Should you own more than one bed surface?

Find out how many printer beds you're supposed to own according to me! Video sponsored by PCBWay - www.pcbway.com - PCB Manufacturing, 3d Printing, CNC parts, and more..
Also get $5 of credit if you sign up to PCBWay using this link www.pcbway.com/setinvite.aspx...
In this episode, Lost In Tech looks at print beds, again, yeah this never gets old. However there's some new information, and a lot of you didn't watch the first one so it seems appropriate.
*** Please consider supporting the channel to allow me to do more, and better stuff! ***
(also you get to see the odd bit of out takes, extra content, and sometimes, usually actually, a chance to see videos first)
/ lostintech
Links to models used:
triceratops cults3d.com/en/3d-model/game/...
screwdriver www.thingiverse.com/thing:540...
print in place engine www.thingiverse.com/thing:457...
gecko www.thingiverse.com/thing:350...
Join us on Discord! There are many of us now! Hundreds! (somehow we're up to about 270 members now!) / discord
Waste: None. Nothing. Another 3d printing video where I do pretty much no new 3d printing. Becoming a habit?
*** Please consider supporting the channel to allow me to do more, and better stuff! ***
(also you get to see the odd bit of out takes, extra content, and sometimes, usually actually, a chance to see videos first)
/ lostintech
chapters:
0:00 intro
1:13 sponsor
1:46 cheapy textured bed
2:22 textured bed pros and cons
2:34 carborundum glass bed
2:54 the many fails of glass
3:09 carborundurum pros and cons
3:45 Smooth PEI
4:08 Smooth PEI pros and cons
4:27 Textured PEI
4:41 Textured PEI pros and cons
5:19 Magnetic Flexible
5:52 Magnetic Flexible pros and cons
6:22 Other print surfaces
7:19 My proposal - How many beds?
8:14 Finishing up

[@Dystrackshun]

Jokes on you, I've already spent my money on these beds

[@LostInTech3D]

You might need spares!

[@avejst]

The PC surface is waring down fast I Think 🤔

[@TopFurret]

Don't forget the fashion over function option: PEY. Or other beds that imprint a pattern on your bottom layer.

[@Supperconductor]

Bare spring steel sheet (uncoated) with a smear of Elmer's Purple glue stick. Works on every filament I've tried: PLA, PETG, ASA & ABS.

[@g.4279]

I agree, regular steel with glue stick is fine for 90% of filaments. And Magigoo on steel works for the last 10%.

[@hermangaviria690]

This is a trade secret not trade secret. Bare steel and glue stick in unbeated

[@tttuberc]

Do you use magnetic tape to hold the steel sheet down to the bed? Does it still work with ABS print (which has bed temp at around 110 degrees Celsius?) Thanks

[@als1023]

Same, did not know about Magigoo ,, This bed setup lasts for a very long time as well, To repeat, Elmer's Purple , white does not work I simply take the surface off , run under warm water , give it a wipe and ry, back on the printer. bullett proof

[@billallen6109]

I've been waiting for this video so I can save money not buying extra beds I don't need. Well now I'm aware I need them all! Thanks for another in depth video

[@zviper]

NANO POLYMER from vison miner is amazing stuff

[@genericcheesewedge4870]

You mentioned that you would only go up to 75C on a PEI bed, I regularly run mine at 110C with no problem and it's even in the Prusa slicer profile. I had zero bed adhesion on the Prusa textured build sheet, with even large flat parts just detaching mid print, and I avoided it for years. I recently conditioned the surface with fine scotchbrite and it made a night-and-day difference, now everything adheres wonderfully, and still self-releases. Since you are having trouble with your smooth PEI not sticking on small parts maybe give that a try, I think the microscopic scratches are way more important for bed adhesion than the macroscopic texture.

[@LostInTech3D]

Oh yeah its 75 C for PLA, theres no "only" about it. It does save a fair bit of energy though, I did a vid on energy a while back. Interesting idea about the smooth PEI

[@przemekkobel4874]

You can buy large sheets of ferromagnetic adhesive foil and make any print surface compatible with magnetic base. Also, when I was still using glass, I found that pouring a glue stick solution (dissolved in water) on glass and letting it dry creates pretty uniform and durable surface that can be cleaned several times with IPA before re-applying.

