Shoichiro Irimajiri on SEGA of America & Saturn - 2022 Interview - [ READ DESCRIPTION ]

Check out the HIDEKI SATO Interview as well:
• Hideki Sato on SEGA Sa...
Former Sega president Shoichiro Irimajiri recently gave a lecture series at the Forum of Management for Tomorrow on October 20, 2022, focused on his time at Sega in the 90's. He speaks candidly about the troubles with SEGA of America concerning the 32X and SEGA Saturn.
Huge thanks to MD SHOCK for making this information accessible to English speaking audiences!
MD SHOCK: mdshock.com/20...

[@zacharygirgenti3790]

Great perspective on how a company with so much momentum can fall apart.

[@MegamanNG]

After seeing this and so many others, I am now seeing things in a very different light.

[@thegameoverviewer4508]

I've always believed that the correct decision for SEGA would've been to go in "all guns blazing" with their next generation machine after the Genesis (which was the Saturn). I had always believed that the chain of events leading to a downward spiral, purely from their console business standpoint, began with the decision to greenlight the 32X. All respect to Mr. Irimajiri for both sharing and confirming many things in this interview. In the end, the SEGA Saturn ended up being a *marvelous* video game console (for me). I "saved up my pennies" and bought one at US launch... and even through many real-life events etc, I still have mine today. I could import, therefore I had a full fifth-gen experience with the Saturn. The Japanese library really did deliver the kinds of game experiences I was looking for back then, but not everyone was able to gain access to the full plethora of what the Saturn actually had during those days.

[@retroav777]

Sega of America's concerns on the Saturn's pricing were understandable, but without true support from Japan, the 32X should have never been approved.

[@MaxAbramson3]

Or just release the already developed $50 SVP Lock On cart. There were already four games developed for it.

[@maroon9273]

And a sega mars console project and later neptune as well.

[@MaxAbramson3]

​@@maroon9273I'm saying that Sega would have been more profitable just sticking with their $49.95 SVP Lock On and Sega CD until 1995, and partnering with SONY going 50/50 as SONY had already agreed to.

[@tonberrymasta]

Fantastic video! You know, from watching this, one thing I think they didn't consider at Sega was that the video game magazines had a lot of influence at the time, and the magazines all covered the Japanese launch of the Saturn and Playstation together as the next generation. This basically told the American market that the Saturn was on its way, which undercut the 32X completely.

[@SEGASATURNSHIRO]

Absolutely! They underestimated the effects of globalization...

[@MaxAbramson3]

That's part of it. To stay up with SEGA from 1989-99, you'd have to shell out almost $2,000 for hardware, $200/year. That's roughly a new PS5 every year, adjusted for inflation. NINTENDO kids only had to spend $450 on hardware. And the Sega CD+SVP was a good enough platform to hold up until Dreamcast.

[@l3rvn0]

It's insane how they thought the 32X was a good idea, literally split the software teams, delayed the Saturn's release in the west, and reduced consumer interest in the Saturn by narrowing the graphics gap between it and the Genesis. For comparison, Nintendo canceled Starfox 2, according to them, because they wanted to widen the graphical gap between SNES and N64. When Virtua Fighter came out in the west, westerners were already playing Tekken, so it didn't have the same impact as in Japan, releasing it one year early could have changed things

[@MaxAbramson3]

The 32X was doing fine until word started coming back that the Saturn was more powerful than PS1.... then rumors of an early release of the Saturn came in. Then it happened, and retailers, developers, and gamers realized that SEGA would not stick to its shakey roadmap.

[@SEGASATURNSHIRO]

I don't know where this idea that 32X was doing fine comes from... According to this guy who actually worked at Babbage's for it's launch along with several other consoles claims it was pretty much dead on arrival: www.google.com/amp/s/arstechnica.com/gadgets/2013/01/how-i-launched-3-consoles-and-found-true-love-at-babbages-store-no-9/amp and the recently leaked SEGA fiscal review documents confirm this when you look at the sales figures...

[@MaxAbramson3]

​@@SEGASATURNSHIROSEGA sold over half a million in one month and 800,000 in total. It's the Saturn's impending launch that scared away consumers. The 32X was supposed to have free run until Christmas of 1995.

[@SammySam7x]

They should've release a genesis/sega cd backward compatible saturn a year earlier and scrapped the 32x idea

[@MaxAbramson3]

@@SammySam7x That's basically what the 32X-CD was meant to be, even using the same dual SH2 CPUs to help programmers learn how to write performance code for the Saturn. There was actually some limited success there. In the end, there were only six 32X-CD games, so engineers at SoJ didn't bother. Obviously, it would've made even more sense to build the Saturn in two parts: the original 1993 version (about $200 at retail) and a big addon similar to the Sega CD for more hardcore gamers looking for bigger games, jRPGs, high end 3D graphics, more RAM, game saves, and textured polygons, fog, AA, and effects. Perhaps even offering the $40 RCP + MIPS + 4MB of RAM + 2-4xCD-ROM as an attachment. No more Megadrive bandwidth and color bottlenecks to deal with.

