Shimano Develop New Race Winning Motor

EMTB racing has exploded in popularity across the world, pushing manufacturers to develop their motor units into beasts that weren't necessary in the early days of e-Biking. @RideShimano were one of the first manufacturers to the table way back in 2016, with a fantastic, reliable motor in the guise of the E8000. The E8000, however, wasn't designed to win an eBike race, because eBike racing didn't exist. As the sport has evolved and achieved World Cup status, so too have the challenges which your average electric mountain bike has to deliver upon. The accolade of being the toughest of those challenges certainly belongs to the EDR-E Power Stage. This is the story of how Shimano - along with partners such as the Yeti / Shimano EP Racing Team - has developed its latest and greatest motors, and motors of the future, utilising this challenging space to drive innovation.
In association with Shimano: embn.me/Shimano
Thumbnail Image courtesy of Kike Abelleira
⏱ Timestamps ⏱
00:00 - The Story Of Shimano eBike Motors So Far
05:41 - Yeti Shimano EP Racing Is Born
06:17 - How Shimano Approaches Racing
08:10 - Developing A Motor At The Races
16:25 - Always More Room For Development
Thumbnail image: Kike Abelleira
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[@FIGHTTHECABLE]

The biggest issue with ALL ebikes is compatability. Not even the charging plug is the same. Not consumer friendly and also not helpful for the bike industry. If atleast a charging standard is agreed upon, it would help bike sales greatly.

[@calvinforsure]

I would love and e-bike and I’d buy one tomorrow if I could update the motor and battery tech as and when. At the very least frame only options need to be available before I buy.

[@DW-10]

"Good for the consumer" isn't going to cut it. The argument is going to need to be something damaging to a corporate reputation. Enough to outweigh the profit advantage of a system specific consumer trap. Maybe something from an environmental angle, much like cell phone chargers, e-waste from motors, battery and chargers that are not cross compatible.

[@porroco]

For short i wish i had money for an ebike

[@dicksplatts007]

@@porroco buy second hand they're basically the same as a bike now

[@gsum1000]

Mr Shimano and his UK customers would be much happier if he sorted out the EP8 water ingress problem rather than developing a new motor. Until that happens I'll avoid Shimano.

[@bradsanders6954]

1150 miles on my EP8 bike with no problems of any kind, been thru all kinds of water, the bike can go 90 miles if I want. Ive ridden dirtbikes for years, and if you ride em in water alot? Water will get in no matter what bike it is. Its the nature of the beast, no seal exists to keep long term water out.

[@helicopter12345678]

No water in my bosh and ride it all through winter craft lee Quarry just clean and maintain it 🤛

[@carlosbarragan6729]

Same here but split between two ep8.s

[@chrish8871]

You’d hope they’d be able to make 1 that doesn’t leak 😂

[@philwebb606]

⁠@@bradsanders6954saying you’ve 1150 and no problems means nothing when you look at owners reviews , I know 1 person out of around 10 that has had a ep8 replaced and some more than once, I don’t know anyone with a Bosch replaced. You can’t deny ep8 is a bad motor

[@alexandervonbraun]

The problem with investing into Shimano is the unbelievably poor after care support. Shimano are no where near as good Bosch. I don't think they are even as good as Bafang as you can at least purchase replacement parts readily. A good example is the Ep800 then hardly a year after ep801 and consumers with the EP800 were stuck with not such a great motor despite paying the premium.

[@ElGuapoDeSantoPoco]

Apart from the motor discussion , awesome riding and that Yeti is such a weapon

[@riottownrecords]

Man your videos are well edited. Straight up mini-documentaries. LOVE IT!

[@agentdrygrass]

With Shimano customer service and support being virtually none existent and their motors being under powered and unreliable, I would not go near any bikes with a Shimano motor. My friend did. His bike was in the bike shop for nearly 5 months when the EP8 motor failed. 💩

[@bradsanders6954]

Nothing online backs up what you say. The constant failures of EP8 motors just isnt happening. 100's of EP8 motors are for sale new just on ebay, as are parts of all kinds for them. Online the only shimano motor heard about, is one that fails, the rest of us are out riding them having a blast. 80% of emtb's have shimano motors so there is bound to be issues with some, like any motor. Some submerge the things in silt /water/mud then cry warranty! It all varies. It generally isnt motor failure on any EMTB, its the outboard parts getting wrecked, usually by cramming mud and water in them.

