Should All Ancient Coins Be Locked Away in Museums?

[@ClassicalNumismatics]

The inspiration for this video comes from the very well thought-out article in favour of Numismatics made by Gareth Harney, author of "Moneta The Rise and Fall of Ancient Rome in Twelve Coins". Make sure to follow his work at www.harneycoins.com/

[@edwinvdv7030]

The circumstances in my private "museum" at home are better than in most museums in countries in the Middle East or most of the Mediterranean. I have a good security system (and moreover, my basement is a vault of itself), air-cleaning, humidity and temperature control. These denarii and aurei have never been kept better in the past 2000 years. The pictures are still available to scientists, as I bought them on the big and well known auction-sites. And eventually, they will outlive me and the best pieces will probably end up in another good collection or museum. Couldn't be better, I think.

[@emcee6365]

There are too many ancient coins out there to put them all in museums.

[@filmbuffo5616]

Many of the best museum collections had their start as privately gathered collections which were then donated to the museum. Private collectors and museums complement each other as to the preservation of these artifacts. Some pieces are simply too expensive for a museum to acquire, but it may come to them in time from the estate of the collector.

[@MPLS_Andy]

This. The amount of major collectors that will their collections to museums after they die is huge.

[@henrikbergholtz3811]

Spot on! One of this year’s most important video! Thank you, for an interesting and important youtube-channel.

[@MPLS_Andy]

This hobby is under attack, but it's also growing and spreading because of videos like yours, which showcase it. A lot of great history is being understood and appreciated because of the internet and videos like this.

[@ClassicalNumismatics]

Thank you for the kind words! I hope this can become a full-time thing

[@chezburger1781]

some people just don't realize how many thousands of ancient coins are sat on shelves of some museum backrooms and that museums have no interest in most coins.

[@limaechonumismatics]

Really good advice at the end about keeping track of where you got your coins from, and keeping dealers accountable!

[@briank7936]

I have to agree with your points. I am a member of 2 numismatic societies, and I have not heard either of them bring up this topic. They have thousands of members and can influence this concern in the favor of collectors.

[@ClassicalNumismatics]

Put particular pressure on the dealers that are part of these associations. They are the ones with the time to push our agenda. If they dont show interest in the matter, one must start wondering if maybe they are more interested in cartelizing this market rather than protecting your rights as a consumer and client.

[@compatriot852]

Noticed a lot of coins tend to get confiscated during transport. Do you think you could make a more in depth video on ensuring a collection stays safe while going abroad via plane for example?

[@antonio4782]

Excelente video Leo,una exposición perfecta de la realidad acrual mas lo que nos espera,un fuerte abrazo.

[@ClassicalNumismatics]

Gracias Antonio! Hay que despertar para esta realidad y luchar por los derechos individuales de la gente

[@Bluelobster36.5]

I think some coins should be in museums like those found at archeological sites but most ancient coins are just found out in a field by metal detectors and those should be allowed to be collected by the public

[@ClassicalNumismatics]

Exactly! I think the same

[@istoppedcaring6209]

they should be protected from remelting by giving them a slightly higher vallue than the base metal vallues, if it works for euros it works for any precious metal items

[@Bluelobster36.5]

@@ClassicalNumismatics I also think the rules they have in the UK that incentivise people to report there findings so that the museums can learn from them with out taking there stuff are very good

[@PCMcGee1]

Before you even say "in a museum" you should be aware of the theft and dereliction of museum artifacts that goes on. It's an absolute nightmare and only getting worse over time.

[@ClassicalNumismatics]

Even the British Museum had a case of stolen artifacts recently! As I mentioned in the video, just because they work at a public institution and for the State, it doesnt mean they become infallible and incorruptible all of a sudden.

[@blackbaron9544]

On the topic of educating and making sure coins are enjoyed by the public, every coin collector i know (myself included) are dying for the chance to show off and talk about their hobby and coins with someone that wants to know about them. Id bet more people get to enjoy them in the hands of private individuals than the storage boxes in the back of a building

[@harryzero1566]

The answer to the question, it should be finders keepers. Museums have more than enough of every era. Coins are basically currency that were in everyday use.

[@leonardolatini1450]

Without coins Collectors, who truly love them as ancient artifacts and connections between older civilization , probably a lot of them never reached modern time. Archeologist have already enough info about ancient coins in circulation because coins are already classified in books and archives. Politicians normally talk without knowing the exactly matter of things, but they use words to taking personal advantage. I am a coins collector, truly grateful to people before me handled and took care of the coins who now I have. Then , when my time arrives, I hope someone else cares as me and my predecessor to preserve this beautiful piece of history to the future

[@Numischannel]

Hello Leo, you know that I think 100% like you: Numismatics is a science thanks solely to research carried out by private and independent academics, since AD 1350 until today. The contribution of museums was much smaller and, although important, was only made by museums in countries that do not criminalize coin collecting, because it is in those countries where there is a thriving numismatic community interested in the coins that a museum could display and publish, and that produce the experts necessary for the advancement of our science, both curators and researchers.

