🐴Serious Horsepower!⚡ Double-Tap .357 Sig VS .357 Magnum Controlled Expansion

[@GunSam]

I want to address something that has been bothering me lately, and that is the repeat comment in some form or another, about .357 Sig ammo price and availability. Paraphrasing 100 comments into one here - ".357 Sig is not available anywhere, and it's two to three times the cost of 9mm so it's useless". My question to these people is - what are you even talking about?! I know that a lot of physical stores do rack up the price because all they offer is generally Federal American Eagle .357 Sig, which is very pricey ammo. But to say that the cartridge is hard to find and to say it's like $60 a box in general, is very factually wrong. Going on ammoseek, there are 5+ pages of .357 Sig for purchase just like any other popular cartridge, and about a dozen of these retailers offer 50 round boxes of .357 Sig for $22 to $25. Also, defensive ammo is often about the same price if not less than 9mm+P defensive ammo. The fact is, .357 Sig is not all that hard to find and not all that expensive. It's not a lot different (at least online) than buying a 50 round box of .357 Magnum for cost and availability, but for whatever reason a lot of people are either seriously misinformed or have an agenda to make it seem as .357 Sig ammo is about as rare and expensive as .455 Webley (5 retailers online averaging about $65-$70).

[@SmokinSigs]

100% agreed. The only way I see people complaining about the price are the people who only walk into the gun shop and buy a box of 50 each time they shoot. I've seen 357sig white box winchester in a local shop at $69.99. Crazy price. However, online its everywhere and very affordable. Especially if you buy it in bulk. Most online shops give free shipping with your cart over a certain limit. So, buy online and get your cart up to 100 or 200, whatever the requirements. Good prices, free shipping. I believe the people who say this are the people who want to walk into their local shop and see 357sig boxes of 50 at $29.99 instead or even cheaper. BUY IT ONLINE PEOPLE! Also, its a bottleneck caliber which feeds better and it has amazing performance in comparison to cheap 9mm ammo. You pay for what you get. Lastly, these people can somehow afford a handgun from $300-1200 on average and complain about prices. Come on now.

[@jasonkeating9958]

Every 357sig on here tested is performing every vid every time its just an apsolutly solid performer, The more you see it the more it shows that the extra 2 rounds of 9mm are not important compared to the extra all round performance, And really 13 to 15 rounds of full power 357sig plus a spare mag should really be enough in any real encounter.

[@GunSam]

After several comments saying that the .357 Magnum ammo was tested for it's rated velocity through a test barrel (not a revolver), I feel I need to chime in. This is Double-Tap, which is sort of a small company in regards to them using test barrels, and generally companies like this use an actual firearm to get their rating numbers. This is dually confirmed with the Double-Tap website giving this information for this ammo: Velocity: 1600fps / 4" Ruger GP-100 1425fps / 1 7/8" S&W 1750fps / 6"bbl S&W 686 Bullet: 125gr. Semi Jacketed Hollow Point Muzzle Energy: 710 ft. lbs.

[@calabazamaligna997]

¿Existirá algun cartucho de 357 magnum con bala de 200 granos?

[@Master-AGN]

I wonder if they’re just using a test barrel rather than a test gun? Like a 4 inch rifle barrel rather than an actual handgun with a cylinder gap🤔

[@Master-AGN]

@@calabazamaligna997 If you buy him a box of bullets I’m sure he’ll do it for you

[@onpsxmember]

@@Master-AGN Of course they write down Ruger GP100 for shits and giggles.

[@onpsxmember]

@@calabazamaligna997 Sí. Hay algunos, pero se usan más con rifles. Estoy seguro de que algunos los usan también en revólveres de caza.

[@louv4437]

Double tap makes great ammo and 357 sig had amazing real world results in hun fights

[@kevinrichardson8859]

357sig tops in stops!! 💪

[@adamneville1809]

More people need to go and buy a 357 sig. You will not be disappointed.

[@scottythebody0811]

I love the 357 Sig content. Thanks for posting!

[@MAG-li5jo]

I can get Remington UMC 357 Mag semi jacketed hollow point for 72 cents a round, and it performs better as well. I am good. LOVE your videos Sam!

[@mefirst5427]

They really need to make a carbine for the 357 Sig like the Ruger takedown, switch between 10mm and 357 sig, that would be lot of fun!

[@bretgeidel613]

I would like to see full power 10mm vs full power 357sig. Thank you for your time and effort in making these videos it is appreciated.

[@handsofstone1887]

357sig will lose to 10mm

[@fastfordman1965]

Good video. I was quite surprised that the magnum was out gunned.

[@kevinrichardson8859]

I'm not...the 357sig is a hot 🔥 number...40k psi...and a bottleneck to spike pressure like a rifle round...optimized for short barrels..unlike a 357 mag revolver round

[@exothermal.sprocket]

@@kevinrichardson8859 What does any of that have to do with DoubleTap's actual advertised numbers, with a specified handgun achieving them? Can you imagine Buffalo Bore pulling these shenanigans? No.

