SHŌGUN Eps 1 and 2 SPOILER REVIEW | FX | Hulu

SHOGUN, a brand new series based on the James Clavell novel, dropped its first two episodes on FX and HULU. The series stars HIROYUKI SONADA, COSMO JARVIS, and ANNA SAWAI. Set in the 17th Century, John Blackthorne, a sailor who rises from outsider to samurai, while being used as a pawn in Japanese leader Toranaga's struggle to reach the top of the ruling chain, or Shogun.
The Outlaw John Rocha is joined by his The Cine-Files cohost Steve Morris who is steeped in the knowledge of James Clavell and Japanese culture to SPOILER REVIEW the first two episodes of the SHŌGUN series!
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[@pjny21]

The fact that Hiroyuki Sanada is a producer on the show is awesome and well-deserved. It's amazing how they've already defined all the characters personalities and abilities in 2 quick episodes. A true masterclass compared to soaking up so many snail-paced series and so many rushed half-assed content in the past few years.

[@joshrandor4371]

I like that you said "two quick episodes" when it was 2 hours of content. It felt short, but it was longer than a lot of movies nowadays.

[@bernardr7182]

I've read the book like 5 times. It was still INSANELY fast moving. He landed in Omi's village, got peed on by him, watched him cut a villagers head off for being disrespectful, plotted with his uncle Yabu, and they never even mentioend Omi's name one single time. Literally nobody knows who Omi is after these first two episodes.

[@DisingenuousComment]

The actor playing Yabushige is Asano Tadanobu, one of the greats in Japan. I can't wait to see more of him in this series.

[@joesmith1946]

His facial expressions are really good, almost comical they are so expressive.

[@AlongNaga-vo6lg]

Isn't he Ichi the Killer.?

[@DisingenuousComment]

@@AlongNaga-vo6lg Correct! he played Ichi in that movie.

[@dharambasi1928]

Slight error with the poem. Nobunaga, Hideyoshi and Tokugawa are considered the 3 Great Unifiers of Japan. Nobunaga precedes Hideyoshi, he wasnt one of Hideyoshi's generals, it was the other way around, Hideyoshi and Tokugawa were his most loyal vassals. Nobunaga's reign was cut short by Akechi Mitsuhide (Akechi Jinsai in Shōgun, who is Mariko's father), then came Hideyoshi, the peasant who rose the ranks; finally, Tokugawa Ieyasu (Toranaga in Shōgun). The poem describes their personalities/reign perfectly.

[@matdrat]

The unsubstantiated rumour/speculation was that it was Ieyasu who "inceptioned" Mitsuhide into betraying Nobunaga. Nobunaga once accused Ieyasu's wife Lady Tsukiyama and his son Nobuyasu of being involved in a plot to assassinate him. Ieyasu was forced to execute his wife and ordered his son to commit seppuku. Some thinks Ieyasu never forgave Nobunaga in his secret heart.

[@dharambasi1928]

@@matdrat That's a good point, very well could have been the case, especially with Ieyasu and Nobunaga having been together not long before Nobunaga's death, Ieyasu could have tipped off Mitsuhide, a pawn in the wider plan.

[@easyislander]

Are you sure that Tokugawa is Torinaga in Shogun? I think it's about the same era, but Tokugawa Ieyasu became Shogun through war with Hideyoshi. Not through political maneuvering to what Torinaga is doing. Two totally different people.

[@dharambasi1928]

@@easyislander It's historical fiction but yes, Toranaga is based upon Tokugawa Ieyasu and the late Taiko in the show is supposed to be Hideyoshi. In real history, they did have a feud but it was dealt with quickly and they went back to "good" terms. Hideyoshi died the most influential man in Japan leading to the political power struggle that ultimately led to Ieyasu becoming Shōgun.

[@easyislander]

​@@dharambasi1928 You are right. When the Emperor Taiko was dying he mentioned that he would have given Japan to Torinaga if was victorious. Hideyoshi tried to conquer Korea during this era.

