Secret Lives: Jeremy Thorpe

[@precioustraveler]

The original commercial breaks were unexpected but utterly charming. 😄

[@misswendy7298]

The irony of Cyril Smith calling Thorpe a 'Jekyll & Hyde' character and full of his own self importance certainly does not go unnoticed

[@npe1]

Exactly wendy stone - Smith was the biggest ego in the north west.

[@rosshilton]

What a disgusting bunch of arrogant arseholes....

[@DorothyGTyas]

*Vomitous creatures!* ☜ 💀

[@EricaNernie]

Just looked Cyril Smith's Wikipedia entry. Ergh. Lots of accusations of molesting boys, always let off by the police, defended by David Steel, and receives an MBE. So your typical upper class malevolent creep, then.

[@MrDaiseymay]

@@npe1 well, he was the biggest everything, that was bad and evil. But, like Heath, he was in a powerful gang of pervs, and protected by Police and MI5

[@aldiboronti]

Interesting to see Cyril Smith interviewed. He had plenty of secrets of his own.

[@malbig2344]

Aye, and David Steele knew about Smith buggering small boys and still let him be an MP.

[@roberthutchins4297]

@@malbig2344 Who says? How do you know ??

[@vincentsmit1935]

He resigned from the Lords over it

[@keeley-jasminecavendish2256]

Vile paedophile who was allegedly covered up by MI5 and senior Liberals/Liberal Democrats

[@davidfoxall3344]

@@roberthutchins4297 Steele admitted that Smith had confessed to him

[@noordinarylives7951]

David Steel really is an odious man. He covered up for the likes of Cyril Smith whilst projecting this air of honesty and reasonableness.

[@keeley-jasminecavendish2256]

Indeed.

[@dianethibault4265]

the self righteous ones are always the most odious

[@Stu-SB]

"He done nothing more than spanked a few bottoms" says Steel !

[@insertclevername4123]

@@dianethibault4265 I think it's in one of the news segments on the Cyril Smith revelations where they show a clip of him from the 70s going on about how there's too much obsession with personality in British politics, and how what's really needed is a return to good old fashioned Christian values.

[@thisperson5294]

​​@@Stu-SBI just read a book about Cyril Smith. He liked his boys tight. As they got older and looser, he stopped r*ping them. I do not know why he is not as hated as Jimmy Savile. I see no difference.

[@sometimeworld1]

Cyril Smith's evil puts whatever Jeremy Thorpe did in the shade.

[@Woodman-Spare-that-tree]

And Ted Heath. Half the Government was at it. They probably still are today. 🤮

[@cBearTV-]

Wow Cyril Smith is certainly not someone who should be lecturing anyone on morality!! If you know a child is at risk ALWAYS Report it.

[@MrDavey2010]

David Steele was a slimey individual. Here he’s denigrating Thorpe yet he actively covered up Cyril Smith’s criminality.

[@starduck8014]

playing the game as they all do

[@markhayward7400]

Lol, you mean David Steel, the former Liberal Party leader, not David Steele, the former England cricketer!

[@starsweeper11]

The only creature I feel sorry for in this crazy story is the poor, innocent dog.

[@HenryMcGuinnessGuitar]

I think Norman Scott had got the dog (a great dane) as protection - he'd been beaten up a few weeks previously. One wonders what the story behind *that* was. I seem to remember that quite a few people attached to this totally bonkers story died in accidents. One wonders if there are further levels of lunacy here left unplumbed, so to speak

[@lisashelley9439]

I agree . the only innocentto suffer. not a dazzling character , more like a greasy wimp

[@anonUK]

kzbin.info/www/bejne/iWqwhJ6XZ9FoZ6M

[@fizzao1342]

Poor Rinka. The only one who had nothing to do with the case.

[@eileenstacey1536]

I know poor rinka,..all norman wanted was his n.i card, and what an evil man jeremy thorpe.just goes to show that money and power got him off ,should have rotted in jail

[@jeanettehinds4253]

None of these politicians regardless of party, can be trusted. How easy they stand and look you in the eye, lying and deceiving and covering each others back.

