Vise Squad #3: The Ancient Wooden Twin-Screw

[@Migh7yb00sh]

I wish you’d pick this series back up!

[@josephchristensen4578]

I attached a twin-screw vise to the end of my Roman workbench (Woodwork for Humans series) and I love it. The total cost in materials was around $12 (two 3/4"x12" bolts with nuts and washers, a couple lag screws to hold it to the bench, a piece of 2x6 scrap for the jaws, and some faux-leather from Joann's to line the thing). It's great for all the small projects I've been working on. I can sit on the bench and work, or sit on my Woodwork for Humans stool at the end of the bench and work from there. Great series - keep up the good work! Oh - one more thing. I use spray-can graphite to lubricate the threads. It uses isopropyl alcohol as a propellant and the residue is just dry graphite. If it gets on a project, it's really easy to clean up.

[@magiuspendragon]

I remember seeing a video, and unfortunately I can't remember where at the moment, but I think that one of the concessions with the twin screw vice is that you don't always need both screws. If you're most often using, say 3/4 stock, you actually leave one screw alone and use the other to quickly release and clamp the work. The physics works much in the same way as when you demonstrated the ability to hold tapered work. You only havwe to adjust both screws when you have to change stock width or when you have to hold a strange shape. So if you're preparing a project, you would prepare all stock of a sinle width, then change the second screw and go through the next width, and then only at the end do wheird shapes, or osmething like that. By adjusting your process a little, you'd minimize your reliance on changing the second screw. When you manipulated the vice in the video, you often had the vice way more open than you needed in order to insert or remove the stock. *Disclamier: I haven't yet actually worked any wood, this is just what I remember watching/reading, so take it with a grain of salt.

[@Iambjork]

I agree, If you use the free board to wedge smaller stock for boxjoints with just a nudge of the free board in the opposite side of holding you could probably tighten and loose really quickly wich would be preferable in an industry. You would probably wear out the threads a little in the long run but it would increase production. Probably just use both screws with really big stock.

[@AramisWyler]

Aye, like a horizontal leg vice, you can set one end and just use the other. The screw threads were nice and wide, and rock maple, so wouldn't get gnashed easily doing this.

[@jean-paulbaudet2951]

As a manufacturing engineer, I’m going to say the Dominis used it for production. Your leg vise is more versatile for different tasks. But for production of furniture the twin screw would be faster at each stage of planing, joinery and assemblies etc. One set up you would just use one screw to open and close as you work each part and replace for the next. Think about the time you would save planing saw marks of 30 tapered legs or or dropping in each carcass for 10 sets of drawers.

[@Colonel_Overkill]

Thats what I was thinking as well. There is a complete opposite and often counter intuitive mindset for switching from single to serial production and I suspect thats where this piece shines.

[@RexKrueger]

Okay, but i only use one screw on my other vises. Trust me, this one is not faster in any way.

[@jean-paulbaudet2951]

Haha, we trust you Rex. There is the other possibility it’s simply looked cooler, more expensive and impressed clients.

[@elund408]

it would also hold long jigs better without the constant retightening. Their shops would have had large changes in humidity temperature etc. this would have continued working through all conditions without messing around with warpage and swelling.

[@dinosilone7613]

I'm glad I read the comments before replying - I was going to say basically the same thing. You don't need to loosen both screws to get a workpiece out. Once you have it set for the thickness of the boards you're using, you can just leave one screw alone. Another element of the Dominy vise that you may have noticed is the jaw extends a good distance to the left of the left screw. This allows you to use that piece to the left kind of as a leg vice. Again, you'd use the right screw in the same way you'd use whatever you use on the bottom of your leg vise jaw, to set the vise for the thickness of the piece(s) you're working on, and then just leave it alone. You'd then use the part to the left of the left screw as your leg vise for working on the ends of pieces. It looked (in the picture you showed) that the Dominy vise had something lie 6-8” to the left of the screw. I don't know that I'd replace my current vise with it, but I don't think the Dominy's didn't know what they were doing - if the twin screw actually stunk, they could have always put the old leg vises back on. In fact, since this is pretty easily removable, maybe that's what they did, depending on what they were doing that day. (Again, assuming a production shop environment, they probably made a lot of the same kind of parts one after the other, e.g. chair seat day, drawer sides day, etc. )

[@NhyraVirakah2]

I love your history lessons. I learn so much!

