Man-]

@@thejontao OK, that sounds cool, thanks

[@thejontao]

​@@G.Man- Here are a couple examples of the reverb technique I mentioned. The low frequencies just kind of feel nice on my ear drums. The videos are unlisted, you can only get there from the links: kzbin.info/www/bejne/kIazan-Dg52IhLc kzbin.info/www/bejne/foiwhpRngdR5gNE kzbin.info/www/bejne/g4qqZoCLo8ujrNk kzbin.info/www/bejne/mYDbg5xno72Kb80

[@iconoclast1970]

Great observations you made in this video. Much appreciated!

[@MontyDatta]

I'm not sure why but the mixed track example you used at 6:42 really did not sound to my ears

[@TexasStarCave]

This is why I've started migrating to VSL MIRPro. Each instrument is placed in a highly tuned space with a specific location that participates in the overall sound. The MIR tools allow me to visualize the exact placement and the exact parameters of the sound stage.

[@synkrotron]

I couldn't work without reverb I have since ditched VST stuff and instead I use a Lexicon MPX 500, which I bought over 20 years ago, and I thought I should make use of it I honestly don't know what I am doing but I now add an EQ before the send to the MPX 500 so that I can apply some low cut I am not trying to achieve any realistic space and am happy to stick purely to being sort of "creative" but everything gets sent to it, so, in that way at least, it is a "single space" but, what is it about reverb? why is it so damn addictive?

[@nanocyde_artist]

Reverb recontextualizes the instruments, forcing your hippocampus to imagine the virtual space. At least, that's my theory. It tickles the 'grid' and 'place' cells in that particular part of the brain and gets you more engaged with the sounds.

[@synkrotron]

@@nanocyde_artist an interesting theory 🙂

[@G.Man-]

Reverb effects kinda try to mimic the ambience of spaces, so adding some reverb to dry / dead recordings, sounds more 'natural'

[@ScottsSynthStuff]

My reverb bus always has a Trackspacer plugin on it, which has its sidechain fed from the vocal bus. You can do the same thing with Fabfilter or any other multichannel dynamic EQ/compressor that can be sidechained. That way it pushes the frequencies of the reverb out of the way of the vocals when there are vocals present, and prevents the mud.

[@JamesonNathanJones]

Absolutely. Great tip.

[@tetkiktedavi1674]

Great video. I learned this back in the day because I had to conserve CPU/Ram and one thing that helped was to stop using multiple instances of the same plugin and use it single instance in a bus instead. Something else that comes to mind: The album antichamber by yannis kyriakides. It struck me by switching abruptly from reverb'd to dry, which I found to be a very cool idea.

[@Daumat_]

Reverb is spretty important in some genres, but it surely can ruin your mix if not careful, still finding ways to work around it :)

[@amado7760]

Thanks Jameson, great insights. I appreciate it.

[@simpson6700]

This is one of the first things i learnt when i looked into recording guitars and drums, having one room reverb for everything, but i wasn't sure if this applies to electronic music as well.

[@DjNikGnashers]

The simple principle of a good mix, is allowing space for all of the individual parts. It's not rocket science, everything in a mix needs a portion of the frequencies available for it to be heard. When everything overlaps, nothing stands out, and gets lost.

[@Turtlpwr]

Really needed to hear this advice, I use waaaay too much reverb

[@fluoxethine]

The more reverb, the better.

[@MuzixMaker]

YES YEs Yes yes sss ss s…..

[@ifiwantyoutofeel]

Reverb at 11

[@tapeexperiments]

I just now got this comment because of all the reverb😅

[@macronencer]

Great tips, thank you! Right near the start when you were describing the way you used to work my brain was muttering "use a bus, use a bus..." Sure enough... :) By the way, another thing I occasionally like to use is reverb ducking. Many effects plugins have internal ducking as a feature now (so the wet signal is suppressed via a sidechain whenever there's a signal on the input), and it can really help in some situations.

[@GOLDENCORE78]

Best tips, ever. Luv U. U open my mind. Thanks you.

[@internalreality]

Amazin video bro

[@DeMoeAurelius]

Thank you for this, I forgot that concept after changing Platform and DAW.

[@theleastsignificantbit4794]

I worked on ambient project with a friend who wanted to put Big Sky on EVERYTHING. Arguments ensued.

[@unclemick-synths]

Being an old fart, when I started out I only had one instance of my GBS mark 2 reverb and had to use a send for everything I wanted to have it on. Insert points were for my compressor (which effectively gave me two instances when I flicked the "stereo" switch to off). I was surprised when I came across people putting a separate reverb instance on each track - it had never occurred to me to do that.

[@zenchiefengineer]

I'm guilty of the same thing. It was actually the Producer/DJ Rinzen who turned me on to Blackhole. I put it on everything. Music libraries that I submit my music to would always return my tracks saying that my samples sound old. I found out it was all that reverb.

[@JobimSynthMusic]

nice insights. I do have an eventide space pedal with the blackhole algorithm but because I play all hardware ,and I'm mostly an improviser, automatically I record the way you described. I'll record a 100% wet reverb track that includes a submix of a few synths and each synth dry in separate tracks. then I might mix the dry synths differently from the reverb submix but my mixes are usually simple and quick to make, I don't have to control many different instances of reverb. also, my daw template has a dry return track for the synths and an fx return track for the effects. that way I have a global wet/dry control of the mix, before they go into the master bus. another thing I noticed is that ideally I have to control my instinct and really lower the reverb track, because otherwise the next day a finished mix might sound too wet on phones.

