All Main Sonic Games Debate w/ TWIP & Premydaremy - Part 2

Join TWIP, Premy, and I in a debate about each mainline Sonic game.
Special thanks to Sonic Overtime for allowing me to use some game play footage for the video! Check him out! / @sonicovertime
Thanks to BLG for some game play footage as well: / b0wserl0ver13
Thanks to FCPlaythroughs: • Sonic the Hedgehog (20... for 06 footage!
Make sure to Like and Subscribe if you enjoyed :)
Special thanks to my guests:
Premy's Non-Sonic Channel: / premulous
TWIP: / @twip98
Twitter: / samsprostation
Twitch: / samprocrastinates
Discord: / discord
Instagram: sam_sloulin
Snapchat: xxsam_sloulinxx

[@thelognerrator]

Premy saying Sonic Team rushed out 06 when it was Sega who wouldn't let up on the intended release date, thus forcing Sonic Team to rush it out.

[@thelognerrator]

@BOUBERT PAQUIN yup

[@lezzdenden]

@BOUBERT PAQUIN which was supposed to be an 06 port actually, but they showed SEGA the specs and they went "o fuq."

[@Fantazious]

It kept bugging me whenever he said it.

[@BankBryee]

I never fucking understand when people would use the excuse. Who gives a flying fuck if the game was rushed? They STILL released it and I STILL spent money on it. Meaning, if the game is ass, I’m not gonna give them leeway and excuse them from making a terrible game. And if we’re being real; there are mad games that are *good* which were rushed as hell

[@acousticslayer5883]

@@BankBryee they had less than a year to develop a game on new hardware, the team was split in two and the director left in the middle of the project. How would that turn out well?

[@premydaremy]

Thumbnails making me look short af smh

[@SamProcrastinates]

THEN SEND ME A PICTURE THAT ISN'T SHORT LMAO

[@mbdg6810]

@@SamProcrastinates you tell em sam ! :p

[@XPGamerPro360]

@premydaremy you and TWIP were the biggest bruh moments in the discussion. Sam is the voice of logic and reason.

[@sunshinex2012]

Hey prem hence you didnt play black knight too check out some voice clips of jason. He sounds so so good a lil bit like ryan too. kzbin.info/www/bejne/jZ_Rg5aQfbB-aZo

[@princeali7871]

xD

[@mrblujeans1483]

"What do you want them to do, break the building?" lmao that killed me.

[@TWONSSHOW]

lmao that whole argument was easily the dumbest thing I ever heard in my life.

[@sumnahlennon4516]

LMFAO I love Prem but that whole argument from him like Twon said was dumb.

[@BlustreakG]

27:43 when Premy started explaining his question, the cutscene playing just fits the argument atm

[@ArylBarrel]

LOOOOOL, oh my gosh I’m SOOOO glad you brought that up BWAHAHAHA that’s amazing!!

[@hatef7023]

That's actually hilarious it fits so well

[@FuzHammer]

Cerberus the uber lmaoo

[@DeeJamari]

The shots Premy and Twip throw at each other are HILARIOUS 😂

[@ZanZa_811]

Bro. Who is TWIP yelling to? Why is he yelling? I feel so sorry for Sam trying to talk and prem and twip cutting him off.

[@rayansecret2965]

Maybe it’s because his mike was too loud

[@jaxxxx1984]

Noticed that 2. Was kinda annoying

[@SamProcrastinates]

No need to feel sorry haha. I really enjoyed talking to both of them and having a fun debate.

[@princeali7871]

@@SamProcrastinates I feel like you guys need to establish that you are friends and are just joking around with any insults before starting the next video because comments like this are everywhere.

[@sumnahlennon4516]

@@SamProcrastinates I love the videos as they;re hilarious but you should've established the fact that it should be a somewhat normal debate and they should keep interrupting to a minimum.

[@ProdKeion.T]

Everything you guys agreed on: "The music was good."

[@shro_okee]

everything that the fandom universally agrees on and I'm happy for that, it's something xD

[@joeshi4202]

jesus I couldn't deal with those two without spazzing lol

[@Max-Rtpmp]

sam getting interrupted every five sec lmao

[@danielcurtis8895]

Premy is right about Gens source code. There’s no way ST would lose it. The reason why Forces controlled the way it did was because it was made by a different team within ST... probably the same team that made Colors and Lost World. Forces, Colors and Lost World’s direction has a lot more in common with each other. Unleashed & Gens obviously have the same DNA.

[@GLXY23]

@@foolpatrol didn't they restructure not to long ago?