[@mjm290853]

I remember a comment by Scott " I cried and bit the pillow", he was lucky it was Thorpe giving him one, had it been Cyryl, he'd have bit the mattress

[@stephenroney2366]

OMG. LOL. Maybe Jeremy Thorpe was hung like a horse. Effeminate Gay men are pillow biters. Masculine Gay men are shirt lifters.

[@jater242]

those adverts were a trip.

[@valmarsiglia]

Great episode of a great series -- I love the commercials too, a lot of cultural history in those as well.

[@Sonofwill]

😢😢

[@ossian11]

.. And all for the want of a National Insurance Card. Hugh Grant does a great job of Mr Thorpe in 'A Very English scandal' - an excellent miniseries.

[@rumblefish9]

Absolutely. Grant said that he had a "reptilian" quality and I absolutely see it and Grant did a great job portraying him.

[@keeley-jasminecavendish2256]

I never understood why Mr Scott was not able to obtain a replacement N.I. card. The then Department for Health and Society Security, now D.W.P. had a helpline for lost or stolen cards.

[@aarondavis8943]

@@keeley-jasminecavendish2256 I don't understand a) Why Thorpe possessed it, b) why he refused to give it back, and c) why Scott, as you say, couldn't just claim he lost it to get another one. I do wonder if the entire story was a way for Scott to justify some of his behaviour, for example, writing the letter to Thorpe's mother?

[@sianwarwick633]

I think I would read John Prescott's book about the subject, without trying to decipher Norman Scott's motive

[@andyaim4764]

Without his Establishment contacts Jeremy would have done time!! The law is so unbiased 😞

[@robertmackenzie3995]

It’s now proved that Thorpe was guilty beyond reasonable doubt.

[@Eliza-wj3ft]

OMG - Cyril Smith When you look back at these old Documentaries - you realise how Fowl and Disgusting our Political system has been for decade after decade It's just so tiring and sad

[@socksal]

Great Doc, the Uk adverts are a fantastic bonus.

[@DarkAngel2512]

I literally remember the Ruby Wax one. This doc must be 80s. And the Boots one. Its bringing it back to me

[@brianeduardo1234]

Cyril Smith "He was a Jekyll and Hide character' is ironic in the extreme and David Steel feels HE the was the victim - politicians never fail to disappoint

[@iandander2473]

Lord Steel had to clean up Jeremy's mess and make the party respectable again. It was a tough job.

[@brianeduardo1234]

David Steel was on Newsnight recently and still defending ... have no regard for titles they are fripperies... but thanks for your response

[@tatters1232006]

Looking back on this programme and the interview with Cryil Smith I have to laugh out loud considering what he got up to

[@colinfarren8326]

Some of this reminds me of parts of Little Britain when the minister is outside his mansion reading a statement to alude to the fact that he mistakenly ended up in another mans bottom........on hampstead heath.

[@englishrose1957]

exactly what I thought🤣🤣🤣

[@johnrider3749]

He was only reaching for a Murray mint ,

[@peter9180]

Thorpe got off Scott free.

[@williamwade641]

Who's read the book "Scott of the Arseantics" ?

[@reginaldgraves1684]

Appreciated, they are all good ones!

[@bollockchop501]

They all get off Scott free

[@fozzybear1978]

Very interesting thanks! Also - Secret Lives with contribution from Cyril Smith and narrated by Chris Langham is a little ironic!

[@kawasaki5187]

Couldn't they find a part for Jimmy Savile ? Can you trust David Steel ?

[@chrish12345]

couldnt stop laughing from start to finish, great stuff

[@KKTR3]

fozzybear1978 when you watch this it just makes me think now LBGT as change the world we living in from the inside of society and of state of government of education of the media

[@ciashill9799]

+fozzybear1978 The demand for child porn by postmen to bankers and is very great and growing.

[@geoffpoole9107]

Savile actually campaigned with Jeremy Thorpe. They did a party political broadcast together!

[@FlakFlinger]

Private Eye, I recall, was savage in its view of the trial. The cover featured a shot of Thorpe leaving the court after acqittal, with the headline "Buggers Can't Be Losers".

[@normanby100]

Remind me never to hire Andrew Newton if i want anyone killing. It would be more efficient to hire Laurel and Hardy.

[@leesawford]

lol..or Mr Bean...worse at his job than half the government.

