SO, WHAT WILL END MY 52+ YEARS OF FLYING? THE COST OF INSURANCE! UP 40%! SINCE LAST YEAR!

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@blancolirio 9 ай бұрын

Insurance! Note that Trade A Plane has an unprecedented 29 Cessna 185's For Sale! Primarily due to rising insurance costs on these expensive taildraggers! Our only choice is to own a cheap taildragger and forgo the hull insurance. (Nice Great Lakes- keep that one) Thanks for Posting Ron!

@pittss2c601 9 ай бұрын

Keep the Great Lakes w/liability only. Sell the twin. Avoid flying into high risk areas like airshows & fly-in's. Just too much risk. Liability only pushes the pilot to become the insurance through skill and judgement. The pilot is the insurance.

@markg4459 8 ай бұрын

Really disappointed to hear about the insurance hurdles. I have no where near your experience, still in my 60s but sure not looking fwd to the price hikes coming.

@HeimirTomm 8 ай бұрын

Don't ever worry about repeating yourself. We absolutely love your stories, personally I think you are one of the best storytellers out there. Having been a VERY frequent traveller the last 30 years, it is quite likely that I have flown with you at some point (based on your explanations of your routes). I would have loved to met you and shaken your hand.

@ronrogers 8 ай бұрын

Thank you so much!

@wdcjunk 9 ай бұрын

Forget pharmaceutical companies or big oil... insurance companies run the country.

@joeg5414 8 ай бұрын

they're all in cahoots

@bentonbee1 8 ай бұрын

Really neat you checked your son out in an airliner!! You are a very experienced pilot!

@pdquestions7673 9 ай бұрын

My first CFI was in his 70s... an ex Navy pilot who flew un WWII. To this day ive never seen anyone who flew as smooth... very little control movements / oscillations, and yet he flew very accurately. It felt like an unnatural stillness, and i never found another instructor or met anyone else who could fly like that. He influenced my flying more than anyone else, and im glad he loved flying enough to do it well into his 80s. I was amazed when he told me he'd also been a Greyhound Bus driver. 😂😂

@bobcfi1306 9 ай бұрын

Insurance companies run the world After 50 years of GA flying I enjoy being a part time CFI, sharing my knowledge and it keeps me in aviation.❤

@warped-sliderule 9 ай бұрын

Insurance is one of the points of "DTSB" and Dan's AQP scenarios. The main point is general aviation people dying... Regarding the cost: Flying may be expensive, but it's cheaper than a psychiatrist!!! My favorite quote of all time...

@TheJustinJ 9 ай бұрын

There is a solution: Drop full coverage and just keep liability. If you total an airplane, You have nothing to worry about. Either because you wont make it, or because that will signal the end of your flying days. Cover loved ones with life insurance and enough liability (~$1M) that they wont have anything to worry about. Maybe downsize to one airplane that does both. An RV-8, Rocket, or Glassair III. Ditching the retracts will substantially reduce insurance. You could also maintain basic $50k coverage on the hull, to cover prop strikes, off airport landings or ramp related accidents.

@ronrogers 9 ай бұрын

Trouble is that I have loans on both aircraft so can't drop hull.

@pittss2c601 9 ай бұрын

@@ronrogers Sell the twin. Just too much cost to own & operate.

@synupps877 7 ай бұрын

@@ronrogersYou have loans on two airplanes and supposedly insurance is what's going to keep you from flying?

@JoeKyser 8 ай бұрын

I feel for you Ron. Its a sad story. I want to see you fly as long as you want to fly. It is okay down here though. We have fun on the ground still

@ThinBlueWarrior 6 ай бұрын

What an impressive career in aviation you've had. I would give my right arm to fly the kind of equipment you've had time on. unfortunately I was born a little to late to escape the era of flying computers with an airplane attached to them. I will say however, that guys like you are the ones i keep my eyes out for at the airport in the slight chance I'm able to strike up a conversation with them and learn something unique from their years of flying in a bygone era. I'm 24, and just starting my aviation career in the northern IL suburbs with 0 time after recently getting out of the coast guard, so I can only hope the insurance rates are more favorable to me! I really enjoy the wealth of videos you've been putting out and the secrets and stories of a life spent in the air. thank you for all the great content!