[@El_Mince]

They do still have the source code for unleashed is because they improved the FPS in the Series X BC

[@mbdg6810]

fun fact : secret rings was the first sonic game i rage quit.

[@tivvy2vs21]

I beat it a couple days ago and it dragged on but it was just the motion controls I didn't like

[@harryjames8064]

I can remeber going to my local DvD store (back when DvD stores were still a thing) and hiring 'sonic and the secret rings'. When I played It i couldn't get passed the tutorial.

[@zackblade3856]

Lol same 😂

[@LowTierMarston]

Mine was unleashed for the wii

[@josepha4161]

@@LowTierMarston Sameeeeee

[@GordieKat]

I will never understand that giving Sonic a sword is "dumb."

[@BetterNateThanN3ver]

I don’t either. People say Sonic having a talking sword is stupid meanwhile Mario has a talking cap and no one bats an eye.

[@PeopleWithPlushies]

Nate Jackson Well, at least when it comes to Mario’s case, the games are good. When he does something super different, it turns out good! Sonic’s case however, it turns out mediocre to bad, despite the concepts being creative and that’s because Sonic Team doesn’t take there concepts to the best where it can be. It then makes people start to getting tired of it because they realize that if they can’t emerge a good concept well, then they should just go back to basics.

[@GordieKat]

@@PeopleWithPlushies Well where has that gotten us? They've been doing nothing but basics since Generations.

[@AK46supr]

PeopleWithPlushies but black Knight was a good game. Not amazing but neither is sun shine when u look at it critically. And honestly the werehog wasn't that bad- the only reasonable major critique is that at times it overstayed its welcome having long stages and the sun/moon medals. As a fan of hack and slashes and beatem ups i enjoyed the werehog as was actually excited for it b4 release. My only annoyance was that it took to long to beat at times and the battle music and level progression. Sure u can argue when Mario does it its above average but when sonic does it- it can be above average also. Its that what ever flaw it has is greatly exaggerated in attempts to bring down the game as a whole. Which we dont do to most other franchises- and it can be frustrating to witness constantly. Especially arins cult of sonic haters

[@PeopleWithPlushies]

AK46supr Some flaws of Sonic games are so noticeable and unavoidable that they bring some titles down. But what I’ve noticed is that some people find those flaws to be less flawed, which is your case. Entertainment is just like humor. Subjective. However, I was looking at a wider scope, aka what other people thought. And to put it simply, most people dislike the flaws that some find to be no problem. This just proves my point of concepts having great potential, yet it’s execution is usually half baked. I guess you can say that the Mario games have a much higher standard because it’s console sellers and it’s arguably the biggest gaming franchise out there. Sonic had those standards, because he used to be a console seller for Sega. That’s why many consider Sonic 1 - Adventure 2 to be the golden ages while Heroes is considered the downfall by most fans. It’s an interesting topic to think about actually!

[@thelognerrator]

Black Knight is an underrated Gem IMO and literally the only motion controls are relegated to the swordplay everything else is controlled with the analog stick and buttons.

[@ng3176]

Funny as hell, can't wait for part 3. Makes me ask, will you guys ever go back for a round 2 on the spin offs and non main series, such as Advance and Riders?

[@mechashadow]

Sam: I’m in hell XD thank god it has quietened down a bit more now. Shadow dying would be a great character arc but he got a great continuation arc in 06 which I do appreciate. Too bad it dies after that game tho’ Sam got his definition of polish wrong, should have said Unleashed is the most full featured production instead.

[@AK46supr]

Yea he had me confused when he said polished. When gens had more polished controls than unleashed lol

[@ViltrumiteIsRite99]

With this bring clarified, I fully agree.

[@IB_KIT]

I know a lot of people in the comments are digging in on Prem and Twip, but honestly I like hearing you all converse and discuss each other's wildly different yet also somewhat similar opinions. I await the next part where you three talk about Sonic's recent decade.

[@johnathonturner2279]

Why is Sam the only one of them that is reasonable and actually able to have a few good arguments? Prem and twip are both just obnoxious and stuck up as all hell.

[@tmcttf8087]

Agreed. Like, it's already been confirmed *long* ago that both Sonic 3 and Sonic & Knuckles were meant to be released as *one* game. Due to time constraints, they had to be released *separate.* Connect them together, they become the one game that they were always meant to be from the very start.

[@DASH596]

Sam had good arguments... Until he brought ''Unleashed Project''

[@johnathonturner2279]

@@DASH596 The ONLY point I disagree with him on.

[@tmcttf8087]

@Casswury Together, the 2 games are.

