Objects Don't Have Existence; Existence Has Objects

A discussion about the assumption that we know a world outside our perception of it, the existence of objects and that Consciousness is a product of and limited to the body.
Timestamps:
00:00 Does infinite consciousness depend on perception?
01:28 What is consciousness?
03:30 Can our perceptions meet?
05:00 A shared world outside our perception
06:35 One world or one consciousness?
09:55 Objects don't have existence
12:48 Awareness is present, I am aware
14:00 Can awareness ever be broken?
16:12 Our thoughts arise inside awareness
17:53 Objects are borrowed from existence
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[@annette4660]

The last 90 seconds of this are mind-blowing. "We don't perceive the world; we perceive the perception. We presume it's the perception of the world, but we never find 'of the world'." All we are ever sure we experience is perceptions. In other words, it's only perceptions that appear, not stuff. Nice.

[@JuraGaga]

Here, that is what Buddhas teach for thousands years now.

[@debtickner]

This is the closest you’ll get to a brilliant explanation of what’s going on. Rupert at his clearest!🙏🏻

[@Axito2]

I Just thought that we probably all know this on and intuitive Level... When there Just is awareness it communicates Through this body vehicle (Rupert) to itself Basicly awareness talking to itself ❤

[@anhumblemessengerofthelawo3858]

_A Course In Miracles_

[@MrCFortune]

Also think of it like this. Maybe it’s not Rupert at his clearest, it could be you at your most receiving , or you at your clearest to HEAR it in the level you needed to hear it on. ☺️

[@debtickner]

@@MrCFortune Exactly! Proof of that is if I watch it again months later it doesn’t necessarily seem as clear! 😂

[@transmogrifiers]

Thank you, lady, for asking these questions and insisting. You're putting a bridge here between Rupert and us, and you're putting Rupert on rails to deliver that truth 🎉

[@josefeijoo7415]

Yo tambien le doy las GRACIAS A ESA SEÑORA POR LA PREGUNTA ¡¡¡¡

[@pamelajfederlein3038]

I FINALLY GET IT!!! I have watched many, many hour of non-duel teachers. Not to mention the books I have read. This one video in itself I have viewed over and over. I just didn't get it until tonight. Just keep going.....

[@chimenerf]

I am so happy for you, i hope one day i am blessed too

[@ivogody]

This is my favourite video of Rupert for the same reason.

[@nonaurbiz2563]

yeah... if you really try hard and disturb the dopamin levels in your brain you can see and feel and understand all kind of things that are not really there nor mean anything real.

[@ivogody]

Like dreams are not share hallucinations neither.

[@flashlife8256]

so, are dreams not real just because they are not shared?

[@christinepletsch]

This talk is really a Masterpiece!!! I hear it again and again and it sinks deeper and deeper. Thank you so much for being in my world! 😅💗🙏

[@irisfelix6699]

The absolute best explanation of reality and existence! Thank you Thank you Thank you Rupert !!! Love always.

[@dudukdreams]

An attempt to explain reality is simply not possible. Everything conceived originates from the mind. Refrain from thinking, refrain from speaking, and arrive at the realization that silence is wisdom.

[@synesthesia251]

By far the most concise collection of thoughts perfectly explaining "reality" is presented in this 21 minute talk! Congrats, perfectly put together, very clear... more "proof" that Free will doesn't exist as we ":think" it exists, but its an irrelevant meaningless question in the first place to an irrelevant meaningless subject (human)

[@ber3203]

“We are not perceiving the world, we perceive perception” 💯

[@brentonl]

Since it's all words, it's really just a story

[@WillDanceAlone2U]

This is simply marvelous. Rupert is such a patient teacher.

[@DiscoverArt]

OMG Thanks for turning my world upside down...Over and Over.

[@joegardens1973]

It takes turns... over and over again... to make the world go round...