[@frankdsouza2425]

Actually, Andrew Newton much more thoughtful and caring than you think, as anyone who actually knows the real man, will readily confirm.

[@barrybarnes96]

@@frankdsouza2425 He's a dirtbag.

[@EricaNernie]

I have a few targets in mind for some 'wet work', but I may as well do it myself!

[@MrDaiseymay]

Well Quite, they'd have died laughing

[@blacquesjacques7239]

Cyril Smith .... ugh

[@kwaggavoetpad]

And did you see who the narrator is? Irony overload.

[@HundreadD]

Am I crazy or am I getting sort of a double Life on Mars effect from this documentary. The footage and commercials shot in the 90s are like a glimpse into another world, while the interview footage shot in the 70s also seems to come from an entirely different world from the one after it. Crazy how much the world can change in just one lifetime

[@mikemartin2957]

Wonder why the untransmitted LWT documentary made in 1979 about the scandal hasn't been shown? The tape still exists because this programme acknowledges it in 'snippets'.

[@thechatteringmagpie]

It was one of those sad occasions in British politics and history, when the defending council with the full connivance of the judge; enabled the acquittal of three very guilty men.

[@suzannesadiiqa]

He always reminded me of a rather louche second hand car salesman, albeit Bentleys or Rolls Royces from the back streets of Mayfair.

[@brianrodney5202]

.....and would habitually address customers as " Squire ".

[@andypandy4078]

I remember when some drug dealers at raves around London used to say "squire" - thus "what have you got mate ?" 'Mitsis pal" "How much?" "Tenners squire!"

[@sbgleason]

Cyril Smith weighing (no pun) in as a color commentator is quite spectacular.

[@louiseoliver3453]

I'm enjoying the retro ads in the middle!

[@ladygardener100]

It looked like Nigel Kennedy lol. Lyles Golden Syrup, in tins

[@djackmanson]

"Unable to carry out a simple murder plot without cocking the whole thing up"

[@janethollman7894]

Cyril Smith has the audacity to criticise Jeremy Thorpe after his debacle.

[@cordeliahamilton1061]

Paying off Scott with Party funds ! Reminds me of the Trump/ Stormy Daniels situation. Times never change, do they ? And here we are 40 years later.

[@HenryJuhala]

It is that very reason that will help to bring Trump down and out of office. Financial paperwork that is easily traceable in matters such as this is one of the easiest and quickest ways to bring people to trial and found guilty. And Mueller has shown many times in cases like the one against mobster, John Gotti,, that Mueller knows how to do just that.

[@robinc6308]

He used his own money you idiot.

[@robinc6308]

Henry Juhala Care to repost your idiotic reply?

[@olivergallimore3490]

Aged like wine

[@laurallama73]

Movie trailer for, “A Very English Scandal,”brought me here.

[@cbjgdicad1]

Forget the shooting...There are two John le mesurier wtf

[@Dreaded88]

Those commercials are great! *_:D_*

[@drinkwater319]

Chris Langham's voice is good for voice overs......sadly he was the absolute architect of his own downfall. Astonishing what he did and disregarded all warnings many times about his conduct, almost daring fate to go after him.

[@thebennt6130]

Michael Hunt I would be interested to know how Chris came to be chosen for this documentary. Is it a coincidence or were there systems in place that facilitated people involved in criminal sexual activity to be able to work together.

[@SwingRiots]

​@@thebennt6130 I doubt Langham had anything to do with the rest of the programme. Voice overs just go into the studio and record their bit, often over the already edited programme. He did a lot of voice overs for documentaries.

[@davidpyott3710]

The Langham narration is a stunning irony I wonder if he thought there but for the grace of God go I Also interesting how religion is part of the pungent concoction The price of homosexualty was high and the establishment was self aware shall we say.

[@francesriddiough8818]

I think that perhaps Jeremy Thorpe was a narcissist. The signs of ruthlessness and dropping people and discarding them at the drop of a hat. His ambition and need for recognition also are signs. Hmmm.

[@williamfrancis5367]

He did call Cameron out- "a phoney ... a Thatcherite trying to appear progressive".