[@MPLS_Andy]

I think the ANA has something like 800+ Athens owls in its archive. I can't think of a single ancient coin in private hands that doesn't have at least one corresponding example in a museum somewhere. Maybe that Panticapaeum facing gold stater, but that's it.

[@squiggymcsquig6170]

The potential is always there that someone may have a unique specimen in their private collection that the world has never seen; but so what? Does this change the trajectory of humanity? No. All of this clamoring against collectors is literally an attack on the very concept of private ownership and the accumulation of individual wealth. Sound like a certain political ideology? That's because it is.

[@squiggymcsquig6170]

2nd attempt at a reply: There is always the possibility of a unique coin being in a private collection, but is this a horrible thing? No. It doesn't deprive humanity of some amazing advancement. Those who rail against coin collecting (or even, heaven forbid, coin investing) are likely to also rail against the very concept of private ownership. This lovely p'form decided my first reply was unacceptable for some reason, even though it said the same thing with a couple different words. Let's see if this one lasts.

[@francescofrancesco4512]

from Jannuary 1st in Italy a new law requires obtaining an import permit for artworks valued above 5000 euros. The situation is serious because, in a short time, this threshold will be lowered, effectively forcing all collectors to obtain permits to purchase artistic objects from abroad. In practice, they are trying to eliminate what remains of artistic exchanges to and from Italy. When I was writing my thesis during university I asked many times to the Soprintendenza Archeologica of Pompei the permission to see the paintings in the storage. I had an answer just 3 years after I finished the university ...

[@ClassicalNumismatics]

Its actually a legislation that affects ALL of Europe. Definitely something terrible that needs to be stopped!

[@choppacast]

I don't really know what those people want. They complain about "muh evil robber British Museum" at the same time they protest the main thing prevented by such museums, which are private collections What happened in Palmyra and Afghanistan shows how different countries don't care the same about historical objects Thank God there are private individuals helping to preserve what they can

[@ClassicalNumismatics]

Typical case of NPC Thinking. The comments section gives me a bit of hope, though. Quite a bit of smart people waking up to the trend of government overreach

[@Muenzenundmehr.]

I have been collecting coins for 5 years now, and a few weeks ago, I was able to purchase my first ancient coins at a good price as part of a lot. At first, I was very surprised that most of these coins are valued at just 1-5 euros, even though they are almost 1,700-2,000 years old. They now almost seem to lie around, and you end up with quite a few duplicates that are hard to sell. Since I often go out with a metal detector myself, I often hear stories from others about how, during house construction, one or two Roman coins were found and were kindly reported to the authorities. This resulted in a three-year construction halt due to excavations during which no further coins or artifacts were found. I believe that any reasonably skilled and informed numismatist is just as much a scientist and often takes better care of individual pieces than an employee at certain institutions. Reforms and better education on this topic are urgently needed so that private collections are accepted and respected. Coin collectors should not be immediately portrayed as criminals or hoarders simply because they collect coins. Thank you for the good and informative video.

[@monedasehistorias]

An exceptional video 👏👏 You already know that I agree 100% with everything you argue. From our channels we must spread this message, that collecting and studying ancient coins is not a crime and that collectors have rights. Congratulations for the video!

[@ClassicalNumismatics]

Thank you very much Marga! From the positive comments we're seeing, lots of people agree with us! ♥

[@squiggymcsquig6170]

Those saying you're creating looters are the same ones pushing a cashless digital society. Also, the very concept of private ownership is in the crosshairs.

[@drcolinwall1486]

It is mentioned below but just to emphasis the point, it is not only that most coins in museums are "sat on shelves" which infers a sense of order and well-being. In many museums the coins are badly kept, often in wrappings known to corrode them, with poor climate control, with poor, dated, erroneous or non-existent attributions. Collectors have the time and the inclination to try to ensure the correct storage and attribution of their coins - most museums don't. If you want a bit of fun, take one of your coins, find the attribution on OCRE, click on the blue title so you can see all the examples from different museums and see how many wrong attributions you can find.

[@ClassicalNumismatics]

Ohh, good to know I was not the only one to notice that! Soo many mistakes. Thank you for pointing it out.

[@rodrigodeoliveiraleite5129]

​@@ClassicalNumismaticsNot only that, but also coins with active BD that are not treated.

[@stephenparker4083]

“Citizen science” is a good appellation for ancient numismatics and its enthusiasts.

