Snowpiercer: Back From The Dead

A broad discussion of the latest episode, relating to various subjects.
Really enjoyed this one.
"Tonight, I witnessed a Snowpiercer unlike any I'd seen before. United, borderless, free of class and greed. The dream of New Eden made that possible. But a dream left unchecked can be a dangerous thing."

[@Paulo-dc6fk]

"Let's not forget she's the one that tortured Josie and almost got her killed" Even though Melanie is a likeable character, and the show is clearly not as good without her, she's really cruel, some people seem to ignore and treat her like she's the Messiah. It's nice to see that some people still remember the numerous horrible things she have done. In a way, the time she spent outside was a consequence for what she did for 7 years.

[@nextanvil3346]

Unlikable*

[@leDespicable]

Still, I wouldn't say she's just cruel. They showed her throwing up after she broke Josie's fingers, so she clearly was struggling treating people that way.

[@samkennedy7081]

@@leDespicableyou can be cruel and disgusted by your own cruelty and the impact of it. Melanie’s character is deeply traumatised and desensitised. Her callousness however is not bullet proof. That’s what makes her such an interesting and layered character. Unlike Layton.

[@eddiethalen4979]

I gently bow to Melanie. Thank you for being able to using logic and not leaving the fate of humanity to people who trust a fantasy (!). The scene where Javi and Mel closes the door to the Engine in Layton and Bens face is my favorite scene from this season. It was more than satisfying. Season 1-Melanie has return and I'm here for it. Jennifer Connellys presence really lifted this. Easy the best episode yet of this disappointing season. The finale will probably be the train spitting in two: One for continuing live abroad Snowpiercer, the other half goes to chase New Eden. Because plot, they will probably find a New Eden, but it won't be how Layton imagned it. Maybe there are already people there, which doesn't want anything to do with the "train people". And if Snowpiercer is a democracy: No. Layton "took" the train. And then he held an election about New Eden, which was held with a premise of a lie. In the real world, that's called an unfree election.. I totally agree with your statement regarding Layton. He's no better than Melanie and Wilford, despite claiming so. To me he has become the annoying anti-hero of the story.

[@lourencoxbfragoso]

Layton is probably one of the worst designed characters on TV shows and the worst part is that the showrunners portrait him as if we were supposed to be sympathetic towards him. He is a revolutionary man, undemocratic and a terrible leader. He reminds me of Russian history in witch a Tsarist autocracy was replaced by a communist dictatorship....both of them suck and none is morally right. Also never forget that he wanted to name its kid Trotsky ffs

[@ProudCommie]

@@lourencoxbfragoso Layton is based like lennin completely based. Melanie enables Wilford much like neoliberals enable fascism always. Communism is the answer and communism has won…on snowpiercer 1,029 cars long

[@lalakuma9]

I think Layton is a reflection of what a many progressive idealists are like today. Their intentions are good, but they lack experience and are sometimes too blinded by their own ideas to listen to other perspectives. In a mission to make things more democratic, ironically they end up shutting down other people and force their ideals onto others at a great cost. That doesn't meant that the opposite is better. People like Layton just needs to learn to work and get along with people like Melanie, and vice versa.

[@ProudCommie]

@@lalakuma9 nah Layton is a based communist not a weak neoliberal “progressive” who would never have the strength for blood

[@RK-zh1ib]

What I believe is that Wilford has finally matured enough that he will only seek power not for himself but for the survival of humanity in Snowpiercer. He is developing a similar personality to Wilford in the movies. It is likely Wilford will seek Melanie and rule Snowpiercer together with her. Layton is a poor ruler not just because he does not know how Snowpiercer works, but because he basically influences his friends and allies into what he believes his right. Layton is now a shell of his former self. Leaders are not supposed to be perfect. They are people who are willing to sacrifice their own morals and humanity to become "monsters" who seek the well being of their people. From the episode 10 promo, it is likely Layton will rally Big Alice's crew to join his faction in order to stop Melanie and Wilford's factions from taking over Snowpiercer. What is unique is that both Wilford and Melanie changed after taking lethal amounts of suspension drugs. I think episode 10 will cover Layton's faction entering New Eden by separating Big Alice before Snowpiercer switches to different tracks to prevent the train from heading into New Eden. It will be interesting if Layton was proven right and that science is not always accurate when you calculate humanity's chances of survival. You just need a little faith to move forward. In fact, it was science that led to the CW7 incident which caused the whole world to freeze. In other words, the Original Sinners (depending or relying on science and accurate calculations too much to save humanity from a disaster). Big Alice will later contact Snowpiercer that New Eden is actually the paradise that they can inhabit. Season 4 of Snowpiercer might have similar to the story of Exodus and Joshua from the Bible in which the Israelites go through a gruesome journey to reach the promised land. Humanity in Snowpiercer will reach the promised land but the cycle of humanity's self-destruction will continue.

