Rusting Wax Chains, Tyre Width & Turbo ERG Mode | GCN Tech Clinic

[@gcntech]

Drop your hot tech questions in the comments using #askgcntech ⚙

[@rogersimmons8788]

I put my waxed chain in a bowl of rice to remove any moisture, as suggested. It worked brilliantly but the rice tasted horrible!

[@mjokffsgfjs]

A dash of soy sauce does wonder.

[@rogersimmons8788]

@@mjokffsgfjs On the chain or the rice?

[@PeterFulford]

@@rogersimmons8788 The soy sauce goes on the rice. Sesame oil on the chain.

[@IamPapaShaw]

You are supposed to add lube to the rice after you remove the chain. Bon appetit.

[@blakebullock9656]

Nice one! 😂

[@TnFruit]

Hi Olli. The big ring might be more efficient, but the power data might be more incorrect on some turbo trainer, cause the flywheel turns faster. Best gear for Erg mode: front small an rear middle or slightly right of the middle.

[@81antiloop]

Spot on

[@jamesmckenzie3532]

Agreed. Even Wahoo recommend this. The key is smoothness at the trainer and watching for overspin of the flywheel. Several YT videos go into this in great detail.

[@Tomaschhh-k5z]

Absolutely correct! In 34x25 my Saris is off by +/- 1 watt from my power meter and in the big ring 50x24 is already +15 watts off. Then again the higher flywheel speed gives it more inertia, therefore it is easier to get off over the top dead spot.

[@redalert2834]

If you live in one of those parts of the world where water sometimes falls from the sky or the air can become fully saturated with water vapour, i.e. anywhere except the Sahara desert, the best thing to do with a waxed chain is to oil it like an ordinary chain. Or be prepared to fit a new chain to your bike every day (after the rigmarole of waxing it).

[@zygmuntthecacaokakistocrat6589]

Or treat waxing like the marketing-driven furphy that it is, and ignore it.

[@samtwine42]

GP Lama did a video comparing big and small chain rings in erg mode. The small chain ring means your peak force happens earlier through the pedal stroke phase. Larger chain ring means it happens later and you can accelerate your pedal stroke more which can allow more force production. It also means peak force point occurs at a point more efficient for biomechanics. Also big ring gives the flywheel more momentum making it easier to continue pushing the gear. And as I’ve seen others say with the bugger gear you get bigger power fluctuations which can make it feel easier. My contribution to the hive mind ^

[@samtwine42]

kzbin.info/www/bejne/q3m4gJujfJVng5osi=70i7VO01fwlVw7LB

[@samtwine42]

Gp lama video if anyone super nerdy wants to learn about optimal chain ring angles 🤓

[@matt_acton-varian]

I find it curious that Ollie said that higher pressure induces wheel slip on an indoor trainer - I have found the opposite to be true. I run a trainer tyre close to max pressure and when I feel wheelslip I know it's time to re-inflate. Rolling resistance is also noticeably more at lower pressures.

[@feedbackzaloop]

what kind of trainer do you have? Rollers or turbo? Because latter is pressed against the tyre with a mechanism and as pressure in the tyre drops the contact decompresses, hense the slipping

[@matt_acton-varian]

@@feedbackzaloop wheel on smart turbo.

[@feedbackzaloop]

@@matt_acton-varian so here you have it: keep high pressure and strict control over it or lower pressure with higher tension in the mechanism.

[@kestralrider313]

I think Ollie mixed up his terms on this one. In my own experience when using a wheel on flywheel trainer (non-direct), you would raise the pressure until the tire stops slipping, but there other factor is the clamping pressure is the best way to do it. I used a special trainer tire when using it for long periods, but in general ran tires are the sidewall rated pressures and used the clamping pressure knob to get it tight enough to not slip on sprints, but not tighter because too tight = more friction and heat/wear on the tire.

[@MarginalLosses]

Belts definitely have their downsides, many of which were mentioned here, but they're not inherently limited by gear range. Of course a cheap 3-speed hub will have terrible range, but a Rohloff Speedhub, for example, 14 gears and over 530% gear range, and the Kindernay XIV offers a similar spec. And moving away from hubs, some of the Pinion gearboxes have a gear range of well over 600%. The biggest downside of belts for non-competetitive use is, in my opinion, the fact that they require a split seatstay in order to fit the single-piece belt through the frame. There is now a split belt on the market, which removes that requirement, but there doesn't appear to be much information about it so its quality and durability are anybody's guess. Also high quality, high-range gear hubs and gearboxes are really expensive, and gearboxes obviously require a special frame.

