When you hear “DarkChild” on the song you knew it was gonna be a banger.
@elrickpenn4 жыл бұрын
... On God !!!!!!!!! ... Word ...
@cnsmooth4 жыл бұрын
I strongly disagree with that statement
@MarcusDobson9164 жыл бұрын
@@cnsmooth lol he had a couple slaps.... But I wasn't feeling the fast hi hats, fast shakers, I like that nice tight poppy kicks, he didn't use 808s tho. The only thing I really liked was his style when it came to strings. That toni braxton song is crazy. I think it's called "wasn't man enough" the string are crazy.....very dope. The drums on that are stupid too. But I don't really like dark child, he would of been better if he stuck with artist like toni, and mya. But Destiny's Child wasn't cutting it.....
@cnsmooth4 жыл бұрын
@@MarcusDobson916 I hear you. I dont even dislike him, he has a right to be called one of the better producers of the time he was prominent in...but his name wasnt synonymous with great hits. Some songs were great and some some were meh. He probably had more good tracks than bad but still not enough for me to agree with the original post in this thread
@518goeshard4204 жыл бұрын
I feel like he’s so under rated when it comes to the conversation of producers. Everyone mentions Dre, timbo, wyclef, etc no one mentions darkchild
@reese3734 жыл бұрын
What we really need is a Jodeci Movie real talk.
@prehydes74 жыл бұрын
I'm still waiting
@willellis5024 жыл бұрын
A biopic opened casting a few years ago but I haven’t heard anything about it since..
@stellabellafontay93664 жыл бұрын
💡💡💡
@MissJaynet4 жыл бұрын
supposedly Vh1 got the rights to do it. and I remember seeing the open casting too
@shamickawhite95244 жыл бұрын
B double O facts
@lifeoftkae68174 жыл бұрын
His production on “you rock my world” ☝🏾 a legend period.
@pinball5724 жыл бұрын
Very! Its my kids favorite MJ song
@anjelheaven4 жыл бұрын
The vocal arrangements are out of this world too!
@lifeoftkae68174 жыл бұрын
anjelheaven i still get chills when i listen to it 😫
@mr.burlbattle22334 жыл бұрын
Facts!! That is one of my all time favorites
@Tha90sKid4 жыл бұрын
One of my favorite MJ song ❤ Rodney did his thing on that track
@brotherLee3404 жыл бұрын
I notice alot of the producers were raised in church heavy and played instruments. That's dope. Learning music is a powerful tool. Anybody can rap but having a ear for real music is special.
@MarcusDobson9164 жыл бұрын
A lot of the producers from the 80's and 90's lol But these "producers" today don't even play an instrument....they don't even know chords or how to read notes.
@brotherLee3404 жыл бұрын
@@MarcusDobson916 yep..even most rap producers from the early 2000s could play instruments. Manny Fresh, Zaytoven, Drumma Boy, Kanye West,Etc. Computers have made it too easy lol
@MarcusDobson9164 жыл бұрын
@@brotherLee340 oh yes exactly. Forgot about them....I'm so put off by the 2000's I forget about everything after 2010....it's like after 2010 (or really 2012 the so called end of the world) music, movies, and tv and internet have all changed for the worse. It's almost as if they were right, like they said 2012 is the end of the world, but not physically. Like the end of the world that you knew. I dunno....but shits crazy now that's all I know. But yes...I think lil John was the only one from that era that didn't play an instrument. Computers now load the sample for you, notes, in the scale you need, and even create a melody for you.
@t.o.o.smooth58704 жыл бұрын
And you definitely can see a difference in the type of music that came from these producers. Fast-forward to the common era of molly-poppin, degenerate music. 🤦🏿♂️
@johnsonzz-jw3oz4 жыл бұрын
@Brother James Yes Rodney's father Rev. Jerkins kept them in church.Rodney and family are from my hometown in NJ, and I remember when he was working with Whitney Houston in Pleasantville, and she came to his visit his dad's church one time. I don't know if Michael Jackson visited the church, but he was in town working with Rodney at his DarkChild studio in Pleasantville.
@kevinumba62814 жыл бұрын
Devante is one hell of a producer
@Pharoah5104 жыл бұрын
Devante was the one who laced up a young timbaland in the music production game
@kevinumba62814 жыл бұрын
@@Pharoah510 Timbaland also did the scratches beatboxing, and vocals on Diary of a Mad Band and After the show, hotel, after party.