[@AndreasDelleske]

Just come out of the washing machine, will ya? :)

[@elainereader9247]

Wow! I “think” I got something……I think. I will watch this again and again and maybe again. I seem to be “hearing” something that i really need to “hear.” Thank you Rupert! 💕

[@josefeijoo7415]

Hoy lo estoy oyendo por 1 vez ,pero tengo que oirlo otra vez¡¡¡¡

[@geneedgerton4482]

Great, great questions from this woman. Rupert’s answer blew my mind. I got it!!!! Thank you. 😊

[@guillermohernandez4000]

7:30 *"Why is there a consistency between the 75 rooms ? Because they all come from the same consciousness"*

[@GordonBurnsVideo]

This is indeed very clear and lucid. Thanks you so much Rupert. I had a most remarkable emotional experience listening to this. Like the truth of it touched a knowing in me and recognised itself. Great emotional energy was released - was it crying - was it laughing - was it both? I will sink into and meditate on this fully until the truth of it is made clear and known.

[@sanjayseroha4219]

Thank you lady, you pushed Rupert all the way to the truth. This is what I got from it: every human being only exist as a vibration emerging from One consciousness, perceived as an individual from the separate self. We only perceive the perception of the individual, in reality there is no individual

[@susanwale8887]

Thanks to you dear Rupert I feel more and more aware of consciousness. How can we not realize this earlier in life? I feel so free from mind and thoughts.

[@celiaclaase6887]

We don't share the world, but we do share the consciousness of the world -profound!

[@ginaseawright7450]

You're Amazing. You are one of the very few people I've ever heard explain self consciousness awareness so beautifully🌹

[@TheRenoir]

Thank you. The analogy of the screen helps my mind in grasping that the screen is. Careful choice of language to me appears pivotal in order to communicate this to others. Rupert is certainly gifted in this area.

[@trishaemry55]

Rupert, your analogies, clarify so much for me ,THANKYOU ! ❤️

[@I-Am-Aware]

What an amazing presentation! Rupert Spira has such an incredible way of expressing Truth.

[@DLBurggraf]

It is thought that derails me of realizing my true nature. I am the awareness of them.

[@frederickalschuler4693]

The qualities of awareness include: existence (beingness, presence); awareness; indivisibility; indestructibility. And, underneath it all, underneath the appearance of multiplicity and diversity; underneath an apparent storm of emotion or darkness of grief and sorrow, is the clear open and pristine space of awareness.

[@saidas108]

Magnificent! Such clarity and articulation. I would love to hear/see a scientists rebuttal of this contention with Rupert.

[@terefefeyssa877]

Saidas108: reality is not revealed through contention

[@TheParakeet1999]

Science is just words too. The concepts don't mean absolutely anything just like all teachings and all knowledge ultimately. In truth science is a joke that's only useful for those who believe there is matter out there.

[@charanjs3108]

@saidaa108 Watch the one with Rupert and Bernardo .. there's a few of them ..

[@davidhughes6]

Oh wow! I have wondered so much about why we humans seem to experience the same world when we are each a different world or universe. Finally i get it thanks to this video. It's because we come from the one same consciousness. Thank you Rupert, i had given up any one even trying to explain this to me so to hear you address this in this video was most surprising and pleasing xoxoxo

[@reptilexcq2]

Are you sure we're living in the same world? John's world is different from Mary's world. If John passed away, his world does not exist anymore even if Mary think it is there. Each individual has its own world.

[@JustinTweed]

I'm speechless this actually makes sense to me

[@joegardens1973]

It's so simple it's hard... I see it too... I'm with you...

[@nsbd90now]

He is able to talk about the human experience of reality so clearly.

[@alemandeutschutm7894]

Just great, the clarity and comprehensibility of your message touches me at the very core! It reminds me of Wu Chi, pure awareness as the great emptiness.

[@susanvaughan4210]

When I was in Kindergarden, when I went into the bathroom stall and closed the door (my first experience of being alone behind a closed door) I would wonder if the world outside that door then disappeared.

[@zoranvanzindell]

awww its woody and buzz coming alive..

[@teryarty177]

That's like the fridge light syndrome. Does it really go off when you close the door? Terry Waite reckons it does.

[@TheLUCYCAT]

@@teryarty177 The fridge light goes off because there is a switch, But the real question is if we don't SEE the refrigerator, does it exist?