@davidgubert1883 9 ай бұрын

I'm in the same boat. My Great Lakes is at Waco finishing up the paint and annual. When it gets close I'll be checking on insurance. I'm 75 now so I do not hold out much hope. If I can't afford, or am not willing to pay for, insurance anymore I'll have to modify my flying going forward. For instance I do not think I'd be willing to fly into Oshkosh without insurance. However my main interest in flying is aerobatics. I have my own airstrip here on the farm and it's all agricultural around here so I'll just go up and play. Maybe even try strait and level some day, probably not though. It's our own fault for not dying young.

@TheJustinJ 9 ай бұрын

Keep liability insurance, for the sake of everyone else please. At least enough to cover our deductibles. 😂

@sc1784 9 ай бұрын

Great video. Thanks for sharing with us some of the details about your long career in aviation. Don't stop flying because of the insurance. Find a way to make it happen. Too many people stop doing what they love and retirement becomes a death sentence.

@Pan1man4 8 ай бұрын

Giving up something that you really enjoy and can afford is hard, I sold my two motor bikes Honda Pan European 1100cc and Honda CBF600cc when I was 63 as I thought I was getting too old even though my wife and family told me to keep one. Fast approaching 71 and miss it so much.Keep going Ron.

@cornbread83 9 ай бұрын

Same thing happened with auto insurance if you have a Kia Soul like me. I went from 124.50 per month full coverage to $410 per month for the same coverage in 1 year. No accidents, tickets, nothing. Hope you're able to keep flying forever!

@TheJustinJ 9 ай бұрын

This is almost certainly due to a change in credit score. No vehicle insurance should be anywhere near that amount unless You started driving for ride share companies. Change insurance.

@cornbread83 9 ай бұрын

Kia Soul with key. Most stolen car in America.

@DrDirigible 9 ай бұрын

The sky rocketing cost of flying is why the only flying I do anymore is with Xplane. Love your airplanes and your car. I hope you can continue flying.

@jdshemp 8 ай бұрын

MSFS 2020 for me, waiting on PMDG 777.

@petegoldmanmd5758 9 ай бұрын

Ron, I'm 80, fly the Mooney I bought new in '74 (C model + Rajay). I am switching to Avemco starting Apr 1, liability only, $578. If they had turned me down, would have moved from KABE to 69N. NO insurance needed at 69N. The FAA doesn't require insurance. Pete, Lt Col ret USAFR former FS, 113 TAC Ftr Wing, DCANG, former FAA AME (22 yrs). PS, I never purchased hull insurance 😊

@synupps877 7 ай бұрын

$578 per month, six months, or year?

@garyplewa9277 9 ай бұрын

Insurance companies stick it everyone when they have losses in high risk areas. A tornado wipes out several hangars full of corporate jets in hurricane alley and they raise the rates on GA pilots in areas free from extreme conditions. Rates should be commensurate with risk - but insurance companies will never lose when they have a bad year.

@JimyoVibration 9 ай бұрын

I used to wash and wax airplanes while Louis Zamperini came and talked to me. Hershey bars were $50 an hour. A 182 was probably $100 an hour. I’m 45 and I’m already some old ghost.

@mrkc10 9 ай бұрын

Wow insurance up 40% that’s ugly to say the least. I agree with you Ron your -310 is probably one of the nicest still actively flying. As always another great video.

@bigdaddie40 9 ай бұрын

I too wished I could fly with my kid at my airline. I am an A350 CA at Delta, but to my dismay, he decided to go with that second-class airline UNITED! Love your videos, brother. I hope they figure out this insurance thing. I am 57 and fly a bunch of GA. Have you thought about just liability only insurance? That’s a sure way to minimize the inheritance to your kids. I may do this as I get older, or just drop insurance all together. If I create that much damage, what do I have to worry about?

@joescalet6130 9 ай бұрын

I just sold my last airplane (1946 Aeronca Chief). Last 40 years the insurance has gone up every year. Ten tears ago I dropped the hull insurance. I just turned 80 so it went up again. I have had the same hangar for 30 years. The City now requires at a minimum $1,000,000 with the City assigned as the insured. Never have had a claim. Same issue, if I fly 60 to 100 hours a year ( typical) it adds $10 to $15 per hour to the cost of flying. I could afford it but economically just doesn't make sense.

@raulcoronado6024 9 ай бұрын

Keep on Keeping on Ron🛩️✊🏻

@rogerrees9845 9 ай бұрын

Very interesting documentary.... Thank you... Roger.... Pembrokeshire UK

@locustvalleystring 9 ай бұрын

Lots to think about. Thanks. I will be 70 in April. I flew IFR to from Philly to KOSH last year with my wife and will again with my son this year. We camp in the North 40. Been doing that since 1979 all on the steam gauges. That Garmin stuff is something! Scheduled for an IPC this coming Saturday if the weather isn't too bad. The forecast doesn't look so good at this point though.