[@kevinrichardson8859]

@exothermal.sprocket I have seen all of the 3 boutique manufacturers not meet listed velocities that were printed on the box...on AZ Airgunners channel to name one specifically... it all depends on several factors ie barrel length...temperature...humidity...barrel rifling to name a few..Buffalo Bore has been known to change bullet types on their ammo unbeknownst to the customers which I think is worse ymmv

[@d.hayward5232]

Heck yeah!! 357Sig is my current favorite SA caliber, and 357Mag is tied for my favorite revolver cartridge. Love these videos Sam, keep 'em coming! As a "revolver fanboy", sure do wish you could do something to make .41Mag more popular - I know thats asking a lot however, sighs.

[@ladonnaghareeb4609]

My partner Bob is a big 41 mag fan too. He's also a big revolver fan, along with 1911's and Hi Powers.

[@Lateralus1007]

41 mag will never be popular Ppl are too infatuated w semi loaders these days

[@richardelliott9511]

Wow, someone actually has a positive commment about 357 sig? And deservedly so.

[@frankhinkle5772]

Thanks for the test.

[@ctsnider88]

I never thought to compare those two. Thanks

[@lutherpayne9957]

The .357 Sig in a Glock 33 is my usual EDC. When I don't carry that I'm carrying .357 mag in a Taurus 605. Love the stopping power of both. Good to see a different ammo selection to try out. Cheers.

[@CYOA03]

I knew it would be a matter of time till you got that little kid smirk when talking about the 357 sig. The 357 sig is an impressive round. I was sure you would love shooting it as much as I do. I love revolvers but they are just not as easy to reload and hold far less rounds so to me its a slam dunk for toting around the sig.

[@curtismatsune3147]

The one application where revolvers excel is a bedside home defense gun for folks who aren't gun aficionados. They just need it to go bang no matter what with minimal attention and maintenance. Note that I'm not saying neglect.

[@lens7859]

The 357 Sig is some amazing little cartridge!

[@FoulPet]

And yet sig barely supports it anymore

[@exothermal.sprocket]

@@FoulPet This is nothing new. A parent corporation historically has designed something with their name attached to it, and other companies use that cartridge even if the parent doesn't give it much later attention. Just consider the last 120 years of cartridges, who started them, and who's making them now. Some survive, others do not.

[@FoulPet]

@exothermal.sprocket That's news to me. I was fixing to look for a Glock in 25 acp. Thanks for the heads up. Maybe I'll see if 45 gap is still popular

[@FoulPet]

@exothermal.sprocket I would have never known that without your insight. Do you mean like the 25 acp or the 45 gap? Do you think it's performance related, cost related, easier production, popularity, or all the above? Not like we'd ever keep an outdated platform like the 45 acp around when 9mm is so popular and sells so well.

[@exothermal.sprocket]

@@FoulPet My personal interest in cartridges goes back to the late 1800's, so I guess I would have a much more broad perspective on naming conventions and who started what. This is rifle and handgun cartridge related. There's so many factors in what causes one to fall off the market, and sometimes later return. It's hard to say generally, other than deal with their history on a case by case basis.

[@ethanhenry5873]

That was some woeful underperformance in the ballistic gel for those energy numbers for both calibers. Makes me wonder about Double Tap these days.

[@leadfarmer556]

Remington 357 125 are way more spicy than these!

[@calebsrccrawlers]

I have always liked 357 sig, and now I have even more reason to get a 357 sig.

[@FoulPet]

Not much coming out for it anymore

[@FoulPet]

@@TransformersHoarder true but I'd like to have P225 double stack in one.

[@FoulPet]

@@TransformersHoarder I've got a P239, P229 Legion + P226 Legion in 357. I just want a smaller double stack that isn't Glock.

[@oldcop18]

My wife is in her mid 70s & has had RA for years. It’s almost destroyed her hands and I’m impressed that you can shoot magnum rounds at all. Take care of yourself.

[@GunSam]

I have been on infusion therapy from the start of it. Should slow down the disease.

[@exothermal.sprocket]

Bone and tissue repair and vitalization has more to do with nutrient absorption and utilization than anything else. Millions of Americans are severely deficient on a host of nutrients and it sets of domino effects in the body. The medical system neither wants to know this, nor tells anyone about this, and spends billions on making sure their therapies are predominate and other solutions are held as quackery. Look up Dr Eric Berg DC on here, pertaining to calcium, magnesium, D3, zinc, copper, potassium, deficiency symptoms and osteoporosis sources. Taking high dosage of supplements doesn't equate to absorption. Blood tests indicating nutrient presence and optimum levels also doesn't indicate the same nutrients are in the blood cells. Couple all of this lack of clear majority information in this country with the payload of toxic chemicals and poisons people consume in common foods, and the gut cannot absorb much of anything over the long haul. It's a complex chain of problems.