[@j.d.503]

Yea mine has worked great for 3+ years, and I think it does better on battery consumption than the competitors...

[@vashon100]

non existent vs none existent

[@tmstriveon]

Uhm? Was expecting an EP801R... or something in those lines!

[@Domane-mh8wg]

The new MGU platforms are the wave of the future and these factory riders can benefit from an integrated unit. Eliminating derailleurs would significantly improve mass centralization and reliability.

[@ENDUROMASIVO]

17min to tell me that SHIMANO still with the same motor, just changed the rider to win the Power Stage 😅

[@carstenreeder8634]

So there is no new motor? They just fine tuned everything and found good riders? I hoped for a proper answer to the Bosch Race Motor. How is nobody able to come up with something that has the Bosch punch?

[@davefreeman9347]

Having not got a full fat Emtb bike I haven’t got any opinion on the different motors but a lot of my riding buddies say that the Shimano motor continues to be underpowered compared to the likes of Bosch

[@helicopter12345678]

Yep agree we have to assume they have as good a rider and low weight as every other team and so much is subject to a lot of factors

[@Dannyjones1]

If those riders can win with a shimano unit, they can win with any other. As consumers, we want even more powerful motors than we do today - having the option of reducing it if and when.

[@eugenux]

exactly this, 1000%. edit. hasn't a thing to do with how powerfull shimano is... because it isn't.. Bosch is what's what.. and, of course, rocky mountain motors.. those are beasts!

[@sijmes]

I disagree, power is fine as it is and allows us to share the trails with the analogue bikes. Shimano need reliability and availability for their customers.

[@symmetricon1982]

​​​@@eugenuxagreed, that is exactly why I picked Rocky Mountain and their motor. It absolutely crushes all my homies bikes (EP8, Bosch CX, Yamaha and Brose) on the steep climbs. It doesn't have overdrive like the other motors so sometimes it can be a struggle pedalling through technical climbing stuff cause if you pause you stop. I haven't pulled against a Bosch Race CX.

[@Tsuchinokoed]

Does it still rattle? ep801 Shimano like a bag of spanners straight out the box

[@RicardoPetrazzi]

Good production. An interesting, informative and entertaining watch. Well done. 🥇👍

[@BertineFamily]

Excellent documentary, Thanks!

[@Magoo71]

Stevie thanks for the work you put in to share with your readers about the progress of eBike racing. I've now owned my first eBike for 2 years and really enjoy it! It'd be great to know the Battery size they used to race with and how many miles are each stage? Then I could compare that to my bike to see if I could compete one day in an eBike race...

[@deanrwilson]

The battery size depends on the race track. Also many of the races/racers use multiple batteries so you carry a 2nd battery. Altitude climbed, rider weight and conditions all affect battery usage.

[@motoboggle7525]

So why is it that on customer bikes both Ep8 and Ep801 are so lame compared to Bosch ? Because they are and unless your deliberately sitting on the fence you can’t deny it….

[@BoogieBrew]

Hopefully Shimano can make a good profit from this exciting development, they need to recover from the financial hit of their crankset recall debacle.

[@jonesypaddlearounddevon]

I love my yeti always had yeti bikes not lover of shimano gear so yeti ebike had to take back step went for specialized what a game changer ❤love it

[@bradsanders6954]

Its funny, the fanatical need for absolute max power. I go trailriding with 5 other guys on wed, all have various E Mt bikes. None run in boost mode, or extremely rarely would it be used. Max power just isnt the thing for a long trailride, its not used. Losing 40 seconds does not matter trailriding. I have leg power to contribute, Im a bicycle rider as well as ex dirtbike rider for life. Mine is an EP8 bike and it always runs at the front cause I ride it fast, skill is involved in speed. Never had one problem with the motor or bike, it climbs anything I aim it at. Pro racing full power to sell E bikes is a very different thing.

