The BEST martial arts for KNIFE FIGHTING?

[@scholagladiatoria]

The first 1,000 people to use the link will get a 1 month free trial of Skillshare: skl.sh/scholagladiatoria08221

[@mrd7067]

Take a look at Ed Calderon aka Eds Manifesto and libreknifefighting or immediateactioncombatives and Cecil Burch. Do you have any sources on the training of ww2 german special forces. I have looked for it but there seem almost no informations on this units and especially their training corriculum out there. Especially in regards to had to hand / steel weapons. Thank you for your time.

[@arnijulian6241]

The idea of fisticuffs or pugilism being Hema sounds wrong but i suppose you are technically correct though it has it's origins in the ancient world called pygmachia=fist fighting. Pygmachia & pale/erect/upright=Greek wresting together where used the Pankration since 648BC historically in the Olympics. pygmachia was the 23rd ancient Olympic sport in 688BC. Pankration was considered often considered the most dangerous Olympic sport though both combat date to before the Homers Iliad in the 8th century but to when? I view boxing & geek wresting as a joke today compared their older forms from before rules in the 1700's & later to save live. It is a blood sport between humans so it is meant to be violent. boxers & wrestlers alike on occasion went though the colosseum armed with nothing against those with arms & armour. Some boxers & wrestlers bested a lion unarmed in combat historically. The Pankration Means (all of might) where they had no restrictions & the aim was to kill disable or force your opponent to submit. The Greek-American combat athlete Jim Arvanitis was one of the founding members of MMA which is really just a copy of Pankration. The Pankration is likely the best training method against a knife if unarmed, if the sport doesn't kill you. Elite pankration had few if any rules allowing blows with any part of the body to another even fatal ones like blows to the rear of the skull for example. You could choke your opponent out even or break all their limbs in joint locks. Even better so was the ''falls'' that pygmachia that no one has practiced in a ring for about 2 centuries legally of illegally as it often meant the opponent's death. I now a lot of this stuff but you won't learn it because it all in ancient Greek, Latin or middle-old English for some daft reason.

[@arnijulian6241]

Glima/Nordicwresting is likely the likely the only choice on par against armed opponents to Pankratiast's. Glima even give constructive advice on how to blind a man. Glima has variant's loose grip (lausatök), trouser-grip (brókartök) & Backhold wrestling-(hryggspenna). Their are others Varient's but surprisingly all deal with armed opponents to varying degree. Loose grip/lausatok is considered combat Glima mind that teaches the techniques intended to harm & maim like 1 I briefly mentioned with no detail.

[@arnijulian6241]

​@@tatumergo3931 Pyxlax just means punching & kicking which was a play & later in the 90's a Geek rock band. I haven't ever looked into kick boxing nor have i read any traditional or ancient instruction on it & trust me I looked. if you can recall the name Tatum ergo or any sources I'd be most intrigued. I'm not one for kicking but am familiar with (le savant) but only use the low kicks as age don't let me get my legs up high confidently. I approve of (Muay Thai) but it doesn't meld well with traditional boxing or wresting but it works unlike most kicking based martial arts or pugilism. In the Icelandic sagas & various laws in make mention of Glímuholl, meaning "Glima Hall". glimpse & flash has it's origin in the word Glima that literally means fang which in Norse means grasp or capture. Like Gefangen means to to take or seize suggesting but not always theft. I once read something translated by bias clergy from around the 1200's that used (fangbrokken) to refer to two in a wrestle but never read it any where else. That might be slightly misspelled as I read it a decade ago. oldest reference of Glima i have read is 9th century Gamli Boddason (790-850) and Kveldúlfr Bjálfason (820-878). The oldest Norse inscription date back to around the 2nd century so yes Glima is old Norse but at the later part before the Norse expansion into Britain & west Europe. Could be older mentions of Glima but I can't recall. Glimt meaning glimpse is used over a thousand years ago but I can't recall what poetry or saga it was used. lausatök & brókartök to variants of Glima have older mention then Glima as a word that is all 3 are old Norse but Glima is late old Norse unlike lausatök & brókartök with mentions back to 4th & 5th century respectively on inscription at land sites & not on text. Råbryting is the most violent form of wrestling used in the Viking age if interested. Covers the use of weapons more so then lausatök which does covers use of weapons in the grapple but with less detail in comparison. Rock's axes, swords that sort of thing. Mind this isn't my field as Engineer but more a hobby past down from my elders. My father granddad was the traditional boxer killing north Koreans with it though he learnt from his grand father john. I learned about Old Norse & Glima from my German Great grandfather Sep & his brother Wolfgang still alive to my knowledge that Sep was part of the Youth program of that time though I suspect something being a double letter & wolgang over 8 foot was Wehrmacht. Glima is used to refer to Norse wrestling today but originally it meant any creature in another's grasp. So caught in the hand of a man or maw of a beast like a wold or bear. My father ex forces as well like to think he is a boxer but he doesn't have the knack for it. He always reverts to women's unarmed combat, a Skye's or better yet a gun when it all go's wrong. Mind his favourite piece of kit was an entrenching shovel or better yet slurry-jelly explosive to make a fox hole to hide in. My old man is the sort that win's by bringing a 36 gauge to a knife fight that is designed to take lorry engine blocks out. Not honourable but he live 13 years of active service then 4 years as a mercenary. I have to agree with him unarmed combat has it's place but that should be a fraction of training if at all. His father disagreed though as he was up against a enemy with more numbers then they had bullets at points. Opposition of opinions but both valid. I think my dad's Ego was always hurt as only middle rung in unarmed but good with chemicals, machinery & a marksmen being a fellow Engineer. Sorry for the length got onto a bit of tangent of sorts ''Tatum Ergo''/''Therefore''. You like your Latin I presume by your user?

[@arnijulian6241]

​@@tatumergo3931 In your comment to MR. D not all Schutzstaffel received such training even in the Elite as it was not mandatory but optional. At least 1 form of recognised unarmed combat was mandatory though. Though Judo or Jujitsu was more common in Germany at the time compared to ally forces it was not common even in the Schutzstaffel. They spent a lot more time training in psychology, sociology & other now taboo fields then combat. Eugenic is a notable forbidden field that many nations b-practice without mention of it for look at the loose abortion laws in the west these days? The Schutzstaffel began in 1925 as the nationalsozialistischen parties security force till eventually body guards of the Führer then the secret police with the branch of propaganda of the Reich ministry. Many of the SS where women league & not nationalsozialistischen. Conversation have been interesting though demented. The men got trials but did the women?;) The final form from 1941 was the final solution that saw the death camps from the SS that Adolf had small part in really. after 145 from 1946 saw former members well into the cold war acting as spies for all part of the be it eastern block west or south America & even Israel in some cases. Their our government won't ever tell you & want to stay hidden for a reason. Even what little I now I'm keeping my mouth shut till I'm an old man.

[@Rupertblade]

I'm an old Italian hiker and hunter and while I appreciated the video about knife fighting I want to share my personal experience about the subject. In Europe and particularly in Italy in practice the only opportunity to use a knife for self defence in the real life is in the woods against stray dogs bocome feral and shepherd dogs out of control. The reader living in USA must take into account that most of European woods, UK excluded, are similar to the American Appalacci mountain secluded woods with long trekking in a densely wooded environment with packs of dogs, sometimes crossed with wolf who don't fear men. As I personally experienced they attack in a wedge formation with the alfa dog as the point. That means that in most cases at the beginning of the attack a person is attacked by oly one feral dog. If and when the person is overwhelmed and possibly wounded on the ground the rest of the pack will attack. The technique of defence I learnt as a boy scout is first of all to have a bowie knife of about ten inches, eleven is better. You'll never see an Italian boy scout without such a knife in the woods! Second you must stay calm and put your back against a big rock or tree in order to have the pack, generally not more the four o five dogs, in front of you. Third don't shout or scream but be relaxed and take your backpack out of your shoulder and keep it on front of you like a shield. Forth put your bowie at the side of the backpack with the edge of the blade upwards like the old Romans did with their gladium at the side of their shield. When the alfa dog cames against you generally snarling don't shout or scream to prevent him from attackimg but on the contrary be silent to encourage him to attack. He'll have to rise up on the hind legs to attack you, because of the backpack, expousing his belly. You must begin to trust the point of bowie agaist the dog shielded by the backpack with the aim of piercing his belly and disembowel him upwards till reaching his heart. But every blow against him will do. Stay calm protect yoursel until the dog dies or retire. If the alfa dog dies and the pack is hungry it will satisfy with the carrion. If he seriuosly wounded retire and flies, that happened to me and in most of cases, the pack will follow. Wait some time before starting again the track to be sure that no other dog will attack you and to relax. This technique is simple sure and proved, by myself, efficient. It takes no strength only self control. But if you lack self control better you don't venture into secluded trekking in places like the Appalachi or similar woods in Europe.

[@mcwiwi5915]

The use of a backpack as a shield against wild animals is a great idea, I've never thought of that before

[@ericsierra-franco7802]

Serious hikers/backpackers do not carry giant Bowie knives in the US. Many do not carry anything more than a Swiss Army knife. If feral dogs pose a threat to people over here they almost certainly will be shot dead.

