Roman Legions VS Japanese Armies

[@mojungle3054]

Can you imagine a Romanisation of Dragonball Z? "Quintus, take heed! His legio number is over VMMMM!" >Severus performing the kamehameha< *VENI. VIDI. VICIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIII!*

[@Deridus]

Toga=Trunks Cauldron=Pan Tomata=Vegeta Hades=Mr. Satan Goku=Goku

[@randyroo2]

"Quintus, take heed! His legio number is over VMMMM!" Best comment ever

[@BroadwayRonMexico]

"Vegetius" was an actual Roman name. Would be the best one for this

[@wolfspirittotem]

Instead of Roshi its Romulus.

[@OnyxXThePunch]

This needs to be made

[@sststr]

And it's not just advantages in technology and tactics for the Romans, but also in financing, logistics, administration, and all the other support stuff that makes fielding an army possible.

[@MrAaaaazzzzz00009999]

Taking that into consideration would contradict the fantastical elements of this scenario.

[@SilverforceX]

The Roman army would have all died out on the journey across Asia before they even reach the coast. Really, Alexander tried.

[@PM-fb3vm]

Actually the Romans /Byznatines/ made it as far as Crimea and Moscow. They sent missionaries from Macedonia and Kosovo to spread "Salvo" /Salvation/. And over time that word "Salvo" evolved into "Slavo" and eventually "Slav" until you had the modern word "Slavic" So, Byzantine Greco-Romans succeeded religiously where Latin Roman offshoots of the Greeks failed. my case an point "Orthodoxy" named by the Catholics as it is. It is actually called "Pravo Slav" /Orthodoxy/ with two interpretations. 1) "True Glory" as in "God's Glory" while the second 2) "Salvation". Even the word for "Festival" and "Celebration is called "Slava"/feast, celebration, holiday of celebration, etc/. This is why there are many Slavs. Not because they poofed from Russia /Only case was the Bulgarian invasion known as the Tartar invasions/. They shot up north from the craddle of European Civilization. And thanks to two Monks: "Cyril and Methodias" their culture actually predates "Germanic" rhetoric and culture by about "500-600" years. Modern Germans are "Saxons". These Saxons could barely write their name without an "X" let alone use a "Fork , Knife or a Spoon". where did you think the Russians, or the "Romanov" dynasty came from? Italy? no. Constnatinople as "Bojars"/Bojardi: Boyar'di/ (Warriors)

[@iivin4233]

True. If the Romans invaded Japan it would mean they had already made a bunch of mind blowing conquests.

[@phillip_iv_planetking6354]

@@SilverforceX Alexander's army died on the march back not to Asia LOL.

[@Eckister]

hmmm the Romans would likely start using wooden armor though. for firewood....

[@metatronyt]

LOL

[@edi9892]

Actually, good wood can offer you decent protection against even arrows, or an axe strike, especially with padding underneath. The problem would rather be that the armour breaks down too fast....

[@Eckister]

@@edi9892 no dispute there. but would it provide better benefits than an iron chainmail? Ill let you answer that for yourself...

[@mattaffenit9898]

@@Eckister Hamata is superior to wood.

[@cattraknoff]

@@Eckister It might be better against some kinds of arrows. Idk how common bodkinesque tips were at the time tho.

[@yaldabaoth2]

>grabs glass of water in dramatic zoom in

[@metatronyt]

Might look like a pointles thing but 1) I like it lol 2) It tells me you alteast watched until that point ;)

[@yaldabaoth2]

It was so random, I thought it was very funny.

[@Xarl-VIII]

Yeah I bursted out laughing and had to take a 10minute break to finish the video

[@metatronyt]

@@Xarl-VIII You are easily entertained my friend

[@Intranetusa]

@@metatronyt I don't think the Romans could have fully conquered Japan, and the Japanese would definitely not be speaking a Roman language. Why? The Romans never even managed to fully conquer Great Britain (let alone the British Isles) despite it being much closer to Roman territory and having an easier geography/topography to conquer. The British are clearly not speaking a Romance language today. Conquering Japan would've been much harder than conquering Britain based on geography. The coast of Britain around the area where Caesar landed is also only 20-30 miles from France, whereas Japan is at least 100 miles from Korea in its narrowest point (200+ miles distance in most other locations with more suitable landing points) and ~500 miles from the coast of China. The waters of the Sea of Japan/East China Sea/Yellow Sea would be much rougher than the waters of the English channel. There would also be typhoons/hurricanes (which wiped out Kublai Khan's fleets when he tried to invade) that wouldn't exist in the English channel. So to even reach Japan from Korea/China, the Romans would have a much longer distance to cross and cross much stormier waters compared to the English channel. Japan's topography would also have been more difficult to conquer - it has a icy tundra environment in north (due to the lack of a Gulf Stream which warms up Europe). The British Isles are also mostly flat or rolling lowlands with hilly areas mostly clustered around the northern areas such as Scotland. Japan on the other hand is 80% highland/hills/mountains and only 20% lowland. Japan's mountains are also steeper due to its geological youth (less erosion) and lack of glaciers to erode mountains. It would be much harder to move armies across Japan compared to Great Britain. So if the Romans weren't able to fully conquer Great Britain, then they wouldn't have been able to conquer Japan with its rougher geography and topography.

[@dtavs_exe]

The problem wouldn't be conquering Japan, the problem would be getting there.

[@EduardoFerreira-gi7wo]

They could never pass the huns which basically "protected" china from a roman invasion. Japan was a somwhat newer nation with poor technology, when Rome had excelent technology advances for the time. Imo: for Rome, conquering China would be rather Impossible, so they could never reach japan.

[@CorvinTheSwasian]

Especially with the climate there. Even if they got through China they would still have to deal with typhoons etc. Didn't the Mongolians try to cross multiple times but they always got drowned? (i may be misremembering)

[@Red-S-267]

themonkeywarrior111 they got to Tsushima in the 12th but thats it. Every other time Japan has been protected by wind and sea.

[@matthewkeogh4365]

@@EduardoFerreira-gi7wo Huns no their a little fish compared to the massive khanates to thee east like the Xiongnu

[@ViscountNo7]

Huns were moving away from east Asia and central Asia. "protect"? do you mean flee?

[@pjbaby66]

Great video! This kind of presentation is excellent in highlighting both cultures in an educational way but being entertaining at the same time! You're a good teacher Metatron!

[@metatronyt]

Glad you think so thanks

[@juanpablogonzalez8528]

Well, he is an actual teacher after all. I would have loved to have that kind of teachers when i was studying

[@JGSuttonJr]

I agree. It was amazing. If I did a video like this, it would consist of just his final statement. That's all I got.

[@larryhrh]

And you can hear as the music is not to loud!