[@nickbond6447]

Oh yeah, Tom and his team HATED Saturn so did the SoA contracted Devs, this is clear in the many interviews and the games they released. Meanwhile SoJ devs diligently produced. With Toms heart in it and no 32X, it would have sold a little better I’m sure. Yes there were tons of mistakes in Japan, but SoA of the early 1990s caused quite a dent. Furthermore, I reckon an early US release would never have happened if he just played ball! Thanks again for shedding light Shiro!

[@SosumiInc]

Tom Kallinske was the only part of the company making sales. The rest of the company was taking a $200 loss per console sold. Kallinske had a plan for $50 profit per system sold. They ignored him and started producing *less* Saturns so they didn't hemmorrhage money. Literally all due to racism;.they didn't want non-japanese control of their company and future, so they murdered Sega of America. Sabotaged the company to do so, and didn't get sued by shareholders. Japan is so polite.

[@ViperGTS737]

There is one relevant detail that I think is important, and it the choice of the CPU, SOA recommended an American brand called Silicon Graphics that was very effective and popular, SOJ rejected this and went with Hitachi SH2, later Nintendo would use that SG chip, and it’s considered a factor in the difficulty to develop games for the Saturn

[@roscoe75]

Tom K. wanted Sega next system to focus on 3D not 2D. He was right about that. Sega of Japan executives were on a different planet. What were they thinking releasing the Saturn at $399 and early not telling retailers. Not good!!!

[@lazarushernandez5827]

That had to be a reaction to Sony's mic drop $299 moment. I had the Saturn reserved at Babbage's for the expected September 95 launch only to receive a call months earlier that the console had arrived. It was cool to have this surprise months earlier, but there were only a handful of titles available at that time. They caught devs off guard because they were expecting the Sept launch. Also several retailers were left out of the loop and subsequently abandoned Sega going forward.

[@MaxAbramson3]

Kalinske, Al Nilsen, Roger Hector, Joe Miller, and most of the other SoA guys wanted to go 3D with SONY or at least SGI's Reality Engine as early as 1993. SoJ said no, then kept trying to retrofit more and more chips into the Saturn to compete. No dev tools until the Saturn was pretty much dead and buried in North America and Europe.

[@chungkingexpress94]

So, the idea that Saturn was going to be a 2D powerhourse is only half true. It was going to do 3D in the beginning, but after they saw the competition they BOOSTED the 3D capability, they weren't adding 3D for the first time. Makes sense.

[@dab7465]

I wanted to buy a 32x back in the days. The retailer told me about the Saturn and i waited and was not disappointed. It's still my main console today. I never understood even back then what sega was doing with there brand, they could be so much more but the human pride from both ceo didn't let it happen :-(

[@MaxAbramson3]

When SEGA brought out the 32X, I was already asking why they'd provided lackluster support for my $300 Sega CD. Then they abandoned the 32X for the Saturn. Why? SEGA wanted another 400 bucks, and we were broke!

[@eduardoalvarez4457]

even if you where uber rich, asking to expend closer to $1,000 in consoles and periphals in a time span of less than 3 years was crazy!@@MaxAbramson3

[@Mitsuraga]

I wanted a Saturn really badly, at the time. I didn't even know about the SEGA CD, 32X, or Nomad.

[@MaxAbramson3]

@@Mitsuraga We now know that the already baked Sega CD + SVP Lock On was capable of doing 80-90% of what Saturn could do. The Saturn was very powerful but very hard to program for. Hideki Sato admitted in an interview that third party developers would spend a week with the console before they could even draw a line on the screen. The PS2 could take over a month to do the same.

[@Adamtendo_player_1]

Well, this is why Sega, I no longer in the console market and wind Nintendo. The true winning team are still doing gangbusters with the switch.

[@retrospiel]

THANK YOU for this. I have been fighting the lies of Kalinske and his fanboys for an eternity and this finally provides first hand interviews from the Japanese side. Thank you!

[@avalond1193]

Right by listening to lies of Sega of japan

[@WillSams]

I would take what he said, years after the fact, with a grain of salt. Businessmen have a tendency to skew the past and/or re-interpret things by mistake and for purpose. So, if folks think "they are hearing the story from the other side", really, I wouldn't take everything he said at face value.

