Roger Federer Forehand Analysis

[@JeffLewistennis]

Thanks for watching everyone please consider subscribing and checking out the links in the description!

[@TJ-ml4oy]

$150 for a tennis ball on a stick is crazy

[@tirregius]

30+ year veteran pro here ... I just want to mention that through the years of watching Roger train, he clearly spends a portion of every session finding the very maximum spacing he can achieve with his strokes, on both wings I might add. Every player should add this simple objective to their practice/training session EVERY DAY to ensure they don't chronically crowd the ball... simply experiment with the greatest possible spacing from the ball for your groundstrokes. Both FH and BH. Even 5 or 10 mins of this focus each practice will calibrate your strokes in an way that you avoid the very common issue of improperly close spacing, which students often spend thousands of dollars on me to fix ... improper spacing over time will lead to fundamentally flawed technique. Appreciate your video. Pretty much spot on!

[@JeffLewistennis]

For sure. I’m sure you’ve seen enough beginners run straight at the ball like they want to give it a hug to emphasize spacing 😂. Thanks for the comment.

[@tirregius]

@@JeffLewistennis Beginners for sure! ... Beginners have to go from manipulation of the world with their hands to the center-of-percussion on an instrument of tennis 😀. My comment was directed at more experienced players, in fact. Thanks for the chance to contribute. Keep up the good work. Subscribed.

[@MichaelDamianPHD]

Thank you coach!

[@jacobfashh2565]

I like how you took the time and effort in explaining

[@JeffLewistennis]

I like how you took the time to compliment me 😊

[@rajkumarv2140]

Sir, you revealed the truth about Roger's grip. This is something which i felt as well. He uses same (Eastern forheand) for many of his shots. That's the biggest secret of his success of using both forehand and back hand with equal ease. Great Thank you.

[@marktace1]

The reason Fed gets topspin with an Eastern grip is because he drops the racquet low rather than taking it back further. If he hit with a bent elbow like most of us the angle would be too steep, too much low to high. The path isn’t as steep making contact with an extended elbow, but is still low to high. Nadal does the same thing with a semi-western grip to get even more spin. A flatter hitter such as Djokovic takes the racquet back a bit higher and gets spin from the semi-western grip while hitting with a bent elbow.

[@ReidVV]

Fed actually has a very unique and individual swing that most players don't do well when trying to imitate, but as in this video, can take some things to use in their own technique. The one I see that's most translatable is Fed's contact point. He very consistently strikes the ball with his arm at a 45-degre angle from his body and out in front. If you watch video of all top players, you will see this 45-degre angle contact point is common. You could even call it the power point (see what I did with that). Seriously, go look at other slo-mo footage of any top player hitting forehands and you'll see it, chest turned forward, dominant shoulder in front of non-dominant shoulder, arm on the 45, POW! Not to confuse the issue, but this is also the almost exact point where the racquet and the racquet arm are changing from a more forward motion to a more up and across the body motion as the racquet strikes the ball and continues up and over the non-dominant shoulder. This contributes to Fed's ability to hit heavy topspin without using an exaggerated low to high swing angle.

[@pdiseris]

This video convinced me to stick with my eastern grip and cease exploration of the more modern western top spin way of hitting a forehand. It makes sense to use a single grip for multiple shots and have more time to set up.

[@JeffLewistennis]

Glad to hear it. You can get plenty of top with eastern.

[@gabrielteo3636]

Here's one thing I noticed. RF keeps his right elbow in line with his shoulders longer than almost all players and only starts shoulder internal abduction and internal rotation just slightly before hitting the ball. Most of his swing is body rotation. He windmills most of his forehand. I started doing this and it really helps especially on short and high balls. It also has the advantage of being able to hit the ball well from any foot positioning or running. The body rotation feels like you are using less energy.

[@ifeanyiikpegbu6465]

Wonderful analysis. You laid emphasis on areas others totally ignored. Thanks

[@JeffLewistennis]

Thanks for the comment! Glad you enjoyed it!

[@LinusFeynstein]

Excellent! You nailed it.

[@seguso]

The eastern grip allows Roger to hit with a straight arm, and therefore have more leverage (and power). Whereas if you look at Sinner or Djokovic, who use semi-western, the grip forces them to have a semi-bent elbow at contact time, resulting in less leverage.

[@karadagmert]

Very informative video, thanks coach..

[@JeffLewistennis]

You're very welcome!

