S2E20: We road test the fuel saving Robo-throttle on our project car and discover hidden MPG’s.

[@justinderksen6907]

I came to this channel because of the Honda Insight, and I’m sticking around to see it again! I’m ready to see what the Predator 670 will do in it

[@robotcantina8957]

The Honda insight project is still alive and well. We will finish the 420 experiments and move on to the 670 when it cools off a bit here in Kansas.

[@jonpippen6998]

@@robotcantina8957 Speaking of predators do you have a indepth/detailed video on building a prony dyno? Google has no relevant info on building one that ive been able to find.

[@AgneDei]

@@robotcantina8957 Skip ahead and put a Hayabusa 1300cc engine in that Honda Insight, and then dull it down to get 60seconds from 0 to 60 mph - that would really piss off a lot of people :D

[@IJ-E36]

Interesting concept, wouldn't this work in conjunction with normal DBW cruise control and just have presets for each cruise speed? My thinking is press a button and let the robot accelerate the car to the preset at best fuel economy, takes the human factor out totally for repeatability in testing..

[@wirenutt57]

@@AgneDei Yeah, use a single 6.5 HP lawnmower engine carburetor! Probably a 22mm throat diameter.

[@roribune8162]

Hey mr Jimbo, I think you may have had better results with lower manifold pressures but shifting earlier. I think the main reason that vacuum gauges worked so well on carbureted engines is because of the enrichment that occurs at wider throttle. if the saturn were leaned out but had a wider throttle and shifted earlier, you'd have much lower pumping losses, fewer ignition events/meter travelled, and much lower internal friction due to having to move the pistons up and down fewer times/meter travelled. also cam timing, exhaust/intake manifold/port design are much suited to lower rpm as well. i think just a purely vacuum based robo-throttle would yeild better results on a primary/secondary throttle style carburettor than on a modern MPFI system. i always love these experiments, please continue making them!

[@harlanbarnhart4656]

"Even I am uncomfortable with this experiment"... Sounds like fun.

[@kansasrose2909]

It does sound like fun... Most viewers agree👍👍👍

[@ouch1011]

Some older cars with primitive traction control systems actually used systems fairly similar to this (with the combination of mechanical and electronic throttle bodies) but the implementation was a little different. The mechanical throttle body was used for most operations and the electronic throttle body would be wide open most of the time, but when wheel slip was detected, a separate module controlling the electronic throttle body would command the electronic throttle body partially or fully closed to reduce engine power output and reduce the wheel slip. Some early electronic throttle body systems would also use remote mounted accelerator position sensors that were connected to the throttle pedal with a traditional throttle cable. Some of them even mounted the APP sensor directly on the throttle body. Honda mounted the APP sensor on the firewall, and I think some Toyota, VW and Audi models mounted it on the throttle body.

[@wesley00042]

I had a brutal commute during the dubya gas crisis and with a vacuum gauge regularly averaged 41 mpg in my '90 Accord (27 EPA hwy rating). It's amazing what you can do with even basic instrumentation.

[@robotcantina8957]

The vacuum gauge technique of driving is almost a lost art. Glad you could save a few bucks!

[@aspecreviews]

The 2002 and later Acura TL Type S had a similar dual throttle body system. Acura's vehicle stability assist system needed some way to reduce engine power, and they weren't confident with going full drive by wire. So, vehicle stability assist would just close this secondary throttle body to limit the engine output, and thus limit wheelspin.

[@tomp538]

this setup is similar to (but more restrictive) the econ button on my '12 Civic.

[@owencousins8271]

An additional throttle body is capable of preventing poor driving behaviour, but it also adds to pumping losses for those who use their gas pedal wisely....I averaged 5.2 litres per 100 km on a stock saturn SL1 fully loaded with gear for a 2 week camping trip through the rockies, while drive up into the rockies! Truth is that these cars make great gas mileage from the get go

[@sambrose1]

I have a vacuum gauge mounted next to the tach in my old truck. It's amazing all the information you can get if you think about it. Thanks again for the best Sunday Morning Cartoons on TV.

[@CarlosGomez-vt9pk]

Oh man I just realized I should give my cache of old MPG vacuum guages to my friend with his classic truck! They were meant for each other!

[@ocdman202]

@@CarlosGomez-vt9pkHEY JIMBO..... congratulations on reaching 100k subscribers.. ROBOT CANTINA is providing the entertainment and fun that viewers enjoy..👍👍👍👍

[@cmuller1441]

You could add a safety like having an emergency stop button disabling fuel injection. No fuel = no power... For full power you could disable the fuel economy mode if the pedal is over 80% depressed.

[@rpavlik1]

Yeah I was thinking the same for the throttle. Iirc, in stock configuration, the Saturn ECU will turn off a bunch of stuff at 80 or 90% throttle (AC, etc) for max acceleration.