[@Reegareth]

I went from a Voxelab Aquila C2 to an AnkerMake M5C and I gotta say that the AnkerMakes default bed is an absolute banger to me its one of the metal ones with the texture but its also double sided. Once side is a little rougher than the other. Really awesome that it has 2 sides

[@davethetaswegian]

I have used most of them. Textured PEI is my preferred surface although I also use G10. However, none are perfect and I still fall back on glue stick when needed.

[@cerberez1]

What’s your favorite if you need a smooth surface?

[@monkeywrench1951]

This video was awesome. I truly feel like everyone talks about the filaments and VERY seldom reference or even mention what bed they used and what surface treatment they used.

[@TroyMackay]

Recently joined the ABL club. Now I can swap build plates all day long. Glass so heavy, though! Tried a few and now have a greater appreciation of the textured sticker on G10.

[@GeekDetour]

Excellent video you just stole from my list!!! 🤨🤣 I second your advice: different surfaces depending on what you are printing. Spot on - super fun video!

[@LostInTech3D]

There's plenty of space for more bed videos, I think this is my third or fourth! 🤣👍

[@GeekDetour]

@@LostInTech3D You are right 😄 Everyone’s perspective is quite particular. But, indeed, quite good video! Cheers!

[@Tarbard]

Really useful, thanks.

[@B1GJano]

im glad im not the only one that thinks not all coated glass beds are created equal (which i have been learning the hard way as of late) But at least im becoming more flexible (like the beds) ;) I just wish they made more flexplate pei sheets for larger (300x300 or larger ) printers as stock. Great insightful video!

[@LostInTech3D]

Yeah the PEI gets expensive for bigger bed sizes!!

[@anToha_UA]

I use glass and with some portion of 3D Lac spray it works like a charm each time. I actually forgot about detaching of the part mid-print. But yes, unless you print for the first several times after the glass clean, your parts' surfaces will look utterly gross.

[@SoHautRightNow]

I scrolled the comments and only saw one other person use my method (but I know why it works): AquaNet (hairspray) on a glass mirror. The hairspray works as an adhesion promoter for PLA and as a release agent for PETG. Only needs a fresh spritz once and a while on the areas of the bed that get clean and reflective again (the center). Flat and smooth, so I tram my bed and don't need to "level" it. Cheap, been using the same can of AquaNet and 10 pack of mirrors off Amazon for years. Easily swappable. I know this is *my* way, and you made the right kind of video, where you said "There's no right answer! Do what works!" so I'm not actually arguing my method, haha. But kudos on making a video that's sure to be comment bait. ;) I'm new to your content but it's fantastically informative. Keep it up!

[@TheButchersbLock]

I am still a bit of a noob and have only tried glass and the flexibile magnetic type. The magnet one works awesome except when you change nozzle and forget to change the probe offset, now I have a permanent outline of that print on one side of the plate. Great video as always mate 👍🇦🇺😊

[@LostInTech3D]

Haha we've all done it. I have dents in most of my beds, they should really design something to stop it happening. Cheers! 👍

[@KnooBill]

using a cut mirror for everything, really happy with it, no glues or anything

[@zacsmith6321]

I personally use all of prusa's sheets on their printers, as the changing of z offset is really easy between them. For my custom machines I just use a one side smooth and one side textured sheet of pei. I use prusa's smooth pei sheet for PLA, PVB and ASA The satin sheet for pretty much anything The textured sheet for Nylon, petg and tpu

[@3dPrintingMillennial]

I love my Mamorubot bed (polypropylene). Everything sticks and it releases when cool

[@Brainfrz82]

This video released right on time, i always had great luck with my carbonorum glass bed with 3dlac (basically hairspray). PLA and the occasional PETG stick great until the bed cools down and the part practically self-releases. Last week i've been trying my luck with some ABS parts for a specific project. I printed a couple of parts which also worked out great, but one larger part started to fail. the corners were rising and i aborted the print. I let the bed cool down, but instead of releasing like it always did, the center broke shard of the glass bed, even though the part didn't adhere enough to keep stuck. So i was a bit baffled. Fortunately i had a spare on hand, but now looking into something else for the occasional PETG and ABS print. Fortunately i recently fitted a bltouch sensor, so swapping beds isn't as bad as it used to be.

[@marijuanas]

Please don't tell people about the secret surface... Sugar water on leather is my go to, with a bit of horse glue for good measure! Great video man and nice sponsor B)

[@DejitaruJin]

I've got a Creality glass bed on the way since it went on a decent sale recently. My Longer LK4 Pro came with the textured-plastic-on-glass, and yeah, it was fantastic for a beginner, not having to worry about keeping parts down... but I've been doing this for a year, I'm sick of both the bubbly warps and having to absolutely *hammer* the scraper against parts to get them off.