[@thomasgarrett190]

I'd love to know about your knife. It's absolutely beautiful What is it?

[@Rupertblade]

@@thomasgarrett190 The knife I carry in my hlkes is an old Bowie Cold Steel Trail Master Carbon V 10" made in USA. I bought it many years ago. I changed the handle from a kind of rubber with one of stabilized oak wood cut from a railway slipper and the sheath made of solid 3mm leather because the original was of thin hide. It's a big knife but very well balaced for every serious camp use included self defence.

[@edwards99]

@@RupertbladeI had a Cold Steel trailmaster I brought from the us when I was stationed in Germany. One weekend I drove to the UK with that and an axe. When I got to the border in Dover after crossing the channel it was confiscated at the border - but they let me keep the axe!?!?!? Do you know if there are typically knife size restrictions for hiking throughout the rest of Europe?

[@jonod8757]

Having worked doors in East-Germany, and old instructor's words that have stuck with me: "The winner of a knife-fight wins the luxury of dying in a hospital bed" Another good maxim is: "If you think your knife-defense techniques are good, give a teenager a marker pen and tell them they get a fiver every time they draw on you"

[@pablob.m.7746]

those are the basics, only after one understands them, can then start learning

[@-XXI-]

very true

[@iratevagabond204]

That is why you should always wear femoral and radial guards. It'll still suck getting stuck, but at least you're protecting your main arteries.

[@pablob.m.7746]

@@iratevagabond204 lol wtf

[@iratevagabond204]

@@pablob.m.7746 There are cut resistant sleeves you can buy that are meant to protect your arteries. One of our OGs worked as a CO in the prison in Chino, CA, and he would order them (and stab vests) for us youngsters. We'd wear our stab vests and sleeves to school every day.

[@saidtoshimaru1832]

In Argentina and Uruguay, people used to fight with a long kinfe (facón) in one hand and the poncho rolled out in the other.

[@esgrimacriolla]

The Esgrima Criolla is an art of fighting with knives, with abundant technique and still in use

[@penhullwolf5070]

About 10 years ago when I studied Japanese martial arts we did a lot of Tantojitsu. Using wooden tanto with damp red chalk on the edge to show up cuts when sparring. I quickly learned that no matter how skilled you are, if you get into a knife fight you will get cut. Probably badly. Possibly fatally.

[@happy_camper]

The best defense you can have in a knife fight is an escape route. Just get out of there.

[@johnbennett1465]

Every martial arts instructor I have had has said something equivalent to "in a knife fight you will get cut, the only question is how badly. " This is true across multiple styles.

[@CtrlAltRetreat]

@@happy_camper This is actually one of the few instances where that is actually very clearly untrue. You can check stats on the mass stabbings in Europe and China and you'll note that in the high death count instances, there is largely a single assailant stabbing unresisting civilians trying to flee in a public situation, the low count situations are largely ended by the would be victims dog piling the assailant. In either case, both the assailants and the victims tend to be untrained. Looking at the London stabbing figures, fleeing after a knife attack has mixed results but often results in grievous wounds to the back and the victim was much more likely to survive if he was able to force the assailant to flee rather than attempting to flee. Running with a knife is not very encumbering either so unless you are significantly faster than your assailant, turning your back on them puts you at the same disadvantage a routed force on the field getting run down had throughout history. Another takeaway is that most lethal stabbings are a really a multitude of potentially lethal knife wounds. Often you'll see people getting stabbed twenty or more times in an instance. Each individual stab is not very likely to be immediately lethal given modern medical treatment but being knocked down and stabbed repeatedly is almost certainly so.

[@happy_camper]

@@CtrlAltRetreat ​ though I appreciate the data you’ve shared, it’s obvious that the safest course of action is highly situational. And to best-address these situations, the best preparedness you can have is to be trained to defend yourself. Knowing if it is safe to run is absolutely part of that. An “untrained” and “un-resisting” civilian is not who I imagined when typing my very un-nuanced comment. Running away from a would-be assailant wielding a knife saved me from harm in the past, but the circumstances were right for it. Not to be cheeky, but context is key! My recommendation to anyone is to be taught how to defend yourself from a reputable instructor, and my second recommendation is to always avoid confrontation if possible.

[@wehrewulf]

@Cee U Next Time Media Jutsu, not jitsu.

[@robertillston2350]

Having practiced Kali before HEMA, I can definitively say that in most cases the only difference between many HEMA techniques and KALI techniques is only the vocabulary used and the presence, or lack there of, armor. This incudes things like messer, because the "typical" messer blade is relatively short, it corresponds with the "swords" or long blades used Filipinos.

[@ScarecrowsSwords]

I did HEMA before Kali and found the same thing. I found a lot of moves translated back and forth really nicely.

[@Shiresgammai]

The Eskrima/Kali/Arnis masters I've met so far always warned about knife fights, they were honest enough to make it clear how tough and vicious knife attacks can be. The worst ones are the "street self-defense" experts who just want to sell you belts and worthless degrees.

[@robertillston2350]

@@Shiresgammai Yeah, it gets brutal; I have great disdain for those "masters" that try to show how to defend empty hand against a knife attack and claim that their "system" allows them to walk away unscathed; someone with just rudimentary training in how to properly use a knife a serious threat to any unharmed person, even a serious Kali master.

[@thezieg]

The correspondences are due to the Spanish presence in Philippines.

[@Shiresgammai]

@@robertillston2350 Amen to this! I'm so sick of the pajama-wearing douchebags who just want to sell belts and grades! They treat human lives like garbage. We had a severe problem with McDojos here until people found out that they are bullshitters. Things have drastically changed since then. If I may ask, are you an Eskrimador?

[@raazial]

Probably the best informational book I’ve read on the subject is: Contemporary Knife Targeting- modern science vs W.E. Fairbairn’s timetable of death. It goes through with(graphic) crime scene photos and cases of knife injuries. Updated with information about blood loss and time table to things like shock and death. It as well as other consistent things I’ve studied have shown that the idea of knife combat outside of killing is naive at best and childish at worst. Everything from the difference in mindset of taking human life and not wanting to kill vs each other. To other factors like a knife wound to the forehead may not be deadly but will bleed a lot which can obstruct the vision of an opponent, or yourself if it happens to you. To the best legal uses of knife in terms of defense are bisecting large muscle groups, the bicep for excample is a great place to cut if you can because while it’s not a fatal wound once a muscle is separated it ceases to function properly. This as the book states and so have others in the comments is more valuable because there were cases where people suffered multiple knife wounds to vital areas and were still able to persist until they expired. In all, the more I’ve learned about lethal and non lethal techniques using a blade, the more the knife terrifies the shit out of me.

[@matthewwarren4809]

That book goes for 352 dollars on Amazon.

[@og_squeekz5248]

I think its also worth noting in rural Philippines knife fighting is still a common means to settle disputes between neighbors. Unlike most bladed arts today which are often taught from a historical perspective Arnis and FMA in general still maintain a modern tradition of knife fighting. It's hard to find a bladed art that is still used to draw blood on modern streets.

[@wreck-it235]

@@matthewwarren4809 I was lucky to get it for £100 there and that was the low end 😅

[@pablob.m.7746]

Very true, the more I train and learn UKF (anatomy included) the less I want to use it and many times choose to not carry a knife but steel chopsticks instead

[@darkythecrazyninja5228]

Gutka magic 🍮 ✨

[@HariOmRadhaKrishna]

I have about 25 years of training in Eskrima-Kali-Arnis. We start Beginner students with knife defense & knife fighting basics at green belt, after about 3-6 months of single stick training.

[@adwarfsittingonagiantsshoulder]

In the "Swiss Open of Free Fight" there is one of the competition that is all about knifes (it is in fact a marker pen), this competition is one round knife vs knife, 2nd round knife vs unarmed, and 3rd round the knife is given to the other competitor. What one can conclude is that : -it is extremely difficult to defend onself against a knife without wistanding at least a few cuts. -people who did well in the few competitions that I watched where from Hema, Yoseikan-budo, and Pilipino martial arts (some guy did a modern philipino derivative that specialises in knife fighting); those comming from MMA and Sambo who did really well in other competitions, did poorly with knifes depite beeing good all around fighters.

[@Shiresgammai]

Does this take place in Switzerland?

[@adwarfsittingonagiantsshoulder]

@@Shiresgammai Yes, it is or it was in Switzerland (I have no idea if it still exists, I went to watch it for three years around 2015-2018 maybe). It was organised by Geldman, a Combat Sambo champion that is a student from a UFC champion that has a club in Geneva (I cannot remember the name of his master, he was a russian guy who won UFC 5 or 6 ?). Despite looking glorious and having a grand name "l'Open Suisse de Free Fight", it was in fact a very small competition, open to all, but in fact only clubs from Geneva and neighbouring towns took part (there was regularly some MMA and Yoseikan-budo practicionner, and in the knife competition there was also regularly some HEMA people from at leat two clubs, one of them in neighbouring France). Despite beiing a small competition, there was quite a pannel of effective martial arts represented (but in a lot of cases it cannot be resumed as this art is better than this one, as most practitionners usually have experience in more than one martial art), and this knife competition was an eye opener for me.

[@Shiresgammai]

@@adwarfsittingonagiantsshoulder Sounds great! Were there some genuine knife people or more or less the "pajama guys" from McDojos?

