ROTB Scourge was NEVER going to be Bayverse Optimus Prime | Talon Discussions

There was a popular fan theory in the lead-up to the release of Transformers: Rise of the Beasts that said that the film's main villain, Scourge, was going to be a corrupted Bayverse Optimus Prime. I break down why people thought this and why this was NEVER planned.
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All images used in this video were from Google searches, Hasbro Pulse and the TFW2005 boards.
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#Transformers #optimusprime #optimus #megatron #MichaelBay ##transformersriseofthebeasts #transformersrevengeofthefallen #Transformersdarkofthemoon #Transformersageofextinction #Transformersthelastknight #studioseries #Bumblebee #BacktoBaysics #videoessay #scourge
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Copyright Disclaimer under Section 107 of the copyright act 1976, allowance is made for fair use for purposes such as criticism, comment, news reporting, scholarship, and research. Fair use is a use permitted by copyright statute that might otherwise be infringing. Non-profit, educational or personal use tips the balance in favour of fair use.

[@RydellAggin12]

Talon, I know you might not read my comments but I wanna tell you something You're the only Transformers fanboy that knows what it's like to be a real n***a. That’s my compliment to you bro🫡

[@Talon_Productions]

Lmao thank you, thank you!

[@RydellAggin12]

@@Talon_Productions anytime Brudda, I guarantee you in the future you’re gonna be the biggest G.O.A.T of all time

[@angelozenstories7080]

After u explain how Optimus Prime was never a psychopath and I agree with that since this is a different universe its too obvious its never going to have a crossover with Bayverse

[@wither.arbiter.gaming8978]

Bro you didn't watch his previous video

[@arael1580]

Well tbf Unicron has been a multiversal character for a while but yeah... this theory was dumb.

[@thepotatoshow1887]

What bothered me the most about this theory was the sheer size difference between Bayverse-Optimus and Scourge. If Unicron somehow corrupted the 3rd or 4th most powerful Autobot alive, why on Earth would he shrink him 10 feet instead of keeping the height advantage when traveling to a reality where cybertronians are shorter?

[@isuckatusernames4297]

energon efficiency.

[@Talon_Productions]

Yeah the size discrepancy never made sense to me!

[@user-wo7ql7or3g]

I think the part where Scourge gets unmasked should have at least had some easter egg for the fans so that it doesn't turn out the awkward way it did. Like, maybe model his face to look like G1 Scourge or hell, make him look like one of the Quintessons, at least that would raise some interesting discussions. But no. Instead we got the love child of Ultron and Springtrap.

[@Undertalefan1-s3e]

Ngl though, ultrons voice wouldn't have been a bad choice for scourge tbh

[@user-wo7ql7or3g]

@@Undertalefan1-s3e Scourge being soft spoken would have been a nice contrast to his brutal demeener but even then, I think his design had to be slightly different

[@Talon_Productions]

Some sort of Easter egg would have been nice but I don't mind it as is!

[@Talon_Productions]

Oooo Ultron's voice would have been good! James Spader is awesome.

[@TheSlimyServer]

This was such a cool idea to me. When I saw Scourge’s mask come off in the movie, I thought they were gonna do the reveal with all of that suspense. I was disappointed, but I guess it wouldn’t have worked.

[@Talon_Productions]

As an idea and concept it isn't bad! i just don't think it necessarily would have worked here.

[@Jman92854]

I never believed the theory myself. The fact that the theory itself was based on literally the top of Scourge's head behind his mask, and that Bayverse Optimus is a brutal warrior, that's all they had to go off of. By that logic, Megatron could've been Scourge, since he turned into a truck in DOTM. Or Sentinel Prime, or any of the other Bay movie cast.

[@azemthetraveler6154]

Sentinel Prime becoming a servant of Unicron is a nice idea and would be a very fresh breakaway from the "Optimus becomes evil" trope.

[@Talon_Productions]

Exactly! Don't forget the "leaks" that originally put this idea out there. Good point about DOTM Megatron too.

[@bluelycannarutoxfateseries1352]

if the theory was true hypothetically speaking, it would have ruined the movie itself, why? because it would be copying the last knight Optimus prime being brainwashed again? no way bruh plus there's the size difference the bayverse are taller than the rotb

[@Talon_Productions]

I guess it would be the same core idea but I feel like it would be different enough not to just be a copy of TLK.

