Shout Out To Fluff (with Griffin McElroy) | Adventuring Academy Season 2 | Ep. 18

Griffin talks with Brennan about getting into 5e and finding what's important in storytelling.
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[@laurafrakinroslin]

Griffin claims not to be great at floral language yet this boy whipped out ‘when someone leaves your life those exits are not made equal. Some are beautiful and poetic and satisfying. Others are abrupt and unfair. But most are just unremarkable, unintentional, clumsy’. The gall, some of us struggle, Griffin

[@Pablo360able]

…and she shouts something else but you just can't hear it anymore. You just hear the wind. And you just see the stars above you. They are beautiful...and then they're gone.

[@Alison.taylor.c]

the giant hype for griffin and then his face pops up and he's just griffin is SO FUNNY TO ME

[@femthingevelyn]

any appearance of griffin is funny because it's literally always Just Griffin

[@nobodynews]

You know he's a fan because he pronounced modern the appropriate way.

[@left8277]

Also muh-bim-bam

[@levtokol8649]

Modren, no?

[@boo-lh8tz]

an advice show for the MOJERN ERA

[@cirrane1860]

Who do they do that? Is there a story behind it?

[@nobodynews]

@@cirrane1860 I had remembered Justin in a very early episode just mispronounced it that way and kept it. But I've also heard it was actually a reference to some actor they knew in West Virginia who did it that way. I'm not sure which is correct.

[@nathanaelwaters2509]

"I fell in love with a joke, oh no" is a great descriptor for TAZ

[@Alison.taylor.c]

Barry BlueJeans

[@mobslayerstudios]

I’m living for how subtly hurt Brennan looks when Griffin calls “Theater of the Mind” a douche-y term

[@elylozada9576]

Here's the timestamp 11:55 because it's a truly priceless moment.

[@jamesnewton7959]

@@elylozada9576 thank you!

[@jv7x]

Lol I saw that too XD

[@eliasmycroft1388]

Is that one time "30 under 30 media luminary" Griffin McElroy???

[@szpilunia]

Griffin could beat up the others no problem, even if its 2 against 1. He is the strongest McElroy.

[@intraum]

@@szpilunia i think it's a rock paper scissors situation

[@rancidprince3133]

@@intraum Justin beats Travis, Travis beats Griffin, Griffin beats Justin

[@Alison.taylor.c]

griffin's nod after "a one-off joke turned into a beloved character" was just him just going "oh god, barry bluejeans"

[@pbtenchi]

I’m an adversarial DM. Or at least I pretend to be. It’s a carefully crafted persona. My players all believe they are overcoming impossible odds with luck and skill. Little do they realise I’m their biggest fan.

[@lolafendetti970]

You probably give them so many proud, happy moments :)

[@anavnaj]

Troy Lavallee style...

[@rollychairs]

You are the best dm in that case

[@Lurklen]

Same, they're always so paranoid and terrified, suspicious of my smiles or tone. We've been playing for 4 years, had one player death pretty early on, and they've kicked ass from one side of the land to the other. It's like "Guys if I was as scary as you think I am, I think you'd be dead by now." but they get so excited when they win, I don't disabuse them.

[@gaarakamaru]

This is great though because I’ve played with the bad kind of adversarial DM and the difference is that they don’t /let/ you overcome those odds. The dude I played with very clearly had an idea about how the story would go, and if he wanted a monster to be unbeatable or a situation to be unwinnable, he would never roll with punches when we tried to do something different, and it just meant my investment became less and less because I never saw my character’s decisions matter. I don’t entirely fault him because it can happen unintentionally when you’ve written something and you don’t have a plan for when it goes wrong, but ultimately you’re not running DND for people then, you’re just making people listen to your story.

[@juliahancock-song3377]

it warms my heart to see Brennan fanboy this hard

[@rhymeswithmoose228]

Breaking: man claims dinosaurs are just dragons, stuns family with what a damn power move that it

[@chiffon788]

I mean you gotta think it's at least part of the reason so many civilizations have dragons and other big flying things in their mythologies

[@Pablo360able]

@D Money That would imply that they’re a holdover from an oral tradition that’s somehow older than *primates.* And, to be fair, it might be.