[@wemcal]

Great video... if the .357 magnum had the velocity stated on the box it probably would have performed better than the .357 sig... still great rounds

[@papadan8468]

I enjoy the vlogs as always. They are very informative. It would be interesting to see a comparison between the 357 Sig and the 10mm. Keep up the great work. Thanks

[@handsofstone1887]

10mm will outperform the 357 sig. The 10mm will push a 135gr bullet 1600fps which is over 100 fpe more than the 357 sig.

[@CCM2361-]

Thanks Sam. I really appreciate the work you are doing. You have a great channel!

[@steveschaefer1070]

Very impressive rounds

[@larrydavis9851]

Very nice .357 Sig load from Doubletap!

[@edmundleblanc9508]

Both great rounds. Both firearms have advantages. The necked down 357 Sig has reliable feed, and of course something one does not have to be concerned with in a revolver. Everyone should have one of each.

[@johnpalmer6822]

Your comment on semi vs revolver to me rings true. Buffalo bore always was close for me in revolvers.

[@bobcatforever3485]

Good video. Another interesting comparison. Also, great distance shooting. Thanks for sharing. Take care.

[@GunSam]

Thanks. Take care

[@richki.24]

Yay for 357Sig !!!!!!

[@Stoney_AKA_James]

Good test, but I wonder how it would compare to "hot" 158 grain defensive loads (Fed HST, Hornady, Underwood, etc)?

[@carloparisi9945]

Hi Sam, I don't think ammo companies test revolver ammo in revolvers, more likely it's a device with just a long barrel and no cylinder gap.

[@TheKentuckyPatriot]

Great stuff as always brother 🙂

[@GunSam]

Thanks a lot!

[@magickaldood]

One of the reasons that revolver cartridges may be less accurate in the rated velocity vs actual is the test barrel. Most revolver cartridge test barrels are actually closed chambers (no cylinder gap) and 8" long. Auto handgun cartridges however are usually tested from a 4.25" or 5" barrel. Since auto handguns leave the breach closed for a time, less gas escapes from the action thereby improving velocity. SAAMI even has a provision for "vented test barrels" which is designed to replicate velocity loss from a cylinder gap in revolver cartridges. The ammo manufactures could also just be dishonest, but it's hard to tell sometimes.

[@OGbqze]

I can't stop binging these videos. I think I've watched over 100 in the past few weeks.😂

[@guardianminifarm8005]

Surprised the Sig was "more" than the Magnum. Both are more than adequate for self defense. Good stuff. Thanks

[@kevinrichardson8859]

Surprised??? The 357sig is bottleneck and operates at a higher pressure....so at 125 grains and less at or around a 4 inch barrel the 357sig is VERY comparable to the 357 mag

[@ax.f-1256]

The SIG 125 grain out of a 4 inch pistol barrel was specifically designed to Mimik the exact performance of the 125 grain magnum out of a 4 inch revolver barrel. So if you get a very good .357 SIG load and a just slightly less powerful magnum round or the barrels are at a just slightly different length (or your revolver cylinder is changed so that it can handle moonclips, you will end up with the SIG being a bit more powerful. Basically they were designed like some sort of cousins to one another. So they often behave like they are related to one another. Sometimes the magnum Cousin is more powerful sometimes the SIG cousin. 😂

[@exothermal.sprocket]

@@kevinrichardson8859 Sam explained what DoubleTap clearly advertises about velocity. Now, if you chose a Buffalo Bore load, you would GET EXACTLY what Buffalo Bore claims, if not better.

[@timshelley8635]

Nice admission! I know you're a revolver guy, so that was hard to swallow, even though we could see it was true. Well done Sir!

[@Lanzerath1244]

As always, excellent production and content

[@mkshffr4936]

Would love to see more double tap tests. They have a pretty wide selection of +P and standard loads to choose from.

[@ReapAndReave]

Great video, and a great showing from DoubleTap. I personally choose DoubleTap over Underpants ammo all day.

[@Ifoughtpiranhas]

I still have a box of Double Tap .357 Mag 125 gr. loaded with the Gold Dot bullet rated at 1605 fps from a 4" barrel, and when I fired a few rounds at the local range, I didn't need a chronograph to know that they stretched the truth of their advertised velocity to the point of being deceitful. That box still collects dust in my stash, and I haven't bought Double Tap since.

[@glockensig]

I was torn between converting a M&P 5" barrel or a CZ P-09 into 357Sig! I went with the CZ P-09! it is a crazy accurate pistol.

[@GunSam]

I have no experience with that pistol, so you may have made the right choice. What I can say is this M&P conversion has not had a malfunction yet, not one. So it's not a bad choice either.

[@glockensig]

@@GunSam I agree!! I would still love to have one!!

[@tysonfromm5397]

Tried out double tap’s 200gr hard cast yesterday. Powerful stuff.