[@orhandalegend]

And would be a terrible fucking way to end Bay Prime’s story.

[@zaidadoesart5864]

Some one said it, THANK YOU, I cannot tell you the amount of frustration when this theory became a thing, and when I brought up that it was not the case at all, people argued about it with me 💀 like bro- it was so annoying, so thank you for making this video

[@Talon_Productions]

I'm glad to and I'm glad you enjoyed it! yeah, its nuts just ho attached some got to this theory. The evidence was so poor and suuuuuch a stretch to say the least.

[@zaidadoesart5864]

@@Talon_Productions your truly correct, this is why I tend to no longer be a fan of “fan theory’s” not unless they are backed up and some what confirmed by some sort of leaked scripts or footage or something of the sort like concept art, especially in the transformers community they stretch it so much. This isn’t the first time, And this whole theory about scourge, made people theorize that Apelinq wasn’t actually in the movie before it came out, people thought it was made up 💀 my thoughts were the same as yours as soon as someone even posted a video about bayverse prime being scourge, also canonically no one ever brought this up, but bayverse prime is taller and larger than scourge, I think scourge is about as big as bay verses primes lower leg- so idk how anyone thought that would work. Regardless, absolutely subbed after watching your video, can’t wait to see more content ✨

[@pigeonleader]

Maybe the reason why people thought Scourge would be some sort of Optimus Prime was because in Robots in Disguise Scourge was basically Nemesis Prime so if the movie said Scourge was from a timeline where the autobots lost the war or something then it could make sense. Although why specifically Bayverse Prime idk

[@GalvatronStudios]

Even if Scourge was Bayverse Prime, the more you look into the theory it just doesn’t align properly. Especially when you consider the opening scene and the ambiguity of when it takes place. The future? Or the past? The film never explains it. Also with Unicron in town, chances are Megatron is Galvatron and that's why nobody has mentioned him in any new material. The Decepticons don’t even seem too concerned about the possibility Megatron might be dead but we won’t know anything until that incoming GI Joe flop releases.

[@Blitz4086]

It's the present but we're getting a decepticon prequel movie that explain everything

[@GalvatronStudios]

@@Blitz4086 but if the Maximals are from the future how could they possibly exist in the past and present?

[@Sharkey_SM]

The only reason megatron hasn’t been mentioned is cuz he was intended to be frozen on earth since bumblebee was originally a prequel to bayverse but they changed it so no one really knows where megatron is atm

[@slickmanfonzthatanti-troll]

Scourge needed to be bulkier. Also the fact fans thought he was Bayverse Prime, made me realize some Transformers fans had something in their water that messed em up.

[@orhandalegend]

Its hatred, hatred towards Bay prime so that he would become a villain to be killed. A stupid ass headcanon to fit with their “bay prime is a war criminal psycho” delusion.

[@slickmanfonzthatanti-troll]

@@orhandalegend Facts

[@tffan1029]

Finally, I'm not the only one who didn't believe the "ROTB Scourge is secretly Bayverse Optimus" theory. Even taking into account any similarities between the two, and his helmet in his (control) artwork looking similar to Bayverse Prime, I never believed in, nor hopped on the train of this theory on the grounds of "unless the film/producers say otherwise" and look where we are now. After the Scourge unmasked scene, the only thing I could say was "Ultron, what are you doing in Transformers?". Also, I believe another thing that people believed in the theory was the Energon Igniter Battletrap toy because the character artwork was a rusty orange version of Bayverse Ironhide. And at that point, I thought, "Gee guys, why not take it a step further and say Nightbird was gonna be Bayverse Arcee because they're both prominent females and Freezer and Novakane were Bayverse Wheelie and Brains just because of their small size?" because things were going nuts with this theory.

[@zebruh7490]

I can see that ROTB Scourge may have taken inspiration from RiD Scourge, and the character he inspired, Armada Nemesis Prime, as he has the same name as the former but is a herald of Unicron like the latter. His truck mode being a Peterbilt also plays into the idea that RiD Scourge was "Optimus-like" but not an exact clone of RiD's Optimus. In RiD, Scourge was a Laser Prime repaint, and I believe in the design process of ROTB Scourge, they may have been inspired to use elements from Bayverse Prime, but that's about all that connects the two. I don't know what Caple intended with the unmasking scene, but there was an origin story for Scourge that ultimately got cut from ROTB, so perhaps that had something to do with it.