[@CommissarLORDBernn]

Pasta vs Rice

[@thejarljbj5263]

Spaghetti vs Sushi

[@daswordofgork9823]

Ay Lord Bern from Warhammer 40k Dawn of War 2 Retribution

[@NH-xg1cp]

Paulo Mendes Metatron made a video about the history of pasta. Pasta was invented in China, however, in the Roman Empire, pasta was invented simultaneously. So no, pasta wasn’t copied from the Chinese.

[@oiurehj]

Why choosing?! In Italy you could have risotto if you want rice.

[@sabin97]

@@oiurehj damn....i was 4 hours too late....well played sir. you earned yourself a like.

[@EvilChudChimp]

Which Noodle Is better.

[@smdfromthatbackshawty9787]

pasta

[@ahightechlowlife]

Now you've done it. That is the true debate.

[@PASSPORTKING2106]

RAMEN FTW! LOL 🤣

[@SkippyTheSpiteful]

Top ten questions science still can’t answer

[@crozraven]

asking the hard questions indeed. Both originated from China, so I guess China would win it instead?

[@jacobali333]

The title should be "Spaghetti VS Ramen"

[@Sahiyena11]

Please god don't make me choose 🙏

[@Pooknottin]

An easy victory for Italy there.

[@strengthisabsolutestrength8215]

Ramen is better.

[@WarmPillow-hs6kj]

Ramen better

[@gm2407]

That is using your noodle.

[@adriansoto343]

I like how much you have improved since your first videos, and I want to greet you for all your work and passion when teaching about history, I also like the variety of content you offer and I wish you te best.

[@metatronyt]

Thank you very much!

[@TrueMentorGuidingMoonlight]

2:27 Yayoy/Kofun Armor 8:35 Lamellar Armor 10:17 Roma 12:09 The Roman Shield 16:44 Greaves and Manica 18:56 The Clash

[@elijahc.brooks3493]

Hey Metatron, I got my Greek Corinthian helmet for Christmas. It feels so good wearing it. If you’re curious about it, look at my picture up close. Awesome video! I feel so educated by you. I’m really reading history now and not the Wikipedia on the internet. I hope you inspire millions to be intrigued of history. God bless!

[@metatronyt]

Cool looking helmet pal and thanks for watching

[@elijahc.brooks3493]

Thanks Ralph and I want to let you know I’m always appreciative that you answer me. Even if you can’t answer my comments, I’m grateful to be one of your subscribers. You rock and thanks for calling me friend.

[@deino117]

Are you a professional narrator? Because you don't just have the voice - you have the delivery. Nice work!

[@metatronyt]

Thank you very much! I put passion in what I do sir :)

[@AnubisTheMaster]

@@metatronyt but he doesn't have the long hair .... anymore

[@NobleKorhedron]

@@AnubisTheMaster: No offence, but who cares? I don't, unless he claims to be depicting a hairstyle, and doesn't wear it...

[@salt_97]

He's a teacher

[@theromanorder]

"YOUR THE VOISE TRY UNDERSTAND IT. MAKE A NOISE AND MAKE IT CLEAR." Who gets the joke? Who knows that song?

[@dontsubscribe3702]

ROMA INVICTA, WEEBS

[@yaldabaoth2]

Just wait 300 years and some uncough barbarians with similarly bad equipment completely kicked roman butt.

[@Joe-qw5im]

The Goths, Franks, and the other Germanic tribes are quite well equipped if I might add.

[@dontsubscribe3702]

Then Constaninopolis Invictis

[@dontsubscribe3702]

Vocabula veritarum( I think that's correct)

[@yaldabaoth2]

@@Joe-qw5im I was thinking about the Huns.

[@TheColombianSpartan]

Roman boi: *Yeets pilum* *pilum gets stuck* Roman boi: get rekt mate

[@Kkey884]

Videos like this, plus your soothing voice, are precisely why you’re my favorite presenter when it comes to anything to deal with weapons and armor of almost any period. You just have a passion for both of these cultures, so I think your view is the best in the world when it comes to such a match up. The presentation in this video is the best you’ve done hands down. The music, graphics of the transitions, everything is just so... crisp! I’m sure you’d love to spend a day with either army in the field, at least outside of battle of course! And, well, we’ll just have the Romans speak Italian! Just bring some pasta. You’ll make quick friends.

[@captainzenbi]

Think a comparison to China would have been more appropriate.

[@nagybalazs4501]

captainzenbi “General Ceasar! Do not pursue Lu Bu!”

[@crafterofdoom]

was looking for this

[@adrianfirewalker4183]

Metatron has done this

[@SweetMattieG]

It has been done.

[@emperorconstantine1.361]

Wish granted!!

[@thatonenerdwhoreadsbyhimse5429]

I have always loved the discussion with different ancient armys that never met in actual history but are put up against each other in a hypothetical situation. Some how you always make this topic more fun to talk about.

[@peter-radiantpipes2800]

I’ve used Metatron as a handle online since 1996. Damn you for getting to it before me here. But your channel is great! I grew up studying various martial arts since 8 years old, including fencing, Epee and Sabre, Kendo and other various weapons over the past 30 years. It’s great that you and Shad are here on YT. (Found your channel through his)

[@user-mr1zs1np7w]

I love your videos metatron

[@metatronyt]

Glad to hear!

[@tauempire1793]

13:07 aye it's my Ethiopian boi who joined the Roman army. What a lad, great to see he's doing good over there

[@Impaler00100]

Dude, I enjoy how precise and meticulous you are about your details. I look up to you and hopefully will one day be able to outstand you.

[@gary0044187]

I never considered a comparison of rome and japan, I always wondered more about rome and Han dynasty (especially considering comparative national power) or what would have happened if Alexander made his way to Qin during the warring states period?

[@stormrhode2330]

In the end, you expressed more of your belief/theory than opinion. Just a constructive critique. :) Great video replete with great information. I'd love to see even more of these comparisons and what-ifs.

[@williamgoo7621]

21:16 - No. If the Romans manage to defeat the Ancient Japanese in a field battle, they will speak English instead of Latin. “OUR MEN ARE RUNNING FROM THE BATTLEFIELD!!!! AHH.. SHAMEFUR DISPLAY!!!”

[@Chiinkayy]

William Goo you’re so funny dude

[@kapitan19969838]

I understood that reference!

[@fedda9999]

this is a black day, our general has fallen

[@giannis7043]

Rome total war vs shogun 2

[@richardquinones2959]

Once again you hit it out of the ballpark great video brother😁👍👍

[@kek6969-w9y]

Metatron, I tought Roman armor of the Republican times was made out of pasta... 🤔

[@metatronyt]

I wish

[@budibausto]

nah dude, it's sheets of Lasagne, lots of them, uncooked and stiched togheter.

[@matthewpham9525]

You’re getting that mixed up with modern armor, pasta armor only began to appear when firearms were introduced.

