SECRETS Behind The Peace Conference Mechanics - Hearts of Iron 4 By Blood Alone

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[@CoconutsWithDrag]

Never had a problem with the conferences system. Its the AI contesting random lands that you need but don’t have the points for and how the game assigns war score, it’s better, but not good enough. Also why can’t I give puppets/liberated lands outside of their main cores?

[@rafabajcer2556]

Devs said that giving land (other than cores) to newly created nations is impossible due to some technical limitations in code. So unfortunately, it will probably never be possible.

[@lars9925]

@@rafabajcer2556 It was possible right before the patch, so it can't really be the code

[@mainman879]

@@lars9925 That's assuming anything of the old code remains. The new peace deal system could be made from scratch and come with that issue built in.

[@NoymoHD]

@@mainman879 that's a boomer since now you cannot create reichmittleafrika with zimbawe

[@rafabajcer2556]

@@lars9925 Before the patch system was completely different, now they changed it on a code level. Anyway if devs say that now it is impossible because of code, I assume they are telling the truth.

[@RebelRenegade76]

I despise the set counter of points, I find that sometimes I can’t annex certain lands because I run out of points so quickly.

[@haukionkannel]

Yes! You can not annex everything! You have to also use other options.

[@ratkovac7]

Its clear as day this DLC wasent play tested enough or at all. The biggest 3 problems with the peace deals right now in my opinion are : 1. AI contesting random provinces 2. Not having enough war score in a 1v1 peace confrence to do everything you want. I think by passing after the first 5 turns you should get more points. 3. Not being able to give lands to a created puppet in that confrence resulting in having multiple puppets made out of one country. When i played Italy there were at one point three "italian north american territories".

[@etherealhawk]

Can't you use the beneficiaries tab

[@paulthiede]

The biggest problem of peace conferences rn is, that you arent able to give territory to nations u puppeted / liberated during the peace conference. This is unlike the old system; now you can just give all nations their cores and can't make the borders how you want them to look. You basically have to rely on mods like Toolpack for the game to be fun, which disables Ironman and career profile points

[@CaptJPurdie]

Beneficiaries tab has what you're looking for.

[@paulthiede]

@@CaptJPurdie u cant select those nations there tho, or has this been changed?

[@CaptJPurdie]

@@paulthiede idk about earlier patches as am just getting back into game now, but bittersteel demonstrated this in more recent video so...

[@paulthiede]

@@CaptJPurdie i just tried it. u cant actually select beneficiaries. u can only select war participants, but for example, if you defeated yugoslavia and created croatia in the peace conference, you arent able to give them bosnia, cause u cant select them

[@CaptJPurdie]

@@paulthiede yeah I just did ahistorical and I can see what you're saying. I know there IS a way to do that though. I know because I just accidentally created 2 separate tiny Ethiopian puppet empires as Germany in 1938 after Italy went democratic and guaranteed a treacherous Hungary that got a bit too Austria hungry. 😂 So... How did I even manage to give them each other's land by mistake if it ain't possible? Idk... But I must've clicked somewhere.,.. Am in ironman rn, will get back to you if I figure it out after the big war.

[@xmagnacarta]

Only thing i hate about the new conferences is the fact, that puppeting a nations turns it into for example "German Poland" and not Generalgouvernment anymore -_- plus the color changes (all of europe was blue in a game as USA after i puppeted them all)

[@derthcobra9765]

the only problem I have with the latest peace conference is that the amount of times that I've run out of war score in a solo war and couldn't completely take all the territory is like once a game. This appears to happen when you call allies but they have 0% war participation. the game just won't give you enough score after 5 turns to actually take all the territory you fought for.

[@derthcobra9765]

Now I will say that I haven't played hoi4 since the patch where they said they had fixed that issue but I hope it's fixed

[@ianmiller8399]

One problem with the system is that nations can become majors if they have a certain percentage of the factories of the existing majors. This means as you occupy factories of a major it lowers the threshold for nations to become majors. This leads to nations getting major status right before a major capitulates It also doesn’t help that France will be capitulated in a lot of games lowering the threshold.

