Should you buy, refurbish or upgrade vintage Carver audio products?

Practical guide to Carver audio decision making. It spells out the pluses and the minuses.
Its not for hard core fan bois, nor is it going to win over many carver haters.
It describes the difference between refurbishment and upgrades. What to refurbish, and what not to.
Hint: the C-2 is mid-fi with obvious sonic flaws. I had one for a week and got rid of it for a c-1. It was a big upgrade. Most 80's brands like Adcom, Nakamichi, Yamaha and Onkyo have much better preamps than the pedestrian and flawed C-2. If you can't hear how bad the c-2 is, you really can't claim to be a good listener. Don't be mad at me because You cannot tell the difference.

[@racerex340]

I miss my M-1.0t mk II's and PM 1201's. My road rig consisted of a case with a pair of M-1.0t mk II's running a pair of 502b subs, and two PM 1201's running a couple of monitors and four PT 2400's running our four pole-mount Custom PPA15 800W PA enclosures. Was the closest you got to Tube sound with enormous power and clarity. Also had an optional outdoor kit with two more PT 2400's driving two pairs of AWCS-II SR tubes that my dad hacked to work way better than with the WSC controller, those things would rattle fillings out of your head 100ft away in a grass field, the sound pressure was nuts. My dad was a huge Carver fan and when his boss had bought a high-end boutique loudspeaker company back in the 90's, it came with an entire room full of about fifty M-1.0t's, M-1.5t's PM1200's/1201's PT-1800's and PT-2400's The PT-2400's were pre-production units and had some supply issues. I think my dad offered his boss $1000 for 12 varying units, the 2400's weren't working right and the 1800's kept blowing fuses, he put about $500 worth of component upgrades into them and then we beat the bag out of them for years. I toured with the kit for years with multiple bands, he did as well, in addition to DJ events. He still uses four of the same 2400's in his DJ/traveling PA sound-kit and he's in his 60's.

[@scottlowell493]

My favorite thing is a "Resto-mod". Like giving a 57 Chevy a modern Corvette drivetrain and suspension. You have a classic, that's even better and more reliable after a mod. Better parts= better performance.

[@mrd7051]

I have a TFM35X on the way to High Tech Audio for a rebuild.They did a TFM15CB for me years ago and it sounds great.

[@craigdoriety9798]

I have a Carver M240 amp that I purchased as part of a system for my 84 Z28. It worked very well at driving my 12 inch subs.

[@scottlowell493]

I wondered how good the car amps were. thought they were cool in the day.

[@scottlowell493]

Note: when carver made his amp, he installed a series of variable potentiometers to dial in Bias. The mods simply install fixed resistors to set bias accurately.

[@scottlowell493]

Note: a Sunfire "load invariant". isn't just more stable and powerful, it's not made of lowest bidder parts than carver amps.

[@ivandjdocrodriguez]

Great information, thanks. I sent my PM-1200 to Rolland Barr for a full refresh, definitely nostalgic product for me, that is why I went forward with the service. I also have a Soundcraftsmen A2502 that I'd like to recap.

[@GreeneAlien]

I’ve had Rolland at hi tech audio service two of my carvers, he repaired and completely re-capped my receiver mxr 2000, (it wasn’t just an upgrade one of my channels completely went out so it needed full repair) I’m very pleased with the work and it sounds amazing. Now I’m waiting on m500t I can’t wait.

[@scottlowell493]

The M-500T is the best looking of the classic amps. I dig the VU meters. I'd have him put in blue led lights.

[@LordSamuelJ]

I like carver products for the most part. I liken them to pioneer or any other consumer lvl audio. Every brand has its good and its bad products so I don't listen to the haters or fanboys. I have a couple TFM 35s and am pleased with the sound quality. I like the warm tube sound they give. Whats there to hate?

[@scottlowell493]

You definitely need to look at Carver as polarizing. Haters for example, likely heard one Carver product for a few minutes in a suspect system. So they paint ALL Carver products (even modded) as sounding like crap. They have never heard a modded unit, especially since there are many mods that are very different. Fan boys go overboard and lavish praise on the low end Carver stuff that wasn't very good to begin with. The truth is in the middle. Carver DID beat a roomful of press and audiophiles that couldn't tell the difference between his amp and a Mark Levinson. That tells you the power of blind testing over hype and hate. And Carver DID produce a few lemons and products that were mediocre at best.

[@dominicpardo4783]

Currently have a Carver C-2 preamplifier and a Carver M-400 amplifier. A Rotel RP1100q turntable with a very nice Shure cartridge and stylus. Klipsch Heresy II speakers. To me, it sounds amazing.

[@scottlowell493]

I had the c2 with Klipsch forte 2 for a week. It was so obviously bad, I returned it and got a c1. It really mangled the sound. No, it wasn't defective, it was just made with junk parts for a budget. Too bad you lack the ability to hear that.

[@rudykraker4905]

I have a Carver C1 preamp and carver tfm 45 amplifier upgraded and a carver m1.5t mkii upgrade from nelion audio speakers are elac uni-fi uf5 speakers

[@scottlowell493]

If I were to do this right now- I’d definitely start with the TFM. I’d have Neilion do all the mods, including driving low impedance.

[@david3991]

I agree with@@scottlowell493 but if you want to stay with Bob Carver designed amps, I'd spend a little extra and try to find a Sunfire 2-Channel amp for even better sound. I've owned and/or compared Carver TFMs from the 6CB, 15, 25, 35, 45, and 55 using same preamp and speaker setup. Then I "upgraded" to the Sunfire amp and sold what TFM's I had because of its superior performance. With that said, TFM series are still great amps. I would recommend a TFM amp or a CM-1090 integrated amp if you are on a budget but trying to assemble an audiophile stereo system and prefer the Carver sound. I've found that the TFM 35 is the sweet spot on power and build quality for most listeners' needs. The 45, 55, and the very hard to find 75 are much more expensive and not worth the price they fetch when you could get a Sunfire amp in a similar price range.

[@steverogers7611]

I have a Tfm-45 as well, who did you get to service ?

[@sandeepkaul3315]

Nicely done, appreciate the honest review. I have an Carver 2000 receiver and am debating what to do with it since it supports both moving magnet and moving coil phono inputs. Is this a better candidate for a refurb or is some sort of ‘upgrade’ available?

[@scottlowell493]

The mod companies can answer that.

[@biglew1161]

I have an 806x 6 channel power amp that I can just barely hear some 60 Hz. hum if I'm within a foot of the speakers, been thinking of doing a recap of the audio chain myself.

[@scottlowell493]

You may find the issue is more than just degraded caps. Good luck.

[@edd2771]

Very informative video. Do you know what the M 200-T was nulled against? Also, what is the topology of these amps? Class A/B, class D? Class H?

[@scottlowell493]

I'd have to ask Bob that one. The M1.5T seems to be one of the few that's nulled against a solid state amp. The M200T was never listed, but I bet .02 cents that it was either one of Bob's tube amps or maybe a Conrad Johnson. It's my understanding they are all class a/b. They are certainly not switching like D,T,H etc.

[@Truthtalks86]

What do you think of the digital time lens stand alone unit ? I have one. Where should it go in the chain of streamer, DAC, pre,-amp and power amp ? Is it good to adjust dither ?

[@scottlowell493]

It's a self contained soft-eq for the midrange. It's like a mini parametric eq. It's in line like an eq. It was originally created to counter the horrible sounding cd's in the 80's that were very brittle sounding. These days? Unless you MUST have it, there are better, and more flexible EQ's out there like a Schiit audio loki.

[@Bass_loves_Julian]

I restorated pt1800