SIIIG and ChristianPrince: On Icons and Images

[@ungas024]

He argues like a Muhammadan, which reminds me of the iconoclast heretics and how the Eastern Church rebuked the Muhammadans while the Muhammadans ravaged Christian lands those Saints gave their life fighting the scourge of Muhammad while at the same time fighting these kinds of heretics. 😏😏😏

[@zman42]

Yes indeed, Islam is the birthplace of Iconoclasm and was able to influence the church to become iconoclastic until icon veneration was brought back. 🙏

[@YeahHanzo]

Siig dont confrote him anymore its ridiculous.. this guy has no idea about our tradition may the Lord open his eyes and soften his heart

[@goldie862]

But it might help his listeners that are following this whole thing

[@JosephChreian777]

Return to the Apostolic Church ✝️

[@TryingToFollowChrist37]

Yeah bro your right CP is a waste of time. The only way is to catch him on a neutral platform.

[@Huntingdonn]

Have you ever read the second commandment?

[@ig9642]

Tradition will get you nowhere just like it didn't get the pharisees anywhere. Hold true to God and God alone.

[@caliburnblade7895]

This is like how protestants automatically assume prayer=worship.

[@Cee_H]

I wouldn't label that to protestants that's just people in general

[@jonathanguyot624]

And most Muslims

[@TryingToFollowChrist37]

@@ayo123 They do kind of sound the same at times.

[@jukrak]

They are the same

[@perry714.]

It completely depends on how you’re praying. Are you praying for or praying to. You shouldn’t be praying for dead people as their fate is already sealed and if your praying to someone who isn’t God then yes that is a form of worship

[@aquavitae3824]

God help us out of ignorance and pride.

[@jonathanguyot624]

Amen

[@TryingToFollowChrist37]

Amen

[@TheChaz789]

Amen.

[@YeahHanzo]

Cp lost his mind ....

[@Improvementcrusader23]

Once an Abdul always an Abdul. CP can’t help it

[@jameswitt108]

I love your use of the Naruto soundtrack😂

[@guillermodeleon3547]

As a Maronite Catholic fam, God bless you and your ministry. In Christ, every man is a word in the mouth of God so that all humanity becomes a song of love ✝️ 🎵 St. Sharbel

[@Orthodoxyistheway1234]

Cp needs to admit he's wrong.

[@d3adp94]

Good luck.

[@Alana12]

He isnt

[@JPhillips19877]

@@Alana12No, he’s wrong. An iconoclastic position undermines the incarnation. Christ is the icon of the Father but CP doesn’t know that because he’s stupid.

[@SneakerByNature]

It is his understanding but I hope the Holy Spirit will guide him.

[@lsksportsacademy8498]

But his not

[@lindakhosho-pz5gt]

I like CP’S work but I disagree with him about the icons

[@felixmeier3298]

Why do you like him, he calls you and his christian brothers idolators XD

[@SIIIG1]

Thanks for watching! Make sure to head over to Patreon for more stuff as well as if you want to support the community!

[@andrewbailey9453]

I thought you were wrong SIIIG but after watching this, I say you're 100% right. My bad brother and God bless you 🙏🏿 ✝️

[@lesmen4]

millions of miracles are happening through relics of Holy people in Catholic Church. even protestants go there for healing

[@BR-to2nk]

Thank God for our relics❤

[@SneakerByNature]

Siig you’re doing the right thing here by not hating, I love CP’s work when he handles the Muslim. But he’s old and Stubborn, he should refresh his knowledge on this. Luckily, These issue with CP happen so me myself will learn too. Thanks Siig

[@arthurgarber1315]

This should not even be a debate... That's why CP asked why every church have different image of the same person... CP don't even insult him...

[@lahleholivia7398]

Al lah - I started Christianity (Quran 4-157). Al lah - I don't like Christianity (Quran 98:6). 🤡👞

[@Ev3nol]

Imagine using the Quran, Christianity came before Islam and as a sane person I'll never trust someone who married a child and consummate the marriage with her when she is a child.

[@Inquisasist15]

This was totally unbearable... you tried keeping as cordial as possible but his ego and insecurity just wouldn't let you reply.

[@jonathanguyot624]

Thanks for trying SIIIG,God bless🙏

[@Ola-Bezalel]

SIIG is a baba! Thanks man, I got a response for them now!

[@joshuastelly9129]

I now see why Kelly Powers is dodging you on your debate challenge of Icons. You know your stuff man. Keep up the great work.

[@PatrickIreland.]

this chat was at least 2 weeks agi

[@str33ttun3r9]

That’s like many people worshiping cows in India that’s more like an idol

[@TryingToFollowChrist37]

CP kicked Siiig first time for calling Mary a Palestinian Jew. A little bit weird.