[@lalakuma9]

I like how Melanie coming back reveals that Layton was too self-righteous to realize his own flaws and hypocrisy, even though he has good intentions. In that way, Melanie is exactly the same as Layton, although she's more cruel and iron-fisted. But it shows that if two opposing sides both have good intentions and are willing to listen to each other, they can work together to create better decisions. Also Wilford being exiled kinda leaves a possibility that he'll move on to rule Chris Evans's Snowpiercer 😂

[@derickyyy]

I forgot about the electromagnetic weapon! I bet it comes back in the finale.

[@wayneswackgameing9775]

It did not

[@gorillasoup553]

They literally threw it off the train

[@triciaelder0517]

This show just was not hitting without Melanie.. thank God she's back

[@sydneylawson484]

By the time they build the emp, they had Alice, which had enough supplies to rebuild all of the major systems on snowpiercer, including agriculture. They probably sourced materials from there.

[@kirayoshikage2075]

Nice video, thx for your opinion

[@pierce873]

Team wilford all the way, I mean it’s only logical why would you gamble with what’s left of humanity when you can keep them safe on a train

[@jochannon]

Agreed

[@ProudCommie]

Nope communism will win

[@samkennedy7081]

He killed children on Big Alice and used Miss Audrey as an escort at the age of 17, to name a few of his atrocities but okay …😂. I get that tactically he makes some agreeable decisions tho.

[@sydneylawson484]

@@samkennedy7081 He sucks, but she was an escort at 18. He met Melanie at 17.

[@samkennedy7081]

@@sydneylawson484Miss Audrey says that at the age of “17 I was already a high end escort. Private parties for some of the most powerful men and women in Chicago. You have to understand I was his (Wilfords) exclusively for years.” Seeing as she was an escort at 17 it is very likely that is when he met her. It is never stated that she meets him a specific age i.e. 18z

[@patrickarseneault7407]

i wonder if in the end it will lead to the movie or be a reboot. from what i saw first 3 seasons and from what we know from the movie things gont add up if it follow and suppose to lead to the movie

[@samkennedy7081]

Yea the Series and the movie are set in different universes. We know this because the Freeze in the movie happens in 2014 and the Freeze in the Series happens in 2019-2020. Also in the series it’s colder outside than the film. In the film universe arctic animals can survive outside but in the series universe everything outside the train dies.

[@tyronejohnson409]

king

[@goanna83]

Adding to the comment regarding the 'questionable' resources or stock they have on board was the use of music everytime it's played on stereo or in a night club. They sounded so current with today's music in comparison to anything earlier than 2013 which is around the time Snowpiercer took off. I know it had more than 1000 cars but there was no indication as to how they were producing new and innovative sound, or that one of those cars was at least a recording studio with musical equipment and such. Yes there is the nightcart which showed live entertainment and Audrey seems to be the only entertainer/singer in Snowpiercer and is able to cover songs we already know. But take that scene where John was dancing in the bar to a song being played until he got interrupted by his wife lol. To me it sounded like something fresh off the charts, instead of hits from David Guetta, Gaga, Bruno Mars or Foo Fighters. Despite that however I appreciated that 80s classic being played from a tape cassette showing Roche bonding with his daughter. On another note, I totally agree about the characters undergoing redemption arcs that don't feel earned, in particular, John. I know he's not a main character but I hated how the show veered to him being pitied and then made him into a romantic. Even so, I never felt sorry for him and still hated him throughout the show and never found him redeemable in my opinion. Has anyone forgotten about what an asshole he was in Season 1? And the shit he did to benefit himself? Pretty disturbing if you can quite recall and it shouldn't be taken lightly either. I agree about the whole Josie saving Melanie thing. I wondered about that the whole time, and was waiting for at least a confrontation or reconciliation between the two at least while Mel was still in bed recovering moments after waking up 3 days after being rescued. Nonetheless I liked how it rounded off despite, if I'm being honest, the writing to be quite off (yet not as bad as S8 of GOT). I also felt like the producers initially intended to finish off the show altogether with an actual finale, just from the way the pace and change was going at the very end like it was trying to quickly rush things (the peaceful divide, saying goodbyes, the exodus, etc). But what I also liked was the scene showing the train splitting in opposite directions which obviously was meant to be symbolic. For me, this is where I honestly thought it was gonna end, because if you think about it, yes it would keep us as the audience reeling for the outcome but this would have formed a perfect ambiguous kind of ending. I bet producers would have thought this was how it was gonna go if that were the case, especially if the show wasn't getting enough ratings for another season. The only giveaway that it's not a complete finale was the showing of "Pro-New Edeners" finally landing (of course its gonna keep going if they show this: its like what about Melanie and the rest?). And then of course, the cliffhanger of Wilford's vehicle exploding in mid-air. Also and lastly, I am curious to find out the beautiful location of where New Eden was filmed. My guess is that it's somewhere in between the Swiss Alps and Italian border as it looked like secluded area from when I boarded the Bernina Express (definitely a recommended train ride 👌). I've been digging around for this and looks like they haven't revealed it yet so maybe there's going to be a go-behind-the-scenes sometime soon to show it. But if anyone knows, please kindly tell.