[@dkarras]

To say Nestor Carbonell was unrecognizable is an understatement!! No eyeliner!!! 😜 I was about to stop the show for a moment knowing I recognized the voice but couldn’t place it but was determined to not look it up as I could feel the hamster in the ol noggin speeding up. The storm came and I let it go. Then when he’s recovering on the ship it suddenly clicked & I was Leo pointing at the TV 😂. I thought he was great but haven’t seen the original since it aired so 🤷‍♂️. I did buy it on BluRay a few months back but didn’t want to watch till after this came out. So thinking I might have watch 1ep for every 2 every other Sat night (streaming on D+ Tues nights but I’m saving to watch every Fri night). Only issue I had was w/ the subtitles & watching the performances I felt like I was having some issues tracking relationships & backstory but trust what’s necessary will come clear when needed & there will be subsequent viewings to pick up on missed details. Maybe watching the original might help a bit but might not w/ the appropriate name changes. And of course there’s the book to dig into. And of course this cast continuing 🤞. So yeah, really looking fwd to the journey over the next 8wks !!

[@majorlazor5058]

He was so good in this

[@dannyschoe4874]

The atmosphere of this show just sucks you into this world immediately. I never Read the book or the other series..so I'm going into this show blind. it is setting up a crazy interesting story...

[@vchmiele]

In an interview with the producers, they said that this version is very much about how every character has their own agency. This is a fascinating way to evolve this from the original miniseries where some characters felt more subservient.

[@jeffreyrobinson6988]

The best review I've heard of the new Shogun series yet. This is The Godfather, meets Ran, meets, GOT. Hopng the romance between Blackthorne and Mariko is sacrificed for the palace intrigue.

[@LazyEyeNZ]

So dope to see Steve on here. Him and Rocha have great exchanges. Love the cine files.

[@Vulcanerd]

The best deep dive movie show!

[@philipho188]

Holy Shit! The show is so good! Sanada really did it!!

[@MrNathansdad]

As someone who watched the original airing of the series, then promptly read the book, I'm all in. The first two episodes promise a show as great, if not greater than the one I watched. (Is it Tuesday yet?)

[@epiphany519]

There are three serialized stories that have returned my faith. With scripted stories dying the death by 1000 unscripted reality TV shows there have been three shows that give me faith that some can still live. The original Game of Thrones. The Last of Us. and now Shogun. Yes others aspire to the heights of the three but I have found them wanting. Thanks for your discussions. Take care all.

[@ameliacraiig4193]

This review was a joy. I'm in love with the first two episodes of Shogun. Even my parents who revered the old dramatisation adored this version so far.

[@darthmork6324]

My favourite scene is near the end of episode 2 when Blackthorne is explaining the Catholic plan and Toranaga says "You should abandon your war in Japan, you are outnumbered, It is hopeless." and Blackthorne replies "Not if I win". The little smile on Toranaga's face speaks volumes.

[@bogeyb200]

Ah... so glad you brought his uP.. this is another thing they changed from the BOOK .. and it's a FUCKUP... In the book Toranaga is questioning Blackthorne about being a pirate and his responsibility/duty to his liege lord.. Blackthorne appears clever in answering in that yes, it's wrong/bad to disobey/rebel against your liege lord UNLESS YOU WIN .. Toranaga is very entertained by this asnwer because it fits in all of his machinations .. as in a way he's rebelling against his ex liege lord the Taiko and his testament.

[@mrgsudo]

@@bogeyb200 Much better in he book and original. The new version became a little non sensical.

[@RailroadTy]

Love seeing Steve on the channel. I hope you're getting enough views to keep doing the entire miniseries. Always meant to watch the original but never got around to it. I'm loving this series so far!

[@steves5773]

Pleasantly surprised to see my favourite podcast duo reviewing Shogun. Michael and Shannon are great but for this show I'm excited to hear from Steve hearing his book knowledge!

[@brucecambosos816]

I'm watching it tonight... I will come back and listen to y'all review... I'M STOKED!!!!

[@WayneE42]

I'm 54 years old. So, I remember watching the Shogun series with Richard Chamberlain And Toshiro Mifune. I loved it so much that I read the book as a kid. So, I'm intrigued by the new series so far. Steve is sooo knowledgeable about the book and its history! Love it.