[@jacobockman709]

So that is where the French baguette originated from.

[@GhostRS3411]

budibausto in other words, extra carbon pasta

[@roshamia]

木製の鎧や盾は、後世の足軽の陣笠のように漆を塗って補強していたかもしれません。漆は乾燥すると素材を堅固にするためあらゆる武具に塗られました

[@tercomada]

Y aún así roma arrasaría Japón

[@camrendavis6650]

Put them against Han dynasty armies. I think the Roman Empire existed around the same time as the Han Dynasty, and early Han soldiers were well disciplined Warriors and comparable to a Roman legion. Plus, there are many rumors by historians that say that the Romans and the Chinese fought a battle once. It would be the perfect match up Edit: look guys. Lets stay on topic here.

[@withastickangrywhiteman2822]

The Chinese power grown and dropped quickly. When Chinese were strong they were hard to deal, They drove Huns to the west for example. but when they were weak, anyone can deal them easily. so if Romans fight Chinese the ending will rely on if the Chinese are strong or weak by that moment.

[@camrendavis6650]

WithAStick AngryWhiteMan totally true, like I said, early Han Dynasty could stand a chance

[@camrendavis6650]

WithAStick AngryWhiteMan whoa whoa whoa now. This got unnecessarily controversial and biased. We're talking about ancient China not modern China

[@withastickangrywhiteman2822]

@Camren Davis Unlike modern Greeks, The Chinese are NOT merely a shadow to those Hans. Just look at IQ map, isgp-studies.com/miscellaneous/race-and-iq/global-iq-scores-black-white-asian-hispanic-arab-large.png Napoleon actually said beware of them, it's necessary they should be limited

[@ousamadearudesuwa]

@@withastickangrywhiteman2822 get out of here you modern observer we are talking about Han China and Wei China when Gogryeo, Baekje, and Silla were warring Korean kingdoms.

[@rameyzamora1018]

Your professionalism is developing, Raf! This is a beautiful video. Thank you so much for all this hard work.

[@HuyGia-wp5tx]

Roman full-scale armor Calvary soldier approached a Japan village: we came to talk to your leader. The village: Oni!! (Then proceeds to abandon defends). The Roman trooper: (asking a Japanese translator) why are they running? The translator: (stare)...look at yourself in the mirrors.

[@dokletian1951]

Excellent video as always, but you have to admit that some of the camera moves and angles were a bit hilarious :D

[@veritasardens6547]

While it is true that I love the samurai sword and the way of the samurai, I have also come to admire the organisation and the technological prouesse that the Roman army had because of my love for the Latin language and after watching many documentaries about the Romans, so it is true that in the epochs described by the Metatron when the Romans and Japanese warriors would have hypothetically met in battle, the Romans would have definitely had a massive technological advantage over the Japanese forces and the Japanese would have spoken a Romance language today. Good comparison Metatron!

[@jacobberry5138]

You are reminiscent of the original history channel. Unbiased and educational. Thank you again, sir.

[@metatronyt]

Ye no aliens involved here u.u

[@xaviercrow6997]

It would be interesting to hear the romance language that the Japanese would speak. Especially with the heavy influence the Chinese would have had

[@roycspary8923]

nice one o hairy angel. well thought out and presented

[@kingkuroneko7253]

Hay metatron what about ancient Korea?

[@hessanscounty3592]

That fight would have been more even, but would have likely resulted in Roman victory. While iron was much more common and the Korean states more familiar with organized warfare thanks to their proximity to the Han Chinese and internal conflict, the Korean peninsula was still broken up into conflicting kingdoms and confederations of city states for the time period in question.

[@withastickangrywhiteman2822]

@Hessan's County But if attacked Korean they will beg their Chinese dads for protection as they always do. Koreans always seek big dads to protect them. "My dad will sue you!" Now their dads are Yankees.

[@hessanscounty3592]

@@withastickangrywhiteman2822 While not phrased very nicely, you do have a point. However at this point northern China would be ruled by the Han Dynasty and later the Wei Dynasty, who would be more likely to conquer Korea as come and help them. That sort of close relationship did not come about until the Tang-Shilla alliance.

[@jonbarad1]

Yes do Vs China. Although Japan is interesting China had the tech and numbers to maybe....beat the Romans at their own game!

[@withastickangrywhiteman2822]

The Chinese by that time had a lot of crossbows, a thing even Huns fear, very powerful to against armors. If Romans against Chinese, they will have to overcome bolt rains. unlikely it is possible considering Romans lost to Huns

[@Peptuck]

What I love about Metatron's videos is that he never just goes with the typical internet "make these two groups fight in a vacuum" but instead analyzes comparable periods and the cultural and social context in which these armies existed, which were often just as crucial to deciding who would win in a war.

[@metatronyt]

Glad you like my work pal

[@-Zevin-]

Great quality video, however it seems like a fairer comparison would have been Han dynasty China against Rome, that would be a much better fight, Japan at this time was a backward, fractured tribal society certainly not a empire. The Chinese at the time barley considered the Japanese Islands a passing curiosity(viewing the people of the Japanese island much like how the Romans viewed the ancient Britons.) All the while the Chinese built massive fortifications and walls of stone, raised massive armies, (from a population of tens of millions) even surpassing the largest armies that Rome ever assembled. At the same time China was already using trebuchets, mass production of crossbows, technologies that didn't really take off in Europe until hundreds of years later. Not to mention the very well established and creative use of military strategy and tactics, with generations of Generals studying the art of war. Chinese history and Chinese military history is criminally underrepresented in the west.

[@camrendavis6650]

Zevin X that's what I said

[@jurgenkarambit2084]

agreed,here,have your thumb up good sir.

[@mirsad7]

Please make a roman empire vs samurai empire video both during their heights. Maybe even a series going into detail. Great vid thanks!

[@Angrypolack]

ROMA INVICTA!!!!

[@gorillanobaka9772]

Amazing video indeed, and may I say , good command of English language as well as excellent presentation ... I'm sure it took a tone of research. Would be really interesting to see all the references added in the description.

[@fishnujish1511]

Roman Anime: I-I-sure hope Senpai Caesar notices me. *sighs and blushes*

[@brandonhey7797]

The fuck? 😂

[@arya31ful]

@@brandonhey7797 "You think i'm your beloved Julius Caesar.... But it was me!, Marc Antony!.

[@koryonos-geheim-einherii]

( *cultured* *anime* intro ends) Oh no, both Gaius Julius Caesar Germanicus -senpai and Nero Claudius Caesar Augustus Germanicus-senpai are coming after me.....

[@hawkticus_history_corner]

Damn man, that quality is just *mwah*. Love to see how much you've improved, gives me hope for myself

[@doggo1098]

The 25% Japanese in me wants to think "The Japanese will destroy the Romans!" But yeah, who am I kidding.