[@twcmaker]

Rex is one of the best 👍

[@jonathantillian6528]

Rex - "I thought it'd be the last one I ever needed." Man, that's how I felt about way too many things... _guiltily looks at collections of cards, pipes, and 70's TV shows_

[@Cadwaladr]

I built my workbench about 20 years ago, and I put a twin screw vice on it. 1 1/2" maple screws that I made myself, white oak hubs on them, birch handles, and a 1 3/4" thick white oak jaw. The nuts that the screws go into are some weird brown wood, I think it's from west Africa, and the dust from it is irritating as all hell. But I dovetailed the nuts into the bench top and they look awesome. I've found the vice quite useful, especially when making boxes, because you can clamp a whole box up to 24" wide in it and plane the sides without racking it. I got the design from Fine Woodworking, the article was written by a chairmaker, and he liked the vice for holding chair seats. The loose jaw takes getting used to, and sometimes it gets stuck at a weird angle, and you have to yank on it or whack it, but honestly I love it. The other thing I really like is how the handles I made are one solid piece of wood. You drill a hole through the hub maybe 1 1/16", the turn the handles to 1" with 1 1/8" bullet shaped ends. Boil one end of the handle for 20 minutes, then hammer it through the hole, it squishes down, then expands again and it's permanently in place. Making the handles out of birch helped too, I think, because it's softer than oak or maple, but still strong enough to be a handle.

[@Tensquaremetreworkshop]

Moxon vices have several issues- some of which you pointed out. A further one is that it is two point clamping, so any workpiece that does not pass through the vice causes the face to tilt. There is a version with a swinging plate under the bench, which allows wedge shaped parts to be gripped without the front hubs being at an angle to the jaw. This would permit a bearing to prevent tilt. A twin screw vice with a single handle and torque matching on the screws would give the best of all worlds- working on it...

[@williamh123456789]

Never stop these history lessons. Amazing vídeo. I learned a lot

[@donaldjackson968]

4:40 A whole world of vices. You got that right. Most of them can be found in Vegas too.

[@sanctusletum8522]

I love when you dig in to history mystery. The Thor Hammer with incredible geometry, the antique table by an unknown maker, and now the mastercraft family from days gone and their mysterious choice of tools. I eat this stuff up. Its not just they mysteries themselves, although they stand very well on their own, but your incredible passion for these topics that really makes it such an experience to watch. I love it.

[@windhelmguard5295]

there is some asian woodworker on youtube (don't know the writing well enough to spell out his name), he holds what he's working on using a rope, he puts the piece on his bench, puts the rope over it, steps into the rope and holds it down with his own weight.

[@kristophesankar737]

​@@windhelmguard5295 are you talking about Grandpa Amu? I saw him do that and since then I use that technique a lot to dimension rough lumber as I don't have the space for a full bench yet. Works really well.

[@Adamant4160]

I think it really comes down to the ability to hold tapered/irregular work. It seems like the finer the furniture the less straight and square it is.

[@AntuandeSadExzepury]

I made myself a similar vice from two of the cheapest jacks, or rather from their screws and nuts. It turned out very well! From the remains of the jacks, I made short oblique handles, which are very convenient to quickly twist. I mainly make boxes, chests, etc., so this vise is very suitable for me.

[@cjhification]

My wife picked up one of those turning saws for me from a second hand tool store she visited a friend, when seeing them between lockdowns, and a push pin setting tool.

[@tomandolin9623]

I made myself a twin screw using 30 mm threaded rod years ago without knowing any of this. I just thought it would be strong, cheap, easy to make and hold tapered pieces. Those were the big considerations. It ended up really growing on me. Truth be told, I made it at first without garters and it drove me nuts, I just had to upgrade it. I found that the way I made them also helped with the outside tilting of the jaw, which was also a problem.

[@hdwoodshop]

Wow Rex. I bought the same wood thread thing at an antique store with patina for $15 bucks. Good deal!

[@magicdaveable]

I love your video Rex. I am an eclectic woodworker. You offer a broad spectrum of projects and even better DIY high quality tools.