[@Akotski-ys9rr]

In a modern car the eco mode is disabled after about 25% depression of the accelerator

[@ocdman202]

@@Akotski-ys9rr Did you see Jimbo's last video???

[@mommapanda5736]

@@ocdman202 I really think some of his earliest videos are the best.

[@Akotski-ys9rr]

@@ocdman202 yes it was a concept video from what I remember

[@CarlosGomez-vt9pk]

I think what you said about controlled testing is VERY important. The hardest thing is recreating a test under "real world" driving conditions. As much as you can reduce the human differences in testing, the better. PS - That Saturn wagon looks like a candidate for EV conversion. Lotta room for batteries, :) .

[@randr10]

Your acceleration runs are getting better fuel economy than my pickup truck. Man I miss those days when all I had to cart around was my own skinny ass and I was getting 30+ mpg doing it.

[@TeckieWeckie]

You are one of the few KZbin channels I look forward to seeing on a weekly basis and wanted to tell you thanks for the great content.

[@MrPlasticsnowman]

Absolutely insane. I love it so much. You're awesome.

[@ocdman202]

CONGRATULATIONS JIMBO..105k subscribers!!👍👍 ROBOT CANTINA is providing the fun and educational content that viewers enjoy! Let's keep that number rolling on up! THANKS TO YOU JIMBO!~

[@kkitzhaber]

THIS is the most entertaining stuff I have seen on KZbin for a long time. Disclaimer: I have owned and used a Scan Gauge. I have owned 3 Prius (Prii?). I have added an aftermarket 6 kWhr battery pack to a 2014 Plug-in Prius. I have done a few of these tests myself, off-camera. Disclaimer: I have a degree in electrical engineering and a fetish for MPG. Keep up the fun!!!

[@Borkery]

i love this and i love saturns. such great cars.

[@notserpmale03]

The double throttle actually “doubles” as a Saftey feature, if the robo throttle gets stuck open, your normal throttle still works, so you won’t ever runaway

[@cooperturbo4598]

Excellent as usual !

[@limprooster3253]

This channel is making me like Saturn's and insights. Neither of which are something I ever thought I'd say

[@robotcantina8957]

I'm sincerely sorry about that. For therapy I recommend you get a 68 Chevelle with a 396 and a M21 gearbox.

[@kansasrose2909]

@@robotcantina8957 Robot, we are looking forward to the next installment here..

[@lightdark00]

That tiny gnome cameo was not enough! Where oh where am I going to get me gnome fix? 🤔

[@annaplojharova1400]

Irony is, such feature (maintain an optimum MAP) was present in 80's Skoda 120, implemented in the way how the two barrel carburetter was controlled: There were two butterfly throttle "parallel" (so the mixture had two paths to go through), one (primary) was controlled from the pedal cable directly, but the second was controlled by a diaphragm responding to the MAP. But there were two links from the primary to the secondary: When nearly closed, a cam forced the secondary butterfly closed when you completely release the pedal (about below 20%). And then when you depress it (beyond about 70..80%), it forces the secondary open as well, to allow full power on a kind of "kick down". Overall when you maintain the pedal position between the 30..70%, the MAP was maintained at the optimum efficiency level. Drawback was, it felt like the car "had no response on gas" until you really fully depress it. And all that without any electronics... For your setup, I would implement the "robo throttle" to gradually open over the last ~20..30% of the pedal position, so you don't need to operate any switch when wanting to accelerate, just full pedal will effectively deactivate the "robo throttle"...

[@xLiteraryAllusionx]

That type of system has also been in use on US cars since 1952 or so- the humble four barrel carburetor.

[@KrisisVal]

That is a feature on like half the carburators out there, it's called vacuum-secondaries.

[@CarlosGomez-vt9pk]

I think of this as a "dynamic cruise control" in high MPG mode. I would feel 100% safe with the redundant design. The control box could have a rotary switch that controls different MPG algorithms in the arduino, "pass through", "economy", and "performance" (that I would never use). PS - The roof on the 1st Gen Saturn Wagon was *the* largest single piece of plastic that GM had ever incorporated into a passenger car at the time. Don't ask me how I know this (pretty sad, hee hee hee).

[@robotcantina8957]

When we revise the robo throttle in the near future, we will incorporate a variable settings for different road conditions. Ya know , just the other day I checked the roof on the wagon and discovered it was plastic. The roof on my second gen wagon was metal and I just assumed the first gen roofs were as well.

[@CarlosGomez-vt9pk]

@@robotcantina8957 Yeah, my 2nd gen SW2 has a metal roof. The same way that the Pontiac Fiero plastic tech was used in the Saturn plastic body, the lost foam cast aluminum engine tech in the Saturn S-Series was used in the GM Ecotec engines.