[@J.M.I_Filmmaker]

It was a cool idea for me but I'm glad it didn't happen

[@Talon_Productions]

Fair enough!

[@OneWithNoFace]

This theory is as viable as the Blackout = Grindor Bonecrusher = reused model in Egypt battle Brawl = Desert Brawl Scrapper = Trench In other words complete nonsense

[@Talon_Productions]

Facts! The only one here I give any credence to is Blackout being revived as Grindor since he has rust all over him, like Megatron does, and the original audio files for the ROTF videogame referred to him as blackout. I still think he is a separate character overall though! Those other ones though, dumb. Bonecrusher, Brawl, and Scrapper were killed and those reused designs are exactly that, reused designs.

[@OneWithNoFace]

@Talon_Productions That's kinda ironic for the game part. Because theirs a scrapped line where Optimus says "Don't make the same mistake as your brother!" To Grindor.

[@TorridPrime217]

I thought it might be possible, since they keep trying to loosely tie the new films in with the Bay films, but in hindsight, it's clear that they won't make a cord-severing move like that until they're comfortable establishing a 'new franchise' that will be as profitable as the Bay films, since both BB and ROTB weren't cutting it

[@yonderjam]

I'm personally not a fan of Scourge's maskless head, not because it's not bay Optimus as whilst it was an intriguing theory, it was supported by paper straws, but because the masked face looks so unique, it being removed made his face become too generic.

[@Undertalefan1-s3e]

To be fair, his mask was on for the majority of the movie whereas him being maskless only lasted a few minutes

[@TPND45]

Next video idea: “Why Cogman from Transformers TLK being Sam witwicky is actually a dumb idea”

[@Random_Idiot_1020]

I never once believed in this theory, however I can definitely understand why others did. The original version of Nemesis Prime was simply a clone of Optimus named Scourge, and with all the coincidences between Bayverse Prime and Scourge's designs, it seemed reasonable for people to believe something similar is happening. Another reason is that it would give us some insight on the aftermath of TLK. With the fan projects and the requests, it's clear Bayverse fans are still interested in some kind of conclusion to the original film universe. Plus, Hollywood is so interested on doing soulless nostalgia bait films these days that I'm somewhat surprised they didn't add this plot twist in last minute. Also I think in the original script Scourge's face reveal was originally supposed to show how much he's damaged and abused by Unicron and that he has no free will. I don't remember where I first heard this, it might've been either the interview where Steven Caple Jr talks about the Transit scene or the TFW thread about the test screenings.

[@user-zo7zx3zb4u]

I legit thought this was a Joke. I cannot believe a few people actually bought into this theory. Btw I loved your Optimus video, it gave me a new perspective on the Bayverse as a whole, keep up the phenomenal work.

[@Talon_Productions]

Yeah it is crazy that this got as big as it did! And thank you so much, glad that you liked it and that I could help how you see things!

[@TRSleekZ12]

Wake Up babe, new Talon Production just dropped❤🎉

[@alobaymar]

4:15 HAHAHHAHAHAHAHAHAHAH!!!!!!!!!!!!! The CGI difference between a 2023 film and a 2017 film is hilarious, ILM W

[@orhandalegend]

TLK had the most beautiful CGI i have ever seen in a movie along with the amazing music. Too bad the movie sucked.

[@alobaymar]

Personally it's my second most favorite transformers film but it's like Transformers isnt about visual spectacles and quality anymore now it's quantity

[@mmrproductions3176]

I’m very glad it didn’t happen, it would’ve been nice to have acknowledgement of bayverse, but it just would’ve been absolutely stupid so thank goodness it didn’t happen.

[@RingoLoadagain]

I also hate fan theories, because it ruins the movie for some people and it's not fair. As for the design similarities, they're just general homages, which is cool, but I never would have read that much into it.

[@Talon_Productions]

Yeah some people get so hung up on these theories that it ruins the experience for them and that is so dumb to me. I never read too much into those design similarities either.

[@wither.arbiter.gaming8978]

Stand Proud Talon you earned most of the 2007-2017 fans respect

[@Talon_Productions]

Ayyy thank you!

