Reverse Flow Smoker BRISKET | The "KAMADO" of Offset Smokers?

[@LightZone9]

Ok James, you are officially the "Alton Brown" of KZbin BBQ channels! After seeing your yard full of grills and smokers,I would like to see a brief interview with your wife to get her take on your "hobby" all of your KZbin success.

[@SmokingDadBBQ]

lol thanks. She doesn’t mind borrowing for a while. Not a huge fan of buying more unless I promise to sell one 😂

[@briandaffern5108]

What would be interesting now that we're heading into the lousy weather months, is to see how each offset performs in the less then ideal weather conditions. Cold wind, rain/snow, sunny/cloudy can play havoc with maintaining steady temps in an offset. Seeing most of us live north of the Lone Star State, finding which smoker's performance is better under these conditions may help the decision on what type to buy.

[@SmokingDadBBQ]

Good idea. Will add that to my I don’t want to be outside today video list lol

[@SausageKingofCanada]

Thank you very much for doing these tests James! Your channel is great for these types of tests and it's really appreciated! You are helping me to make informed major purchase decisions.

[@SmokingDadBBQ]

Glad you like them!

[@lobsterbisque7567]

SausageKingofCanada Agreed! A great channel with tons of answers!

[@Iridtube]

I have a Meadow Creek reverse flow, and wound up lining the bottom with 1/2" square pizza stones (they are cheap on Amazon) to knock down the radiant heat from the baffle plate. Looking at the thermal properties of that material versus steel, steel transfers about 7X better - so the stones act as a great insulator and the difference on the bottom of the food is pronounced compared to without it. Super even.

[@SmokingDadBBQ]

That’s a good idea. Not sure I need it though if not running into any issues stock

[@PubRunner]

The last brisket I did was a 8kg one it didn’t have a lot of external fat and was flexible and it took 20 hours. It stayed forever at the stall. Once I sliced it I found out why. It had about a 4 inch seam of fat between the flat and the point.

[@AndreLederer]

Another fantastic video where James dives into the valuable details. Excellent! If I do the math correctly, that’s 50 splits of wood for one cook. Thus I think I would relegate the use of this large smoker, (if I had one) to larger group gatherings where I would cook more than one brisket. But ya, great video!!

[@2005Pilot]

I’m thinking you pulled brisket at probe tender then did overnight hold? Is this why it came out borderline over cooked? Thanks for your testing and all the information & efforts you are providing 😁👍👍

[@CoolJay77]

A highly valuable video James, pointing important differences in the cookers. It does seem like Smoke North did a great job with the design. I suppose one improvement would be to make the bottom plate removable for cleaning purposes. I'll be watching for head to head video with Huron. Reverse flow is supposed to be less efficient and result in smokier meats, even if cook time is shorter. I wonder whether that will be your experience as well.

[@kmbbmj5857]

Would love to see several of you guys get together and one of you cooks Kamado, one on the offset, one on the RF. Then have someone else slice and serve so you're all getting blind samples and do a bland taste test. With a couple of normals on the panel as well to see how different it is for everyday eating vs experts looking for specific things.

[@henrykrinkle5353]

That was fun, James! Enjoy your methodical explanations and the multitude of gadgets that you put to work. Don't have an offset *yet* but this sure gives me the BBQ itch. Keep up the good work! :) But what in the heck do you do with all of that meat?

[@SmokingDadBBQ]

This brisket was for another video which is five recipes with left over brisket as the point is that it’s easier to cook a full size brisket for better results and have left overs than it is to cook a small brisket for just a few people

[@michaelcoughlin8238]

I watched Chud's RF video series. The thing that stood out to me the most was he is a very experienced direct flow pitmaster, admittedly. He is just now getting experience on RF. Some of his cons are just differences. Also, his comment about not getting much smoke in 2 hours. 1) he cooked too high temp for a RF. He cooked at direct flow temps. 2) Meat only absorbs smoke to a certain point/temp so in actuality 2 hours is probably all the smoke flavor he'll get regardless of cook time. BTW, I do not own a RF. I have a Kamado Joe Big Joe and a COS with some mods including baffle plates, but the stack is opposite the FB. I am still shopping for a proper offset. In your multicooker temp test, do you smoke briskets with that ceramic deflector setup, or do you use the slow roller setup? The plate on the slow roller is metal and has the airgap around the perimeter. I'm curious if it would have similar temps to what you measured here or not. I like your term "work back schedule". I have lots of spreadsheet or iPhone Note pages with my cooking task schedule, but never had a name for it. Whether you invented it or not I'm using it, thanks. Regarding schedule, you referred a lot to cooking duration for a brisket in this video. What temp is that based on?