[@sogk12]

Sam, I've been around "ammo testings" for a while now (~15 years). The point you made about "boutique companies" not being honest about revolver ammo velocities: in my experience, if one wants "true velocities", I'd recommend Buffalo Bore if it's revolver ammo and Double Tap or Underwood if it's pistol ammo.

[@GunSam]

Yeah, I have stated that many times in dozens of videos. Buffalo Bore revolver is always above the rest, Underwood is about as good for semi auto but sometimes even greater. I have tested many comparisons with a Buffalo Bore revolver round VS an Underwood semi auto round for this reason.

[@abengelbrecht]

Put some Hogue grips on your S&Ws, makes a world of difference in shooting comfort and felt recoil. That Sig cartridge is really hot, while the Mag is pretty much factory load. Seems like BB are the only ones that seem to load revolver cartridges properly.

[@GunSam]

This revolver does have hogue grips. Felt recoil is pretty low

[@MnS101]

Another excellent demonstration. I, too, have arthritis issues that is making it difficult to get a lot of practice in with my .357 Magnum. I have given thought to searching for another caliber as my go-to for every reason caliber. Furthermore, I am considering the .357 SIG as the caliber I gravitate to. However, I am concerned with the availability of those rounds long term. In addition to the cost of these "novelty" rounds in terms of the funny shaped casing. I am also reluctant to give up the versatility offered by the Magnum (38 Special use in same firearm). One thing I would prefer to see is displaying both data points at the same time. What I like to do is compare the velocities and FPE between the two test calibers. That means I have to go back and see what the first set of numbers are and the go to the second set. I just think it would be nice to see them displayed at the same time. I truly enjoy your channel. Keep up the excellent work.

[@GunSam]

Ultimately, I think one needs to do .40 S&W with a .357 Sig conversion barrel for all the reasons you listed. If you can't find .357 Sig ammo, the .40 S&W is still known to be very effective and available.

[@texasrex2222]

I feel like double tap has done an excellent job. I purchased their 9mm +P all copper HP 115gr rated at 1275fps through a glock 17. I'll have to consider getting some of that 357 magnum for my Marlin 1894C and my S&W 686-6

[@GunSam]

I have had mixed results. I carry their ammo in my .327 Federal, excellent. But then again a video I didn't release yet with their .38+P with a 4" barrel rating of 1,175 gave me only about 980 FPS in my 4" barrel. That's no different than like Federal Punch with it's 120 gr doing like 1,030 in my 4".

[@texasrex2222]

@@GunSam That's unfortunate. For a company that makes such good loads, I think you are correct that they would be best-served to more accurately list their results on the box. I mean, they were able to precisely give the fps and firearm used on the box of my 9mm +P, so an accurate rating with firearm used on all other boxes would be nice.

[@keithjones668]

You keep getting better. Nice shooting, btw.

[@Walter-wo5sz]

Test barrels for 357 mag may not have a cylinder gap. This would account for velocity differences.

[@tedcollins4684]

My 1st thought.

[@googleeyeseyes4033]

Correct, either a controlled stationary barrel or even a coonan 357 or a Desert Eagle even.

[@GunSam]

Like I said in the video, a 4" Ruger GP100 was test barrel rated at 1,600 FPS from it.

[@paulscountry456]

Nope just a medium load, I can get 1680fps from Buffalo Bore 125 from my 6 inch 28.

[@GunSam]

@@paulscountry456 I like that load. Sometimes not super consistent based on lot of production, but hot nonetheless. Typically I get over 1,600 FPS, like maybe averaging 1,625 in my 4.125" S&W here, but one time my 5 round average from the 4.125" was 1,682 FPS, a couple rounds were over 1,700.

[@danoneill2846]

yep comment & thumbs up ... then watch .........

[@herbertblevins7077]

Really good shooting at 75 yards !

[@chrisbrake7219]

Good video! Still waiting on these compared in snubby vs 3" autoloader

[@GunSam]

Thanks. Unfortunately I don't have a way to test .357 Sig in a 3" auto. I just don't have one, nor do I have any short barrel .40's to convert.

[@chrisbrake7219]

@@GunSam understood. Maybe sometime down the road. Always learn from your content. Thanks!

[@Patriotx-gx4ce]

In your previous tests Remington HTP 38 special penetrated deeper than both of these). Followed by 38 special +P and 357 same brand. So looks like horse s+ ammo) I 'll go with Remington or Hornandy and if I want " horse power", buffalo bore and Underwood.

[@Patriotx-gx4ce]

Cant edit comment without KZbin app, so have to reply to self) That test I am talking about was also done with a snub nose revolver not even close to either one of these.)

[@GunSam]

Penetration doesn't really make it more effective. Just means the bullets didn't expand so well. I could get a .22 LR to go deeper than these with the right load, but obviously this wouldn't make it better.