[@xandermoyer8730]

I never understood this theory. Also, it doesn't make sense. Like if they wanted to do the evil bay prime...they could do nemesis prime but good

[@TheMushroomMeister]

if this theory turned out to be true you’d see me on the news this shit was so dumb

[@dynobros2383]

Thank God that was not the case. I did not believe it and I was more than relieved bc it would have destroyed my entire childhood and I really would have never looked at Optimus the same way again if it was ever true

[@alobaymar]

Man, im cool with stuff like Bumblebee fighting Nazis and Unicron being Earth and Transformers killing the dinosaurs and building pyramids and most possibly did september 11, but when it comes to time travel it's just this soy reddit marvel crap and I'm already uninterested, glad Scourge was his own thing.

[@westernengine11]

Another thing that supported this corrupted autobots theory is that a gimmicky figure of battletrap was made that used the mold of a bayverse Ironhide figure, aswell as it having a photo of bayverse ironhide colored orange on the box

[@Talon_Productions]

Eh, I wouldn't say that supported that since gimmick figures aren't indicative of much and Ironhide wouldn't have even been around post TLK to have been turned into anyone.

[@osmakdb9706]

Apparently there's versions of Optimus prime in comic books that are like bayverse Optimus prime and some worse willingly killing injured decepticons on Cybertron before the war

[@mingfanzhang4600]

Alitte late but I agree with you on scourge not originally going to be the Bayverse Prime. I know that the Bayformer is my favorite version of the transformer series (unpopular opinions I know but I really enjoyed the Bay version of the transformer series dispite it flaws since it was what got me into the transformers franchise) and I would love to see a closer to his version of transformers, but I feel like saying that they're the same person is ridiculous. Not only that, I remember that someone told me that "scourge transform into a long nose semi truck, so does Bayverse Optimus, that proof that scourge is supposed to be Bayverse Prime, why else would they transform into similar semi trucks if they're not supposed to be the same character.". This makes no sense to me as by that logic, Megatron also transformed into a long nose semi truck similar to the Bayverse Prime and scourge, therefore, all three of them are the same person. As you can see, it doesn't make sense and not only that, there are some transformers from the Bayverse who just happened to have the same vehicle mode and I didn't see anyone calling them the same person. For example, in DOTM, during the high way chase, we see 3 the dreads who were chasing the autobot who all transformed into a black police suburban car and I didn't see anyone accused them of being the same person and, similarly, all of the wrecker in the film all transformed into the same Nascar style car (albeit different color and numbers) and I don't see anyone accusing them of being the same person because of that

[@brendinveness]

Yeah that was just a dumb theory, this is a whole different universe, and I bet people really wanted it cause they wanted their precious Gen 1 Knightverse Prime to kill Bayverse Prime. Please, Bayverse Prime would solo those 2

[@Talon_Productions]

Oh I'm sure! I remember on the TFW2005 forum people saying it was "G1 Prime killing Bay Prime" and thats just so lame to me. I'm with you too, Bayverse Optimus would have no problem taking them down.

[@mingfanzhang8927]

Also I want to say is the fact I know that a lot of people say that this version of of scourge is the same person to the Bayformers Optimus Prime because they both transform into a long nose semi truck and that they wouldn’t have been the same person had they not transformed into the same semi truck. One problem I have is that even if this scrourge WAS Optimus Prime from another universe being possessed by unicron, it easily could have been any version of prime who was being possessed by unicron in any other universe. For example, in the transformers Prime’s universe, that version also transforms into a long nose semi truck similar to the Bayformers with the only difference between them being the fact that one is a mostly red with a little bit of blue where the legs are supposed to be while the other one mostly blue with red flames. Not only that but the tf prime universe this version of unicron also secretly earth 🌍 similar to how unicron was in the Bayverse. Even if this version of scourge was supposed to be Optimus Prime from other worlds who transformed into a long nose truck and was being possessed by unicron, it easily could have been any other version of him who was possessed by unicron and transformed into a long nose semi truck with the most obvious one being the one from the aligned continuity (which contains the prime universe series) as both series had prime transform into a long nose semi truck and both had unicron as earth 🌎 (and megatron was even possessed by unicron in this series) so even if it was supposed to be Optimus Prime, it easily could have from a alternate version of the Transformers Prime series where unicron won and possessed the this version of Optimus Prime

[@afzalhakimbinzairini956]