[@user-zx9jq4pv1w]

The book's scene between Blackthorn and Toronaga does talk about rebellion because the Dutch are in the middle of throwing off Spanish rule. Toronaga says there is no mitigating circumstance for rebellion against a lord but Blackthorn responds that there is one, winning. Toronaga is much amused by that answer since it aligns with Toronaga's thinking with his plans in Japan. To come back to the poem- wait. It is a bird's nature to sing, there is no need to make it do that. In Osaka, Toronaga expects the Catholic lords on the council to do something that annoys Ishido since he doesn't like the Catholic influence in the country. He's waiting for them to screw things up which is what Mariko understood to be Toronaga's thinking. Blackthorn is a terrific catalyst to get the Catholic lords to act on their nature. They do, trying to assassinate Blackthorn. Blackthorn says his Letters of marque come from the Protestant Dutch, the folks trying to throw off Catholic Spanish overlordship. So, it's not surprising the Spanish and Portuguese don't recognize the Letters because it would be accepting a rebel government as lawful which they don't want to do.

[@bogeyb200]

yes, yes! precisely I found their changing of this scene to be a BAD MOVE (because original dialogue was better and also portrayed Blackthorne as clever.. thus far he's a fairly arrogant dunce who is showing none of the interest in Japanese culture/society that he showed in the book immediately after his first (forced) bath

[@anaeusrex2014]

Yes, but the point is how to get the bird to sing when it isn't.

[@user-zx9jq4pv1w]

@@anaeusrex2014The point of the story isn't about the bird. It is illustrating the personalities of the three lords when dealing with a problem.

[@anaeusrex2014]

@@user-zx9jq4pv1w My response is to your statement "it's in a birds nature to sing."

[@user-zx9jq4pv1w]

​@@anaeusrex2014Pedantic waffling.

[@joesmith1946]

I read the book quite a few years ago, but what I remember was that it started with the story being about Blackthorne, but as you got into the book, the real main character was Toranaga. The 1980 miniseries had the political intrigue as a sideshow, but to me, the political intrigue, and Toranaga's struggle to survive and gain power was the main plot of the book, and the best part of the whole story.

[@majorlazor5058]

If the show would have focused on pilot I would have turned it off.

[@jewsco]

Great to see Steve here as the cinefiles is one of my favorite podcasts

[@mitchmatt6002]

Fantastic discussion and enthusiasm, guys! Love this show SO MUCH!

[@Bubbertan]

I think my only complaint so far is the distortion of the anamorphic lenses they use on the camera. Maybe it's to show the warped perspective of how Blackthorne sees everything, but it's there even with the Japanese only characters. It is pretty distracting at times, but overall very excited about this adaptation. They're hitting all the right notes.

[@jamesestrella5911]

Perhaps it also represents the tunnel vision the other characters have.

[@majorlazor5058]

I’m thrown off by the language. Are the wyte characters speaking English or Portuguese?

[@joeyartk]

Asano was the main psychopath in Takashi Mike's "Ichi the Killer"

[@Vulcanerd]

He was also the main antagonist (Hattori Gennosuke) to Beat Takeshi's Zatoichi in 2003!

[@nont18411]

He looks too rough and grumpy to play a good guy

[@Vulcanerd]

@@nont18411though, he was also Hogun of Warriors Three in Thor.

[@blinksstayfresh2524]

My fav new show!!!

[@Khail707]

Yup keep these comin JoRo😂

[@jasonwynne5735]

Just started this series. Looking forward to watching the Outlaws reviews aftewards. This had great insight from the source material. Bravo!

[@jimw966]

This show is fantastic and it filmed in BC Canada. They brought all these Japanese actors and crew over there to film.

[@vchmiele]

I think the original plan was to shoot much more on location in Japan, however Covid obviously effected production. That’s something else to admire about this. The fact that the production values are so high even with having to contend with the peak of Covid restrictions on set.

[@Warhaawk]

Hiroyuki Sanada has said that they had both eastern & western catering during production and at the start everyone stuck to the known & comfortable, but by the end everyone was delving into every thing.

[@zGraeme]

@@vchmieleI think Japan had too many buildings now built and couldn’t film as much in Japan as they’d liked to

[@dkarras]

@@Warhaawkit’s a cute little anecdote from the podcast that no doubt for some is true but honestly the Vancouver crew would largely be already very comfortable w/ Japanese food. There are more Japanese restaurants here than Starbucks at its height.