[@richdobbs6595]

I stuck it in a my freezer, and then I only had to sort of hammer it. I switched to textured PEI, after destroying the flexible magnetic bed by some stupid leveling or Z setting mistake. Much less frustrating.

[@ZERONEINNOVATIONS]

I love my G10 bed when printing PETG. So easy to take it off with hand. I never had to take it off and bend it. Also I like hairspray coated glass bed for ABS. Again, so easy to take it off. I mean, after cooling down, it's already released from the bed.

[@itemushmush]

thx. my only printer is a DIY jobby which is very temperamental, im using borosillicate glass with a pritt stick, it works OK but i think i will invest in a flexible magnetic one

[@trohn_javolta8485]

Did you ever try rubbing down your smooth pei sheet with ipa and 000 steelwool? Worked wonders for me in terms of adhesion and the steelwool is so fine that you wont notice anything on the printed part. Also as an adhesion helper I can recommend a mixture of white wood glue+ water (just don't get that express wood glue without pva in it). Gives you insane adhesion, magigoo adhesion helper or a glue stick is a bad joke compared to this. Only downside is if you care about the surface on the printed part you'll have to clean it up with soap and water to make it presentable.

[@timschafer2536]

I have this exact setup and if my smooth pei does not stick I clean with ipa and if that is not enough the pva water usually does the trick. I never used the textured side yet but those bumps seem very large and counter intuitive for good first layer quality. Now I am waiting for a spare pei and fr4 sheet to arrive.

[@dutchsailor6620]

My secret : Lidl hairspray.

[@martinbernath]

I dont know about carborundum glass beds, but i have been using a piece of regular glass for a bed for some time now and its the best free upgrade i have done. I had some spare glass and the cutter. Regular glass works wonders if you know how to level the bed. I print mainly petg so i have to use glue stick on larger parts but they always release on their own once the bed cools down. In fact you can hear them cracking loose as its cooling down, pretty cool. I think the surface being smooth helps with adhesion compared to carborundum beds and if you chip it you can just toss it and cut a new square out. I want to try the garolite as well by flipping my ender 3 bed (which is garolite) and putting it on the glass so that i have a flat surface to print on.

[@JohanFasth]

I couldn't get POM or Nylon to stick to anything. Then just for kicks I tested cardboard paper, the rough ones. Gluestick so it adheres to the print bed and then some more gluestick on that. It worked perfectly. Only thing is that some paper was stuck in the print but that was not an issue for me.

[@yourlocaltoad5102]

I use the carborundum bed I got with my Ender 3 and while using it without any coating is a horrible experience, I absolutely love it when it’s covered with a thick layer of glue stick. I apply multiple layers of glue stick when it’s heated up, wait until it’s dry and then print on it for months without ever having to do anything. The prints release really well and they stick perfectly while it’s warm. But I only work with pla, so I don’t know how this would perform with other filaments

[@HeikosGarage]

Unfortunately you forgot to mention that the flexible magnetic sheets do not work with inductive bed leveling sensors. I bought myself a textured Pei built plate that is a spring steel, I bought myself a smooth Pei build plate which is also spring Steel and I bought myself one of those magnetic flexible built plates and the first time I used it I homed all axis the printer ran the nozzle right into it. My inductive sensor doesn't detect that flexible one because it has no metal in it. No other damage but I learned it the hard way.

[@covertpluto]

I use a textured pei sheet on my ender 3 and had zero adhesion issues(pla, petg and even nylon) in the last 2 years printing daily

[@richdobbs6595]

I got an Ender 3V2, and with the stock Carbondum Glass bed: I couldn't get parts to release without taking the bed off and sticking it into my freezer. So I switched to the flexible magnetic bed, and then I gouged it with the leveling not right. So I found a textured PEI, like I had used with the CR-6 SE, and I've had decent success. But most of the time I'm only using the CR-6SE with a textured PEI bed. A lot of the time it works great, and then it gets an attitude and won't print the second iteration of a part that just printed fine! I seem to get it over its attitude by washing it with soap and water!

