Amazing Counterpoint: Analysis of C Sharp Minor Fugue from Bach's Well-Tempered Clavier, Book I

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Richard Atkinson analyzes the amazing counterpoint in the astonishingly complex C-sharp minor fugue from Book I of Bach’s Well-Tempered Clavier. This is a fair use educational commentary that uses a performance/recording of András Schiff at the piano.

[@TomRussle]

One of the best pieces of music, not only Bach, not only piano, but in music history.

[@yvindJarsve]

I agree.

[@Lianpe98]

Keyboard*

[@scottalbers2518]

I was pleased to read your comment. I've always felt this to be true, but I've never heard it expressed before. The piece has become deeply personal for me. I first came across this piece while I was doing my first murder trial in Montana in 1995. I had just arrived in Montana the previous year at the age of 35. The conflicts in this piece seemed to mirror all the difficultues of the case. For some reason it seemed to help to be able to play these conflicting, dramatic lines on the piano while living through them in the courtroom. Ultimately the guilty verdict was reversed on (a tortuous) appeal. Robert Robbins vs. State of Montana, 2002 MT 116. This included with it an appeal to the United States Supreme Court of an ethics charge filed by the very prosecutor who lost the appeal. Albers vs. State of Montana, in 2000. helenair.com/news/lawyer-challenging-state-s-discipline-law/article_a4e7067e-7d25-5ab1-81e0-99032752a91c.html And a divorce, in 2005, followed by the realization of what was wrong in the marriage from the get-go. So, first theme: a rather simple, straight-forward, depressing murder. The 5 voices seem to reflect the way in which this murder affects, ultimately, me (bass), my son (tenor), my ex-wife (alto), my eldest daughter (mezzo-soprano), and youngest daughter (soprano). Second theme: complicated legal maneuvers everywhere, as reflected again in the same voicing. Third theme: judgment on a bad marriage which finally must end, again in the same voicing. Finally the legal maneuvers drop out and leave the hard climax: a dead body, and a dead marriage.

[@philipk4475]

@@scottalbers2518 That's an incredible comment you left, I have the feeling there's a whole life's episode there that could reach a far wider audience if fleshed out

[@scottalbers2518]

@@philipk4475 true story.

[@josepholeary3286]

A notable feature of this fugue is the contrasting characters of the three themes -- the first one deep and solemn, the second sprightly and dancing, the third an inspiriting fanfare. This distinctiveness of profile and contrast allows the five voices to be clearly heard and distinguished throughout.

[@vincent-ataramaniko]

I disagree , all 3 themes give a dark feeling, although the 3rd one a bit less. This is because they all go around the same note, creating a feeling of "difficulty", for example the first theme (the first time) is full of notes circling C#

[@oskarsennert4075]

I agree with you, it's already shown through the note-lengths. Half notes, quarter notes and eight notes.

[@zhiyuyang3007]

Hi,I’m watching this from China(with some efforts getting around the fire wall which bans general access.)Really enlightening !These video deserves more views I shared this to my friends.Iplease keep doing this series.

[@metodoinstinto]

You guys can't watch KZbin? I know there's an internet ban of some stuff, but I thought KZbin was allowed. What are you guys allowed to watch or not?

[@louisvalencia5244]

It´s really great that you can watch YT. I hope one day China rises away from this tyranny .

[@PM_ME_MESSIAEN_PICS]

@@metodoinstinto KZbin, Google, Facebook, Twitter, PH and Instagram are all banned

[@paxwallacejazz]

Wow intellectual freedom now!✊☯️👍

[@orb3796]

@@louisvalencia5244 There's no tyranny in china.

[@brianbernstein3826]

what really blows my mind about this piece is that all three subject are tetrachords: four notes in a row in a scale, in some order. just like Mozart's Jupiter symphony motive... I suppose the reason is that when you split the octave in half, a 4th is the largest interval (anything larger inverts to something smaller) so in that sense, everything can be expressed within a single fourth interval. but to see how the seven tetrachords in a diatonic scale overlap as Bach does, that is just beyond genius.

[@channelelectronique]

holey crack!

[@peterelliott5720]

This is a fascinating comment! But my understanding of theory is too limited to understand the full extent of what is being said. Please could someone explain in what sense a fourth being the largest interval when an octave is split in half means that everything can be expressed within a single fourth interval? And what is meant by Bach's demonstration of how the seven tetrachords in a diatonic scale overlap? I'm currently learning this fugue and any further explanation of these points would be invaluable. Many thanks!