[@SmokingDadBBQ]

Font is super small but it was 250-270f as the normal temp to compare the three

[@smokingtarheel3003]

Wow, that brisket looks really good James. That's a really nice smoker too!

[@SmokingDadBBQ]

thanks!

[@bobgore1962]

A couple of months ago, I changed my diet completely! I eat meat, (beef, chicken, pork, seafood, and fish) eggs, cheese, vegetables, and some fresh fruit. I'm down 60 lbs, and stronger than ever! This broiler is awesome, and I love the fact that you cooked the steaks perfectly! Thanks for sharing my brother! 💯🥩😎👍🏻🔨🔥🔪

[@SmokingDadBBQ]

Amazing!

[@zulucharlie5244]

Great information and data, thank you. I'm guessing that a reverse-flow smoker makes a whole lot of sense if you're running at -30C in the dead of a Canadian winter.

[@goofsaddggkle7351]

Love that you referenced Chud. When I saw his reverse flow results had the same ‘nope’ reaction. Think maybe removeable clay/ceramic plates (like the heat deflectors that come in the Joe) might be better as they don’t have the same ‘hot plate’ effects as that big plate of steel his reverse flow has. EDIT too soon lol - as you tested plate temps of Kamado in video

[@SmokingDadBBQ]

I think he said his baffle is thicker and closer to the grid. That might be part of it … but I didn’t get the issues he encountered

[@chadw6593]

I suspect Smoke North optimized this intentionally through several prototypes. Brad only had one shot.

[@jamesorr1200]

I’d be *super* interested in using the aeronometer to test the flow in the Joe with and without the Slo Roller. 😳

[@Keith80027]

I guessing the design of each smoker that makes distance from different parts matter in the cooking temp and heat curve. A suggestion for near term cooks would be a pumpkin pie cooked in the pizza oven. What does a pie cooked in a smoke fire taste like, is it worth doing?

[@ericthibault8875]

So far no negatives to the reverse flow! Nice! Do we know when smoke north plans on putting these for sale and what the price looks like?

[@SmokingDadBBQ]

I have asked about lowering the top grate which is so high only ribs fit. a lower option would allow more pork buts or brisket so that just makes sense to me and they said they agree and can do that. I also don’t love the gauge placement. it either needs to be calibrated away from boiling water to reflect the temps where the food is or move. I placed my probe in the probe port on the collector and that solved the issue as it matched the Meater more there than it does in its current location

[@michaelstogner4120]

I have a Lang Reverse Flow. They have been making reverse flow smokers since the 80’s. I have heard they were the first to make the reverse flow smoker but not sure. I also have a KAMADO big Joe. I am seeing very similar cooking results as you. The reverse flow is about takes a little less time than a regular offset. I cannot tell any difference in the offset and the reverse flow as far as flavor. I have never had issues with the bottom plate over cooking my cooks. I think that has a lot to do with the design of the Lang smoker. I love my KAMADO, but you just cannot beat the flavor you get from an offset. I prefer the reverse flow because it just cooks a little quicker than a regular offset. I will be interested to see you go head to head with a reverse flow and offset to see if you can tell any difference in the flavor.

[@williamwilson2624]

That was a tasty looking brisket. Great video as usual, James.

[@SmokingDadBBQ]

Thanks 👍

[@manofwisdumb]

Great video, as usual! I noticed you did not use a water pan on this reverse flow cook, yet I believe you normally fill the integrated water pans with both the Smoke North Huron & Carlisle (traditional flow) models; was there a reason for this? Do you think an added water pan would have resulted in any changes in the outcome? Thanks again for all your informative content! ✌🏼

[@SmokingDadBBQ]

Thanks. Will try it in a future cook. Not sure yet if the gasses need to be tempered with water as they travel further before coming back over the food

[@1airborne82]

I would like to see the double indirect. Tested and use a heat gun on the top deflector plates. So you are not just looking at the plates above the coal. You go to the second set of plates and I think you will be surprised.

[@SmokingDadBBQ]

I will check that. Based of food results I suspect it to be much lower

[@cameronbatko]

Interesting video. Wonder if it is the distance of the baffle plate from the grate.