[@adwarfsittingonagiantsshoulder]

@@Shiresgammai No Mc Dojo, and I don't think the Mc Dojo crowd go to this kind of competitions that is opened to all arts. For the knife competition, the first year I watched, some of the guy did'nt seem to know what there where doing (I suppose MMA and Sambo guy who don't train with weapons) despite beiing good martial artists. The second year, I missed the knife part. The third year I think all the people in the knife competition where good. The competitor of wich I know what martial art they practice where from Yoseikan Budo (they train knife sparring with foam knifes and woden tanto), two HEMA schools, one Philipino school, and a Philipino derivative that specialize in knife fighting - called something like Barag Sugbow or Barak Sukbow ? if I remember - (I don't know how they train, but I've seen their metal blunt training knifes and I thought they are far too dangerous for safe practice as they are somewhat pointy and the guard is also quite sharp and pointy).

[@Shiresgammai]

@@adwarfsittingonagiantsshoulder Sounds like a neat event! I've heard of Baraw Sugbo, could this be the knife system/school which you mean? You bring up a good point, I don't recall actually a good "complete" martial arts system. Most systems just teach the handling of one weapon or one specific way of fighting, but it seems as if the systems which were designed to offer a complete system for almost all aspects of fighting have long perished.

[@JingShenKuoshu]

Wow, you are a relief. I live in the world of Navy Seals, Marines and Delta. I believe the knife to be the true equaliser to all. Understanding that there are blunt force, bladed, flexible, projectile and explosive and combination weaponry. The blade is the the truth of history. I have so many critics that downplay the knife but so few who will challenge even the shock blade. I would love to make a connection with you and maybe have you join me here in San Diego to speak. Respectfully, Grand Master Greg Fraser (Just another ranking in the changing world) Help me explain that sport fighting is play fighting and a knife is more real than a gun. Knife principles are the game changers against age, strength, aggression, and pride. Please, lets chat.

[@SuddenRushman]

I grew up with a knife art from Indonesia, called Pinjak Silat. My instructor was employed to teach US special forces knife techniques, so at least the pentagon thought his art was useful.

[@moreparrotsmoredereks2275]

I don't know what is taught in special forces, but my experience with the Marine Corps Martial Arts Program doesn't give me much faith in the Pentagon's ability to find a way to effectively teach martial arts

[@shiyotso1]

Pankat silat is an amazing modular knife martial art, also includes the only art that uses baghk nagh(?) Or the tiger claws as a sidearm.

[@johnbennett1465]

@@beowulf_of_wall_st on what basis do you claim this? Even regular soldiers can end up in unexpected hand-to-hand. Why would SF be immune to this? While it might be rare, using a knife for stealth seems like a valid strategy even in the modern world.

[@CtrlAltRetreat]

@@johnbennett1465 Unplugging an unaware sob's lung with a shiv isn't a one on one knife fight. The Fairburne-Sykes techniques mentioned do include far more relevant techniques for that.

[@johnbennett1465]

@@CtrlAltRetreat you seem to have skipped over my reference to unexpected short range attacks. Also, a stealth attack can fail. At that point you had better be ready to use the knife to quickly deal with an active opponent.

[@Ken19700]

A fun but unrelated fact, karate had no high kicks until they borrowed them from savate.

[@SamuraiAkechi]

I'd say that spanish knife fighting (the art described in Manual del Baratero) is underappreciated and should be tried more.

[@PavelStoykov]

kzbin.info/aero/PLUUtIUpmRdhgejVctISzkqElIspMko9mP

[@marcondespaulo]

There also an italian knife fencing school "scherma de coltello", IIRC

[@TheFlyguywill]

I knew a guy in college who was a bouncer at a night club and he got slashed in the face by a guy with a broken beer bottle. A knife fighting defense would be extremely useful for people in many situations, so I think it’s foolish to argue otherwise.

[@moparman1692]

Huge difference between a broken bottle and a knife though..

[@ashtheswan705]

@@moparman1692 not really? A broken bottle is light, sharp, and held in one hand. You cant exactly stab someone with it, but thrusting broken glass at someones face is not pleasant for them.

[@moparman1692]

@@ashtheswan705 well.. a broken bottle can cause some dmg, but its really trivial compared to what you can do with a knife. Dont get me wrong.. you can manage to kill someone with broken glass, but you will struggle trying to do that with someone that fights back. I knife on the other hand.. can be used to produce disembowelling slashes, combined with superfast thrusts to the torso. You simply can not use a bottle like that. Also.. a knife can be used to trap your opponent, and has a very high degree of versatility. There is a reason why you dont see many drills using broken bottles as a weapon, because they suck at it, compared to a knife. Also.. a broken bottle is also hard to conseal, which is the main advantage of a knife. I could really go on and on..

[@joshuawalker301]

I'd say is between esgrima criolla (gaucho facon fighting style) and traditional Filipino knife fighting. Because they both fought a lot with knives for a good chunk of time and had a lot of time to develop it, and they use those almost exclusively.

[@SamuraiAkechi]

They both borrow a lot from Spanish knife fighting.

[@bradolfpittler2875]

@@SamuraiAkechi si! But they evolved to fit their environments and were also influenced by regional techniques.

[@joshuawalker301]

@@SamuraiAkechi Yes, but they are kinda their own thing also. And Spanish knife fighting is considered HEMA. To me esgrima criolla is the best cause it does have some cultural things to it but not as much as Filipino ones that heavily factors in their clothing style and a bunch of specifics of that region culturally, hence why slashing and cutting is their main thing, still hella useful tho', but context plays a bigger factor, in esgrima criolla you have both cuts and stabs, wrestle, defence and is focused around fighting people in regular clothes, not in armor or pseudo armor, it was tremendously popular in the region, lots of people did practice it, both for practice sake and for killing people and had a if it works it works approach, that purged out nonsense out of it.

[@SamuraiAkechi]

@@joshuawalker301 Honestly, I'd love to try esgrima criolla, but there are no clubs in Russia doing it. I know a spanish knife club, but I'm not yet good in my current art of choice to spread my attention.

[@ElkaPME]

@@beowulf_of_wall_st ​ ​Not true, FMA has a lot of weapon improvisation, something that's very realistic in dangerous situations, especially in urban combat. The one sad fact however, is that there are also a lot of sham FMA "trainers" that's only in it for the money and have additives like those belts that weren't a thing at all with genuine FMA To prove that FMA isn't fantasy, Bobby Taboada is one of the best examples of genuine FMA

[@watcher314159]

This is one of the reasons I'm so fascinated by Fiore. Even if 90% of what most people train is swordsmanship, it covers a lot more and the fundamentals are in grappling and dagger. And while the modern context is quite different, the sheer breadth of techniques and contexts covered in the material seems to make it relatively adaptable to modern situations (though there remain some stumbling blocks like Fiore generally assuming daggers with longer blades than are really seen today). I'd probably choose something else if I really wanted to focus purely on modern self defence, but given that I also really like swords and other weapons... it makes Fiore an efficient choice for me. Or it would if I weren't in the boonies and had the resources to train.

[@Tanstaaflitis]

As a Fiorist and someone actively learning competent modern knife defenses, there are other things deficient in Fiore. Specifically, he does a lot of grabs that a knife attacker will use to filet your wrists and arms. Fiore doesn't seem worried about cuts at all, only penetrating thrusts. There's a lot of difference between Fiore's ice pick dagger and common pocket knives and it shows up in technique. That said, my knife defense studies are allowing me to reinterpret my Fiore. But more than technique is finding some means to study and practice in a realistic manner.

[@dougsinthailand7176]

It’s interesting that martial artists often regard knife fighting as almost taboo and often spout such things as “oh you’re going to get cut no matter what you do”, but then seem to regard sword fighting as a lark, although that’s much more dangerous.

[@vetrean]

It's quite plausible that you'll run into someone with a knife, where bad advice or poor training can result in overconfidence and dire outcomes. It's pretty unlikely you'll ever have to worry about swordfighting, except in a controlled martial arts/sports context.

[@Quixotematic]

Sword fighting is much 'safer' IMO. You can see a sword coming and you can parry it, even though the tip speed may be higher. It is much harder to parry a knife with another knife.

[@markwalker4485]

@@Quixotematic the answer is a knife/dagger can be hidden and brought to bear very fast. Usually for a fast/clandestine kill. There are many different styles and likes. I know my first real knife fight I lost two tendons and an artery before I even knew the other guy had a knife. A neighborhood friend got stabbed so bad it took her many operations to even use her leg again. My personal adventure knife you would laugh at…but it scares the natives so that also works.

[@kaen4299]

@@Quixotematic The margin for error is much smaller in sword fighting. While knife fighting is nasty and dangerous, victims usually die from bleeding out and not from the initial impact alone, which means it also takes longer to die from a knife. But swords on the other hand are able to end the fight in seconds and with single hits by removing limbs or splitting your skull open.

[@zweihandersarecool5929]

you can parry swords with swords(due to blade length and guards), but you cannot parry a knife with another knife, that is what makes it officially dangerous

[@mariosebastiani3214]

I practiced long time in Aikido, we often used a wooden tanto in "full contact" attacks. I've learned a valuable lesson: if confronted with a knife, the best martial art to survive is running.