[@lazarushernandez5827]

There is a definite lack of fault presented on their side. Irimajiri was their when the Saturn was cut short in the U.S. (Bernie Stolar was his SoA president, taking the job after Irimajiri stepped in for Nakayama). Stolar prevented certain japanese titles from being ported to the West, he also announced that the Saturn wasn't their future in 97, it was still going strong in Japan and finding its groove in the west. Irimajiri was in charge when this happened. Truth be told both SoJ and SoA contributed to Sega's exit from the hardware market.

[@thegameoverviewer4508]

Thank you so much for sharing this. Now... so many things make sense. We finally have factual confirmation on things that were speculated about for years.

[@DTM-Books]

It's all about timing. In 1993, Sega Genesis was at its peak, and the company's US bosses wanted to extend that momentum for at least two more years. However, they failed to realize that the 16-bit market had not only peaked (spurned greatly by the blockbuster success of Mortal Kombat and NBA Jam), but that it would enter a steep decline for the next three years. So, in that sense, the 32X was a terrible gamble and it ultimately hurt Sega greatly. On the other hand, Kalinske's people were rightly worried about Saturn's price. It was simply far too expensive in a market where $149 was the mass market price, and the hardware was simply too expensive to ever hit that price point without taking massive losses. This left the company vulnerable to a price war, which is where Sony absolutely murdered them in broad daylight. Sony PlayStation went from $299 on 9/95 to $199 on 6/96 and $149 on 3/97, leaving Sega forced to follow the price cuts and subsequently bleed to death. Interesting how absolutely nobody will ever take the blame for 32X. It was always the other guy's fault. Why am I reminded of Reservoir Dogs?

[@StillTheVoid]

🎶You're gonna be o-kay-ay....say the goddamn wor-rds...you're gonna be o-kay-ay!🎶

[@nmcintosh8769]

Donkey Kong Country proved the ,93 wasnt the peak of the 16 it era. ​@@StillTheVoid

[@Gary_Hun]

Desperation and thorough thinking through aside, the MegaCD was their one big shot/opportunity at expanding the Mega Drive. Even if i understand Sega's inner workings better than ever now, i still must say the 32X was very silly.

[@MaxAbramson3]

After having seen some of the limit pushers on the Sega CD--Soul Star, Batman Returns, AH3--it seems unbelievable to me that they would even think of bolting yet another add on. Using SH Mode, they could draw hundreds of colors out of 3,375, and the Sega CD supported games of 500MB for it. FF7 and perhaps even Metal Gear Solid could be done on the Sega CD using prerendered sprites and the ASIC-DSP's scaling-rotation-warping capabilities.

[@Epsilonsama]

The decision of both the 32x and Saturn were wrong. Instead of that they should have developed a full 3d console for 1995 or 1996 with Backwards compatibility with the Genesis and maybe a trade in program to get people who had the Genesis a discount for the new system.

[@Bristecom]

I think it was hard to tell how quickly 3D would progress at that time. The 3D arcade boards were huge and super expensive. Saturn, PlayStation, and N64 used early 3D rendering techniques where they were able to get reasonable quality 3D for a low cost. It wasn't until 1997 or so that 3D chips started to become more standardized and impressive and affordable like the PowerVR in the Dreamcast. I think the 32X and splitting the market with another upgrade was a horrible decision but the Saturn was actually a pretty good design for its time with the best 2D graphics, some decent 3D graphics, a good sound chip, CD based media, easily expandable, etc. They probably could have designed something a little better eventually but as he said in the interview, it would have taken a lot more time and investments and risks. But yeah, not releasing the 32X and making the Saturn backwards compatible with the Genesis probably would have made a big difference in its success.

[@PPHDocumentaries]

Saturn being made backwards compatible with the Genesis would have made the already expensive Saturn even more expensive, thus making it more risky for Sega. Sega did not realize that by the time the Saturn came out, many Genesis owners became old enough where they can get a minimum wage job, and that would have enable them to afford a Saturn. That`s how i was able to own a PS1, N64 and Saturn in the 5th console generation. Also when the Saturn come down in price, many parents would have been willing to purchase the Saturn for their kids. Sega should have not released the 32X, and simply released the Saturn in the fall of 95 when the manufacturing cost would have decreased substantially. And Sonic made by Yuji Naka should have been 1 of the the launch titles.

[@marcusmatthews8255]

Unfortunate what happened at Sega of America after the Genesis

[@GR8FLMD3AD]

A house divided cannot stand.