[@brianbernstein3826]

@@peterelliott5720 Let's take an interval larger than a fourth. Look at C and G on the piano, a perfect fifth apart. If you flip the notes around so that the C is above the G, it is now a perfect 4th interval. What about something big, like a major 7th? C and B on the keyboard. Flip the notes around, and you have B and C, a minor 2nd interval. Finally, take C and F#, a tritone (also known as augmented 4th or diminished 5th). Flip it. You get a tritone again. In example one, we went from a perfect fifth (7 semitones) to a perfect 4th (5 semitones). 7 + 5 = 12 (an octave) In example two, we went from a major seventh (11 semitones) to a minor second (1 semitone). 11 + 1 = 12 (an octave) In example three, we went from a tritone (6 semitones) to a tritone (6 semitones). 6 + 6 = 12 (an octave) In conclusion, to "invert" an interval, first count the number of keys that span the interval (the number of semitones, or half steps). Subtract that number from 12. Whatever answer you get, count that many semitones out on the piano and the interval you get is the inversion. Any interval between 6 and 12 half steps will invert to 0 and 6 halfsteps, meaning you never have larger than a tritone as the smallest of the two. I called it a 4th as a simplification, as tritones can be expressed as augmented 4ths if need be.

[@brianbernstein3826]

@@peterelliott5720 "how the seven tetrachords in a diatonic scale overlap" Well for the context of this particular piece I might say that the 7 tetrachords diatonic to C# harmonic minor would be: C# D# E F# D# E F# G# E F# G# A F# G# A B# G# A B# C# A B# C# D# B# C# D# E Which correspond to the following scale degrees in C# harmonic minor: 1 2 3 4 2 3 4 5 3 4 5 6 4 5 6 7 5 6 7 1 6 7 1 2 7 1 2 3 As you can see, it's a circle that repeats. This is only for one key however (which I did to explain it clearer) - in reality, Bach is changing keys and modes continuously throughout this piece.

[@peterelliott5720]

@@brianbernstein3826 Thank you so much for this eye opening explanation! I hadn't conceptualised the three subjects in terms of their being tetrachords before but doing so, and seeing how Bach must have perceived the possibilities of overlapping them has opened up a new dimension to my enjoyment and appreciation of the piece! What a genius Bach was. And there's something really special about this piece in particular; from bar 94 onwards with that double stretto, it's like all of his genius was bent on finding the most perfect solution to the problem set out by the opening notes that one could imagine.

[@johnchessant3012]

4:48 I like how Schiff borrows a note from the blue subject to emphasize an unintentional(?) red subject

[@Pakkens_Backyard]

The stretto section is so ridiculously difficult, I almost had a breakdown practicing it lol

[@frenchimp]

The tricky thing for me is when a melodic line has to be played alternately with the left and the right hand and still has to sound like a single entity. It's hard to do but very stimulating.

[@vincent-ataramaniko]

The stretto part is interesting because you really have to decide carefully which voice you prioritize and which theme. I have played this fugue thousands of times and I'm certain I haven't played it twice the same way.

[@schrysafis]

Richter's recording of this fugue is absolutely phenomenal. I appreciate all of Andras Schiff's recordings cause he understands the counterpoint of Bach but Richter also maximize the balance between the emotional and mathematical connection of music.

[@tjhooker2433]

One of Bach’s best subjects for a fugue (the first one). So simple but so exciting

[@julianmanjarres1998]

Agreed!

[@gexahedrop8923]

i think it's b-a-c-h transposed

[@qwaqwa1960]

Bass entry in bar 73 is one of my favourite moments in all music... Tho not so much the heavy-handed version here.

[@mattbalfe2983]

Half the time I listen to this played on organ, boy does the ending pedal point and that bass line hit hard.

[@vincent-ataramaniko]

It has to be loud because it's the theme played on the original key, but still too loud is not great.

[@tackontitan]

Ooh that chord at measure 112 sure is spicy

[@Richard.Atkinson]

Yes, it's one of my favorite parts of this fugue, even though I don't mention it in the video!

[@StephenAntKneeBk5]

I'm glad Alan Downunder mentioned that chord (measure 112), It caught my ear, too. How would we name that chord? This is where Bach shines -- his unexpected, yet always delightful harmonic directions. Excellent video, thank you. :-)

[@skoto8219]

Knew the one you had to be talking about. I'll resist the urge to say anything vulgar out of respect for the master but yeah, I... really enjoyed that.

[@berserker96]

That's where he got to, maybe a bit of irony... I'm less than a novice but it's still evident to the ear

[@tomafrank8220]

It's a iv in second inversion with a 3-4(1) and a 7-6 delay (I don't know if this is the same in English, but we call it delay). A typical way to end a piece in this period is with a small coda with the root as a pedal point. I#37 iv46 and then some kind of dominant function over the pedalpoint. This chord in measure 112 is basically the first two chords mashed together.