[@wadeng3410]

Coins are different to antiquities as they were state / city / leader issued money / currency for circulation, not as artifacts (for the most part to fund wars). So while there are some key numismatic pieces and finds that should be in museums the remaining 99.9 % could be just that ... old money (some of it very pretty). My grandfather was given denarii as change when buying in a store in Italy as late as the 1930s. (store ran out of change). So, in my humble option, they should be freely traded and doesn't make sense to restrict what was used as money or collectables for thousands of years.

[@neilterry1726]

Great video on an important subject, many great points. It may or may not be a sad reflection on society, but when it comes to especially more common antiquities like coins or fossils, or more recent historical items of value like art or historic guns or cars or jewels, they are often better off in private hands. Museums have limited funding, limited space, and most importantly, and causal to these previous issues, limited public interest. Literally countless tons of interesting historic items and artifacts are essentially hidden from public view in museum backrooms because they don't draw enough mass interest to justify the expense of display. And museums are not perfect, they can and do lose items, and just like private collections, are subject to war, terrorism, natural disaster, as well as political corruption both from their own governments and internally from politically motivated academics. Ideally, private collectors would be generous, and allow public photos and relevant academic research involving their collections, and laws would be respectful of both private collecters and public interest. But whether or not, private collectors of all manner of artifacts have been essential in preserving history for as long as interest in history has existed among humans...appreciation of history (and art) and the ownership and preservation of art and artifact has always been part public, part private. All that said, I personally would love to acquire a modest but quality- made replica of the bronze statue honoring Momofuku Ando that stands at the Instant Ramen Museum in Osaka Prefecture, Japan. But if the original, for whatever reason, is ever sold....it would be tempting....

[@peterkordziel7047]

Did you notice that the coin you're holding at 12:42 is a trick image that, if turned so it's right hand side is "down", it becomes an image of a war galley's Rostrum?(bow ram). I have a radiate bronze of Claudius like this but it was poorly done and I can't tell what either image is!😅

[@ClassicalNumismatics]

Good eye!

[@ClearlynotaBalmist]

Great video and Showcase of knowledge. During the XVIth century even some theologians of the Salamancan school wrote Numismatic treaties

[@Numischannel]

21:59: In this photo, the only coins minted in what is now Italy are... the bronze 10 centesimi of Vittorio Emanuele II and the silver 500 lire 1958... 🤣🤣🤣

[@jppagetoo]

A museum is a good place to put coins if you don't want anybody to see them. Example: The US collection at the Smithsonian has some of the rarest and greatest US coins. The collection is vast and nearly complete. Only a very limited number are on display. If you want to see the King of US Coins, the 1804 dollar, great! They are on display. If you want to see early US gold, which few were made and even fewer survive, you will be sorely disappointed in that only a few are on display.

[@jonathanaristone2468]

Thanks for this Leo !

[@allanlangdale1028]

As always, excellent video.

[@nsi-nbsecretary7232]

Another excellent video and I agree with much of the sentiment with it in relation to the role of amateur numismatists. All of my collection is available online and I have no hesitation in allowing royalty and attribution free access to any of the images and am happy to provide any information on request.

[@ClassicalNumismatics]

Thank you for making your collection available for the public to enjoy and research!

[@bratrcunik4571]

Numismatics as a science was founded by private individuals, not academics. This is the main argument for the existence of private collections. Museums should have representative collections of coins, but they should not prevent enthusiasts from starting their own collections. By the way, I have to admire the denarius of Faustina the Younger at the beginning of the presentation.

[@ClassicalNumismatics]

Couldnt agree more! Thanks for the kind words on the Denarius, its one of my favourites 🌟

[@1917WWI]

I agree I enjoy showing them to friends and explaining the origin of the coin!

[@neilterry1726]

One follow-up comment...the idea that someone metal detecting for coins, or even the finder of a hoard or valuable artifact should be regarded as suspicious, and should gain nothing (or worse) for their effort or luck is contemptible. The causes of such behavior might be many...there is government greed, there is the governmental urge for over-control, there is government desire to control historic, socioligical, or religious narratives, but none of the reasons are good reasons, they are all negative qualities with negative consequences for the people. There is a similar idea among academics, that any artifact that is not important enough for immediate study should be left decomposing in the ground until someone "qualified" can be bothered. This has some merit in some cases of under-explored territory, or when dealing with looters of already-claimed shipwrecks or known archaeological sites. But when applied to every coin and shard of pottery it quickly becomes a politicized, often racialized, and elitist argument for public ignorance and elite control of information and value. Respecting the wishes of existing civilizations is one thing, but the long-dead are long-dead, and their human history, at least in part, now belongs to every human still alive, both collectively and individually.