[@MaxAbramson3]

Sega CD+SVP (and Saturn's VDP1) Having been a huge SEGA booster since I'd bought the Master System in 1987, everyone was gung ho about the all new SVP Lock On cartridge. Using the SH2, 512KB of RAM, and Saturn's venerable VDP1, it would be capable of adding 80,000 Gouraud-shaded, textured polygons per second to Genesis, almost as many as some arcade systems--a huge deal in 1993. This would also allow 256 colors out of 16.7 million and added dozens of games to Saturn's launch library. Game press was abuzz. Star Wars Arcade, Virtua Racer, Virtua Fighter, and Daytona USA had been developed already. A Sega CD+SVP platform could've sustained Sega for two years and run many top titles of the mid to late 1990s. All for just $80. The Sega CD had dropped to $99 by 1995, and a combined console could ship for just $249 by Christmas of 1994 with arcade quality sound and nearly as good graphics. Such a machine could host hundreds of profitable Sega CD+SVP games into the late 90s. Most importantly for SEGA, had the $49.95 SVP Lock On been released with the four games already developed for it (Daytona USA, Star Wars Arcade, Virtua Racing, and Virtua Fighter), far more Genesis consoles would've been sold over the course of 1994, preventing returns by retailers. More third party developers would've come in and stayed, and a renewed effort could've been made to clear out inventories of expensive Sega CD addons. Using all of 1994-95 to promote the Sega CD+SVP would've left SEGA so far ahead of its rivals SONY and NINTENDO would've had a much tougher time signing up even smaller, hungrier devs.

[@maroon9273]

Imagine if hitachi made a 2nd revision svp chip which is more powerful and $20 cheaper than samsung version. Plus, lock-on cart. Even the possibility of having mixing video/audio cable to improve both needs.

[@MaxAbramson3]

​@@maroon9273The SH2 was about the same price, polygon performance, and power consumption. But the SVP and four games were finished. That could've been hundreds of millions in sales including the CD versions.

[@maroon9273]

​​​​@@MaxAbramson3not true, the sh2 is $20 per cpu. Most hitachi risc cpus were $20 to $30 and cheaper compare to the $50 svp chip. Plus, SH-2 can push do more polygons than the svp. Fully 32-bit and has larger bandwidth than the svp chip.

[@MaxAbramson3]

@@maroon9273 The SAMSUNG DSP was $20. The memory and additional ROM and circuitry around the chip increased the price, though Kalinske noted that they'd make a few bucks off of the Lock On cart. I'm saying SH2 + 512KB RAM + Saturn's VDP1, allowing for 256 out 16.7 million colors and rendering 80,000 Gouraud-shaded, textured, polygons per second. That would've cost about $80 (slight loss by SEGA) and resulted in dozens of CD games that would've played natively on the Saturn at launch.

[@georgeschannel9411]

I will never get over the stupidity of the 32x and how SoJ+SoA couldn't work things out and see the bigger picture. The Saturn with the right tools could produce amazing results - yes even in 3D and had it lived as long as PSX we would have seen many more examples of optimised games. SEGA only has themselves to blame - and I'm a SEGA fan boy!

[@SammySam7x]

Interesting perspective from the japanese side but it seems they putting a lot or the blame on developers, Kalinski and SOA and none on themselves. Examples of SOJ dropping the ball include Sega president worrying about the Jaguar and wanting to release an entire 32 bit console (not the saturn btw) in response. All Kalinski did was suggest an addon instead. Also, SOJ pissed off Walmart and EA with their panic, sneaky surprise Saturn launch in the USA. This made Walmart vow to not carry sega products and EA to not make their sports games on sega. Kalinsiki and SOA had the right idea in not abandoning the success of genesis and wanting backward compatibility. The sega saturn already had a cartridge slot. They shouldve made it play genesis games and never release the 32x.

[@Bristecom]

Yeah, the 32X was the biggest mistake. Sega CD was fine. But as you say, they had no faith in the Saturn. Yeah, it was expensive but not 3DO or Neo Geo levels of cost. And as you said, if it was backwards compatible with Genesis (which would have only required minimal adjustments as far as I know), then there'd have been more value to the Saturn. Also, I hated how they always assumed that the US market was SOOO much different from the Japanese market but eventually they realized that American kids and teens actually loved most Japanese games and art like anime so they would have been better off keeping most things inline with Japan.

[@MaxAbramson3]

@@Bristecom Understand what SEGA's roadmap looked like to the world at the end of 1993. The Sega CD was criminally underused, and millions of us were rightly tee'd off. There were rumors of an SVP Lock On cart that could draw 3D polygons over the Genesis backgrounds, making the whole Virtua series possible on Genesis. SoA later admitted that the SVP Lock On cart had been finished, and we've since found that four games (Virtua Racer, Virtua Fighter, Daytona USA, and Star Wars Arcade) had been finished. Even if they'd had to replace the SAMSUNG DSP with the more powerful SH2 and boost the RAM to 512KB, the SVP Lock On cart would be less than $70, and most people would've bought it. More importantly, the Sega CD+SVP was something that gamers, retailers, and third party developers could invest in long run, and the platform would've had all of 1994 and 95 to develop a potent library of proper 3D games, much better codecs for cut scenes and FMV, and huge, textured planes (like Soul Star, Sonic CD, and Batman Returns) with textured polygons for buildings and bad guys.

