Sound Blaster 16 - The Quest For The Ultimate DOS Sound Card Part 12 - Most famous ISA sound card

[@RockstarRunner7]

Wow, that's some effort, this will be a great help for people wanting to compare models. I actually have the 'and one that looks like this' XD

[@KITR-UK]

I have to get that one, somehow :)

[@GruberTD]

i remember going to buy this exact card at some unknown dealer first when it came out and i was so happy with it

[@metafish2428]

Thanks for this! Been looking for a good comparison! I ordered my first soundcard this weekend!

[@KITR-UK]

What card have you ordered?

[@metafish2428]

@@KITR-UK I've ordered the SB16 C2230

[@dabombinablemi6188]

My limited experience with the Vibra16XV (integrated on my PCPartner VIB862D) - updated the default Windows 98SE drivers or change any resource setting, and then the clipping bug started. And it never worked properly under Windows 95. So I'm disabling it and just using the better of my 2 ESS Audiodrive 1868f. FM synth just below the quality of OPL-3 found in the YMF740C (integrated on my Intel SE440BX-2), with no bugs, full SB Pro2 support, no TSR and the ability for me to leave the LPT enabled.

[@saxxonpike]

CT2890 is great if you don't want to use Waveblaster at all especially if you have a CT1703-A amp on it. Its similar cousin CT2800 is also good - the only difference is that one lacks UPnP. But I still have to give "best SB16" to CT2230 or CT2290, which are effectively the same card. (I even modded my CT2230 with a 4.05 DSP.) Despite all these points though, my retro SB of choice is not a SB16 anymore! I am using a Labway YMF719 based card these days. It has its own limitations (particularly for ADPCM sounds which can be patched anyway) but can be dropped into just about any machine and "just work".

[@saxxonpike]

Also KITR: thank you for this extended video and all the comparisons!

[@TheYuppiejr]

The CT2890 has pretty much all of the documented bugs that a Sound Blaster 16 can have, including the worst kinds of hanging MIDI notes (via wavetable or external MIDI devices using the MPU-401), vibra clipping and ringing issues. On the plus side It has a legit Yamaha OPL YMF262 chip, no single cycle DMA clicks and a generally low noise output which is, I believe, why it got such a strong endorsement here. However, I'd take a CT2230 or CT2290 (assuming it has the CT1703-A or CT1703-TBS DAC variant) over one any day particularly if you are proposing connecting any MIDI devices to it. Honestly your best bet for a Soundblaster 16 compatible ISA sound card with great FM synth, good clean digital audio output, lean/easy to configure driver + mixer, and bug free MIDI via wavetable or the joystick port is an ESS 1868f or 1869 based card, which usually runs $20-$30 shipped on eBay. I'm saying that as someone who owns 8 different Creative Labs Sound Blaster cards including 4 different SB16 variants. Here's a link to a PDF outlining the various SB16 variants and which bugs they include: www.mediafire.com/download/86q5oxtpvi7z0fc/SB16_Bugs_Sample_Collection.7z .. lots of discussion over on VOGONS about this topic.

[@KITR-UK]

I have to agree that ESS 1868 is a great card, it's cheap and works like a charm. However, CT2890 worked best for me. I couldn't even replicate most of the bugs that plague SB16s on this particular model.

[@madzen112]

One of those in a mid-90s computer and you were set to go. 32 AWE for the aficionados

[@krz8888888]

Surprised the speaker out has lower noise floor!

[@imkow]

I used to have an ESS sound card that emulates SB16 in DOS games...

[@KITR-UK]

Some ESS chips sound surprisingly good.

[@pentiummmx2294]

they didn't do SB16, but they did SB Pro 2.0 and WSS

[@Mani-aX]

holy smokes!! thats a lot of models.!

[@KITR-UK]

If I find more models, I'll do a second part :)

[@mariedelacroix6427]

Re: the dos screen at 1:48 how did you load that csp driver? I just bought and installed a csp chip into my 2290 and don't know how to set it up or test it. All I've done so far is press it in and opened 2 jumpers to physically enable it. Thanks.

[@KITR-UK]

I used loadsys.exe utility and loaded csp.sys with that.

[@tetsujin_144]

19:33 - I'm guessing CT2940 is where CQM comes in... Generally my impression of CQM has been that it's pretty good but the difference is noticeable for sure...

[@KITR-UK]

I never hated CQM, but it definitely sounds different.

[@FOIL_FRESH]

i got a ct2830 and it's super noisy, has all the bugs, but the fm output is strong and bass is punchy. it is massive too, no matter what slot i put it in my baby-at board, it blocks up the area for the front panel headers. seems to work in all games i've tried (except jurassic park's sound gun sound effects, i still havent found a card that makes those sound correct) but some games are super low volume and i can barely hear them. i have figured out that on launch of some games, the mixer settings are basically discarded and then all volumes are put to 5% - if i run the game in windows, alt tab, mixer shows everything fine. but as soon as you move the sliders you are back in control of sound and can turn it up (i dont think i explain it well but there's a problem, maybe my mixerset.exe is a different version?? no idea). unfortunately the games i want to run that have this issue will crash in windows. it happened on a 440bx board as well as a socket 7 board so i believe it's the card's fault.