[@drjdchan]

Great video as usual! I may have missed it but it's still not clear to me what the advantage of a reverse flow would be. Is it just the faster cook time?

[@SmokingDadBBQ]

More useable space in a smaller footprint and about 20% faster

[@tyoglesby5768]

Ok. It was Saturday night so forgive my memory, but I saw a video where someone was saying a soapstone would only get so hot vs cast iron. Again, forgive me if it was you. Anyway, have you noticed that and have you thought about using that “fact” when doing the double indirect method?

[@BehindTheFoodTV]

So the takeaway is that you’re a better pitmaster than Brad. Go it! I feel like you and I both have new additions coming to the back yard James! How are we going to convince Heather and Sarah?

[@SmokingDadBBQ]

lol 😂 i assume his baffle is closer and causing issues that not all reverse flows are destined to have. Girls are great thanks, can’t wait to see what you’ve got coming

[@BehindTheFoodTV]

@@SmokingDadBBQ when you say “his baffle is closer” is that a euphemism?

[@SmokingDadBBQ]

@@BehindTheFoodTV 😂 Canadians can’t say mean things … even via euphemisms In either case, no burnt bark or smoke issues so far in my reverse flow tests

[@KingBjord]

what about an insulation mod for the baffle plate to block radiant heat? you mentioned filling it with water earlier in the video, or is the radiant heat the point? not sure why offset normal vs reverse flow

[@crushingbelial]

Heya James have you measured air flow speed on the echo? I may have missed this but it is certainly of interest

[@SmokingDadBBQ]

No I melted the fan and am waiting for a warranty replacement lol

[@crushingbelial]

@@SmokingDadBBQ am considering purchasing one - very helpful measurement to provide

[@Radioactivechemist]

Amazon has the Kamado Joe classic III on sale for around $1529, which is $470 off the normal price. The III series are almost never on sale so I thought I would share.

[@SmokingDadBBQ]

Right on

[@acousticriff7579]

great call out. I got incredibly lucky and picked one up for $1,299 - hardware store was switching to BGE and had to get rid of. went in to fill a propane tank, never looked back

[@Radioactivechemist]

@@acousticriff7579 Wow, what incredible timing! I am planning on getting one kamado style bbq in the spring.

[@acousticriff7579]

@@Radioactivechemistenjoy it man!

[@bubblehead7680]

Love these videos. Now lets see a UDS. Lol

[@SmokingDadBBQ]

Good idea

[@wayneroland8220]

I love my Lang reverse flow. All i am saying

[@SmokingDadBBQ]

I see why. Not sure why some KZbin hate, everyone I speak with that has one doesn’t say the things that are claimed as weaknesses online

[@__-ul7cc]

Which smoker will you keep: the huron or the reverse flow? I guess you still need to make the comparison side by side of the two, but so far, what would be your thoughts about it?

[@SmokingDadBBQ]

I haven’t noticed any negatives yet. It fits the same in less yard space and cooks 15-20% faster. If it is as good in the side by side I think I will sell my Huron and order a production version of this

[@RandomProjects2112]

Where do you get your splits from? I can only find wood chunks

[@SmokingDadBBQ]

These are furtado farms. I pick up at bbq galore but I have also done delivery from dicksons bbq These are only sold in Canada

[@RCRadioShow]

I can verify that a brisket on a Kamado Joe only takes around 7 hours. I did one earlier this year and I was expecting it to take much longer. I had to rest it in the oven after starting it around midnight it was done by 7 AM. Live and learn.

[@SmokingDadBBQ]

They are speedy for sure

[@ryanb4481]

That is a lot of wood. Maybe I missed it but do you use that much wood on your direct flow too?

[@SmokingDadBBQ]

Yes. 5 logs for 1 hr on it as well

[@tlc2011jlc]

I never needed to cook a brisket on my KettleJo or Green Egg, as I have an offset. If I did dies the radiant heat test mean we should cook brisket fat side down in kettle type cookers?

[@SmokingDadBBQ]

I still prefer fat up and use a foil boat and double deflectors to protect the bottom like how you would do pizza on the egg

[@Pitjunkiescraftbbq]

🔥🔥

[@SmokingDadBBQ]

Cheers

[@igormijic]

Can you add a smoke stack to the kamado to try to get it to draw more air out of it? I saw some pics of people doing it to the Big Green Egg

[@SmokingDadBBQ]

You can but this ramps up heat so instead I have something that vents 4 more air without making temps uncontrollable. Video comes out nov 5

[@igormijic]

@@SmokingDadBBQ cool can’t wait to see

[@garrisonstewart9306]

What's that smoker behind the reverse flow again???