[@maililistaalterego]

Hey Rex! I built a twin screw vise with $25 worth of hardware. I bought a TR20 threaded rod, split it in three parts and made a thread tap from one of them with an angle grinder and some creative filing. Then I used the tap to make internal threads directly to the hardwood apron of my bench. It is my favorite vise, the only thing I regret is not making it even wider so I could put a whole cabinet carcase in it to do finish planing after glue-ups.

[@benjaminfrayser4392]

I put a twin screw vise on my bench using 1" tap-and-die set. I threaded dowel rods and tapped the bench skirt and a pair of locking nuts. Dowels are secured through the bench and dont move; locking nuts spin in and out on the dowel to hold the outer jaw in place. It was one of my first projects

[@GaryKlineCA]

How're the 1" dowels working for you? I'm thinking of building a low workbench and adding a twin-screw vise like you described. A 1" tap-and-die set would seem more versatile for other projects around the shop than the larger sizes out there, but I was worried that the 1" might not work as well for a vise.

[@benjaminfrayser4392]

@@GaryKlineCA 1" dowel works just fine. I had a problem with vertical racking, but I think this was a design flaw of the verical placement of the dowel holes in the jaw. I.e. i think I put them too low. Another set of dowels fixed higher on the jaw has limited the amount of racking and will get me bye until I want to redo the whole contraption. If you're familiar with the Wood By Wright channel, I followed his build for the inspiration. He has two videos on twin screw lime this and a bench-top mounted moxxon vise.

[@GaryKlineCA]

@@benjaminfrayser4392 Thanks for the response! I noticed some examples of a twin-screw vice showed an outer jaw that dropped 6" or so below the bench top. It didn't make sense to me, but maybe that was to help with the vertical racking you observed. I'll check out Wood By Wright's videos.

[@MrMarkpeggy]

Thanks for the great video Rex. Please be safe and stay well.

[@mcweav2]

Rex, My grandfather had one of these. He would hold the piece in place with with one hand on the vice jaw, then spin and tighten with the screws with the other hand. Swapping hands to tighten the other screw. Doing it that way was easy to place the piece in the vice.

[@MMMS75]

Thanks for some of the pragmatic advice. I’m about to take on a workbench build for hand tools, after being an all-power tools woodworker and looking to do more with hand tools. Hearing others lessons learned with practical advice is great. :)

[@contestwill1556]

I use two pipe clamps with the non crank end screwed inside the apron, and pipes threaded through a jaw for a vise. Like, the impoverished man's version of this. Saw someone (Jay Bates maybe) post it on YouYube. Anyway thanks for shattering my blissful ignorance of how clumsy it is at times compared to other vises with this entertaining and informative series. Guess I will just tell myself I am following in a proud tradition. Excited for next episode.

[@compsolt]

I have been using a twin screw vise with a couple pieces of all thread (largest home depot had) and 3 nuts per screw to hold in place with some 4 inch hole saw cut outs on each screw I think the hole thing cost me less than $15 to make Just used some 2 by scraps for the material Mine is not nearly as large as yours only down side is it takes a while to screw into position for larger boards but it was cheap and works great.

[@2dividedby3equals666]

I'm loving this series of videos!! Not only are they enjoyable because of the woodworking, but the historic part also fascinates me. Thanks for sharing and take care!!

[@antallaczko8793]

My great grandfather had a lathe propelled by foot pedal - like the old Zinger sewing machines -. You should build one at some stage. He was a wheel maker until the 60s. Wooden horse cart wheels were common until the late 60s in Eastern Europe. Thumbs up, keep up the good work.

[@FranksWorkbench]

That is one sweet and stout looking wood screw vise! I can totally relate to the sentiment to the green cast iron vise. I never could bring myself to disassemble my first workbench (which was also my first hand tool build) and now it is just basically a shelf for scraps lol

[@supergeek1418]

I have two different WorkMate(tm) portable work benches, both with integral twin screw vices. The larger WorkMate has a belt/clutch drive such that turning one screw turns both, whereas on the smaller one the two screws are completely independent. The larger unit is *much* more convenient. Perhaps, you can brainstorm/fabricobble a belt or chain/clutch drive between the two screws. I'm sure that would help in the "convenience factor" department, immensely.