[@Chris-wy1wh]

The thing is, I hate the conferences because once you have multiple Ai's, they really start to fight over certain stuff, and then don't take other states, while creating the worst bordergore ever, so you might get the Axis capping the Aliies (I'll get to this later) and then the UK's mainland gets compleatly dissolved, while they still exist in some random island in the middle of the pacific. (Now to Axis capping Allies) - Paradox hasn't fixed the majors system! You cap the UK, but then India becomes a major, so you don't even enter the peacedeal in the first place!!! This makes actually getting certain factions to capitualte a nightmare (especially Aliies) because you have to capitulate some Island on the other side of the world (In the case of the Allies, whilest having the entirety of UK's fleet about to sink all of your marines) THIS IS WHY I HATE PEACEDEALS SPECIFICALLY - YOU CAN NEVER EVEN ENTER ONE

[@Chris-wy1wh]

Sorry for the rant btw

[@xenosfur]

They should really add other types of peace like you have in literally every other paradox game. Yeah, the war won't end till one side dies but is random minor countries like Philippines or Venezuela being considered "Majors" really have continued a war... A semi capitulation of enemy countries should result in some surrender, like in Japan's case, where you can white peace if you kick them out. Maybe not for Majors but Minors should definitely have a white peace option if all other Majors have been capped. Its more realistic than straight up annexing Australia and New Zealand who I never even touch.

[@Cmoehlman12]

I just use the peacedeal mod that let's me make demands or give up stuff for peace, works ok

[@ianmiller8399]

Do you even understand why it happens? It is because you can get majors if the nation has a certain percentage of the avg. factory count of the existing majors. This ends up meaning that as you take factories from a major you lower the factory count needed to get a new major.

[@xenosfur]

@@ianmiller8399 That or you conquer the majors leaving only the Minors which have no choice to take over. But it still makes 0 sense that a 30 total factory country counts as a major just because its the only other country left with factories.

[@chibertarian]

I see how it is. It's a Halloween episode so you have to jumpscare us with some bordergore over in canada for the end.

[@staven512]

I'm a parent with young kids. The changes in the conference left a bad taste in my mouth. I spent my precious few hours playing the new DLC just for the new conference mechanics to mess up me up enough I quit that game and have refused to join a faction since.

[@benjamin_w.]

AI should ask for peace deals and we should be able to demand claims. Without having to go through total capitulation

[@MrMichaelBCurtis]

toggle box to remove stuff that has already been taken, yes, but you can still retake that stuff, it isn't resolved until everyone is finished, you can change your mind about previously taken areas

[@SLKoolKats]

Just subscribed due to this video. Second half answered so many questions

[@akasperowicz]

It is not even close to be fixed - it is common to not be able to take land that is not taken, but other parites of confernece do not want it. You just have to leave it. So frustrating.

[@JurasJankauskas]

The reason why it still shows states that have been claimed and uncontested, is that you can contest claims that were uncontested in the previous rounds if you have the extra points for it. Basically, if germany takes Paris at round 1 and you pass the turn, you can still press a claim for Paris, but with each round that it was uncontested, the price of contesting the claim will rise higher and higher.

[@juvandy]

Yep, was going to say this too. A toggle box would only work if it showed the things you could no longer afford, not thing that had been 'taken'.

[@GReznov]

he knows that, he's not asking them to disappear, he's asking a "filtering box" where you select filters for states so you just see what you're looking for (maybe with a place to search names so you don't have to scroll no more)

[@InkydoodleVR]

I just won my first war in HOI4, I feel so happy now.

[@frankunderbush]

The weirdest thing is, often times in conquered nations it's marginally cheaper to annex instead of puppet. I wonder what's the calculation that goes into it. Personally I even tried to capitulate all minors in Allies before UK and it still didn't seem change the costs by much.

[@quoras1887]

Claims reduce the cost of annaxing a state

[@tannerunderwood264]

Love your vids Dave, but you told me exactly what I needed to hear in the first 45 seconds and it’s an 18 minute vid😂

[@Vaelosh466]

The new system is easy enough to understand, but at least to me it keeps leading to not having enough points to deal with the entire capitulated government so I'm always ending up with one or two states that I can't take where I have to do the EUIII thing of waiting for the truce to expire and finishing them off. For example, I entered a war against the UK about a year after Germany started it (after I had capitulated Germany but they had more major allies, lul), between me and all the Central Powers members we didn't have enough points to get every UK state (or the AI just wasn't taking them, no idea, but I did end up with mosaic Canada). The UK government still existed on Newfoundland with them holding Egypt and Sudan (which I guess they immediately puppeted since they couldn't garrison them). What this ultimately meant is that I had to wait for the unbreakable truce to run out before finishing off the UK, since I needed Egypt. The immediate fix for this is just to give people more points, or add back infinite point scaling. Maybe something that the navy and other specialty options become unavailable after turn 5 if they don't want people exhausting every possible peace term they can impose. Another option would be that any land that is actively occupied flips to the occupier if nobody claims it in the peace conference.

[@funbucket09]

Having the navy etc become unavailable after turn 5 sounds good in theory, but that just means that people will take the navy first and then keep passing until they annex everything.