[@curtismatsune3147]

A square butt L frame with Pachmayr target grips covering the back strap would go a long way toward recoil mitigation by putting it on a more apples-to-apples comparison with a modern semiauto.

[@TheHappy2cu]

Thanks for the video.

[@crusiethmaximuss]

357SIG is such a good pistol cartridge... I haven't checked to see if SIG actually has an XMACRO chambered in that, but if they do, that is my next handgun!

[@shoreamaze177]

They dont, dead caliber

[@joelclark2130]

Yep, got to love 357 Sig, I also love the 357 Magnum, fan boy. It is like in shotguns it's called a square load, a 28 gauge is the most efficient gauge. Just like the 357 Sig super efficient. Great video can't deny the facts. Long live the Republic. Get out and both people you know who to get rid of.

[@Manbunmen65]

Waiting to walk to my deer stand watching some KZbin. The side arm of choice. S&W model 60 pro with Remington 125 sjhp.

[@louv4437]

Great test pal!! Great ammo! With the 125 grain bonded double and the 115 grain solid copper I had great results!! Test the underwood 125 bonded 357 sig I got 1631 with a 5 inch just insane power!

[@exothermal.sprocket]

Seems once again, the best place to go for rimmed revolver cartridges is Buffalo Bore. DoubleTap and Underwood seem to do pretty well with semi's. Buffalo Bore and Grizzly and Garrett are very good with rimmed. Toss in Aria Engineering and Steinel after that.

[@adonikam1]

EXCELLENT EXCELLENT VIDEO. ILL STAY WITH THE 357.

[@colt10mmsecurity68]

Great video. But something was off here with that ammo. Every test I’ve seen over the years, always shows .357Mag outperforming .357Sig in the jelly tests. From higher 357mag velocities, to more violent expansion and usually much better penetration that what was depicted here. Weird.

[@GunSam]

I didn't see anything off personally. The .357 Mag expanded larger in plain gel and held together, so with more surface size and a tad less velocity it's going to penetrate less. The .357 Sig fragmented a little, had more velocity, so the overall smaller diameter is going to go deeper. Also most other tests out there I see people comparing 4" .357 Mags to 4.5" .357 Sig, which give the .357 Sig a half inch less burn time than the .357 Mag. Using a 5" .357 Sig like I did gives better velocity so it performs better.

[@colt10mmsecurity68]

@@GunSam 👍 very good. Love your channel. You always produce great comparisons.

[@OmegaDoom660]

Could you do a similar test with some of these hot loads in various calibers but hit the gel from a further distance like 20 yards or so? I love these gel vids, but never get to to see what kind of performance is achieved at extended ranges.

[@dcidci1012]

I would like to see you compare 38/357 in 2" & 4" & 6" & a Rifle Lever action, Chrono & your normal MDF & without in the Gel. Thanks Sam.

[@GunSam]

I would too, but you just listed like 2 grand just for you to see that lol. I don't have all those options.

[@biggunshandguns3687]

That was a very cool video I like the 357 sig quite a bit even though I don't own 1. I'd love to get a m and p like yours then slip a 357 sig barrel One suggestion and I know how those drive you nuts. Maybe when you do your long range test shoot closer to begin with so you have a general idea where you are hitting one you shoot at 75yds. I know with ammo being the way it is that may not be a very good idea

[@highermedia]

would love to see some tests with grizzly ammo. Don't think you've tested that brand before

[@GunSam]

What? lol. Literally one of my last tests

[@angrysheepdog9744]

When you consider that the 5" semi barrel is 4" of actual barrel...this loading outperforms the design criteria (1450fps) of 357 SIG by over 100fps

[@JTP1967]

Hello Sam, I just acquired a Thompson Contender. You should do a video on them. I really enjoy your videos because, well quite frankly, you know your shit.

[@GunSam]

I have seen those guns over the years. Might be fun to mess with with multiple caliber barrels.

[@JTP1967]

@@GunSam I have an ole timer friend who is big on competition shooting. He competes in "Quick Draw" shooting contests, and man he is one heck of a shot. He reminds me of the Old Beverly Hillbilly tv show (if you've ever seen them) where Jed is sitting out front shooting his rifle and splitting the wings off flies at over 300 yards. LMAO. Anyway, that contender almost knocked me out when I first fired it. He loaded it up with a 45/410 and it almost came out my hand. And I know better to. Maybe it should've banged me in the noggin for not paying proper attention LOL.

[@JTP1967]

@@GunSam I'm an avid bird hunter, so a lot of my arsenal are shotguns. But for me, NOTHING beats a .357 revolver. I prefer the revolvers over everything else. I have an old .44 black powder revolver. Loud as heck. Love shooting it.

[@GunSam]

@@JTP1967 I vaguely remember my dad talking about that show, and something along the lines that he's a good shot but granny can shoot better or something like that. I used to watch it 20 years ago on TVland once in awhile but never paid much attention. Sort of a thing where I had my tv playing in the background while working on my PC and that along with leave it to Beaver and a bunch of shows played back to back.