@markjohnson5619 9 ай бұрын

Ron, enjoy your vids, went to Vance 84-06. Lots of similar memories. Flew A7D and all models of Viper. Now have my 2nd Maule drop in next summer, call first. 79 ws Moosejaw

@warped-sliderule 9 ай бұрын

Of coarse there's always the cost/2 option. That requires its own mental anguish, but keeps you flying. All depends on what your definition of "flying" is...

@aviatortrucker6285 9 ай бұрын

I haven’t flown a multi since I got the rating because it is just so doggone expensive. Today, FBO won’t even rent without 1000 hours total time.

@aviatortrucker6285 9 ай бұрын

I started back in 1983 in the Air Force aero club. Cessna 152 with instructor was $47 an hour dual.

@OlesonMD 9 ай бұрын

The cost of my insurance went up 400%. $20,000 / year for hull and liability. And I'm under 70, never been involved in an accident.

@musiqtee 8 ай бұрын

Well, capitalism has changed. It’s not “stuff” or “profit” now, it’s nominal growth of ownership value. No capital asset income equals decreasing economic agency after 2009 - across the OECD… Best of luck, so great to listen to you sharing your profound knowledge…! 👍

@aviatortrucker6285 9 ай бұрын

I worked part time and ice cream stand when I was in the Air Force to save money for my multi ratings. In 95.

@donaldolin7219 9 ай бұрын

Time to get a dirt bike!

@firstielasty1162 6 ай бұрын

I did charter in light jets, and the usual BS that leads to that job. Some aerobatic fun, not a lot.. None of it equals dirt riding for fun. And fitness. I'm an Eastern woods rider, for a long time. Love it. It was sort of a disappointment that flying didn't really come close.

@rlsmith6904 9 ай бұрын

Thanks for sharing this. I didn’t know about it.

@yuglesstube 9 ай бұрын

Im looking forrward to this. I would observe that given the fleet size and flight frequency and duration, the number of hull loss and fatal accidents in GA seems quite high in the US. Many of these crashes are preventable. Is that the main driver of insurance costs in your opinion, or are there other major factors? Regards Guy

@peterschnaubelt1903 9 ай бұрын

Thankfully insurance is NOT required for operation of general aviation aircraft. Operate safely and responsibly, keep the shiny side up.

@TheJustinJ 9 ай бұрын

Maintain enough liability to cover a guys Cirrus if you taxi into it. Else you will be sued, and potentially lose your house.

@pittss2c601 9 ай бұрын

@@TheJustinJ Stay away from those Cirrus guys.

@markg4459 8 ай бұрын

Well, if you've had to finance the plane the bank will require hull coverage to protect their investment.

@alikartal8426 9 ай бұрын

Is there any real statistical data which shows that old pilots are more accident prone, or does the insurer just feel like it? Why cant they drive up premiums for bold pilots instead?

@jimcear1766 9 ай бұрын

It’s simply the actuarial risk factors of age coupled with the overall loss rate of the insurance industry in last several years . We CAN blame them for assuming too much risk, in all facets of their industry , etc., etc. ( they’re done this many times over the years) Couple that with increase in inflation of 23+%between 2020 and Nov. 2023. Thank congress for “ printing” enormous of money , historical deficit spending despite any economist telling them this would be the result. This not a political commentary simply the laws of economics , much akin to the physics of gravity . You and I are simply the bystanders of poor leadership both corporate and political.

@TheCousinEddie 9 ай бұрын

Was that David Hartman in the photo of you receiving an award?

@ronrogers 9 ай бұрын

Yes

@Okie-00-Spool 9 ай бұрын

David Hartman, an accomplished pilot as well. He even played one on TV! See "San Francisco International".

@michaelgill7248 9 ай бұрын

Ron I'm surprised you were never a NASA astronaut with your background?

@dillonhopson4367 8 ай бұрын

I'm thankful to have a nice homebuilt that we can do most maintenance and repairs on our own with A&P supervision so I only have liability insurance I don't need hull but the insurance is so ridiculous you almost have to have low hull coverage to afford it then is something happens they'd write it off anyways so you pay for repairs out of pocket if you wanna keep the plane.

@oleran4569 9 ай бұрын

Sounds like the insurance company is just trying to be helpful. Their current mission is to assist you in your goal to spend your children's inheritance.