[@festerofest4374]

Thank you for that explanation. And I hadn't thought about getting a belt on/off with a traditional bicycle frame and gears setup! I would have to believe with today's manufacturing tech we'll be seeing good removable belts soon, which opens up more development options for belt-bikes. I would LOVE to see 50 years into the future with what will be available!

[@CameronFraserACHF]

I appreciate the answer to my question. Very helpful. I also appreciate your belief I could generate enough power to make the tire slip on my trainer. Your belief is misplaced, but I do appreciate it.

[@Erd_Geschoss]

rust on waxed chains: I had great success with a "winter wax" where i mixed about 1/6 of petroleum jelly into the hot wax. This way is bleeds out a minimal film of water repellent oil.

[@adadinthelifeofacyclist]

In erg mode using the small chainring, the resistance of the trainer would increase and the speed of the flywheel would decrease, the equivalent of an increase in gradient in real life. Obviously the erg mode keeps your power input the same so the resistance cancels out the gearing, but you'll feel the difference in flywheel momentum not just when accelerating but also through the pedal stroke particularly at the top and bottom, making spinning feel different in the same way as it does when spinning uphill

[@davidpala7882]

Belt drive is also probably the best option for expedition bikes, and if you use an appropriate gearbox like Rohloff or Pinion the gear range won't be an issue. from my experience, the belt is less efficient than a chain in 'normal' riding but not when is plenty of mud and dirt

[@francoispayen]

Exactly, different tools for different jobs! I'm getting a gravel/bikepacking bike built around a Rohloff and a Gates belt drive, for long trips in any conditions.

[@davidpala7882]

@@francoispayen I'm with you! To riduce friction of the belt, if you have a very stiff rear triangle, the suggestion is to reduce belt tension much more than what is indicated by Gates (see Cyclingabout as reference)

[@Avioto]

@@francoispayen What kind of bike are you thinking about? I love the idea of a belt-driven gravel bike, but struggling to find any.

[@francoispayen]

@@Avioto These bikes are pretty much impossible to find in North America. You basically have to import, buy the components and build your own (Soma Wolverine frame is a popular option) or get one custom built. I went for the 3rd option, from a local builder. Delivery should be around February, can't wait! Commercially available, fully built options include bikes such as the Shand Cycles Stooshie, Tout Terrain Scrambler, Santos Gravel King and Gravel Master. All European, very high end bikes. My custom build will be at a similar price point, but way more specific to my own body measurements.

[@Avioto]

@@francoispayen Thanks for that super detailed response. I'm in the EU so maybe I'll have an easier time. Have fun with your new bike, it sounds fantastic!

[@veloello1]

Wheel on trainer: high tire pressure and high forward pressure of the roller to stop slip, then recalibrate with that setup.

[@davidnicholson6680]

Im a heavy sweater riding outside and my sweat seems to be highly corrosive. I tried waxing my chains for about a year. I ran a three chain rotation on two different bikes. I didn't find waxing to be any more work than running wet lube, but without exception all of these chains started to rust shockingly quickly. I maintain my bikes carefully and I have not had an issue with chains rusting in the past while using wet lube. I had cleaned the chains I waxed carefully in an ultrasonic cleaner. I had waxed then about every 150 miles and supplimented between waxing with Silca Super Secret drip wax. Regardless, all of them rusted. I went back to carefully applied wet lube (Silca Synergetic) and the rusting issue stopped. I guess waxing just doesn't work for me.

[@timtaylor9590]

Endurance rides at slower speeds definitely go to 28, 30 may be a bit to much, but that depends on the weight of the rider. Lighter riders don't need a 30mm tire on decent roads. Wider rims are now made to fit the wider tires and should give a slight aero gain assuming the fit is good.

[@MggW]

#askgcn Having just watched the excellent cafe ride with Matt Stephens (nearly as good a presenter as Dan) and Tom Pidcock, the raised a really important question we need answered. Are peas more aero than carrots? And in which direction are carrots the most aero? My gut says fat/leaves end first, but this possibly depends on net airspeed.

[@gmivisualsjason3729]

Some excellent information this time........ As always 😂

[@mjokffsgfjs]

The allotted time is about 11 mins, since Ollie said "Unfortunately, that is all the time....", after the last question.