Among all the fan theroies I heard from this franchise, this is the one theory that I actually very stupid and idiotic at the same time. Because I know some fans already said that " Ugh if you look at the top of Scourge head, Scourge truck mode, his smokestacks bla bla bla, he looks like Bayverse Prime bla bla bla" or the most famous one is " Ugh Scourge is Bayverse Prime? Man know wonder he is so violent bla bla bla". Ugh, this theory man... the fans annoyed me with this theory. Okay first of all, SCOURGE IS NOT OPTIMUS PRIME!!! Scourge is just his own character, and Optimus is his own character, plain & simple. Second, when Optimus fighting his enemies, he has a reason why he is to go full beserk cause all the pain & suffering by his enemies. Scourge on the other hand, is Trophy Hunter who kills his victims and takes their insignia as trophies. And finally, when the film release and when Scourge mask cames off and his face reveal, suprise, it's not Bayverse Optimus but just another generic dude. Speaking of Scourge, he is actually my favourite parts from ROTB and I thought he is great TF Villian. But compare him to Sentinel Prime, Lockdown, and 2007 Megatron, yeah this guy is an okay villian. I still think Lockdown and Sentinel Prime are better TF Movie Villians. Also Scourge only transformed two times in the movie and at times, he can be really generic. It's reason like this I start like ROTB less and less now. The villians are not as impactful and memorable as the likes of 07 Megatron, Sentinel Prime and Lockdown.

[@darkhypergojira]

I would have LOVED the idea that Scourge was Bayverse Optimus but the more I thought about it the more I realized that it would have ruined the character of Bayverse Optimus (I think) Primes will power is just too powerful even for Unicron There’s no way Scourge would have been Optimus Again it would it been awesome (at least to me) but it would not have worked

[@clipsdelosmajes]

But it was fun to imagine it, you gotta admit that. Plus the face reveal scene was really like weird? Like it only shows its scars and that's it, while the composition of the scene would make it seem it was an identity reveal.

[@bluelycannarutoxfateseries1352]

fun or not it wouldn't make sense just look at the size difference

[@Talon_Productions]

Even though it isn't necessarily a bad idea, I didn't like it for that movie so I didn't have fun imaging it, especially with those that were so sure that it was true pushing it so hard. I feel like people are looking into the face reveal too hard, its just meant to show how messed up he is and what serving Unicron does to you.

[@clipsdelosmajes]

@@bluelycannarutoxfateseries1352 I am not saying it was real, but that it was fun to imagine the possibility of such a multiversal encounter.

[@bluelycannarutoxfateseries1352]

@@clipsdelosmajes and i'm not saying that your thinking that it's real i'm not trying to accuse you on something that you didn't even said plus it's not just the size difference it would have just redo the whole brainwashing thing again bayverse optimus was already controlled by quintessa after he would have learned to avoid being controlled and he would miraculously just got controlled by Unicron again? nuh uh

[@isuckatusernames4297]

we all knew it was never meant to be, we all just hoped it would have been easy to headcanon into. like, bayverse has started becoming a nostalgic part of the fandom for alot of people and the fact that it ended in a sort of cliffhanger made alot of people want any kind of official statement on that movie serie.

[@Talon_Productions]

Im.not sure who "we all" is but I, and many others,never believed this theory and didn't hope for it to be a thing at all.

[@justnoob8141]

It’s the stupidest headcanon possible in any standard you use

[@CDCobermai]

I’m of the opinion that scourge was never going to be bayverse prime, but the way the reveal is shot, I DO believe that there is definitely some big twist with him that got lost as later versions of the movie were developed. If I were to guess what that would be, I wouldn’t be surprised if it had something to do with the rumored initial time travel story that the film was supposedly gonna shoot for

[@Talon_Productions]

It is possible that there was a twist that was cut but I doubt it. I really think the intention was to highlight just how far gone and messed up Scourge and what serving Unicron does to you.

[@patrickriordan6706]

I think this boils down to the fact that a lot of Bayverse fans desperately want a conclusion/closure to the story of that universe, and as someone who grew up with Bayverse myself, I don’t blame them; the Bayverse was already nearing its logical conclusion with introducing Unicron in TLK. Once you get to Unicron, there’s not much more you can do to raise the stakes for future sequels other than something stupid & contrived like “Ultracron” or “Supercron” or whatever. The fact they pivoted away from that story so quickly with the Bumblebee movie after the failure of TLK, while understandable from a business/financial standpoint, will also inevitably lead to the feeling of blue balls in a lot of Bayverse fans who had been invested in that universe for a whole decade up to that point.