[@francesriddiough8818]

thats somewhat flippant! are you sure you know about narcissism? not a Word to be brandished fippantly. narcissisism CAN be dangerous......at the very least hurtful........in order to better/save/aggrandise themselves. more often than not,they are cowards covering it all up.

[@OakleyANDSittingBull]

​@@francesriddiough8818, *Hear! HEAR!!!* Thorpe, indeed, was a *vindictive malignant narcissistic personality disordered* abuser.

[@Woodman-Spare-that-tree]

Funny how, with these gay “relationships”, the boyfriend is always half the predator’s age, or even younger.

[@lilianazalew9232]

it is quite common for rich, influential, both hetero and homosexual men to seek out young, vulnerable partners. It is some sick thing of power dynamics

[@rajnasarda]

Thanks for uploading.

[@ianreynolds8552]

This is a case of politicians doing something they should have campaigned to change. The hypocrisy of society s attitudes to gay life.

[@jeremygaynor2410]

Tragedy my arse ... Thorpe was a privileged public school elite .... politics was his stage.... he played a high stakes game and lost.

[@hugohugo2832]

They were all lunatics. Worse then than now. I’ve just finished the book. Cover ups were breathtaking.

[@francaperotti5934]

How close is the series from the book. I was only 8 when this all hit the fan in 79.

[@hugolindum7728]

Bartholomew Horatio Brunel What grade were you in the civil service?

[@hugolindum7728]

Kandy Kandy So apart from lacking in common civility, you haven’t read the book?

[@DorothyGTyas]

*While on the topic of evil:* kzbin.info/www/bejne/pKHCqp-smJ2NoJo ☝🤓

[@brianrodney5202]

He looked like someone from whom I would be wary about buying a used car.

[@rskershawe]

I'm not sure about Hugh Grant playing Thorpe in the forthcoming drama. He will be able to to do affable public side of Thorpe but I think he is too lightweight an actor to portray Thorpe's Machiavellian side. Ben Wishaw as Scott is perfect casting. I wonder who will play Bessel and Justice Cantley? I hope R T Davies and S Frears do a good job here, the story has much potential as a script. I will look forward to seeing it.

[@rumblefish9]

This did not age very well, at all. Grant not only excelled as Thorpe but also received multiple nominations for this performance (he should have won). He was able to capture Thorpe's mannerisms. Grant said Jeremy had a very "reptilian" quality and I absolutely see that. The whole series is excellent.

[@vino140]

And Thorpe was protected...like the Cambridge spies--.

[@JoeStunner]

"We didn't vote Liberal to put Ted Heath back in power." And some of us didn't vote Liberal to put Cameron in power...

[@g-r-a-e-m-e-]

Yet you did.

[@williamfrancis5367]

And some people didn't vote Labour for the Tories to get in bed with the DUP.

[@stellathefella]

and dont forget joe, nobody at all voted for gordon brown. he slipped in through the back door if you will excuse the pun

[@ianjarrett2724]

Heath was another suspect bastard.

[@ianjarrett2724]

Better than that bearded Labour Union twat Corbyn or Wallace and Gromit!

[@TheLastOilMan]

An establishment cover up. What a surprise !

[@657111221]

But not as sinister as the Madeleine McCann cover up.

[@bankzie]

Thanks dude, please keep 'em coming

[@harrydebastardeharris987]

He always reminded me of a bent estate agent or posh second hand car salesman,even before his eventual downfall.Whatever his sexuality or politics.He was the first of the Rotten Row Eton Swill that is tearing the UK apart now.

[@tooleyheadbang4239]

He was a bit like James T Kirk... They both wanted more thrust from Scotty.

[@stephenroney2366]

I remember even in Primary 4 or 5 boys asking each other, "Are you a Jeremy(Thorpe) or a Norman (Scott)? Of course it was all above our heads. I think some older boys in Primary 7 (11 and 12 year olds) probably started this.

[@YTChiefCritic]

If a blackmailer cannot be silenced, then the ultimate route is the only way to go.

[@popazz1]

Thorpe always reminded me of the character, Arthur Daley, played by George Cole in the TV series ' Minder ' co-starring Dennis Waterman. A dodgy used car salesman always on the wrong side of the law and the local gangsters. Interesting that now this tawdry and damaging affair between him and Scott is now airing on BBC 1, with Hugh Grant as Thorpe and Ben Wishaw as Scott.