[@huzudra]

Regarding deer, ebay 150db electric air horn. I've got one on both cars, I see deer, I honk at deer, deer run away. Doesn't work as great on Canada Geese though, I think they're habituated to honking already.

[@TheDistur]

I think it's neat how you take the mystery out of some of these sensors and put together cool experiments at the same time.

[@kansasrose2909]

Experiments, in my opinion, the cooler the better. 👍👍👍

[@ocdman202]

@@kansasrose2909 I watch this channel for the fun experiments.

[@elitecpudoc329]

Commenting for the algorithm, because Jimbo deserves it. Cars + science = Fun

[@thunderpants645]

Thank you for applying a logical application to your experiments.

[@eastman5181]

I love these videos. Gives me so many ideas for my own cars!

[@ocdman202]

CONGRATULATIONS JIMBO..105k subscribers!!👍👍 ROBOT CANTINA is providing the fun and educational content that viewers enjoy! Let's keep that number rolling on up! THANKS TO YOU JIMBO!~

[@electi0neering]

I’ll be honest, idk why I watch you videos, but I think I’ve watched most of them. Good job! Been teaching me about things I wasn’t motivated to learn myself even though I’m in a relevant industry.

[@robotcantina8957]

Thanks, I appreciate you sticking around and watching!

[@mommapanda5736]

@@robotcantina8957 Robot, we are looking forward to another great video here.

[@JDStickland]

My 1991 Mercedes 300SE has an "Economy" gauge that is driven by vacuum pressure. That was the last year of the last old school S class that was way out of date in 1991.

[@mungtor]

Yeah. Lots of BMWs used to have a similar MPG gauge mounted in the bottom of the tach.

[@jfv65]

i have 1990 volvo with a boost gauge that not only shows boost but also vacuum. i still use it to check if i am getting reasonable fuel economy (minus on the scale) or not (plus = boost on the scale) Back in 1980's many european cars had a 'econometer' based on manifold vacuum: lots of vacuum? green light, no vacuum? red light. Because fuel has always been expensive you would automatically adjust your driving based on those lights. You wanted green light all the time so you would get more range out of 1 tank full of fuel. (green = good, red = bad. Talk about subliminal behavior control!)

[@Tinman97301]

This maybe a bit sadistic but I love tuning PID's. That feeling when the stars line up is just the best.

[@robotcantina8957]

A good PID is awesome when it works. We still have a little bit more work to do on ours.

[@kansasrose2909]

@@robotcantina8957 Robot, we can't wait for your next installment here..

[@mommapanda5736]

@@kansasrose2909 Looking forward to the next video here.

[@mommapanda5736]

At the heart of gratitude, kindness and compassion can be found.

[@mommapanda5736]

I am a proud member of the ROBOT CANTINA fan club. Love the content and LOVE the humor of the channel. 👍👍👍

[@ElectronikHeart]

Very nice work! After some software tweaks it can be a very good way to upgrade an old car. The dual throttle body is a good failsafe solution.

[@ocdman202]

How Cars Work: * Explains the fundamentals of auto mechanics * Describes the 250 most important car parts and how they work * Contains 96 pages, seven chapters, an index, and a glossary * Uses a "one topic per page" format

[@ocdman202]

Each Chapter: * Describes a major automotive system * Begins with the general view, then discusses specific parts * Has a test at the end

[@ocdman202]

Each Page: * Describes a single topic, part, or system of parts * Has an illustration to identify and locate topic parts * Has text to explain how it all works

[@ocdman202]

How Cars Work: * Gives the reader a general understanding of mechanical devices * Allows the reader to understand automotive workshop manuals * Prepares the reader for beginning do-it-yourself car projects * Equips the reader for logically solving car problems

[@ocdman202]

My grandkids are really interested about how cars work. I was trying to explain to them, but I was not doing a good job explaining. We've been reading this when they visit and it really helps them understand what is going on. Each chapter explains different components and the diagrams bring the text to life. We all are enjoying the learning.

[@ocdman202]

“I haven’t failed at anything, I’ve just found all the wrong ways of doing it.”

[@d.jerrycook2994]

Good work Jimbo, I appreciate your efforts.

[@grandtheftauto1233]

Discovered this channel when it was a little smaller. Happy to see Robert cantina taking off!

[@artursmihelsons415]

Great video! Add to Robo-throttle kick function similar like for automatic gearboxes.. Fast pedal release and then fast flooring deactivates fuel saving until next pedal release, holding Robo-throttle wide open.. 😉

[@markmatt9174]

You can set the auto off (mpg increase off if TPS) is over 70% WOT. So floor it and gives better acceleration. This makes more programming but does a away w the Pot. First 70% of accelerator position is only 40% of WOT. Last 30% is 60% of the added TB. To make it easy to know where the MPG change kicks in add an extra throttle return spring that kicks in only at the 70% WOT so you feel it in the foot too.