[@webscgaminganimations3695]

I still believed until I found out Scourge is only 19 feet while Optimus is 30 feet. But why the Bayverse fans wanted this is bc we thought that this was Paramount's answer to "Will the Bayverse continue?" but bc he ain't Prime I'm happy bc this shows there's a chance Bayverse will come back. I'm sad bc this would've been an amazing idea

[@Sharkey_SM]

i kinda doubt bayverse will make a return since bumblebee started a whole new trilogy im sure paramount and hasbro will wanna milk like bayverse hopefully this new verse don’t meet the same fate as bayverse but I think bayverse is done for since tlk flopped so hard they made a reboot trilogy

[@webscgaminganimations3695]

@@Sharkey_SM tlk still did better than rotb

[@Kaiju-bm4ts]

​@@webscgaminganimations3695 buddy no it didn't 😂, tf5 flopped and didn't get a sequel. Rotb barely broke even and is getting a sequel anyway. Learn to look at the budgets of films before immediately looking at the box offices and assuming one movie dd better than the other.

[@justnoob8141]

@@Kaiju-bm4tsit’s actually because of G1 and not because it’s better, story be damned, just make robot look like a toy, thus defeat the purpose of the very motto, and you got a sell

[@CRABboy1678]

Love your videos

[@Talon_Productions]

Thank you! I'm glad that you enjoy!

[@CRABboy1678]

@@Talon_Productions I've been enjoying you amazing videos for around a year

[@BobbyMoore2-mp8wb]

Cool 😎 video bro

[@Talon_Productions]

Thank you!

[@HSB819]

So in my FB tf group I posted a pic of dotm Megatron's truck mode with the caption " OH MY GOD dotm megatron is actually bayverse Optimus from another universe or something " I posted this as a joke but I genuinly got a few comments hating on the joke, saying it's gonna happen, yep glad those people didn't get their wish 😂

[@vlad2OO5]

I never believed in this theory from the start (i was just a bit scared that movie get unnecessary connection with bay films). And i won't believe in this even now. And after thinking a lot about this situation, I realized that this theory now makes even less sense to me.

[@chazzq2428]

I think people were running off the hype of the Marvel movies, especially with what Spider-Man No Way Home did. I do wish the Bayverse movies had a proper end to it (a redeeming one too to make up for TLK), Hasbro has moved on from it.

[@mohammadhossain9608]

I didn't believe in this theory like you and thought that they used some design reuse to make it, but people believed it anyway. Another thing is that in the g1 movie scourge was created by the remains of thundercracker by unicron, while in the rid 2001 scourge was a protoform in stasis pod which megatron reprogrammed him to be evil, while scanning a tanker truck the pod also scanned optimus which made him look like him, this added fuel to the theory that scourge is bayverse optimus. Another thing is that scourge in rid gave the idea of an evil optimus, though the idea came before rid01 in beast wars neo, rid01 made the idea of nemesis prime in armada and now so people thought that he is nemesis prime but with a different name. There were some people who took the terracon symbol and put it on aoe-tlk prime's face which surprisingly looks roughly like scourge.

[@Achieme]

Bro I thought this theory was dumb and made very little sense. The control art was a poor argument because multiple TF have similar body types. They can accept that Onslaught, Canopy and Long haul are different characters but when it comes to scourge they were just reaching I understand that theories are ment to be fun but folks be taking this as facts

[@zoltanperei4789]

Huge missed opportunity imo. Unicron wakes up and eats the Bayverse, then hops to the rebooted universe.

[@Crypteral08]

It’s just something Edformers said and if anyone seen his videos, you would know how stretched out his theories are

[@Talon_Productions]

Edformers may have pushed it, but he wasn't the one to put this out there. Supposed "leaks" from 2021, leakes that have now been proven to be false, first mentioned it. But yeah, he tends to push a lot of BS out there as fact and it is annoying.

[@Crypteral08]

@@Talon_Productions he was mostly the reason why it got popular and he does get very annoying at times

[@BusinessStanderBoy]

Lol this theory makes my brain not braining . There’s simply no way

[@QuanjayNon-ie5yx]

finally someone debunks this idiotic theory

[@user-rq1hq5py2n]

Well his face is the terrorcons symbol just like tarn face is the Decepticon symbol

[@HillSD1120]

There’s a theory that Scourge might have killed Ultra Magnus Because he has a Elite guard symbol on him and what better than the leader of the Elite Guard.