@kevinumba62814 жыл бұрын
@@Pharoah510 Mr.Dalvin was also a dope producer as well
@itzjdub2824 жыл бұрын
DarkChild created Brandy's near perfect album. Never Say Never
@sweetlikez4 жыл бұрын
He really did. That album was a masterpiece!
@itzjdub2824 жыл бұрын
@@sweetlikez exactly
@itzjdub2824 жыл бұрын
@Escapism VSReality couple songs I pass on
@mintruth4 жыл бұрын
You mean PERFECT!!!
@CleanMusicLover2294 жыл бұрын
Best song is "Have U Ever", which was written by Diane Warren & David Foster.
@vegitausa4 жыл бұрын
Toni Braxton - He wasnt man enough for me (darkchild tag)
@friezasama88604 жыл бұрын
Clearly
@KreativeSoul4 жыл бұрын
Dawk child yeahhh *Toni voice*
@sexytrinny523 жыл бұрын
Yessssssssssss
@kaysha4 жыл бұрын
Such a talented creative
@ictembe4 жыл бұрын
Such a Legend 💪🏽
@char_d.09084 жыл бұрын
Love hearing his story! Didn't really know his background. But, I know he produced some REAL hit songs💯
@JohnJohn-zn3sz4 жыл бұрын
He's lnot telling the truth if i m not part of the story
@moneymacc63674 жыл бұрын
We need a Devante swing interview asap
@YoungBlaze4 жыл бұрын
He wouldn't do it
@queenladybug17024 жыл бұрын
@@YoungBlaze why do you think he wouldn't do it? Just curious 🤔
@YoungBlaze4 жыл бұрын
@@queenladybug1702 I Mean its just like why "Drake wont come on the show, or nas,sometimes you get to point where all publicisticy regardardless of what us fans thinnk, you dont want it (disregard the bad spelling)
@queenladybug17024 жыл бұрын
@@YoungBlaze I most certainly see your point. I love Nas and you're right, I've only seen him do two interviews and the most recent one was with the Breakfast Club.
@ricai1324 жыл бұрын
Devante is very private...does not like doing interviews. Still hoping Jodeci would do the verzuz though.
@sweetlikez4 жыл бұрын
We need a movie about Rodney Jerkins because he got so much stories. This interview was so good!
@emmanuelanning80904 жыл бұрын
Most underrated producers - dark child and Johnny j
@eastlos70904 жыл бұрын
Johnny J RIP
@Uncle_Kof4 жыл бұрын
💯
@deiselcobra854 жыл бұрын
100%
@ahshaadnichols74234 жыл бұрын
Love love johnny j.. him and pac was like Michael and Quincy
@agthaog19864 жыл бұрын
And Easy moe bee
@johnmiles61474 жыл бұрын
Jodeci is my favorite RnB group and I wanna see their biopic.
@jesuspiecemaster76834 жыл бұрын
Homie don't say Tupac to Vlad thats the beginning of the end of your interview
@dmxisbetterthantupac65284 жыл бұрын
Dmx > Tupac
@2pacisgay9554 жыл бұрын
Baby lane ended Tupac the ballet bishop 🤣🌈👯♀️
@moneymatters84574 жыл бұрын
🤣🤣🤣🤣
@cl33014 жыл бұрын
😂😂
@tiago71604 жыл бұрын
@@2pacisgay955 what's with all these 2pac hater accounts damn lmaoo u know pac neva denied that shit
@Kitchywac4 жыл бұрын
DEFINITELY one of the DOPEST producers to touch some cords! VICIOUS!!!
@honeybdream4 жыл бұрын
Horace Brown was so underrated ‼️🎵✔️
@Nov24thsFinest4 жыл бұрын
Still listening to his album in 2020👍🏾🔥
@TkKirkland-lm5wv4 жыл бұрын
One for the moneyyyyyyy
@Nov24thsFinest4 жыл бұрын
Kris P “Two for the showww... three to get the honeys...here we goooo!”👍🏾
@honeybdream4 жыл бұрын
Will Randall Same!