[@MaxAbramson3]

And Touche about not accepting much responsibility--given that 100% of the changing hardware roadmap and canceled games was SoJ.

[@dragonsofsaturn7391]

The Saturn may have been just as successful as the Playstation if SoA had been willing to step up and away from the Genesis. Hindsight. I'm going back to playing Shining the HolyArk. Thanks for another great Shiro! Video, and remember to PLAY SEGA SATURN!

[@Epsilonsama]

The Genesis was extremely successful and it was until 1995 that the SNES surpassed it barely in America. Imagine telling the president of SOA that we going to rush the production of a new console when the Genesis was still doing great numbers.

[@Kevin-uj4uu]

@@Epsilonsama but it sounds like genesis was topped out by then, and stores were not selling as many genesis by the mid 90s at that point. nvm i found this on wikipedia "Sega underestimated the continued popularity of the Genesis, and did not have the inventory to meet demand". that seems to go against what this soj guy is saying

[@maroon9273]

​@@Epsilonsamathat's was sega's only best selling console. Had the game gear sold as much as the genesis. SOA would've been okay with the sega saturn launch in 1995.

[@MaxAbramson3]

@@Kevin-uj4uu The Genesis and its games were still on store shelves as late as 1998--1999 in some shops. In fact, Sega of Japan was forced to acknowledge in amnual reports the fact that Genesis was still making money when the Saturn was being discontinued and getting put on clearance. Proof that the Kalinske plan had been right.

[@avalond1193]

Sounds like alot of rewriting history by these Sega of Japan guys to try swift blame on Sega usa

[@allgenerationsgamer]

There is one thing that bothers my mind in this interview, if the 32X was the idea of SOA and the idea from SOJ was to split the market Saturn in Japan and 32X in NA. Why did they released the 32X one month later also in Japan? This interview proves the backstabbing of both companies. There are 2 stories, which one is true? Fact is SOA had brought the SEGA brand to its peak, so the momentum was there. But the Saturn wasn’t the right console to go in the next generation even though I love the Saturn. Price, Architecture, Launch and Launch Games all mistakes…

[@dtester]

Interesting to hear the story from the other side. A lot of us heard the story that Nakayama was concerned for the Atari Jaguar and wanted a release a new "enhanced Genesis" while SOA talked them down to a 32x. Most of us agree that an enhanced Genesis would have been stupid with the Saturn coming, but was it possible that the new console mentioned in the story was actually the Sega Saturn? That actually would have been the better move! Now we wonder what are lies or perhaps misunderstandings! ^_^

[@MaxAbramson3]

The Genesis could've been remade with the 32-bit 68EC030 and increased memory in no time, and for not very much money. But the game maker already had the $49.95 SVP Lock On that everyone was anticipating. The Sega CD + SVP could've been the company's platform for two years and already had four games completed.

[@maroon9273]

Later on reviving the mars console concept with the Neptune (genesis and 32x duo). Due to fear of the suprise will crippled the Saturn in the west. Then, canceling it. Sega was very paranoid during the 94 to 95.

[@SammySam7x]

I think SOJ execs are lying by omission. They still hang on to that pride to this day.

[@SosumiInc]

You should play Doom Resurrection on the 32x, and then think long and hard about whether the Saturn was really needed at all.

[@MaxAbramson3]

@@SosumiInc I'm working on the SH2 source code for DR, trying to speed up some time critical routines. I never thought that the Saturn was necessary once we had the 32X-CD, something that was going to be released as the Neptune CD in 1996 for just $199. Taking a hardware loss, SEGA could've marketed it for just $149 or so and kept building the overall platform. If you saw games like Soul Star, Batman Returns, and AH3 on the Sega CD, then you realize that the Saturn (and probably even the 32X) wasn't necessary at that time. Most AAA titles of the mid 1990s could play on the Sega CD had all of its hardware been put to full use.

[@Kadamose]

They didn't need the 32x. The Sega CD had an extra UNUSED Motorola 68000 cpu in it, and they could have made some amazing games, which would have bought the Saturn enough time to have a gpu implemented. Better yet, if they would have accepted the Sony deal, all of their manufacturing woes would have been resolved. If they had made the right choices, it would have been Nintendo who would have bowed out of the console wars because the N64 was an even bigger disaster than the Saturn was. Nintendo, at the time, was also making massive errors in judgement (Virtualboy) and the only difference between Sega and Nintendo was that Nintendo was not experiencing an internal civil war with itself.