[@popazz1]

Kandy Kandy ...... Really, is this your little pleasure, correcting people?! And whatever you think of Scott, and however much you wish to laud Thorpe, he DID treat Scott like shit and wanted him out of the way when his sordid secret life was to be exposed. Go lay flowers on Thorpe's grave if you're so in awe of the hideous creep.

[@popazz1]

Yawn, whatever.

[@iandander2473]

@Kandy: I know. Scott was crazy as fuck. I felt bad for Jeremy, he could've been big, but Scott the creepy loser wouldn't go away or shut up.

[@OakleyANDSittingBull]

​@@iandander2473, Again, it's interesting how much you identify with deceptive, self-centred criminal, Thorpe. It's *​very telling* about what *you are.* Thorpe was a *vindictive, malignant narcissistic personality disordered* abuser.

[@frankdsouza2425]

@@OakleyANDSittingBull You obviously have inside information, - known to no-one else!!

[@Dabhach1]

Davis Steel -- "We (the Liberals) were at our lowest level, and it couldn't continue." Cuts to Cyril Smith...

[@jammyjay917]

It's a real shame Thorpe was like this, as he did do good for the people of North Devon. Politics and politician's...... don't think you can trust any of them.

[@MrDaiseymay]

Remember--Power Corrupts, Absolute power, Corrupts Absolutely.

[@davidoneill9244]

{ity Cyril Smith was involved in the programme. He was the lowest of the low!

[@thebennt6130]

And.... The vicar held a service of thanksgiving. 'This is the day that the Lord have gave.'

[@keeley-jasminemaxinecavend9780]

Yet apart from Thorpe's family, the only other members of the congregation were journalists. Apparently, Thorpe had also hired the village hall to relay broadcasting from the church. No-one turned up and the hall was completely empty.

[@JumieTV]

A very English scandal brought me here.

[@gopherfacts6915]

Has Norman got his Ni card yet?

[@Compleme_Cunm]

Rinka was keeping it safe for him towards the end

[@gopherfacts6915]

@@Compleme_Cunm Grrrr

[@bascet1]

Not cool enough to be a musician, not talented enough to be a footballer, ladies and gentlemen I give you the politician. Fame hounds the lot of them.

[@williaminavanbottle9297]

The irony being... It's men from class and political positions such as this individual... That influence the passing of laws.

[@j0nnyism]

His crimes seem quite tame these days particularly when compared to some of his compatriots. Politics is a dirty business

[@williamevans9426]

Good grief - Jeremy Thorpe and Cyril Smith in one documentary!

[@Finians_Mancave]

I'm sorry, tried to pay him off with 5 and 7 pound payments? I get that this was in the 70s, but we're still talking about ridiculously paltry amounts.

[@bbq4126]

Nah this was £5-7 in 1970s money

[@MarlaLukofsky7]

Watching this brings up the hateful, self-loathing thoughts and attitudes of being gay or having gay relationships. It's saddening to watch. I hope things are greatly advanced to understanding that love is love no matter who it's between as long as they are consenting adults. We need more of that love.

[@hgriff10]

homophobic idiot, have no fear.

[@RiaLake]

It wasn't love in this case!

[@Johnconno]

What about the 🐕?

[@tonygilder7912]

Marla It ain't love in a public toilet honey.

[@mohammedbedsapour7503]

Marla Lukofsky Don't be ridiculous. it is the lying and mistreatment of his wife and lovers was well as the cover ups that brings out the negative feelings. after all he opened himself up to blackmail jeopardizing the Security of the country. The suspicious death of his wife...whom he did not love. But no one cares if he is a gay man. Not unless of course you are muslim. As I know all to well what happens to lesbian and gay men in Islam.

[@adrianaleon7413]

I even enjoy the commercials.. thanks

[@markstanton63]

Rumour has it that the pillowcase which contained the pillow that Norman tremulously bit into on the night of their consummation is now living under a witness protection programme as a novelty tea-towel in North Wales.

[@markstanton63]

It was either that or relocate to Scotland. As if it haden't suffered enough!