[@sonicfanatic6733]

THANK YOU! God it’s kinda hard to watch this without pausing or making my head hurt

[@originalgamer4002]

Sonic adventure 2 had the most organized and stable story. I wish sonic team would go back to the adventure formula.

[@AK46supr]

I dont get how changing gameplay formula is gonna garner better storys...

[@originalgamer4002]

@@AK46supr I just felt lazy writing a huge paragraph. Most people should know what I mean.

[@AK46supr]

Original Gamer ill be honest im really curious to what u mean. If u dont want to fine. Im just stating what understanding i got from it But it does kinda come off u saying that if sonic team returned to adventure formula would fix everything. Idk if ur talkin gameplay or "writing style"? But that doesn't promise better writing. It could be forces like writing but from multiple characters again. The logic just doesn't add up.

[@Jmanclub-vd7mg]

AK46supr, I believe he’s referring to how the formula’s force the story to be like. With the boost formula, because of the fast paced nature and the few characters the game has to work itself around that fact and it can get very narrow, very quickly. But In SA2, they are forced to give us all angles and are able to have a more complex story as it can go in any direction it deems fit for the story. Of course, a boost game can have a good story, but it needs to be designed in a way that accommodates the extreme speed of the boost games.

[@AK46supr]

Jman 1234club I can understand with the lack of characters a games story can sometimes get narrow so for certain ppl that could be a negative, add more characters to fix that. What I dont get is how sonics speed through levels effects the story. Just because sonics fast through levels doesn't mean the stories gotta be fast with it to "accommodate" That just makes no sense in all honesty to me.

[@AK46supr]

Sam thats not polish ur describing. Its that unleashed was the last full experience sonic game. Complete with lots of gameplay and a full story with great cut scenes etc. Gens is my favorite but when u say polished it sounds like ur talking about controls which gens is better.

[@TusharSundarka]

well tbh, I think Unleashed's control was better for what it wanted to accomplish. For example, the jump doesn't reduce a lot of speed because it isn't intended for platforming, it's intended for jumping over obstacles at a moment's notice, whereas Generations' jump is made with platforming in mind as that game's level design is more platforming focused than Unleashed. That's why playing the Unleashed Project with Generations' control always felt off to me.

[@rynobehnke8289]

I mean at least performance wise is Generations far better optimized than Unleashed which at times can tank below 15 fps. So I guess you could argue that Generations is in at least a few parts more polished than Unleashed,

[@mared7305]

I bumped into Part 2 and I'm loving this conversation. Really interesting to hear how people convey their experiences with the game. Also, acrobatics. Seems that Sonic Heroes and Lost World are never really forgotten or left untouched, despite how much concepts from those games are undermined

[@playbossthebest936]

Can't wait for this 🤣🤣

[@SpielehunterLP]

Those discussions with Premy and Twip are way too much fun to watch, normally I'd never bother to watch a whole 50 minute video on youtube but this felt like it was over in a minute. Definitely need more of this!

[@mbdg6810]

Im glad sam agrees the characters needed more momentum in 06! I thought the exact same thing because i do like a lot of bits and pieces of the gameplay. If the character's were naturally fluid (have some speed naturally) and have an attack that doesn't stop that momentum (amy's hammer for example contradicts this ) most of the gameplay would be pretty decent. Blaze is probably the best side character to play as

[@A-Dubs398]

"Adventure 2 to Heroes is the biggest controls downgrade." No, Heroes to Sonic 06 is, LOL!

[@callumsparrow4379]

I absolutely love how these retrospective videos progressively turn less into discussions between the three, and more into Internet Boxing Matches with Prem vs. TWIP.

[@Bowblax2]

premy lost when he said you get eggman hover before sand ocean. 0 IQ

[@AutismGayming]

Dude. Why do I always found you in the comment sections in the most random videos? lol

[@Kiezly]

@@AutismGayming he’s a sonic fan lol

[@TheStorytellerAJ]

The TWIP and Premy dynamic is incredible. This shit is great.

[@artsyomni]

When people say “Sonic 06 ruined the series,” it should be automatically understood that the subtext is “Sonic Team/SEGA ruined the series with Sonic 06.” I feel like that goes without saying. Premy’s being really silly.