[@eliasm907]

Would love to see more of these reviews of the show!!! Loved the differences and elements of the book that Steve provided

[@ZachBobBob]

Loved the episodes and loved the review...I had no idea it was based off a book or that that there was an original miniseries. Took me a while to realise that was Nestor Carbonell too I was like HOLY SHIT ITS EYELINER GUY FROM LOST mid-way through episode one. He was going awesome work I wish he was in more stuff.

[@easyislander]

I took Japanese history in college. The story of Hideoshi would be awesome. That was a pivotal moment in Japan. They need to make a movie about that.

[@Vulcanerd]

Ugh, I can't decide if I can watch this w/o having seen the new series yet. I watched the old miniseries so I have a general idea of what happens, albeit ages ago, but I also suspect they tweaked a lot of the stuff to modernize it (visually, stylistically, etc)... But, I hate missing out on any Rocha and Steve deep dives into movies/shows (a dilemma I'm often faced over on Cine-Files when it's a movie I've yet to see). I am torn! Also, an excuse to lend my katana to the algos...

[@simonlittle9294]

So so true about Jonathan Rhys Davies in the original series.....he was fantastic as Rodrigues. Loving the first two episodes and this was a great review.

[@Darrenleewright84]

There is no better way to review this show than the cinema files way . As one not a huge fan of Samarai culture or the base story, I trust no better guide than Steve and John to walk me through the subtleties of what I’ve just watched . Great episode and I look forward to the rest of the series with you all

[@liamlvp3886]

Imagine this series has reference to the Ghost in ghost of tsushima, considering this is over 300 years later lol

[@bogeyb200]

Yabu's courtesan was not Kiku. She was the highest paid in Yabu's province. (Omi had to borrow a lot of money, greatly described in book, as his mother counsels him) But otherwise, deeply respect the guest's commentary and thoughts though I'm not sure he will convince me that the book plot/portrayals can be "improved"

[@Deato9000]

Only disagreement is that Anna Sawai absolutely shined in Monarch. Between Shogun and Monarch she's having an extremely strong start to the year. I hope this really launches her career into super stardom

[@tonyosime9380]

Excellent review. Please talk about the english language version vs the japanese subscripted version. Are they both out? How do they compare?

[@stephenrodwell]

Nobunaga came before Hideyoshi (who was one of his generals).

[@MrGrouch86]

OMG. a face to the voice of Steve!!! been listening to cinefiles forever. glad he's doing this with you!

[@thechewatson]

Everyone says Tom hardy and of course I see it but I think they both are actually doing Ollie Reed

[@matdrat]

You have your Japanese history confused. The chronological order of the three unifiers: Oda Nobunaga, Toyotomi Hideyoshi, Tokugawa Ieyasu. It was Hideyoshi who died and left behind a five-year-old heir and a council of regents. Ieyasu was once Hideyoshi's rival. Realizing their conflict would only weaken each other, they entered into a peace agreement: Ieyasu would pledge to be Hideyoshi's vassal. In return the Tokugawa clan would be exempt from serving in Hideyoshi's army for ten years. Ten years later, after Hideyoshi and his loyalists exhausted themselves invading Korea (Imjin War), the Tokugawa was the strongest clan in Japan.

[@notrixamoris3318]

The series should end at the battle of sekigahara and I hope it could beat GoT in that department...

[@stelierx]

What is life? but an escape from death

[@darkmattergamesofficial]

It is a great show and really stands out among the sea of garbage content out there. Even the recent Masters of the Air and Halo shows are a total snooze compared to Shogun.

[@chasx7062]

Better than Villeneuve's Dune?

[@mrgsudo]

[Heavy spoilers] Show is good so far. Nothing to complain, just to admire in terms of production value and all the amazing work the actors are putting out. But I have some reservations about the changes on the script. Apparently the writers pump up the struggle between the Catholic and Protestant and made it way too central to the plot in my opinion. In the original work the peril was there but was deal quite nonchalantly by Toranaga when he finally rise to power. Because this change the part of the script where Lord Yabu saves blackthorn of being killed makes absolutely no sense! Why the guards are moving him to be decapitaded far away from the prison when everybody else was killed right there? And why now, Toranaga have in his quarters someone that was condemned to death but escaped, this dont makes him accomplice of his crimes? I still have a pile of things to say about the new script, but I will leave it here.