[@markstanton63]

@Paul Gavin probably got auctioned off to raise funds for the Lib Dems .

[@janelow2613]

I think they should have taken out the Cyril Smith contributions, now we all know about HIM !!!

[@DBIVUK]

Who's 'they'? This programme was made in 1996, before the full story of Cyril Smith was known.

[@Merlin-lc4zu]

Why ?.To pretend it never happened or to appease the easily offended.Quite an apt comment considering he was a Liberal.

[@eakherenow]

Your asking this horrible man if he is bitter?

[@aarondavis8943]

I've never understood why Thorpe had possession of Norman Scott's insurance card and why he refused to return it.

[@DBIVUK]

Michael Bloch's biography of Thorpe explains it. Scott's complaints about his National Insurance card were in reality attempts to keep other people supporting him. He originally came to Jeremy Thorpe complaining that Norman Vater had stolen (or retained) his National Insurance card. When Thorpe found Scott a job at a riding school in Minehead in late 1962, Scott first asked Thorpe to get him a new National Insurance card, and Thorpe did so; Scott immediately claimed never to have received it. Scott quite often pointed out that the card would show that Thorpe had been his employer (although it's more likely that his employer was North Devon Liberal Association, for whom Scott was paid for election work). However Scott's claim carried to Thorpe an implied threat that the card would be written proof of their association and evidence to back up Scott's story if he was to go to the papers.

[@colinfarren8326]

"I fell on top of him and a part of me........entered him"

[@jiji1946]

who said that then? rings a bell.....

[@DCFunBud]

I don't understand this whole insurance card business. Thorpe held onto Norman Scott's insurance card and would not return it. As a result, Scott could not work. Why did Thorpe do this? Why didn't Scott just apply for a replacement card?

[@DBIVUK]

Most likely explanation for this situation: Scott needed a reason to keep in contact with Thorpe (for psychological reasons as well as the prospect of getting financial help), and convinced himself that Thorpe had retained his National Insurance card in order to give himself an excuse to contact Thorpe.

[@thebennt6130]

DCFunBud I am actually wondering whether Scott wanted Thorpe to make contributions to his National Insurance, similar to that of an employer. It is my understanding that in the 50's and early 60's people who were home makers but not actually married sometimes referred to themselves as a housekeeper and the housekeeping money as the wages. So that he would not fall behind in his National Insurance it seems Scott wanted Thorpe to make contributions to this. There are parallels between this and MP's who employ their wives as their searchers. I think this has been banned though at the time many MPs probably employed the people they were involved in relationships with.

[@WestieDoodle]

he needed the N.I card back from JT in order to claim benefit when he was out of work. JT had employed Scott. However, JT refused to return it as he didn't want there to be any evidence of a connection with NS.

[@patrickraftery1815]

DCFunBud it didn't make any sense to me either,it made Thorpe look guilty.unless it was pettiness cause Scott had the letters.

[@thebennt6130]

Pooper dooperPatrick Raftery If you think of the insurance card as the equivalent to a p45, then it makes sense. If Thorpe gave this to Scott, then he would have to admit to employing him, when in fact he had not employed him, he had just given him some money towards his living expenses in the manner that you might if someone was your partner. As it was then illegal to engage in homosexual activity and also not considered an appropriate lifestyle for an MP, there was no way Thorpe was going to admit to this. The insurance card would have required Thorpe to document the payments made to Scott for tax purposes and pay an employers national insurance contribution for Scott. It did not make Thorpe look guilty because no one believed Scott. The reason that the judge called Scott a blackmailer was because he believed that the sex was consensual and that Scott was using this to extort money from Thorpe at a time when gay sex was illegal and sodomy between heterosexuals was also illegal.

[@amandajones6481]

I'm watching this from Melbourne, Australia and it's fascinating, almost a comedy of errors!! I was born in England, in 1968, in Richmond on Thames, but my parents and I came out here to Oz in 1974, which was before the scandal broke I think. What year did Jeremy Thorpe have to resign from the Liberal Party? And do you believe that the Liberal Party in Britain failed because of the scandal? It certainly couldn't have helped matters! My father remembers it, as it was all over the news here. The whole Jeremy Thorpe/Norman Scott affair (and by affair I mean the whole thing, not their sexual relationship) happened during a rather curious period in recent history - on the one hand, the world was, or seemed to be, a very modern place, but on the other, as the affair demonstrated, the upper classes still seemed to believe that they had certain inalienable rights, and that one of these was the right to do, and say, pretty much what they wanted, without any repercussions. And it also seems that they DID have such rights.I can hear dissension as I write, and I would love to hear another view on this, as I am no expert!