[@JTP1967]

@@GunSam Granny could most certainly tear up that skeet with her side by side LMAO

[@joeyoung3319]

Taking a serious look at a 3-inch Smith Model 60... compact, beautiful and Oh-So-Smooth. Currently, rocking HST in my 9mm LCR, front pocket, off-side. Strongside: HST 200-gr in XDm 4.5 IWB. SHOULD handle about anything..?

[@beanalog8202]

Wow, looks like the sig one this time. Don't worry, we'll get em next time 😜

[@johnmaresca69]

Gotta give it to the Sig this test. Put a spanking on that magnum on this one

[@johngriffiths118]

Sorry to hear about your hands , I feel your pain

[@drsmokeybones]

If you're a fan of the 357 magnum loaded to its potential, Buffalo Bore is your friend. The magnum has substantially more powder capacity than the Sig! This comparison shouldn't even be close. The sig has 19.5 grains H20 capacity the magnum has over 26! Grizzly Ammo does a pretty good job of doing the 357 magnum justice as well. I have no trouble getting 800 ft/lbs+ out of my 6" GP100 with the formentioned ammunition or my H110 or Lil Gun handloads. With some 180 or 200 grain .358 hardcast gas-checked loads the 357 magnum will leave even the 10mm behind. Every time.

[@slelliott14]

Cylinder gap plays a huge role in velocity too

[@GunSam]

Not really. Rated is rated.

[@FoulPet]

@@GunSam an interesting test might be how much velocity is lost if the cylinder gap widens.

[@jasonkeating9958]

The 357sig for me is a much better option, you can argue about performance and with the same bullet and more powder the 357mag would be roughly the same but having at least twice the capacity of the revolver and the ease of reloading makes it an easy choice, The round I really want to see tested properly is the 9x25mm dillon as that's really the true automatic magnum as that's the 10mm case where as 357sig is the 40, Also underwood has and I think buffalo bore also has loadings with both 357mag rated bullets and 9mm bullets loaded into the cases, As for this 357sig it shows that losing 2 rounds of capacity per mag in relation to 9mm is not really important compared to the extra performance even compared to the the top tier 9mm+p+.

[@onpsxmember]

The 357 Sig is made from 10mm cases. It has more wall thickness at the bottom/head of the case. The .40 S&W case would rupture. .40 S&W handles 35.000 psi, while 357 Sig handles 40.000 psi

[@leadfarmer556]

More power than 357 magnum. This ammo is weak underpowered.

[@texasbeast239]

My understanding is that these are Hornady XTP projectiles. They brag about "controlled expansion" a ton. Their idea for c.e. seems to be using a thin jacket that reliably begins to expand even in low-velocity loads, bypassing the unreliable expansion problem that has traditionally plagued JHPs. They're supposedly more reliable. But in addition to that, the thinness of the jackets means they are kinda weak, so when they expand, they don't just spread wide like flower petals. They're not strong enough to hold themselves out wide. Instead, they peel and roll back along the bullet shank. This affords some level of expansion for increased wounding, and also for increased drag to minimize overpenetration. Because c.e.'s don't pop open wide, they don't slow down as much as other JHP designs immediately on penetration into the target. They experience less expansion and less drag, so they slow down more gradually. And that ideally leads to consistently deeper penetration. The thinness of the jackets also explains the observed debris breaking off and being left behind in the bullets' wake. In theory. 🤓

[@GunSam]

XTP's are good bullets, but I know for sure neither of these are XTP.

[@texasbeast239]

@@GunSam I've heard of some other bullets tossing the lingo around recently, but not what brand they are, either.

[@mohammedcohen]

...is it THAT cold up there???

[@pecosjane]

Velocity numbers for revolvers are often wrong because the manufacturers use a “test barrel” which has no cylinder gap. I have encountered this disparity with many cartridges and most blatantly with Hornady bullet load data.

[@GunSam]

Some do, but Double-Tap lists actual revolvers as test barrels with numbers attached to each.

[@notnowchief.3089]

Hey Sam, Can you do a Damage test on Bones with Lead round vs Lead Hollow point Ammo in the Future?

[@albertjabberin739]

Very weird that the dt .357 mag was considerably slower than advertised and slower than similar .357 sig. It still seemed like the 357 mag was hitting harder and doing more damage in gel after the initial impact though if that makes sense.

[@GunSam]

Yeah, the mag lost no lead fragments at all, so it's impacting all at once. The Sig lost some pieces and broke up a bit in gel. There may be some unknown factor causing the mag to be moving faster at 75 yards than the sig too, who knows.

[@dangerman007]

I think you are well armed with either round. I don't the bad guy will be around very long to tell you if there is much of a difference...

[@turdferguson5300]

Once again I'm wrong. I'm starting to think that I don't know crap.

