Sounds of a class 365 (GEC-Alsthom)

[@british_rail]

Every night I cry... I miss them...

[@SamT]

I miss them too, absolute units they were

[@NXEAFrenchie]

Same with non prm class 321

[@NSE465]

This sound will not be forgotten.

[@bb-3653]

Perfection, was waiting for this one. Rip to these networker soldiers.

[@martinchapman3204]

Love this. Helps me fall asleep

[@cbawitlife]

it’s sad how little time they had on scotrail before those god-awful 385s came to give them the boot.

[@Solomon_C]

Hmm... I've heard it argued that the 365s were the worst trains of all time. But I haven't been on them. That being said I've been on 465s and they have their fair share of issues...

[@reimztrains2024]

I miss these trains

[@bb-3653]

365s were always quiet at higher speeds. 465s were always more audible

[@365networker2]

Would you ever consider making a pack to replace the motor sounds on the AP 365? I find that the default EP sounds are quite flat and distorted. There are also certain elements missing, such as the 'spool up' type sound in the initial phase of the motors, the internal motor relay clunk and the high-speed motor growl. I also feel that the dynamic braking sounds are slightly too high pitched - presumably because they reversed the acceleration sounds to make the braking sounds. It's a shame about those issues, as the rest of the pack was very good - the physics, liveries, cab & door sounds etc. It would be nice to see a completely new networker pack - with all the different variants, (especially the original fronted 365).

[@bb-3653]

Damn!! upon coming back to this video i couldnt agree more. I am always hyper aware of motor sounds when travelling on trains, that being said with the class 365s I don't think AP are as aware of those different variables in the sound, it's more a layman's intherpereting of sound. What you said about a "spooling up sound" is esspecially accurate. These sounds are what I personally reffer to as, " Core Motor sounds", seperate from the pulsing patterns of the traction control/PMW/GTO or IGBT inverter noises. I call it "CORE sounds", because they are the sound that don't randomly change In pitch, rather they are they classic noise that most, if not all motors make where they start off, from deep then rise in pitch towards a screaming sound almost (depending on the motor) With the 365s, there are about two of these "core spooling up sounds" seperate from the GTO pulsing sounds, the first sound starta off at a mid pitch and rises rapidly before the slower and more deeper sound begins, which then rises in pitch until the max possible speed/ Radians or revolutions of those motors (basically the max spin rate) this exists for washing machines to electric busses. In the case of the class 365s they are quiet at higher speeds and most people likely don't pick up on the screaming pitches of the motors at mid/higher speeds. AP likely took advantage of that and didn't bother to put in the more refined and intricate parts of the motor sounds, they even did this with the class 465s, which are even more audiable that 365s (which is a crime imo because sam T even made a video of the "20 min ,465/9 sounds" ,which was tons more audiable than the 365s motors) In reality a more audiable unit to compare them too would be the 334s or 458s(Juniper units) as they also have alstom traction packages . Listening carefully their "core" motor sounds , they are actually very similar to the class 365s, but the 365s are alot harder to hear, whereas junipers (334s and 458s are LOUUD. ) Other trains AP have veen very lazy with were the electrostars, HOW ?!....HOW DO YOU FAIL TO MAKE THE ELECTROSTAR SOUNDS CONSISTANT!?!?, they are the easiest units to listen to and likely replicate. The motors are so audiable, even when they are quiet they are very audiable. AP really jacked those up. The only units they got seemingly perfect were the BREL MK3s or the 317s /321s/319s etc etc. BUT SOMEHOW NOT ELECTROSTARS.....HOW!?!. but again I respect that you picked up on these same problems that I have. Sam T likely is aware of that too. And lastly , you even mentioned the "high speed motor growl" I call it a Hum typically, but it doesent matter , that sound is hard to miss.. but somehow AP did. Its the sound of the air passing through the mounted motor fans spinning to cool down the traction motors, they aren't separately controlled, rather attached to the motor shaft and spin with the motor , like a giant cooling fan, that's an integral part of making the sounds realistic imo.

[@365networker2]

@@bb-3653 I didn't know the growl was caused by the motor fans - thanks for the info. It's also good to know I'm not the only one who has noticed these issues.