[@samkennedy7081]

The Train in the Snowpiercer Series took off in 2019-2020. In the film it took off around 2013. They are set in different universes.

[@samkennedy7081]

I agree John’s redemption arc was totally not urned. He sang a song big deal 😂

[@anoniemw.222]

To be very honest. I would have preferred a bad ending for big Alice. Would really set up an interesting character development for the people on Snowpiercer when they found out and show that big risks do not always work out (like in the rest of the seasons)

[@gusramos3620]

Yeah. Imagine Big Alice derailed before the warm spot and only Boki would have survived. Then in season 4 Snowpiercer would find him. I still liked the original ending though.

[@anoniemw.222]

@@gusramos3620 He would probably not survive the fall of the train from the bridge. Would if done right, be a surprising, shocking and emotional scene

[@techniqueswithtodd]

Layton went back for her and saved her life. Then she betrayed him on day one? Crap. She lied to the train for years for the same reason he lied. To give them hope. Also Bess is now shacking up with a girl she hated last season? Wilford is now a weakling? Lame writing. The writers have flipped the poles on every major character just to have a civil war in the season finale for a cliff hanger.

[@lalakuma9]

I don't see what Melanie did as a betrayal. (In fact, you can also say that what Layton did was a betrayal to Snowpiercer citizens). She's a scientist, and she told everyone about the truth because she believes that it's more important than lying to keep people hopeful. It shows that she has integrity, although her methods are hurtful and inconsiderate of others, even her friends. That is her flaw.

[@beatricelim7969]

Melanie's return saved the whole season. I wished they'd done it in an earier episode. We wasted so much time with Layton and his ridiculous visions 🙄 only thing that kept we watching was Wilford, Ben, Alex, Javi and Ruth. I was honestly gonna quit after the bound by one track episode if they didn't bring Melanie back for real. Episodes 5-8 were all fillers. what a waste the 7th episode was. I was rooting for Layton to pass.

[@samkennedy7081]

That dream episode was a total and utter waste of time. So much more could have happened instead.

[@justrandom90]

4:48 is that malaysia petronas twin tower

[@mickcv4554]

How about that the train has all these unique cars like a car and a crane purely for picking up a little side rocket car? Like 1. Why would this exist. 2. Tellin me theres a whole empty car on the train for 8 years?

[@thetwotrainstheory8895]

It's like Batman's belt, only giant.

[@samkennedy7081]

The Crain was installed before the freeze for lifting the cargo containers into the train. It’s multi-purpose but not designed to lift the track scalers into the train.

[@mickcv4554]

@@samkennedy7081 I like where your head is at but still makes a lot more sense to have crane off train to load, plus it had another car to hold the rocket car seems like a bug waste for what this train is made for. It’s whatever though there’s a million plotholes in this show and this one is minor compared to them all. I mean the passengers just falling in line to whomever happens to be in the engine is dumb enough.

[@samkennedy7081]

@@mickcv4554 very good points. However I think the reason the train has its own cranes may be because Snowpiercer prepared for the freeze subtly and in secret. This is so the government and/ or military wouldn’t try and take the ark as the world crumbled. Having big industrial cranes around for days on end lifting giant cargo containers would be pretty obvious seeing as all construction had almost definitely stopped because the world was ending and fast. Using massive cranes would have put the entire project at risk. Melanie was as prepared and as careful as she could be when preparing the train. Just a guess tho :)

[@YouTubeCensors]

Lol, as if I would feel bad for privileged rich girl real or fictional

[@MissCharly1992]

Team melany here, strongly dislike layton. He had nothing to lose and everything to win. Melany had a lot to lose and a lot to preserve..