[@teryarty177]

@@TheLUCYCAT The real question is do you recognize that the existence of things outside of consciousness is a belief? It's that belief that also says "I am a limited conciousness"

[@TheLUCYCAT]

@@teryarty177 Well my "make belief" refrigerator may need replacing soon, and I am conscious of the fact that it will cost a lot of money. LOL Such a deep subject but I wonder if it can be applied to practical matters. We can't seem to escape objects in our existance. The only time I have been un-burdened from them was in my dreams. Does that make sense?

[@KSGEmotions]

One word...PERFECT! THANKYOU

[@Misslotusification]

"The appearance of a world comes into existence when consciousness takes the form of perceptions."

[@reptilexcq2]

And where does perceptions come from? Love. And where does rationality come from? Wisdom. For God is Love manifested into Wisdom.

[@19Marc79]

This is AWESOME :-) It shows that modern societies have to come back from merely thinking about life, back to EXPERIENCING life (or from theoretical knowledge back to EXPERIENTIAL knowledge).

[@Elazar40]

"Objects don't have existence." Perfect! Similarly, "we," do not move through time. Time, of which the physical body is a subject aspect, moves through us (consciousness). "Aging" then, is watching our bodies go by. Whereas matter is transient, consciousness is not.

[@arianmenmi2510]

"Time borrows its continuity from My eternity"

[@Lila-cy8qm]

clear and more clear...thanks a lot Rupert! Beauty.

[@kwixotic]

That TV screen/character analogy is nothing short of brilliant.

[@hexenblut13]

Anybody here knew these things since childhood and Rupert seems to be shaping them out in words as he goes along? And its like I always knew that but couldn't describe it

[@azimshabestary6411]

Thank you,the best example is seed and a tree seed is before,during the existence of the tree and at the end of a tree .

[@stevedavy2878]

Surely the creation of visual art, music, dance and scientific discovery, shows that we all see the world individually, and intepret the world from a different Perspective.

[@sunbeam9222]

This man speaks way too much sense for my mind. I get what he says yet don t quite get it, tho I seem to grasp a bit more when I view it again. Type of video to watch many times, fascinating.

[@suniltshegaonkar7809]

Very wise question asked. Thanks for asking.

[@keithnisbet]

I completely understand this lady’s frustration. Intellectual understanding is vastly different from Realization, as is so well illustrated by this interchange. Great Q&A.

[@dudukdreams]

The process of realization has nothing to do with mind activity. Reality itself is a concept of the mind. There is nothing to realize. Realizing is the exact opposite of "realization". True wisdom remains silent. To claim that objects outside of our perception do not exist is based solely on the misconception of believing that we know what an object or perception itself is.

[@OurEternalHome]

18:25 the next few words of Rupert are of incredible significance. KIJK OPNIEUW.

[@borkapajic4154]

💖Thank You😊Rupert🌺for being the CLEAR Transperency for The One lnfinite Mind🙏In THAT Realization lS our True Liberation🙏

[@mehovek]

I think it is one of the most important videos I watched on my journey

[@letsgoforit88]

I'm just in the middle of this talk, but it already amazes me. Contradicting to all my basic beliefs and concepts. Not 7 billion perceptions (which is inside each person's body) looking at the same object, but the same perception looking at the 7 billion objects. Consistence is kept by the same perception, not by the same object. Existence has Objects, not Objects have Existence.

[@markparfett5380]

The lady does not need to feel insecure. She is allowed to believe in the conventional and do the best she can do in that realm.

[@Jayd-san]

Perfect illustration the screen and the character.

[@delcapslock100]

I was wondering when KZbin's Angry Adolescents would discover these videos.

[@gardeniabee]

Perhaps that is why we feel "Love" and "in Love" when we have a mutual perception our awarenesses touch?

[@maheshn9970]

There is no shared world. Each one of us sees a, slightly, different world because our minds are not identical. Consiousness is one but each one of us sees the world through our mind and since our minds are not identical our view of the world cannot be identical either. Is this correct?

[@EvenStarLoveAnanda]

The Character does not awaken... Consciousness Awakens from the Character.

[@jameelisaac1265]

Consciousness can't awaken without the character im not saying the character awakens. You can say the purpose of consciousness expressing itself is so it can awaken.

[@joegardens1973]

@@jameelisaac1265... Well said...

[@pedrogonzales9202]

Jameel Isaac why does consciousness need a character to awaken? Is not Awareness already awake?