[@diego1590]

He's a pro Israel genocide apologist.

[@heatherxmars46]

I would too if someone called Mary a Palestinian.

[@Akhgy]

@@heatherxmars46doesn’t matter bro, Cause Rome Called it Palestine you can call it Israel.. it doesn’t matter.. the Arabs in Gaza are not natives

[@heatherxmars46]

@@Akhgy relax bro. It wasn't Palestine till after Jesus death. So calling Mary a Palestinian is inaccurate. Call ended lol.

[@sdf32asd]

@@heatherxmars46 lol? are you serious🤣

[@Franko.nate24]

Exodus 20 v 4 “You shall not make for yourself an image in the form of anything in heaven above or on the earth beneath or in the waters below.

[@michaelong2625]

thank you siig....you just exposed how cp is disrespectful....sad ill pray for you cp for enlightenment..

[@inrmds]

icon is poopoo - cp

[@ulka7777]

CP doubling down is just so disappointing

[@couragenwosu9036]

question: is the conflation how some may subconsciously treat icons as idols in terms of ‘praying to or through them’ regardless of the accuracy of the artistry itself? p.s. that has been my question mainly towards catholicism for a while now as to why saints or angel can be a called upon when i believe all we need is the name of Jesus.

[@MrApoons]

At this point CP just become a poor comedy, I stop watching him long time ago... It was just a matter of time till, someone get piss off & expose him, coz he went way to far

[@TryingToFollowChrist37]

I used to watch him too until I realised that it was a waste of time same content same approach, that and the way he used to wine about the stream numbers are down and that the viewer were fake Christians for not sharing the stream.

[@BR-to2nk]

I love CP :( It just breaks my heart when he bashes catholicism, he doesnt realize the harm he does. I think all catholics should unsubscribe for a while. To make our point. He needs prayer on that matter, and his listeneners too

[@MaxStArlyn]

Great work.

[@olubunmiolumuyiwa]

Holy Theotokos pray for us!

[@Monday2705]

Please keep being KIND. There are obviously various barriers to understanding happening here …

[@markullah9590]

“And laid open the book of the law, wherein the heathen had sought to paint the likeness of their images.”

[@zman42]

Me when I don’t understand Greek

[@jaygo586]

Reference please

[@BR-to2nk]

Where bro

[@BR-to2nk]

SIIIIIG That was youuuu ?? ❤❤ I had to unsubscribe when he wouldnt let you talk. I had no idea it was you. Woooow this is what happened in the back scene?? How didn't this go viral?? Thank you so much for having tried to come on stage and argue this point ❤ its really sad that he doesnt wanna hear it. It's so unfortunate even to inspire Christians that admire him so much, to think so erronly about the icons. But hey, Mary & Jesus saw you behind that camera and they smiled❤ (Btw i resubscribed, but i needed a break!)

[@ConradThePalamite]

🔥

[@bigchungus5001]

☦️

[@Giant_Meteor]

Mary and Jesus have appeared to the saints from the beginning, and the community has been creating images of them all along. CP is rejecting the unanimous testimony of the church when he says that the church does not know what they look like.

[@alexmason8557]

Church is not an institution. Its anyone who believes in christ. Bible never said mary is the intercessor.

[@Giant_Meteor]

@alexmason8557 The church is a body, _instituted_ by Jesus, under an authority he designated of Apostolic leadership. From the beginning, this authority is conferred from one generation to the next by the laying on of hands. Outside of this historic community, there have also been many men throughout the ages who have appointed themselves as leaders over congregations of their own. These no more belong to the historic community that Jesus instituted than a random restaurant would be by merely putting up some golden arches out front would be a legitimate McDonald's. There are Christians outside the historic church, just as there are hamburgers outside McDonald's. Anyone who prays for another is an intercessor, and there is a great cloud of holy witnesses interceding with God.

[@BR-to2nk]

​​@@alexmason8557Jesus reveals himself not just in the Bible. He has appeared to many saints throughout history. Also the Bible has been compiled. It's stories of men witnessing God. Something still happening today.

[@edward1412]

“I went in to pray, and found there a curtain hanging on the doors of the said church, dyed and embroidered. It bore an image either of Christ or of one of the saints; I do not rightly remember whose the image was. Seeing this, and being loth that an image of a man should be hung up in Christ's church contrary to the teaching of the Scriptures, I tore it asunder and advised the custodians of the place to use it as a winding sheet for some poor person.” Epiphanius, Letter to John, B of Jerusalem (394 A.D.)