[@SmokingDadBBQ]

That’s the one I own, Huron direct flow offset from smoke north. The echo is the prototype reverse flow I am borrowing to test

[@lamarwilliams185]

You answered a question without giving a direct answer. Can a open in ground pit get the same taste as a off set? I make good brisket on a Weber kettle. I have been to restaurants that use off set smokers. They results are just like mine. Sometimes it’s great and sometimes it’s ok. My question is consistency. If it’s great one day and ok another day. I’ll stay with the kettle for fuel consumption. All these videos. Why nobody answers this question. Harry soo has won completions with the Weber. Who was he competing with? Did they know what they were doing? I can beat a 5 year old in basketball. It does not mean I can beat Lebrun James!!!!

[@SmokingDadBBQ]

Competition scoring doesn’t prioritize smoke flavour in equal proportion to box presentation, injection, glaze and seasoning. So long as there isn’t bad smoke … I’ve not seen any judging reward offset smoke over pellet grill smoke. Harry regularly shows pulling his competition style food off a pellet grill at 160f and finishing in his oven… to my knowledge Texas monthly has never highlighted a single restaurant cooking food on a kettle or pellet grill to 160 and then cooking in a commercial oven (they do use warming ovens for a hot hold) Harry Soo also says over and over his winning ribs and briskets are inedible for the backyard family so not sure I follow the competition benchmark. Kettles or smaller pellet grills and drum smokers all of which a few people can load into a truck or suv are far more common than people carting their 1,000lbs backyard offset to competitions at least in my area So not sure if that’s the direct answer you’re looking for to an indirect question ranging from Harry Soo, to competitions to restaurants but hope it helped… either way with live fire you are introducing variability that largely falls on Pitmaster skill. If a pellet, Kamado or kettle are the most consistent and require the least skill, country style bbq with live coals Rodney Scott style requires the most. A reverse flow offset like this is in the middle. If you can place the logs as I showed 10 times you can cook consistently on this offset

[@lamarwilliams185]

@@SmokingDadBBQ Thanks for the reply. I was questioning smokey flavor. I do a open pit like Rodney Scott with cylinder blocks. I get the same results on a Weber kettle. Just less fuel consumption. The results are inconsistent. It taste good and sometimes it taste great. Everybody’s taste buds very depending on craving and what someone just finished eating. When I go to restaurants. I get the same results as if I cooked it on a kettle. Sometimes it’s great and sometimes it’s ok. I also work in fast food. The key is consistency. A McDonald’s Big Mac and a Burger Kings whopper taste the same if done right. All over the United States. When you leave the United States both burgers taste different. The Burger Kings whopper has changed. I have not worked their in over two decades. I have noticed that they do not hold the whoppers in a steamer anymore. What I’m looking for is consistent great tasting BBQ. Then again it could be my taste buds. I always have left overs. How ever I felt the bbq tasted the day before is normally my impressions days later. Is there a way to get consistent results? A fresh tomato from the grocery store is consistent as long as it is fresh. Backyard tomatoes are consistent if you pick them at the right time. That is what I’m trying to say if you ever experience vegetables from a garden. A bag of your favorite potato chips taste the same no matter where you buy it at in the U.S.A. If it has not been compromised. Long story short. There are too many variables to get consistent great BBQ. Seasoning. I have over seasoned and under seasoned. Wood species, charcoal, outside temp, size of meat, type of meat, type of grill, etc… Thanks for replying again and hope you have many years of great BBQ!!!!!

[@mikecraig8442]

Dude, you have great BBQ content, but you have a bit of a grill hoarder thing going. :)

[@SmokingDadBBQ]

lol I do need to purge again soon. This is borrowed so won’t be forever

[@mikecraig8442]

​@@SmokingDadBBQonly giving you trouble over the addiction that plagues us all. :) I have learned much from you! Only wish I could afford one's those big Joe's.

[@agpmjm]

Wood smoker far more labour intensive than `start and forget` Kamado

[@SmokingDadBBQ]

Yes it’s definitely more involved

[@2005Pilot]

And alot more therapeutic & fun to me! My WSM hasn’t seen a spark since getting my Wrangler 2.5 yrs ago 😂

[@agpmjm]

@@2005Pilot :) My attempts to keep a consistent fire in my (cheap) offset smoker failed horribly... I salute those who can do it