[@garyconroy8918]

Rupert.. please explain your take on how the universe undertook any beginning and subsequent formation prior to any form of biological awareness. It is this that makes me think that matter has trace consciousness.

[@Echiya]

Rupert is so patient with this woman who really triggered me.

[@DagangWei]

When you see a flower, the flower is your consciousness, there is no flower independent of your consciousness. If you don't believe, think about dream, you will believe it is totally possible.

[@humanbeing64]

After awakening that is exactly the way it happens here Rupert. The aliveness or awareness that i clearly am, is seen and actually caught forming into the thought usually as an image and it seems for a moment that awareness is covered, but it then falls back inn. in a split second it is seen how it forms and unforms. This flip flop has been going on for the past 4 years.

[@pedrogonzales9202]

Dylan please elaborate.

[@marialobato4845]

So very well explained.

[@jean-paulbascelli1078]

What about people that have damaged or inoperative perceptive faculties? Someone who is deaf cannot hear yet sound exists. Why would we have perceptual faculties if there wasn't an external world to perceive in the first place?

[@dudukdreams]

Because the sensory organs are also objects within a larger "consciousness". Again: "perception is also a perception"

[@energyeternal]

amazing video.

[@I-Am-Aware]

"Phenomena only "exist" in the mind that perceives them." - Tibetan Book of the Dead

[@dewdrops3065]

Mind blowing... Truly amazing

[@bornuponawave]

That first 8 minutes blew my mind wide open 🤯🤩

[@borkapajic4154]

💖Thank Y😊u🌺Rupert🌠🌠🌠🌠🌠Rating for The CONTENT of this video Presentation🙏

[@bernbisca]

Thank you so much for sharing! Could you activate the translator button for the videos please ? Thanks a lot. A French Friend

[@dexx44]

You are the consciousnesses, which experience a Illusionary world through one character in a movie. A world, a character, taughts made of consciousness. The illusion is the character believes through his ego, he experience a world. The ego is a veil, glasses, though the consciousness experience consciousness

[@osvaldovaldes10009]

Never gets to saying explicitly that, like in a dream, there is no world. Very good...

[@synesthesia251]

I 100% get what you are saying, and think the same was as you Rupert...

[@joegardens1973]

Wow...all I can say WOW... Awareness... I am ultimate Awareness... Unlimitless Awareness... For I am Aware of myself... I am aware of you being Aware of me...

[@spiritfilled5758]

So beautiful. It's amazing that when we turn things inside out, they make sense.. mind blowing, LOL

[@Kaynos]

Awareness is the canvas on which the world is painted on. Can a painting exist without a canvas ?

[@actoranandcr]

Like how he says there is no proof for existence of the world, is there any proof to say it is non-existent?

[@KnowledgeandWisdomhub]

Worlds best spiritual teacher

[@thomassoliton1482]

There are 75 consciousness' (C's) experienncing 75 rooms. The room I see cannot be exactly the same as you see. However, the "rooms" are similar in many respects because our brains work (process our perceptions) similarly. We agree on the gross similarities, so we can agree that our consciousness is similar. That doesn't mean that there 1 or 2 or 75 C's. "It cannot be divided" - true because it doesn't really exist, it is an idea - a paradigm we use to communicate. There is absolutely no need to believe that there is an "independent" consciousness in there or out there or anywhere for that matter. Awareness is fundamental, but consciousness is just a process, a concept, a symbol our mind uses like love, greed, beauty, or any other abstract concept we use everyday.

[@AndreasDelleske]

Radioactivity is outside of our perception but it is there, including nuclear waste that does not only exist in our thoughts. So, what or who is aware of it? Or brought it into existence? I am pretty sure natural laws and physics are not in contradiction to what Rupert says. Physics is not about matter at all, physics is the science about world structures, repeatable phenomena. We just don’t know enough yet to find the bridge between these worlds of knowing.

[@angeloiodice9304]

I got it on the first go around. But, in the final elaborations and distillations, it became hopelessly convoluted.