[@mauricecatayan3406]

On grass, he sometimes slipped up into an eastern. On clay, slipped down into a semi-western. Typically though, he was in between. He generated massive topspin when needed, by starting the forward swing with the racket head well below the ball and below his hand. Shortly before contact, he uses internal shoulder rotation to rotate the racket upward into the ball.

[@CoachAdrian]

Interesting how you showed the two clips there at the end of Federer's forehand shifting his grip and turning racquet head abruptly after contact. I'd like to see the result of these shots. I don't think this is his norm and probably closer to a mistake. I like your observation though on how Federer's forehand is truly compact and really hits out in front to maximize taking the ball early. That extra fraction of a second is huge!

[@JeffLewistennis]

I don’t think it’s intentional and definitely doesn’t happen on every ball. But it happens a lot and the result is a solid shot just as if the grip didn’t shift. Not something you can teach that’s for sure.

[@futarydary]

Impossible, you cannot be so loosened up to let the ball change your grip. This should give some massive mishits/frames.

[@miguelbarahona6636]

Federer hits a bit below the center of the stringbed. That's the only way the racket tilts forward.

[@elevendct1102]

@@JeffLewistennis I think you are wrong, if the grip shifted in his hand at impact on these shots, that would mean he would not have an eastern grip anymore after impact. Do you have a clear video or pictures that show the grip is not eastern anymore after impact ? I think the opposite, on these shots, the videos show that, when he finished the shot (arm around body), his grip is still the same (racket head parallel to the ground)

[@elevendct1102]

I knew about these types of Federer forehand, to me it's not due at all to the grip shifting in his hand, but an immediate rotation of his (loose?) wrist.

[@navindjoonucksingh5502]

Thanks Jeff for making us aware of these differences that RF makes compared to the rest of mortals. Your analysis was awesome, just like you 🥰

[@JeffLewistennis]

Thank you!

[@a2casius]

Great analysis. Fab video.

[@JeffLewistennis]

Thanks so much! Glad you enjoyed it!

[@FF_AlohaEdition]

Federer uses a small handle. That’s why the grip shift easier. To sum up the.p video, Federer uses a eastern grip.

[@SimonDinesen]

Hey Jeff, great tuff thanks. - Where did you get that big tennis board ?

[@JeffLewistennis]

Dryerasedesigns.com Was actually a damaged one Ryan Reidy sent back that I got a good deal on!

[@ashlychauhan9151]

Absolutely fantastic explanation....thank you

[@JeffLewistennis]

Thanks for the comment! Glad you found value!

[@tennisfreak312]

Thank you for this video. I've been watching him for a long time and still there are things I did not know about his forehand, which is funny because his FH is the simplest but full of things for us to learn.

[@JeffLewistennis]

Yeah he’s efficient that’s for sure!

[@leemajella]

Have always played an Eastern FH. Been struggling with adding more consistent power. This definitely helps. I play an all-court game like Fed, so even though I've thought about switching to a Semi-Western FH, it just feels limiting and uncomfortable. Thank you.

[@JeffLewistennis]

It’s definitely tempting to just turn that sucker over a bit isn’t it!?

[@cfhar080591]

I hate the semi western grip. The eastern grip feels so comfortable.

[@JeffLewistennis]

@@cfhar080591 The brain does like the palm for direction.

[@cfhar080591]

@@JeffLewistennis It really does

[@thestuff8023]

I am a Pete Sampras fan, I love his forehand. It generates a lot of power for me. Hope you can have a video of his claasic game.

[@JeffLewistennis]

Love me some Pete Sampras! Need to try to find some good footage I can use.

[@babadeeAsp]

Thank you for this. I play this forehand and definitely will try this tips.

[@JeffLewistennis]

You’re welcome! Thanks for the comment!

[@swalterstennis]

Good analysis. USPTA PTR USTA HP Ex-ATP coach.

[@JeffLewistennis]

Thanks Coach!

[@twinwankel]

Jeff, nice video. Fed's Eastern grip is problematic for most pro players because it really requires that your weight is forward when you hit. You can see this in every forehand. He is nearly lunging forward. This is because if he doesn't do this the racket face will be too open and he will hit out. Taken to the extreme, when Fed really wants to crush a ball, he will jump forward and looks great doing so. And he definitely has a loose grip. I also play with Fed's forehand using a full western for most shots. Other times, I will use a higher elbow position for flatter shots. I think he does the same for flat shots. Of course, I don't think you can teach a loose grip technique because it's hard to control and for most people, they will tighten up on contact (sometimes they are not even aware they tighten up). And it's a talent that not every pro has. Nadal for instance, has tension in every shot he hits. His whole body tightens up. You can see the strain in his videos. I don't think I've seen the looseness in other players. You can see the lag but at contact, they are tight. Just look at tension in the forearm muscles. And some ppl will think the loose grip is an illusion but I can testify that for cross court shots you can be completely loose and really destroy the ball. It's a great technique Fed invented in 2005, he completely modernized the game for the entire ATP as everyone tried to copy it in 2006. Just look at Nadal's forehand before 2006 and afterwards.