[@emmengel]

I use two 3 1/2in leg vices. One at each end my bench. I put a 2x8 between those when be I need a Macon type vice. One leg vice goes to the floor the other is 8in off the floor, this allows me to have wheels on the left side.

[@CodeSquares]

I built a DIY version of this because I couldn't source a screw large enough for the leg vise (found the Yost on Lee Valley now, but ...), whereas I could use threaded rods for mine. It's worked well enough that I haven't tackled the leg vise yet, but it is definitely on the slow side. It was however pretty simple to put together and attach to the low roman bench with existing, small stock (didn't need anything beefy like I will for the leg vise) with minimal finishing (add a chamfer, glue on some leather, done), so there's the cost and speed aspect. However! Neither of those would not have been reasons for the Dominy to choose them, especially since it looks like they already HAD leg vises on there. Very interesting indeed, maybe it'll reveal itself over time. Thanks for the video, and nice to see you using that lathe you've unearthed. :D

[@timsampson5229]

Fascinating as always Rex. Stay safe yourself and your family.

[@oldpuebloforge]

Awesome video. Very interesting. I love your honesty. It is very tempting to only report positive expetimental results. I love it that you also report negative and inconclusive results .

[@timort2260]

Twin screw was the design I have. I use an impact and it's super quick and I can do 30inches wide. I think it's a very nice feature to have and can be done for cheap. I'm rocking like 5/16 all thread and that's more than enough holding force and with an impact it takes only a few seconds. Then older style tables would be lovely to work with but I dont have the space so my own table has to do just about everything I need now and in the future.

[@Caromaros]

I’m gonna guess Rex is going to start selling tool components in the new year, which would be huge for me because I live in a small area in northern Ontario where vintage woodworking tools are extremely scarce!! I’ve been looking steadily for around 3 months now and haven’t found anything, not even a single plane or bit brace :( I’m gonna have to start making my own stuff once I have a bit more money saved for tools to help with that, so that could be cool!! Either way, I love your vids Rex, I turn them on whenever I have free time, or sometimes when I’m getting frustrated with something and need to calm down. You have a very relaxed and fun approach to everything you do which for some reason just makes life nice, so keep it up💕

[@Michael-vs9bi]

Very cool to learn about a historical wood working dynasty. Great video!

[@charlesrussell9312]

I have used such vises in the past. They remind me of the Jorgensen wood clamps. They grip very well on odd shapes and worked well for building boats, but I have never thought of installing them. Like everything, their utility depends on what you are making.

[@BradsWorkbench]

TUNG WAX!!!! GIT'YA TUNNNG WAX HERE! ...Lol great video, very interesting indeed!

[@thomashverring9484]

Imma goin' to have to get me some of that magic wax! I'll go look at that Etsy shop 'o yours. Yessiree!

[@BradsWorkbench]

@@thomashverring9484 just holler if u got any questions 👍

[@thomashverring9484]

@@BradsWorkbench Will do!

[@bobt2522]

My wife is also delighted when I mix up a batch of beeswax and mineral oil on the stove. Actually, as long as I clean up my mess and recoat all the wooden utensils, she is happy with it.

[@BradsWorkbench]

@@bobt2522 tung wax is different but i get what ur saying 😝

[@TheBilgepumper]

It's nice to see a product made in Erie PA featured.

[@Ikantspell4]

Good story telling with the video. I watch a few woodworking / making youtube channels and this really is different BECAUSE of the story telling. Not something I would like regularly but an appreciated change. Normally I follow projects that I am or would do and honestly I think I'm just much less enthusiastic about workpiece clamping than you but I Still watched the entire video

[@GrantHendrick]

Another great video. Thank you.

[@jamesmcbriarty2079]

You might want to take a look at the Gizmozilla vise, found in the October 2012 issue of Popular Woodworking. It's a portable Moxon type vise that is clamped onto the bench, has integrated stops, and can hold stock up to fourty-eight inches wide.

[@Ryan_Thompson]

Those are some good looking threads. Cool vise.

[@johnpossum556]

The Dominys used the twin vise because it was cheap back then to buy them in bulk and they didn't have access to a JawHorse by Rockwell. Best vise I've ever owned. But I have been thinking about making a twin screw vise using some allthread I salvaged from worksite's trash. Now that I think of it I have enough to easily do a quadruple screw vise, synced with stepper motors.