[@easyalpha1]

Listen to that 25 %....Japan had the numbers to wipe out the Romans.

[@nelson_rebel3907]

@@easyalpha1 I like the japanese warrior culture. But no. Rome was feared and admired and hated for a reason. They were brutally effective, well organized, well equipped, and well trained from the lowest soldier on up. Even if Japan was a fully united Japan (which it wasnt) their tactics, armor, and weapons wouldnt have lasted long against a serious roman invasion. Although it is incredibly unlikely rome would have been able to get that far with any signifigant force

[@robertt9342]

@@easyalpha1 . You’re kidding right? Their numbers weren’t that high. Now the Chinese is a different story. Higher population, better weapons and organization than the Japanese of the time.

[@easyalpha1]

@@robertt9342 that’s the point, do you have both the Japanese and Romans meet each other at their peaks of power? Or do you give a time era advantage which would favor one side?

[@williammanues7716]

I p agree with most of your conclusions with the addition that the Roman legions orginazation,disipline and tactics of unit cohesion would be significant factors in battle.

[@elleCX01]

"their armor, weapons, and tactics will be explained and compared..." to see who would win in a Death Battle!

[@brianfuller7691]

Great video, sir.

[@ApexPredatorWithSungGlasses]

Legions VS Mongols. That'd be interesting. Both adapted greatly and are very disciplined.

[@johnwicksfoknpencil]

ApexPredator_ What would be the point? They’re separated by too much time. What’s next, compare medieval knights with US-SOF? Same difference in time period, same ridiculous comparison.

[@thletrelas3817]

Mongols win gg

[@thetemplar8167]

The Romans would win depending of the General , just re-use the phalanx formation and put it together with the forces of artillery and auxiliaries. If everything goes well there will be low casualties in the roman side , I'm not an expert about the Mongols but I'm sure than artillery is something rare to non existent in such quantities as the Roman legions.

[@johnwicksfoknpencil]

Meander T1 No shit gg. Just like Mongols vs US Army 2018 = Army win gg

[@thletrelas3817]

Remember Crassus.Just like that

[@carebear8762]

Fantastic video. You continue to produce high quality content. Thank you and I look forward to 2019. I have started (casually) looking at the wooden armor of the Southeastern Alaska Native tribes (Haida and Tlingit) which apparently was at least not ineffective even against Russian muzzleloaders. Be interesting to see how the styles compare around the North Pacific Rim over time.

[@Seriously_Unserious]

Great video as usual Rafe. While I do agree with points you brought up, there is one HUGE point that would be working against the Romans in such a scenario. Their armies would have to travel a VERY long way to invade Japan, bringing up a HUGE issue with logistics. In short, unlike the Roman invasion of Britania and the Scotts, where they were relatively close to their own borders, an invasion of Japan would involve a HUGE voyage around Africa, past India and through the SE Asian archipalagoes and up the Eastern coast of mainland Asia. While Romans would be very well equipped when starting out on such an epic campaign, how well organized and equipped would they be by the time they finally arrived at Japan, a few years later? I think that is a huge enough point that it bears a follow up video.

[@SonsOfLorgar]

And the Romans would most likely have been forced to stop to replenish losses of both men and ships several times along that many-year voyage. Though they would probably skip Africa completely by disassembling their ships in Alexandria Africanus and reassemble them in the Red sea. Crossing to India by way of the Horn of Africa and the Persian Gulf.

[@metatronyt]

I think this scenario would make sense only if Rome conquered China or Korea first and have a base of operation, like Gaul when going to Britannia.

[@patrickbrennan1317]

Jason Ross logistics often gets overlooked but it will make or break you in war or even peacetime operations

[@Seriously_Unserious]

@@metatronyt I agree. If Rome was going right for Japan, they'd have nothing left but a ragtag band of survivors by the time they got there. I'd love to hear your thoughts on how Rome would fare against China during the same time period. I think here you would be seeing more of a clash of equals. But for even that to work, Rome would have to do something they failed IRL, conquer the mighty Persian Empire. Or again, find a way to go around Persia. Which brings us right back to the original logistics dilemma.

[@seanbissett-powell5916]

@@metatronyt Great video, and so nice to see a recognition that Japan had a history before the samurai ! My understanding is that Rome's trade network to the Far East via the Red Sea and southern Arabia generated a very significant portion of Imperial revenue - Dr Raoul McLaughlin did an interesting KZbin video on it, kzbin.info/www/bejne/eJLEfXqIj5qepKc How about a long-term scenario (say, from the end of Punic Wars to the early/mid Principate) where Rome acts to secure this trade route more thoroughly, initially with Roman rather than locally controlled trading posts. Military involvement would happen as soon as the locals got twitchy. Expansion would likely be an unplanned and creeping advance, similar to the way Northern Europe was occupied by just dealing with whoever created opposition. After a couple of centuries, I can see Rome having a long strip of lucrative coastal provinces, from southern Arabia, to the west coast of India, and maybe the whole of Ceylon. The different types of sea would likely spur technological development (oh okay, "borrowing" other people's technology as the Romans were so good at) so the Romans would have more seaworthy ships, capable of making the crossing to Malaysia and Sumatra, where the whole trade - military post - expansion thing would start up again. Admittedly this timeline would need some very serious changes to the history we know - probably including firmer succession rules to reduce the number of civil wars. But it has the advantage that it avoids the need for the Romans to fight their way through Parthia, Central Asia, China or Korea. Dealing with the various post-Mauryan Indian states could be a great video in it's own right, although of course the Romans knew how to handle elephants.....

[@noelebbert9322]

I love your longer information videos

[@fr0ntend]

Roman empire vs Han dynasty.

[@harrymcnicholas9468]

No Roman empire vs. Mongolian.

[@fr0ntend]

Harry McNicholas mongolian stomps

[@fredericksaturnine4167]

Romans die every time.

[@SteaksOnSpear]

Rome would lose to shear numbers if we just imagine they could ever field armies against each other.

[@dontsubscribetome3262]

@@SteaksOnSpear rome could actually muster up similar numbers and they have won many battles outnumberd

[@kevlarandchrome]

Excellent information, really good food for thought.Thank you, and happy new year!

[@edwardpate6128]

One of Rome's great strengths was it's ability to bring in and assimilate other cultures into its own. Japan never did that. I've always thought that was one of the great strengths of the Empire at its peak.

[@dreamofknight6639]

Wow thanks is nice to see the different aspects of the Army's compared. Leant a thing or two as well thanks

[@Quilgen]

Only thing that would stop Romans (and did) would be logistics... Reinforcements and supplies would be almost imposible to get to Japan.

[@harrymcnicholas9468]

The Romans were stopped by the Iranians. They could not conquer outside the Med.