[@Lawrence330]

The pot was for trimming the ratio instead of hard coding it. Once you get that part dialed in, hard code the ratio, then add in a nice sliding scale as the driver approaches wide open throttle. You should *always* have the option to floor it.

[@jaakoala-aho3898]

Waiting aeromods and weight reductions!

[@802Garage]

Very cool work. I hope to put more of my programming and electronics experience to good use in the future like you!

[@mathuetax]

Ahh, J.C. Whitney! Bought quite a few things from that catalogue in the 1980s. When I was a younger lad I had (and still have) a garage sale vacuum gauge, a huge thing with a brass bezel, clearly not aimed at automotive diagnostic tool use. On my 1970 Volvo 145S and a later 1979 Volvo 240 wagon, I'd string a hose from the engine and set the gauge on my dash where I could watch it. It made a little bit of difference on the 79' to watch it but 1970 with its ZS 175CDS carbs flushing fuel down their gulet just wasn't precise enough to get much of a milage tweak from watching engine load with the gauge. Sorta wild today to think I have a 1970 Volvo (a rather ragged 142S) again, I've come full circle.

[@xgford94]

You Seriously need more subscribers I’m liking a sharing as much as Possible

[@mungtor]

It's been a while, but I could swear that a '98 BMW 540i that I owned also had 2 throttle bodies. One was a manual connected to the pedal and it was mounted on the upstream side (closer to the airbox). Then there was another throttle body behind it that was normally open which I think was used as part of the traction control system. I could be remembering wrong, but I thought it was a pretty cool way to implement TC and still not be full drive-by-wire.

[@kansasrose2909]

☺☺☺☺

[@mommapanda5736]

@@kansasrose2909 Rose, you seem pretty happy today...

[@ocdman202]

Feeling blessed, never stressed... Got that groove on for my Sunday best. 😇😇😇

[@mommapanda5736]

Yes to this.

[@mommapanda5736]

Member of ROBOT CANTINA FAN CLUB here.

[@mommapanda5736]

Here are some ways to improve social skills.

[@mommapanda5736]

Say Thank You...

[@mommapanda5736]

Hold doors open longer.

[@chrisdrippe]

I live near Topeka Kansas and for over a decade I have been building gadgets for my car . Hydrogen scam stuff and now I run my car with Propane.. I used basic stamp MC to manage my AF ratio... I am absolutely loving every precious minute of your show.. Following in your footsteps I got a 1995 ford escord wagon and just got it running on propane.. horrible mpg ... 22.... need that robo throttle.. maybe I will try and lean my propane mixer down a touch.. my propane mixer is a pvc T and a water valve.. slightly close it a bit and it goes leaner... stone age technology!..

[@dangerousdave5915]

Stone age is best! ICE engines are popular because of the versatility. EV owners in non-temperate climates are in for a rude awakening. I suppose you could always ride your bicycle to work on the below 30 degree days when the heater in the EV is not up to snuff.

[@ocdman202]

@@dangerousdave5915 Dave, you seem to know a lot about that.

[@reallifehardtruth4465]

Rebuild the engine to take advantage of the propane. Start with higher compression. You will need custome pistons. Call Kieth Black. Cast is ok since its not high performance

[@nerd1000ify]

You need a propane carb. You may be pleased to learn that such devices are available off the shelf, in Australia for many years propane fuelling was a factory option on our locally built Ford Falcon sedans- the LPG tank replaced the spare wheel and a propane carb was added to the inlet alongside the standard fuel system, allowing the car to run on either propane or petrol. 'Autogas' was half the price of petrol, so despite the reduced fuel economy you saved a lot of money. An added benefit was significantly reduced exhaust pollution. The gas does displace some air from the charge, reducing power. The last generation of Falcons actually had propane direct injection to circumvent that problem, and developed slightly more power than the petrol models!

[@mariusfridlund55]

I learn alot from this, and i want to learn more of how to tune mega squirt. so that is how i found this channel👍

[@kansasrose2909]

I found this channel a while back and check it out for new ideas...👍👍

[@otter9099]

Can’t wait to see the robo throttle and lean burn working together and what fuel economy will be

[@chesspiece81]

I would have NEVER EVER thought so little on road HP would interest me so much.

[@pleasedontwatchthese9593]

Small HP stuff is getting popular these days. Small motorcycles with 10 or less HP have been selling better than sport bikes with 200+ hp

[@SimonTekConley]

I've seen the mpg gauges that ran off vacuum, I always thought they were a scam, i didn't realize it was actually good. Uhaul trucks use them a lot too.