[@ulka7777]

The controversy over the authenticity of this letter is discussed in the writings of St John of Damascus, the 7th Ecumenical Council, St Theodore the Studite, and - most extensively - by St Nicephorus of Constantinople. All of these sources argue that the postscript was not by the hand of St Epiphanius. Assuming that it actually was, a single voice among millions is not sufficient cause to reject the long-standing Tradition of the Church. For example, in On the Holy Icons by St Theodore the Studite, the following dialogue is found (under the heading, “Patristic Authority for Iconoclasm”): Heretic: Epiphanius is one of them, the man who is prominent and renowned among the saints. Orthodox: We know that Epiphanius is a saint and a great wonder-worker. Sabinus, his disciple and a member of his household, erected a church in his honor after his death, and had it decorated with pictures of all the Gospel stories. He would not have done this if he had not been following the doctrine of his own teacher. Leonitus also, the interpreter of the divine Epiphanius’ writings, who was himself bishop of the church in Neapolis in Cyprus, teaches very clearly in his discourse on Epiphanius how steadfast he was in regard to the holy icons, and reports nothing derogatory concerning him. So the composition against the icons is spurious and not at all the work of the divine Epiphanius. A central dogma in the debate centered on the teachings of St. Epiphanius. Iconoclasts argued from a dubious text that the venerable saint stated his rejection of icons … In response, the iconodule John of Damascus (676-749) apparently visited the multiple-domed basilica of Salamis-Constantia in the eighth century, recording that “The proof that he [St. Epiphanius] did not object to images, is to be found in his own church, which is adorned with images to this day.” Domes of Heaven: The Domed Basilicas of Cyprus, p. 87

[@SIIIG1]

Likely a forged document

[@mirelaalina4050]

Hi Siig, thank you for being you. Not sure if you are aware of Jay Dyer's work. ☦️❤️ Christian Orthodox Eastern. ❤️⛪

[@MaqAttaq1]

Idol is an image of a false god Two parts - image and god Image can be an icon God infers the image being worshipped So an image/icon only turns into an idol if it’s worshipped?

[@prodigalsonposts]

Roughly speaking, yes, if it’s given Latria. Then it’s idolatry. Idolatry is a contraction of Idol + Latria

[@Nilunam]

CP is very knowledgeable about islam and does a good job at debunking it but he is totally ignorant about christianity which makes his pseudonym a total misnomer. It's actually sad to see him act like this.

[@olav8490]

CP and shamoun are just out of their depths. They should just talk one on one than just making their followers fight it out.

[@ElDogeRenacido]

Agreed, they should talk it out. But it is CP that is out of his depths here. Icons have been used since Noah.

[@BR-to2nk]

​@@ElDogeRenacidoand he wont let us say it !

[@brogro6081]

In my country Mary is looks Asian. Is that real Mary?

[@fatyoutubepanda]

hello SIIG CP is an OG please reconcile dispute with him in private try to heal the split instead of fueling it i am a supporter of you both god bless

[@BR-to2nk]

Huh??? Who fueled what?? Bro get lost😂

[@ricetanzania4148]

what is this: no discussion that it is not

[@danielkumaga1108]

Why do we read and define scriptures according to the idols of our heart.? I thought these two verses are so clear on this issue, except you're saying the church traditions that are anti-scriptures are stronger than scriptures. I don't believe all church traditions are correct and no church father is infallible. Scriptures can not be broken. Verse 4 says don't make any graven image OR any likeness (may not be graven image; icons fall under this category). Verse 5 says don't bow (not even because of worship, it says don't even attempt to bow for any reason) OR worship them; Exodus 20 Verse 4 King James Bible Thou shalt not make unto thee any graven image, or any likeness of any thing that is in heaven above, or that is in the earth beneath, or that is in the water under the earth: New King James Version “You shall not make for yourself a carved image-any likeness of anything that is in heaven above, or that is in the earth beneath, or that is in the water under the earth; New International Version “You shall not make for yourself an image in the form of anything in heaven above or on the earth beneath or in the waters below. New Living Translation “You must not make for yourself an idol of any kind or an image of anything in the heavens or on the earth or in the sea. Verse 5 King James Bible Thou shalt not bow down thyself to them, nor serve them: for I the LORD thy God am a jealous God, visiting the iniquity of the fathers upon the children unto the third and fourth generation of them that hate me; New King James Version you shall not bow down to them nor serve them. For I, the LORD your God, am a jealous God, visiting the iniquity of the fathers upon the children to the third and fourth generations of those who hate Me, New International Version You shall not bow down to them or worship them; for I, the LORD your God, am a jealous God, punishing the children for the sin of the parents to the third and fourth generation of those who hate me, New Living Translation You must not bow down to them or worship them, for I, the LORD your God, am a jealous God who will not tolerate your affection for any other gods. I lay the sins of the parents upon their children; the entire family is affected-even children in the third and fourth generations of those who reject me.