[@GunSam]

wrong about what? lol

[@jasonkeating9958]

I think he means 357sig vs 357mag

[@turdferguson5300]

@@GunSam I thought the .357 would penetrate better than the .357 Sig. I don't have experience with a .357 Sig. While Trump was president and ammo was easy to find I picked what I wanted to stock up on. My picks were 12 ga 00 buck, .308, .223, .40, 9mm, and .22. I have several other guns but I can't stock up on every ammo.

[@ratagris21]

Looks like either one with good shot placement will work. That .357 Magnum may not be loaded correctly where as the .357 SIG may be loaded correctly or the barrel creates much more of a seal. That cylinder gap may play a part like another viewer commented. 🎩🎯🎱🇺🇲🏁🇺🇦🌻💮🌼🏵️🌸🏴‍☠️🏹

[@googleeyeseyes4033]

Tests could be being tested through Coonan 357 or Desert Eagles, perhaps a controlled stationary barrel. Irregardless of Ruger test claims.

[@GunSam]

I just don't find that valid testing. If a person is going to use a .357 Magnum, it's 90% of the time going to be in a revolver. Buffalo Bore 125 gr gives me as much as 1,692 FPS in my 4" barrel here.

[@JohnSmith-hm9hn]

Manufacturers test revolver bullet speed in barrels without a cylinder gap so it is just a little higher then if it was shot from a revolver. I called up one manufacturer once and they said they were using a 14" test barrel for their rated speed. That is certainly deceptive advertising.

[@GunSam]

Guessing you didn't read the pinned comment.

[@JohnSmith-hm9hn]

@@GunSam Nope

[@justenzo928]

What a beautiful day to shoot

[@wmbedsole1]

What conversion did you use, m&p does not make a .357 sig. did you get the .40 then swapped the barrel? If you did how is the frame holding up? Thanks

[@GunSam]

KKM .357 Sig barrel for the M&P L/pro. I don't know a lot about what to look for in terms of the frame, but to me it looks the same as it always has.

[@Vibe77Guy]

Have you ever actually done the Delta E÷DeltaT horsepower calculations for a firearm launched projectile? I can pretty much guarantee that you will be astounded by the actual numbers.

[@bdogjr7779]

Awesome GSam《☆》Nice test Brother👍🔥I wouldn't want to catch either bullet in ma pumpkin😁I have some Winchester Whitebox 357 Magnum Semi jacket 125gr hollers for my Taurus 7 shot Tracker 4" revolver. I did some testing with dry phone books years ago. I think it went thru 2-1/2 phone books🖖😎☮

[@GunSam]

Thanks. I haven't been able to find that ammo in forever.

[@LarryeWhite61]

Have you used the Underwood #149 125gr Bonded Jacketed Hollow Points yet? It's 1 of their BEST 357 Sig rounds. 1475fps ME is 604 ft-lbs.

[@GunSam]

No but I did try one of their 124 gr Nosler bullet loads that also said 1,475 FPS. In my 5" M&P it actually averaged 1,519 FPS.

[@LarryeWhite61]

@@GunSam these #149s are their version of the "GoldDot" round.

[@Hutzjohn]

Is there a conspiracy by ammo manufactures to download revolver ammo to sell more auto ammo? Seems like Buffalo Bore is the only one to really load full power 357 magnum ammo anymore 😭. All Razor Dobbs 10MM hunts are all using "Double Tap" ammo and it seems right up there in power with Underwood and Buffalo Bore --- "almost" !! I once upon a time was considering a 357 Sig but talked myself out of it because Underwood 10MM 135 grain are a bit faster than the Sig's 125 grain so it does the same - just slightly better. The B.B. 180 grain coming out of your 4 inch 686 at almost 1500 is hard to beat. Thanks Sam for another good review!

[@GunSam]

I just think there's no motivation to load revolver cartridge to their potential. Ammo companies know all the agencies they get huge contracts from for their 9mm ammo will test it, but revolver ammo is just for regular people who often don't test it.

[@Hutzjohn]

@@TransformersHoarder You missed the whole point --- the 10MM does the SAME thing why spend the extra $600 - $800 for the same thing??? + Put up a video of you loading a 220 grain hard cast in your 357 sig for bear protection!

[@Hutzjohn]

@@bobjones-bt9bh YES I agree --- the thing that's true of both is --- both will put a MAJOR hurting people both are powerful handgun calibers. But keep in mind the Underwood xtreme defenders are 100 grain with VERY LITTLE recoil even in 10MM they do well against level 3 and cause almost as much damage as a hollow point.

[@won8135]

That Sig is just evil. Looks like it's hardly kicking as well. It's not a round for the range because of high price but for self defense... can anything beat it?

[@GunSam]

it's great, however I have seen 50 round boxes under $30. I could still find some range ammo for it.