[@tophatdalekthetophatteddal7402]

@@harrymcnicholas9468 The main reason they failed was because of the terrain of Iran. The region was too difficult to conqeur given the hills and valleys. The Romans did actually conqeur outside the Mediterranean. Mainly Britannia or Albion as they called it.

[@VexxedSR]

Amazing video. You deserve 20x the subs!

[@IlBaroneRozzo]

Next video: Alexander the Great VS the Aztecs

[@andredulac4456]

Well, I guess the phalanx will not be really usefull in tropical forest and moutains :p

[@dontsubscribetome3262]

@@andredulac4456 why do you assume it must be on aztec territory

[@crisr.8280]

An honest comparison and a most likely correct opinion. I do wonder just a bit about when a factor of climate and environment is taken in as there is a grave difference in the flora and fauna. I'd imagine a bit of the 'new world' population decimation to occur, albeit less destructive to either armies.

[@benjaminschmidt3022]

Maybe he meant that Yayoi armor was made of wood but he uses the term japanese just for a later periods because it is a little bit far stretched to call yayoi periode people japanese. Its like saying that a celtic warrior from Britania was english:D

[@edged1001]

Excellent video. I think a video comparing the Chinese armies and the Roman legions at a similar time frame would even more interesting.

[@atlasstories_]

I visited Rome last week! amazing city , magic atmosphere!!

[@JSPagliacci]

I really appreciate just how detailed this investigation was. It feels like I'm back in grad school.

[@dreadrath]

As much as I like Japan, they'd get steamrolled by any empire of the time period.

[@KaiZX]

Even Aztecs?

[@bleflar9183]

@@KaiZX Pretty sure Aztec empire wasn't a thing back then. It was made somewhere around 15th century if my memory is functioning properly.

[@bain6655]

@@spencermadsen8752 I dunno about that, mid to late 16th century Japan would have been a match for most if not all European land armies.

[@bain6655]

@@spencermadsen8752 They were well versed in the early modern warfare of the time, innovated the pike and shot tactics (continuous volley fire and archer cover fire while the matchlocks reloaded, standardised calibres, gun sights) had more firearms than any European nation and could likely field bigger armies than the majority. For sure they were behind in many areas, but I don't see them getting steamrolled by any of the colonial powers. There's a reason they weren't colonised.

[@bain6655]

@@spencermadsen8752 The thing that held Japan (and Korea) back in the later centuries was their self-imposed isolations. By the 18th and 19th C I agree they were far behind the western powers militarily and wouldn't have been able to stand up to them then. Hence why they were forced into the unequal treaties which China had experienced.

[@kevindaniels7386]

Well narrated. Like how you use the same time periods instead of the next of the 2.

[@afriendlycadian9857]

God the cringy comments of people trying to pretend they know history it actually makes me die

[@Velocispic]

Another great video, amicus.

[@oguzhantavus4237]

If that would happen , we could see anime girl sculptures around the Caesar-chan and chopsticks in Italy today.

[@oguzhantavus4237]

@anythingnew hahahaha brillant :)

[@shanedoesyoutube8001]

Nahhhhh, more like the case of Caesar going "et tu, Brute" with the inscription "OCTAVIVS!!! ORE NO SAIGO NO HAMON DAZE!!! VCETOTTECVREEEEEE!!!"

[@allengrantham6693]

Metatron, Have you done a video on the Anglo-Zulu war? Rork's Drift and Isandalwana are modern armies vs iron age armies. At Rork's Drift the Zulu startegy was to try to close with the British where their spears and shields would be superior to bayonets on empty rifles. They achieved their goal. At one pont three of the spearmen faced one British soldier with a bayonet. He killed all three of the zulus. This shows the effect of training and an understanding of terrain overcoming an advantage in weaponry.

[@ForgottenHonor0]

I feel Rome would have run into the same problem the Mongols did during invasion. The best time of the year for it almost always fell in typhoon season, which is why the Mongol invasion fleet sank both times.

[@ForgottenHonor0]

@@googleaccount93 Why?

[@harrymcnicholas9468]

Actually the first invasion failed because the Mongols did not have enough troops. The second invasion failed because the Mongols made a blunder. They had catapults shooting grenades which destroyed the Japanese front line of defense. They then decided to finish off the Japanese with swords. They left the catapults and grenades on the ships and went off to fight the samurai. They lost and had to get back on their ships and then is when they were caught in the storm. Kublai Khaan simply was not the great general his grandfather was.

[@maincoon6602]

Great video 👍🏻

[@Intranetusa]

The Romans likely could not have fully conquered Japan and the Japanese would definitely not be speaking a Roman language. Why? The Romans never even managed to fully conquer Great Britain (let alone the British Isles) despite it being much closer to Roman territory and having an easier geography/topography to conquer. The British are clearly not speaking a Romance language today. Conquering Japan would've been much harder than conquering Britain based on geography. The coast of Britain around the area where Caesar landed is also only 20-30 miles from France, whereas Japan is at least 100 miles from Korea in its narrowest point (200+ miles distance in most other locations with more suitable landing points) and ~500 miles from the coast of China. The waters of the Sea of Japan/East China Sea/Yellow Sea would be much rougher than the waters of the English channel. There would also be typhoons/hurricanes (which wiped out Kublai Khan's fleets when he tried to invade) that wouldn't exist in the English channel. So to even reach Japan from Korea/China, the Romans would have a much longer distance to cross and cross much stormier waters compared to the English channel. Japan's topography would also have been more difficult to conquer - it has a icy tundra environment in north (due to the lack of a Gulf Stream which warms up Europe). The British Isles are also mostly flat or rolling lowlands with hilly areas mostly clustered around the northern areas such as Scotland. Japan on the other hand is 80% highland/hills/mountains and only 20% lowland. Japan's mountains are also steeper due to its geological youth (less erosion) and lack of glaciers to erode mountains. It would be much harder to move armies across Japan compared to Great Britain. So if the Romans weren't able to fully conquer Great Britain, then they wouldn't have been able to conquer Japan with its rougher geography and topography.

[@BruceKent00]

The Roman's didnt conquer the north of Britain because there was nothing there worth conquering. If the wanted it, they would have conquered it easily.

[@Intranetusa]

@@BruceKent00 Incorrect. First, Roman Britain was constantly raided by the tribes in the north. Hadrian's wall was built because the Romans weren't able to invade and subjugate the northern tribes of Britain. Second, Roman Britain itself was suffering constant rebellions (including a rebellion that ended only a year before the construction of Hadrian's wall), so the Roman logistics and military garrisons were already stretched. If it was so easy to conquer all of Britain, then the Romans would've done so and wouldn't have had to build Hadrian's wall. Also, the Romans around this time had to pull back from lands in the Middle East because the territories conquered by Trajan were not defensible. The Romans signed treaties with Parthia, pulled back to the Euphrates and gave up Armenia and Mesopotamia around the mid 2nd century AD.