[@JeffLewistennis]

Yes def need to more of a forward lean for eastern. And def yes to a lot going on here that I could imagine trying to teach to someone 😳. I often think though that if he didn't try to start getting SO FAR away from his body at contact that he would have a little more hitting zone and maybe not catch the frame every so often. His forehand had definitely changed over the years.

[@yashjain2305]

I find it difficult to maintain eastern grip on babolat pure aero racket as it slips to semi western whereas on other rackets i can maintain that eastern grip All rackets tried are of grip size 4 3/8 Is there a reason why?

[@JeffLewistennis]

Not sure. Sometimes grip slips are as a result of your body opening up early. The Pure Aeros also have wider frames that might have an effect 🤷‍♂ WOuld have to see it.

[@goggleboy2464]

He's hitting continental on half volleys, drop shots, and and many returns.

[@CaocaoXI]

Swing with an eastern grip, it will become obvious that you don’t need to do this intentionally. The backswing pulls the racket close, and the acceleration of the Unit turn pulls the racket open. After contact, unit turn slows down, it would pull the racket head close again. These all happen automatically. For Roger it just happens a lot faster so it’s a small window of open racket.

[@JeffLewistennis]

That sure would make my job a lot easier! Thanks for the comment!

[@CaocaoXI]

@@JeffLewistennis hahaha, I think that has something to do with the angle between the racket and the arm. Just like western back swing naturally makes the racket faces back. As long as the racket is powered by the unit rotation, the chain of the arm and racket lag would naturally create this rotation of the racket head.

[@vladimirbajic9906]

The actual thing that nobody talks about with RFs forehand is the position of his non hitting arm (palm) when he strikes the ball. Just watch when he practices, his non hitting palm is so much in front of his body and he literally catches the racquet as soon as the ball leaves the strings. This prevents the over rotation of the non hitting shoulder and keeps the racquet face closed even with the eastern grip. Just my 5 cents

[@JeffLewistennis]

Great observation! That deceleration of the opposite side would also work as a reactive break and help him throw the arm out faster. Good eye!

[@ncournault]

Great video Jeff! What's your personal take on Roger shortening his backswing loop as years went by? Do you think he did it mainly because the pace of the game increased significantly since he started playing or because he aged and his reaction time dimished or some other reason?

[@JeffLewistennis]

Thanks for the comment! It's a good question. I think Federer is extremely intelligent and most likely just figure it out. A good definition of efficiency is "the least amount of moving parts". Why not shorten things up!

[@francoissg]

Good points and observations...so which is it?

[@francoissg]

He got slow or got more efficient?

[@francoissg]

I think it's both...we should all try to play smarter/more efficient as we age...for longevity and more importantly less injuries...hopefully:-)

[@JeffLewistennis]

@@francoissg More efficient. Feel like he shortened it up before age started to creep up on him.

[@JeffLewistennis]

Did you take away anything that you think might help your own forehand?

[@chtomlin]

this seemed to be more about Fed's style than his fundamentals.

[@HCaulfield115]

No it takes too much practice and talent to hit the way Fed hits his forehand

[@KingCast65]

Thank you. I'm a ball-crowder lately. Hitting old old school Western too. I'm a fossil. But always working on it LOL

[@JeffLewistennis]

I hear ya. Keeping distance is something I have to constantly be telling myself. Thanks for the comment!

[@PeterFreemantennis]

Great video coach

[@JeffLewistennis]

Thank you!

[@CaocaoXI]

Great video

[@JeffLewistennis]

Thanks!

[@mhareesh76]

Spin will be generated automatically when you hit exactly at max arm extension point, from that point racquet will start coming towards you.

[@JeffLewistennis]

Thanks for the comment? Not quite understanding how this works. Is there a video you could point to that maybe explains it?

[@leokovacic707]

@@JeffLewistennis it's a different kind of spin , it's similar to what happened in a serve , the arm pronates but not completely from down to up but partly also from fright to left , depending on the contact thie either can produce power or spin , that's what's happening in your thumbnail picture , it's not alose grip cause the grip is quite firm on contact , it's the pronation like on the serve

[@crsantin]

I learned it’s generally not a good idea to try and copy the ground strokes of pro players. Good fundamentals and finding what works best for you is a better way forward.