[@Oden-gp8xu]

May i ask what music that is? it is neat, it sounds familiar.

[@Talon_Productions]

It is called "Sci fi" and can be found on the Bensound website!

[@legorobloxian9862]

I feel like the movie producers made the mask removal scene and Scourge's face reveal JUST to f*ck with those who thought he was Bayverse Prime

[@Talon_Productions]

Lmao that'd be funny if so!

[@orhandalegend]

They literally started this theory because they had a similar PART on their heads Like come on

[@Talon_Productions]

That and "leaks" saying this was gonna happen.

[@woahbeashooder8671]

I definitely knew it wouldn't turn out to be true, but did think it was a cool idea. Though it's a real downer ending and almost makes the Bay verse all for nothing If anyone major should have been revealed to be scourge, it should have been reboot Megatron. Think about it. He's completely absent in bumblebee (yes i know both scenes were deleted), and they could've done something with that. Have him be found by unicron and turned into Scourge. Although yes that's pretty much a waste of the character, but it's a far better choice if a twist reveal is necessary than Bayverse Optimus. Though at the very least it'd be something since we are now two movies in without even a hint of Megatron's whereabouts or fate

[@Talon_Productions]

Yeah that is part of why I don't like the idea here. I dig the concept but it is too much of a downer ending for the Bayverse and Bay Prime.

[@justnoob8141]

The community DEMAND Bayverse to have downer ending, that’s the problem, they can’t even read ABC

[@AndrewDavis-sj6mb]

What I wanna know what happen to the baddie from TLK movie

[@CRABboy1678]

Also ngl bayverse optmus as scourge and would be pritty cool

[@Talon_Productions]

I don't think that it necessarily a bad idea, I just didn't like it for the movie, plus the annoying people treating the theory as fact ruined it for me.

[@CRABboy1678]

@@Talon_Productions at the end of the day we all have our own opinions

[@korruptor9777]

IT’S NICE TO HAVE HOPE.

[@Talon_Productions]

Is it though? For a dumb theory like this?

[@korruptor9777]

@@Talon_Productions listen bro. At least it was something. This theory is dumb and wasn’t gonna be true. It would be cool tho. I always thought that Optimus was a violent war criminal.

[@Talon_Productions]

@@korruptor9777 If it helps, I don't dislike the idea as a concept, I just don't think that it would have worked here. I disagree with your view of Optimus though! While he is violent in battle he isn't otherwise and he certainly isn't a war criminal. I did a big video on that here if you're interested: kzbin.info/www/bejne/fXbSYoKZm9GXl8k

[@Somerandomguy75812]

The only way i can see scourge being an evil version of optimus is that unicorn or someone else revives him as nemesis prime He was already nemesis prime once in an old anime form the early 2000s

[@BoTron12-sk7zw]

Me: I loved this theory of Bayverse Optimus Prime Being Scourge in Rise of The Beast! Talon Production: I hate it. Me: Yeah, I hate it too.

[@Talon_Productions]

Aw damn I hope I didn't ruin it for you lol

[@BoTron12-sk7zw]

@@Talon_Productions nah I Get it bro, It’s fine

[@seeeabaasssiliketransforme9904]

never really bought it because I know the story writers never go that deep, but I thought it was an all right concept

[@Talon_Productions]

Thats kinda where I'm at. I'm not necessarily against the concept but it just wasn't gonna happen here.

[@0t3n4layf]

Transformers rise of the breast is my favorite movie of all time❤

[@Griffin-Titan]

I also hated this theory so much since all the “evidence” people used was just dumb. “ oh they have very similar bits on top of their heads that means they must be the same person!!!” Which even if that was true ( which is isnt no part of them look alike at all) just because they have the same bits that doesnt make them the same person.

[@FILMBIONICX]

Pues desperdiciaron la idea

[@Zodiac3107]

Every truck transformers exhaust go behind their backs. Take a look at DotM Megatron! Also, the head looks nothing like Optimus.