[@ClassicalNumismatics]

You are 100% right by pointing out the disturbing trend governments have of over-controling every aspect of society, including the material good of its individuals and the overarching cultural zeitgeist a culture works with. It is a scary trend we see everywhere, even in the supposedly freedom-loving western world, and we need to push back against this kind of Government overreach if we dont want to become mere cattle for a caste of holier-than-thou buraucrats.

[@bryanoneal8067]

The Boston MFA polished their coins to a blast white. Huge loss.

[@ClassicalNumismatics]

Good lord. One would think they knew how to take care of these things.

[@aureaphilos]

@@ClassicalNumismatics If only they had consulted with an average Numismatist; I'm sure that any coin shop or collector could've given them valid advice on how to display their coin collection. I can see a museum of 'fine art' wanting to remove all traces of patina, to show the coin in a freshly minted state, but wouldn't it be more meaningful to also show identical coins in their 'natural' state of preservation?

[@HungoverHistorian-zf6gi]

Saw the same awful stuff in the Buda castle, albeit a smaller collection. I thought the cleaning was some old 19th Century or Communist period intervention

[@mt6544]

Well said, Sir! You nailed it.

[@akwinter]

I agree with everything you’ve said. But don’t forget about dealers. Some people pay the bills by playing show and tell with their public collections.

[@ClassicalNumismatics]

Dealers should be the people most concerned about the protection of this hobby. Im more than happy to pay the premium they charge for their coins if they actually wake up and push for legislation to protect our rights to collect.

[@compatriot852]

Coins were a thing ancient people produced in the millions. It's not like they were rare commodities

[@ClassicalNumismatics]

Precisely! Thats why the argument from archaeologists that these are "priceless, unique artifacts" simply doesnt hold water.

[@filmbuffo5616]

Makes one wonder if there were collectors of coins, whether of ancient and old or contemporary, in antiquity. I suppose there probably were.

[@evanever]

I do agree with this general idea but doesn't that open people to criticism for owning coins that are, say, 'one of five known examples'? Just a thought.

[@brunoovejero1073]

This is a very important topic you are spreading. As much as it seems like "common sense" to think that ancient objects should be in museums, this is ridiculous when it comes to coins (which there are millions of circulating in private hands for a long time). The study of numismatics and private collecting need each other.

[@gnotter7676]

One of a kind items belong in a museum. Coins were massively produced so to have all of these in museums is ridiculous. It is important however that all coin types are in museums and can be easily accessed and researched by historians. This is mostly already the case. Museums already have massive coin collections, which is a good thing. There are still coin types out there which are only privately held, collectors outbidding museums in this regard is a problem. I know a guy who metal detects in his free time who has a coin wanted by a big museum, but the museum isn't able to offer him the market value of the coin, so he isn't willing to sell. In my opinion some legislation is needed here.

[@limaechonumismatics]

I think the private collector is entitled to his find, and if the museum can’t afford the market price, maybe the museum needs more funding!

[@heavymetalcoins]

All our ancient coins in museums and all our money in public treasury...every dictator's dream. 👌

[@4doormas758]

ancient Roman and Greek coins were manufactured all over Europe so to return these coins how can we do that? Because we don't know what country they came from. So, if a coin was made in Portugal or Spain or Syria do we hand it over to England?

[@Kaesar39]

Fantastic video! One clarification, in Italy the metal detector can be used and purchased, its use in archaeological areas is obviously prohibited, and if you find something ancient you have to report it. 90% of the time the authorities don't want to know about it and send you home with a permission slip to keep the coins, but no one really does. As for the shame of musealization here in Italy, it is absolutely a nightmare. Pieces are constantly disappearing from museums, especially those in repositories that are not visible to the public have appalling gaps, in fact often those who work in those environments are underpaid or worse are never checked, it agrees that pieces that can now only be seen in photos often disappear. Private collections are a boon for the preservation in large quantities of coins, more than that!

[@neptunesmarsh]

Treasure hunters, private enthusiasts, and even just simple farmers blaze the trail trod by state-funded academics. The tomb of Tutankhamun was discovered by Howard Carter, who was patronized by Lord Carnarvon. The Valley of the Golden Mummies was discovered after some farmer stumbled across a crack in the ground. Giovanni Dattari was a late-19th/early-20th century Italian businessman, who assembled and catalogued the most thorough collection of Roman-Egyptian coins in the world, and whose work is still referenced by dealers and collectors today.

[@lr6648]

I think the collectors are keeping the coins' purpose alive. These coins were made with the intention of circulating and going from person to person, by going to and from collections, the coins are continuing their journey. They are also going to places where their history and artistry can be given the respect it's due.