@honeybdream4 жыл бұрын
Will Randall Yes ✔️
@carlosrob64944 жыл бұрын
peace; Never ever forget Chuckie Booker who was a artist himself before he went into producing
@timothygeorge51064 жыл бұрын
Right!!! Chuckie Booker is definitely a legend!!! So underrated!!!
@simpdown14044 жыл бұрын
That was that nigga
@milansanchezwilliams4664 жыл бұрын
Turned Away was my aunts favorite joint
@jasondawson924 жыл бұрын
I love why you wanna play these games and love is medicine
@jaycoleman65524 жыл бұрын
It's *Chuckii* .
@danemartin29924 жыл бұрын
I remember hearing his Tags my whole life...Fixture in the Game Legendary 💯💯💯💯💯🥇🥇🥇🥇🥇🥇🏆🏆🏆🏆🏆🏆🏆✊🏿✊🏿✊🏿✊🏿✊🏿
@skinnyminnieog4 жыл бұрын
Absolutely🔥💯💪🏾
@stretchluv4 жыл бұрын
True. I was a young teenager when Jodeci dropped and I was messing with R&B at that time. I was into EPMD, NWA, Boogie Down, Public Enemy. When Jodeci came out...I got on board with them and only them.
@realnumber_94 жыл бұрын
Dark Child revitalized the late 90s r&b and hip hop sound
@novalove47904 жыл бұрын
"Darkchild Darkchild" 🎶 say my name say my name🎶 (that's what I always think of when I hear Darkchild)
@Ldddurtydizzl34 жыл бұрын
wooow...i thought that was a strictly Timberland produced song
@anjelheaven4 жыл бұрын
It's "Darkchild '99"
@aceito284 жыл бұрын
Yeah u legit 35 lol.. I miss those days
@sinmilitant81894 жыл бұрын
Want to see a Devante interview
@black90454 жыл бұрын
I beat lil D in the neighborhood 💪💪 god bless him
@landrelljones57084 жыл бұрын
I said this about 4 years ago, it would be epic
@dropdarealest4 жыл бұрын
He ain’t been the same since that robbery back in the day.
@balls_down_ya_throat4563 жыл бұрын
Devante just don’t do interviews because he say to much real shit he don’t fake the funk he’s doing good.
@omegahtv67794 жыл бұрын
Peace to Darkchild. One of the best producers out there
@melindamullins99714 жыл бұрын
Thank you for the interview this means so much Rodney Jerkins is The Mastermind behind so many of our classic huge hits awesome⭐⭐⭐⭐⭐⭐⭐⭐
@beans26054 жыл бұрын
First time I noticed the tag was on “Say My Name”
@davon44704 жыл бұрын
Same here hey before anyone kills me in the comments I admit I was only either 7 going on 8 or already 8 however that when I think I first heard his name on say my name
@bronxbully62614 жыл бұрын
By destiny child or no cuz he been out way before that Gina Thompson was the first time I heard him on the things you do song with Missy Elliot in 1996 and he was like on every brandy song in like the late 90s way before that destiny child song
@selfiekroos17774 жыл бұрын
Smart dad. He guided and taught his son the right way.
@RaquelCGary4 жыл бұрын
Everyone keeps talking about destiny’s child and brandy, but I first heard of dark child and seen Rodney jerkins on the Kirk Franklin track “Do Ya Wanna Revolution!” I started hearing his tag on other stuff after that. Very versatile, I love it!
@TheDJMysterE4 жыл бұрын
Loved that song
@phlickster4 жыл бұрын
Mr. Jerkins is so very together for someone who reached the heights of our celebrity and pop driven culture. It is totally refreshing. A true example and role model - for us all. Whether you are in the entertainment arena or not.
@haylotroutman78264 жыл бұрын
So saddened to hear about Casserine Young! She had a wonderful voice and a beautiful album with the guy Cato who co produced it with her and wrote some of the songs. I was very sad to hear that she passed,because I listen to her music daily. There's a live performance on here with Casserine and Cato, that I watch often.
@LibertarianGal3 жыл бұрын
Right. I had no idea that she had died! I am heart-broken. Why Not Take All Of Me is one of my favorite songs at all time.