[@BurritoKingdom]

And Nintendo had the Gameboy. People forget but the Gameboy is the 3rd best selling console of all time after the PS2 and DS. Nintendo's portable division kept it afloat during hard times. Hell, Japan is basically all portable now. Each successive PlayStation has sold less than the previous in Japan and Sony closed all their Japanese devs except Team Asobi and Polyphony Digital. While the Switch will probably outsell the Gameboy

[@Bristecom]

Sega passed up Sony and Silicone Graphics partner offers - which if they had accepted, would have made them the clear dominant winner in home consoles for a while. But hindsight is always 2020. I'm still grateful for the Sega consoles we had but clearly the 32X was the biggest blunder and should have never been born! LOL

[@maroon9273]

​@@Bristecomplus, sega was impatient with nvidia and lockheed martin which they chose the saturn hardware over those 4.

[@lazarushernandez5827]

@@maroon9273 I don't get how Sega was simultaneously pioneering the use of 3D in the arcades and thinking that their next home platform should have been more 2d focused.

[@maroon9273]

Sega wanted a system32 like sega saturn. Once the ps1 specs were out, they made little changes to beat ​the ps1 in pushing more polygons. But forgot to add better 3d renderings.@@lazarushernandez5827

[@madly909]

Awesome video

[@maroon9273]

Both branches made terrible decisions and after 1994 January meeting, the entire company needed restructuring. Plus, sega should've waited for GPU/Coprocessor chipset for the saturn with a immediate release in 1995/1996 or 1996/1997 (In EU). If SOJ wanted a 1994/1995 or 1995 saturn release. The hardware need to be backward compatible (NA and PAL regions which the neptune project should"ve been) or based off the genesis and sega cd hardware. Which includes certain hardware from the saturn like the vdp2 (lesser specs), 2x cd-rom, faster scu dsp, texture cache ram, mpeg slot, a cutdown scsp audio chip, ram/rom expansion, and SH-2 or different risc cpu from other companies. The 32x, mars/neptune console was not needed for the NA market. All NA needed is enhancement chips, SVP chip especially 2nd revision to put the price down, better software development kits and resources in upcoming genesis/sega cd games. Remastering genesis/sega cd and release sega publish and developed games prior to the saturn release in the mid 90s.

[@DDRmails]

one of main mistake was - no back copability with megadrive, and whole politic of usage the cartrige slot.... its would solve the nevessity of 32X, which is was too weak wor saturn... but if look at first concept of saturn (with single SH2) so actually 32x seems decent

[@Gary_Hun]

Then what the frick retailers do exactly apart from being a big house with a cash register in the corner, if they don't even take the risk of ordering in stock on their own money?! That return thing with all money back crap is completely new to me.

[@warchild9381]

The 32X is the ultimate, "bold move Cotton" if there ever was one. It's like Sega wanted to self-destruct or something.

[@nathleflutiste]

This is not true. The 32X didn't do bad at the beginning. What really killed it was its end of support. If you look at the sales, they were going well until that point.

[@Robbinsffxi]

It's interesting how the Genesis infuenced their decisions negatively. Sony didn't have any console before and was motivated to make something new. At the end of Genesis's lifetime the console was basically an SoC (system on a chip). They could have easilly made the Saturn backwards compatible with the Genesis, add a SH-2 and 3D chip and call it a day. It was going to have a cartridge slot anyways and by making it backwards compatible they would keep many of their current Genesis owners.

[@Kevin-uj4uu]

i think something along the lines of what the ram extension cartridge for saturn is fine for upgrading a machine. nice little cheap boost, and not an entire new console that leeches off the old on that is rather expensive. like did they really think developers or players would really want an expensive half wit 32 bit console or a real 32 bit consoles that were just around the corner

[@Kevin-uj4uu]

surprise launch and not many games at launch or after launch. i know people love the saturn library of deep tracks but they didnt have the heavy hitters for larger appeal. they should of had everything in order and focus on the saturn completely with big name titles. imagine at launch, 32bit 2d sonic with sprite scaling and rotation fully incorporated that had different intersecting lanes at certain points. Ecco for saturn. just more 2d games that incorporated their ips in general along with their new ones. they would still lose to the ps1 but they still could have been successful

[@Clodd1]

What a mess. Several years later, SoA and SoJ are still in disagreement. We could have been playing on a Sega console in 2023.

[@pashaxyz9496]

...two different scenarios... SoJ needed to go to next gen because Mega Drive was not so succesful... SOA wanted to extend a sucessful Genesis life... tom Kalinske did a excelent marteking for SEGA America, but Genesis couldn´t be updated with a add on again, after the Sega CD ( great manchine) failure.... Saturn had to be launched in America on right time, more software and enough stock ....the issue about reailers limited stock was a very bad decision.... although PS fenomeal ( more 3d titles, "lower price"), more flexible library, massive thirdy suport , probably cannot be avoid PS1 success...but the impact over Saturn failure maybe will be minimized...