[@MAMZYY_YT]

Artsy Omni Very silly, like no offence to him but I feel like his love for 06 is blinding him to a point where he’s making very illogical arguments trying to desperately defend the game in this video

[@kevinm.5951]

Obviously sonic 06 was ruined by sonic team/SEGA combined but like arguing as if the game itself is innocent is illogical. They're both in the hot seat Game and developer Also saying something like "Sonic Team ruined the franchise" is very open to interpretation, that could mean anything regarding the entire franchise...context is everything

[@mared7305]

Do you guys care to understand his point with that? Bell me when you do. LOL

[@Banana807]

@@kevinm.5951 idk why you say sega and sonic team combined when it was thhe great minds at sega who thought rushing the game to a holiday release was a good idea when half of the game was still unfinished, and on top of that split the teams so they could make sonic and the secret ass rings

[@akira4409]

I agree with most of sam's opinion , EXCEPT the fact that you said sonic with a sword is dumb lfmao

[@SamProcrastinates]

Hopefully after I play the game my thoughts will change :)

[@akira4409]

Hopefully lol , the game is cool not gonna lie

[@atari9477]

Lmaoo black knight was soo bad

[@superdeionbro8163]

Lmao I'm super excited to hear Part 3; don't keep us waiting too long, Sam! This is super fun discussion to listen to!

[@EnderElectrics]

take a shot whenever he says "now hold on" or "here's the thing" you won't survive

[@itachisusanoo3689]

Loved it thanks for having these tri-casts sam, Twip and premy!

[@dayaneramirez1492]

Imagine comparing Sonic Unleashed with God of War. I can't with TWIP. If cobanermani456 is in this debate, I would like to hear those opinions from him.

[@Gamermario-lb3rq]

Dayane Ramírez but the werehog and God of War are comparable. They both have long reaching attacks, QTEs, special executions, a super state that you have to charge up to use, etc. After seeing gameplay of both of them I realize that it’s a little bit more than a coincidence how similar they are.

[@invencsibel]

Sonic Team intended for the Werehog to be similar to hack and slash games, such as God of War, since that genre was popular at the time. This is a fair comparison.

[@princeali7871]

Huh? Are you referring to God of War PS4? Then that would make sense, but the first 3 God of War's play a lot like the Werehog, gameplay-wise, level design not really. They both consist of spamming long-reaching attacks with a bunch of QTE's, they both even have those weird bars that fill up as you attack and then you press a button to make your character way stronger. The Werehog for all intents and purposes was designed to play like the God of War games.

[@lartts7483]

?????

[@AK46supr]

Also sam as a game developer it's not hard to make a simple designed hallway especially when u can just copy and blend models or just extend them which is very noticeable in boost games. And u dont need hallways to make a good boost level as stages like sea side hill (honestly most of gen stages) shows or even modded stages can do well without loooong hallways like unleashed. And i felt the conversation kinda migrate into or light weight attack the boost as it cant hold on its own since its "hell" to develop. But honestly thats just a 3D sonic issue. The "adventure formula" was made with this flaw 2. If it was just sonic stages in sa1&2 the game would be very short. Hence why other playable characters were made. Great vid, nice discussions, cant wait for part 3

[@Gnidel]

I am a 3D fan game developer based on Bumper Engine and I can say that making stages for boost formula is EASIER than Adventure formula (with rolling that works). Why? Because with boost you can be sure that the player is going fast. When you have working physics (and Adventure titles do), then the player needs to build up the speed again after slowing down and the stage should be fun even after failure that slowed down. That means building at least 2 stages on top of each other, one for slow players and one for fast. And I'm talking about one path here. With boost formula, invisible walls are also less noticable as objects in the background blur together as one wall. Try going through Apotos Act 2 without reaching running speed. I'm sure you'll feel urge to jump over some fences.

[@AK46supr]

Gnidel thank you that's very well explained.

[@CMC6996]

We need more of this is any kind of media, arguments presented from all sides in a civil manner where we can joke and not offend and still have our point come across. Fantastic work on this series from all of you guys. More content like this in the future!!

[@x-mighty7602]

make each zone for each team then. like: Seaside Hill: Sonic Grand Metropolis: Dark Casino Park: Rose Rail Canyon: Chaotix Frog Forest Act 1 & 2: Sonic Team Battle: Shadow Mystic Mansion: Rose Egg Fleet Act 1 & 2: Chaotix Egg Emperor: Sonic

[@jdawson7877]

i prefer if grand metropolis was for team sonic and seaside hill was for team dark

[@mared7305]

Interesting how the title screen demonstrations kinda touched upon that. Hmm. Mystic Mansion, ROSE? Huh...

[@sunshinex2012]

I cannot wait for prem to spit on roger 😂

[@joshstarr6400]

Jist of the conversation: Prem: *argument* Sam: *counter-argument* Twip: "Prem you stupid piece of shit!" Rinse and repeat.

[@Cringefov]

Been watching this series for a year and it's still very fun lol

[@pipipsy]

Also, I think Prem’s right about Unleashed’s Source Code, as Jungle Joyride for example now runs PERFECTLY on Xbox Series X.