[@shinjisan2015]

GM Holden for a period of time in the 70s/80s actually installed them in the dash cluster as an "Economy Gauge" instead of a tachometer in automatic transmission cars.

[@moconnell663]

I had to put a post-it note over that gauge in the uhaul I used when I moved because it was buried in the red most of the time.

[@fortisrisuspater]

Simply fascinating. I do appreciate your talents but I must admit I really miss the big block supercharged Honda and remain optimistic it will soon return. Thank you for continuing to make fun and enlightening videos.

[@robpeabo509]

If KZbin is correct, this will be available at 11:00pm Australian Eastern time! Do I sleep and wait till tomorrow or stay up late and maybe sleep in tomorrow if I am unlucky and possibly be late for work, what to do, what to do??

[@ProlificInvention]

Stay up late mate

[@EthanSeville]

#TeamAustralia lol

[@EthanSeville]

Watching this while waiting to start work at 00:00

[@rydplrs71]

Get a better alarm clock

[@robpeabo509]

@@ProlificInvention I did. Off to bed now!

[@jacobwilliams4132]

I love whenever I see a new video from you. I am going to start doing similar projects on my 97 Passat TDI 😎

[@xzkt]

You are making this so interesting! Thanks for the effort, I’m really enjoying it.

[@herrjonna2007]

Never change

[@thewilliamss2392]

Another gold standard film mr

[@RadioReprised]

I suggest you leave it between gears as this is where the best MPG seems to reside!

[@tiitsaul9036]

Very clever design. Always looking forward your updates.

[@APOTwixx]

It’s always good to see another video in your project series. And from a fellow New York native who now lives in rural Kansas, I fully understand what you mean. 😅

[@flb78]

This is basically an electronic engine governor. That's pretty cool.

[@AntilleanConfederation]

ECM. But on top of the already existing ECM. A computer to correct the old computers error.

[@ocdman202]

@@AntilleanConfederation HEY JIMBO..... congratulations on reaching 100k subscribers.. ROBOT CANTINA is providing the entertainment and fun that viewers enjoy..👍👍👍👍

[@natet8148]

Omg this is something I've wanted to try for years!!! Thanks

[@robotcantina8957]

Hope you like it!

[@natet8148]

@@robotcantina8957 Yes, thanks so much for your content.

[@kansasrose2909]

@@natet8148 Robot, we are looking forward to the next installment here.

[@gregholloway2656]

Great video, Jimbo! Keep the cool experiments coming. 👍

[@kansasrose2909]

Love these videos..

[@AustinPerdue]

This is a fascinating exercise, but it largely goes against what a BSFC chart would suggest. Most engines make their best fuel economy at 60-80% load, at very low RPM. Looking at the efficiency islands on those charts, it's better to dig deep into the throttle and short shift, rather than limit MAP and rev it higher to compensate.

[@gasolinefumes]

That's definitely true when accelerating, and changing the code to accelerate at peak BSFC should improve the MPG even more. For cruising with a stock drivetrain at normal speeds, light load will be better. Higher load will just result in acceleration without changing the gearing.

[@AustinPerdue]

@@gasolinefumes certainly (Hi from Ecomodder), but I'd think it would be more effective to cap MAP just before enrichment. Cruise control would still be pretty efficient if so. In fact, this gives me some throttle mapping ideas for my own car.

[@gasolinefumes]

@@AustinPerdue so you're suggesting allowing higher load? Probably a good idea, but it might not make much difference on flat ground. I want to try the MAP-based cruise control that was posted on EcoModder years ago.

[@tsd560ti6]

I thought exactly the same thing. The only thing I would consider is an automated push&glide cruise control, that applies ~80% load alternating with fuel cut-off.

[@wirenutt57]

Some motorcycles today have modes, such as "Economy," "Normal," "Sport," and "Performance" or "Race" that probably work similarly, also taking wheelspin into account by reading the anit-lock brake tonewheel/encoder on the front and back wheels. A lot of these technologies have been used in industrial automation for decades, and as an industrial electrician, I'm quite familiar with the concepts, if not so much with the code used. I did have to write a program for a can crusher in a class years ago that used a crude encoder, 2 sensors to determine direction, a motor, and threaded rod. I kept tweaking the code for features and efficiency long after the project was done and graded, because I had so much fun doing it.

[@aaronfidelisrecine]

GAHHHDDDDD I love your videos. I learn so much and your, "fuck it, lets try this" attitude is so appreciated.

[@mommapanda5736]

yes, love his 'tude... just try it.