[@liquidsnake6879]

The PlayStation was almost on the level of Virtua Racing? Bro, it outclassed the Model 1 board considerably, by an order of magnitude, i think he means the Model 2 and is confused

[@sega-re-trop-vieux]

They should have reported the Saturn launch for 1996 in Japan and improve the Saturn with a gpu, meanwhile the 32X would have maintained the hype.

[@BurritoKingdom]

The Saturn was Sega's most successful console in Japan. It was outselling the PS1 until Square announced FF7 for the PS1. It was in the US where it failed. And the 32x made it worse. Americans were wary about Sega because they kept having add-ons that they kept abandoning. Also graphics aren't everything. If graphics was the Neo-Geo should have won the 16 bit era and the N64 the 32/64 bit era. Even making a console easy to develop for doesn't matter. The PS2 was one of the hardest consoles to make game for and it blew out the competition and is the best selling console of all time. And why? People believed the hype of the PS2. Sony was great at marketing. That plus it was a DVD player.

[@sega-re-trop-vieux]

@@BurritoKingdom i know that, the 🇺🇸 was responsible for their bad marketing and obviously just abandoned the Saturn in 96. I don’t like the 32X however they rush that add on and the timing was really bad. Graphics in mid 90’s were important, do you remember the Sony marketing? They said that the 32bit system from Sega can’t handle true transparency ( obviously fake ) and magazine, journalists said at that time the ps1 was way more powerful than the Saturn ( which isn’t the case in terms of specs)

[@BurritoKingdom]

@@sega-re-trop-vieux yes, that's why I said Sony's marketing was great. That was Sony at the top of their brand recognition when their TVs, camcorders, electronics were the best and they leverage that for the PS1 and PS2. Sega lost due to bad business decisions, wasteful spending, bad marketing and negative brand reception due to 32x and Sega CD being abandoned quickly. But mostly due to wasteful spending. R&D ain't cheap, manufacturing ain't cheap and rent ain't cheap. Which SOA was at fault at. They ordered so much inventory and housed them in warehouses in the Bay Area. The fact that there was over 250,000 Doom carts for the 32x by 1997 is disgusting. That means there was a lot money lost manufacturing all those carts and a lot more money just housing it.

[@jsr734]

@@BurritoKingdomIt was a DVD player, a Ps1 player, a CD Player, a Ps2 player and if you were nerdy enough a Linux PC. 😎🤓

[@maroon9273]

​@@BurritoKingdomatleast the ps2 had conservative hardware design like the n64 and atari jaguar.

[@Adamtendo_player_1]

I think Sega of America didn’t have confidence in Saturn, and their poor marketing of the Saturn made that abundantly clear.

[@matthoward9509]

You tend not to mention that the saturn was lousy and buggy and had like 8 games for it ours locked up all the time.

[@arakachiyoga2253]

Is this the guy that denied Ayrton Senna the Honda engines for ‘93 F1 season that led to his death in ‘94?

[@ciello___8307]

no but he did engineer hondas legendary grand prix bikes of the '60s and their first F1 engines. He was a brilliant engineer. Maybe not the best executive for a video game company though.

[@billyjesus5442]

very interesting, sounds like tom played a big hand in sega's failure. But you wouldnt know it from talking to him.

[@SEGASATURNSHIRO]

It's not like he's going to throw himself under the bus... That said, many mistakes were made in Japan as well. Nakamura should have been on top of the accounting from the very start (I mean... That was his job...) If they had been following the numbers, they would have seen the losses much sooner, and could have worked to correct course and force Tom to restructure earlier, when it would have made a difference... SoJ was the parent and SoA was the child, and I feel that parents are equally responsible for their children's behavior.

[@billyjesus5442]

but its quite telling that tom never ever mentions any of his own failings. @@SEGASATURNSHIRO

[@MaxAbramson3]

​@@SEGASATURNSHIRO100% pure, unfiltered wrongitude. Tom called the shots until January of 1994, and things were going great. As soon as the $50 SVP Lock On cart was replaced by the rumors of a $200 addon that SoJ wanted, the SEGA roadmap became uncertain. From then on, SoJ increasingly micromanaged things, right down to moving up Saturn's release date. Marketshare under SoJ was 3% and quickly returned to 3% when Kalinske was gone. The list of successful consoles released and managed by SoJ: That is all.

[@Gorilla_Jones]

A huge grain of salt with this.

[@maroon9273]

No, Joe Miller who pitched for the 32x add-on while no one from both branch sit there and agreed with his idea. After that sega should've restructure the entire branches after the Mars Project meeting.

[@fXoKDM]

SOJ was terrible SOA tried to help them out but like always Japan made all the bad Decisions i don't want to hear that they. Know what they should had did they should had listened to Tom Kalinski and jump on bored with silicon graphics Inc but SOJ was like naw we good lol that's why i will never respect SOJ

[@sylviusdelvalie9671]

History will come full circle when Microsoft buys Sega.