[@ArylBarrel]

Yup lol

[@Indominus23]

I believe it was found that they used an emulator for Unleashed. Gotta check back, though.

[@Sujiceel]

I couldn't understand a thing. This debate is Joe Rogan podcasts on steroids, Premy and TWIP are interrupting too much and their points don't make sense.

[@x-mighty7602]

4:39 Sonic Heroes' gameplay is fine but it changed the Sonic friends cast & Eggman into downgraded undeveloped versions of themselves.

[@princeali7871]

I don't think Sonic Heroes can be blamed for that, especially considering how long it took after that game for Sonic's cast to turn into the downgraded versions of themselves.

[@thatonemanbehindthegarbage7126]

No it didn’t. It was a lighter tone but it didn’t downgrade anyone. Sonic acted like SA2 Sonic. Knuckles wasn’t dumb. Shadow wasn’t edgy like he is in Shadow and now. He wasn’t always just brooding like one line I still remember is “Cool City” in Casino Zone. It’s so small yet I love it so much because he can act different than an edge lord.

[@mared7305]

@@thatonemanbehindthegarbage7126 I'd honestly love them to _describe_ how they downgraded 😂

[@andyw386]

One thing that is important to remember is that once you've met 1 Sonic fan, you've met 1 Sonic fan. Because of Sega releasing so many different types of games over a long time, lots of different types of fans have come into the community. So it's very difficult to talk about general consensus a lot of the time.

[@xenoglitchy]

I wish the sonic franchise was like other gaming franchises but no Sonic gets the most hated i feel so bad for sonic.

[@colinkiama]

I knew something was up when I realised that these videos are split parts. Almost 1 hour just on 2000-2009 😯

[@imanobody7911]

This pretty much sums up how different are the opinions of the Sonic fans

[@omarnsouli1555]

this debate is godly can we get a part 5 but with spin offs this time

[@zrosix2240]

Black knight is probably the most fun I’ve ever had with any sonic game, hands down. I unlocked every sword for every character, and every character is unique. There’s even a vs co op mode that’s fun af. There’s just one damn level that I still stop this day can not beat, it’s a shadow level (who was my favorite to play as personally.) hands down, honestly, my favorite sonic game. It does NOT deserve its hate

[@christhorndykesbiggestfan5810]

Twip’s bias nostalgia towards Sonic 1 is showing lol

[@Sonic171K]

So there's a part two now. Unleashed and Black Knight are underrated masterpieces.

[@dhgmrz17]

I would have enjoyed Black Knight more if it didn't have the restrictive on rail game-play. If it played like Unleashed, then I would have really enjoyed it. Black Knight story is a pretty cool concept and unique, the game-play is just executed poorly and was too focused on trying to jump on board the Wii popularity.

[@SpeedyBlur2000]

As an artist, in the past I've had many projects with deadlines and even though I try to plan everything out, I always wished I had more time to complete it so it can be the best it could be. Now I know that you have to have some timeframe otherwise it won't get done, but with the 1 or 2 week deadlines I always felt I was cutting it close, and I procrastinated like hell back in the day. So I should know.

[@ArtHollow]

Part 2 down and I am still REALLY enjoying these opinions. It's making me want to have Sonic the Hedgehog discussions and debates with people because all of these conflicting opinions are fascinating to me. Again, Premy (I enjoy your content) and TWIP (haven't checked you out yet, sorry) are really disrespectful and that is hard to listen to. But nonetheless, I look forward to Part 3 because these are great videos (even if they're more arguements than discussions).

[@fat-hat]

Sonic as werewolf = weird Sonic as super saiyan = completely normal

[@Banana807]

Super sonic cool

[@fat-hat]

@@Banana807 truuue

[@gamejitzu]

I feel the opposite about the Werehog than Sam. I think the concept itself is pretty cool, but just because the execution was poor, it goes back and makes the concept look stupid. If the Werehog gameplay was done in a way that complemented Day Stages instead of extremely contrasting against them, people wouldn't think the Werehog as a concept was bad

[@mistersureshot1749]

I mean, Is there any game that you can use to examplify how the Werehog could've been better. I'm on the Team that the Werehog is not bad, and doesn't so much hate.

[@CandyApples4ever]

MisterSureShot I think Sonic heroes is a perfect example. When you change to knuckles you’re slightly slower but still fast and punch around and the life bars are smaller than unleashed. Sonic still runs the fast but changing characters doesn’t drastically ruin the pacing.