[@jonathanaristone2468]

Leo on another question after my intro. Today in church the sermon talked about a point in time 490 yrs BC. The oldest coin in my collection is Greek Stator from 530 BC, What is the earliest known coin or when was the earliest coin introduced? Thanks

[@ClassicalNumismatics]

Coins were likely invented around the 650s BC in the Kingdom of Lydia. Have a look at my channel page, over on the videos list. There's a video called "The First Coin" where I look at some of the very first coins ever made. You will enjoy it :)

[@jonathanaristone2468]

@@ClassicalNumismatics Thanks Leo, great info. Do you have an episode on Widows Mites by chance?

[@ClassicalNumismatics]

Not yet, I need to study the subject a bit more, check out "Numischannel", he has quite a few videos on biblical coinage. Its in Spanish, but you should have no issues following him with subtitles

[@CapAnson12345]

Museums would just stack boxes of them in the backrooms gathering dust except for maybe a small display. There's nothing magically noble or anything about museums. In fact the purpose of them in the first place is for people to come and see interesting historical things. And frankly, coins don't exactly display well for the masses. I don't think museums are supposed to be government run and mandated warehouses in charge of all things historical. Actually I think there's a lot of things in a lot of museums that should be considered for sale to private parties. They don't necessarily do a good job of curating them.

[@operator1997]

I hope that advances can be made to achieve this balance thru a lobbying front by the community.

[@VirginiaBikeWoman]

How much extra do archeologists get from keeping multiple , hundreds, even thousands of the same coins found in hoards? They end up putting them in a pile and charging people to see them.

[@Gumardee_coins_and_banknotes]

Wikipedia has an article on Han coins and the reference "Nishijima, Sadao (1986), "The Economic and Social History of Former Han", in Twitchett, Denis; Loewe, Michael (eds.), Cambridge History of China: Volume I: the Ch'in and Han Empires, 221 B.C. - A.D. 220, Cambridge: Cambridge University Press, pp. 545-607, ISBN 978-0-521-24327-8." you can find online. It states that in the Han from 118 BCE-5 AD 28 billion coins were made, for an average of 220 million per year. I assume they are all Wu Shu coin. The Tang in Tien Pao 742-55 327 million per year most likely Kai Yeun Tong Bao, Sung had 3 billion minted in 1045 and 5.86 billion in 1080. Just show you for China the mintages were hugh as the economic development was advanced and population large. I assume the same for the various Indian coins and alot are very common.

[@ClassicalNumismatics]

Thanks for the info Glenn, I didnt know about these numbers, thats a staggering number of coins made! 👀

[@monedaslimpias]

Siguiendo esta corriente cancelatoria sobre la numismática, y estableciendo un paralelismo con ella, se me ocurre que podemos empezar a devolver las pizzas, y los macarrones a Italia, porque proceden en su origen de allí, o los BMW y los audi a Alemania. Empecemos a censurar por poner música andaluza a aquellos países que lo hagan, llevemos todo el picante a México y el Senado española a Roma... Es completamente ridículo. Un fuerte abrazo y excelente vídeo, Leo.

[@ClassicalNumismatics]

Muchas gracias Oscar! Me gusta ver en los comentarios que hasta la gente del mundo Anglosajon, donde tienen muchos mas derechos que nosotros, estan preocupados con el tema, y estan de acuerdo que hay que luchar contra la cancelación. Hare mas videos del tema en 2025. Un gran abrazo, y feliz año nuevo!

[@loucasella5148]

The first rule of finding treasure... Don't tell anyone. No one, not a soul.

[@ClassicalNumismatics]

🤔 Treasure? What treasure?

[@213thAIB]

From museum to, “storage for preservation and ‘eventual’ research by ‘experts.’” This is what has happened to hundreds of Gettysburg battlefield artifacts, viewable by the public in the 1960s but now secreted away in vaults that you need to apply in writing to government “guardians” for entrance. Disgusting.

[@ClassicalNumismatics]

The hypocrisy is blatant, yet, the "guardians" for our heritage just keep doubling down

[@SSS-bd6li]

Most all museums sell off inventory at some point. Also ancient coins were used for commerce and trade, not to be hoarded by the host country. Coins are not religious or sacred items.

[@GordonGrant-o1h]

Thanks Leo brilliant about Peru 😊

[@HistoriaMoneta]

If you are in the US, join the Ancient Coin Collectors Guild! The more organized we become, the harder it is to take away our rights away. The guild works with lobbyists that will lobby your local legislator on your behalf. I was able to get a meeting for the guild's lobbyist with the staff of my local legislator!