[@gcadams782]

"Taking direct action against some ne'er-do-wells" is the most fucking Brennan Lee Mulligan phrase to ever Brennan Lee Mulligan. I am absolutely here for it tho, don't get me wrong

[@blakefeary4369]

i feel like I can see Griffin thinking about barry blue jeans when talking about one of joke npc's

[@grantchatham8267]

Or Garfield???

[@teabeenz6526]

It is. infuriating. that one of my favorite fictional characters of all time that I really truly and earnestly adore is named Barry J. Bluejeans.

[@femthingevelyn]

@@teabeenz6526 not a fan of the name B. J. Bluejeans?

[@teabeenz6526]

@@femthingevelyn oh no I love it wholeheartedly I just can’t talk about it to the uninitiated without sounding like a maniac

[@jumanjiman86]

GRIFFIN NEEDS TO BE A RECURRING CHARACTER

[@jumanjiman86]

IN EVERYTHING THAT HE POSSIBLY CAN BE IF THAT WASNT CLEAR

[@leeblock9573]

I want to like this comment so bad but it's at 69 ;-;

[@jumanjiman86]

@@leeblock9573 you’re a gentleman and a scholar.

[@intraum]

just immediately a story about Noam Chomsky's coffee maker, i love it

[@juliawhitmore3991]

*Griffin:* -and now we're just like trying to destroy capitalism *Brennan Fuck Lee Capitalism Mulligan:* ✊🏻😏

[@_zurr]

Fuck Lee Capitalism indeed

[@femthingevelyn]

all my homies hate Lee Capitalism

[@boo-lh8tz]

it's so refreshing to follow a conversation of two people who can listen. it must be really nice to talk to brennan, he's such an active listener

[@ianpeters1980]

Seeing Griffin grin all the time while he's talking adds so much charm to a podcast I love it

[@gmescott]

Love how unabashedly psyched Brendan is to have Griffin on the show! Two good good boys. :D

[@TylerMartin]

what you guys were talking about at around 50:00, the actual play experience at the table leading to more investment than a backstory, is why the other DMs at my table and I have implemented "preshots" where we actually play a one on one session with each PC before the campaign starts, covering their backstory, some important events and characters in it, the formative event in their backstory, and how they got to where the campaign starts. actually playing through that rather than just writing it on a piece of paper leads to so much more investment and connection to your character right off the bat

[@giggy7935]

I do this, and in my most recent campaign I had them all appear (extremely briefly) as NPCs in each other's intro adventures, so when we actually started the first session they all had this "YOU!" moment and then looked around the table all confused. It was *chefs kiss*

[@axelz4316]

That’s really cool, I’ve contemplated that before. I might have to try that.

[@DimT670]

Hunter the vigil has that as a normal rule

[@littlesnowflakepunk855]

griffin kinda did that with Amnesty

[@JonathanAwesomeify]

Just saying, I absolutely loved Amnesty. Especially the perfectly-timed outro taglines!

[@svenbtb]

Amnesty was great, I feel it doesn't get the love it deserves. Definitely Clint's best-acted and most real-feeling character imo.

[@JonathanAwesomeify]

@@svenbtb True! I'm actually bouncing off Graduation pretty hard.

[@nickbeutler]

@@JonathanAwesomeify I sort of felt the same way regarding Graduation, but there was a moment, albeit pretty late, where it grabbed me and I’ve loved it ever since.

[@JonathanAwesomeify]

@@nickbeutler I've skipped ahead to the last two episodes, we'll see how it ends! I think there are a few things going on for me: way too many NPCs, especially at the beginning, who I didn't particularly care about, along with a HUGE amount of world-building; some relatively minor but glaring rules errors, coupled with some strange build choices; and a general sense of the McElroys straining against the 5e rule set. Like the time Clint wanted to chop off the evil dude's hand to get the ... glove, I think? That would be easy to roll for in MOTW. Not so much in 5e. I know a lot of people won't care about that stuff as much, but for me it just made it really hard to get into.

[@Josie-th3id]

I mean I’m an English major rn and I’ve referenced/studied TAZ balance in a couple of different contexts already in college. My university actually features a number of classes that present Ttrpg real play as a genre of study in at least a couple units!