[@Gunsandbunsmma]

My okinawan sensei ron nix taught me how to run and live happily and peacefully before he taught me how to fight! Everything from the knees because if you are on the ground, you can get to your knees. Wrist and ankle control and situational awareness are what we take from aikido, besides the sword and understanding of disruption and rhythm breaking

[@wayneholmes637]

Not everybody is physically capable of running from a, probably younger, attacker.

[@JetConvoy]

Honestly, I’m a horrible runner so it would be the least likely option for me. If deescalation doesn’t work I’d choose to fight every time.

[@scassoniostrarompi1691]

Police advice on knife attack defense goes viral kzbin.info/www/bejne/mH6XZpWKg5mJpMU

[@chriswindham1822]

US Army combatives is currently trending toward wrestling and BJJ for knife fighting. At work I have personally turned a lethal encounter into a less than lethal encounter. Coincidentally WW2 army combatives had a catch wrestling base. We have come full circle.

[@markwalker4485]

Funny thing with military training. In particular the USA in WWII pacific was poorly trained hand to hand soldiers that only had at best 7 days training would take out people trained in a culture of hand to hand fighting. I believe that the culture to live out ways even years of trading. Sorry guys. And to the School of Gladiators. I cringed every time I saw how you held your dagger and what the handle was made of. Many a wonderful horn or antler handle I have broken. Keep with leather, modern plastics or basic wood. And the style of hand placement changes with the style of blade. And the style of handle. So does the different styles of attacks you can perform. My favourite Bowie style knife turned into a perfect failure. Mainly from how it was made and what with. She was perfect in play class games. But when used properly in “real life” play? The handle cracked and became an expensive brass backed wall mount. Never did get to find out if the brass back actually worked. That’s sucked

[@moparman1692]

Wrestling and BJJ have a very limited approach towards good systems for knife fighting.

[@manticore4952]

@@markwalker4485 The average US soldier could easily defeat the average Japanese soldier in WW2 in hand to hand. Most marines were taught boxing and wrestling which are better arts to fight with, they were then taught an introductory course in Combatives which added throws and disarms. You had 190 pound guys going up against 100 pound guys.

[@theripcord03]

The combative training I got from my time in the army circa 2010-2018 mainly focused on delaying your opponent(s) long enough for your buddy(s) to get to you and end the fight. Like, it's good enough that you can win against a less trained person, or defend yourself long enough to get to a more advantageous position etc but really its just the basics and not good enough to go up against someone who's trained for years in a specialized school of martial art.

[@moparman1692]

@@theripcord03 and.. lets not forget.. in the army you get to respond by means of firearms. That helps a lot! That said.. most people tend to underestimate how nasty a well executed knife attack can be.

[@christopherseivard8925]

Fascinating. I believe all caveats are points are covered. Half-way through, I had to hobble down hall, just to acquire my AG Russell .’sting”. Despite a stroke, and paralyzed left hand, I am now able to hold it in my hand. Thanks. Good motivation!

[@Wolf-Wolfman]

Any 'Knife Martial Art' that doesn't do regular full contact knife sparring is basically fantasy play acting. Some HEMA clubs (including Scholagladiatoria) do regular full contact knife sparring. Technique is a part of how good an art is, but if you can't pressure test it and regularly spar, it's not enough.

[@widdershins5383]

A swordsmaster was teaching a student who had perfected all the technique practices. Watched his first duel and watched his student get killed. Realized he was only teaching theory and started introducing bloodletting early as possible to make sure his students were prepared to draw blood as well as technique. Possibly not a real story, but I read it somewhere and it fitted this perfectly lol

[@moparman1692]

Sparring is important, but knives does mot need a lot of force to be effective.

[@Wolf-Wolfman]

@@moparman1692 which is why you spar. You spar to build speed of action, speed of decision. To put together the elements of the drills you have learned into something you can actually use. One important lesson sparring will teach is how much better you need to get!

[@moparman1692]

@@Wolf-Wolfman yet.. and this is esp. true for anything involving a knife.. if you train with the wrong instructor.. your sparring lessons will be pointless. Tbh. Im not a big fan of sparring as in a knife fight. For self defence.. scenario training is more useful imo, because a good knife fighter will not "face off" against an opponent.

[@Orkaney]

There's an old Norwegian saying, "En kniv i hånden holder den andre i sliren", or in English, "a knife in hand keeps the other sheathed". I guess us Norwegians were civilized after all.

[@andrewk.5575]

There is also "En mann uten kniv er en mann uten liv" or "A man without a knife is a man without a life."

[@moparman1692]

Norwegian here.. and ive never heard any saying like that. Not sure i understand the logic behind it either.. :)

[@Orkaney]

@@moparman1692 The logic is simple. If your opponent has his knife drawn, would you risk your life to draw your own, or would you accept your defeat and capitulate?

[@moparman1692]

@@Orkaney that does not make any sense to me. If someone draws on me.. i will ofc draw my own blade. Anyone that knows how to use a knife will spend as much training on how to draw the knife fast.. without presenting it to your opponent, as any other technique or move in your arsenal. If you draw your knife in order to intimidate someone into submission.. you will mostly find that you will produce the opposite result. You will instead escalate the situation. Following your saying, one should not draw a gun neither, if someone pulls a gun on you. That makes zero sense as well, if you know anything about gun tactiques.

[@moparman1692]

@@Orkaney but.. seriously, where in Norway does this saying come from?

[@innerwavesilat]

I've had decent luck using Pencak Silat in HEMA dagger tournaments, although I did lose in a final bout against a Kali guy because I tried something dumb and flashy. I would use HEMA rather than silat or kali if heavy clothing or armor is involved. I think that Pencak Silat methods are useful for minimizing cuts to yourself in a tournament context, which is my experience for knivery.

[@armynurseboy]

What is your opinion on the comparisons between Kali and Silat when it comes to knife techniques? I've dabbled in both and find them to be pretty much the same general techniques and strategies, although the training methods were different.

[@innerwavesilat]

I think that the knife material is highly similar between kali and silat. In my experience, Pencak Silat tends to incorporate more unarmed motion earlier on than FMA. There's also mimickry of animal movements that I haven't seen much of in kali. In sparring with my FMA friends with knife or stick it looks much the same.

[@nullifye7816]

Sounds like a reasonable conclusion for rondel dagger fighting, but plenty of "HEMA" is 19th c Bowies or WW2 knife stuff. That'ss definitely "minimise cuts".

[@ilsegno7732]

Was this at IGX in 2018?

[@innerwavesilat]

@@ilsegno7732 IGX 2014. The same dumb move won me the 2019 National Silat Championship... so 50-50? @Nullifye I want to learn some 19th century bowie and WW2 knife material sometime. Is there a manual for bowie knife? How much of modern practice is intercalated FMA? I know my silat training informs how I use the rondel dagger.

[@a-blivvy-yus]

It was good to see the acknowledgement of "run away" as a valid option in many situations. In general, for ordinary civilian life, I often think the best discipline to study for personal self defense, wherever you live, whatever weapons might be prevalent around you, is one that isn't generally regarded as a martial art. It is, however, occasionally described as "the martial art of running away" - parkour. You learn how to maintain balance, keep yourself fit, learn a lot about body mechanics in general, and a lot of those lessons can translate to effective movement and action if you're forced to fighht, but it doesn't *encourage* you to confront threats, it helps you to be where those threats areen't, or to have ways to get away from them before you get hurt. Martial arts, no matter how focused your studies are on being "safe" and on protecting yourself rather than picking fights, teach people to be *confident about confronting* an attacker, even if they actively try and tell you to avoid doing so. It's a situation where what you're shown and what you practice, doesn't match what you're advised to do. Parkour doesn't teach you to face off against people, and has no techniques specifically designed for confronting someone in an antagonistic manner. As such, there's no encouragement of confidence in your ability to handle such situations, but you are more confident in your ability to get to places other people might not be able to reach. As such, training in parkour is likely to heighten your "flight" response where martial arts might make "fight" a more likely answer for you to default to. Obviously this doesn't guarantee you can always get away, and doesn't benefit you as much as being experienced in fighting when there's some external factor (locked in, or having to protect someone else) preventing you from running away. That said, in most civilian contexts, running away is an option, or could become a more plausible option than it otherwise would be if you're more skilled at it from parkour practice. Also, the basic training for parkour does improve general fitness in a similar way to regularly practising any worthwhile martial art, and helps improve strength, balance and body awareness, which are all useful core skills if you end up having to fight. You might lack in technique, but your basic physical attributes will still be closer to those appropriate to a fighter than those of someone who didn't take up any physical activity.

[@garyledford2901]

Ive studied hema, American military knife fighting, and also Apache knife fighting. All are good because they emphasize full speed sparring. However Apache knife training has greatly increased my ability with a knife.

[@Benjanuva]

Ooh! I forgot about American tribe fighting styles. I will definitely have to look into that.

[@ftdefiance1]

I grew up in Arizona and studied the Apache Wars. I see discussion of Bows (wow) clubs and lances using fire hardened yucca stalks and broken saber blades. I have yet to find a contemporaneous report of knife use . Given my understanding of fighting on the frontier knives were important. Do you have a historical source I can check out?