[@ClassicalNumismatics]

Not only in the US. Dealers worldwide really need to wake up to this, lest we end up like Italy or Turkey

[@giampieroilbello5373]

As an italian, the farmer question made me piss myself😂

[@ClassicalNumismatics]

Did I get the cursing right? 😂

[@giampieroilbello5373]

​@@ClassicalNumismatics perfect👌🏻😂

[@GediminasStrum]

That italian farmer 😂

[@creounity]

How do people dare melting ancient and medieval coins? I can't believe that even museums do this...

[@colbystearns5238]

There are WAY too many coins for only museums to handle them all, they quite frankly don't know what to do with the ones they already have unless they're the most exquisite works of art like some of the gold aurei/solidi/staters, silver tetradrachms/decadrachms and medallions I've seen put on display at the Getty Villa in Los Angeles. If they're super common and pedestrian by comparison then they'll just sit in storage the whole time gathering dust and not being looked at, which is where private collectors can come in and gladly accept them for what they are, warts and all. It would take the weight off the shoulders of museums who don't have any need for them and be given pride of place in an average joe's collection, win-win all around.

[@ClassicalNumismatics]

100% correct assessment there!

[@MrMonkeySwag96]

Uninformed politicians parroting the rhetoric of restricting ownership of ancient coins to museums appeals to the ignorant general public. To this day, I have trouble convincing the average person of how exceedingly common ancient coins and artifacts really are. In their minds, objects that are 2000+ years old must be rare and valuable. Most of these people have never seen a map of how extensive the Roman Empire was. A large empire like Rome had to produce millions upon millions of coins to support its economy. In addition, much of these coins survive today due to ancient people burying their coins in clay pots. When I bring up facts like these, I still can’t convince a non-collector to abandon their previous notions about ancient coins/artifacts. What people don’t understand is that most “experts” like academics and archaeologists don’t know much about ancient coins. Academics and archaeologists are more focused on general Greco-Roman history, they don’t focus on niche topics like ancient coinage. Which is why private collectors are a better source of knowledge about ancient coins.

[@ClassicalNumismatics]

The fact most people have NO idea of how monetized and complex ancient societies were shows many Museums and historians dont do a very good job at explaining what the ancient world was. Its quite telling, indeed. Thank you for spreading the message of ancient coins to the people! :)

[@MrMonkeySwag96]

Quite a few people I’ve talked to say they’re “coin collectors” without truly knowing what coin collecting is. In their minds, coin collecting is merely accumulating or hoarding random coins. These people don’t realize that true coin collecting involves much study and research about coins. After all, it’s advised to buy the book before the coin. The general public don’t realize that numismatics is an intellectual hobby. I bet most of these people calling themselves “coin collectors” don’t even know terms like “numismatist.” Accumulating random coins from spare change is not coin collecting. Inheriting old silver coins from grandparents isn’t the same as coin collecting. What separates a hoarder/accumulator from a true numismatist is the desire to gain knowledge about coins.

[@jeffkeller9009]

Very great video.

[@oscarkaltschmidt-tc2jc]

one major issue. were should coins be returned to?. returning roman coins to italy means to return looted minerals to the looters. The major part of the metals used for minting coins was stolen (or traded) at other parts of the world killing the local inhabitants in the process (supose you survived the "conquest and direct looting" and then had to work in a silver mine. how long would you survive?... The looted minerals were then minted to coins to pay for the war machinery and trade of resources and whoever was lucky to dont be enslaved was paid with those coins for their work (yes... your ancestors were paid with those coins...)... so is Italy the rightfull owner of a coin?. clearly not...

[@HungoverHistorian-zf6gi]

Italy makes rules that are impossible to follow, so people just either give up or disregard them altogether. Same thing for stuff like shooting to the range or starting a business. No wonder clever, talented people have been emigrating for decades. I don’t think it’s intentional, only that those who write the rules should care enough to admit they’ve been in the wrong for almost a century.

[@ClassicalNumismatics]

Italy is the perfect case of a cartelized market. One side has a bunch of government workers, enacting draconian policies so they can constantly be on the headlines, seizing "priceless" 10 euro coins from collectors and justifying their cushy jobs. On the other, there are the half a dozen big dealers who are delighted to see all the smaller competition close their doors, so they have the market for themselves, being the only ones who can afford all the paperwork and red tape to operate. This means they can charge as much as they want.

[@HungoverHistorian-zf6gi]

@@ClassicalNumismatics just a quick look at biggest Italian coin dealers’ sites proves your point.

[@hessex1899]

The only appropriate response to "There should be a law." is "F you stack up.". :)

[@KingEdwardtheTurbulentNeill26]

I don't think all ancient coins should be in museums as a coin collector myself, I would like to physically own something from history like a coin or jewellery and to be able to pass it down through the generations. As someone who likes shiny things from gold, silver and shiny gemstones like a pirate. I would like to have any numismatic coins from ancient or medieval and add it to my treasure collection.