[@Guitarman17864]

I have one of these that I built on the end of my bench. I used two gate bolts from Home Depot for my screws and handles though it is awesome.

[@gslavik]

Rex Kruger, Rick Flair of the woodworking world? Wooooo!

[@GCaF]

Hi Rex! I can't talk from experience but that large screw with the movable jaw makes me think that it would grip pieces based on the jaw position. I can't really draw a picture in a youtube comment, but I feel like tilting the movable jaw vertically a bit would lock in place with a shallow grip almost any small to medium piece. Not to mention pieces that have a "v"-like shape. The way it looks in the drawings, with a thinner movable jaw... I imagine tilting it would be common and it would do quick work: Drop the piece in, grip with vertical tilting, do small and fast work, take it out - similar to the hold fast principle. And then, if the piece does move or you need to do heavy work on it, tighten one of the screws, clamping it in an angled grip (tighten the screw closest to you, depending on where your body is in regards to the work piece and bench). If one screw hold is not enough, then and only then tighten both, which locks everything in place as you demonstrated. Again... I don't use (and have never used) one - I'm just referencing the drawings you presented and how the sizes suggest to me it should work. If it's all baloney... that's that. Still... like you say, the fact that a leg vise was abandoned to favor this one makes me think that some of the advantages I listed above ought to work. I almost want to build one myself and test what I just said :)))

[@jonpaypompee3406]

Subscribing after watching this. love watching wood work and history

[@codefoote]

Something that is in the same realm is a Moxen vice. I built mine for super cheap and absolutely love it. It is a simple design and holds wood very well.

[@stevendezwaan5707]

I really like seeing a great channel mention another great channel. You always have great content with some really cool projects and Brad's Workbench does some fantastic wood turning and has some great content as well.

[@joshblumenthal4873]

Rex, I built a 2 screw vise months ago and bought a tap & die set to make my own screws. It was easy to do and would lower the cost ALOT (and you'd have the tap & die set). I went with much smaller 3/4" diameter, but larger is available. Even with smaller screws, the holding power is amazing.

[@alexjames1146]

Nice episode. I love the shameless plugs. It's part of what I tune in for. Thanks.

[@AJ-ln4sm]

That vice is a beast! I loved the bit of history.

[@calebshort2169]

I love this channel. And I promise as soon as I’m done going back to school. And can. I’m going to become a patron

[@figrollin]

In a similar vein to finishing abrasive paste, you should try Yorkshire Grit. It's awesome.

[@luccarron]

Thanks Rex. This Vise Squad series is really a jewel. Technically, historically... Yeah, that's very interesting.

[@H3xx99]

You could easily add a belt drive to your twin screw. The belt would allow you to over tighten one side for tapered work by slipping the belt, but still save time by letting you turn both at once. Chain and gear drives sacrifice the tapered grip by locking the handles together.

[@mariushegli]

I have nothing to say really, but I appreciate your content, and wish to help with the yt-algorithms.

[@charlesmckinley29]

Great video, I need to start building stuff again.

[@Youzack1]

You take care of yourself too bud. Great job, as always.

[@OutOfNamesToChoose]

It makes sense for holding long pieces of tapered wood, such as table legs

[@airwolf61970]

Just a question but, could you do a video on a hand wooden resaw saw. The ones I've seen used are big and mostly a "2 man" apparatus. I am trying to stick with only hand tools. But I'm byyself and I need tools I can manage on my own. Great videos, and love you channel sir.😃

[@peteflaherty3573]

Just came across your channel, keep it up please, I really enjoy making tools I need for my work , you have helped a lot. Thanks

[@DataSmithy]

Hi Rex, It's pretty clear you could shorten the handles on those screws for more efficient and faster turning.

[@Breacher-ue1jj]

Hey Rex I love your videos. I was thinking you should try to make a Japanese tool box for all the hand tools you made and/or will make. I think it would be a cool project.