[@avalond1193]

I'd rather see Nintendo merge with Sega than see Microsoft buy and kill sega

[@avalond1193]

Sounds like ALOT of rewriting history on sega of japan part.. they were greatly responsible for alot of what went wrong with saturn, and seemed more focused on sega of japan beating sega usa . Ask him why they demanded eternal champions 3 get cancelled when it was very popular for sega usa players and they were anticipating it. They didnt want to have virtua fighter get outshined and released it bare boned here in the u.s. EC was more popular than VF at the time and they could of released both they bloody owned the ips. Just alot of jealousy

[@TECHVSTECHX]

Loved this historical lecture from your channel from the great Shoichiro San! Sega was my first console ! It was the Master System then until the Dreamcasts demise.❤️‍🔥 The blunder that Sega of America made would trickle down to doom the entire industry after the arrival of Xbox. then after all this it was utter mediocre garbage gaming business models! and spurred by off shelf technology with diminishing returns of same old lame rasterized 3D and gimmickry crap effects like RT reflections . All so obviously Rasterized graphics none the less.Then add to this the off shelf technology of AMD ,then throw in the MS game pass subscription model of low quality games , and what you have is garbage shovel ware ,cross gen game releases, and an occasional rare very rare (every 6 years )next gen AAA game (1 or 2 !) . Truly pathetic. Unqualified “gaming” Companies like Trillion dollar Microsoft have forced the industry into a greedy profit model of low quality mediocre game development with high quantity of mediocre games and high quantity of subscriptions models. At this point Sega ,Nintendo and Sony should just join forces or one of them partner with Apple or IBM , Samsung or Huwaweii and start building their own bespoke gaming console and go back to games and focus on blockbuster AAA development. Get some ASML fabs going and return to focus on Games ! Hi End games ! Or all be damed if Apple and TSMC pulls this off all on their own and the Vision Pro enters into the console market !With Sega and Nintendo on board! I loved the fact that these lame 3rd party game developers could not program assembly on the Saturn !But the Japanese in house could ! Same would be the situation with Sony PS3 . Truly lame and mediocre stuff ,such as where we are now current gen where all the “Next gen “ games are a vomit fest of remix , remakes of old titles with upgrade rasterized crap gimmicky effects! Give me a break! Go back to AAA games ! Not subscriptions and remakes ! Truly sad when if you look at all the Sega /IBM/ Lockheed Model 3 games all ran at 60 fps and looked stellar even now compared to a lame stale lifeless sterile boring looking games such as Gran Turismo 7. Truly pathetic! Where are the true Next Gen games!

[@MaxAbramson3]

Writing high performance Assembly for SuperH is really hard. I'm working on a project right now, and there's little documentation and no tricks and performance books.

[@SosumiInc]

*Nobody* could write games for the SuperH. Your worship of japanese programmers is misplaced. Remember Square had to hire an Iranian to write good 6502. Imagine if PS3's Cell had no documentation or SDK, and developers were just told to "guess" via trial and error. That's the Saturn and the SuperH. Your belief in "bespoke" systems died when Sony controlled the entire supply chain post-PS1. Nobody could compete, and consolidation became appealing. Why do you think every console opted for PowerPC before going X86_64/AMD? The costs were too high to absorb in-house. Nothing they could create today can compete with AMD/TSMC without alienating both developers and shareholders, now that everyone's trained on Vulkan for a full console generation now.

[@MaxAbramson3]

@@SosumiInc Like I say, I'm working on SuperH code for DR, and it is difficult. When developers have a mix of C code and SuperH Assembly to optimize, obviously, they're going to put their efforts into what they know--improving C. Performance and development time of 32X, Saturn, Dreamcast, and other applications of the embedded ISA suffered. The SH5 would've been much easier.

[@MaxAbramson3]

@@TECHVSTECHX Not sure what you're talking about. I just believe that SEGA would've done been continuing with the Sega CD+SVP approach that Kalinske's team seemed fine with.

[@TECHVSTECHX]

@@SosumiInc Did you even watch the interview ? there were two segments ! Did you even play Sega arcade games at a Sega Center in Akihabara or Long Beach CA ? Do you know who Yu Suzuki is? So about my point . Look at Apple and go tell Apple to stop making their bespoke Arm silicon , and go tell the graphics design software companies to stop developing bare metal software that performs better on Apple Silicon Macs ! Get the picture! Keep consoles bespoke ! keep PC shovel ware and off shelf tech separate! That's my point ! focus on games and the high end cinema experience on consoles ! and leave the subscription Xbox gpass PC crap experience on PCs and for Amazon streaming . 🤮