[@Twentykixx]

Yeah, agree with this. I take care of the motor and battery housing/cover as I ride here in the PNW, and haven’t had any issue with my EP8. I set my modes accordingly also, so I know my riding skill set and what I need to accomplish what I want. I don’t get it when I ride with people who just want full power 💯 of the ride, and call it quits early. I can use Trail mode and go x2 times up and down the mountain. I have never had any fade or problems with the motor. I have run out a couple of times, but not because of the motor. The new SRAM T-Type is also a bonus, smooth as butter while crushing rocks. 🙌

[@wayneharris9394]

Can't believe anyone would want to ride in anything other than turbo. Best workout as well if your pushing to the max

[@DW-10]

Ride Bosch in emtb/turbo on fast gravel climbs. Eco on tight trails, toura on flowing trails. New to emtb, but tried turbo on tight single track and turned it down after the 5th time I nearly face hugged a tree because I pedalled just before a corner 😂

[@wayneharris9394]

Yes that is indeed the challenge and the fun. In tight trails you really have to work hard to control turbo

[@vashon100]

@@DW-10 I don't like the over run on the emtb/turbo. Motor manufs should have an app setting to turn it off. When I stop pedaling I don't want the motor to continue.

[@blackbird969]

Instead of developing a new motor, manufacturers should stick all together and come up with a one standard for charging ports for example

[@IvoJaric]

But they still cant make motor without rattling sound and without cutting power over 115 RPM !?

[@mremtb7689]

When you you ever need to peddle greater than 115 rpm?

[@vashon100]

@@mremtb7689 pedal vs peddle

[@nomad-pq4yw8iy7v]

Shimano has the deck stacked against them they need to make a absolute killer motor to over come this. I'm mean the whole package has to be not just better than the comp but, almost like it has to be leaps and bounds to over come what they have been labeled it's not just the power.

[@DekGT5mad]

You're definitely right about the stacked deck, Bosch has been making high speed and high torque electric motors for decade's, but Shimano will catch up with a good recruitment and development program. People like Honda F1 Energy Recovery System technicians and battery engineer's could be possibly be borrowed or one's that don't want the stress of F1 anymore, but are too young to retire. IP bought from similar companies to Bosch, would accelerate development massively. I think they'll catch up by 2024 at the latest!

[@DekGT5mad]

If Shimano can develop at the same or better rate, I can see 2 Aussies battling for the overall championship!

[@troymortimer3487]

I would love to see a super light raced or drop the full power and force SL as the standard

[@FritzPhoto]

Awesome edit and commentary by Steve but seeing by the comments from the Shimano guys I sense some ignorance there. Shimano motors still suck in so many areas, not just power but also reliability is still not on the same page as Bosch and Yamaha.

[@LaurentGIORDANENGO]

My only concern about all of this beautifull film is that shimano won his first EWS-E or now EDR-E at EWS-E Valberg in 2022 with Alex Rudeau...

[@Whyusadd]

I like shimano, and can’t wait to see this bad boy on bikes

[@FantomPhish]

That was a very long advert

[@Shane_has_a_muddy_bike-rx2dv]

The -20c temps on the Annapurna Circuit you just done will kill the the batteries.

[@FreediveRN]

Why did Adam leave EMBN after such a short time? As far as I know, he works for Muc Off now?

[@vashon100]

good.

[@laurenceritchie]

A 17min commercial that tells me they don't have a new motor 🤔

[@thewrx2600]

so the takeaway is that the "tune" or calibration of the motor is a key aspect of how an ebike performs... And not every configuration is optimal for every rider and every terrain, so they should offer more flexibility for riders to be able to adjust to their needs and not just accept what is the "default"

[@Spikejones5001]

Lets talk about the after care issue. We need actual aftermarket support. Its not acceptable to scrap faulty motors when everything else on a bike is serviceable and supported by oem

[@S14AA]

Seems like if they could use previous motor frame again or atleast make people feel older platforms are supported into the future for some future proofing, ad ludicrous mode, and abit better repairability they would nail it 🤔

[@moozeex1]

Shimano can't even fix their old motors and now they making a new one!!1 WHAT A FUCKING JOKE!!!! Why my e 8000 doesn't turn on in -1 C cold SHIMANO????? with a fully charged battery WHYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYY I CAN'T BUY REPLACEMENT PARTS FOR E 8000????