[@felixmeier3298]

"icons fall under this category" No they dont, the text speaks about Idols, not Icons, the word used is "פֶ֣֙סֶל֙ ׀ (pesel)" The Septuagint also uses the word "εἴδωλον (eidōlon)", so it should be clear to EVERYONE, that this isnt talking about Icons. Icons are not anti-scripture, Jesus is an Icon of the Father, Words are Icons of our language, so the Bible itself is an Icon. Guess we have to get rid of all Bibles now?! XD Nobody worships Saints as God, they are venerated. "Scriptures can not be broken." But it seems like it can be twisted to your liking? Stop reading things into a Verse that arent there, it clearly talk about idolatry (worshiping false Gods) and we shouldnt do that. Every Christian can agree with this Verse, but why make it about Icons, when its not talking about them? Again, no Christian, not one, worships the Saints as false Gods.

[@danielkumaga1108]

@@felixmeier3298 bro it literally said OR any such thing, and it said don't even bow to it, whether it's for worship or not.

[@felixmeier3298]

​@@danielkumaga1108 Again, its talking about idols, how do you not get that? Its talking about taking things in nature and making them your God, its not talking about icons.

[@danielkumaga1108]

@@felixmeier3298 bro you can stay with your man made traditions that's not scriptural, but the truths still stands. What's an icon.? The meaning of ICON is a person or thing widely admired especially for having great influence or significance in a particular sphere. In relation to icon veneration, an Icon in Greek simply denotes a picture but it has now come to be closely associated with religious art which is used by the Eastern Orthodox and Catholic Churches. Icons are used to assist in prayer and the worship of God by Orthodox Churches. Bro scriptures teaches that we only honour the Father, the Son, and the Holy Spirit, not any other saints or person what so ever, talk more of asking for prayers or favor from such saints. I've often heard that it's not the materials that's being honored but the saints behind it. You can go read those verses I pasted again, it clearly says don't make any graven image OR, it's seems like you don't know what or means; well it means it's making a distinction between two things, there's the making of an image, or there's the making of any likeness of a thing (which may be a picture or icon or any other thing), then verse 5 says don't even bow to it, what you are worshipping it or not. But no, the traditions you were brought up with are stronger that scriptural commands, I get. But let God be true and every other man a liar. If icon veneration is to be held, the early apostles would have carried it on their head and made one for Mary and another for Jesus, but no, neither Jesus nor his apostles ever even came close to inferring it. You can attribute the first iconographer to Luke in the 4 century for all I care, but bro, something is not in scripture, in fact anti-scripture, and then you attribute it to someone in the fourth century, something that the chief corner stone (Jesus) nor the foundation of the Church (the apostles) never inferred. Continue with your tradition, but the Bible is clear on this.

[@venture7486]

@@danielkumaga1108So why did the Israelites make graven images of cherubim on the Ark? Or why did Solomon have heaven images of animals and cherubim INSIDE the Temple? Answer that.

[@jamalkhan3708]

Christians stop attacking each other’s. God will judge, who we are to judge each other?

[@diego1590]

Could you not judge lets say jehowah's witnesses or Nestorius himself?

[@albohnayen]

bible says use righteous judgement.

[@ElDogeRenacido]

We are called to love our neighbor and be kind. Not nice.

[@Mytears_01]

Cp is right on this matter because Sam started insûlting and accusing cp because an individual says cp debunk him... I go with cp but they need to settle all the ungodly character 😢

[@dolphinitely_bro3944]

Cp is in grave error, 500 yr old cultists

[@MrApoons]

CP just insult every single Catholic & Orthodox... CP debunk nothing, he just expose himself as a massive ignorant & deciever.

[@micke6705]

cp insulted the church Sam called him out to debate

[@MrApoons]

@@micke6705 William Albrech too, Jay Dyer too... CP wont stand 2 min in front of people of knowledge, that's why he wont show up. He wont appologise & repent too...

[@lientforjuve8118]

Dude, Sam schooled CP, because CP insulting apostolic church by saying they are pagans just like Muhammadan. In fact the first one who response was William, then Sam

[@jonathanguyot624]

Seems like CP does not know of the many Marial apparitions...

[@BR-to2nk]

Exactlyyyy !!

[@guruji.2022]

A bit off topic Well please tell me why did the priests have scandals with little boys???

[@SIIIG1]

I don’t know, because they are nasty?

[@ChristianTheChicken]

Why did Judas betray Jesus? Why did Jesus choose Judas as an Apostle if he knew he would betray Him? Nobody in the world believes priests can't sin, be corrupted, or betray the Church. This is tragic but a false dilemma.