@thatairplaneguy 9 ай бұрын

There have been less accidents in 2023 than at any time in history. There’s nothing to excuse the 15% increase

@ronrogers 9 ай бұрын

Greed!

@michaelnapier3221 9 ай бұрын

Same here….. Flying 43 yrs., Flight Instructor 34 yrs to present CFI, CFII and at 70 what’s that get you👎👎👎get out of here😭……

@bdcochran01 8 ай бұрын

Babbling? Just wait until you get older! Cokes for 2 cents and 1 one cent deposit at the PX in the late 1940s. Movies were 15 cents in the 1950s unless it was an Elvis Presley film and then it was 25 cents. I used to charge 10 cents an hour for baby sitting. More than 60 years of driving without a chargeable accident . . . can I have my premiums back. A girlfriend was an avid skier and owned a place in Vail. One day she stopped skiing. She said it was time. A couple years later she sold her place. Another friend was an avid horseback rider. She didn't stop after retiring. Broke both wrists when thrown with multiple surgeries . . . and continuing. What you do is find another portion of aviation to experience. I live walking distance from Santa Monica Airport. If I had your experience and know how, I would find a way to mentor some of the people there.

@9HighFlyer9 9 ай бұрын

The advice I was given is to either make them tell you "no," either medically or a blown biennial. If you can afford it, keep paying it. How many people ever say "I wish I quit earlier". I'm going to assume you are pretty risk averse so I think you'll know when to hang it up. Be sure to thank Avemco and make it easier for us younger guys by not denting your planes.

@ronrogers 9 ай бұрын

52+ years of flying, 200+ different aircraft, 23,000 hours, no dents (other than flight test).

@9HighFlyer9 9 ай бұрын

@@ronrogers Like I said, risk-averse or you'd never get to those stats. "Something, something, no old and bold pilots." You mentioned the 727. Was it as unforgiving in the flare as I've been told? Only rode in the way back as a kid, I loved watching all that aero-mechanical wizardry as the wing dissassembled itself on approach.

@BoomVang 2 ай бұрын

Insurance companies may notice list of recent GA fatalities that seem to comprise of about half elderly pilots. There is always the freedom of ultralight flying with rocket parachutes.

@parkburrets4054 9 ай бұрын

Dan Grider had an interesting statistic. We don’t know how many hours are flown in general aviation every year. But we do know how many fatal relaxants are every year. So you could look at whole loss per registered airplanes every year

@joefin5900 9 ай бұрын

Old age will end your flying. Take it from one who had to give up motocross racing and surfing. Nothing to do with money.

@AugustusTitus 9 ай бұрын

You'll need to object to the raise in insurance cost and provide documentation that 1) you actively maintain currency, 2) you have an instrument rating and are proficient at instrument flight, 3) retired ATP who has a 777 type rating, 4) the extensive glass cockpit of your Turbo 310, and 5) your extensive history in military and non-military flight test and flight safety programs.

@ronrogers 9 ай бұрын

I did that and that I'm a CFI CFII MEI GI (have been for 45+ years), member of many aviation societies and organizations, take a flight review and ICC every year. Didn't matter in the least!

@phoneticau 9 ай бұрын

Come to Australia CASA gave Bob Hoover a licence to keep doing his barrel rolls or get Australia recurational licence if you don't mind 750kg MTOW

@sgriffith2353 Ай бұрын

A real problem is the potential for degrading skills that you don’t recognize. Would it be cost effective to pay a safety pilot to fly with you in order to get an insurance reduction?

@ronrogers Ай бұрын

I get two check rides a year. I still flight instruct by the way. It becomes very obvious, when flying a tail dragger, when your skills start to degrade. I can see issues if I don't fly patterns for a few weeks!

@pittss2c601 9 ай бұрын

@georgew.5639 9 ай бұрын

With your experience and career you are far less likely to do anything stupid or illegal that would be cause for a claim. Your insurance cost should be lower than for the normal private pilot. But of course they don’t see it that way as they want to profit as much as possible from the flying public.

@warped-sliderule 9 ай бұрын

Here's some truth that may hurt feelings. Vast amounts of experience don't always map to low accident rate. Dale Snodgrass accident is a prime example. Evidence even in my very small corner of aviation, the only pilot to prang the club PA-28 (prop & nose gear) was an ATP. Sooooo, the insurance increase may in fact be justified by hard data. OK, turning the flamethrower off now...

@sgriffith2353 Ай бұрын

Would you get a reduction if you traded for a plane that has stability enhancement and/or one of the automated auto land systems? How about a Cirrus with fixed gear and stability enhancement?