[@VishisTV]

I understand what Premy means. He is right there were a lot of forces defenders before the game came out. Now they are nowhere to be found

[@mared7305]

LOL That's a neat way to describe it

[@rock-n-party9241]

Sam you have and need to finish SECRET RINGS first before you even dare moving on to BLACK KNIGHT 😆 No escape.

[@SpeedyBlur2000]

Imagine if in the next game Dr. Eggman is searching for the scabbard from Sonic and the Black Knight, and he becomes two powerful for even Super Sonic, and Sonic has to retrieve Caliburn again.

[@redz0065]

The one thing that we cannot deny is Shadow's storyline in 06 was written extremely well. How it showed his relationships with his team dark members, rouge and Omega, and his whole outlook. Come on that ending scene was 🔥

[@typreegamingtpg2198]

crazy idea, what if the third storybook game was supposed to be some kind of dracula adaptation that was embodied into sonic unleashed

[@talondiwisch5206]

In every other Sonic game with alternate viewpoints you weren’t playing the exact same levels to get to the final ending. Even 06 changed it up a good amount for each character. That’s not the case with Heroes as it feels a lot more like you’re playing the same game 4 times and other than Team Rose, every story is quite long so it gets boring and repetitive. I know each story is slightly different but not really that much.

[@rynobehnke8289]

Exactly what I though when hearing him try to defend Heroes forcing you play play the game 4 times. Even Advance 1 that also forces you to do this hasn't it this bad as at the very least the unique skills of Tails and Knuckles as well as the totally unique move-set of Amy at least allow you to interact with the game in a whole different way (not to mention that its not nearly as big filled and way shorter for play through).

[@talondiwisch5206]

Ryno Behnke Glad you agree. I’ve never played Advance but I’d like to try it.

[@JakeTylenol]

I feel like these debates are so much more healthier than hearing Brainscratchcomms/ SGB talking about sonic games like they hate the series. Or at least it feels that way to me when I hear them talk about most sonic games (savor some like Sonic Colors and the such)

[@alexthebluehermit]

I can't stop laughing my ass off about how gun-ho prem and twip go on they're opposing viewpoints😂🤣

[@EpicStikyBot]

so they don't like sonic unleashed in the thumbnail

[@whaleping]

The secret pleasure of Sonic fans: Talking about your favorite Sonic game to other Sonic fans and why you love it and listening to others what their favorite Sonic game is and why they love it.

[@BetterNateThanN3ver]

Still love Adventure 2

[@TripleJump]

Unleashed was grand. It felt bombastic and epic like Super Mario Galaxy. I've never a Sonic game with that same sense of _wow._

[@davesinsanestudio8072]

I like the discussion, but you guys really need to learn to let each other speak out first.

[@SpeedyBlur2000]

The problem with the level design in Heroes is that the levels don't change up enough to warrant 4 separate playthroughs of effectively the same game. All they do is add some enemies here and there and move the goal ring. The level design is LITERALLY note for note the same for each team, which leads to the monotony.

[@amari648]

Are you gonna finish your team sonic racing play through

[@bigfanofsb653]

13:16 You DO realize that all the teams control basically the same. In fact Team Sonic and Dark control exactly the same. Sonic, Tails, and Knuckles have much different moves than the teams do.

[@Thatanoguy]

I really want to see a All main sonic handheld games discussion! 😆

[@hawk6901]

Here's how I'd rank the games Unleashed > SA2 > Heroes > Black Knight > 06 > Secret Rings Haven't played Shadow yet.

[@danielmartin2116]

I haven't played the HD version of Unleashed and I really want to, but because so many people won't stop talking about it constantly (from my experience), it also makes me not want to play it. I know that's probably petty, but I just can't be bothered to try it for that reason

[@thatonedude2159]

Give it a try. Everyone has different opinions so most likely you'll enjoy it.

[@jaxxxx1984]

Ehyyy man i say give it a try

[@hardmancanada]

sonic heroes is my favorite 3D sonic game .I love the team system, I like the fact that normal ennemies have and an HP bar(it doesn't die in 1 hit of any attack) , levels are long and the homing attack are the best one in the series.

[@itachisusanoo3689]

Regarding secret rings, you never went into whether the controls themselves were reasonably tight, motion controls or not. Just writing it off as motion controls seems pretty close-minded. And that egg-finding dino stage and such collecting stages were side levels, and they were mostly speedrun-able, so your takes on the issue seem a bit overblown.

[@princeali7871]

Honestly I agree with a lot of that, I'd like it more if they went into more detail with their opinions instead of just saying, this is dumb or this is bad.