[@JeffLewistennis]

Agreed. The trick would be figuring out what's fundamental and what's kinematic.

[@christianmilon2311]

This will not affect the shot because the ball is already gone. His contact point was sound and the grip may or may not change, possibly slightly.

[@JeffLewistennis]

🤔 Seems like such a light grip could effect the mass striking the ball and the racquet giving slightly could also effect outcome. Not sure exactly how but either way was just a testament to how loose and relaxed he is.

[@christianmilon2311]

@@JeffLewistennis actually my FH is a bit like him (😎) Eastern grip and short take back. What you get is a lot of racket head speed (especially with Roger huge racket lag) so that gives a strong contact point. (Speed gives some mass, the whole thing happens sooo fast). Due to the grip the racket also automatically goes somehow into that flat position. He usually doesn’t produce a high windshield wiper) So I don’t think that it is a result of an over loose grip. I checked a video and he seems it happens almost at every shot. Anyway I will call Roger to confirm that 😎😂

[@JeffLewistennis]

@@christianmilon2311 On the phone with him now. Will let you know how it goes. 🤪

[@karvastor57]

Roger's forehand is a modified eastern, very small grip makes it looks eastern but it's not

[@srinitaaigaura]

Compare his 2004-2006 forehand to today's forehand. It went through a lot of changes, but right now they're close. But there's more lag and snap while before it was a full swing.

[@CC42_]

It looks so good but the old forehand was much more dominant and never a liability.

[@marcodeluca4068]

How can teens get into future tournaments

[@JeffLewistennis]

A lot of futures events have qualifying tournaments that anyone can enter. However if you just play local events and win all of them someone will notice. If you're not easily winning all of them then you probably shouldn't be playing futures yet.

[@srinitaaigaura]

Also tell me why he shanks so often these days. When it's on it's invincible. When it isn't, it's a glitch in the universe. It wasn't that way from 2004-07. What happened?

[@JeffLewistennis]

Honestly I feel like he's SO FAR away from his body theres no room for a hitting zone. Like if he gets just a touch early his racquet is starting to pull. Just a theory!

[@raychayyc]

he is not getting any younger

[@hymansahak181]

Footwork is slower. He is late to the ball. Hence shanks.

[@grokker99]

Can i guy you a new overgrip?

[@willkittwk]

It's all about trying your best to set up where ball will be hit in easiest strike zone which invariably is from knees to around the waist in backcourt and waist to chest inside service box so it's easy to drive the ball down and avoid the net while not driving past the opponents baseline. Sometimes it's not possible and just have to improvise. Sometimes the instructions videos show a text book stroke off a perfect ball but lot's of stroke are all different angles when scrambling for points.

[@RVP-TENNIS-CONSULTING]

「フェデラー」を利用して商売しようとしてる奴、多いな。苦

[@ethanhan7402]

He is using a full western grip because the way how Roger holds the racquet when in contact with the ball and the way he finishes it

[@CC42_]

When his forehand was on (circa 04-10) it was the greatest shot ever, it's become a bit of a liability though recently.

[@JeffLewistennis]

Yeah. Going back and watching slightly older footage he didn't seem to get quite SO FAR away from his body at contact. Wondering if it's something he was doing on purpose but unknowingly shortened his hitting zone. Could explain the shanking.

[@edwardgrunder5628]

@@JeffLewistennis he had a pretty large loop back then .. he hardly has one now .. so it’s much more wristy now hence his Consistency issue

[@JeffLewistennis]

@@edwardgrunder5628 He definitely shortened it up! He finished higher too.

[@leonardmeulemeester6188]

Do you think the continental forehand Will extinct?

[@JeffLewistennis]

I think it will take some time but I actually think it will make a massive come back.

[@jag3384]

Why is an eastern grip more "conservative?" What the hell does that even mean?

[@JeffLewistennis]

🤔 I guess I just meant since 98% of pro players are on at least semi-western it seems to be less extreme? More traditional? Not Jack Sock?

[@cacaoperesoso732]

Worse Federer analysis done

[@CC42_]

It was actually an excellent analysis jackals. You must not know tennis fundamentals if you think this was bad.

[@fedr39]

First off, it's not an Eastern Forehand grip the proper name is Semi-Western grip. You Americans like to change things but in this instance completely wrong.

[@JeffLewistennis]

Was there something else?

[@hrabmv]

another loose Federer forehand preacher...which is dead end street