[@elias69420]

People who want to relax, with Netflix: Just one more episode Bookworms with books: Just one more page People with a sweet tooth, with chocolate: Just one more piece *Rick Atkinson with a dictionary:* _JuST oNe mORe ADjEcTiVe_

[@authenticmusic4815]

lmao

[@elias69420]

@@authenticmusic4815 thanks

Wow, just wow. What an astounding piece of music. Thank you for highlighting it! I also loved this crazy chord, 1st measure of the 4th bar from the end... Things like this make Bach's music so unpredictive and interesting. A real journey.

[@marcogusy6870]

An addition: the first subject draws a latin cross. Bach often used this symbol in his thematic material. (Christe in b- mass, b-a-c-h fugue and many others)

[@johnchessant3012]

Notice the rising motif at 2:35 (m. 17-18), 2:48 (m. 24), 3:03 (m. 31-32), etc. (including inversions), later forms the first beat of each bar of the green subject, at 2x diminution; it also appears an impressive 5 times at 4:21 (m. 72-74).

[@PetStuBa]

before this I was JUST listening to Bach and nothing more, I had already an idea how great he is / was ... but now it becomes even more crazy ... it makes me dizzy haha ... if I try to listen and understand all voices ... unbelievable ..

[@mtv565]

You have to analyse Bach to really enjoy his music, not just listening or playing!

[@geiryvindeskeland7208]

Yes, mmm, you’re absolutely right! And precisely because I have analyzed BWV 668, I struggle hard to believe the information in the obituary, that Bach lay terminally ill in bed, dictated the composition of his son-in-law. The polyphony is so complicated that you have to be completely healthy to create something so impressive! We know that the title of the choral was ironed out and replaced with another lyric on the same melody - perhaps that’s what Bach terminally ill managed to ask his son-in-law to do? The title «Wenn wir in hochsten Noten sein» was replace with «Vor deinen Thron tret’ ich hiermit».

[@Murcielag0scuro]

This is my favourite Fugue of all time.

[@marslu5117]

Do an analysis of the Beethoven op131 string quartet, first movement (which is a fugue) please!

[@josepholeary3286]

Yes, PLEASE!

[@marjoriehalloranmusic]

Oh how I wish videos like this had been around during my years of undergrad analysis...

[@stregananda]

Right?!?

[@bachouvenn3563]

I love how the first subject imitates the “B-A-C-H” motif but in the C#m key

[@violinscratcher]

The first subject is a transposition of the BACH-Motive.

[@teodorlontos3294]

No it most definitely isn't. This motif consists of a descending minor second and then an ascending augmented third and then another descending minor second. That is not the BACH-motif, which would be (in C# minor) C#-B#-D#-Cx

[@violinscratcher]

Teodor Lontos Oh, that's true! It is not literal. But it has a similar flow.

[@GU3MUSIC]

It has the same contour. BACH= 2143. This subject = 2154

[@fgbowen]

one of my favs out of the 48. just touches me so. Such a beautiful ending. (even though - lol - they're All my favs).

[@chrrev1]

clear explanation. from a musical standpoint, I prefer the slower Richter interpretation in which one can fully appreciate the harmony. I think he found the right tempo, this is a little fast

[@darb.musica]

Gustav Leonhardt has a very beautiful version of this fugue, on harpsichord

[@DanielSilva-gc4xz]

Faster tempo = emphasis on the melody Slower tempo = emphasis on the harmony.

[@Ezekiel_Pianist]

@@DanielSilva-gc4xz I would respectfully disagree with your assessment of faster tempo emphasising melody as slower tempi can emphasis melody and harmony in the right circumstances

[@DanielSilva-gc4xz]

@@Ezekiel_Pianist I didn’t mean quality, but emphasis. Because melodies are horizontal, the faster they are played the less memory and effort you need. Harmony, in the other hard, is vertical, if they change too fast they become hard to internalize.

[@mattbalfe2983]

Disagree, a big part of a fugue is about hearing horizontal voices.

[@MorganBallardWheeler]

This video deserves a remake--your most recent videos are so detailed and there is so much more in the amazing fugue. Thanks for considering!

[@johnchessant3012]

The descending chromatic motif that cycles through the top voices at 4:13 (m. 67-73) returns at 5:20 (m. 102-105).

[@christophemarois5423]

Thank you so much for this! Not only is your video analysis extremely instructive, but it is to my point of view complementing the music in a way that makes me even more appreciative of it. I just know that when I hear this fugue again, the voice interplay you highlighted in here will make me listen better.

[@yuk_notkim7658]

Bach was a legendary composer. I really admire his fugues due to how genius they are.