[@whateverforevermusic]

I love this little Saturn. I'd love to see all your systems working together to see what kind of mpg you could get! You earned my sub

[@kansasrose2909]

Yes to this!~

[@kawkaw8623]

imagine driving by the saturn and seeing those wires, mans got a bomb inside

[@robotcantina8957]

Yeah, the wires are getting out of control.... lol

[@MangoSmoothie16]

I’ve done a bit of ecu tuning for power on various cars. I noticed on older ecus, accelerator pedal position was basically linked to a desired throttle opening. Sometimes linear, sometimes not, but the relationship could be easily manipulated. Now the new ecus use accelerator pedal position to calculate a desired torque, which then correlates to a throttle opening. I think this video/experiment helps explain why OEMs are doing that. At lower pedal positions its effectively doing what you are where it’s removing the human error element for better mpg. But at higher pedal positions it can still give acceleration when needed.

[@randr10]

LOL on the Ferrari decals. I had an SC2 back in the day with the pop up headlights. The factory color was tan, which I hated, and the paint was pealing, so I spontaneously did an Autozone paintjob in my rental's garage over a weekend and painted it what turned out to be a very bright but matte red (the clear would not lay flat because it was reduced with acetone per the manufacturers recommendations, so it was drying before it hit the surface). Anyway, I had put a set of daisies on the car just prior and did a halfway decent silver metallic paint job with good wheel paint on those, so they looked really nice and shiny. The car actually didn't look too bad when I was done honestly, but I was just trying to get rid of the ugly color and those hideous turbine wheels. The car was a beater commuter car. Anyway, I was driving through the neighborhood one day after all the cosmetic work and I rolled up on some young kids playing in their front yard and so I slowed right down to like 10-15 mph to make sure I could stop if they darted out, and as I rolled by the younger boy goes "Hey look! There goes a Ferrari!" and his older sister goes "That's not a Ferrari!" all mad. I laughed all the way home when I heard that.

[@mommapanda5736]

This is a great story..... Laughed all the way home

[@johnwells5314]

Outstanding job on the explanation.. very insightful. 👍🏻👍🏻 But i'm dying of anticipation for the diesel swap. I just know it's gonna be great.

[@motomech83]

the stacked throttle bodys reminds me of yamaha sport bikes right after they did away with the constant vac slides in the efi systems but right before they went full fly by wire

[@Willa_Doo]

Wonder how the Saturn would perform with full maintenance, fluids, filters, oils, plugs, wires & coils. On top of all that a re-written ECU tune optimized for fuel economy. Could it possibly break into the 50MPG range?

[@jasonz7788]

Great work Sir thank you

[@westellmodel]

This is basically automating the hypermiling technique. Maintain a throttle position that slows down uphill, and speeds up downhill. You are using the least amount of energy to maintain a general speed that you are wanting to travel (ie. 56-64 mph for 60mph average.)

[@robotcantina8957]

Yes, basically that all I did. The cool part is it's completely automatic.

[@ocdman202]

@@robotcantina8957 That is the cool part!

[@mommapanda5736]

@@ocdman202 yes to the cool part here.

[@Jon-yh3gb]

I love the feeling of acceleration! That's why Miatas are so enjoyable, I can accelerate for so long before reaching the speed limit.

[@ocdman202]

Did you see Jimbo's last video???

[@mommapanda5736]

@@ocdman202 I am watching all of season one now.

[@Jon-yh3gb]

@@ocdman202 yes! I thought about doing some fuel-saving Arduino project back in college (gas was a lot more affordable after graduating so that moved to the bottom of an ever growing list of projects that I enjoy working on) A few hours living vicariously apparently has saved me a days of time and frustration. And a new appreciation of Saturn. That interface for plastic panels looks like a decent excuse to build a really huge 3d printer.

[@ocdman202]

@@Jon-yh3gb Love the 3d printer.

[@whitefreeman5798]

imagine the market out here that would buy this to put on their kids cars to limit their speed and lack of full throttle ability .. i really do think you are onto something great and am very much looking forward to see what kind of results you get when you have it tuned in

[@dazeller82]

Modern aftermarket ECUs like Haltech etc already have what's called 'Valet' mode.

[@unclejoe6811]

Yeah limit the power so they can't accelerate out of danger. Great thinking smooth brain.

[@JThyroid]

Honda did this to my car with a software update years before I got it, because the hybrid batteries were dying from being used too much. The car went from getting 45 to the gallon to less than 40, and from 90hp gas + 20 hp electric whenever needed to 90 hp gas + ~10 hp electric whenever it felt like it. Most of the time it is dangerously slow when accelerating, but every now and then it decides to give me 20 hp electric and get to speed. Limiting acceleration sounds great until you need to get on the gas to get out of a dangerous situation, or when merging onto an interstate with almost no on ramp/merging lane and a blind lead up so you can't see if there is anybody there. I usually just elected to take the 45-55mph back road 15 miles rather than they to get onto that rough section of I-25 with most people doing 80+ mph.