[@Ex_Nihilo777]

but how are false gods created? by practices...what are these practices you ask? well practices such as bowing down, kneeling and kissing man made created object...thus a false god is created. you are in a vicous circle you can't get out of. no amount of word play will allow you to maneuver your way around the practices you do weith these "icons" that turn them into an idol.

[@z3rocodes]

@@Ex_Nihilo777 straw man. Veneration vs Worship, if you can't understand the distinction your ignorance doesn't prove your claim. No one believes an icon or statue is God or has the capacity to forgive sins or grant eternal life. Try and understand the theology of those you critique before opening your mouth and bearing false witness.

[@Ex_Nihilo777]

@@z3rocodes you call me ignorant and that I lack understand even though you yourself completely did not understand my argument. siig mentions that icons are not idols, which in "face value" I agree. however my argument was from a stand point of underlining what idols/false gods are. idols are only idols because of the practices one does in service of them, by them I mean any man made created object or in your case icons. the israelites thought they were worshiping God by creating a golden calf and venerating it i.e bowing down, kneeling rasing hands and kissing. these types of practice and acts are what creates idols to begin with. thus at face value icons are not idols but if you were willing to understand what constitutes an idol, you will come to the conclusion that icons are in fact idols. I cannot say you worship a false god that is the icons, however I can say that you have created an idol/false god by the practice you do in service of them. I hope this helps 🙏🏽 you or siig are not my enemy, God bless you.

[@Ex_Nihilo777]

@@z3rocodes also you yourself made a strawman of my argument as it did not including me saying anything about how icons may or may not be believed to forgive sins and grant eternal life. all I mentioned was the practice you do towards them.

[@venture7486]

So when God allowed Israel to bow to David, a created creature, alongside him in 1 Chronicles 29:20, was he sanctioning idolatry? Or when Jesus said that he would make the synagogue of Satan bow down to the Church in Rev 3:9? Or when God gave Joseph a dream of his brothers bowing down to him? Was he allowing idolatry? The act of bowing itself does not constitute idolatry, but the orientation of the heart from which these same acts proceed from.

[@bruce6545]

Idol is an idol no matter what. Otherwise Hindus can say the same to us.

[@robbiestones9447]

Hindus openly worship them idols though.. no Christian has ever said I worship a Saint....church history and the bible..it isnt bible only...you protestants have made the bible something to be worshipped...

[@bruce6545]

@@robbiestones9447 Hindus worship openly and you closely that won't change the fact you are not different from them.

[@jaygo586]

@@bruce6545biig difference actually

[@JORA52]

Nobody worships icons

[@bruce6545]

@@JORA52 you do it same as Muslims worship black stone. Your words can deny it but not your actions

[@Caffer9286]

The Israelites made and image/calf and declared it to be the God that brought them out of egypt. They thought that what they did was right. This is why God forbade it, it doesnt matter what you think or believe you are kneeling/kissing/praying is. Its not what you think it is. Statue or Image of Jesus is not Jesus. Israels number one sin or most frequent was going after idols. Come on people. No deep dive into the greek needed. This is what happens when you put the traditions of men over and above scripture.

[@SIIIG1]

I literally used the Bible. You put the words of a page over what Jesus and his students taught.

[@Akhgy]

Your making absolutely no Sense.. - the Israelites Made a Image of A Calf, and Worship it as A Diety, and Give it attribute that this God Carried them out of Egypt.. that’s a Image of A False God.. - God Says to not make any Graven Image above and Below…. We know what he mean. Do not make a Image Of A Created Things, it doesn’t mean don’t Make Anything, it Means so not make a God like The Israelites Did. - Later God Command For Them to Creat a Tarbernale with heavenly Cherubim’s… if we Go by your ignorant understanding, God Contradict himself.. -but you gone say because god command it it is okay… -God also command not to do so.. Either God we worship is a False God that contradict himself how there is a meaning to what he says.. Christ is The Image Of God .. Is Christ Idol? no

[@Ex_Nihilo777]

I agree

[@jaygo586]

A deep dive into Greek actually IS needed

[@felixmeier3298]

christian prince argues like a muslim when it comes to the injeel. He says the picture of Mary isnt Mary, but how does he know it isnt Mary, when he doesnt know how Mary looks like? XD Also, why is he treating you like a muslim caller and not like a brother? How can he call himself christian prince and defend christianity, if he doesnt understand the difference between idols and icons, all you need to do is to read the bible, to know the difference, you dont even have to know church history, its really basic stuff. It seems like he doesnt know what the bible AND church history says, wich is pretty weird

[@whomptalosis22]

Iconodules have to advance beyond the basic John of Damascus reasoning. Aniconists who have done any reading can combat those arguments effectively. When actually pressed the image venerator just falls back on assuming their traditions are apostolic and won’t convince someone outside their tradition

[@SIIIG1]

What is the reasoning against the respect given to icons of any sort? The term itself is a representation of its prototype or archetype.