[@alexshih3747]

I've been waiting for you to do this.

[@doricdream498]

5:39 god i love this moment

[@darb.musica]

Amazing. One of my favourite pieces by Bach. Great analysis, thank you.

[@pianoyeah]

Thank you for this. I return to this piece often to see how much I've learned since the last time I played it. And it keeps growing with me. I appreciate your clear analysis and look forward to torturing my students with this video.

[@gracelee9437]

One of my favorite. Well done!

[@DirkdeZwijger]

This music becomes much more incredible when you learn how to listen to it. Bach was truly ahead of time and mankind. Thanks for the compact and easy to understand analysis!!

[@stregananda]

Thank you for creating this wonderful, clear and incredibly helpful analysis of one of the most stunning keyboard compositions ever written. I will be passing this and other of your videos to my piano students.

[@terrybyrne4324]

Absolutely sublime analysis of a sublime work. Excellent work Richard.

[@AshThunor]

By far the best out of the Well-Tempered Clavier.

[@Igneous01]

Great analysis! I think at 4:49 you forgot to mark the first subject which plays just before the third subject's stretto enters

[@Reino_X]

No tho, the notes are similar but it doesen't match the 1st subject, cuz 1 note was missing

[@Igneous01]

@@Reino_X I don't think there's any rule that prevents a composer from omitting or changing a note in a subject. Otherwise it would be impossible to have tonal answers. In this case no notes have been omitted - The last note of the third subject is the first note of the first subject.

[@Reino_X]

@@Igneous01 kk

[@geiryvindeskeland7208]

Reino X, sorry for my inadequate English. Reino X, quote: ".....cuz 1 note was missing." This is not correct. The 1 note is a crotchet, Bach did the same in some other fugues too, the first note in the fugue subject only got the half value.

[@Reino_X]

@@geiryvindeskeland7208 Ok

[@fredhoupt4078]

Awesome fuge. Good choice you use someone of Schiff's calibre, someone who has grown with Bach over an entire career. It was so nice to hear all the voices so distinctly. It also sounded like he opted for using the sustain pedal. I guess that this about as complex as fugal writing gets? An intellectual tour de force.

[@julienroussillesuarez6244]

What is this chord 5:40 🤯🤯🤯🤯bach never fails to amaze me

[@mtv565]

Ingenious Triple Fugue!! Some people say those 2 are counter-subjects, but if they are, they would appear with 1st subject in the 1st exposition. Another reason is Bach will never use counter-subjects in stretto. So it is clear those 2 are subjects and this is a Triple fugue with 3 subjects. Bach sometimes don't use unaccompanied expositions for 2nd and 3rd subjects, but doesn't mean those are counter-subjects.

[@geiryvindeskeland7208]

mmm, please listening to my version of the fugue BWV 849. If you also read the text hopefully you are able to understand the major differences between my version as a triple fugue and Bach's original.

[@AethonZerus]

​@@geiryvindeskeland7208 You seem to be overly concerned with the dictionary definition of a triple fugue and the absolute adherence to a very specific set of limitations on such a composition. But might I ask, where are you getting your definition from? The answer is you invented it yourself, per the description in the video you posted. But from what I can tell, the generally accepted definition for a triple fugue is simply a fugue with three subjects. So I think what you are fundamentally trying to do is find a set of rules that distinguishes between a subject and a countersubject. In so doing, you come up with the arbitrary requirement that a subject must necessarily be exposed solo, in a single voice. Fair enough, but you completely ignore all the precedents concerning countersubjects. The generally accepted definition of a countersubject is counterpoint, continuing from the subject, in support of that subject in an additional voice, that recurs in the composition. There's countless examples of this, such as the f minor fugue from wtc book 1. But the 2nd and 3rd themes in the c# minor fugue bear no resemblance to this kind of structure at all. These themes, in contrast, are their own emphatic statements. Their own ideas. They begin their own musical phrases. They are a continuation of nothing, but are the starting point for new adventures to be had. Furthermore, the introduction of these themes largely mirrors what you see in a typical exposition. While not entering solo, the themes start an important musical phrase in each of the five voices, a clear convention of a fugal exposition. In the end, of course, this is all up for debate. But I would argue that this debate shouldn't be had. Fugal writing, especially in the hands of Bach, is extraordinarily complex, and Bach himself obviously went out of his way to test the limits of the form. We don't need a rigid and strict definition for triple fugue. All that matters, in the end, is whether or not the end product is musically compelling. And surely the c# minor fugue is one of the most transcendent pieces of music ever written.

[@geiryvindeskeland7208]

Astral Zenith. 1. Is the fugue BWV 890 a triple fugue? 2. Please give me some examples of fugues with a countersubject not been a double or triple fugue.