[@Holypikemanz]

My confusion with peace conferences was just the fact that I have to click the country to submit demands, I thought making demands and then leaving the peace conferences would submit the demands but no.

[@nickstoneham5629]

I think the issues really start arising when you have 20 or so nations in a peace conference. Any peace deal involving a victorious Allies does feel like a big free for all. And do you know if they fixed it where you can take states from those in a civil war?

[@matiasdiaz8913]

very nice, now do the same thing but with all the axis powers in the same deal

[@xXxMonkeyBoomxXx]

Nothing feels like when conquering France, Uk, czecho, yugoslavia, romania, belgium, netherlabds and all uk dominions, just for my puppet ethiopia with 5% war score to steal half of the world and then some more. Love you paradox, thanks G i guess ? Also paradox: oh you have 95% war score as Italy ? Best i can do, is one Island of Malaiysa. (THERE ARE TWO)

[@funbucket09]

The stuff that has already been taken is still showing because you can re-contest it later in the conference if you feel like it (for some reason). IF there is something I really want I just wait until the AI has used up all of its points on other turns and then contest their bid when they can't afford to outbid me anymore. Not sure if that is a bug or it is supposed to work like that (I feel if you forfit something you shouldn't be able to change your mind and say you want it again).

[@evilsnowball]

Its always fun when the game shows you up like that.

[@rysph9945]

Maybe a different highlight color based on puppet or annexing etc. it would in theory be an easy thing to do and make it a lot clearer IMO.

[@Stouzough]

Thanks for explaining. One final important note is about remaining points: what we don't understand is that after fighting for some territories, points are exhausted, and a country that lost war can still survive, unchanged albeit probably reduced in size. Shouldn't winners of the war be able to bid until all territories from losing side have been treated (annexed/puppeted/changed)?

[@funbucket09]

I guess from a realism perspective you could argue that the losing side feels that didn't have enough damage done to them to unconditionally surrender to the enemy but just want to stop the fighting. But if that is the case, their should be an option to continue fighting 'peace conference fails' with a counter option for the loser to say 'ok you win we won't fight anymore'

[@aidanjones4067]

I love that Mosley ended up in Affrica somehow

[@Kaiser282]

I don't have the dlc, I wasn't able to puppet all of Yugoslavia as Bulgaria when I called my puppets in. Paaaaiiiin.

[@supernovatv9514]

I kinda miss being able to transfer land to my puppets in the peace deal

[@keshet2002]

I really love the new peace conferences. Once you get it, it isn't that complicated

[@ArchAngelOfficialCh]

Can you do a new Japan video. I’m a Japan one trick and now that I can’t join the axis in single player the cracked strat is gone. Apparently no one’s has done a Blood alone Japan video and im super struggling. ISP did a video recently but it was before the update.

[@quoras1887]

You didnt really understand the peace conferences, did you? All states are still availiable to click on because you can contest their claims too, they are not taken until the peace conference is over. Even if you forfeit a claim you can later contest again if you got more points. Also something to note: Claims reduce the cost of states massivly so you should get claims through focuses and if you justify manually its now actually worth because the land gets cheaper.

[@RunicRhino22]

5:53 Well, it could be exploited if you let them do focuses for factories and then annex them.

[@haukionkannel]

Yeah! You can really make good peace conferences, but you have to be really careful! And understand what each button does...

[@a.ricole4081]

How do i give land to the puppets Ive formed DURING the very peace conference? So basically id like to give territory to beneficiary(?)

[@craig7405]

i have a problem where the game crashes whenever i try taking a navy, even though i have dockyards. can anyone help me?

[@eliaslopez2740]

I think one of the most op things about this peace conference, is that if you puppet India without taking ALL of their territories, that creates two Indias, the original one and the puppet which won't have any debuff, agrarian society that gives them -69 reclutable pop. Basically you can have a Chinese-like amount of manpower as India.

[@sral8769]

Peace conferences suck, i just want to keep all territories that I've liberated regardless of any war participation score

[@londonsmith1990]

Your examples were fairly simple peace conferences. That being said, The last one still had issues. To me, this just highlights the problem with the new system. I don't hate it. I think it's better than the old system overall. But it's not perfect. I hope paradox put some work into making the AI understand the system better.

[@infini_ryu9461]

I think I'll just forever use player-led peace conferences, the AI just infuriates me to no end with their choices.

[@freezer20cm64]

They "kinda fix it" before the "patch" it works like in 50% of peacedeals now its like mb 80% but its still 20% when its not working. I played 3 games as US and all 3 times nether i or China manage to take all Japanese lands before we run out of points. Sometimes Japan continue to exist even in french indochina.