[@bb-3653]

@@365networker2 yeah, even electrostars lowkey have them too. apologies for all that text, but it was sort of bubbling up in my head 🤣and then I find that someone (you) recognises the issues too. But yeah, I hope all the talk of "core motor sounds" and "high pitch screams" made sense? I did type alot 🤣🤣so apologies if I did

[@SamT]

It was definitely very interesting reading all of this, I did not know that the networkers (particularly the 465s) had big cooling fans attached to the rotor of the traction motors, or at least I did not know that was where their unique growling sound came from. I always assumed that was down to the bearings on the motors turning over or the emf interference between the rotor and the stator. But yes going on from your description of how some sounds rise continuously and some don't, that's what is called synchronous and asynchronous. Synchronous sounds rise with the RPM of the rotor, whereas asynchronous sounds (E.G. 375 whine) are not directly affected by the RPM

[@bb-3653]

@@SamT to be fair, I mostly assume its air passing through, from motor fans, as I was doing a bit searching on the Internet here and there to search for the answer, and it mentions that traction motors can have fan blades mounted onto the shaft to help the motor cool down "seeing as motors need to maintain a specific temperature to be efficient " , I'm not sure how many traction motors have this feature but it seems to be the case that is likely the case here, that air is going through the motors and potentially cooling it down thus making that "HMMMMM sound". Its also the reason why you still hear them when the motor isn't powered because its still spinning with the wheels etc. But if you happen to be correct that it's only the bearings etc, then idk what the Internet is saying. And with the 375s about the motor pitch rising sounds they tend to be affected verg similarly with the rising in pitch. I.e depending on how fast they are spinning the higher pitch they go , at 75mph they always have that slight / decible jump before it goes quieter ,but still simultaneously rising In pitch. And keeps rising in pitch until the end. That being said, I truly think Armstrong powerhouse were just lazy somehow when making these, they aren't hard to hear at all. To make it worse they assumed..not even tried to make it accurate, but assumed!!, the internal sounds were Inaudible...when they are very much MORE clear from the inside of the train than the outside of the train. So I give you thanks for making these to replace the watered-down AP sound. If you end up making the 465 and 365 one that would also be great.

[@TransportCambs]

loved these units... any plans on replacing the AP 365 sounds?

[@Train-LCI-Spotting]

That was my favourite British EMU train (Sounds like a car changing gears)

[@bb-3653]

I think these would have been faster had they used the 465s motors, the Internet sources them as having more or just as much power as an electrostars traction motors (I.e 280kw) Class 365s only used around 1250kw tops , meaning their motors were either had low power output, or they were capped ( probably have power with lower power output than 465s, although 465s were limited by 3rd rail power so couldn't use more power )

[@SamT]

The 465s had quicker acceleration on third rail compared to the 365 as they had a lower top speed with a high torque output on the wheels. The gear reduction for a lower top speed means more tractive effort, although the 365s could draw more current on AC so have a similar acceleration rate to the 465 albeit with a higher top speed of 100mph. The rating for the traction motors is most likely peak power and not continuous (if they ran continuously at peak they would probably melt)

[@bb-3653]

@@SamT oh yeah I am aware of most of these factors . Although hypothetically speaking, I'd have to say, I don't know if the motors would "melt" so to speak as they are basically using little power compared to their max power output design(280kw), I guess the the way to prevent them from "overheating" if they were to be geared 15mph to 20mph higher, to achieve 90 to 100mph. When i say give the 365s the same motors as the 465s, i dont mean to leave them geared to 75mph otherwise yeah, trying to achieve 100mph with that gearing ratio would probably melt the motors, like completely wearing it out by leaving it geared to 75mph and then letting it hit 100mph (that would be rediculous). Obviously gearing them appropriately would be the first measure,. That being said The total power of a 465 is said to be 2240kw , but they only use around 1200kw in reality or maybe even less based on them beung third rail only, that means each motor likely only uses around 150kw out of 280kw around 50% to 60% full power, which is over 100kw less than the true power output of each motor. So to apply that to a class 365, I don't know if that would be a problem considering they also only used 1250kw. Giving them the 465 ALSTOM motors of that power output , and then gearing them specifically to hit 90mph to 100mph , i dont knlw that would make the motors melt, its even better because now they'd have more power potential to utilise, i.e the 365s would be pushed to use 1350kw and still only use near 60 to 70% power per motor and likely hit max speed quicker without issue, but again this assumes they are geared with good balance of torque vs not pushing the motors to rotate too much past its max rpm?. But either way this is all theoretical I don't truly know every detail of how the hyper specifics work tbh.

[@Bve542]

can i use this

[@SamT]

If it's non-profit and you give credit, then sure :)

[@Bve542]

@@SamT and mate do you mind helping me with this im trying to change the sounds in the ap class 365 whats your discord

[@Bve542]

@@SamT can you

[@SamT]

@@Bve542 unless you're prepared to pay me as a professional comission then no

[@Bve542]

@@SamT yes

[@orange123ABCnaananamr]

Roblox SCR CONFIRM?!?!? Omg guyz it’s mrtamapusr guy the sound deverknokv omg

[@JHsTransportVideos]

not funny

[@SamT]

@@JHsTransportVideos I disagree, this is hilarious

[@omegamezle]

I... Just don't know what to think about this comment. I've already lost myself enough braincells trying to make sense of Unity. I'm going to bed.

[@SamT]

@@omegamezle ouch, I felt that one.