[@Shiresgammai]

Did you study William E. Fairbairn's knife system?

[@garyledford2901]

@@Shiresgammai no, I study Apache knife under Robert Redfeather.

[@garyledford2901]

@@ftdefiance1 no, I have my instructor who grew up on the reservation and learned from his grandfather and grandmother. His grandmother taught his grandfather before he went to WWI so he would come back alive. She hd been taiught by her father, because many families and tribes tautht the women how to fight.

[@stupidanon5941]

1:44 I know a lot of people probably won't like to hear this, but I think it's important to know how to use a knife against someone who is _unarmed_ as well. Just because they don't have a weapon in their hand, doesn't mean they're not capable of dealing you grievous bodily harm or killing you. I think your point about different laws in different places is really going to throw a wrench into this idea (from my understanding, most places in the Western world require some sort of 'equal force' measure, so even if someone is trying to beat you to death with their bare hands, you may still be in hot water for pulling a knife), but for places where it is applicable, I think it's an important potential scenario to consider. If someone is trying to kill you, don't give them a fair fight.

[@dougsinthailand7176]

Matt, if I had to choose, I’d train in tankendo. They practice in kendō armor basically, combining traditional wakizashi styles with dismounted bayonet blades. It’s very stripped down, tested with realistic sparring, and sources a venerable heritage as well. Worth looking at.

[@WhiteApeMA]

That one is an interesting one. Sort of a companion martial art to Jukendo, if I'm not mistaken. Seemed to be pretty ferocious.

[@scholagladiatoria]

Interesting, I've not looked at it before. I'll check it out.

[@outsideiskrrtinsideihurt699]

@@scholagladiatoria ​ maybe you can make a future video about both tankendo, jukendo and their history?

[@johnnemo6509]

Tankendo clearly shows a modernized version of traditional Japanese martial arts. developed from and for the imperial army. Simple solid techniques..because teaching soldiers. A focus on power thrusts because during the period of development the Japanese military was active in Manchuria...cold....big thick coats. Blade length and form is as you say modeled on the Arisaka bayonet. Since morihei ueshida was a drill instructor in the Japanese army teaching bayonet fighting and tomiki Kenji was located in China for 10 years you can see how tenkendo influence tomiki aikido competition. Good post

[@johnnemo6509]

@@scholagladiatoria This is a pretty good intro covers kata and kumite. kzbin.info/www/bejne/hoCVeZyQaNZ-jdE Exactly a companion to jukendo ...basically junkendo when there is not enough space for a bayonet on a rifle. W E Fairnbairn (who else) was involved in bayonet fighting competitions in Shanghai with the Japanese, and absorbed a lot of ideas from them. great channel thanks! don't always agree but always willing to listen

[@twodog42024]

Some Native American tribes still practice historical forms of knife fighting. I cannot speak for any other tribe but I am Lakota Sioux and we have a living tradition of knife/axe fighting.

[@stevenlowe3245]

WW2 Combatives based on European fencing and American Bowie fighting. It works and has a lot of testing behind it.

[@colbyalbertson4573]

Re: techniques across multiple arts: I remind people all the time that there are a finite number of ways to manipulate the human body. I’ve studied a number of arts (love the bujinkan mention 😁) over the last twenty plus years, and I still adore finding the similarities.

[@manalainen]

Loved that Bujinkan bit too, really nice to see it recognized. :)

[@chrisnotyourbusines7739]

I have been in 4 knife incidents, only one was a fight where we stood across each other with the other boys cheering us on, luckily I stumbled and broke my wrist before we could hurt ourselves and the fight was indefinitely postponed..the other times I didn't see it coming, ended up stabbed in the gut once and managed to deflect in to my thigh the other times. I think worst about it that you know your with a person that is prepared to kill you. That's quite scarry and sort of quintessential for the lack of a better word. I think best defense would have been to expect a knife and be prepared to get cut vs stabbed. I honestly think even in te context of early 90's eastern Europe it's very difficult to overcome the fact that your in for your life suddenly. I can imagine training technique, but I can't imagine training the mindset for it

[@markwalker4485]

Remind me to never go out with you

[@chrisnotyourbusines7739]

@@markwalker4485 hahaha, there is a reason why Eastern Europens are portrait as the baddies in movies

[@markwalker4485]

Or South Eastern White Africaans 🤪🤣😇😇. My opinion the best combat knife or dagger maker still comes out of RSA. Hard to get his blades now he is old. And I won’t name drop here. British thing ya know Eh🤪🤪🤣🤣

[@welinder01]

@@markwalker4485 are his initials pb?

[@stupidanon5941]

0:24 Yeah. I once heard a saying about knife-fighting; winners dribble, losers gush. While I understand the point of the statement (it's preferable to take minor hits that won't kill you, _if_ you can trade them for a massive artery blow), I prefer my own formulation; "in a knife fight, the loser dies on the ground, and the winner dies in the ambulance. Don't get in knife fights."

[@AJJ129]

I love the pure passion of Matt would love to see a Bowie knife fighting video.

[@JoelyOlyOle]

Great content brother! Love the shirt!

[@BladeFitAcademy]

It seems to me if you can manage to see it coming, a cloak (and also a dagger) is a fantastic defense against a knife or dagger attack. It's too bad cloaks have fallen out of fashion.

[@znail4675]

If you wanna beat knives then a stick or cane is pretty much the ideal as it's something you can carry in most countries without issues.

[@ericdpeerik3928]

Barchairs, barchairs work a charm 🤪

[@denx2pogi]

@@ericdpeerik3928 Yes, in all seriousness, a chair (providing it's not too heavy), is a good tool to defend against a knife. Or at least, better than bare hands. Just make sure the 3-4 legs are facing at the opponent and poke him/her with it, while blocking the blows!

[@robertvondarth1730]

A Cutlass is an excellent defense against a knife.

[@griffin5226]

It blow my mind how many people who regularly conceal carry firearms will practice knife fighting but never practice shooting from retention or compressed positions.

[@iangrau-fay3604]

I remember going through level 3 Combatives back in 2013. I had some MMA training and was rolling with a fairly skilled BJJ player, he missed a takedown and went to pull guard on me. The NCOIC of the course just happened to be walking past us, and dropped a shock knife (rubber knife with a taser on the edge) next to us. Very much changed the roll. I also got to shock a Lieutenant. I have a background in Arnis and Bujinkan, and none of it helped during that session. Once in grappling range, grappling takes over distance knife fighting.

[@glowstickofdestiny1290]

If you have the choice, the best martial art for knife fights is track and field.

[@foyjamez]

under rated comment.

[@travishancock9120]

Someone: "What is the best martial art for knife fighting?" Matt: "All of them."

[@petejitsuman9025]

A good explanation, you may add Kalah , which as you were saying , "Combatives" , they have a lot of knife use and defense but one other style we integrated, was Baraw Sugbo , certainly an element to add to any knife fighting skills , I am glad Fairbain Tactics were also mentioned.. There is another form of knife fighting , which is boxing skills , with a blade , I haven't seen much on this but worth researching

[@markwalker4485]

The most interesting end result I have ever seen was an old dude using a WWI brass knuckle trench knife. I never saw his teq but the left over remains where very astonishing. Basically stab, bash and crush. He didn’t have a scratch on him.

[@petejitsuman9025]

@@markwalker4485 interesting , I have met some very skilled with a blade in my travels and training , never seen anyone use a WWl brass knuckle blade before

[@jrhamilton4448]

I train in American Kempo karate which does a lot of knife work. I would consider it to be a good system because it draws on several martial arts that all utilize knives as a defensive weapon. We spend a good deal of time on the mats training with and studying these techniques as well.

[@176bammm]

As an amateur cutlery collector. My favorites... 1. CRKT Hissatsu. 2. USMC KA-BAR, COLD STEEL LEATHERNECK. 3. BOWIES (Various types/styles/sizes.) 4. DAGGERS (various types/styles/sizes.) 5. DIRKS. (Various types/styles/sizes) 6. KUKRI (same as above.) 7.COMBAT/UTILITY KNIVES 5 INCHES AND UP....

[@batteredwarrior]

I really love the SOG SEAL Pup Elite. It's such a practical design...used it to trim back bushes in my folks' garden. 🤣

[@andrewk.5575]

Fun fact, James Williams, the designer of the Hissatsu, is a highly trained traditional Japanese martial arts instructor who has some videos here on KZbin about his knife work.

[@176bammm]

@@andrewk.5575 I've seen at least 2. One with the woman and self defense. And the one where introduces the Shibo, and the other tanto variants...

[@176bammm]

@@andrewk.5575 I have the 2 different variations of the Hissatsu...The early bright stainless, and the later black that looks more like the current HX tanto....Plus, I have the large assisted folder and the Heiho....