@haylotroutman78263 жыл бұрын
@@LibertarianGal OMG, mine too! I never could find anything about her on an internet, not even her passing. That's surprised me cause usually you will find an obituary or something. I couldn't find anything. I still listen to her CD and even Kato the producer of the album's,I get a buzz, I love that song too, not everybody had the honor of singing with Patti LaBelle, Casserine had that honor.😇
@younggun054 жыл бұрын
🙆🏿♂️can't believe he produced my favourite song of all time 🤩🤗you rock my world🙌🏿🙏🏿RIP MJ
@jojodavis28563 жыл бұрын
He always made some of the best beats to me especially R&B
@bigmils444 жыл бұрын
Man I'm loving these interviews I heard his name before but never know his story great interview I can't stress this enough
@NeverIsNoOption4 жыл бұрын
He was the first producer tag user 💯
@djoneshks4 жыл бұрын
If u grew up in a Gospel home. Darkchild was labeled as a sellout to the kingdom.... ppl tore his name up in churches....now those same ppl doin choir remixes to his famous hits
@mesutozil94864 жыл бұрын
Lool facts. People used to say when you heard his name in a song it meant the artist was a mason or they were in the illuminati
@BbGun-lw5vi4 жыл бұрын
I wonder how difficult that period was for his family who was so involved in the church.
@carolterry61914 жыл бұрын
Dark Child is a Legendary Producer!!
@daelenevans29344 жыл бұрын
Facts😎💯
@hazey83484 жыл бұрын
Jodeci best group ever.. the most street rnb gangsta group.. Oh shit he said Horace brown.. my nigga ho brown was the shit.. whatever happened to him???? He was one of my faves..
@3BuckHead4 жыл бұрын
I need to hear him talk about Say My Name with Destiny's Child. He murdered that production. No other song like that.
@CuirPhotodotNet2 жыл бұрын
.....what i loved is that i would see major stars singing it back to them....literally in their faces...several huge stars did it....but of course the best....was WHITNEY....she also gave them her phone number...and they would call her....particularly ....Kelly...
@thesupervisor32704 жыл бұрын
We need a Devontae interview vlad
@73lyfe964 жыл бұрын
Coko - Sunshine "Darkchild....Nine-Nine..all up in ya spine"
@Jay42000Ай бұрын
“Sunshine, Sunshiiiiiine, you brighten up my day”. 🔥
@chrissantos42244 жыл бұрын
He looks like Daz Dillinger sounds like the game hahaha
@leetiprobinson85374 жыл бұрын
Yeah They look like they could be related
@jeremythompson68224 жыл бұрын
Wow lol
@gazwillz32254 жыл бұрын
Glad is still Getting them interviews!!!
@JCPFILMS4 жыл бұрын
I've never seen his face but as a child, my mama use to play the songs that ''Darkchild''... First video I saw of him was yesterday to posting this comment. Producing ''Hard Place'' by H.E.R popped up in my recommendations and that how I came across him.
@chaasarpachaad70444 жыл бұрын
Vlad: So you got your name from doing a lot of dark chords? Darkchild: No its whatever you want it to be thats not what it means . Also Darkchild: So yeah I got my name from using a lot of Dark Chords 😂
@BenFrankMadeThis8084 жыл бұрын
Same thing I said 😐
@KingAjali4 жыл бұрын
Same thing I said
@drpsych34 жыл бұрын
He wanted to tell his story
@YoungBlaze4 жыл бұрын
Lol
@narzhiotheartist81294 жыл бұрын
Interviewer: So Rick do you remember grinding your feet on Eddie's couch? Rick James: C'mon man how I look grinding my feet on Eddie's couch. I got a little more sense than that. ..... Rick James: Yeah I remember grinding my feet on Eddie's couch... Chappelle Show 😂😂😂😂
@nlee45664 жыл бұрын
The song "Cheat on you" by Json in 98 was the first time I ever heard the tag Darkchild. That song was fire!
@brycegoode89354 жыл бұрын
I miss this group man they was fire
@WilliamsWorld874 жыл бұрын
I always wonder who the guy was behind the sound. This is dope! He’s a legend!
@synethaitbe2 жыл бұрын
I've been searching for Casserine Young for so long not knowing until today that she passed away. My sweet school friend. She would come to my house after school and she also sung at our school graduation P.S.269 in Flatbush Brooklyn SIP friend🙏🏾😥😥😥
@globalreiАй бұрын
I said this years ago before Tupac tattoos shirt off there was jodeci before deathrow pendent there was the jodeci pendent
@dejahasan19804 жыл бұрын
Interview devante swing best producer out then
@carlosrob64944 жыл бұрын
He want do it. Devonte I mean
@KennyMacGMB4 жыл бұрын
True
@Boogiesince4 жыл бұрын
Yeah, DeVante don’t do interviews.