[@BruceKent00]

@@Intranetusa Hadrian's Wall simply marked the boundary of the empire. If you actually believe that the Roman's could NOT conquer the North of England if they really wanted to, then your a complete and utter moron. I think you are one of those suckers that have been conned into believing that the 9th Legion actually went missing in Calendonia, which is pure myth and wishful thinking by the Scots 😂😂😂

[@Intranetusa]

@@BruceKent00 You are clearly ignorant. Instead of calling people morons, you need to learn some basic Roman history, learn the difference between "you're" vs "your," and learn the difference between "conquering" and "invading." Sending troops to invade a region is not remotely the same as actually conquering (as in invading and controlling) a region. The Romans could and did invade northern Britain with armies, but they could not and did not conquer it because they failed to defeat the Caledonians. The Romans could barely control southern Britain as they were constantly dealing with rebellions in Romano Britain. Just like hypothetically, the Romans could invade the rest of Germany or send more armies into Iran to fight the Parthians, but the Romans couldn't conquer those regions because stretched supply lines and local resistance made it infeasible and economically prohibitive. The Romans had to build built another wall (Antoine wall) decades after the Hadrian wall to protect the new frontier further to the north. If conquest was so easy, then the Romans wouldn't have needed to build walls and subjugated them. The Romans had sent invading armies and built forts north of these walls, but they never defeated the Caledonians and thus never actually conquered northern Britain. So go learn some Roman history first instead of peddling nonsense ideas of supposedly Roman invincibility.

[@BruceKent00]

@@Intranetusa how ironic, the fucktard that wrote absolute dribble and nonsense in his/her original comment, now wants to give me a history lesson. 😂😂😂😂 Please don't make me laugh, you lost all credibility in your original comment. I think it's you who is in desperate need of a history lesson in respect to the Roman Empire. I stand by my comment that you're a moron.

[@mamushi72sai]

Metatron. I love how your pronunciation sometimes reverts to that of romance languages when saying certain words. この動画をアップしてくれてありがとうございます。　僕は君の大ファンですよ

[@metatronyt]

Ahahah yes it does happen sometimes :)

[@charliewhite578]

actually, I don't think the Japanese of this period would be as fucked as it immediately seems. At this time, Japan and Korea were allies, and if they invaded Japan, korea would have came to aide and the iron age koreans were much more well equipped than the japanese of the time.

[@netiora]

Well it's really just the kingdom of Baekje that had a close relationship with Japan, so what kind of aid they would be able to send to Japan would also depend heavily on what state Baekje was in. At its height, Baekje could field an impressive army and fend off the other two kingdoms, at its worst it suffered defeats that resulted in beheaded kings and lost capitals. Lots of factors.

[@charliewhite578]

@@netiora totally, but it's still a factor that can't be ignored.

[@kek6969-w9y]

"Or they could have just hold out in little improvised fortifications Inb4 a Typhoon came to wipe the Romans out..." 😅

[@charliewhite578]

@@kek6969-w9y That and they Japanese could have developed stone castles quite easily during the kofun period if they invaded then, because their massive tombs were all made of stone, very well made too.

[@danieloutlaw6610]

But even so Rome had legoins from all over it's empire and would focus on any toops there sent to help and evently take Japan and move forward as it would mean the senent and genruals would get glory and power and wouldn't find fundings hatlrd nor would season troops be hard to looks for and the Legionaries were able to walk miles in the course of a day and could set up a basic defense camp in a few days as well as masrwe hand to hand combat and sword play of the time and took invasions seriously and chose the best of strategic positions that could let them hold easly and let there war machines do massave damage to any oncoming enemy

[@clutchingdaggerz359]

Excellent video, your best yet when it comes to showing periods not usually covered by common history. Such as iron age pre-Samurai Japan. Here is a challenge for you my friend, since obscure warriors are obviously your mastered subject. Do a video on the Kshatriya warriors of Chandragupta Maurya/Ashoka's time. So roughly at around the time of the Greek invasion of India ? Good idea ? Bad idea ? What do you think ? It would like pre-Samurai Japan be a period of human history rarely covered. You could of course compare the Greeks vs the Indian armies.

[@ernestomiguelbaez7649]

Make a top 10 on the best Roman generals

[@JcBravo8]

I saw a thread on Spacebattles about the Classical Greek armies vs Aztec Empire. One scenario being a disunited Greece, the other about a united Greece.

[@IsAcRafT]

El enfrentamiento más esperado por toda Latinoamerica unida XD.

[@Vladimir_Ches]

thank you for another great video!

[@eduardokenji8678]

AGAIN , HAHAHA PRAISE THE SUUUUUUUN \[T]/

[@MandalorV7]

Great far comparison. So basically Rome was at its peak while the Japanese were still starting out. A follow up comparing the samurai and Roman legionnaires would fun to watch as well.

[@Ungeboren1988]

On tribes having no chance the germanic tribes and picts would like to diasgree with that statement

[@metatronyt]

I never stated "tribes" having no chance, I only said specifically Iron age Japan didn't. You can't compare the Germans with Iron age Japanese.

[@Ungeboren1988]

@@metatronyt I interpreted the conclusion on my first viewing this way and see the problem. On the German with Iron age japan comparison I can't say much since this part of history eludes me somewhat ( I only know what roughly happened ), so further explanation would be appreciated if it isn't to bothersome.

[@Deridus]

I always figured that Arminius ambushed Varus as his legions were on the march, and defeated the Romans in detail. Had Varus not been destroyed then and there, I believe the Roman frontier would have been much, much deeper into Germanic lands before they reached the limits of logistics. Say, thurnigia and Saxony.

[@brickstonesonn9276]

Amazing Video! Its so interesting.