[@ns987]

Even the name of the country Filippines was given in the honour of Spanish king. Some techniques in Arnis like fighting with short and long blade or even costumes and armour of Filippino warriors were simillar to spanish conqistadors. So to some degree Arnis has elements of HEMA and classic boxing with local dirty tricks. So arnis is like sambo or bartitsu - mix of European and Asian martial arts. I think it was first Euro - Asian martial art, cause this country was first european colony with long and glorious history of resistance

[@noelfrancisnunez5729]

Haha no we killed magelan with our own martial skill. Pilipino swords skills is there before spain

[@Dragonamg2]

I have studied Pencak Silat, Krav Maga, and HEMA dagger systems based on Fiore and Meyer. I consider the Pencak Silat knife techniques to be the most versatile and "best" over all for me but they are also the most technical and take much longer to become proficient at. The Krav Maga techniques I consider to have the most user-friendliness in terms of time expended to learn the techniques versus the quality and versatility of those techniques. I think of the HEMA techniques as being somewhere in between but closer to Pencak Silat than Krav Maga. The HEMA techniques are decidedly more well suited to engaging a trained opponent or armored opponent than the Krav Maga techniques I learned. I would love to learn more about the combatives systems from the world wars era. If anyone can recommend some period or even modern reference material please let me know.

[@andrewk.5575]

Get Tough, All in Fighting, and pretty much anything written by W.E. Fairbairn, Richard Sykes, or Rex Applegate are a good place to start for WWII.

[@TheAtomicCross]

One of the reasons 'knives' are still in use is cost and availability. You can make a knife with some scrap metal or an old tool and some patience. A firearm is a lot more involved and requires more specialized material and ammunition.

[@Erjad]

I train both HEMA (for almost 9 years) and Muai Thai (6 years) It's a good combination, many things overlap aswell you find many similarities.

[@Erjad]

@@tatumergo3931 exacly, that's why I've said they overlap

[@81Roeland]

You forgot the Indonesian Martial arts. Pencak Silat does an awful lot of weapon training with pisau (knife) and golok (machete) and various other weapons.

[@derstoffausdemderjoghurtis]

How come that we are being blessed with such a upload frequenzy?*-* I was just sparring with rubber-trainer knifes with some friends a day ago and our conclusion was that we never want to get into a real knife fight. Almost every encounter ended in doublescores and both people (would) have had their arms and wrist badly sliced and pierced. Stabs into the torso werent that common but even when they occured it was very hard to defend yourself succesfully to a counterblow to your own torso.

[@carloparisi9945]

Hi Matt, in my book "Dagger fencing the Italian school" you can find the translation of Italian dagger sources like Marozzo and Altoni

[@otxoawolf9054]

Link please

[@niklashall5969]

That intro was awesome I love your charisma mate good stuff

[@robsarnowski6313]

I would add some of the Indonesian Silat arts and some of the Sub Continent styles like Bando. When I studied FMA we did a lot of freestyle which since I’m a fair grappler, my bouts would often end on the ground. Really ends up looking a lot more like a prison yard than a martial arts studio. On Saturday you could attend an optional Silat class. That particular style was heavy in the use of knife or a flexible weapon. I think both the FMA and Silat, as presented to me, were both heavily influenced by modern combatives, and by the recent experience of the diaspora of people from the Archipelago’s

[@eoagr1780]

Knife sparring is a great way to make cardio in Hema.

[@raigarmullerson4838]

Love the vids and cheers from Estonia

[@Jedittee]

Poland's staying strong with Estonia, we'll protect ourselves from orcs aggresion

[@brasildiegopro]

I'm a Kung Fu teacher, Northen Shaolin style especially, and there're basically 2 forms of using a dagger: one form uses a dagger with the right and other form with both hands using two daggers. Both of them with reverse hammer grip. There is also the southern style Choy Lay Fut which also has one form using 2 dagger in reverse hammer grip and there is a form of butterfly Knives which uses the regular hammer grip. But as you said and I confirm by experience, the focus is on the other weapons. Great video. Thanks for sharing your point of view. 🙏

[@GodsAssassin]

This is an excellent analysis Matt. Thankyou for this!!!

[@gingerbreadzak]

00:30 🗡 Knives statistically injure more people around the world than firearms in civilian environments, making knife defense or use essential. 02:38 🤺 HEMA (Historical European Martial Arts) covers a wide range of martial styles, including knife-armed combat, from the Middle Ages to modern times. 06:18 💥 While MMA is excellent for unarmed combat, it doesn't prepare you for knife encounters, where weapons change the dynamics significantly. 08:09 🇵🇭 Filipino martial arts focus on various knife techniques and traditions, making them a valuable resource for knife-related skills. 09:18 ⚔ Certain Japanese martial arts delve into knife use and defense, but it's not the primary focus and may vary by school. 11:36 🌍 Some regions, like the Caribbean and Southern Italy, have living traditions of knife fighting, often rooted in HEMA. 13:55 🪖 Military combatives draw from various martial arts and offer practical knife training for modern contexts. 15:46 🤼 Evaluate martial arts schools based on how much time they dedicate to realistic knife defense and training with or against knives. 17:08 🔪 Consider HEMA, Filipino martial arts, or military combatives as the main approaches for learning knife-related skills. 19:41 🤔 The choice between these approaches often comes down to personal preference, accessibility, and specific training goals. ✅ Summary complete.

[@siegebug]

thank you for your very detailed timestamp

[@KlausBeckEwerhardy]

My first work on knives has been in ju jutsu, later bujinkan workshop, tanto lessons in kendo and an acquaintance of mine teaching shaolin double dagger which is quite interesting. In gongfu it very much depends on the style and the teacher. There you also find mixed weapon use - which is always fun.

[@DanGoodman-n4b]

Lifelong martial artist including serious edged weapons. Here are the main things I have learned. - be ready first even if you start second. Practice your quick draw. - move unpredictably but always maintain structural integrity. Aikido Taichi Judo - contol adrenaline, breathing and heart rate. Yoga. None are 99 day courses. A lifetime of prioritizing my ability to defend myself. Lighter is better as you age. Response times. Emphasis on tactics & mental game. You have to walk that way or not. But better to have a knife & know how to use it, even if not deployed. But need one and not have one? No thank you. Martial philosophy has led me down an interesting life path. Your work is an outstanding analysis.

[@tanegurnick5071]

There are still in existence today, several knife martial arts within the indigenous American community which are very effective.

[@AppliedDefenseConceptsLLC]

Greetings Matt! You hit the nail on the head in terms of Combatives training. We provide combatives training and edged weapons defense to military and civilians alike and it is always evolving, indeed. From the days of Sykes F to now. Having a HEMA and Japanese martial arts-side of our company as well, the amount of sparring done in these classes with the rondel or tanto really does translate to modern knife fighting effectiveness. HEMA practitioners just tend to spar more often and so we found it to be a great resource to continually challenge and evolve our systems as well. Always love your content and cant wait to see more!

[@pearceelliott7855]

I would also mention Bando for learning knife fighting, although I think they focus on the Kukri in knife fighting. There is the American Bando Association, the European Bando Thaing Federation, and the International Thaing Bando Association (I'm only familiar with the American one). They incorporate both open hand (unarmed) and weapon techniques. So far as I know, none of these groups is very large, but if you can find one in your area, they could offer some interesting options.

[@stephenmcvay5368]

My new carry combo: a Solingen Main Gauche and a MilStd 1911 in .45ACP. Good video. Thank you for your hard work.

[@eugenevictortooms4174]

I recently had the opportunity to do some training in libre knife fighting. It was the most eye opening couple of hours ive experienced in a long time. If somebody with a knife really wants to switch your lights off, there's pretty much nothing you can do.

[@danhaywood5696]

Kali is useful, because it's very natural and makes sense including empty hand and knifes and small swords, and sticks and staff. I practice fighting my cane and also a small selection of knife's with it or each other, and also my tactical pen. I am learning some Kali to guide me and to practice from, but I am changing it to work for what I have, and to specialize around using my cane at very ranges and all parts of it both single and two handed and slapped, and with or with one of my knifes drawn. Though I practice just single and double knife also, and I use both foreward and reverse grips depending. I am practicing daily for hours in the forest trying to put all this together into a system of skills for myself, to fight, single or multiple attackers, armed or variously armed. I use dead tree's a lot to practice on. I've used tomahawks a lot also. Its a combo I'd have canoe camping, but the biggest threat is to the vehicle left behind, or from cops charging felonious camping now in Tennessee.

[@jimgolab536]

Well stated. Also remarkably hard to take my eyes off the shiny blade.

[@CJOwen]

If I was to rate the most important thing I ever learned through the years of studying and practicing martial arts, number one, by a large margin, is respect for the danger posed by knives. Doing live training, even against novice opponents, disavows one of any delusions on what can happen when a knife comes into play. That is even under the best possible circumstance of you also being armed and prepared when you square off, which pretty much never happens that way IRL. So, yeah. Knives are super dangerous, small, concealable (even while being wielded), and even a "small" knife is deadly, deadly, deadly.

[@browntrout8830]

There's a recent viral video of an Australian man who was murdered in knife fight. It absolutely confirms this. It happens so incredibly quickly. Also the video is obviously extremely NSFL.

[@davepuxley7387]

You make a really interesting point here, about the intersection of historical lines of development, contexts for use, and our own present viewpoints - all helpfully placed in the overall context of human biomechanics as the common ground from which all this springs. Thanks!

[@CobitoTorres]

I've wanted to ask you for a while. How was spanish fencing seen in England historically? I've seen Verdadera Deztreza videos where they say that spanish fencers were feared around Europe, but that statement is said by spanish people and I haven't heard the same from people outside Spain. I'd appreciate it if you could touch this topic.