[@dhgmrz17]

I tried the motion control I hated them and right after I attempted Black Knight and beat it. Tht being said, I hate motion control for most games in general, it clear when they are used to enhance the game and when they shoehorned in. Both games feel like they were shoehorned in, because both games could have been played just fine without them.

[@sonicemerald5488]

Twip knows what he's talking about I have to hand it to em. He knows his Sonic games.

[@zrosix2240]

I just realized, shadows not only a copy of Vegeta in character, but also in design. Vegetas hair was meant to mimic the legendary super saiyan by being spiked up. Shadows hair completely mimics super Sonics hair (at least from the adventure games)

[@Banana807]

Fun fact: the super saiyan and super sonic when sonic 2 was in dev were made around in the same time, its just that sonic 2 released a few months later.

[@zrosix2240]

@@Banana807 super saiyan was revealed in the manga in 89, 3 years before sonic 2, that’s not at all true

[@dink7458]

I like to imagine I'm with them debating as well...

[@colinkiama]

For Premy, Xbox One's back compatibility is basically an emulator. If Sonic Unleashed had adjusted source code, they would have added enhancements and stuff (like in Sonic Generations). They 100% used the finished Sonic Unleashed Xbox 360 version. Xbox One X can do upscaling by itself because of its raw power.

[@songohan5866]

Great set of videos you guys got.

[@mared7305]

To put Premy's point into like 3 words surrounding defending Sega: *hold Sega accountable*

[@ZanZa_811]

Dude I need to jump in this call to get things straight

[@Alph4Falc0]

“Giving sonic a sword is dumb” it’s a cartoon blue hedgehog and it’s based af

[@invencsibel]

Why is Black Knight considered an underrated, good game? Just curious, since I’ve never experienced it.

[@jeriahrosen101]

It’s ok. It’s better than secret rings

[@mared7305]

It is definitely very undermined & not given much credit...at all EDIT: Dunno why. Seems it mostly comes from being associated with Secret Rings and the Wii console

[@mikimario1166]

I have run Sonic Generations at 4K and it has never lagged for me at the chemical plant sliding section

[@randybudderknubs5152]

It's not lag actually. It's sonic partially clipping into the tube.

[@SpeedyBlur2000]

If the Rocket Accel was more like the boost maneuver and you can charge it up easily, I would like it a lot more. Also if they give you more opportunities to use it, because in Sonic Heroes, you don't really need to use the Rocket Accel at all, there's very little use for it. Yeah you can blast away some enemies, but it's much easier and faster to just homing attack enemies in this game.

[@sheriefwoodard8686]

I respect Premy for his loyalty to Heroes. It’s one of the best Sonic games along with Sadx, Sa2 and Unleashed imo and me personally I never really had ran into problems with the mechanics or bugs in Heroes with the exception of the special stages

[@Banana807]

I respect your opinion but honestly, if someone that is not a sonic fan tries to pick up heroes they would hate the absolute fuck out of it, also heroes had a downgrade from adventure 2, from the smooth controls of adventure 2, to the more slippery controls of heroes, i remenber that when i first played it i would start to get annoyed of how long the stages were and the fact i had to do the same thing 4 times

[@sheriefwoodard8686]

@@Banana807 Heroes was my first Sonic game and I loved it. Sure the controls weren’t as good as adventures but I didn’t know that, they worked well enough for me. Like most Sonic games the game is very skill based so how good you do will depend on how good you are at Sonic games. When I first started playing Sonic games I absolutely sucked at them but I wasn’t really interested in A ranks at the time I just wanted to complete the levels. I never got fed up with the game because team rose was basically the easy mode for me and Chaotix mainly focused on collecting. I only got stuck on Power Plant zone and Mystic Mansion as a kid but by the time I finished the Rose gameplay I had a good handle on the game and I breezed through Mystic Mansion. It’s actually now one of my favorite levels in Sonic. The levels all look beautiful and creative especially for the time, the level design is great, the music is also great and the characters are very entertaining. One of the things I like is it feels like a 3D version of classic games with multiple roots and path ways and the higher roots usually leading to the quickest path. My only real complaint is Knuckles and Omega’s punches being to slippery and the Special Stages. The special stages look cool in concept but are way to janky in execution. I actually wouldn’t mind seeing them return but only if they’re more polished. The game is challenging but that’s honestly one of the things that make it fun to replay unlike Frontiers. I like the most recent Sonic game but after finishing it twice there really isn’t much to do but wait for the DLC content. With Heroes I’ve been playing it for years and only recently A ranked all the stages. But getting better at the game, taking advantage of momentum and platforming has honestly been a really fun adventure for me and everyone I know who played Heroes. I still think Sa2 is the best Sonic game but I do think that heroes also deserves to be at the top. I honestly think that both Heroes and Unleashed catch way too muck flak

[@SpeedyBlur2000]

When it comes to the mech stages between both games (SA1 and SA2), the mech STAGES were better designed in SA2 because the levels were actually built for the mechs unlike SA1 where it feels like they just stuck everyone in certain sections of Sonic's levels. However I believe that Gamma had the better CONTROL over the mechs in SA2.