[@TF_LoRdwashere]

I really believed this theory back then but now I did hope that scourge was prime😂

[@alejandrocaudillo2993]

That’s a stupid theory

[@Fivepiecesofbread28174]

If scourge was bayverse prime the whole movie will be a blood bath bruh the autobots will be died

[@Pedalforwezal]

Hey I like bayformers, but for not the thing that they have immyerd, having bay optimus as scourge, and the bay autobots being evil. But I think the hands of scourge has the hands of bay jazz.

[@justnoob8141]

BB’s Scourge is Bayverse Prime? In a clearly single universe movie? And there is no rumble? G1 fanboy, let me tell you that In fact, NONE of G1 fanboy say Ravage appear in Beast Wars a crossover

[@juantroisi6276]

It was stupid, and I never believed it, but I so wanted to be true, it wouldve honored the name also, or at least one incarnation of that name

[@weewoo695]

Scourge is most likely a lithonian that his ass bitten by unicron then reformed like megatron thundercracker and bombshell in the 86 movie. He resembles kranix wayyy more than optimus

[@Talon_Productions]

I don't mind the idea but I wouldn't say that it is likely considering that Lithone hasn't been seen or mentioned at all. I'm also not really seeing a resemblance to Kranix although that would be a wild way to reference that character!

[@QuanjayNon-ie5yx]

also even if scourge was bayverse prime he would have been to strong but scourge was weak and getting amps everytime from unicron and also the way bay optimus fights bay optimus is skilled and agile meanwhile scourge is weak and as i stated before he got strong from unicron every time and lost fast

[@bcallinan95]

Yeah i thiught this theory was kinda dumb and so happy it never happened.

[@Talon_Productions]

Agreed!

[@christygunter7546]

I miss ratchet.

[@Scourgeisoptimusprimeyt]

I just wanted it to be true because I’m a bayverse Optimus fanboy

[@Talon_Productions]

Me being a Bayverse Prime fanboy is part of why I didn't want it to be true lol

[@Scourgeisoptimusprimeyt]

@@Talon_Productions oh lol

[@nobodyhere8257]

I hated this theory from the second I heard it

[@Gengarextreme]

The funny part is that the movie plot was even dumber

[@Talon_Productions]

Not really lol

[@Gengarextreme]

@@Talon_Productions the villan literally has a gun that turns bots evil and he used it once. Why? If he had used it on Optimus he would have won.

[@jross9553]

The size chart alone debunked the theory

[@Talon_Productions]

Exactly!

[@Melkorsolostheverse]

fr, Scourge is only the size of Crosshairs, whereas Optimus is 32 feet tall

[@Jason49110]

THANK YOU GOOD GOD! This theory was stupid from the start! It makes no sense at all!

[@Talon_Productions]

Agreed! The "evidence" for it was poor and the fact that a good bit of people ran with it is astounding to me.

[@Jason49110]

@@Talon_Productions fr

[@wickdaline8668]

A Transformers multiverse is what they were thinking?

[@Talon_Productions]

The fans were thinking of it more than anyone lmao

[@slickprince0859]

I thought that theory was dumb too😂😂😂

[@BigKnGa]

This was the absolute dumbest theory that ever came out 😂😂😂. Looked nothing like Prime and peoe just ran wild with it.

[@XDarksoulX1129]

Yes he was. You can clearly tell from the movie itself seeming like a lot of things have been cut that included it. You can find remnants run being the ending battle where he says let me show you the power of a real prime. Referencing that scourge was a prime. There are so many scenes that feel like they cut it out of it and we're reworked to drop it. Even unicorn saying they've traveled acrossed time and dimensions. There's a lot of solid evidence for it. More evidence? Scourge alt mode is legit a decrepit true nemesis prime. Many people have broke down how similar they are from figures alone.

[@Talon_Productions]

No he wasn't, and there is not any good evidence for it. The concept artist who did his early designs has denied it, Hasbro themselves denied it, hell even people who saw early versions of the film through test screenings said that wasn't included. When Optimus said "Time to show you the real power of a Prime!" he was referring to what Scourge said earlier in the film "And you call yourself a Prime. Primus would be ashamed." calling Optimus weak, not referencing Scourge being a Prime. The alt mode and figure similarities are coincidental at best. Scourge was never going to be Bayverse Optimus or any other Optimus.

[@NurseAmamiya]

I like to think that Scourge was just a random, nobody Junkion that Unicron snagged and turned into Scourge. His design kinda looked akin to that of the trash heap bots from G1