[@Michael.Miles1]

Shogun > Dune 2. Don't @ me. ✌🏾✌🏾

[@Whizzer_]

Spoiler warning should be for these 2 episodes ONLY. Spoiling aspects of the future plot because you’ve read the book (regardless if it was ‘hinted’ in the trailer) is unacceptable.

[@michaelhenson7867]

It is sad that this so called show is so different from the book.

[@bogeyb200]

completely agree that this version is more faithful to the book in that it's Toranaga who is the key and central character (with Mariko and Blackthorne as supporting but fascinating and strong characters in themselves). I like this aspect because I saw the 80's miniseries and didn't learn about all the political machinations until I read the book and that was incredibly fascinating. I must admit I have a complete bias vis a vis being quite faithful to the book - it's a masterpiece. I found this Blackthorne thus far to be gelded and fairly idiotic - exhibiting none of the charisma and none of the presence that I like in Chamberlain's portrayal. Is that because he's "white"? NO! ..That goes for a lot of other characters in the book, that I hope are better portrayed.. (Ishido being prime e.g. as he was portrayed as fat, kind of stupid buffoon in TV series. Have you noted how Ishido and Yabu (another better casting) are shown to be younger, fitter and more virile? (in reality of course, we don't know, their actual aging selves may had been closer to original casting but I don't know.) I do hope Blackthorne starts looking better in future episodes, because as the book made clear, by the end Toranaga talked about him as yes a pawn, but one of his "falcons". The episodes so far also (it's early so we will see) aren't showing the developiong mutual; respect and then friendship b/w Toranaga and Blackthorne. Can't wait to see what they do with the sailor dance scene. Therer are two things that really stick in my craw so far. 1) Alvito - first, completely ahistorical by giving him that horrid Franciscan friar haircut. The Jesuits didn't do those and the tensions between Franciscans and Jesuits are in the book and historically accurate. This new Alvito(though fine, they show him speaking fluent Japanese) just loses all his aura and power as the powerful Jesuit as he is (ditto re Father Superior.. in the original, that guy didn't look Portuguese, but had this aura and presence about him that was powerful) No casting could replace original Rodriguez.. but ok.. 2) don't understand why they switched assassination and portrayed killer as a maid (wokester female casting, but no problem, why isn't she a trained ninja from that Amina Buda sect ? (important because it makes Yabu a suspect). Finally, as attractive as they made Yabu's female lady of night (she was unbelievable) I can't wait to see what they do with Kiko (who is supposed to be hottest of them all?) LOL Also hoping Omi san's character better developed in this remake because in the book it's interesting/good and original ignored it all.

[@mark2graves-movies689]

I had to stop watching when you started referencing future storylines the source material. I feel a spoiler "review" of certain episodes shouldn't reference "future" topics. Just my opinion

[@betopower5275]

Does it bother you guys that they are supposed to be speaking Portuguese? Whenever a character speaks in english while it’s supposed to be Portuguese it completely takes me out of the show. I would prefer if they just historically lied and said they were speaking english. It feels weird, maybe it’s just me?

[@Buckifan822]

Blackthorne mentions he speaks Portuguese in the 1st episode. Also the Japanese call the Euros “barbarians” the term comes from Romans thinking all Celtic tribes languages sounded like they were saying “Bar-Bar-Bar-Bar”, so to the Japanese, English & Portuguese might sound the same. hence we hear Portuguese as English to the audience.

[@EmpireStateUtopian_Dystopia]

Yes, it's just you. Nobody cares about these petty details of language and why the Portuguese man isn't speaking Portuguese.. enough of these gripes between book and this new SHOGUN series.

[@betopower5275]

@@EmpireStateUtopian_Dystopia i care lol when you speak multiple languages, things like this matter. Just a small gripe, i’m enjoying the show thus far. Specially the Japanese characters, they seem a lot more grounded.