[@cothat]

it just like online game ? the internet is the Consciousness, the clients are all "rooms" which have the consistency, cuz it belong to one server in the internet :)

[@arunagreen8119]

This is like " existence precedes essence". Said by the existentialists

[@tylerfehr7883]

Question: in reference to "can awareness ever be broken?". When one goes under anesthesia, time seems to skip forward for however long you were out. When one gains awareness again, what happened to the world in between me going under and coming back up?

[@sakyedhondup]

What Rupert is presenting here seems entirely consistent with the core of the Heart Sutra, which states: "Emptiness is form, and form emptiness." It also seems identical--or nearly identical--to the the formulation of Bernardo Kastrup in his "Why Materialism is Baloney." I would love to hear Rupert and Bernardo dialogue about this.

[@joseph.chahine]

You had your wish :p

[@Ron-rk6iz]

Rupert loves to make simple things difficult. All is build of sub atoms, energy and vibration, either invisible for the human being or clustered and it becomes mass, thus visible. Do people here on KZbin really get happy knowing this.....?

[@yelp005]

Yes, absolutely! 😊 He only needs to do so much explaining because most of us are so fixated on the *contents* of our thoughts (e.g. atoms and logic) that initially we have a hard time shifting our focus from those contents to the “place” where thoughts arise (consciousness). Once we recognize the fundamental difference between a thought and its contents, we see that our understanding of the “world” is just a story: It is something that appears as the contents of our thoughts, just like a novel appears as the contents of a book. Our “normal” view of reality is the result of mistaking the contents of our thoughts and perceptions for reality, like a child believing a fairytale read to it by its mother. 😌🙏🏻

[@mattias0114]

Well thoughts can be the same but that dont mean that it as the same structure and the Sam with reality we se different I can never know how others se me

[@LifeIsATest4TheHereafter]

can I have the link to this full talk please

[@brahmasatyamjaganmithya6708]

Thank you Rupert. One consciousness and millions of persons.

[@brahmasatyamjaganmithya6708]

There´s nothing to proof, take it or leave it. Consciousness is our primary expierence, before you have an expierence of anything, consciousness must be presence... Good luck with your sience.

[@Teaganbear]

This is arguing a technicality. The point that the video makes is that you both ARE - and we have that in common. The fact that we ARE is mind-blowing and science cannot account for the Self - you cannot point to somewhere in the body or universe and say "that's the Self". without the Self, matter is just a bunch of chemical reactions, atoms, building blocks... life is the point of the universe.

[@brahmasatyamjaganmithya6708]

Yes, life is consciousness and it is pointless.

[@brahmasatyamjaganmithya6708]

one consciousness and millions of minds.

[@asstornaut1066]

BILLIONS of consciousnessess and billions of persons. It is not one , two, three or four, it is many. It isn't even a field, a connected field, it is billions unknown etc.

[@dr.susheelkhemariya8966]

Wahwah AhaAha wonderful Chamatkaric VISHMAYPURNA wonderful dhanyabadDhanyabadDhanyabad thanksgretitude dhanyabad dhanyabadDhanyabadDhanyabad Rupertspira dhanyabadDhanyabadDhanyabad

[@siewkonsum7291]

Likewise, take the analogy of waves and ocean. The waves arise due to external winds on the ocean. Both waves and ocean are never apart of each other - as a huge mass substance water called Ocean. So winds ( perceived objects) cause waves (thoughts) to arise in the all-around Awareness ie Ocean. In essence, thoughts ( waves) are part and parcel of the underlying Awareness ie Ocean.

[@benshrope5707]

Consciousness, from the Latin root “Con” “scio” literally translated “to cut” or “to split”.

[@trick0171]

It is scary how many people buy into this. Yes, consciousness is how we model reality. That, however, does not mean, imply, or infer that consciousness precedes reality. That idea is a nonsequitur - it doesn't follow from the premises. P1: Everything I know or am aware of through the mechanism of conscious experience P2: My knowledge or awareness of objects comes through conscious experience C: Consciousness precedes or produces objects, not vice versa That conclusion does not follow, because there is a distinction between one's awareness of an object via conscious modeling, and the actual object itself. The reason we can know there is something external is because we can also model things like how photons reflect off of the object, how they hit our retina, and the fact that we have a brain which we can use an MRI to show which areas light up when we do conscious modeling. We infer that there is an external reality that is mind independent through our conscious modeling (what we experience). We also infer there are other humans with other minds the same way. If one is going to fall into the trap of solipsism, then they should go all the way. If we cannot have knowledge about an external reality because we need to parse everything through our own consciousness, then we ALSO cannot have knowledge about other minds, as we only experience our own. We cannot make some inference of "infinite consciousness" because we only know our own conscious experience. For all we know we are a brain in a jar being probed by alien scientists to experience what we do. But let's stay consistent when using hard solipsism and intractable epistemological problems for our conclusions....either go all the way with this for consistency, or recognize that conscious experience is our way of modeling an external reality that existed long before creatures with any consciousness ever evolved on planet earth.