[@jordandavenport5784]

These two have the best version of DMing, in my opinion. Having a track, but letting them pick the route, vehicle, and stops along the way is my favorite version of DMing. I’ve played full open world games, and people just don’t know what they want after a while. People want a goal, otherwise they aim their sights at the nearest threats, which is their party.

[@crisdaguru2025]

Finally, been waiting for at least one of the mcelroys on the show

[@left8277]

Travis is on next week (this week for dropout!)

[@kacektv9405]

Alternate Title? "Two good good GM Boys talk about Good Boy DnD Subjects. Spoilers Theys good"

[@user-vl8ws4wd7o]

Warning: heart-wrenchingly wholesome content ahead

[@FreelancerLA]

TAZ is what got me into D&D and where I learned about Dimension 20. So cool to see Brennan and Griffin discuss their approaches to GMing!

[@oyasumiruby2751]

I can see how far Griffin has grown as a DM and I really cannot wait for his next adventure. What a great, insightful interview. It has given me a lot to think about for my own campaign as well!

[@MeleeTiger]

I remember when I heard that Griffin was a new DM when starting Balance, that it spurred me into trying to DM myself. I had only been playing D&D for like a year, with only having played one campaign to fruition, and maybe 2 others that were up in the air. It was such a relief when my older brother who helped me play-test my campaign as a player said he was pleasantly surprised and would never have guessed it I had zero experience doing that sort of thing had he not already known.

[@MeleeTiger]

It was 95% scratch built campaign no less, only things I re-used was monster and equipment stats. Was a post apocalyptic dealio set in like 2050 after an overgrowth disaster on a generic island nation. Had basic maps online but the rest was theater of the mind, which is apparently what I'm better at, too many doodads slowed me down.

[@MeleeTiger]

I feel one thing that helped was that I've always had odd dreams for better or worse, and have been keeping a dream diary for years, and with figuring out how to properly describe what I dreamt and put it down on the page in a descriptive way that makes sense, feel that experience leant itself to writing a story, especially when a number of my dreams have story like structure to them.

[@rek8193]

Seeing Griffin on video during a conversation is both wonderful and bizarre.

[@KarlKatten]

Griffin McElroy is literally my favourite content creator of all time. I've listened to all the episodes of wonderul, mbmbam and currently re-listening to all of the Balance arc because that shit is straight up a master piece of entertainment. So awesome to see him on here, much love.

[@KarlKatten]

Also three deep in the window is the best thing ever

[@andrewba11ard32]

I love Balance so much, it’s one of my favourite pieces of media ever created tbh.

[@Tickerbee]

Brennan is so right about how much you can hate a villain that became a villain during gameplay, in my Curse of Strahd game, we hate Strahd because he's personally done a lot of stuff to us outside of simply being told he is bad.

[@supercres]

"Different DMs have different superpowers... you had an intuitive immediate ability to know what was diamond and what was rough." This highlights a great point that I found tough to put into words. In fairness to others who don't have this superpower who shall go unnamed, it's got to be way easier to do this when you're using the starter campaign and not when you've spent a year on worldbuilding preproduction. That way lies madness (and a significant chunk of episodes that I found tough to listen to tbh). The closest I could come to putting a name on it before was that a DM has to be able to kill their darlings.

[@f33f33nkou]

It's okay, you can say Travis is a bad dm.

[@supercres]

Neither confirming nor denying that’s who I’m taking about, the DM in question has gotten a *lot* better. More drawing the contrast with how Griffin was immediately very roll-with-the-punches

[@peytonwarren1936]

@@supercres griffin got worse as a DM throughout balance. HTBG and TRE are both 9/10 arcs and it never gets that good again. “What if we made it dramatic?” is TAZ’s “what if you showed who killed Laura Palmer?” - planned arcs and dramatic scenes run counter to their talents.

[@bw4708]

Just two tremendous boys

[@youraveragemonkey7823]

I need a sketch with brennan as the CEO of Parler 😔

[@emilycpy9991]

Accurate.

[@igerstel]

oh my god it's a perfect idea.

[@Dallior]

See but the CEO of Parler knew exactly what the fuck he was doing, that nasty little cretin

[@Acidtesting123]

Its honestly just so refreshing to see both of these minds not only *not battling* but fully engaged with each other. So so fucking good.