[@iris_irlydntk]

the player-led peace conference mod is a must have at this point

[@gamidragon]

I finally reached a WW2 peace conference a couple days ago, and honestly it was really nice. SO much better than the old system. Once you've used it a bit, it really is quite intuitive and functional. I'm excited to play more games and actually finish the war to shape the world~

[@basedpatriarch]

Why does it cost as much to puppet or even satellite?

[@jeremielarin1979]

I am surprised that you can’t make additional demands on a independent contry.

[@Kilgorio]

Wow

[@Xeemix]

Also predicting postwar beef and demilitarizing zones have saved my ASS

[@fele09]

can you tell me the use of demilitarizing zone. Cant get the use of it in the game :(

[@Xeemix]

@@fele09 Its to prevent military units from going in a designated area, the game doesn't allow it!

[@fele09]

@@Xeemix Thanks. A follow up, does war militarize the zone again?

[@Xeemix]

@@fele09 yes, I should also say it prevents certain military buildings being built there as well.

[@thesilentninja9255]

Don't necessarily hate peace conferences, hate how the game will sometimes allow third parties to claim land from me that I had already concuered and had peace deals concluded while not even in the war that the new conference is about.

[@Dante-mr3rz]

Try that without By Blood Alone dlc. It's still a clustercluck.

[@jaredmurage6173]

I play man the guns and my Italian puppet kept on contesting with France over Tunisia France wanted to liberate Tunisia but Italy wanted to give it back to France 😭😭😭

[@mrr9636]

Do resource rights expire if the countries become hostile?

[@szekspir98]

Finaly end of vic3 shait

[@memazov6601]

The update should be renamed to By Gore alone

[@wntu4]

I wish you would just use the base game for these. Not everyone has or wants all the DLCs

[@Xeemix]

Me the guy who always plays minors making out like a BANDIT when I take navies from under peoples noses HAHAHA

[@ogerpinata1703]

Peace deals still suck. Therefore use player led peace conferences. To me this solves everything and because I don't care about achievements Iron Man doesn't matter to me.

[@burch8400]

Player Let Peace Conferences is not an improvement, it lets you take everything you want and that breaks the game for me.

[@malcolmduncan]

We have a very different definition of beautiful 😂

[@Piddzle3]

0:48 you can just use op for short I believe

[@SonofAlbion]

The multi party (even just two victor) pease deal mechanics are still a joke. I especially loath you or the AI can go back to contesting regions after you have ‘forfeited’ them in earlier turns. Occupation needs to reduce cost/ increase it for other parties to take from you (I bleed for it and my divisions are on it so it’s bloody mine alright?!?!) Securing claims from focus need to be automatic and not contestable by AI: it’s in my tree and I did the focus so it should be mine

[@tuxanar]

Having the Empire of Emu as a puppet miss me... More seriously, i had liked create demilitarized zone, take war reparation or destroy military industry, not only in a puppet, but also in an independant country (sorry for mistakes, english isn't my native language)

[@forresterscalan3921]

Wrong I hate these peacedeals with ai just not with players. It gives a lot of tools that players can use to create cool borders and puppets with each other. But I still think ai the need improvement with the new system. But I really like the new system over all. Making puppets then demanding war reparations stealing all their civs and resource rights taking all their resources is really op. You can create a supercharged soviet union by invading turkey and Romania at the start and take their civs. And Romanian oil to starve the axis into trading with you for the whole war till barb.

[@yws152]

this should be in base game

[@KokenyRichard]

Why is the game 3-4 times slower than before?😭 I have to go back to No Step Back to have the game playable. Anyone else experiencing this?

[@haukionkannel]

Noup.. I did play to 1947 and game speed was really good! I think better than before. Maybe this new system like relative new hardware more? I have x679 with 3700x and 5700XT, 32Gb of system memory and it is running like a charm!

[@KokenyRichard]

@@haukionkannel Good for you brou

[@haukionkannel]

@@KokenyRichard Yeah... I have seen these comment of slow game play after BBA and there has to be new bottle neck, because for me the game was less speedy before the update. Maybe extra memory is now more useful than before?

[@Wolf-Rayet_Arthur]

Ethree-opia

[@darraghmckane4016]

Wrong we do want to create wacky scenarios the real problem is I can't puppet individual tiles

[@dumatrising2421]

Good explanation, I like the conference myself much better than the old system. I think paradox gamers just complain about anytime they don't immediately understand how something works despite playing games that can take days of play just to figure out how to do the basic stuff. Couple of comments: they can't get rid of the taken states on the side bar becuase you can contest any of them even after Germany claims them. Also when there's a refund of warscore becuase of contested demands it's not a full refund, hover over the refund amount when the contested demands pops up and I'll tell you how much was lost. Each time there's a contest the ratio of points lost increases

[@arya.n.8252]

New peace conference mindset: Play as Germany,defeat allies early, take their navy, occupied continental Europe, puppet UK, change government in malaya and east Indies but take all their resources right, don't get invaded by Japan + dominate the sea + easy barb + all the rubber is mine

[@Lich_V.]