[@Iceburgh6901]

My dad has two Workmate portable benches, which works on the same principal as the twin-screw vise (mainly because they ARE twin-screw vises). I'll often use one when I'm grinding a piece (I'm a beginning blacksmith), depending on what I'm doing. If I'm just cutting a chunk of stock down to throw in my forge, I have a Harbor Freight carpenter's vise attached to a small bench that I use. I find the twin-screw design a bit awkward, though the fact that the handles are crank-style rather than the sliding bar helps when it comes to speed, and you do get used to it after a while. I don't use the Workmates very often (especially in winter. It gets COLD in Boise, and I don't usually have to do a lot of grinding), but I've gotten used to it even just using it occasionally for most of my life. The one vise that I wish that I had was a post vise. Problem is, I have nowhere to put it. The area where I have my forge is tiny. I need to get out there and reorganize the place. Probably when the carport's installed.

[@DudeWhoLikesMuzak]

I'll shed some light for ya. With the twin screw you can quickly and easily lay a board on the screws horizontally then drill out and clean out a mortise. It's especially fast for furniture making (table chairs etc.)

[@quitethemike]

Great work Rex! We're still left with a bit of a mystery, but you're preserving a ton of good history that I think might otherwise get lost in the noise of the modern world, in specific, knowledge that I think we should carefully preserve and keep passing on.

[@rainmaker6217]

I wonder how hees feeling about the twin screw vise now that it's been a while and he's been able to use it for a while. I'm looking into maybe making a vise for myself on a new workbench, and the twin screw vise seems like it would be excellent for something simple and would give me a ridiculusly wide mouth compared to the other kinds I'm looking into making. With the strong hold and all that I think it would be a good candidate for a larger style vise, being able to hold super wide/long boards with insane hold seems quite practical. Since it's a hobby too the small time increase for actually screwing it in every time is inconsequential since I won't be using it as part of work or time critical projects.

[@TomBuskey]

Grips a little better than a leg vise & handles larger items w/o a deadman & peg. Costs 2x for the screws, 2 screws are more fiddly and slower than 1. I think I'm building a leg vice to replace my cheap 6" cast one. Thanks!

[@James_T_Kirk_1701]

Rex, reading Chris Schwartz’s book on work benches mentions his surprise about loving twin screw vises. I think the answer is two fold. One, he’s only familiar with the twin drive modern style. Take that into account. However, for a workbench that has a shorter footprint I think the twin screw his good for edge jointing long work. The bench design where he praises the twin screw was not originally equipped with a dead man or dog holes on the legs. Those were added afterwards. This means he was likely pushing the limits of the Veritas for edge work and was impressed with its capability. Two, these were production shops where there likely were more than just one set of hands to hold and situate large demanding pieces of wood in the vise. I can see the real benefit of shifting the work to the right of workers were sharing the bench and edge work was needed. Instead of a leg vise using the apron to support long pieces. The work piece could be held in the vise alone shifting the work over opening up some of the bench for another worker. I will admit to being occasionally intrigued by the idea of a twin screw. It weridly comes and goes. However I think a leg vise and some planing stops or a face and tail vise combo are almost all that is needed. A leg vise is cheap to build and works better than almost all but you most expensive face vises. Couple that with some planing stop and some dog holes in the apron and you’re good to go. I like planing stops because of the feedback they give you about your planing which is really beneficial to beginners. Throw in a moxon vise and you’re golden, although the need for one is far less than a lot of prominent woodworkers make it out to be in my experience. I mainly bust it out if I have a LOT of dovetails to do and want to be able to sit down.

[@Russ0107]

The shop looks nice and clean in the background!

[@diYotamCh]

Great video and story telling. I think we forget that they used to have apprentices at a shop. that would also help in things. I remember i used to turn the handle on my granfather vintage grind stone. So no need to upgrade to power tools. on a multi worker workshop or even with an apprentice turning and moving things around for you makes things a lot easier.. Kids were a part of daily prudction work force back then. And the education was for them to be part of the family proffesion. No wonder why Dominys are multy generation of craftsmanship.

[@kc1850]

Thank you for posting this information. I have been looking at these and wondering about them.You have had the twin vice for awhile now. What are your thoughts now?

[@mattydelicious1977]

Classic Rex talking about high precision work while using his Harbor Freight Lathe

[@crnlbwlawson]

Is something wrong with it???? Looks like he made a perfectly good piece with it. Stop knocking another man's tools...

[@ciaheadmechanic0809]

Any updates? How do you like the vise now that you have had a bit more time with it?