[@otxoawolf9054]

La Verdadera Destreza is probably the most successful sword method considering how long it lasted. Even well into the era of the gun. Also considering that there isn't land without a Spanish tomb it's influence in Mexican, Filipino, Caribbean, and Latin American martial arts is undeniable.

[@badlaamaurukehu]

I think George Silver referenced Spanish fencing iirc.

[@otxoawolf9054]

@@badlaamaurukehu perhaps although I thought he predated it. He did put.some interesting dagger fighting info in his paradoxes of defense.

[@andrewk.5575]

@@otxoawolf9054 Silver wrote his book in 1598 while Carranza was 1569, in Paradoxes of Defense there is a little subsection on Spanish fencing. Silver's conclusions are a little confusing though because much of the section is him basically saying that Spanish fencing works great on paper, but only on paper, but at the same time he also says that the Spanish were the second best fencers in Europe after the English. As a general rule with Silver you always need to keep in mind that he was a raving xenophobe, so take his comments about foreigners with a grain of salt. Once you do that, the fact that he said the Spanish were second best might actually mean that he thought that they were the best and just didn't want to admit it in public.

[@banditone00]

Have things like the clinch pick become popular over there like they have among many who are serious about self defense in the US? Guys like Cecil Birch and Craig Douglas have really done impressive things using that style of knife or any small fixed blade worn horizontally in front of the hips. It works well with the bjj crowd because you use the grappling skills to control the person while stabbing and then ripping the blade back towards you. It also uses a smaller knife that isn’t terrifying to the general public. I have a three tiered system. I carry POM pepper spray clipped in my pocket. Not every encounter requires or justifies deadly force. My primary deadly force is a concealed handgun, however I understand that in close quarters it is difficult to get a firearm into play at times. So, I have a combat flathead on the front of my belt that I can get with either hand, and use with my BJJ skills.

[@chriswindham1822]

I was an 18b im US Army and taught combatives for a brief period. Smaller knives are easier to manipulate around the body. Additionally people are less likely to see them. Keeping hands free until you are in proper position as a grappler is key. People see you pull out a knife, that's the first limb they will try to isolate. If you have a grappling base, positioning is the most important part.

[@garychurch9237]

The four classic boxing punches, the jab, straight, hook, uppercut, can be modified with less body movement and more arm speed and targets switched from nose to eye, jaw to neck, and liver to heart.

[@vincentvanagtmaal3561]

I think HEMA is the best because it's the only one that focuses on sparring generally for knife fight/defence. If you don't spar you can't test yourself and your skill.

[@johnnemo6509]

I would say Fairbairn's Knife system was heavily influenced by the fighting he experience in Shanghai. Knives were probably the most common weapons and the ones where criminals were most skilled with. Also Tsai Ching Tung from whom Fairbairn learnt Chinese martial arts almost certainly knew the knife methods of yin style Bagua. I would say that traditional Chinese arts all address knife fighting. It's just that it has been down played because it was associated with criminals and so has been lost. now what most people are exposed to are empty forms.However, I found a lot of movements in forms only make real sense when you put a knife into the equation. Respect to all.

[@tonyyarbray]

two of my long time favorite things military combatives and knives...as to the Japanese methods once upon a time (i'm old) a friend I had who was an instructor of a Japanese tradition who also really liked knives so I asked him where was the knife fighting in his school and he showed me how he applied katas from other weapons into knife fighting the one he showed me and said was his favorite was a kata for kamas.. I was impressed always moving a series of 8 slashes moving forward or backward where he could go straight in at any point interrupting the sequence for a second if the opportunity presented it's self he also showed me a couple other techniques from other weapons applied to knives also useful but something I wouldn't think of in regards to knives

[@daveburklund2295]

I have bookmarked this video to watch later this evening, but I am willing to wager the concept of situational CONTEXT shall be explored.

[@nobodyrissole1921]

*Titanium Armour* Firstly, titanium armours can be spaced apart to increase the effectiveness at stopping bullets. And spacing the titanium sheets apart creates a cushion that slows the bullet before the titanium is penetrated. For example, a titanium shield can have a thin 1.2mm sheet of titanium over the front of the main shield plate. This 1.2mm sheet can have spacer lugs welded to it. Furthermore, a bullets force will be reduced on impact with a space of 1 centimetre inbetween two titanium sheets. And a 1.2mm sheet of titanium in front of the main shield plate would do this. Lastly, this titanium spaced armour has actually been demonstrated and tested to be effective on the American demolition ranches. Next, spacing other metals apart would create a similar bullet stopping effect. And I imagine that spacing steel apart would be effective to create a cushion that would slow a bullet. In addition, aluminium would also increase in effectiveness spaced apart. Furthermore, I think because of the properties of aluminium spacing it would have limited benifits. However, you would still increase your bullet stopping power by spacing your aluminium apart. As a result, I think that all your metal and alloy armours should be spaced in some way and taking the time to do that is a good idea. Lastly, when you space your armours apart it is so effective that you can expect to stop a higher calibre bullet. And this is particularly useful on a shield. Table#1 Types of Shields ------------------ *Titanium backpack buckler* -40cm in diameter -4mm thick titanium -Weight 2.5kg including handle -If the 4mm of titanium is a high tensile strength and spaced correctly you will be able to stop 7.62 NATO and 50cal magnum rounds with this buckler. *Steel backpack buckler* -40cm in diameter -3.5mm thick steel -Weight 3.7kg including handle -If the 3.5mm of steel is a high tensile strength and spaced correctly you will be able to stop 5.56 NATO and 45cal magnum rounds with this buckler. *Titanium Tower Shield* -100cm×70cm in Area -3mm thick titanium -Weight 10kg including handle -If the 3mm of titanium is a high tensile strength and spaced correctly you will be able to stop 45cal magnum rounds and 5.56 NATO with this shield. *Titanium Shield* -50cm×70cm in Area -3mm thick titanium -Weight 5kg including handle -If the 3mm of titanium is a high tensile strength and spaced correctly you will be able to stop 45cal magnum rounds and 5.56 NATO with this shield. *Aluminium Shield* -50cm×70cm in Area -10mm thick Aluminium -Weight 10kg including handle -The tensile strength of aluminium varies a lot between regular aluminium and the 7000 series of aluminium. And that means you can make this shield just as effective as titanium. *Steel Shield* -50cm×70cm in Area -3.5mm thick steel -Weight 10kg including handle -If the 3.5mm of steel is a high tensile strength and spaced correctly you will be able to stop 45cal magnum rounds and 5.56 NATO with this shield. Lastly, the perfect thickness for bullet proof brigandine plates is 3.0mm or 4mm titanium. And you just try and find the highest tensile strength titanium you can and just use that thickness. In addition, I have also decided that if you get a 1mm thick aluminium face size plate you can shape it in to a horror face and then bolt it to your titanium helmet. As a result, you can have a full set of bullet proof brigandine armour with a horror face helmet. That is going to be terrifying with swords and bowling ball cannons. Finally, if your metal tensile strength is high enough you will be able to deflect or even completely proof yourself against 7.62 NATO bullets. Table #2 Use of Formulas ------------ s = tensile strength in pascals (Pa) F = force in newtons (N) A = cross-sectional area in (m²) m = bullet grain mass (kg) a = acceleration of bullet (m/s²) t = time of impact (seconds) v = velocity (m/s) *(m(v/t=a)=F)/s=A* 9mm bullet Force = (m(v/t=a)=F) v/t=a (430m/s)/(0.0024s)=179,167m/s² ma=F (0.0075kg)(179,167)=1344N Aluminium tensile strength = 240MPa = 240000000Pa F/s=A (1344N)/(240000000)=5.6e-6m² 5.6e-6m² = 0.0000056m2 = 0.056cm² = 5.6mm² Therefore, a 115 grain 9mm bullet traveling at 430m/s requires 5.6mm² of 240MPa Aluminium to block it. Reference: kzbin.info/www/bejne/h4DOi62ghqqraq8 kzbin.info/www/bejne/fIW8eKmClMpkodE kzbin.info/www/bejne/q6Pdaamef9WWf7s kzbin.info/www/bejne/pnOueqd-g8pnp80 kzbin.info/www/bejne/bKDRaa2HhNqGY7M kzbin.info/www/bejne/rn22c4V9mrWbZrc kzbin.info/www/bejne/eqi7q5-XZ76YaJY kzbin.info/www/bejne/imrbfqtslM5so8k kzbin.infokf9LtS2QDQA?feature=share

[@Chiller11]

As you mentioned in the specific locals in and around late 19th century Buenos Aires knife fighting techniques were intimately associated with the Tango. Visteo, the knife fighting training practiced by the compadrones often rural gauchos who had come to the rapidly growing urban centre), was a refinement of combat techniques by men who were occupationally well accustomed to knives.

[@YoutubeCommenter1]

Could be interesting to see some videos about the Fairbarn Sykes knife fighting

[@crazypetec-130fe7]

When it comes to BEST martial art forms, I've concluded that it's not the form, it's how well the individual can best employ the form he or she chooses.