You could do the exact same thing with the old system.

[@ironhandsapothecaryecdanes8127]

Hey Feedback, you do exploits, well I found an amazing exploit for every achievement in the game. I’ll let you handle it to figure it out 😉

[@v.7232]

I love the new system. Played as germany, the return of the kaiser path, and got by via the system the navy of the italians and other smaller countries. Making sealion a cakewalk.

[@Lich_V.]

Well, sealion was allways a cakewalk.

[@erikbust7209]

ah yes border gore at is finest...

[@KinoTechUSA69]

The thing I was most excited for, reworked peace conferences, sucks ass. Bordergore is worse, puppeting is worse, and war score is worse. I love the game until I actually win, now winning is a punishment.

[@Aiphiae]

Be Germany. Fight solo for the glory of the Fatherland. Italy begs to join you. Refuse the dandies and their hand-waving pleas. Crush all who oppose you. Windmills fall, chocolate melts, baguettes are trampled. The white cliffs of Dover are splattered in blood. The reach of the Fatherland is far, yet lebensraum is waiting to the East under the flag of the red menace. Peace conference... time to consolidate your gains. Italy, who did nothing but pout about being turned down contests *everything.* Wonder why Italy has any claim to any part of the UK. Wonder why Italy has enough points to actually contest for core provinces in the UK. Wonder why Italy has now managed to take Greater London and Wales, having never set foot within 2000 km of them. Peace conference is over. Italy rode your coattails to a strong position in the UK, Africa, Australasia, and North America. Be frustrated. Feel the wrath of a thousand scenes from "Downfall" and wonder who made Look East to Russia. Look South to Italy. Look at Russia... sigh. Start driving South. Dandies must die.

[@ryanokeefe8944]

I would love to hear that we are wrong. Please explain how to make this simple and beneficial because I just can't get my brain around what I should be doing.

[@DoomDutch]

15:45 *music* What is this, WTF1?

[@breath2273]

i still hate peace deals

[@RobsRedHotSpot]

I love how realistic division/tank/ship/plane designs are cringe but realistic borders are loved.

[@ole182]

British and French decolonizating Africa in 1960’s, colorized.

[@FalkyRocket2222]

i thought i was the only person who liked them lol

[@jonssoni3210]

Same

[@jojo_da_poe]

People just don't know how to use them.

[@haukionkannel]

So much better than old and yeah, did take some time before I did learn what each button actually do!

[@speight88]

Even when it goes mad i like it. who can hate a war between American Russia, French Russia and Chinese Russia?

[@Ian-pm2ly]

Nazi Germany makes Israel???? Historically accurate

[@olekirkchristiansen1601]

New peace conference system sucks

[@justinb2824]

It's funny how this video ends up proving how terrible this system is after all. A person with thousands of hours in the game and making a video specifically about peace deals still makes multiple mistakes. What chance do the rest of us have?

[@VanDerFenix]

Hello

[@capamerica2427]

First 🎉

[@burch8400]

The new peace deal process is Good, Bad and Ugly and needs more work. Players should not have to settle for anything less than Good. PDX needs to continue to perfect peace deals and not wait another six years before making another attempt.

[@shrithan2871]

where my BBA giveaway

[@melfice999]

I hate it for the simple fact that WW2 ends up with Chinese Norway in Guangdong

[@johannesterl9083]

This crap is so stupid. I stopped playing.

[@anderarmould]

So many people are crying about the new system, WHEN ITS AMAZING. Crybabies.

[@matiasdiaz8913]

is only good when you are the only one making demands and there is no AI eating rocks in the way

[@burch8400]

I do not think players are being crybabies. The new system is Good, Bad and Ugly and needs more work. Players should not have to settle for anything less than Good. PDX needs to continue to perfect peace deals and not wait another six years before making another attempt.

[@SonofAlbion]

Bet you love Vicky 3’s war system too.

[@Lich_V.]

The Ideas are good but the execution is quite lacking plus it has apparently never been playtested. And since it's a 20€ DLC I expect PDX to deliver an appropriate product for the price.

[@jeeferw7770]

help me please i played as germany with ai, italy annexed the entire world but i am only able to annex poland🥲

[@Aiphiae]

It's such a stupid mechanic.