[@markmissildine961]

I think if you just backed of one screw it might make it easier for repeat in and outs

[@Richard-wk9le]

Apprenticeships were common back than their would have always been a second pair of hands to help, would explain part of it another part could be that they used a leather strap or string between the screws to twist both at the same time ?

[@pyrokiller4682]

These would be good for beginners who use a work mate because of that double handle

[@jamesanthony5874]

12:00 seems like the chain drive vise would kind of miss one of the advantages of the twin drive vise, namely that you can hold onto a piece of wood that is different sizes at each end.

[@prego2011able]

So on the Veritas twin screw Rex talks about, you can disengage the chain drive to allow for tapered pieces.

[@mymemeplex]

Andrew Klein has a twin vice that can handle those.

[@brainwashingdetergent4322]

Big baller over there!

[@iknownothing-m8c]

I'm thinking that one advantage might be that the pressure plate does in fact move freely when the vise is open. You can manually push the pressure plate to your piece of wood it and align it perfectly before tightening down the screws.

[@lglgmoreiracom]

A twin-screw vise is the only vise I have in my bench. Mainly because it is cheap to make (if you use modest threaded rods instead of those expensive wood screws). It is indeed not the fastest kind of vise and needs different approaches than those used with a cast iron face vise. For instance, usually, you would set one side of the vise and then work on multiple tasks only actuating on the other screw. Besides that, in some cases, you would use shins or something similar in one end to prevent vertical raking (not sure how to spell that).

[@louisvictor3473]

TL;DR: maybe the advantages aren't when you're making furniture and funiture-esque parts one at a time as a one man shop, but when you're making a lot of things as a family at the same time. I think you might have answered your own question already. They were a family of craftspeople, not a modern one man at a time show. If I get it right, they made lots of things, they made lots of big things, and they produced in numbers too, and as a collective, not just individual craftsmen doing individual work. With that big vice there, I bet you could plane the sides of a lot of boards all at the same time, either for joining them all together or just to get a lot of work done at once. Lose some time in prep work, but you know, if you do 2 boards instead of 1 at once, that is half the time. Three boards, it is 1/3, four is 1/4, and so on. Can cut a bunch of time doing things on mass. And I betcha it is wonderful for making a mortice, little or no slowly sliding down shenanigans. Also, if you're working as a group rather than the modern one person show, the shop dynamics are just different. For example, while someone is cleaning up some boards on a vice, another person is prepping boards on another to be cleaned up, first person moves to that vice when done with the first while the other person go back to the vice to take care of that board (setting up to clean another side or moving it to another step). Optimisations for a one man shop and for collective work are just not the same. That all being said, I get you're doing is basically experimental history here so you gotta do it the historical way for that. But for more practical purposes, I think more modern twin-screw designs (either diy or bought) offer the same power with much more practicality. Linked screws and metallic screws, for example, make the use smoother and afaik don't sacrifice any power.

[@RexKrueger]

You make a good point, but multi-person shops were the norm then. Solo work was very rare, so that doesn't really answer the question.

[@louisvictor3473]

@@RexKrueger I am not sure I follow. I was making a point that maybe the vice works better for multi-person shops and work, rather than solo work. Wouldn't solo work being rare reinforce the idea? I feel I am missing something.

[@Beakerbite]

@@louisvictor3473 The issue is that many shops abandoned the twin screw. So the Dominys were an odd duck yet also very capable. So Rex wants to know why they returned to the classic rather than using more "modern" designs.

[@AM-os4ty]

@@RexKrueger - Huh? It does answer the question. I don't do woodwork (that's my husband) but I do sew by myself for a family. I have discovered that many techniques that speed up a shop or factory might .slow down or even stall altogether a home sewist with average skills, little time, and forever making custom pieces. I baste a lot, something that does not happen on factory floor. But I have one garment to produce, rather than 100 in day. I will simply never get the experience I need in putting together that particular garment to avoid the step. Many other examples like that, in many areas of crafting. A home shop versus a factory like setting is just different.

[@AM-os4ty]

@@Beakerbite - Maybe they weren't as capable as you're giving them credit for. For sure, the production of anything from woodworking to sewing to food is approached differently in a multi-person for cash environment versus hobby type activities to supply yourself.