[@AethonZerus]

​@@geiryvindeskeland7208 1. I would argue that the BWV 890 fugue has two counter subjects and is not a triple fugue. When these counter subjects appear in the middle of the fugue, each time they are presented approximately 1.5 bars after an appearance of the subject, and they have common irregularities. This indicates to me that the fugue is still structured around the main subject, with these themes playing the role of supporting counterpoint. In other words, they morph to fit the needs of the music, rather than the music being built around them as a main theme. In contrast, if you look at the middle of the BWV 849 fugue, when the second subject is introduced, the piece is clearly structured around the expression of this theme in the soprano II, then tenor, then bass, then soprano I, and then alto. In other words, the music, at this point, is built around this theme. It is not playing a supporting role. 2. Other examples of fugues with counter subjects rather than second or third subjects include: Fugue in C minor BWV 847, Fugue in F# Major BWV 858, Fugue in B minor BWV 869, Fugue in E Major BWV 878, Fugue in A minor BWV 889, and Contrapunctus IV BWV 1080.

[@geiryvindeskeland7208]

Astral Zenith, thank you for your interesting answer. But right now I am too busy to give you any proper answer, I am a chuch musican, and the calendar says Desember...After the 26. I am ready to continue.

[@Leunam99]

Oh god, I just noticed another red theme in measures 85-87. There's always something new to listen to when you're dealing with Bach 😮

[@stiboh1]

Dear Richard, I really want to thank you not only for your videos --- they are superb! --- but also for introducing me to András Schiff. I am flabbergasted by the way he interprets Bach. I like it much better than any other interpretation I have heard before.

[@leonardobacchi1464]

Thank you for you great videos.

[@paxwallace8324]

A light year away beyond the architectures of his contemporaries Handel and Vivaldi. But not only mind bending embedded structural complexity of his counterpoint but his opening theme is nearly a tone row.

[@johanJL]

Bach is the greatest composer, his music brought so much happiness to my life! This particular piece resonates deeply within my soul.

[@mazactal6063]

Much appreciation for managing to get the tears rolling down as my jaw was dropping at the dense stretto run near the end

[@gevenliu1931]

I’ve always loved this piece but I really wasn’t musically enlightened enough to know how this piece came about. My jaws literally dropped after I watched this video. Thank you so much!

[@patrckhh20]

My favorite fugue of all time.

[@yurimelkonyan2619]

Try this one kzbin.info/www/bejne/bnaZpalpZspsndU ,You will like it.

[@OrbiliusMagister]

Just a piece of intuition to add some speculation about triple fugues or fugue with two countersubjects... Bach juggled different subjects in the art of fugue and especially in CPT 8 and 10 which are usually called triple fugues even if they do not present regular second or third full expositions: exactly like this fugue. Bach knew very well how not to be boring! Only at the end, in CPT 14 he wrote a fugue with three regular expositions (like BWV 552), and like this fugue the second subject has quick crotchets... it seems as Bach during his life had in mind a monumental project that he fulfilled at the end of his Art of Fugue: CPT 14 is in fact a quadruple fugue but you can bet that there would not have been any fourth regular exposition. Just some thoughts swirling in my head...

[@geiryvindeskeland7208]

Orbilius Magister, quote: "Bach knew very well how not to be boring!" Sorry Orbilius, but I miss two regular expositions in this fugue. That two countersubjects popping up from nowhere - that's boring! Quote: "CPT 14 is in fact a quadruple fugue..." I also believed that at the time I wrote my completion of CPT 14, but later onthere are arguments that CPT 14 was ment as a triple fugue. The fugue subject from CPT I don't fit perfect together with the 3 subjects from CPT 14. Quote: "...but you can bet there would not have been any fourth regular exposition." I support you right here, and the reason? There was no need to do it, because he wrote a regular exposition already in CPT 1.

[@arturosommariva5769]

It is my favourite fugue and in my opinion the highest point of counterpoint, but I have to deeply disagree on the statement that it is a 3 subject fugue when it is actually a 2 subjects fugue. The second subject that you mentioned is clearly not a pure subject but filler made of the pattern of the first one. A thing that is really interesting for me is the calling to the first subject after it's first note in the second part, that makes you understand what is going on, no matter the chaos. Appreciate that someone is making analysis of these masterpieces, well done

[@MarkLAsche]

Best channel on KZbin,

[@OdinComposer]

You are the greatest Bach apostle of our time! Thanks x)

[@Richard.Atkinson]

I'm not sure about that, but thanks!