[@whomptalosis22]

@@SIIIG1 is “respect” really the term or action in contention?

[@SIIIG1]

What is in contention is whether any commandments of God are intrinsically violated by Icon veneration or not.

[@Alana12]

Siig you are out of CPs league. Honestly. Stop it !!!!

[@ayo123]

😂😂😂😂😂😂

[@diego1590]

😂😂😂

[@SIIIG1]

Second comment is brazy

[@SonGoku-wd4mi]

😂😂😂

[@justmebroC134]

“Holy images of the saints” 😂😂how are images holy siig? 2 seconds in and you proved its idol worship 🤣🤣

[@officialkamzie]

Yeah images of saints or prophets is odd when I see church buildings with these I’m put off and walk away

[@JesusDiedForAll]

@@officialkamzie fax

[@camel1211]

mhm

[@apologeticslondon]

Iconoclasm evidently is the normative view of the scriptures given the fact that theirs no clear injunction or even nod to Iconodulism in The New Testamen. I have little respect for iconodules who beg words and attempt to twist the the meaning of scripture to their own destruction simply to perpetuate their repugnant idol worship God simply didn't view Israel worshipping the cow and think "well the word Icon isn't being used here it's latria no he was willing to destroy Israel because they had had considered this golden calf a vehicle to the divine rather than accepting the God of Israel. As for the Ark most Jewish historian will note it itself wasn't venerate but represented the throne of God the mercy seat upholding the glory of God hence it itself is not venerated but The Lord who sits enthroned upon it

[@zman42]

@@apologeticslondonare you f*this damn stupid? They bowed before the ark, they rent their clothes and poured ash and dust on their heads before it. Tell me you don’t read the Bible without telling me:

[@christophe2570]

The images of saint aren't holy either.

[@TroyEnglish.]

CP was correct. You do not know Gods words. Stop fooling yourselves. God bless you CP abundantly may god be with always.🙏

[@zman42]

You’re brainwashed. Iconoclasm is a heresy which came from Islam which persuaded the church to remove icons, but icons are allowed in the church. Read church fathers, heretic! Anathema!

[@felixmeier3298]

We know it better than christian prince XD

[@TroyEnglish.]

You think you do.​@@felixmeier3298

[@shanewilliams3912]

😅😅😅😅

[@GizmoMcs]

cp is right.

[@dolphinitely_bro3944]

Says the person who hasnt studied themselves

[@Gady______]

Cp is deff in the wrong here no diddy I would like to see a peaceful dialogue with him and lang Luigi since lang Luigi even shows that Paul had an icon

[@JesusisLord213-z6h]

no he is not.

[@micke6705]

tell cp to come debate and stop hiding

[@TryingToFollowChrist37]

Tell CP, that William and Sam are ready whenever he decides to stop hiding from the Muslims.

[@donnajess1918]

When born again the holy spirit will guide you away from this 🙏

[@HMFOG]

I could say the same for you

[@arisshako5080]

I've always admired your insights, SIIG, but I have to disagree on this point. CP's behavior is unacceptable. The veneration of Mary is simply not biblical. Paul's warning in Galatians is unequivocal: any doctrine not rooted in the gospel is to be rejected. Mary is honored as Jesus' mother, but that's where it ends. The practice of venerating her is a human invention, likely influenced by pagan idolatry and Roman syncretism with Greek goddess traditions. Theological gymnastics and the reasoning of sophisticated minds do not make this practice biblical; it reflects humanity’s innate desire for tangible objects of worship, akin to the golden calf.

[@Ex_Nihilo777]

absolutely spot on

[@z3rocodes]

@@arisshako5080 1 Timothy 3:15 isn't referencing your Protestant church, which has no roots to Pentecost. Which Church does it reference? If you say it's the invisible Church, I'd ask you where in the Bible does it say all Churches are the pillar of Truth? What is it about Protestantism that leads to rapid secularization and the flying of rainbow flags? Do you think your modernized churches are heirs to the promise of Christ where the gates of Hell will not prevail against it?

[@arisshako5080]

@@z3rocodes Isn't this pure fanaticism and emotionalism? I never claimed to be Protestant, but you jumped to that conclusion because I pointed out a clear biblical fact: the veneration of Mary is unbiblical. You haven’t even addressed that simple argument. If standing solely on the Bible makes me Protestant in your eyes, then I’m fine with that. I mean no offense, but you’re arguing like a Muslim following a Dawah script. Meanwhile, your own pope, supposedly the leader of the "pillar of truth," has approved blessings for same-sex couples and stated that "all religions are paths to God," which directly contradicts John 14:6. Pillar of truth, huh? The true Church is not exclusive to Catholicism. It is the body of Christ-all who accept His gift of salvation and follow His teachings. The gates of Hell will not prevail against that Church, but it's certainly not defined by modern compromises or the approval of unbiblical practices.