[@hannahfanning9585]

I love the vibe of both of these people looking at the other and thinking "wow, he's amazing"

[@hipsterbrigadier9428]

Adventure Zone got me into DnD, Dimension 20 makes me want to DM....so this is a dream

[@helloeverybodization]

Here's some things no one's going to tell you. It's rough. It's really fucking rough. It's hard to deal with the loss of not just characters, but players. There's an incredible amount of preparation, and not everyone is going to appreciate it. It's going to be taxing, but at the end of the day, you're going to love it.

[@JC-ln6on]

Laser Ted, man. Keep it wavy.

[@psi_sig]

Dont print a printer

[@Littlehickish]

i am so ready to see these two nerds gush about each other’s nerd shit for an hour and a half

[@TheKevinHendricks]

Hard headed dinosaur Brennan describes was Pachycephalosaurus (or also Dracorex and Stygmiloch). Iguanadon is a Hadrosaur, and one of the first dinosaurs to be described (after Megalosaurus)

[@FuzorFishbug]

I am now fully consumed by the desire to hear the lost episode of Here There Be Gerblins where they just fought skeletons for an hour that Griffin mentions at 32:50

[@buxzw1945]

I can't remember if they released it, but I remember them talking about how completely unfunny and bored they were

[@kyleserafin9616]

I'll never get tired of Griffin stanning Friends at the Table. Lazer Ted forever!

[@JC-ln6on]

Fuck yeah, dude! Keep it wavy

[@MeleeTiger]

Dude, the first ever game of D&D I played was made using the material Griffin put out! It was so much fun even on it's own, but there was also the element of us doing an arch and listening to the podcast to see how things unfolded for the Tres Horny Boys.

[@legoduckie]

When did Griffin put out materials?? I would like to absorb them 👀👀

[@thisisfine9586]

Me too 👀

[@inkboopus]

ooooo what material 👀

[@valosonthor]

So happy to hear that shout-out for Friends at the Table. Genuinely some of the best storytelling in actual play. Boat party!

[@Martyr9991]

Uhh how did you forget "30-under-30 Media Luminary and your sweet baby brother Griffin McElroy" in his credits?

[@birdlord5000]

lazer ted didn't just work at space kinkos, he got banned from space kinkos for trying to print a printer. absolute legend

[@valosonthor]

Would be really great to hear a conversation between Brennan and Austin Walker. I feel like their GM philosophies have a lot of overlap but some very interesting differences, and it'd be interesting to hear them talk about that.

[@garyantonyo]

Griffin talking about graduation like he enjoyed playing it. This warms my heart.

[@pandanurse]

I adore seeing how much of a fanboy Brennan is of Griffin. Like Brennan is such a phenomenal creative person and I've been living and breathing mcelroy content for 5 years, so its like YO THE GUY I LOVE LOVES THE GUY I LOVE

[@mathewfrance5165]

Two of my favorite digital famous boys. This is so exciting!

[@woebegone_kenobi]

One of my favorite episodes so far. Love hearing you two bounce off eachother so well 🔥

[@devincheeseman3867]

Man, this was cool. Two of my fav DMs sat down together.

[@humanish4042]

this episode warmed my little nerd heart

[@DeganH]

This is amazing!

[@BlackShadow1991]

The Adventuring Academy, without missing a beat, continues the trend of great guests and awesome hosting :D Listening to these talks makes the time fly by.

[@silk3sm00th]

Everything you're saying right here has me hyped for the next season Griffin. Be there day 1 for crazy family ad-hoc insanity

[@aquestionabletaryn]

I love just watching these two guys who are obviously such big fans of each other. So cute and fun

[@julieobrecht1131]

Two of my favorite DMs!

[@boo-lh8tz]

58:50 soo true as a player i often want my DM to point me in the right direction because i often feel like i'm wasting time barking up the wrong tree. i just want to know where the bad guy is hiding in this big city so please give me a hint where to look. it's not railroading. it saves time and leads to a more interesting session

[@notednuance]

I miss Ficus and his bear-friend Kodi. Lotta fun to hear these fellas talk shop and as a forever-DM I whole-heartedly agree with not getting the antagonistic DM mindset. I want fights to feel challenging, but I'm rooting for the players since... ya know... they're my friends.