[@rentaspoon219]

I just got a PEI board after I ripped a hole in my ender buildtek plate, I have spares I just can never find them, best thing about the buildtek plates is sticking on vinyl on the back, I now have a nice carbon fibre texture which looks great when I'm printing things like display covers

[@jaro6985]

If you haven't 3D printed with sugar water on leather, you haven't lived.

[@nickfarley3962]

Getting a thick (3mm) sheet of pei material was my favorite bed surface I've had. Flexible steel pei bed was my second favorite (although easy to ruin if the z offset or bl touch is off), smooth side of the creality glass bed is my 3rd favorite. I use a thin coating of cheap hairspray on the smooth side and have had no issues so far. I recently got a textured pei bed for my ender 3v2, but I haven't tried it yet. My biggest mess up was a large TPU print on a flexible pei sheet. As I removed it, it peeled up the thin pei surface. I then used the steel side with masking tape until I got a new bed

[@LostInTech3D]

yeah once you go PEI its very hard to go back, the only two surfaces I use now are PEI and the black textured stuff.

[@nickfarley3962]

@@LostInTech3D great video by the way. Thanks for the reply!

[@jerbear7952]

I'm a mostly noob but I've done a good bit of printing. I use a piece of picture frame glass that I cut down and a glue stick. I ruined the mat my ender three pro came with and just wipped it up with the intention of replacing it. I have honestly felt no need to replace it. I will occasionally make spaghetti but its been mostly great. Your results may vary.

[@TheEnemy10225]

I actually use bare glass on one of my printers because when I used glue the part stayed on so strongly that I literally brokey previous glass bed trying to release it. The other one came with carborundum glass.

[@flpennstater305]

"you looked at it while printing" lol!

[@winandd8649]

For me FR4 was a game changer! I do print with ABS/ASA 99% of the time. I heat the bed up to 100 or 110 C, (and my printer has automatic bed leveling) Sticks, and releases completely when cools down. The FR4 plate does not wear, prints are shiny like a mirror and when you can find FR4, it's not that expensive.

[@blutadlerx]

Bought the creality Glass Bed pretty early as a beginner for my Ender 3 because I Had Problems with the uneven Stock Bed. Never Had any issues with leveling and First layer after lol

[@JernD]

I use a carborundum glass bed with a very thin layer of glue stick and it basically eliminates the possibility for PETG to rip out a chunk of the bed. Glue stick is a bit annoying to deal with, but it guarantees good results for me even with suboptimal leveling on a wide range of surfaces.

[@toma.cnc1]

I print PETG daily on a Creality glass bed at 65C, never had issues with it .... except when i touch it with my hands! 😃 Never touch the glass bed, no, nope, never.

[@lion7718]

I bought my PEI sheet about a week before this video came out. I love it it's dual-sided so I have all three beds. The good thing about it is I don't have to readjust the nozzle, I can just switch on and off without any issues. Ender 3 Pro.

[@AquaStevae]

Did you buy it from Creality, or somewhere else?

[@lion7718]

@@AquaStevae I posted a link to Amazon after your notification came through, but it looks like KZbin removed it.

[@Drumaier]

I was using the Creality glass and now I'm using PEI and the hype is real, the adhesion is great and with PEI you have a lot of room to play with the Z offset and the filament will stick. With glass, you have to be ultra spot on (and even so a thin glue spray is necessary most of the time). What I don't like about PEI is the double coin aspect of self-releasing when cooled down, since for anything related to pausing and resuming a print you depend on the bed keeping the temperature.

[@janvorlicek8734]

My experience is exactly the opposite. I was always printing on glass (actually, a mirror from Ikea to be precise) and using the 3D LAC spray. I never ever had a problem with adhesion and it was very forgiving w.r.t. the z height calibration. +/- 0.2mm were all sticking fine. Then I've built Voron V0.1 and started to use smooth PEI from Energetic. And it was such a pain to get it stick. I really needed to get Z offset precise within .05mm to stick ABS to it and with PLA, it is even worse. But maybe the Creality glass properties are somehow too different from the Ikea mirror.

[@extectic]

I had it easy - I checked the box for both textured and smooth sheets when I ordered my Prusa MK3, and between them they handle every material I need. The textured is absolutely superb for PETG, which is what I mostly print. Sticks very well, and detaches on its own when the sheet cools (and shrinks). Smooth PEI for PLA and ASA, not that I've done much ASA yet. The MK3 lets you save individual plates with individual Z offsets saved so you don't really have to do a full Z calibration when you swap, either. These are the things you get when you go slightly better than the cheapo Chinese ones - quality, and quality of life. I've basically just printed with my machine and had minimal issues.