[@thethikboy]

Magnificent on every level

[@ViRrOorR]

after listening to it a few times it just repeats itself automatically, like my brain just starts blending the different subjects, especially the blue one. It just fits anywhere all of a sudden. my brain listening to bach its like ive taken acid it all just goes round and round infinitely.

[@saminarose80]

this is so genius. I dont know why it felt like ending on V chord to me :D

[@Richard.Atkinson]

Let me see if I can guess why it sounds this way to you. Many Bach pieces actually do end on a V chord. Other composers do this as well, such as the end of the 2nd Mvt. of Haydn's Op. 54 No. 2 quartet. So, this is the first reason your ear is primed to hear this as a dominant chord (if you know a lot of Bach's other music). The second reason might be that when a piece is in the minor mode, your ear is accustomed to hearing the minor tonic chord, so when a Picardy 3rd appears at the end, it fools you into hearing a dominant chord (since dominant chords are the most common major chords in most minor-mode pieces). The 3rd reason might be that Bach often ends his pieces with long dominant pedal points before resolving to the tonic. Since this piece ends with a long tonic pedal point, your ear might have mistaken that for the more common dominant pedal point and expected a resolution after the final chord.

[@geiryvindeskeland7208]

Samina Yaghouti, I am sorry for my inadequate English. The reason why the final chord sounds like a dominant it's because you are right, it's almost a dominant chord! Almost everyone respect the tie so they don't play the final C charp in the bass. If you play this fugue on an organ it works well to play the tie. But on a piano or harpsichord you need to play the final C sharp note in the bass to avoid the feeling of a dominant chord in the end.

[@minutiaetcetera]

I think we can note the iv chord at the end of measure 113, which moves into a I (1) chord, and could come off as a half cadence in f# min.

[@minutiaetcetera]

Also, I see the last instance of the primary subject occurs here, starting on F#. Instead of playing the final subject in the tonic key (as seems to be the norm for Bach's fugues), it is transposed to the iv-th degree (the apparent tonic for the final chord's dominant sound). Also, the theme doesn't fully play out, but stays on the penultimate note, a G# (a member of the true tonic chord). I'm sure after hearing everything up to this point, the listener would be inclined to anticipate the subject's final note, and thusly anticipate a resolution to the iv chord (a tendency fully supported by the factors mentioned in the previous replies, i.e. the C# pedal and the Picardy third)

[@Axadn]

That's crazy. At first it sounded like it was ending on the tonic to me, but after reading this comment it now sounds like it's ending on a dominant. Haha

[@powertompa]

the bass notes at bar 74 (4:23) gets me every time

[@louisvalencia5244]

I played it long ago and didn´t even noticed how great it is. Bach was surely one of the greatest minds ever.

[@paxwallacejazz]

Bernstein talks about the power and pull of chromaticism made available by Tempered tuning in his long analysis of Schoenberg's impact and importance. In lecture 5 the "20th century crisis" from his Norton lectures the Unanswered Question. He lists this piece along with many others as near tone row embedded deeply mysterious examples. Bach truly let the cat outa the bag.

[@PianoSkyCloud]

Your contribution is an eye and ear opener - thank you !

[@exequielchuaqui5968]

Hello richard. 4 years late I know... I still wantet to point out a "theoretical" entry of the subject that is shared by two voices, akin to the one you pointed out in your c# major book 2 video. Ut occurs in bar 17 between tha alto and soprano voices, right after the exposition is over.

[@momoalnajjar]

Yayayayay a new video by Richard!

[@topsecret1837]

The way Bach uses the idea of the fugue in this triple fugue is not unlike the way Tchaikovsky used a theme to his works 120+ years later. Bach was a mastermind of eras beyond his own style and yet used frivolous calculations to perfect it.

[@mtv565]

It's also a 4-note 1st subject because some critics say it is meant to represent the cross. By starting in the bass, it signifies the heavy weight of the cross. The unending nature of 2nd subject is meant to depict the crown of thorns. The 3rd subject I forgot what it was. So all in all, this fugue is said to describe Jesus' crucifixion.

[@SamtheMaestro]

73rd measure gives me the chills

[@vigokovacic3488]

I learned quite a lot from your videos. They enlightened my understanding of music which I deem very important for my own compositions containing some bits of counterpoint. I would like you to make some more videos on Mozart's counterpoint. The Kyrie from his Requiem has popped in my head right now. It would be a delight if you did a video on that. Thanks for your analysis! :D

[@twangbarfly]

Brilliant analysis and presentation and a great discussion on here - thank you so much for taking the time and trouble to produce this video, and thereby increasing my love of what was already one of my favourite pieces by Bach and deepening my respect for this extraordinary musical genius. Sincere thanks.