[@dannyjohnbrown]

I hope this question makes sense to someone, here goes..... I deflated my (32mm slick gravel king) tubeless tire to replace the bunged up valve. As I did so sealant leaked from all around the rim in about 30 different places. I removed the dried sealant from inside the tire and around the beading but NO AMOUNT of messing about would get the tire to re-inflate. I have a pre-pressure pump thingy. So I am now running out with a tube in. The beading did "pop" in on inflation but not sure what to do now. Any suggestions appreciated. TIA. #askgcntech BTW. Love the show. Love the channel. Love what you do. I used to enjoy cycling but now you guys have turned me into a nerd that loves everything about it.

[@mattlloyd6651]

This might all be just in my perception rather than reality, but when I use ERG mode and have it in the bike's easiest gear it feels like my resistance is being controlled by applying much more brake than it is when it's in the harder gears. Doing two ERG rides back to back - the exact same course, watts, etc with the only difference being the gear the bike's in, the harder gearing feels a bit more natural while the easier gearing always seems to feel more artificial.

[@paulavery8897]

Big ring on trainer feels easier to me. It seems there is less of a dead spot due to the extra momentum in the flywheel.

[@albikes8484]

As a belt rider,Id say the major issue has to do with gearing. Internal geared hubs and gear boxes are heavy compared to a chain system. If your a single speed or fixed rider the belts are light and efficient with less service intervals. Until they figure out how to get a geared belt system light enough to be competitive it will never be the norm. As far as waxed chains and rust. In between waxings you can just take a wet lube,put it on a rag and wipe the side plates of the chain down. As to not interfere with the wax under the rollers.

[@philadams9254]

On the subject of rusty waxed chains, if mine gets so wet it needs a re-wax but I have other chains to rotate through, I'll clean/dry it right away. Leaving it lying around waiting for the next wax dunking (many chains at once) can make rusting so bad that the links go stiff. At that point, it's game over.

[@zygmuntthecacaokakistocrat6589]

Not quite: a) use oil (to start with), but if you haven't; b) soak it in WD 40 for a week or so; c) drip dry it for a day or so; d) put it an ultrasonic cleaner for an hour or so, or maybe longer, changing the solution once or twice; e) fling dry it; f) compressed air dry it; g) soak it in WD 40 overnight; h) drip dry it; i) wipe it dry: it should be ok now. j) Don't use wax ever again.

[@philadams9254]

@@zygmuntthecacaokakistocrat6589 Thanks, but it's too late - as soon as I get stiff links, I throw the chain away. I don't own WD40, an ultrasonic cleaner or an air compressor and don't really want to either. It's all a lot of work and time that I could use to just make more money to buy a new chain! 😂

[@donbethel7675]

Step 1. Buy two chains. Step 2. Buy a chain link removal tool. Step 3. Buy degreaser and chain lube. Step 4. Alternate chains from bike to degreaser container to maintain optimal drive train efficiency. Having the ability to switch out to a clean chain in less than five minutes is amazing,. And as you know having a clean drive train is important, and no one wants to deal with a nasty dirty chain. A Hugh advantage is the dirty chain cleans itself in the degreaser while you ride. So you don't have to do much but the install and lube. Also the life of the chain is increased.

[@MacBob]

@donbethel7675 it's a great idea but your cassette etc also gets pretty dirty using wet lube My preference is 2 chains and hot wax as the rest of the drivetrain stays much cleaner

[@RenAigu]

I kinda wanna do this, it can be a good weekly routine. I always have a few chains in stock anyway. But I'd say 5 minutes is a bit optimistic though, I'd say 10 minutes of actual effort and maybe a bit of waiting time to rinse the degreased chain and let it dry. And while you're waiting, why not spray a bit of degreaser on the cassette and chainrings. Then brush that in and rinse and dry it too. and then it adds up and suddenly you're doing a full service.

[@donbethel7675]

Try to keep it to under 5 minutes, and both tires on the bike. lol And I hit the rear cassette, but I have the fortune of an air compressor to air dry everything before a quick lube with the chain lube machine thingy.@@RenAigu

[@francoispayen]

The gearing comment about belt driven bikes is more or less true: Some hubs like the Rohloff Speed 14 have a range that is just as wide as (or even wider than) your typical cassette setup. The main disadvantage is weight, and the fact that this weight is all in the rear. Like Ollie said, it'll never be suited for road racing, but it more than makes up for it by being bulletproof and almost maintenance free regardless of riding conditions.