[@ariesmight6978]

Gun Sam_Revolver Aficionado For my first everyday carry gun. I am leaning towards the .44 magnum, in Smith&Wessen 629. Does the .357 magnum have any advantages over the .44?

[@GunSam]

I would say .357 Mag is better overall simply from the effectiveness and lower recoil. You can do pretty much anything with .357 Mag and also shoot .38 Special. The .44 Mag is a bit much, you need a much larger gun to control it well, twice the recoil too. Sure you can use .44 Special, but I still see .357 Mag is more ideal. You can get that 96% one shot stop with a 125 gr bullet at 1,450 FPS. Unless you are dealing with brown bears I can't see what advantage a .44 Mag has over a .357 Mag for the average situation.

[@ariesmight6978]

@@GunSam Thank you for your very informative response. I am unbiased when it comes to semi autos or revolvers. My next question is if I were to purchase a 10mm hand gun. Would the 10mm in a semi auto be comparable to a .357 sig. Or a .357 magnum?

[@onpsxmember]

@@ariesmight6978 The 10mm exceeds the .357 Magnum but not the .44 Rem. Magnum. Again, some more recoil. Go to a place that rents out various handguns and try it yourself. Be aware that a lot of 10mm loadings sold are around .40S&W loads. That's easy on the guns, customers that don't check happy with their 'best mm', and more money saved loading for them. Think of the role you want to fill...EDC...everyday carry. If you leave it at home cause the weight is bothering you don't EDC. Also keep in mind that sadly some more powerful handguns good treated differently in court (Case of Harold Fish). A miss of Dirty Harry's .44 Rem. Magnum is still a miss. If I was state side and starting out carrying, I'd invest in training by TPC and south narc.

[@ariesmight6978]

@@onpsxmember As someone who recieved his FOID card not to long ago. I traveled to five different gun stores. I rented a few different semi autos. As well as three different wheel guns. It seemed that the, more powerfull the round. The easier it was to shoot. I had rented a Smith 629 in .44 mag with a 6" barrel. That was a fun gun to shoot. The single action revolver in .45, was not for me. I did not like that load and unload. One bullet at a time bs, way too time consuming. I kept eyeing the 10mm, but the store had no ammunition. Same with the Desert Eagle in. 50AE. I did find the Desert Eagle a little weighty. But over all not that bad. The feel for each type of mechanism. On the Atlas that they had, was all butter. I could have rented it, but that day. I was there only for the wheel guns. The Wilson Combat felt great as well. I did not care for the feel. Of any of the plastic guns. Though their light weight was very nice. Especially for the draw, I so very much. Fell in love with that Smith & Wessen.

[@prestonmonaghan499]

Interesting with the 357 Magnum. I thought it would out perform the 357 sig

[@minnesotanice369]

Where can I find 357 mp handgun

[@GunSam]

I think they stopped making them years ago, but the M&P .40 S&W magazines say .40 S&W/.357 Sig right on them, you can use the same .40 S&W magazine for .357 Sig ammo. So all you need to do is get a conversion barrel. I used a KKM barrel, I believe they come in the 5" and also the shorter versions for M&P.

[@jamesadams1357]

Gun Sam I like your videos,. I watch literally everything you put out. But you're 100% incorrect about Smith being faster than Ruger. I've seen it in my own experience and saw many reviews or comments that say same. Try a ruger GP 100 against same Smith or even SP 101 against J frames. I think you'll find that Ruger is consistently faster. Keep up the good work sir. Again I'm not an internet keyboard warrior but I do believe this to be true. Love the revolver love and be blessed

[@carterthiessen2664]

The more I look at these tests, the more my opinion of 357 mag changes. Not denying its effectiveness, but in my mind the 357 is a rifle caliber, shot through a revolver. The short barrel just kills it. My 1894 marlin 357 is a whole different animal than even my 6 inch smith 586. Basically double the foot pounds of energy from that 18 inch tube

[@Sphinx-19]

are you that one guy that gave a guy a ticket for parking his semi on his property

[@SmokinSigs]

All these great results and sadly 357sig is seeming to be left behind. I'm not sure why people can't see this. The 357sig needs more love and to continue into the future for law enforcement, self defense, hunting, etc. It doesn't help even when Hickok talks bad about the round. Great video and I hope the 357sig sticks around for a long time.

[@GunSam]

I'm editing an Underwood 115 gr JHP 9mm+P VS .357 Sig video as we speak lol. Be out live in about a week. When I say 'I wouldn't want to be hit with it', i'm not saying it the way people often talk about .22 LR or 9mm....if a ballistic tester says they don't want to be hit with it, look out!

[@SmokinSigs]

@@GunSam This will be a interesting test. People typically make the argument 9mm +p can perform as well as 357sig and say "whats the point?" Do you have any spoilers with the test results so far or do I need to wait? 😆

[@poorfatman5317]

👍

[@eddiearchuleta615]

Buffalo bore is the only honest true revolver velocities