[@twangbarfly]

Thanks also to all the commenters for the lively and enlightening discussion! (it's not often you can say that on KZbin :-) )

[@Dnabati]

Thanks a lot !

[@christopherbarber9351]

Thank you very much! I wish I could claim to understand the music; but at least I have a slightly better insight into it as a result of Mr. Atkinson's clear exposition!

[@bradleystich6245]

Excellent video. The chord at the start of measure 112 is so dissonant, it seems to be a major triad with a minor sixth? Unless there's some better inversion or way to spell it?

[@Richard.Atkinson]

I'd probably just call it a tonic major chord with a dissonant neighboring tone (the A natural) that falls on the strong downbeat. If someone else has a better explanation, please chime in.

[@joseph-fernando-piano]

You could look at it as a resolution from the G# major V chord, which could resolve, among others, to the VI (A+, as a deceptive cadence), or using a Picardy third (C# major, with the E#). Here Bach uses both resolutions in the same chord, hence the dissonance!

[@moognificat]

Really great analysis videos! I hope you'll continue to make these. Highlighting the individual subject entries, countersubjects, and other motifs is awesome. It's rewarding to put a piece like this under the microscope, so to speak. We can better appreciate the genius and craftsmanship that went into designing it.

[@canman5060]

Most amazing of all is the Ricercar a 6 from the Musical Offering. That is the ultimate in counterpoint writing of all time.

[@geiryvindeskeland7208]

Lar M, If I were Bach, I’d be more proud to have composed BWV 668. Most people are unaware of the complicated polyphony. But Bach is not the only one in our music history - it was composed fantastic polyphonic music long before Bach’s time.

[@scronx]

Fine presentation and you seem to have found the definitive YT rendition of this extra-special piece.

[@Rayenn_19]

The first subject is known as the cross. The second subject is arguably represents the crown of thorns, and the third subject represents the pounding nails.

[@DanielCharry1025]

I found this fugue as a Shockwave presentation (Tim Smith @ NAU), and it's surprising to see a video like this in KZbin.

[@noirvalentin]

Is it me or the harmonics at the 3rd bar before last are funky ? Any explanation for this ?

[@VinceMadison]

Thank you Richard. Wonderful score.

[@MrLuteboy]

Really nice presentation of an amazing piece of music.

[@Richard.Atkinson]

Thanks!

[@leonhardeuler6811]

2:35 Isnt the bass playing the green subject in augmentation?

[@Richard.Atkinson]

Sort of, yes!

[@oldionus]

This is faster than many play this fugue, but I actually think this is a better tempo... the fugue is complex and solemn, but it is not a dirge.

[@geiryvindeskeland7208]

Guys! I am still sorry for my inadequate English. Some people are impressed because of the five parts in this fugue. The fugue BWV 849 as a composition is great! But as a fugue in five parts it doesn't impress me. And the reason for my arrogance? The entire fugue consist of 115 bars, but how many bars in five parts - 26 3/4, less than 27 bars! The fugue in B flat minor, BWV 867, consist of 75 bars, and 23 3/4 bars in five parts. It's obvious to me that Bach had something else in mind then composing an ordinary fugue in five parts. And it is interesting to notise where he use five parts. The major parts of five voices arrives after the three subject no longer is combined. Alain Bruguieres, quote: "It does have three themes. The three elements are of equal importance, none of them is subordinate to the others...." So the fact that Bach contiue with only two subject long after the second theme is quite don't support the statement of a triple fugue in this case. The fugue 849 is a fugue outside the frames. There are almost none episodes. The three subjects combines for the first time in bar 49, and the last time in bar 94. Between bar 49 and 94 there is not a single episode at all! Very strange! So how to explain this "out of frame" fugue? Signature "mmm", quote: "Yes, I've also heard some critics say this fugue is mean to describe Jesus' crucifixion. The four note 1 st subject in the beginning of the fugue represents the CROSS which Jesus was carrying and nailed to. Notice it enters in the bass, signifying how heavy it was. The 2nd subject of running quavers represents the CROWN OF THORNS....." Yes! That make sense! The symbolism! Or maybe not? cziffra1980, quote: "+mmm the second subject is beatifully lyrical and fluid. The idea that it represents a crown of thorns is one of the stupidest ideas I've encountered." Hmmm...beatifully...The key signature C sharp Minor was uncommon in Bach's lifetime. I believe that it didn't sounded beatifully as we hear it today. So my guess: C sharp Minor sounded more harsh back then. Take a look at the 1 st subject. Draw a line between the first and the fourth note. And then a new line between the second and the third note. What do we see? A cross laying down. It is not my own idea, I read about it in a book. And the symbolism can also explain the section between bar 49 and 94, without a single episode: Nailed on the cross, Jesus didn't got any rests from the pain, the pain was constantly.