@ronrogers Ай бұрын

I don't think that maters to the insurance companies.

@paulkelly4731 9 ай бұрын

Not to worry, we are told inflation is only 3.6%.... apparently aircraft insurance isn't included in CPI calculations..... all smart ass comments aside... go liability only, much cheaper.

@cjswa6473 8 ай бұрын

Quit and consider yourself super Lucky you made it this far.. I started at age 16 , now I'm 67. Also quit riding motorcycles. I was self insured, also aircraft parts are insanely priced. Too many airspace restrictions. Hate talking to controllers, not because they are bad guys, actually they are very nice. Just hate having to get permission

@Absaalookemensch 9 ай бұрын

I wonder how accident rates change with age.

@adolforosado 9 ай бұрын

Yes, everything is sucking. That's why I'm supporting #ROBERTFKENNEDYJR2024 for President. Do any one of the other two candidates even talk for 15 minutes without a teleprompter and make sense?

@fjp3305 7 ай бұрын

Just sell your airplanes and start renting; it's less expensive and less hassle. By the way, nice looking C-310.

@ronrogers 7 ай бұрын

Can’t rent a 310 or a Great Lakes!

@fjp3305 7 ай бұрын

@@ronrogers I know it

@rickr530 9 ай бұрын

Just a thought but maybe just stop buying insurance.

@ronrogers 9 ай бұрын

can't

@vanstry 9 ай бұрын

Do you really NEED insurance to fly? Might be time to drop it. A lot of insurance companies are turning into pure profit centers and they're simply there to make money. They're also trying to price people out of doing a lot of politically 'wrong' things. I've had to deal with it myself.

@ronrogers 9 ай бұрын

Unless you have no assets at risk or have no loans on the aircraft, you need insurance.

@vanstry 9 ай бұрын

@@ronrogers The loan I can understand because of the banks. But there's the cost value analysis of the price of those assets, what the level of risk is (in your opinion) vs the cost of insurance. I've dropped a lot of automotive insurance to just liability. Yes, I took a hit when I lost a car last year in an accident (gal ran into me and totaled the car) I got less than I might have if I'd had comprehensive. BUT, I was saving over $1000 a year on insurance costs. So adding it all up, I still ended up ahead financially. That just might be the way to look at it.

@stevederebey 9 ай бұрын

Great career, Ron! Loved all of the history you’ve experienced! Age discrimination is a real thing. Have experienced it in spades the last five years and have totally given up on doing anything with aviation. I reluctantly sold my hot air balloon last year but I just didn’t feel as was flying it enough to maintain the proficiency I expected of myself, and in addition, it was a very physical sport and my aging body was just not up to all of the lifting, shoving, and carrying that it involved. I have a LONG list of things in aviation after retiring from United that I’ve been rejected from. Literally dozens of things both paid and volunteer. So, I have embraced kayaking, which I LOVE! They’ll have to pour me out of that! There just comes a time…….

@ronrogers 9 ай бұрын

Steve, sorry to hear you had to give up your balloon. I have a kayak too (five actually) and enjoy it immensely. Living on a lake makes that a fun pastime.

@InvertedFlight 9 ай бұрын

@@jimmyoverly3512 United Airlines has just bragged that 80% of the graduates of their last flight school class were all DEI.

@wallywally8282 8 ай бұрын

Never had insurance, don’t believe e in it! More fool you for having it in the first place! I’ve saved a fortune over many years!

@thestardusters7640 9 ай бұрын

You might save some money if you rent!

@thestardusters7640 9 ай бұрын

At age 85 when I want to fly, I rent a plane with an instructor and fly on his ticket. He pays for the insurance and takes all of those check rides for me. I pay for his time.

@InvertedFlight 9 ай бұрын

At the airport where I used to hang out in my younger days, the older pilots there were definitely dangerous. The older airline pilots are not. I always ask those guys to fly with me because they had the most knowledge and were humble. But the GA guys, the ones that had a lifetime of regret for never making it into a jet. Oh my gosh. The stuff they did was scary. I begged a guy not to fly once. I could tell he was getting confused by everything and that was before he even got into his airplane. He tried to sump his fuel tanks from rivet on the wing. He was a good 2 to 3 feet away from the actual sump. As politely and directly as I could I gave him the reasons I believe he should not fly today. Unfortunately he did not listen. Then I saw him smack the runway hard and collapse his gear, he went around and then when he was down wind abeam the tower he stalled and spun straight into the ground. Everybody was shook up but all I could feel was anger.