@Forever.Remain.Nameless4 жыл бұрын
He was cool but far from the best producer....
@dianevrules4 жыл бұрын
@@Forever.Remain.Nameless Besides R kelly, DeVante was the best solo producer during the early 90s.
@TheNotoriousKID4 жыл бұрын
Shouts to Vlad for being the dude who took this interviewing HipHop legends to this point.. I don’t understand the hate.. I just know I appreciate what I appreciate. And shouts to Rodney Jerkins for everything he’s done in the music industry.
@sunshineduffie22034 жыл бұрын
If he didn't make brandy sound the way he did I don't think the world would know her. This man is the truth
@observantvibes2 жыл бұрын
Brandy was already known in the world before she got with Rodney?lmao. First album, tv show, doll, deals, etc.
@Lenasevilla-yb4ei11 ай бұрын
What yall must be young
@12tribes61Ай бұрын
That 2000 rnb was sweet time 🔥
@aprilduffy11172 ай бұрын
This guy is so underrated
@bennybop53874 жыл бұрын
He wasnt man enough for me...toni braxton...he put his foot in tht beat boy
@Mrra-s9e4 жыл бұрын
I want to hear about his work with Brandy and Destiny’s child.
@itzjdub2824 жыл бұрын
Say My Name for Destiny's Child. Brandy's entire album Never Say Never
@leetiprobinson85374 жыл бұрын
Full moon by brandy was cool
@nme.001044 жыл бұрын
especially brandy,
@CleanMusicLover2294 жыл бұрын
@@itzjdub282 Except for like 2 songs.
@Mr4everzay4 жыл бұрын
A lot of the songs he said that artist said dark child on It just flows with the songs ❤️
@shaniefrancis21024 жыл бұрын
“Dark child 99, all up in ya spine AH” Coko sunshineeeeeee
@baberzafar58023 жыл бұрын
Devante did the tag thing in the 90s. He defo was one of the first
@Lenasevilla-yb4ei11 ай бұрын
Exactly
@smoothcutta4534 жыл бұрын
When I was young, I thought his name was DogChild!!!!!
@wunda8454 жыл бұрын
😂🤣😭
@honeybdream4 жыл бұрын
😁😩😆
@MsDonPizzle4 жыл бұрын
🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣
@chreezy244 жыл бұрын
Me too!!!!😅😅😅
@dawb864 жыл бұрын
lol especially the way Toni Braxton said it 😂
@Princess-yr2tj4 жыл бұрын
I love Jodeci
@ShantiForever4 жыл бұрын
He's a musical genius! Vlad gets all the dope interviews
@MisterFoxx4 жыл бұрын
I love everything DarkChild has produced. Especially “You Rock My World”... but I really fuck with the When I Grow Up remix lol
@qumarfreeman86044 жыл бұрын
Ok ok this the last Vlad video I'm gonna watch 😫
@becky9774 жыл бұрын
Even Jessica Simpson said his name on one of her 2001 tracks
@drpsych34 жыл бұрын
I’d like to hear how she said it! 🤣😂
@trentrama26454 жыл бұрын
devante use to run keyboards thru guitar pedals ...
@dawb864 жыл бұрын
Devante and D'Angelo were just of a whole different breed smh.
@doobiesonix4 жыл бұрын
So did Dilla
@Iamgoldygramz4 жыл бұрын
Sherron Davis Running keyboards thru guitar pedals allowed for some POWERFUL dedicated effects I.e. long sustains of the sounds, crazy delays, and you could chain them together to get that “lingering” feel that Devante sound had. I hope that helps.
@kpacshakur69694 жыл бұрын
Legend 👏🏾👏🏾👏🏾truly an inspiration
@PreachaTim4 жыл бұрын
Vlad got wet when Darkchild mentioned 2pac.
@mrsain194 жыл бұрын
"no Rodney......let ME tag the track for you" (Michael Jackson voice) I assure you, that's exactly how it went down. :)
@Shaqt04184 жыл бұрын
When I hear "DarkChild" I think about my childhood.