[@tombombadyl4535]

What I would like to see is a score that color coded the voices instead of the themes

[@edelmantos]

Excellent! Thank you!

[@topsecret1837]

Kind of reminds me of Petscop. A video game where repetition is rampant with significant meaning between each repeated theme. Hence some video games are in fact “visual” fugues where a specific action or character reappears multiple times in a row, as a sign to a higher connection.

[@lylecohen1638]

Don't you think the third subject is nicked from the 1st violin sonata's fugue (or is it the other way around)?

[@twangbarfly]

Yes, I agree completely. Don't know came first but this is such a distinctive rhythmic and melodic figure.

[@johnbarnswallow]

brilliant! and very useful for students, spot on! Thank you

[@davidmelo9042]

Congratulations for the analyzis . thank you

[@bradyschultz808]

Why does the last chord sound like it wants to resolve to F# Major in my ears?

[@g.kech.10]

Richter is playing but not in the actual tempo he interpreted the piece. It resembles Schiff on an old piano.

[@user-je3tc5qp1g]

The deepest piece of music ever written. THX 4 your attention.

[@juanvicentezerpa7250]

Beautiful, thank you!

[@boyisun]

Great video like this equals genius Bach composition plus such nice detailed explanation 👍👍👍

[@ruslanyeleussinovgitara]

Great!

[@mozessiwang7751]

incredible Bach

[@paulkolodner2445]

Say, haven't I heard that second theme in (a) another fugue in the WTC and (b) in Shostakovich's fifth symphony?

[@jasonblairlewis]

can you do more wtC!?!

[@giannottister]

End of bar 48-beginning of bar 49, BACH motif, Soprano (transposed, E-D#-F#-E#).

[@CharlesAustin]

Heavenly !!

[@sebastianciarfella3061]

This is most likely gonna be my 6 or 7 prelude and fugue so I'm exited (currently on my 2 so still gotta do a little bit more work yet i finish these kinda fast so.....)

[@josepholeary3286]

I used to play this when I was 17 yo -- it taught me so much!

[@canman5060]

5-part fugue. Favourite exam work for grade 8 pianoforte from the Assoicated Board of the Royal School of Music.

[@geiryvindeskeland7208]

Lar M, The fugue BWV 849 consist of 115 measures, and only 27 of them have 5 voices, is that impressive? No it isn’t! This tells us that he had other plans than to compose a typical 5 voice fugue. The number 5 also have a religious meaning. Also note that most of the measures with 5 voices come after the three subjects are no longer combined.

[@canman5060]

@@geiryvindeskeland7208 It is indeed.

[@sci-fritz70FM]

Hi, I really like how you explain the resources that the composer uses, and this case isn't the exception; but I have two doubts yet, could you solve them please? The first one is about what's the name that recibes the contrapuntistic material like in the next example: a subject that starts in the first time of a measure but in the answer or in another section, the subject starts at the third time of the measure. And the second doubt is about how to identify when a fugue has more than one subject. Thanks for reading and continue explaining deeply. Good job. Best regards, Sci-Fritz.

[@aidan4624]

Always been one of my favorite fugues. Another favorite is the E Major from book 2. If you haven’t heard Grigory Sokolov’s rendition of this one then you have a great pleasure awaiting you.

[@schrysafis]

What about Sviatoslav Richter's recording?

[@aidan4624]

@@schrysafisHis is pretty good but I feel it’s SLIGHTLY overrated. Don’t get me wrong, Richter is a superb pianist and his WTC recording will forever be one of the reference recordings but it lacks a little bit of drama for my taste. I prefer his to Schiff’s but Sokolov’s recording contains some the most sublime piano playing I’ve ever heard. kzbin.info/www/bejne/mZe4qHWkh958mac The sound quality is a little lacking but with playing like that it doesn’t matter!

[@schrysafis]

@@aidan4624 I just heard of it. It's deeply touching...

[@aidan4624]

@@schrysafisSokolov is really quite special; I can’t recommend him enough! His Bach is especially great. Pretty good Art of Fugue recording too (I noticed your enthusiasm lol) kzbin.info/www/bejne/jGbXnHmoft5nrqs

[@schrysafis]

@@aidan4624 I like Tatiana Nikolayeva's rendition a lot. I prefer others play Contrapunctus XIV Fuga a 3 Sogetti though. To be fair I might be leaving this from my memory since I've been discovering pianists I didn't know but Grigory Sokolov was the first pianist I listened to on youtube back in 2015. It was his interpretation of Mozart's Piano Sonata no 8 in A minor K310.