[@Clee-os6pv]

No, offense but honestly Korea was weak and Japan was weak. Both? Of them would have been easily been conquered by Rome. I think a more fair and more interesting fight would be SPQR Roman Empire vs Han Dynasty China. But? Against Han Dynasty China Rome might not win against them. The Han Dynasty would have gave Rome a real run for it's money. The problem with Rome's armies/military is? They relay to much on close quarter combat. I mean their legions are equipped with Scutum and Gladuis. Let's not forget? Rome also relay's on Auxiliary units for other military support like mounted Cavalry and archers. Plus Rome is not the only one who has siege engines? Han Dynasty also field powerful and formidable Siege Engines themselves. The Han Dynasty army/military was already like a Medieval/Renaissance style force. Their infantry was heavy mixed arm units. Some had short spears, long spears, long swords, short swords with shields, Axe Dagger spear "Invented by China and the Ancient World's first Halberd weapon" (Which was very useful and effective weapon against armies using shield formation like Rome), spears and shields, and much more. China also employed large numbers of small arm crossbow and more light weight heavy cross bows in mass numbers. But also have light and heavy crossbow which these ones was more classified as Siege Engines. In many different combats the Han Dynasty has fought in. Which Rome does not have? Scorpio and Ballista do not count as small arm crossbows they are considered Siege Engines. The Han Dynasty military can deploy many different types of strategy against Rome they can just launch gorilla tactics. With their range weapon advantage of using massive crossbow units. A well-trained crossbow corps was more than capable of seeing off a cavalry charge or incurring devastating casualties if firing as a unit into the flank of enemy infantry during an ambush. Catching enemy troops in a crossfire by splitting one’s crossbowmen into two groups was another highly successful tactic. Han Dynasty China already had Trebuchet and more powerful Siege Engines they would easily destroyed Rome's forts and other fortifications. China of the Han Dynasty had a very large army as well. Numbering over one (1) million strong. Since the Qin Dynasty of the first Emperor of China. Well? Rome can only mustard up only less then a hundred (100) thousand strong. Which is not enough to conquer let alone occupation of China. The only advantage Rome has was it has the best trained discipline Infantry force. When it comes to? military technology, numbers, strategy/tactics, economy and etc. China wins on those advantages. In the Battle of Zhizhi (郅支之戰) in 36 BC? A Roman styled army/military lost to the Han Dynasty army and China was victorious. Rome hasn't? Face anyone like China before. So I already know who would win. If it was SPQR Roman Empire vs Han Dynasty China. And another fun fact? China of the Han Dynasty also defeated Greeks as well. In the War of the Heavenly Horses.

[@Clee-os6pv]

@천승헌 : Really? Well! I don't know very much about the Korean kingdom of Goguryeo. But? I will take your word for it.

[@nobbytang]

Its a great flexible army which fights as a army against a army of individual warriors without shields ?......only 1 outcome and quickly ....

[@Matt_The_Hugenot]

Good video though I disagree with the conclusion. Japan's mountainous geography is not as extreme as the Alps but it's sheer extent would have caused the Romans problems. This would have been compounded by the climate of extreme winters covering the North and the oppressive summers where the combination of heat and humidity work against any invading army. Just as Rome avoided pushing further into the British and Irish Islands, Germany, and Eastern Europe it may have either decided Japan was not worth the trouble or tried to hold on to only those areas that it deemed hospitable. As in Britain the native languages would have survived and the people would have quickly acquired Roman technology. There would have been little incentive to stay, Japan's greatest resources, it's people and their agriculture, were far smaller then so there would have been little incentive to stay for slaves and rice. In the face of organised resistance, improving weapons and tactics, and a hostile climate, all with little to show for it, Rome would have withdrawn and used its legions elsewhere, California!

[@justinbell7309]

Around 7:40 the pic of the period Japanese armors... the very middle one has an aesthetic appearance strikingly similar to the famous lorica segmentata, even with laminar spaulders. Just thought that was kind of interesting, given the videos topic. Cut that one out of the pic, probably could convince someone it was Roman.

[@yourlocalt72]

a knight wearing a plate armour and using an halberd will win

[@GrammarPaladin]

Literally top tier soldier facing off ancient less developed warriors

[@yourlocalt72]

GrammarNazi ikr its equilivent of a tank

[@Cervando]

A soldier wearing body armour and using an assault rifle would win. Yet my example is closer to your choice historically, than yours to the periods in question by several centuries.

[@DrIvoRobotnick]

@@Cervando but Kevlar is easily pierced by a spear or sufficiently sharp knife, right?

[@Cervando]

@@DrIvoRobotnick Lol do you honestly think that even if he wore no armour that a soldier with an assault rifle would lose? Besides military armour offers protection against cutting and piercing from blades and spikes too.

[@TheDLVProject]

Wow, I really love this style of video

[@gn1144]

Some guys are saying that Rome was weak and only capable of winning beacuse they were a "Zerg". Kappa. Tell that to all the armies that lost against them for 600 years (at least). And i'm not considering the east roman empire. They basically formed the actual Europe more than a millennia ago. Can you elaborate this shit? P.s. Romans used cavalry too, why people always forget? Wasn't their main source of strenght but they used it. Story has been written, like it or not it has been written.

[@GholaTleilaxu]

"Kappa"? "elaborate this shit"? You know what? PS: GO FUCK YOURSELF!

[@EugeneT]

Love your videos, my friend!!! Sadly this one I had to turn off half way. The music, sound effect and visuals that add nothing to incredible content were just too much :( I'm sad as I was really looking forward to this one.

[@FightingCucumber]

and still with all advanteges in mind the romans were unable to defeat the germanians xD

[@jaytomioka3137]

Very interesting and well thought out video. It is a wonderful thought experiment! I applaud your analysis! Just as with the Roman invasions of Britain... an analogous invasion of Japan would present great challenges outside of the directly military spheres. The subjugation of Britain was made possible only after the romanization of Gaul and the establishment of the Rhine as the Roman-German frontier . Navigation of the straits of Tsushima is very treacherous even without typhoons. It would make Julius Caesar’s autumn invasions of Britain look easy by comparison. Support and supply logistics over the Silk Road could be theoretically possible... but the distance alone would be daunting. Roman control of the Silk road would be necessary. Only the Mongol empire ever achieved that feat. Then there would be the twin elephants in the room: China and India. Obviously Roman legions enjoy a serious technological, strategic and logistics advantage over the Yayoi or Kofun era Japanese. Those advantages grow slimmer when faced with interference from Han era Chinese or the Kingdoms of Northern India. In the end the costs of invasion outweigh any possible benefits. Japan has always been too remote, resource poor and troublesome to invade. It was only the strategic necessities of 1854 and 1945 that caused the United States to threaten invasion. And even then both conflicts were concluded diplomatically with treaties and surrender, respectively.

[@vampirecount3880]

What a load of BS, everybudy knows a japanese warrior would cut 10 legionaries in a single blow. Samurai warriors could cut bullets in mid air. After all the katana is the best weapon ever made. In the future people will just fight with katanas as homan kind cant think of anything better.

[@johnchestnut5340]

Do some homework. It's not even the best sword left alone the best weapon.

[@vampirecount3880]

@@johnchestnut5340 shut up, katana can even cut through time and kill your enemy before he was even born

[@vampirecount3880]

@@johnchestnut5340 katana can kill superman, so i dont mind.

[@greysonf6211]

John Chestnut You know he’s just joking right.

[@MaxSluiman]

One addendum though. The stop office the wearing of the left grave had propably to do with mobility. Since the Roman army changed from city state warring to regional warring. With emphasis on strategical mobility. So protection is less important than being at the right place at the right time.

[@MaxSluiman]

What does the Metatron think?