[@HMFOG]

​@@arisshako5080You dont have to state that youre protestant, its just logically deducable. The Orthodox, Oriental, and Roman Catholic church all venerate Mary and you are arguing against the veneration of Mary. Therefore, you are a protestant. Therefore, the other commenters attacks on Protestantism and Iconoclastic heretics are valid

[@arisshako5080]

@@HMFOG Ok

[@dollahmusa6705]

All of Jesus disciples knew hw Jesus and Mary look like...so it goes on....particular time ,no camera ....so pple can draw hw a person look like..

[@Yeoman530]

Not everyone can discern the difference between these nuanced topics. We dont want people stumble in their faith in Christ.

[@zman42]

Go read proverbs 13-15. Simple is for the folly.

[@felixmeier3298]

Its really easy. Idol = Image of a false God Are Icons false Gods? NO

[@Yeoman530]

Y'all watch these interfaith debates I am going to assume. You ever think, "why can't they see this for what it is?" It's because their spirit is not ready or cannot allow it. It's not just an intellectual path, it's a path of the heart too.

[@dollahmusa6705]

Cp u need to admit u are Wrong.

[@khantshu4463]

I stopped watching CP channel a long time ago because he was arrogant.

[@itshismercy6783]

So you’re justifying idolizing the saints? Because Christians are idolizing them.

[@JesusisLord213-z6h]

nobody is idolizing the saints maybe that's just in your imagination..

[@tymon1928]

You didn't even watch the video, did you?

[@itshismercy6783]

Give me one bible verse that suggests or says we can pray to saints. Not tradition.

[@ElDogeRenacido]

​@@itshismercy6783 Revelation 5-8. I'm not giving you a verse: read the chapters.

[@JORA52]

​@@itshismercy6783 2 Maccabees 15:11-16

[@aSkS33KKn0C]

May your channel grow by putting his name in the title, inshallah lol

[@SIIIG1]

Inshaallah habibi

[@wakingupat2pm349]

CP is wrong. He still does great work.

[@lawrencecastle2777]

I'm with cp sorry

[@jm_4148]

ur a idiot

[@TryingToFollowChrist37]

I with Jesus Christ and his Church on this, not sorry one bit. It's true what Sam said about you CP fangirls. You guys are CP idolaters disguised as Christians

[@z3rocodes]

It's okay to have a poor understanding of Christian theology and to follow the traditions of Protestant Reformers, it's not okay to attack the Apostolic Churches who have the promise of Christ where the gates of Hell will not prevail against it. There is a reason why your churches fly rainbow flags, host rock concerts, and do TED talks. They follow the pattern of the world and do not have the promise of Christs protection.

[@Alana12]

Me too. SIIG thinks he can talk to CP with disrespect because of Sam. Smh. SIIG OUT OF ORDER

[@TryingToFollowChrist37]

@@z3rocodes Wow bro, Amen

[@wmarkfish]

What do you say to your weaker brother who is offended by your drinking alcohol in his presence? Do you go to such hair splitting semantics to rationalize your drinking or do you put it away for the time in deference to his convictions? I think your churches are beautiful and are very conducive to having emotional/spiritual experience in but I am happy to worship in a plain unadorned building with a cappella worship. It is good to worship without all that “stuff” to encumber and such plain worship offends no one. Catholic, Protestants, Anabaptist and Orthodox alike can worship together in such a way. Stop bickering and let us meet together for worship in the church of Christ.

[@zman42]

No that’s ecumenism which is heretical. Anathema! Submit to orthodoxy!

[@boxingmachamp3178]

CP is cringe. Stubborn ol man😂

[@NEWOAH_ML]

CP cooked unfortunately

[@diego1590]

Cooked himself a bowl of dogshit.

[@jaygo586]

CP is cooked unfortunately

[@tengkhengkhoo7106]

Idol is an idol, especially Mary statue alway in front of Jesus statue. Idols worshiper.

[@felixmeier3298]

so Mary is a God for you? Thats YOUR problem XD

[@jaygo586]

Heretic

[@JohnB_OnYouTube]

ONLY God is Holy, No other human being is HOLY because, we are all sinners!!!! That's why God is Only HOLY. you people who dont understand this, need to Repent from this Idea.

[@zman42]

Eikon, icon, image. The image of the father is Christ, and the image of Christ should be us as we live eat and bleed in God founded church. You clearly didn’t listen to the video. Go pray.