[@Matisto1]

1:15 Thanks for providing arguments for dinosaur fossils 😉

[@ClassicalNumismatics]

Thats the point, now that a huge corpus of numismatics has been made and published, a handful of burocrats want to have it all for themselves. As I said in the video, they just do not care if they destroy 700 years worth of research just to make sure they keep their jobs.

[@oscarkaltschmidt-tc2jc]

and the owls to greece?. They used their silver mine to buy food and goods to other people (again they paid your ancestors for goods and services). Thats the idea of money ans specially of fiat money. silver and gold turned to fiat money very fast. And its like that since then... so returning spent money to the spenders. sounds somehow insane...

[@TieisAwsom]

If we factor in ancient coins from China or east Asia alone, we're talking billions of coins. Factor in everywhere else from all other historical ages, you get a number so big you would physically not be able to fit all those coins into all worldwide museums combined

[@gaineyjohnson6628]

Leo, Roman's collected coins. Augustus I believed collected Greek and Helenistic coins. The coins found at Pompeii in a shelter by the harbor contained a cache of gold, jewelry and early Republican denarii. The English seem to have a good system, but the English also have a long history of land access.

[@Diogenes_43]

Meanwhile ancient coins go unsold for a dollar at coin auctions lmao

[@Hiltibold]

Coins have - most of the time - no high scientific value. In Germany even a law court said that just a few years ag in a case against a metal detectorist. And many museums depots are just overfilled with artefacts. A lot of coins are never shown to the public, Only the nicest examples.

[@Tiridates_the_Great]

Great video as always Leo!

[@toadamine]

probably smarter than leaving them unlocked and letting people steal them... lots of stuff in museums is privately owned, most museums are privately owned... if you want to open a museum and show of your stuff or pay people a fee to show off their stuff... im perfectly fine with it and enjoy many museums because they make private collections accessible to view by the public...

[@ethandriver-vf8pi]

Yeah, why just give them away when you can have a private collection at home and have badass coinage. Plus not every one can just go in a museum.

[@Usermaatre6723]

it belongs in a musueam

[@ClassicalNumismatics]

So do you! 😂

[@Usermaatre6723]

@@ClassicalNumismatics lol how come ill take it as a compliment

[@coinsandwheels.2762]

Una explicación excelente.

[@oscarkaltschmidt-tc2jc]

if somebody would really be interested in avoiding the destruction of archeological sites due to numimastists buying coins (which is very unlikely to happen as well explained in this video) they should keep a close eye on the 100? existing auction houses and the issue is solved.... looting the property of citizens who have inherited or adquired coins righfully is surely not the answer.... is just a way to loot private property....

[@nathanielscreativecollecti6392]

Bold of you to assume that in purchasing uncleaned coins I haven't become a hoarder...

[@ClassicalNumismatics]

It must be a very finely curated hoard ⭐

[@neutralfellow9736]

Sadly, you are correct

[@ClassicalNumismatics]

Dont feel discouraged, lets push back against this trend!

[@dleetr]

There have always been private collections of rare coins and many museums built their collections through gifts of private hoards of coins. I also don't trust our governments these days, so coins may be somewhat safer in private hands. Where it gets interesting is the question of whether we should allow European treasures to leave the West. Perhaps if we get our house in order and rise again, we can buy back all the treasures which have gone to the near East, Japan and China, over time. But these legacies of our ancestors could be lost as well, which is a disappointing thought.

[@MrMonkeySwag96]

Why not have the East swap their Western artifacts for Eastern artifacts held in the West

[@dleetr]

@@MrMonkeySwag96 Can we trust that they won't give us fakes, whilst they trade them for real things? 🤣

[@MrMonkeySwag96]

@@dleetr I'm pretty sure Japan won't be faking anything

[@dleetr]

@@MrMonkeySwag96 I'm not worried about Japan, plus they probably have more of our stuff than vice versa, given their penchant for collecting and several decades of economic triumph. Whereas we have hoards of Chinese pottery which we legitimately bought over centuries of trade, which is now quite valuable to the Chinese.

[@giampieroilbello5373]

In my humble opinion, it should be the opposite. Us numismatists should be able to own all the unused coins museums keep in their archives, as we would conserve and study them much better, since we actually care. Anyone want to do a ocean 11 style heist with me?😂

[@gnotter7676]

Just because museums don't display everything does not mean that they are not being used. The items kept behind the scenes are extremely valuable for researchers. Thanks to the big coin collections of museums, numismatists do not need to own coins to study them. To lock all coins away in museums is ridiculous, museums don't need hundreds of coins of the same type. Hobbyists are more important for numismatics than some academics would like to admit.