[@wirenutt57]

@@unclejoe6811 I've been driving for 47 years and I can count on one hand how many times I've had to "accelerate out of danger." And those times were my own fault. Save your "accelerate out of danger" nonsense for people who don't know any better. Tell the kid to stay off the interstates, and Bob's your uncle.

[@91CavGT5]

Most people have no idea how exhausting it can be to hypermile, ESPECIALLY on long distance trips.

[@ocdman202]

DId you see Jimbo's last video??

[@mommapanda5736]

@@ocdman202 Why do you ask?

[@ronniedale6040]

I hypermile a Saturn and while it takes a lot of concentration I personally find it's the only thing you can do to make a boring commute remotely interesting. I find that this little Saturn keeps me more engaged than the turbo LS 65 Chevy truck I was driving

[@91CavGT5]

@@ronniedale6040 commuting is one thing. I do agree that hypermiling on your commute can be relaxing. Long distance trips though are a whole ‘nother animal!!

[@91CavGT5]

@@ocdman202 I commented on his last video(this one) so yes I did watch it. He mentioned in the video that everything he did with the secondary electronic throttle could be achieved with good throttle control. This is often referred to as “hypermiling”. Hence my comment.

[@dangerousdave5915]

Thanks!

[@robotcantina8957]

You bet!

[@kansasrose2909]

@@robotcantina8957 THANK YOU JIMBO...💖💖💖💖💖

[@kansasrose2909]

French = merci

[@kansasrose2909]

Italian = grazie

[@ocdman202]

@@kansasrose2909 “I haven’t failed at anything, I’ve just found all the wrong ways of doing it.”

[@ocdman202]

You know what Sunday is, naps, Robot Cantina and potential for mayhem.

[@mommapanda5736]

Potential for what??

[@ocdman202]

@@mommapanda5736 Yeah, mayhem and mischief.

[@michaelconquergood9556]

Keep up the good work watching from the kewenaw peninsula, say ya to da up eh

[@mommapanda5736]

Since your locale projects into Lake Superior... This sounds superior!

[@broklee]

I lol'd at the Uno part

[@ericericeric888]

Great result! This set up reminds me my 1997 E39 BMW 5 series also has a similar unusual double throttle bodies set up. The throttle body connected to the engine is a normal throttle cable controlled one, the extra throttle body is controlled by computer functioning as traction control (temporarily closed to take away power when the wheels slip).

[@dangerousdave5915]

I love your channel and I sent some moola to show how much I appreciate it. You have gotten me through some dark days and this channel has been a spiritual re-awakening. Thank you so much!

[@ocdman202]

Love this channel also..💖💖💖

[@mommapanda5736]

@@ocdman202

[@ocdman202]

@@mommapanda5736 "What's a robot's favorite snack?" "Computer chips."

[@jeffzekas]

Yeah, the Ferrari decals will definitely impress the chicks, at least that’s what they tell me. ;-)

[@gurustu4458]

Love the 1st gen sw1!!

[@robotcantina8957]

Me too!

[@ocdman202]

@@robotcantina8957 HEY JIMBO..... congratulations on reaching 100k subscribers.. ROBOT CANTINA is providing the entertainment and fun that viewers enjoy..👍👍👍👍

[@80Loke]

Future Jimbo: It works! 😆

[@The_Masked_Frenchman]

To correct the lag in performance, I would think to have it ignore fuel economy adaptations when tps is requested like over 65% or whatever. Or a neat way would be to have something like a kick down switch/range? I don't know for sure but I love these types of videos!!!

[@unclebs4732]

I'd like to see a comparison between water injection types/styles and using water and then methanal, washer fluid would work. It should increase fuel economy and clean the combustion chamber. Love your vids, keep them coming!

[@Birch_ON]

I'm pretty sure my 1995 Lexus LS400 has this from the factory and I will say it does work. My little 4.0l V8 gets around 20-22mpg on the highway and around 18 overall.

[@mfree80286]

Thing to do is to tie the "mileage minder" activation to deactivate it's function at.... 80% throttle sounds about right. Or manage it on a curve starting from 50% throttle, lowering the vacuum floor by a percentage until it's off by full throttle.

[@umdasu]

i say that 3d printed mount you made is causing and air leak. maybe you could smoke test it or use something else?

[@robotcantina8957]

The mount has a few minor leaks for sure. The good news is it all factors in and we don't see any issues.

[@truckgotstuck]

Could definitely be modified to detect the conditions. Hook up your vehicle speed sensor and when the speed is below a certain point, the system will remove the robo-throttle in order to maximize acceleration. The robo-throttle engages after a certain length of time where the input throttle is at a certain percentage or less, or a certain amount of time that the input throttle has maintained position. You could also indicate to your computer that you want to deactivate the system for passing or when you need power by having it deactivate the robo-throttle when the throttle position is higher than a certain percentage, like the signal that deactivates the AC compressor when the vehicle is at WOT (if the Saturn pcm is equipped with it) and a certain period of time after the WOT event so it doesn't engage robo-throttle soon as you back off WOT.