[@dianethibault4265]

Paul Gavin. Your observations sound pretty expert to me. The uppper classes have always enjoyed unearned privileges in the UK, which is one of the nations great demerits. Outwardly it seemed to have changed, but in essence it has not changed much. Upper class denizens no longer shoot grouse on Scottish muirs, but their present day counterparts still sneer at everyone else from their eyries in Whitehall and their drawing rooms in Islington and Highgate. In a sense, the present day toffs are worse, as the elite in the past truly loved their country, which is no longer the case.

[@normanby100]

The Liberals were already a minority party. By the mid seventies, under Thorpe, they were actually doubling their seats in the commons. At the first 74 election, they were tantalisingly close to power in an alliance with Ted Heath seeking a majority after narrowly losing to Labour,

[@andrewbaird7834]

Quite Ironic Having Chris Langham On Narration Duties Turns Out he Had His Own Dark Secrets Too Didn't He

[@agr7879]

So who did shoot the dog...?

[@zulkiflijamil4033]

Hello David , thanks for the upload. I have watched this particular video for three times but at the end I still couldn't fully understand maybe it is about politics . Any way I enjoyed watching it.

[@DarkRyeOrganic_Au]

It's a fascinating piece of history about another fascinating piece of history but my g-d it's rough going trying to get through the Cyril Smith excerpts. Foul man.

[@zulkiflijamil4033]

...very refreshing figure on the political scene....very charismatic ....quote unquote

[@seanbruce2425]

Sad, he was just gay and all crap fell upon him and friends

[@davidbarker5941]

Thanks for sharing this. It’s most interesting.

[@kevacoombes5585]

Had identical thought as that of Fozzy Bear and also would suspect that given the practical changes brought about by the revision of right to silence and the Defendants would probably be advised to give evidence the result would likely be different today

[@peterbradshaw8018]

Homosexuality was never illegal homosexual conduct was.

[@DBIVUK]

A distinction without a difference, because the laws against importuning criminalised merely smiling at someone in a toilet - that was all the 'homosexual conduct' that was needed to put you in jail.

[@peterbradshaw8018]

A very important distinction as once a homosexual was celibate and didn't go looking for relationships well the courts couldn't launch an inquisition. .Besides once homosexuals were discreet like John Maynard Keynes they stayed out of trouble. Numbers of homosexuals kept it under raps in the very House of Parliament. Only the insane would go out advertising themselves by cottaging or engaging in indiscreet activities like importuning.

[@colinoverton8897]

I think Peter Cook put it best!

[@GertrudePerkins]

Colin Overton ...That he did! 😃 Peter Cook is very sadly missed.

[@davidwilkinson3302]

Norman Scott was the victim in this sordid affair and he still has not received justice.

[@aaropajari7058]

They were both manipulators.

[@KenHumphrey1]

Quite a sad story

[@weeooh1]

I came here after watching an episode of A Very English Scandal. When politicians become desperate, they tend to lose any redeeming qualities.

[@auto_math]

So weird to see Cyrill Smith.

[@artemiszeus9735]