[@paulbrandon422]

trick0171: The flaw in the argument you’re making about the supposed incorrect conclusion Rupert arrives at from the two premises you stated is that you are making an unspoken incorrect premise yourself. You say that “there is a distinction between our awareness of an object......and the object itself “. The premise here is that there is a “self” that is aware. All non-dual teaching today, (including Rupert’s) point to the fact that the separate self is an illusion. In fact some leading scientists now say the same thing. An example is Sam Harris, a well known intellectual, consciousness researcher and neuroscientist who has spoken and written extensively on the topic. Here’s a link to a Big Think video of his titled “the self is an illusion “.... kzbin.info/www/bejne/nJLNl56FlL1jopI. Sam has also stated on numerous occasions that “all that exists is Consciousness and it’s contents”. What Rupert’s teaching suggests is that both are the opposite sides of the one coin (emptiness and form)

[@heatherberg7499]

fantastic!

[@ceruleandusk]

At 7:20 Can't the exact same argument be made for the opposite view, the materialist view, that There are 75 individual consciousnesses seeing one room and it looks the same for each one due to the consistency of the room (matter) instead of the consciousnesses ? Not hating on Rupert but I'm just pointing this out because I also want to figure it out.

[@simonsanchezkumrich8489]

Maybe, idk, gotta keep looking and learning

[@yelp005]

As Rupert explained, the materialist view is not supported by your own experience. If there were 75 consciousnesses, they would have to be limited and separate from each other. But you cannot find any limit or edge to your consciousness. It doesn’t “end“ someplace. And because it has no objective qualities, there is no way in which you could tell two consciousnesses apart. If there was one independent world outside of these 75 consciousnesses, how could you prove its existence if all anyone ever experiences is their own, private perceptions of that world? You can’t prove that your perceptions are exactly identical to someone else’s, because they’re private and qualitatively uncommunicatable. And you can’t prove that anything outside of your perceptions exists, because how would you know of it? 🙏🏻🙂

[@trishaemry55]

THANKYOU. ❤️❤️❤️❤️❤️❤️❤️

[@Idunnoaboutyou]

the patience….a true sage

[@lindaj71]

what is the difference between a mind-body being made of consciousness and a table being made of consciousness.

[@dbkirklandMusic]

Only one of his existences depend on her perception and disappears when she is gone. Does all of her existences disappear when she is gone? Or just transformed into an inanimate casing of perception? Like a star collapses when all its energy is burned only leaving a burned shell body, yet that is still in existence because it still retains the space it takes up?

[@dbkirklandMusic]

Things come into existence.

[@dbkirklandMusic]

Consciousness/awareness then matter? If so then consciousness/awareness is in all matter/things, even rocks etc…

[@DPSAX95]

What about direction? I have the impression that experience happens in different directions

[@jessed.g.122]

Brilliant !!!👍

[@mgciniwata5115]

Theres is one thing that I do not get maybe someone can enlighten me. Why does Rupert say, we cannot have different perceptions and share the world instead having it the other way? We are one species with the same makeup, so to me we can definitely share one world while having 7 billion perceptions. More like cameras of the same phone and software. We only differ in seeing the same world when we sit next to other species with different biology.

[@helmerkappert5152]

Briljant, brilant briljant!!

[@ddowusmc1970]

BRILLIANT!!

[@lifeengagement8050]

Thank you! 🙏🙏

[@hhhstar]

I had an experience that made awareness laugh, and awareness pissed their non duality pants!

[@markantrobus8782]

Two thoughts do meet. It is called love.