[@KITR-UK]

You and your Jurassic Park :) I have to find the right card for you, that will work in the bloody game... What mixerset version you use?

[@FOIL_FRESH]

@@KITR-UK it's version 2.15 and i use mixerset /p in autoexec.bat

[@pentiummmx2294]

my 1740 is surprisingly the least noisy one compared to my CT2830 and the CT3930 SB32

[@AgustinGallardoc]

Good video! Just a question Which soundblaster 16 card would you recommend for an IBM 5160 that can work in an 8-bit slot?

[@KITR-UK]

Good question. And to be honest I don't know. But you dropped a good point there, I have to test this next time.

[@Mani-aX]

Descent - with the CT2260 and headphones on i can hear some hiss or ground hum coming through.

[@KITR-UK]

You're right, CT2260 is quite badly shielded. I have two pieces of this model and both of them are pretty much the same.

[@pentiummmx2294]

@@KITR-UK my ESS is the least hissy one out of my cards, the Aztech 2316 is minimally hissy, the SB16 and SB Pro 2 are the hissiest

[@prockrog5219]

Great video. Thanks!

[@KITR-UK]

Sure. No problem.

[@RockstarRunner7]

I know they are quite common, but I'd really like to see your review of an AWE64, it was my first 'good' sound card. Any chance you have one lined up?

[@KITR-UK]

Well, it's going to be the next video actually :) AWE64 Gold.

[@RockstarRunner7]

@@KITR-UK that's great, looking forward to it. I just picked up another sound card, an Aztech Sound Galaxy Nova 16 Extra II-3D, it has genuine opl3, sb2 pro compatibility and headers for wavetable and ide. It sounds great and works really well. Have you ever used one, or a similar model?

[@angieandretti]

@@KITR-UK I'm curious to see AWE64 Gold compared to the AWE64-in-hiding, the CT3670, as I'm considering upgrading from the 3670 to an AWE64 Gold on one of my retro rigs - but it'll be costly cuz I'll need to get one of those 24MB soundfont RAM boards whereas the 3670 can use 30pin SIMM's... which is why I purchased a 3670 in the first place. Is the sound any better with the real thing, the Gold card?

[@MordacksOrgan]

Too bad you didn’t record Prince of Persia 2. I think it has the most noticeable difference between OPL3 and CQM to my ears. The santoor instrument that starts playing in the introduction at game launch sounds very different than CQM. There’s more full throated buzz on CQM version of the santoor, whereas the OPL3 version of this instrument is more tinkly and open sounding.

[@KITR-UK]

Here you go: kzbin.info/www/bejne/gWHapoFpqs-Afpo

[@pentiummmx2294]

i did like real OPL3 (Aztech AZT2316), ESS (ESS 1688 in a IBM Thinkpad 560), and CQM (SB AWE64) to compare FM synth. genuine OPL and ESS seem to sound the best

[@Alianger]

What would you say is your top 3 for these?

[@KITR-UK]

I'd say CT2890, CT2940 and CT2770. But CT2770 lacks waveblaster connector.

[@RavageReeves]

@@KITR-UK Can you do a video comparing your top 3 sb16 cards Vs the Ess1868, Yamaha 71X , Aztec 2316, sb 2230, solo-1 and the Awe32 and Awe64

[@KITR-UK]

Sure, I can do that, but sometime in the future. I don't have the AWE32, yet.

[@nitroraptor5316]

I love my CT2910. Unfortunately, the 16 bit DMA channel is corrupted, and I don’t know if it’s a driver issue or an issue with the card.

[@KITR-UK]

Tell me more. DOS, Windows, both?

[@nitroraptor5316]

@@KITR-UK DOS 622 and Windows 3.1

[@KITR-UK]

@@nitroraptor5316If it's not working properly in two systems, it's probably the card. I'm not saying it's impossible that it's a driver issue, but it's highly improbable.

[@nitroraptor5316]

@@KITR-UK Hey, what sound card do you recommend for under $40? I'm building a Socket 4 PC soon. I'm considering an Aztech SB clone.

[@KITR-UK]

Well, I'd consider a cheap ESS or Yamaha sound card with QS1000 wavetable chip. I'd get excellent sound compatibility, great FM and decent wavetable. Or working SB16 with OPL3 and waveblaster connector. I could later decide what kind of daughter board I'd like to use with the card.

[@ksp1278]

I just bought a CT2290. I hope it doesn't suffer from any bugs. Lol

[@KITR-UK]

Don't worry, something will come up :)

[@mrb5217]

I can't understand what you're saying

[@KITR-UK]

I'll try to do better next time...