[@maxhammick948]

The prusa ecosystem (smooth for more stick, textured for less stick, and satin when you don't want to change beds) does cover all bases pretty well

[@radmin2]

I use Kapton tape for TPU. I find it releases much easier than either type of pei. and it gives a glass like finish on the bottom.

[@LostInTech3D]

Interesting! I can't stand the smell of kapton 😂

[@habag1112]

I use the bare glass side of my ceramic coated bed when I print PETG. Works really well for me, PLA on the coated side is a pain in the ass tho.

[@rich1051414]

You have to dig the nozzle into textured pei beds for proper adhesion, so if you are scared of elephant's feet, stay away. I am not, so it's my favorite surface. I love the finish it leaves on parts.

[@LostInTech3D]

Try a much higher temperature, like 75C, then you don't have to smush it in so much, but it is material dependent, some filaments just dont stick to PEI at all, like matte PLA

[@derekfarealz]

@@LostInTech3D are you saying the first layer is 75C for PLA and the rest of the layers at a different temp? or all layers at 75C?

[@2mD]

right now i have 3 different beds i use regularly: garolite for PETG and TPU, Spring Steel PEI ( flat ) for PLA and Spring Steel PEI ( rough ) for ASA. and switching between them is pretty easy with a BL Touch probe :)

[@LostInTech3D]

I think we found the best use case for auto bed leveling 👍😂

[@2mD]

@@LostInTech3D it really is its also good if you want to print on top of something ( TPU on a T-shirt works well for example ) no need to fiddle with the bed height because it will just reverence of the top surface of whatever you put on :D *edit* also: if you have a glass bed, there is nothing preventing you from sticking the magnetic sheet to the aluminium and using both magnetic beds and the glas bed ( on top of the magnetic sticker ). that's how i use the garolite. only downside could be slightly longer heat up

[@morphin8654]

I have a 1.5mm thick sheet of smooth pei glued to the carbo whatever glass with a magnetic sticker on the glass bottom. And my god of all my surfaces every material sticks to this bed like crazy by far the best bed for first layers and avoiding any print lifting during the print.

[@reidn5185]

I switch between garolite, textured/smooth PEI, and occasionally polypropylene to cover everything from nylons to PP to PEKK. Glass was great to start with but I got tired real quick from prints that fused / broke the glass.

[@dtibor5903]

For glass you have to soak in cold water while it is 40-50C hot and PETG will detach without an issue. You need to add Gcode to keep the print warm after print.

[@esotericbear9829]

Again, Thumbs up & I love the vid. (I'm not even past the intro yet, hehe)

[@JB-yu1vv]

I've recently tested sort of rough fr4 which gives the first layer a smooth but non shiny look. Works surprisingly well on TPU and PETG with self release, however it sticks well to PLA but doesn't release... I might have to tinker a bit with temperature and initial layer hight. Since I'm using abl I might switch back to the carborundorumdorum from time to time. Do you think a magnet sticker is bad for non-magnetic surfaces like glass or fr4? Since it adds high heating might be harder

[@LostInTech3D]

I doubt it, it will just increase heat time so you'd have to add some extra time before printing to warm up, especially for glass. Might not get as warm either. That could be tested - If I remember I'll try it.

[@Richie_]

I use masking tape on PETG. Works great.

[@Drumaier]

I keep hearing people talking about changing the z offset when changing surfaces but that doesn't make sense since the Z offset is the distance between the probe and nozzle, and that distance won't change doesn't matter if you have a brick or a paper beneath the hotend. Edit: I realized that this will be different if you have a printer without some kind of bl touch, so someone correct me but if you have bl touch or cr touch or pinda then changing the z offset isn't needed when you swap sheets, glass etc.

[@adamjuckniewitz727]

Thanks sooo much! I have an Ender3 with a glass bed. Just started having adhesion issues (first layers are peeling in one corner or another) and was about to try glue stick. Probly gonna order a magnetic textured bed now and try the glue stick while I wait for it. One question though... Do you see any difference between a magnetic textured and non-magnetic PEI textured. Seems like magnetic PEI textured would be just more convenient. Peeps in the comments feel free to answer!

[@kashinoda]

Get a spring steel sheet, stick a PEI sheet on one side and something like BuildTak/LokBuild on the other. Saves you having to buy more steel than you need.