[@fsmoura]

Poor Romans! Those _katanas,_ with their superior cutting power, would slice them all the way back to their hometowns!

[@ahightechlowlife]

Trolling?

[@yaldabaoth2]

You're 1000 years too early for a katana.

[@flamebird2218]

The Katana wasn't invented yet.

[@SonsOfLorgar]

@@justinbeath5169 too bad the Romans wouldn't have any battleship for the Japanese to surrender on after the PMD deployment...

[@Rick-it3tz]

You are just like saying the Japanese battleships and Kami-Kaze bombers will smash the Romans into pieces.

[@crozraven]

Metatron, please take a looks on historical aspects & tactics within "Drifters" anime/manga series. The series premise basically put a clash of a very influential IRL people (leaders, generals, prophets, etc) in a fantasy realm (elf, dwarf, demi human, dragon, orc, etc) to clash each other for a "better world."

[@crozraven]

The series have a bunch of interesting IRL military leaders & politicians like Scipio Africanus, Hannibal, Oda Nubunaga, Toshio Hijikata, Akechi Mitsuhide, Joan of Arc, Rasputin, Genji, even Adolf Hitler & many more. Very much different than Fate/ series if anybody trying compare it.

[@adisura9904]

That was pretty fun. Id like to see how Rome would do agaisnt the Mauryans. Hope you'll cover it sometime.

[@brotherhoodofsteeld.c.chap1917]

That would be a good fight, one on one I give it to the Roman. HOWEVER in a war I think it’s equal, Indians had numbers Rome had a much more disciplined force. Either way it would be a legendary clash.

[@adisura9904]

@@brotherhoodofsteeld.c.chap1917 true, however there aren't many sources left of how Indians conducted warfare. While one could use Mahabharata as a source, most western dont see it as such and i really don't know why, Experts mostly rely on western narrations of warfare which are far more recent and So it would really be hard to find reliable sources of ancient warfare in India. On top of that Universities like Nalanda and Taxila too did not survive invasions by islamic forces ( sadly they were destroyed in a similar fashion to that of Alexandria with all its knowledge burnt to ash) and so very limited sources remain. And there was pretty much an effort by imperialists and racist elements in the west to destroy the leftovers of whatever traditions of both warfare and knowledge calling them as inferior basically ( just letting you know, not really holding anything againt the west as that is somewhat a different topic really) . If you do want some searching on the internet, try looking up Chanakya's ideas on warfare and how it should he conducted. I could give you a brief idea of Mahabharata era wars as well but that is if you ask me as i dont want to extend this already long reply lol.

[@brotherhoodofsteeld.c.chap1917]

@@adisura9904 I totally get you, Great Britain wasn’t very nice. Indians were heavily mistreated. Of course just their actions shouldn’t speak for the entirety of the west, overall I think the west is a place of science and mathematics. A very civilized area. However I believe we have Greek accounts about Alexander VS Porus. Of course these may be false HOWEVER Greeks generally tell the truth about who won or lost, if heavily exaggerated. From it we know that Porus used many elephants and light spear men if I’m correct. We COULD use it as a reference of what the northern Indian kingdoms could have fought like. That being said IF Alexander lost (he may have he may not have its debated on History VS local retellings, both are credible imo) it was probably because he fought elephants for the first and last time thus he wasn’t able to adapt. So Romans who fought elephants many times I think would be able to counter them. Light spear men may become a problem as they did in Britain and Gaul, so ima give it to the Romans due to skill, training and equipment. Of course we don’t fully know how the rest of the Indian lands fought. So I think the Mauryans could win because we don’t know too too much on them. And because I’m 99% sure they would heavily outnumber the Romans. However I think we use western accounts mainly because they are more reliable, think about it. Romans were way more descriptive than let’s say the Persians. And because of how advanced in warfare they were/are, we use western warfare to this day after all.

[@adisura9904]

@@brotherhoodofsteeld.c.chap1917 yep and just like greeks, science and mathematics was big part of Indian life thousands of years ago just like today, probably even bigger than that of greeks as faith and science intermingled in India, while greek philosophers were less common as well as religion being seperate from science. And that is just because of population and cultural differences.I mean after all the numbers on which the modern world works, decimals, trigonometry, Navigation, the value of pi and some others, all stem from India. As for how civilized, well, that is only debatable depending on what years we talk about, as "wasn't very nice" isn't exactly the words id use to define some aspects of europe or Europeans. As far reliable goes, that too is debatable, since western propoganda isn't something that is new. And this is why i said, it would be pretty hard to get the right sources. But yes like you said we can definitely think of ways the romans or greeks would have performed, but that doesn't really tell us what tactics for example the mauryans would use. So giving greeks or romans a win just because they historically performed well in other areas is not really accurate. And while the west has won many wars and are good with it, it isn't really fair to say that the idea of modern, disciplined and a technologically superior military is solely that of the west. I mean historically Indian steel was the most sought by the west and was known as Damascus steel to you. There more such examples but i don't really have them on the top of my head. However, yes the greeks and romans both were an incredible force to deal with. However, we pretty much have no clue of how Indians warfare was in ancient times if one does not consider Mahabharata or similar sources that is. I mean according to some ww2 historians Germany used some of tactics from the Mahabharata in tank warfare, now this i cannot really confirm since i haven't really been able to find it nor do I really have the time to invest in deep scrutiny of such topics

[@brotherhoodofsteeld.c.chap1917]

@@adisura9904 i’d argue that science was more important to the Greeks and math was more important to the Indians, Greeks noted the difference between religion and science. And again, I think we can use Porus’s force as a reference. After almost to the Greek stateside and italics states fought similar, I’d imagine northern Indians would be similar to each other. And yes propaganda has been around for a very long time, but the Greeks have been proven to be quite a reliable source. I’m not saying Indians aren’t great mathematicians, I’m just saying so were the Greeks. And I think Europe was using navigation for a while, i’m sure the Indians were doing it first but I’m sure Europeans developed navigation organically too. And I think it was either the ancient Egyptians or Greeks who came up with pi. But I’m 90% sure that the Indians came up with 0/zero, forgive me if I’m wrong but from what I remember it was them. I said “not very nice” because I was trying to sound gentlemanly, I meant more around complete fucking arrogant douche bags, however they did a lot of good, they were still assholes to a lot of people.

[@spyrosw9]

17:34 We (Greeks) also use a Hellenized version of that word for sleeves. Maniki. :)

[@szarekhthesilent2047]

yeah. but this one originates/was derived from "manus", i think. confusing, i know, it's normally the other way around...

[@Cervando]

In Spanish the word is Mangas

[@spyrosw9]

@@szarekhthesilent2047 manica was derived from manus, maniki is a hellenized version of manica. We have a few words of Latin origin like that in our language cause, you know, Byzantine Empire :)