[@Mavrik-60]

I agree with my kids mom. "Bike riding is an out door sport and should be treated as one. Don't you dare bring that bike inside I don't care how clean it is bikes were ment to ride out of doors" What mama says goes.

[@sventice]

A good way to prevent chain rust, regardless of the lubricant, is to store the bike in a heated room after a wet ride.

[@woutdw4214]

Hi GCN! M bike was delivered with a 10-30 12 speed SRAM Force cassette, which I used for a hundred couple of kilometers. I then bought a 10-33 cassette to ride the Stelvio, which I now used for around 6000 km's. I would like to install the 10-30 cassette on my indoor trainer and keep the 10-33 on my rear wheel for the occasional ride outside in winter when it's good weather. Will this give problems for my chain because of switching between a more and less used cassette? Thanks!

[@oplkfdhgk]

Speaking of tires could you test some schwalbe balloon tires/bikes? I kinda wanna try those but there aren't that much information about those on youtube.

[@HighFell]

Rice is a poor way to dry anything out. Waxed chain is good in winter as it doesn’t attract all the crud and turn to a grinding paste, but to stop the outer plates rusting, keep chain waxed as normal, after a ride wipe over with a cloth, then spray a small amount of GT85 onto a cloth and wipe across the chain surface lightly. The wax does the lubricant job and the GT85 stops the rust. Top up with drip wax as usual

[@davidshardlow4369]

#askgcntech Hi Dr Ollie I have a Rapha Core waterproof cycling jacket, made from nylon .. the advice on the label says to tumble dry it after washing, to “reactivate the waterproofing”.. what is the science behind this recommendation, please? David

[@HeibesHealth]

I also prefer not to ride in ERG for the exact same reasons Ollie listed as reasons why he doesn’t.

[@shahilj]

#askgcntech Can you talk a bit about any technological breakthroughs with saddle fit? I’ve tried everything (everything) but it’s still really really hard to cycle two days in a row because of the pain on my sit bones. I’m sure science has some answers and help for us people that just can’t get comfy.

[@BixbyConsequence]

Unfortunately until there are methods to create custom saddles, the path requires trial and error. After many years I tried the Brooks B17 and fell in love with it. The give of the leather and its ability to mould itself to my personal shape over time works just right. But the perfect saddle for me might be torture for you. Many people give up on the Brooks because they can't get past the break-in stage.

[@nicdoye]

Specialized (in their own stores) have devices to help measure width etc. I found this invaluable after 30 years of riding too narrow a saddle (I'm a small guy - I just assumed I'd need a narrow saddle). Also a central channel really helped. But that's just for me. We're probably built differently. Obviously riding style makes a difference. If your handlebars are higher, more weight goes on the bum, and your pelvis isn't rotated forward at all - meaning more weight on the sit bones. I also know that time away from the bike = muscle wastage = less padding (in the glutes). You may know all this, and you say you've already tried everything so I'm sorry if none of this helps.

[@Graps19]

Recent post by GCN indicated no benefit in fitting premium chains. No rust is the main benefit from KMC SL spec chains.

[@markusvolkmann19]

#askgcn: do you believe that waxed chains will be used at the major races?

[@uknowbass]

There is a limit on narrow internal rim width and tire width. The ratio should not be less than 0.81. Can’t remember where I read this. But there’s a risk of the tire coming off

[@ollybooth6138]

#askgcntech will vittoria ever make a tube type version of the corsa pro

[@dannymongrain4788]

#askgcntech. Hello Oli and all. Here's my question. I have an Elite Suito indoor trainer and its been working just fine for a year. I recently added favero assioma power meter pedals to have power measurement while riding outdoor. Both systems are calibrated correctly. I compared both while training or racing on Zwift. At 150 watts, Elite is constantly reading 20-30 watts higher than Favero. At 200-250 watts, both systems report the same. Above 250 watts Favero reads a bit higher than Elite. I can't afford a 3rd power meter to tell which is off. Any suggestion on how to figure this out or is one know to be more accurate than the other? Merci!

[@jodok_]

#askgcntech if you have a tubeless tyre and get a puncture, is plugging the puncture a good long term fix or should you be doing something else?

[@joshriles84]

Donut media sticker... nice

[@ollybooth6138]

#askgcntech will a wider inner rim width make the tyre measure wider?