[@HeikosGarage]

Does anyone know what type of coating is on those super flexible build sheets? Is that type of coating also available on spring steel?

[@coaltowking]

PEI has worked better than anything for me. I have a textured PEI sheet on my railcore with a mag bed, and the stock bed on my lulzbot taz6 is a solid piece of PEI. Smooth PEI needs to be hit with some steel wool occasionally, and all PEI should be cleaned with alcohol.

[@josiahong5177]

At a certain point however, you can probably sleep on the print beds. Build a mattress.

[@PeterAgostiniJdcap26]

Should I buy a back up pei bed ?

[@diegomasotti7517]

Which bed is best for PP (polypropylene) filament? I've the creality coated glass, and it won't stick. I need to use polypropylene packing tape to keep it down

[@LostInTech3D]

I wouldn't have a clue! I think you're right though, it should stick to itself at least, so long as the tape doesn't come unstuck!

[@Dwarfgrinder]

I just cut to size g10/fibre resin board to size and never looked back. Just have to sand it to be a little rougher and voila.

[@dirediredude]

Haha great video and so true. I swear every post on Reddit about bed recommendations is sure to get hundreds of responses by every bed owners loyal fan base. What I've recently discovered is Magigoo which has been a game changer for me. I personally hate glue sticks because of the mess you mentioned in your video but this stuff really is fantastic and wipes clean with water only. It's nuts. I think magigoo with a glass bed basically covers every kind of print you'd need. At least that's my very singular anecdotal preference 😁

[@LostInTech3D]

Oh I had the impression all this stuff was sticky, I'll check that out! Thanks!

[@dirediredude]

@@LostInTech3D sure thing! It's pricey which is why most people poo poo it I think. Basically a 20 dollar glue stick so for the budget printer crowd that probably seems like a bad purchase. But man, it works well.

Hmm, I have a anycubic ultrabase and I believe its a "ceramic textured glass" and I have not adjusted my print height in ages, still works. Its really not that sensitive... or? Also works... FINE with PETG! Never any trouble. Now its actually beginning to be so worn down that it has kinda bad adhesion, but it still works like 95% of the time.

[@LostInTech3D]

sounds like a good printer, you should keep it! 👍

[@benrr101]

The thing that gets me is I have the "carborundum" build surface and despite what people say about PETG ripping chunks out of it, I can't get PETG to stick to it for love nor money. It's awful. I have to resort to painters tape to have a chance of it sticking.

[@AndrewG91]

can you print petg on the smooth pei?

[@skaltura]

Now there is even more, PEY, PET, CF textured, Diamond Textured, Sparkly ...

[@LostInTech3D]

I know, maybe I'll make a new one.

[@flat_stickproductions209]

The best bed type is the one Bambu Labs gives us.

[@Jynxx_13]

The "best part is the correct part" for the job!

[@marko4480]

I am using blue masking tape and it works greait for me just dont set first layer too low because then it will be stuck on print

[@AndrewAHayes]

for my 2 Ender 3 machines I bought a six box of mirror tiles 250 X 250 and cut them to size and for my 2 Ender 5+ machines I bought 3 400 X 400 ones and also cut those, I can whip a completed print off and throw on another tile and Im up and printing again very quickly

[@faokie]

> Out of context Atomic Shrimp 👍

[@LostInTech3D]

aha, it took 750 people but someone finally got it 😂👍

[@3D_Printing]

The real ultimate bed that prints any thing at all ... is the one the sales person is trying to sell you.

[@christianacar2745]

I dont know why I see soo many negative comments about printing petg on glass. I print mine with no tape or glue, bed is 60-70° and I need to raise the bed a little bit because it wont stick with my normal bed leveling. But after the print, it just release on its own

[@nathan22211]

Well, FR4 isn't used as much. I've seen the creator of the orbiter use it. G10 grade garorite is used more often and works for some people. polypropylene is also a bed surface and is pretty much needed to print polypropylene unless you use clear packing tape. I've even seen proper printing use a wall tile to better effect than glass, apparently. Not sure what the wall tile is made of, but it was probably linoleum

[@Nyaruko]

I'll never go back to those garborundum beds, I find PEI works on both my printers for every model, though you should always wash with soap and water when you first get it, alcohol won't do it!