@DjmadnassScrewed4 жыл бұрын
I gotta admit Vlad ur blue print is priceless
@shaliea.richardson83944 жыл бұрын
Everyone forgets JoJo
@showmethem5ney4 жыл бұрын
For all the 90-2000's babies.. This is the man responsible for your existence.. One of the most consistently hitmaking producers in history..
@southeastd.c56363 жыл бұрын
Ayyyyyyyyyyye,slow down there potna.......Devante swing form Jodeci ran the 90s bruh
@showmethem5ney3 жыл бұрын
@@southeastd.c5636 “Darkchild 99”.. cmon now.
@Mr4everzay4 жыл бұрын
I need dark child and brandy together ASAP
@lancematthews1954 жыл бұрын
DOPE AND LEGENDARY RODNEY DARKCHILD JERKINS IS EVERYTHING TO R&B MUSIC- LANCE ROMANCE 😊😎✊🎶
@lovegod72744 жыл бұрын
I love anybody from my city & he put a lot of work in
@DrLauraRPalmer3 жыл бұрын
He looks so good!!!!!
@newnew41424 жыл бұрын
He was the first. "99 Darkchild Say my name say my name" 🎵🎶
@TheBoomBoxGuru4 жыл бұрын
"Four 2Pac's singin'", that's an great comparison.
@BreakHarpe4 жыл бұрын
This dude is a legend
@685_Era4 жыл бұрын
Glad just jizzed himself when darkchild mentioned four tupacs. Glad didnt have to ask a tupac question.
@robertsessoms10 ай бұрын
He was always in the Background..but well respected
@walkerk57294 жыл бұрын
My son aint living wit no grown ass man
@aandrews70944 жыл бұрын
He ain’t gon be no Grammy winning producer/ publisher either. It takes a village lol
@DrLauraRPalmer3 жыл бұрын
Pure brilliance
@stellabellafontay93664 жыл бұрын
Rodney was always such a big, pretty man to me- like a young Barry White. The old folks would call him "babymaking material." 😜
@gradyturner76274 жыл бұрын
Snoh Aalegra is dope as hell. I know the song is 🔥.
@notsogood94494 жыл бұрын
Rodney Jerkins: Jodeci was Like Four 2Pacs Singing Vlad: Speaking of 2Pac... who do you think killed him? Well... I recently did another interview with Keefe D and... Me: Damn... here we go with this shit again.
@sweeetzz4 жыл бұрын
Devante next pls...😩😭
@schoovaertssimon79044 жыл бұрын
Casserine was dope, I still play that 12", S.I.D remix is DOPE AF
@daystar733 жыл бұрын
Respect to him for recognizing his old man on the business tip and protecting him from that lawyer.
@michaelglazier99324 жыл бұрын
Didn’t the Trackmasters start the producer tag thing?
@joetate21464 жыл бұрын
Probably but I don't remember hearing one. Idk but I figure it started with DJ Clue🤔
@michaelglazier99324 жыл бұрын
@@joetate2146 Mixtape DJ’s are a different thing and most of them were saying their name on their shit, even in the 80’s. They weren’t producing the tracks though...
@Lenasevilla-yb4ei11 ай бұрын
No Devante swing in the 90’s
@mikej53449 ай бұрын
Why I can't find a DeVante Swing interview
@MrsAriHailey22 күн бұрын
DeVante doesn’t do interviews at all
@paigewashington60184 жыл бұрын
If no one is around you say baby I love you if you ain't running game
@qumarfreeman86044 жыл бұрын
LEGEND.
@ashleymarie19254 жыл бұрын
He needs a movie..
@kevinumba62814 жыл бұрын
Watch Glad bring up Brandy and how she did a reality TV series during the Full Moon Era.
@drpsych34 жыл бұрын
Why? What’s the thing about it?
@peterenetuidiah83174 жыл бұрын
Most influential producer in the 90s/2000s
@NAJErEa913 жыл бұрын
King Anthony Hamilton on the G.O.A.T.S. for real and in regard to Jodeci being 4 Tupacs singing. and the chuch said; AMEN!
@kaafaa59444 жыл бұрын
i m waiting stuff about MJackson
@beelowg4 жыл бұрын
Casserine “why not take all of me” is the shit
@AR-ii3ly4 жыл бұрын
It took a while for me to realise that was who he was talking about.