[@totallyfrozen]

12:03 Makes perfect sense. The human body has 2 arms, 2 legs, and we all have the same range of motion and limits of range of motion (all things being equal). So there is only so many ways a human can move and only so many things we can do. It makes perfect sense that a lot of techniques will be common across multiple systems even if (back in history when these systems were contemporaries) those systems never came in contact with each other. We all have carotid arteries, jugular veins, a trachea, a heart, 2 lungs. Our elbows bend one way and not the other…etc.

[@richard6133]

Native American Martial Arts may also be an option in some areas. I think one of the ideas being described here is universal principles. Different martial arts from different places in the world arrive the same idea on their own, by different routes and at different times, because it is the reality of what works best. At some point, as long as a martial art is progressing, they will eventually arrive at the best practice at something, and it reaches a peak plateau. Martial arts that focus on tradition and history are still good for study, practice, and sport, and there's always something new to be learned from the past. However, don't forget that there's a reason why they're in the past. I'm thankful to live in a place where I can carry both a handgun and knife. Plus, all of my emergency kits contain both a substantial fixed blade knife and either a hatchet or tomahawk.

[@eugenevictortooms4174]

Okitchitaw.

[@neemancallender9092]

In Aikido we learnt with a boken and a tanto, where the use of the tanto came from learning the boken Both attack and defense From the focus on empty hand, by the time we transitioned to boken and then tanto, knife fighting was very easy to do and master

[@wehrewulf]

Lol... try that shit. Get life insurance.

[@devinm.6149]

Hema & FMA happen to be the martial arts I'm most interested in, not specifically for knives though.

[@tcschenks]

There’s a science fiction author named Steve Perry who practices Indonesian Pencak Silat, which includes several varieties of knives.

[@BoomerMcBoom]

Lynn Thompson of Cold Steel, conducted the annual ‘Cold Steel Challenge’ every summer in Ventura, CA for many years. Competition sword & knife fighting (PVC & foam weapons). Basically ‘Tag’ with blades. Also did throwing competitions with knife, tomahawk, spear, shovel & spike. Lots of fun. Might be some stuff on KZbin.

[@alextopfer1068]

Short distance running? Interesting discussion, and broadly matches my experience

[@allones3078]

As a Pilipino martial arts guy I do spar (Training knives) with some HEMA guys and find it fun and very interesting. HEMA can be very different depending what the practitioner trains

[@rylie8989]

Hi Matt, I'm really enjoying the recent knife videos, as they can potentially combine interest in swords with interest in self defense methods that are actually usable (in most places anyway, I know Texans like to comment that carrying full size swords is legal haha). After watching this as well as particularly the video on large knives vs small knives, where you talked about using different methods for blades under about 6 inches, I'm wondering if you'd say the proper methods change again for even smaller blades, as some places limit knives even further to lengths such as 3 or even 2.5 inches?

[@Shiresgammai]

I've heard that Bowie knives are legal in Texas, I wouldn't recommend carrying a literal sword around.

[@banditone00]

@@Shiresgammai Oklahoma legalized all edged weapons, however we still are not allowed saps, knuckle dusters, or slung shots. (Not to be confused with sling shots)

[@Shiresgammai]

@@banditone00 That's actually great, but I've heard that the usage of swords can be a negative when it comes to courts, since they had quite a few cases where nutjobs killed or injured people with swords. I would recommend using a big knife or a machete, but not an actual sword.

[@TheLithp]

Matt, most knife injuries are probably household accidents from things like cooking or opening boxes.

[@Gunsandbunsmma]

Grew up studying Seidokan Aikido and sword with Ron Nix in Okinawa Japan for 8 years. My father is a 3rd degree black belt in taekwondo and competed in point karate tournaments in the 70’s before the air force. My boxing coach is a retired Raven and professional body builder and golden gloves winner out of tennessee, and currently I do MMA with some current and retired UFC, LFA , and Bellator fighters and am a Renzo Gracie school BJJ practitioner. I say that to say that sword fighting and HEMA with real battle ready weapons has been the closest thing to live MMA sparring that I can get to mimicking real combat. The rhythm disruption and pattern recognition, feinting and parrying, footwork and balance in stance, headmovement, posture and speed, angle and repetitive confusion. I use swords all day in hand to strengthen my hands and wrists in preparation for blocking kicks and knees and elbows. Swords coming at your shins even prepare you for leg kicks, dont check them avoid them or redirect! Thanks Matt, ur the best at what you do!

[@scholagladiatoria]

Thanks for posting!

[@Gunsandbunsmma]

@@scholagladiatoria I was curious about your opinions and thoughts on threaded vs peened swords, durability and historical accuracy wise. Seems like a cool quick video!

[@daxmafesi]

I recommend Bowie Knife fencing, Japanese Jujitsu (for control) and Ringen. For larger agricultural style blades like Bolos or machetes I recommend FMA.

[@moparman1692]

Bowie knife fencing?? What size of bowies do you use for that?? Id be claiming that a knife size weapons fight can not be called fencing.. as a lot of techniques available with a sword.. simple does not come into play with a knife, and the best deployment of a sword is vastly different from that of a knife.. unless its a really big one, brodering to shortsword size, imo.

[@daxmafesi]

@@moparman1692 Knife fencing has more to do with the footwork and way of holding the knife and prioritizing the Thrust. I have plenty of videos on my page proving this point & actually people instinctually ‘fence’ in real knife fights. Meaning they keep long range distance for fear of getting hit, the midrange which so many “knife fighting systems” prioritize is almost nonexistent in a real knife or weapon duel.

[@daxmafesi]

@@moparman1692 kzbin.info/www/bejne/bYiQh5SZpZiUY7s

[@moparman1692]

@@daxmafesi not sure i agree with what you said about mid range vs long range. Half-handing in swordplay comes to mind as an example. Also.. if you look at some of the South-eastern Asian systems.. they focus on the really close range stuff with great success. Again..the strategy being that the knife is a surprise weapon, and not something you present to your opponent, like in a duel. In a duel.. i would like for my weapon to have some good reach, for obvious reasons, and that would ofc lend itself to long range exchanges, as you suggest, but fact remains, medieval swordplay quite oten becomes a close range contest. That said.. id be happy to look at any content of your suggestion regarding Bowie play.

[@daxmafesi]

@@moparman1692 I’m not talking about half swording, I have a playlist of over 40 modern day duels and the results are the same you can watch it for yourself, long range is the primary range when and if mid range happens it quickly closes and ends up in a grappling match against a weapon, there’s lots of FMA guys who agree and even in dog brothers matches it’s the same results. Long range and grappling range is most important, mid range only happens for a few seconds if it hasn’t already stopped at long range.

[@LionAndALamb]

Based on what we see in MMA, I would say karate (due to the expertise in managing distance and getting in and out of the pocket so quickly, and attacking with kicks instead of hands), and Muay Thai (not as good as managing distance, but a hard guard to penetrate w/o eating a big shot from too many angles to cover, plus the crippling calf kicks). As an amateur, I would defend and try to get wrist control with both hands, and attack with leg and calf kicks. The best you can hope for is the attacker realizing that his best option is to abandon the attack.

[@Sceadusawol]

Matt, it would be great if you could recommend books on bowie knife techniques. Got plenty of resources for rondels, but I figure bowie techniques may well be better for bauernwehr.

[@zigzag913]

fairburn sykes -chair beats knife 9 times out of ten - worked twice for me - although one of those was a broken bottle and we played ring a ring a rosies around a table before he got bored and left

[@MrNicovdw]

what a beauty of a knife you have in your hands , who made it , model ?

[@SmorgasLord]

I have an instructor that know's hema and filipino martial arts so we mix them. Sometimes we throw in some Wing Tsun if it solves a situation.

[@pt109che]

Very interesting perspective of knife fighting, having trained in police/military knife defence techniques and Filipino [Kali] knife fighting system. No exposure to HEMA, but always open minded to learn. Unfortunately, unable to practice knife fighting in my present unit due to lack of partners. Cheers

[@ftdefiance1]

During my police service I responded to a stabbing in progress. The suspect was a fifty plus man in a wheel Chair who cut the heck out of a younger man with a four inch folding knife (Buck.110) The man in the chair was the armed robber! Take the blade and raw aggression seriously.

[@ftdefiance1]

@@Lord_Humungus actually the suspect was!

[@filiphabek271]

Wouldn't it be easy to run away from a man in wheelchair?

[@ftdefiance1]

@@filiphabek271 this was in the 80's but as I recall he rolled up to a apartment demanded property and then stuck him in the leg

[@fredazcarate4818]

Minor correction: the navaja style knife originates in Southern Spain and the Baleric Islands. And it is similar Southern Italian and Sicilian knife fighting. However I thoroughly enjoyed your lecture. 👍👊😎

[@belgoblax1596]

I'm not your target audience by a long shot, Matt. But I do find your talks very engaging and absorbing. A good example of (modesty aside) an enthusiastic expert / knowledgeable teacher presenting an interesting primer into a subject whilst providing useful background knowledge and research for further investigation.

[@vloggingismyhobby]

FMA Filipino Martial Arts. The Kali/Arnis/Eskrima is one the effective on a real Fight Combat. So even if you are an martial expert or MMA. You will not easily defeat the Knife expert with a blade his blade weapon.