FIrstly, it is a horrific narrative against a backdrop of potential criminal recourse and social ruination if you were out as gay and that is a situation that has only changed very recently. This of itself became a tragedy for all concerned including the women in the lives of both men. Thorpe’s qualities when expressed positively were those of an alpha male with the stoicism of an upper-class background. He was gregarious, flamboyant, had a lust for life and was a tremendous politician who would take on issues that many wouldn’t. Scott’s qualities when expressed positively, are more gentle, creative and with a caring affinity with animals and all with a sparkling sprinkling of party boy for good measure. He does have however a strong quiet presence. He is a steel magnolia if you will. Matters turn toxic when anyone’s strengths are taken too far and to a pathological level. Thorpe’s qualities could easily morph into arrogance, preying on vulnerable young men for sexual gratification “going for the jugular”, stepping on toes/heads, making and dumping friends, hiring a hitman to solve a problem and treating people whichever way he saw fit as long as it fitted in with Project Jeremy. Scott’s qualities could morph into stubborn self-destructiveness, lack of self-respect, fecklessness, an unclear view of who he was, drifting and clinging on to any dinghy in a storm and expecting others to carry or save him and using his allure to elicit sympathy (and money). Their union was a catastrophe waiting to happen. Scott discovered to his cost that youth, beauty and allure are visas that run out fast when nothing else is on the table and that Thorpe had simply become tired of carrying him. Scott had also become frustrated with being a kept man. He did not have the self-esteem to let go and give Jeremy and the past the proverbial two fingers they probably deserved. That said, I am suspicious of the fact that Thorpe would not give him his National Insurance card. Surely, it would have been easier than what actually took place. Did he simply want a final vestige of control over him even if he didn’t want him in his life or if the affiliation was to end, was it to end on his terms?

[@DarkAngel2512]

I'd say being gay publicly was prob ok from the 90s. But I prob didnt pick up on those sorts of things back then. I remember the gay kiss in Brookside and a tiny bit of uproar about it being shown before the watershed.

[@francaperotti5934]

It has come to light that the 1st man hired to kill scott that he called radio 2 for a Phone in and he know newman is still alive abd still living in the same place.

[@SaintMartins]

LOL, he goes out to murder another "human being" with no remorse & reflecting back his only regret is....27:57 !

[@DorothyGTyas]

*Sykphux will be sykphux!* ☜💀

[@mikebaum5301]

Secret lives...Cyril Smith...

[@Baskerville22]

"There's a CAMP bed in the wardrobe - get it out and sleep on it" -

[@malcolmdale]

Very interesting but a pity you couldn't edit out the advertisements.

[@domtiv5915]

A certain irony lies with the person narrating.

[@meli2180]

All of these peoples lives were stained and wasted because of homophobia... That's tragic.

[@Bluetoothedshark]

Anyone know what year this doc was first broadcast. Mad to see the changes in advertising, we certainly have it thrust down our throats these days, no pun intended.

[@DBIVUK]

As it says in the info, the documentary was transmitted on 18 November 1996.

[@Bluetoothedshark]

@@DBIVUK thanks for that, fyi, don't know where in the info it says that, but I don't see it on Android app

[@brylcreemy]

Ah, politics. I do so despise them.

[@bojack40]

B Mandel and like so many, by talking a juvenile binary and prejudiced view, you abdicate all responsibility within the democracy. You are part of the problem

[@greggi47]

Would much of the trouble have been avoided if Thorpe had simply returned Scott's National Insurance card?

[@DBIVUK]

Surprisingly little. There's a good explanation in Michael Bloch's biography of Thorpe. Scott's complaints about his National Insurance card were in reality attempts to keep other people supporting him. He originally came to Jeremy Thorpe complaining that Norman Vater had stolen (or retained) his National Insurance card. When Thorpe found Scott a job at a riding school in Minehead in late 1962, Scott first asked Thorpe to get him a new National Insurance card, and Thorpe did so; Scott immediately claimed never to have received it. Scott quite often pointed out that the card would show that Thorpe had been his employer (although it's more likely that his employer was North Devon Liberal Association, for whom Scott was paid for election work). However Scott's claim carried to Thorpe an implied threat that the card would be written proof of their association and evidence to back up Scott's story if he was to go to the papers.

[@greggi47]

@@DBIVUK Thanks.

[@aaropajari7058]

@@DBIVUK Superb book. Reading it now.

[@i.mar.6563]

I Remember when the scandal broke I was only 12 and didn't know the meaning of it all or the word "Homosexual So I asked my Mam and she told me Do you know th way your dad and I live and love each other? I said Yeah, and she said Well homosexuals do that men love and live with men, And I remember thinking to myself and saying "Oh bot Scott and Thorpe were puffs" I was only a kid and didn't understand political scandals

[@DogShitRecords]

howmany people have political parties had assasinated,, in the past who knows ,controlled opposition scott got lucky,