[@DW-10]

Might be a battery protect setting. Lithium batt doesn't like negative deg C temps.

[@BADGERTHEBIKER]

Maybe you should do a piece about how unreliable all these motors are. Ask some bike shops how many failures they have. But I don't suppose you want to upset the sponsors.

[@wayneharris9394]

Supercross on an ebike. What a great idea

[@kodithebear]

What's happened to Adam?

[@Kulric]

The B&W scenes were nice, but maybe open up the mid tones a bit so they don't feel so heavy.

[@wenlambotomy6231]

As long as Stunlocker still works on it 😉

[@wilko2907]

Bosch number 1

[@rawmancemtb]

Shimano EP8 is a shit motor. Least power and least range. Doing a max effort on a 3 min trail segment on the EP8 is way slower than a normal effort on Bosch gen4. Range is almost 20% less than competitors. Sams ebikes has the range test I can confirm the results. Certainly not winning any races because of the motor. 8:40 😂Yeah that's exactly right. Losing 20-30 seconds on the EP8 per stage.

[@fuckinellitsraymo]

Are you talking about the EP8 and not the EP801 because I find the newer motor is on par with Bosch and my Canyon 900WH battery (Non Shimano) does what it says on the tin

[@rawmancemtb]

@@fuckinellitsraymo So how much are you doing on turbo on the 900? And are you using profile 1 or 2?

[@fuckinellitsraymo]

@@rawmancemtb I'm using a modified profile one mostly but using the default profile two for big trail centre loops or blasts up my local hills. I use boost mode occasionally as I find trail mode gets me up most steep stuff. I have a Bosch equipped Trek Rail too so it's easy to compare.

[@rawmancemtb]

@@fuckinellitsraymo So you've never tested the range.

[@fuckinellitsraymo]

@@rawmancemtb Yes, I'm 16.5 stone and recently did 36 miles with 2000 mtrs of elevation and still had 25% battery left.

[@porroco]

What is funny yeti is using sram transmision on the new ep801 motors 😂😂

[@dom9882]

So it was the change in rider then, not Shimano.

[@motoresruedas7357]

Bosch still in the lead

[@marvinlee4887]

Shimano really needs to get back to it's roots and focus on reliability. Pretty well known the EP8 motor suffers from reliablity issues.

[@stephenlord599]

No wonder you can’t buy a shimano motor and warranty takes months .. they must be swapping motors out every stage as they break

[@craigjones9372]

I learned nothing about shimano developing a race motor from this. In fact, I learned nothing about a motor, a bike or anything else. It was 17 minutes of Intro.

[@Ferdigrapher]

totally agree. Not much substance behind the nice pictures at all. Why did they do better at the end? Main question not answered.

[@tsegorahal]

mm, no. As shimano powered ebike owner I would never look for a new bike with shimano motor. I've had a chance to compare it with friend's bikes and I am not so sad only because there were no other options during covid to get a bike

[@DMSGOO]

Shimano&Bosch the cla cla cla cla cla engines

[@danbob1650]

Everyone here saying my scor 4060 with ep8 sucks donkey 💩. ????? Man guys pick it up $2300 off full price. So i got room to buy new motor... Yeah.. hopefully 2 year warranty will fix all the problems.

[@stephenlord599]

Where would you buy a new motor ? Like really .. try actually buying one.