[@SpeedyBlur2000]

Here's a late addendum, but if we were able to put Gamma from SA1 into the mech stages from SA2, it would control and feel like a DREAM.

[@SpeedyBlur2000]

I think one of the big reasons why people say that Sonic having a sword is dumb, is because he doesn't really need it. He's already proven to be a fast and agile character, and one of his main selling points and core features is that he can curl into a ball and literally slice through enemies like a sawblade. He doesn't need a sword to do any of that. Granted, if Sonic and the Black Knight was good and received better, maybe taking Sonic off the rails and into a more free roaming environment, kind of like Hyrule Warriors, then it would be easier to swallow I guess.

[@T.L.P50]

BRO SAM GIMME MORE I WANT PART 3 NOW!!!!!

[@ThatBoiDarius_]

Y’all forgot about the rush rivals games and sonic chronicles great video ntl

[@murt.]

Why was TWIP the logical one in the 06-Sonic Team argument? How did we get here?

[@theminecraft2516]

They all better like Sonic Unleashed

[@oMoonlighto-kn3ql]

They gonna hate on night stages im sure.....

[@englishgiraffe2124]

Premy does. It's in his top 5 favourite Sonic games. Don't know about Twip or Sam tho

[@oMoonlighto-kn3ql]

English Giraffe sam said he love day stages but hate night one

[@SonicOrochi]

HD or SD? The streamlining of the SD version makes it better than HD in my opinion, even though it loses in the boost and graphical departments.

[@oMoonlighto-kn3ql]

Gameplays Traduzidos - S.O.! Sorry for late reply! But he said he doesn’t like the werehog and night stages as gameplay and idea of it

[@georgepanayotidis1494]

black night is the most underrated game in the series. Premy stop shouting some are wearing headphones

[@skelldoom4329]

Each of you should have your own turn to speak so this is easier to listen to lol

[@baggelissonic]

When I first played heroes, around the year it came out, I had reallyyyyy mixed feelings, I just couldn't get it, for years every time I replayed did, I only find some portions fun. But then, earlier this year, I happened to play it again and I was blown away at how good it really was, it's wild ride playing through this game. It is a similar case to sonic cd, you either get it and like it or you don't and dislike it. THERE IS A WRONG WAY TO PLAY HEROES and it's the worst way to possibly play it.

[@sonicshuffler2050]

Sonic Adventure 2 S- Sonic Heroes B Shadow The Hedgehog D+ Sonic 06 B- Sonic & The Secret Rings F- Sonic & The Black Knight A+ Sonic Unleashed S

[@sonicthewerehog2263]

I can only say good things to about Sonic unleashed it's my dream game.I LOVE THE Werehog!!😬 They all keep saying that the werehog is stupid.I hate that.that made me sad😭😢😥😫😧

[@ammiedragon9080]

Me too! It was my first Sonic game, people just can't appreciate the small things! ;-;

[@sonicthewerehog2263]

@@ammiedragon9080 I also have the game to .the Wii version of sonic unleashed, but it is still the best sonic game ever made!😊

[@fuji3d_studio]

I also love Unleashed and including the Werehog! I get that people play Sonic games to go fast and the Werehog is the exact opposite of that, but his gameplay is polished and he has one of the best fighting systems I have ever seen.

[@sonicthewerehog2263]

@@fuji3d_studio I love the gameplay of the werehog. I just think they don't respect that there are some Werehog FANs OUT THERE ,! 😬😧

[@jeriahrosen101]

The execution of the werehog is handled fine. It’s just the idea that’s dumb. I would’ve been ok with it if it wasn’t so long too. It overstays it’s welcome. I do like exploring for the moon medals tho, and the combat is decent. It just happens way too much

[@x-mighty7602]

27:21 these proportions feel off... idk why.

[@Tlseditsz]

If you think abou it sonic 06 is the real sonic adventure 3....

[@princeali7871]

I mean if it was the real adventure 3, wouldn't it be called Adventure 3?

[@Tlseditsz]

GuY oN iNtErNeT Yes but sega decided to call it a new game with Sonics name so more people could buy it but the game and the controls are the same with adventure

[@princeali7871]

@@Tlseditsz Fair enough.