[@felixmeier3298]

Repent from what? Does Jesus need to repent, for being the image of the father, is he now a sinner? XD

[@SIIIG1]

Are people holy in heaven? Are angels holy?

[@JohnB_OnYouTube]

@@SIIIG1 ONLY God is holy. angels are not saints and not even human beings.

[@JohnB_OnYouTube]

@@zman42 you clearly didnt listen to him say saints are holy in the beginning of the video lol what are you smoking on ?

[@Huntingdonn]

SIIIG! Have you ever read the second commandment? It says: “You shall not make for yourself a carved image, or any likeness of anything that is in heaven above, or that is in the earth beneath, or that is in the water under the earth.... Seriously, what's not to understand here? What's the obsession about?

[@sdf32asd]

have you watched the video? I doubt it

[@felixmeier3298]

they are not idols, because the saints arent other Gods

[@Huntingdonn]

@@felixmeier3298 you guys a babies in faith. According to scripture you can idolize a job, any object, a wife, a child, a job, even yourself. Anything or anybody that makes you go against God's will for you can be a god. Ever heard of mamon? How that's a god too being idolized? Put before God? Grow up!

[@not_milk]

Bro have me on, I'll talk on icons with you. I'll keep it fresh, maybe even bring some new arguments to the table that aren't being made by most.

[@zman42]

Iconoclasm is a heresy that is anathematized. It’s not up for debate pal 🤣

[@SIIIG1]

I might stream tonight

[@not_milk]

@@SIIIG1 Thanks bro! I'll try and keep my eyes open for if you hop on at a time I can pull up. Otherwise I'll try and catch another one of your streams here and hopefully we can have some fun breaking things down.

[@godfreym3550]

I totally agree with you and CP is a complete fool but the Luke iconography story is a pious myth and shouldn't be used as an argument.

[@Alana12]

Honestly you are being so rude Siig Antagonising the LEGEND CP.

[@ayo123]

😂😂😂😂😂😂😂😂😂

[@SIIIG1]

This is cope.

[@JORA52]

Womp womp

[@edward1412]

Yes. They are IDOLS! The “saints” and Mary are not even gods so why waste your money, buy them and put them in Churches? And why on earth do you even BOW to them? Even an intelligent guy like you is obsessed with this stuff. How can you criticise Muslims for bowing to the kabah and back stone when you also create statues and bow to them?

[@zman42]

Col 1:15 the image of God is Christ. And Paul emphasizes how we are to emanate Christ in us, basically for us to bare the image of Christ. So therefore through theosis and deification, saints basically point to Christ who IS GOD. How hard is this to understand? Did you not listen to SIIIG’s argument? Open your ears to hear, and let him hear!

[@felixmeier3298]

If they are Idols to you, you should repent and stop looking at them like Gods. You are the problem.

[@TryingToFollowChrist37]

Siiig you said no more CP on another vid. Stop messing with this idiot CP, and get into the deep philosophy and theology content unless that fool calls you out. And if he does call you out don't let him off the hook like you did here, after your very first question "Do you think Idols and icons are the same?" You let him go off question to easy which made him take control of the dialogue, which in turn he tried to make you look silly in front of his audience because he's got you trying to prove your claims about Luke. You're smart and respectful that's great never change, but CP never deserved your respect in the first place in this conversation. He disrespected the Blessed Mother the Saints and your faith and Christian history in general. He compared people that follow our faith to Muslims, many of whom were kill and hamulated at the hands of those Muslims he compered them to. They cry in heaven for justice as is read in Revelations. Bear that in mind next time, not to be horrible but to be firm. Thank you for all your hard work that you put in to the contact. May God bless this channel and those that learn from it, and importantly to bless you and your loved ones. I ask this in NAME of the Father, Son, and Holy Spirit. Amen

[@SIIIG1]

Amen. Btw this was a previous recording lol but I appreciate it nonetheless. I feel as though as soon as I presented the evidence he started to run away which was insane. I wanted people to see my POV so everyone can see the blatant dishonesty. I would love to discuss with him again sometime.

[@Revelacao22-13]

CP is totally heretic, and Sam is also an heretic modernist Catholic. I don’t know which one is worst.

[@bruce6545]

Idol is an idol no matter what. Otherwise Hindus can say the same to us.

[@PHILISOPHICALYCORRECT]

I think he would agree with you on that, what he made the distinction on was that icons and idols are 2 separate things

[@bruce6545]

@@PHILISOPHICALYCORRECT only difference is you called your idol an icon but actions are same

[@BR-to2nk]

​@@bruce6545you need 101 on terminology

[@BR-to2nk]

​@@bruce6545 You need 101 on terminology

[@JORA52]

​@@bruce6545truly u r dumb