[@skaltura]

Carborundum AKA Anycubic Ultrabase --- Anycubic came out with this. And for Ender-3 and PLA only, it's insanely good. I cannot agree with you, it's the most forgiving surface all around imho. Warped bed? Oh it doesn't care. Greasy bed? Oh it doesn't care. Dusty bed? Yea same thing. Infact, after receiving it, washing it -- it's better to get a bit greased up. Want Unforgiving? BARE GLASS. Nothing but glass. That stuff you need to get ultra clean, then it almost "sucks in" the filament. Bare well washed glass + PVA after good amount of use is almost as good as carborundum tho

[@TOCZEKX]

Okey, listen GLASS+PETG is awesome. I come up with method to unstick prints from it easily. I got spray bottle with 50/50 mix demineralised water and isopropyl alcohol, after print let it cool a litel (from 75 to 50 deg - for larger prints 40) and spray it around your part, then take samo thin sheet of plastic (i got some PE sheet from packaging and use it to lift edge of the brim, then just push it gently and part will come off easiliy.

[@NeoDemocedes]

2:20 I'm not sure what he's talking about here. I'm still using the original surface that came with my Ender 3 v1, and I have NEVER had to use a scraper of any kind to remove a print. Sure, if you leave the build surface on the printer and try to remove the print there, you're going to have a bad time. You have to unclip the build surface, pick it up with your print attached and bend it. Large prints pop off instantly, small prints might require you to bend on the opposite axis before they pop off. Tiny parts you may have to pluck off with your fingers after loosening them with bending. The only downside I have encountered is that it isn't perfectly flat like glass. Also, I've only used PLA on this printer. Perhaps other materials might get stuck if they easily bend and stretch with the build surface.

[@LostInTech3D]

plucking off with your fingers actually can be very painful, I have suffered way too many purge line splinters from that kind of bed.

[@NeoDemocedes]

@@LostInTech3D Just a light nudge or a twist is all I've ever needed. It's curious that your experience has been so different from mine.

[@TechieSewing]

Ok, I need to pause at 3:01 to stop laughing. This is SO Ender-like!

[@Optisystemizer]

Why aren't more people using Printbite+? No glue, no brim: PLA, PETG, ABS, ASA, NYLON and Carbonfibre. All self-release. Flexible isn't self-releasing but not difficult to remove. Drawbacks in my opinion is: -That I have to use 67° for PLA which makes overhangs near the bed worse (compared to buildtak style beds that only need around 50°) -It is very sensitive to fingerprints and oils but you shouldn't be touching it anyway. -You have to wait for it to cool down, to around 35° for PLA. But I prefer Buildtak for PLA since it gives the nicest matte bottom finish.

[@taj1994]

Any thoughts on some of the PEI-adjacent options that have popped up more recently? PEO, PEY, PET, H1H, etc. EDIT: I've been using PEI-coated steel for a few years now, and I'm considering trying a PEO one because the pattern on it is really cool (and if doesn't work out, the other side is regular powder-coated PEI, which I already know works well for me)

[@edwinvanderhulst7703]

I still use the carborundum glass bed of the Ender 3V2 with glue stick spread out with a damp microfiber cloth works every time so far. I was afraid doing a PETG print with this setup and so far have used it once and it released upon cooldown just like PLA, but now you made me worried again that at some point my PETG print will rip a chunk of glass out? as just a matter of time or enough PETG prints? Hmmm thanks for that :-)

Don't worry, Ive used so many spools of PETG on my ultrabase. Dont know if its that different from yours but it should not be?

[@ny-lights]

Just want to point out that using a release agent like glue stick often isn't for adhesion, but for easy release upon cool down. Products like Magigoo are incredible because they go on so easily, and come off with a damp cloth. I have NEVER had ABS/ASA parts warp off the bed using Magigoo and I now use it for every ABS/ASA print I do for peace of mind and ease. Vision Miner Nano Adhesive is also incredible both for adhesion and release. Both companies designed these products to basically bond with the first layer of prints and then release their grip on the bed once it has cooled down. You can often hear the bond break while the bed cools down and the parts just magically come loose.

[@LostInTech3D]

You are actually spot on. I have a printer in review that I'm currently wrestling with, and considering buying a new glue stick just so I can get the parts off it. It's not something I encounter often but it's really bad in this one!

[@ny-lights]

@@LostInTech3D Check out Magigoo original formula. It's €17.70 including VAT but it'll last you about 100 applications.

[@ashtonhamm8257]

Pla doesn't really stick to the fr4 build plate I have. Everything else petg/asa/nylon works like a dream.