[@jamescross3740]

I don't generally criticize something like this but to me this looks like the biggest piece of corporate propaganda, very polished and professionally produced etc. I don't think there is really any actual info conveyed only that Shimano admitted it was down on power compared to the other motors. I am sorry but what is it the EP801 does BETTER than the previous edition EP800? It has options for Auto Shift and Freeshift but if you have a manual drivetrain then those options have no benefits. I have a EP800 and all the other riders I ride with on any other brand motors can beat me uphill straight up. The EP800 cuts out long before the regulated 20mph cut off even after I've had to a authorized Shimano dealer to attempt to fix that. I live in southern California and luckily don't have water ingress issues like I read about on the forums from the UK and Europe etc and apart from a battery warranty and a bad speed sensor its been reliable albeit tortoise. I am just non plus-ed and will likely look to another mfg at this point when I purchase my next ebike.

[@benperd]

Power stages are the worst thing about ebike riding. It just doesn’t make sense. Too high a bias to light riders. Keep it to long enduro stages.

[@TerryGriebel-cb1wl]

They should warinty the rattle making motters..it's so not cool that rattle..

[@stevenconnor4221]

Shimano should buy bafang as they obviously dont have power expertise. That would be a great move for them, then the first shimano bafang. Known as the shimfang or the bamano motor even better the badmano motor 😂 just send you marketing and stategy buget c/o me 😂

[@Beef0121do1]

Numerous bike shops have told me shimano are the worst for warranty rejecting alsorts with no valid reason. They go wrong the most, weakest out of the top 3 brose, bosch. I ask the same question an purpose as I travel for work and I akqats nip in a bike shop. Their aftercare is nine existant.

[@porroco]

I dont like the go to your local shimano dealer for an answer. Their customer support is pretty bad. I want to sent an email an get an streight answer from shimano

[@kevinrowlands6753]

All electric bikes are poor suffering water problems chains cogs were quick as a example turbo levo who though it a good idea to have a charge port down by the peddles

[@magicsork657]

The fastest is the ep801

[@magicsork657]

Remarkable: In line with our results from the test bench test, the Liteville with EP801 drive moved forward very quickly and covered the test route at an average speed of 15.6 km/h. E-bikes with Shimano's old EP8 or Bosch's Performance Line CX usually reach a speed of just over 14 km/h with the same test parameters. This clearly shows that even in the test procedure with 150 watts of driver power, the EP801 electric motor still pushes measurably and noticeably more power onto the shaft than the other two drives.

[@danbob1650]

New to e bike without looking it up. How spot ep8 to ep801

[@danbob1650]

So here hard to fix n getting parts.. but think you swap parts to upgrade the motor to 801

[@frankdepasquale8715]

It’s not a new motor it’s all new software

[@H3avyHaul3r]

c’mon steve go and get on the Pinion MGU…you know thats the future of emtnbikes, stop trying to prop up the two big S’s and their ancient drivetrain$

[@JoshThomas-b8d]

How do you win a race when you're restricted to 20mph? Ebike racing is bull until you can buy a bike that isn't restricted.

[@embn]

Every bike in the race is subject to the restriction rules :)

[@damianwaters1489]

Shitmano PR

[@wegder]

Everything seems so fake about the motors and the restrictions.

[@neil27pearson]

And will offer no servicing or parts for it!! Be warned..

[@sp3d387]

I see shitmano motor in a ebike, I skip.

[@fzr1000981]

Nope, Bosch race motor winning more races

[@michaelscott6316]

Who buys these unreliable overpriced piles of dung save your money and get a cheaper bike with a real engine that doesn't fall apart after the first puddle

[@g.wilsondh8407]

no Gearbox, no care... sorry Shimano. Time to move on

[@thurgogopro5338]

Got bored after less than 5 mins. Repetitive.

[@scootjockey]

Worse decision i have made on buying an E mtb heavy piece of shite.

[@Matt-bt8zt]

Only with a shimano motor, bosch are great

[@scootjockey]

@@Matt-bt8zt Yamaha px 2 still heavy and still shite.

[@BPF80MCar-vi1pg]

Please tell me they arent racing these things

[@BPF80MCar-vi1pg]

This entire racing ebikes thing might be the most ridiculous thingbive ever heard. How about just strap an ICE engine and call it supercross

[@asifitmatters1]

Autoshift is the biggest pile of nonsense ever!