[@ChainsawCoffee]

Placement in a reverb "area" is a consideration. Imagine the tracks are sound sources in a room. The fainter sources are far, so they get more reverb. The louder sources are near, so less reverb.

[@EversonBernardes]

And they have a reverse relationship with pre-delay: the closer sources get more pre-delay, since the direct will arrive faster than the reverb, while the further sources will have less pre-delay, since direct and reverb will be arriving nearly simultaneously.

[@samprock]

Finally. It's said - reverb is not a must 😁 so it excuses me never using it, almost LOL .... now I wait for the part 2 "pads are unnecessary" 🤪

[@ToreGThomassen]

Great video, thanks 😊

[@panos3246]

The ONLY guy on this planet that really understood reverb and delay was Vangelis 😜 (just kidding of course but there is a minor truth in that....)

[@martinheuschober4341]

thanks for making this - I have the feeling this video was just made for me, and be it reverb or distortion/saturation all of them have the same effect of making the track muddy. if not used in moderation

[@Beatsbasteln]

often times when I feel like a sound could have some reverb it's just because I should use a better sound in the first place

[@DrivenCrane1]

Reverb is nice if you use it with smart mind.

[@okinawa1312]

This is absolutely true.

[@jimrogers7425]

Back in the day, one reverb for the track, one for the vocal, and one for anything else... also optional.

[@IMForeman27]

My organ hasn't sat in a physical space since 2019

[@TaklaMakanMusic]

'Regularly' is one of the many words I can't say.

[@ShadowZero27]

*furious pedal dialing, shoe gazing, and dream popping is heard...

[@danbient]

So my question has always been; if the sound itself has reverb, should you reduce/eliminate that insert in favor of the send?

[@markridlen4380]

I love reverb, and my main trick is just to turn up the wetness of it and get it sounding good with more reverb. If a lot of reverb sounds really bad, a lesser amount of reverb will sound bad but just less bad.

[@genericusername5909]

It’s hall of the mountain king, not dampened studio of the music producer :)

[@drrodopszin]

One way synth players set up their own music/bands for failure is that they record with reverb in isolating. Another one is filling out the bass notes with the left hand. Both are making them impossible to mix. The third one is that cool metallic preset that's so modern because its overtones will clash with the other well-tempered instruments. It's great to start with the creative juice but then turn off reverb and go back and remove those low notes from your parts so that the mixing engineer and the bass player can do their jobs. Anyways, it's always great to anticipate that it's gonna be an iterative process to fit everything together and pack some patience for adjustments.

[@jonsnow4372]

I put reverb on the master

[@tapeexperiments]

I do it all the time. It can be a really nice effect.

[@rkharper]

I can't mix for shit. But that... I knew from the beginning.

[@andrew4982]

Common, Blackhole is not just a reverb, it is much more than that, I am more than sure that you already know that. You may find a better example than blackhole. I was also hooked by the sound of Blackhole in the beginnings, I rarely use it now, because in my view Blackhole is almost an instrument lacking the sound generative part.

[@krazywabbit]

If it’s a particularly wet space, we need a towel.

[@Gnophkehs]

You should always know where your towel is.

[@aaronpolichar7936]

If you use the appropriate re-verb, you will achieve re-noun.

[@bassguitar2709]

I read something lately, that reverb instantly dates a track! 50s plate 80s gated 10s blackhole, etc. Reverb is like salt, too much of it, you've ruined the dish. Delay is the Pepper 🧑‍🍳🧂🌶 Also EQ Verb EQ to cut standing waves and problem freqs/freaks

[@SlaserX]

Hardstyle has reverb on EVERY ELEMENT, it's basically a requirement 😂

[@tomblaze2]

Less Reverb and mostly mono tracks to pan in the stereo filed are Gold standards in my own work - once I started doing this my tracks were far cleaner and better sounding

[@rodnee2340]

Nah! Synth reverb ON, Vintage verb on the Bus ON, Super massive on the full mix ON!

[@nanocyde_artist]

Yes, Patrick, reverb is an instrument.

[@PhaseDeRecherche]

Always put reverb in parallel

[@samsonlovesyou]

Do you have any advice on the logistics of using the mono reverb approach when on guitars when you want to pan the reverb opposite hard panned guitars (so the left guitar has reverb on the right, and vice versa)? Would you put two reverb on two separate sends panned opposite the guitar which is being sent to it? Or use a stereo reverb and use a plugin two reverse the stereo field? Also, you mentioned having one single space to mix into, which makes sense. But how do you approach that with multiple instruments whilst keeping the reverb mono? An identical instance of reverb on each track? Or is there any special technique to do it using sends to keep them mono?

[@jeffreywestcott6918]

Can I ask about how you made might add and subtract reverb from each instrument, over time, in order to add movement within the entire sonic space-time of a song? How you might automate reverb for separate tracks for specific arrangements? It's my understanding that less can be more if done right. For example, before drops= lots of verb; after = almost none. Still trying to figure this stuff out.

[@silas1414]

“More reverb.” - Socrates

[@joegrant413]

This pops up just as I'm thinking of dropping $$ on a Meris Mercury X ;)

[@tapeexperiments]

One more reverb King to add: Brian Eno.🙂

[@stevhard]

Has anyone here used Ambiente from SWAM? Would this accomplish the purpose that he describes: "one instance of a reverb on a send" instead of each instrument getting their own reverb and trying to mesh together? Ambiente uses physical modelling to simulate all the instruments being in the same room, reverberating on each other based on where they are in the room and the size of room, absorption materials in that room, etc.

[@PauLtus_B]

What's the track at the end?