[@tttuberc]

Do these beds become more prone to part lifting as they age? Also, have you tried ABS print (which has bed temp around 110* Celsius) on those magnetic base beds? Thanks very much!

[@LostInTech3D]

I ran bed temp at 100 when I printed the voron. Bed is fine, magnet is fine.

[@tttuberc]

@@LostInTech3D thanks for your numbers and your experience.

[@Cancer38]

why shouldnt you print on the smooth side of glass? i always print on that side when i use glass because the coating they gave it on the ender 3v2 is bad unrelated but i got into bed surfaces for the past little while i have 3 surfaces: glass(came with my ender 3v2), magnetic flexible and g10 and i mostly agree with everything you said i heard from friends the magnetic flexible is terrible but when i tried it i really liked it, it sticked extremely well glass and g10 are *sort of* unforgiving if you have a relatively clean bed you should be good and you can always add glue or crank the temps i think of g10 as a petg bed or a better glass bed (smooth sided) that's less durable also the problem with printing at very high bed temps are warping so you cant just crank the temps

[@ThisisDD]

FR4 is amazing, but requires being clean

[@boerny6757]

Can I put these thin PEI beds on top of the existing glass bed or does it have to come off?

[@LostInTech3D]

every layer you add will affect heat transfer, so the answer is yes, but leave more time to heat the bed up and expect more falloff in temperature, if you set the bed to 60 it probably won't be 60.

[@Noxoreos]

If the glass is permanently attached, you could still keep it and glue a magnetic base on top I guess. Somewhat heavier but at least a rather flat base.

[@LostInTech3D]

yeah you can, I dont know what the heat distribution would be like, it would definitely work though

[@Raytenecks]

PEI: 75c for first layer... What temp after that?

[@loganluckless372]

In my opinion this is the killer app for auto bed leveling that homes z. Swapping is so easy. I water jet plates and use a sheet of 3m adhesive for stuff like PP sheets and glass. Hot tip: most steel flex beds are 1/16" 410 stainless steel.

[@LostInTech3D]

yes absolutely - just swap beds and start a print! Although if all your steel based beds are level then at least you only have to redo the offset and not the mesh too, which is a lot easier.

[@loganluckless372]

@@LostInTech3D Your feature based print bed swapping is genius I'm not sure why I hadn't thought of it. I print a lot of exotic material that's my main application. Something interesting I noticed about that Bambu printer is that the slicer has a drop down for their different surfaces. Wish other slicers had something like that to link the offset to.

[@LostInTech3D]

Oh there could be a workaround actually - just have two printers set up with different start codes!

[@faokie]

I haven't tried any glass beds yet, but I did try to use painter's tape once. Unfortunately it was a short-lived experiment: as soon as I started heating the bed, each line of tape peeled off around its edges. Are you not supposed to heat it?

[@LostInTech3D]

that must have been rubbish tape, next time I recommend "frog" tape, that stuff doesn't come off.

[@faokie]

@@LostInTech3D It worked fine for painting my walls, but I never heated my walls to 60 C. If I remember to buy it next time I have the chance, I'll try again with frog tape.

[@FranklyPeetoons]

After Maker Schmooze talked about it, I tried "Garolite" (or whatever it's called in other realities). It works well and it cost two dollars and change here in America. So, I like the default bed that came with my Ender (dunno what it is) and I also enjoy printing on Garolite. Using PLA here, of course, because I am a dilly taunt who only prints useless crap such as heroic statues of Walter White fighting Professor X with cricket bat mallets.

[@sasca854]

Satin PEI on a spring steel sheet. Done.

[@martinskamla6789]

Got 13 printers……. Now i need 3 bed surfaces for each FUCK

[@LostInTech3D]

Haha, not unless you print 13 of everything, you can move them around.

[@xirabolt]

Kinda like how a cat will randomly refuse a given food for a couple months, my print beds randomly reject certain filaments with no rhyme or reason Purple glue stick was great for a thick blob of gunk that was impossible to wash off

[@Tom-ik5sc]

I have no problem with PETG on my glass bed. The trick is to sacrifice a goat (preferably virgin) at first moonlight.

[@ameliabuns4058]

I actually like build tak and also polycarbonate as a print surface

[@KaliKavala]

I love using the painters tape. Old school and working like a charm if u do not mind textured 1st layer. I am little bit disappointed on your review for ordinary glass. There is a lot to say about it and it is pretty good even compared to the Artillery glass stuff.