[@יוסיכ-ה2ח]

I bought a new bike saddle (3d) it’s 3 cm shorter than the previous saddle When changing it do I still need to measure the same distance from the nose of the saddle to the handlebar Or should I Increase or shorten the distance from the nose of saddle to the handlebar #askgcntech How exactly to replace to a shorter saddle ?

[@markusvolkmann19]

#askgcntech do you believe that waxed chains will be used at the major races?

[@Ju-S-Ka]

#ASKGCNTECH - Do negative temperatures (as in -1 or more degrees C°) negatively affect the effectiveness of wax as a chain lubricant?

[@zygmuntthecacaokakistocrat6589]

any temperature from -20ºC to +40ºC affects the performance of waxed chains, and any humidity level.

[@rbonn3880]

#askgcntech Isn't it true that you really don't have as many gears as advertised due to issues with crosschaining or using the large chainring and the smallest gear on your cassette? Love this show, even the techy nerdy stuff.

[@Jari1973]

#askgcntech Why has it never been tested; add paraffin oil to paraffin wax in a ratio of 1:3 or 1:2.. Hot-waxed chain does not rust??

[@BixbyConsequence]

Lol the solution to most wax problems is oil. I find a good compromise is Boeshield T9. It's not wax, but it's "waxy". Still has enough flow properties to avoid the bad wax issues but easier to keep clean than oil.

[@stephencharles6932]

#askgcntech Dear Manon, Ollie, Si et al, if I could ask, in your allotted time....Riding only in dry conditions, I have just started getting a squealing rear disc brake. But it is very random! Yesterday no noise at all & as it comes and goes. What should I be looking for to prevent this. I have tried cleaning the disc with isopropyl alcohol on a clean microfibre cloth but that made no difference. I have tried blowing at the pads in case of dust build up. Do you think I need to change pads but think not as it is only occasional noise when stopping (and not necessarily just on steep descents) & braking is very good still- but when it sounds, it is LOUD! Also, for example, I can get the sound pushing with rear brake applied a little bit.

[@darrellstyner0001]

I was having this problem on a new bike. I cleaned the rotors and bedded the brakes a couple times and the rear brakes still squealed. Re-centering the rotor between the pads solved the issue. Worth a try even if it appears to be centered.

[@luismoraissarmento9826]

What is ERG mode?

[@1redjoe0]

I don't really like loud freehuns, can I make mine quieter with grease without ruining the efficiency? #askgcntech

[@BixbyConsequence]

Be careful of using too thick of a grease to mask the sound of the pawls as it can cause the pawls to stick or not engage properly, even more so in cold weather. It can be dangerous when you go for a heavy standing acceleration and the freehub doesn't engage. And it can cause internal damage when the pawls slip and then finally engage. Check manufacturer's recommendations to see what viscosity product they recommend. The pawl noise has more to do with design than lubricant. A relube may quiet them briefly but the noise will return.

[@oplkfdhgk]

i think it's funny that people are like comparing 28mm and 32mm tires while i am here running like 2 inch tires because here we have so shitty roads that you kinda need thicker tires if you wanna go fast. :D

[@BrianRPaterson]

Spot on. I'm on 35mm rubber for exactly that reason. Comfy and fairly flat free.

[@oplkfdhgk]

@@BrianRPaterson nice 👍🙂

[@BixbyConsequence]

Over time I've gravitated to 42mm. 40mm if I want to feel svelte. I'm not worried about shaving 12 seconds off the Stelvio but I sure like to ride 100 miles without feeling beat up.

[@joekaiser2258]

#askgcntech An unrelated question, but quite annoying nonetheless. How do you stop a saddle from squeaking? It appears to be generated internally from the friction between material layers within the saddle. It's a nice fi'zi:k track saddle. Thanks.

[@feedbackzaloop]

It may be a decorative cover on the very front underneath - not so sure about fi'zi:k, but I had such problem with several other brands. Or your saddle isn't that nice apparently. Then switch it, the construction is compromised.

[@Hysterically-Inaccurate]

I've had this. Tilt your bike so you you can get some oil to run down the outside of the seat rail and into the plastic/ carbon moulding that it goes into. Sometimes this is the cause and obviously this won't work if you've got moulded carbon rails. Good luck!