[@giampieroilbello5373]

@gnotter7676 my personal problem is that displaying a coin isn't easy as you can only show one side. At least that's how I've always found them in museums, perhaps there are methods that allow to see both sides

[@gnotter7676]

@@giampieroilbello5373 Absolutely agree, even worse is when they are just thrown on a pile. I have heard of museum displays where coins can be flipped, but I have never seen those.

[@giampieroilbello5373]

@gnotter7676 oh the pile breaks my heart: i understand wanting to recreate the state they were found in but i only think about the potential scratches haha. In any case people kind of ignore coins displays i think, maybe they just dont look with as much interest as we would, but they dont seem to be very interested in them from what ive seem

[@goncalo33]

Absolutely not, unless they're really rare.

[@IDPYouTube]

Spain, Italy, Turkey were fascist states not long ago. The lack of property rights is not so peculiar, or should we say the right of property is not ingrained and given the importance necessary. Unfortunately you only compared them to Britain, which is the middle-ground on property rights, The true spectrum ends with the USA where what is found on your property is yours. Also in the Britain the rights of the individual have further been attacked by the new punishment of bronze items now requiring reporting.

[@ClassicalNumismatics]

Thats a very accurate analysis. The US follows a logic that property rights is a thing people deserve from the simple fact they are people, and the State is supposed to prove any reasons for taking it away and compensating it. The Constitution in places such as Spain, Turkey or Italy, on the other hand, claims all rights of its citizen are given by the State, if it wasnt for that State, they would have no rights, therefore it has the right to take them away when it feels necessary. As you say, it is much more totalitarian view on the rights of its citizens, to a point we must consider if they dont consider us Cattle instead.

[@Gumardee_coins_and_banknotes]

We get this same crap in Paleontology. If the specimen is unique, yer it belongs in a museum, if common, let the people have most. There is a black market for a reason.

[@ClassicalNumismatics]

Its almost like if they want a black market to arise!

[@Gumardee_coins_and_banknotes]

@@ClassicalNumismatics Well the Mafia, Sukura or Triads have a good network lol.

[@ashgamble1168]

Agree with the british system win win for everyone

[@markp44288]

Ignorant people and archaeologists on the same page with this one.

[@BygoneUser1]

Unwashed!? I resent that... I just took a shower on Christmas Eve...

[@ClassicalNumismatics]

😂

[@zargonfuture4046]

If we all get see them not necessary. There are too many 'collectors' who are use them as a wealth collector..if you as a private collector and are willing to give good pictorial viewing on line I'm not opposed to those conservators.

[@ClassicalNumismatics]

There is nothing wrong with wanting to use your collection as a non-traditional asset, although I think it is a bit of a waste of such wonderful artifacts. Generally these people buy them and dont care if people reuse the photos and information about the coin that is online, so its not much of an issue.

[@Teleman01]

No....

[@selimism]

🦉🦉🦉🦉🦉

[@TheNewfyman]

I work as an intern at a classical antiquities museum at a university in Ottawa, Ontario, Canada. We have hundreds if not over a thousand ancient coins of varying value and rarity. The museum is free for all the public and we have many coins on display. While the full collection is exclusive to museum staff (all of which are students) we are at liberty to show off any coins we like to the public. Many of us including myself collect coins. Despite the vast number of coins all of us are there because we love them. I believe that here in Canada, many private collectors leave their coins to museums such as our, so it’s always growing, which indeed as you say creates more work, but even then we only have a fraction on display.

[@ClassicalNumismatics]

Its quite unfortunate that the full collection is only available to those belonging to the academic community. As long as proper rules for handling the coins properly and a security system is in place so no coins get stolen, they should be made accessible for study to everyone, otherwise, there's no point in calling this a "public" collection.

[@dustinbissell996]

This is an interesting video. You made a video unpacking a random lot and found an ancient coin from Thrace minted with the sypillium plant. I felt this coin belong is a museum because of it's historical significance and you assured me there were many more of that mint on the market. A true nerd...

[@ClassicalNumismatics]

Its a very common type, and many museums have lots of these in their archives. No need to give them even MORE of these. Let the collectors have them so society can know more about this obscure plant and its importance.

[@LongLivedCoins]

🍯🍯🍯🍯🍯🐝🌻

[@SARIDAKIS74]

In my opinion, the most perfectly preserved coin of each mint should he donated, selled or exchanged with the main museum of the country on which they were found.

[@banaccbanacc]

I am a fellow archaeologist; great video! I would ask if you could make a longer video of how to recognize false from original ancient and medieval coins. That would be helpful!

[@ClassicalNumismatics]

I've got a few of these videos in my beginners playlist, have a look at them, they should help.

[@香料國境]

real wackademics!