[@Alison.taylor.c]

my two favorite DMs????? i'm crying i can't handle this i got so excited seeing this video

[@SCwirlify]

It is so great when hosts have a great guest and just let them talk ;)

[@cybren3003]

Was hoping there was a friends at the table shoutout. Was delighted that there was a lazer ted shoutout

[@brendanwatroba8568]

Love all the shout outs to Friends at the Table! They don't play d&d, but people should definitely check out their show. Griffen talking about it on Wonderful! Is what got me into it in the first place years ago

[@devonh8473]

Very awesome to see them shouting out Friends at the Table!

[@RLmediashow]

the boys!! the boys are here!!

[@zyanward7169]

50:55 Griffin has used that same halocline analogy before, but for farts 😂

[@dontmindme5239]

yes the shout out to the monster factory!! i love that series so so so much I love the episode!! may or may not have taken notes throughout lmao

[@nerdherder9340]

Absolutely fascinating that there is a direct line from acq inc to adventure zone to d20 and you can really see the influence.

[@LosingLara]

this is perfect timing because I'm about to run a monster of the week game for my friends this weekend and I've never run a game for anyone for any ttrpg ever so I'm glad it's someone who has run monster of the week before!

[@ferociousbiscuit]

I wish to be as cool as Griffin someday. No matter what he does I feel like he's always creating a space outside of reality where everything's going to be okay.

[@hhh827]

Griffin lies, I am here like nothing else before. I am delighted to watch this.

[@Smieska_13]

aaaaah my two favourite DMs

[@emo6577]

I love these boys so much

[@michaelperkins3814]

I was rewatching a crown of candy and realized that limon is just the gilear of a crown of candy

[@ge6906]

i just screamed through that whooole intro

[@biffenheimer]

Oh holy shit it's the former CEO of both Tide and Moviepass Bounced on my boy's subscribe button to this for hours

[@k8g8s8]

Thank you Griffin! Very cute

[@robinl.721]

Tiny Heist with the McElroy fam was sooo great!!!

[@maxhornby6592]

I’ve said it before and I will stand by this point like a fuckin mountain, Balance is up there for one of the best stories every told

[@axelz4316]

Looks like Gronk got himself a PS5. Lucky duck.

[@Mmmbop0987]

When griffin said everyone crawled into bed and fell asleep I felt attacked because I was in the act of crawling into bed

[@jv7x]

Two of my favorite DMs right there

[@intraum]

so when are we getting the 70 hour podcast about Bubbles the jelly bean man

[@igerstel]

Griffin low-key showing off that PS5 in the background. So many good take-aways from this for my own game!

[@KillItAndBurnIt]

Griffin shouting out Friends at the Table, yesss

[@edgarseis]

Aww :) this made me want to watch tiny heist I've been binging on FH and UC. It sounds like a nice change of pace :P

[@ericburgwinkel1309]

Griffin is a goddamn national treasure

[@breadvelvet]

shout out to friends at the table

[@caitlinisahookerfromhell]

griffin: says anything about dnd me, tryna hit: omg so true ‼️🥰

[@liamcarrion]

Two lovely grand men

[@drr0b0tnik]

Griffins place looks like Nicholas Cages apartment in Matchstick Men.

[@darkollie77]

I felt so worried about my upcoming first dm campaign and was just freezing myself with overthinking. This loosened my brain and I'm excited and inspired again. You two are a massive inspiration for this dnd player/writer/improviser/fan :)

[@fluff_thorrent]

Hey, thanks!

[@buxzw1945]

Griffin's DM-ing again is all I got from this, and my heart is singing.

[@altdelet3778]

My two boys together!!

[@DandyCipher]

It's time!

[@TorSmawbs]

Brennan is geeking so hard that he's laughing like he wants to get in Griffin's pants. It's pretty endearing.

[@MrQuickLine]

Uhhhh... Maybe I missed it, but in all the things Griffin does, I didn't hear any mention of co-host of the annual gem, 'Til Death Do Us Blart.

[@buxzw1945]

Goat Talk