[@benjaminplant3734]

Thank you Santa for just Ollie and no Cuthbert

[@johnstrac]

You lads need to allot more time to the allotted time.

[@colnago6501]

Invest 150 quid in an oil free air compressor and all your waxed chain drying issues (and drivetrain drying issues) will be gone forever. Come home, wash bike, air blast everything dry. Sorted.

[@jameseastwood402]

Wrong on erg mode, go for a much easier gear in small ring. Turbo trainers can much more precisely alter the resistance this way.

[@vasiliipopov416]

Not so true on belt drive having a smaller range, there are gearboxes with over 600% range available.

[@boriss.861]

Ollie, Elves & Pixies Rice is not a Great Desiccant as shown by those that want to remove water from say the inside of a car. On that crazy thought a packet of Rich Tea Biscuits would remove more water as biscuits are hydrophobic.

[@Servicevelo]

Instead of shims, which means removing the wheel, disc then refitting for disc spacing. Just loosen the two 5mm bolts, apply the relevant lever and tighten back up. Same result.

[@CrabgrassFarmer]

Shims are meant to be a permanent solution. Adjusting the bolts is an every-time adjustment.

[@Servicevelo]

@@CrabgrassFarmer Yes, they are but the issue the writer has is that if changing wheelsets. That means each time the wheelset is changed the shim would require removing, and adding as necessary. Think about it.

[@CrabgrassFarmer]

@@Servicevelo The way I'm envisioning it, you set your brake pads up (i.e. adjust the hex nuts) so that your wheelset with the "widest" profile works perfectly. Then you use the extremely thin shims between the wheel and the rotor on your "narrower" wheelset to bring the rotor out to the same place they are with the widest wheelset. It would be a bother to get right the first time. But in theory, that would be the end of it, and you could switch between wheelsets without any other adjustments.

[@Imagine2035]

A hot waxed chain indoor is a mess. Wax is falling off the chain on the floor.

[@CarnivoreDMD]

If you are going to REMOVE the frickn chain, just rewax it!

[@user-cx2bk6pm2f]

Oy!

[@xtrailz]

Dry your chain in an air fryer. That's what I do.

[@christophermee5214]

New chain every year whether it’s needed or not.

[@johndef5075]

I use to do that til I got a chain wear gauge. Found out the majority of my supposedly worn chains had no wear at all. My 10speed Shimano mtb chain is on its 3rd year with no measurable wear.

[@dh7314]

You don’t ride enough

[@Mavrik-60]

A rusting waxed chain That's funny. Im seting here looking at my oiled chain. With zero rust ever on it........ Tootaloo keepemcoming k?

[@SnaxNoCo]

Too bad your drivetrain won't last very long...

[@Mavrik-60]

@@SnaxNoCo works fine for me

[@gravelbikemark]

If you live in the UK and wax your chain stop doing it, it’s not big and it’s not clever (yes I know it’s hip) BUT it rains 364.58 days a year so buy some oil y’know like we have done since dinosaurs roamed the earth.

[@dh7314]

Hi grandad, hope you’re well

[@gravelbikemark]

@@dh7314 you must be one of them hip waxers 😉

[@hendriksiering9077]

put your chain into rice...sure what´s next??

[@zygmuntthecacaokakistocrat6589]

Hmm, a rusty waxed chain. Who woulda thunk it. Just like every other iteration of the NEW IMPROVED version of some bike accessory brand or other's w@nk-fantasy of encouraging idiots to pay through the nose for slightly modified cheap-as-chips paraffin wax (cough*Silca*cough) over the last 30-40 years. It goes around in waves. A few years from now, everyone will be back with liquid oil-based lubes when problems such as this become too apparent to ignore.

[@SnaxNoCo]

I've tried dozens of different wet lubes over 30 years of cycling. This year, I tried wax. IT'S AWESOME! So much cleaner, faster, and easier to maintain on both road bikes and mountain bikes. Wear rates are also much lower, so I'm saving money on chains, cassettes, and rings. I'll never go back to using wet lubes--no more messy grinding paste for me!

[@BixbyConsequence]

But... "science!". Lol. Listen folks it's not that complicated to have a chain that is OILED and clean. Hint: oil is needed on the inside of the bushings, and only a TINY amount on the outer plates to prevent rust. What to do if there's too much oil on the outer plates, I will leave as an exercise for the reader.

[@johndef5075]

Wax chain is the ospw of maintenance......

[@livibam]

erg mode sucks