[@ocdman202]

HEY JIMBO..... congratulations on reaching 100k subscribers.. ROBOT CANTINA is providing the entertainment and fun that viewers enjoy..👍👍👍👍

[@dangerousdave5915]

Weld on the wide band = BLOB!!! Still and Awesome video...tuff guy!

[@kansasrose2909]

Great comment, Dave..😊😊😊

[@ocdman202]

@@kansasrose2909 I am watching ROBOT CANTINA videos when I cook dinner.

[@mommapanda5736]

@@ocdman202 What's for dinner??

[@ocdman202]

@@mommapanda5736 Pizza

[@ocdman202]

HEY JIMBO..... congratulations on reaching 100k subscribers.. ROBOT CANTINA is providing the entertainment and fun that viewers enjoy..👍👍👍👍

[@jeffrywade6072]

I have thought of doing something similar, but only engages with cruise control. Once cruise is set, the DBW would prioritize maintsining manifold vacuum over speed within a certain window, like +/- 5mph target speed.

[@robotcantina8957]

That would certainly boost MPG and you could still more or less go at the desired speed.

[@mommapanda5736]

@@robotcantina8957 Robot, we are looking forward to another great video..

[@stinson87]

This is some of what I was looking at, but a bit further, for a commuter, if you use a datalogger and map the speeds, you can let the "robotic throttle" use an optimal acceleration based on situation. a more simple solution would be have it only modulate the throttle under 60% throttle, or use a data set to watch for acceleration requests vs constant speed. cool project though!!

[@NuffMan_]

Just slap shock absorber to throttle to make it slooow

[@kansasrose2909]

Good example of psychological flexibility...

[@oliver380]

another interesting video will be cruise control addig to the car

[@Dan-vq4pz]

That is a gorgeous wagon 😍

[@robotcantina8957]

Thanks, its amazing that this car survived and is still in decent condition.

[@kansasrose2909]

@@robotcantina8957 Thank you ROBOT CANTINA, we can't wait to see the next installment here.

[@mommapanda5736]

@@kansasrose2909 Just waiting for the next video of ROBOT CANTINA gives me goosebumps.

[@antondizxinzo]

If the car is manual gearbox you don't have to worry about a runaway engine, pressing the clutch solves the problem Great video, and great numbers In my 1.4tdi I do 4.4l/100km in daily drive at secondary roads 👍🏻 And thanks for using metrical and the imperial systems in the video 👍🏻

[@kansasrose2909]

Yes, Jimbo thank you for using the metrical and the imperial systems...👍

[@dangerousdave5915]

@@kansasrose2909 I always hated the switch to metric. Pretty soon we'll be on metric time. 10hrs days, 100 second minutes, etc

[@ocdman202]

@@dangerousdave5915 Metric, don't get me started!

[@robotcantina8957]

Correct there are a number of ways to overcome runaway throttle on this car, One of my concerns was runaway throttle while the car was just sitting in the shop and I was fiddling with the software. Having the engine go WOT while the transmission is in neutral is a concern, but I reckon the PCM's rev limiter would likely catch that and keep the engine from throwing a rod or something.

[@ocdman202]

@@robotcantina8957 HEY JIMBO..... congratulations on reaching 100k subscribers.. ROBOT CANTINA is providing the entertainment and fun that viewers enjoy..👍👍👍👍

[@clintcolombin]

3rd party ECU / EMS setups, like Haltech units, can already do most of this without all the extra gear. & they can factor the wideband in in place of the factory narrowband,

[@robotcantina8957]

Absolutely, but these are just fun and cheap experiments for the youtube audience.

[@ocdman202]

@@robotcantina8957 HEY JIMBO..... congratulations on reaching 100k subscribers.. ROBOT CANTINA is providing the entertainment and fun that viewers enjoy..👍👍👍👍

[@dangerousdave5915]

Hey, I just read the description...UAP's, Aliens, Gnomes and Squirrels packing heat?!?! What the heck is going on at that shop of yours in KS?!?! Yikes! And temporal anomalies?!?

[@kansasrose2909]

Did you see Jimbo's last video???

[@ocdman202]

@@kansasrose2909 I am watching it on repeat in my garage.

[@mommapanda5736]

@@ocdman202 I am watching these videos when I cook dinner.

[@ocdman202]

@@mommapanda5736 I have seen all of season one of ROBOT CANTINA.

[@mommapanda5736]

@@ocdman202 I think some of his earliest videos are the best.

[@bradleyj.fortner2203]

Man, if you ever get pulled over in that thing, you're gonna have a LOT of explaining to do.