[@ponga782]

You can counterbore the inside of the vice jaw and secure a big wooden washer to the screws and then the jaw will open when you turn the screws..

[@christophervollick4634]

Random question, unrelated to historical context. When you were showing getting things into the vice it looked a bit difficult to get both tightened together. But since the screws aren't connected to the jaw, could you hip-check or knee-hold the jaw against the piece? Then the two screws just need to snug up against the jaw, and once they're both snug they could be tightened further.

[@TheDistur]

Interesting video! That vise sure does grip.

[@anthonykeel5559]

Got me scratching my head now.

[@GreggGermain-lk8if]

Thanks for a very informative video. If your woodworking life is dominated by dovetails then it seems this vice is the one you want. Especially if you do large cabinetry. As you pointed out it's a Moxon attached to the bench. Well if you have a small shop, as I do, I think I'd rather deal with extra screws as opposed to putting on and removing the Moxon. The only advantage to a Moxon is that, situated on the top of the bench, it can hold tall work closer to the top.

[@SpopySpider]

My theory is that this is a great vice for teams, for people working together, two or three guys one holds the piece of wood the other/s clamp it tight, seems like a great way to ensure a quick rock solid fit and if the dominis worked together, that might have been the reason

[@JanSzymonGoowacz]

To try two screw vise U can buld moxion. I make my from scraps, and regular no acme screw. In every moment I can mout it under the table by few bolts and will work good. Is no best but give me some view on two screw vises. Set to make wooden screws corst round 100-150 usd. And If U planing to buld more vises or clamps, or press in future is best way to save some money. U mention viritas chain vise, but last year is a for vises from one KZbinr i do not remamber name. Two screw ona handle, lot of gears.

[@Thamian]

Question about the Dominys - did they all work in the shop at the same time/on pieces together? Because it may be that if they were working together as a cohesive team, some of the weirdness with the twin screw could be alleviated by having one person on each screw - you would need to really know each other and what you're doing very well, but if they were working together all their lives, and learned their craft in the same shop, then... yeah they would know all of that.

[@louisvictor3473]

You don't even need to know each other that well, just good work organisation and minimal discipline. Kid preps vice 1 with some boards for a project, dad comes clean them up while kid preps vice 2 with other board(s) for another part of the project or another project. Kinda hard to mess that up.

[@RexKrueger]

They were more like solo craftsmen who shared a shop.

[@adamsomkowski4460]

Hello Rex, good to see you :>

[@petrpitha9966]

You have to try the Andrew Klein vise at some point! It's not cheap at all and probably completely out of the scope of this channel but similar to the high end planes and saws, it would be a very nice comparison to this twin screw vise or whatever else you end up testing! Much love from CZ

[@harryjohnston290]

Here's an idea. Have the first screw move the vise in and out and have the second screw set the angle. You do this by having the first screw engage with a nut which is attached to the bench, as previously. But you attach a board to the rear of the screw, so that it moves in and out with the screw but doesn't turn with it. The second screw then screws into a nut which is attached to the board. The board will have to have guide rails to slide on and be quite thick in order to keep the vise Square. This will allow the vise to be moved quickly, hold angled work and have the griping power of two screws. The only problem will be making that back board stiff enough.

[@shidorikuroko]

I’d love the leg vice and twin screw vice together in a build pack. Then I could make both and compare the two. 😊

[@omerZauber]

I really live your videos, they are educational and interesting, and I'm not even doing any woodworking myself or have any kind of workshop, I'm just a programmer :p

[@cardinia1]

Absolutely pro vise squad apparatus chur bro

[@matthewbrady5214]

I think it’s about time for a 1 year review of this vise

[@RexKrueger]

I still hate it.

[@matthewbrady5214]

@@RexKrueger well, that was a quick review.

[@walterrider9600]

thank you Rex

[@strongjohn10956]

I'm in the process of using a Moxen vice kit to build a vice into the apron of my bench. I agree that the twin wood screw arrangement is a bit clunky to work with, but I am hoping that the metal screws will work more smoothly, and I expect that I will keep the left side of the vice set just under 3/4 in since that's the size of most of the stock I work with and clamp down on the right side (I'm right- handed). Would it be worth greasing the screws to make the vice operate more smoothly?