Spider-Man Review - Arguments For and Against The Hero

I decide to review Spider-Man in Marvel Champions and discuss arguments for the hero and against the hero.
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#marvelchampions #spiderman #d20woodworking

[@markblant]

If we could retcon the Spider-Man deck with more modern traits, he should have the Web-Warrior trait and Black Cat should have the Thief trait (It's even in her quote!). He's still one of my favorite heroes in the game though and an iconic Marvel character.

[@beriganfinley9387]

I feel like with Warrior of the Great web they should have just made it a card that is permanent upgrade that can be played on heroes with "spider" in their name, and without the boost to attack. Simple, balanced, and gives everyone what they want.

[@OlivierPrevot-wj3xv]

Totally agree, plus removal of Avenger

[@monoludico6166]

As simple as that. 100% agree

[@TheGreatKyrillos]

Completely forgot that Heroes for Hire trait existed, I can't wait to see what they do with it when we get to Defenders!

[@jaremypyle6314]

They need to issue a pack of cards that need required updates, so we don't have to dance around the "Spider-" upgrade. Just publish new Spider-Man/Woman cards with the trait on them and fix all the other cards that have had text addendums. I'd happily buy that as a card pack for $15 with all the "fixed" cards and toss my existing ones in the recycle bin.

[@spinningspray2607]

Please, do more of the heroes reviews. It helps tremendously. Much appreciated ❤

[@tromdial7719]

I second this

[@syamealleon5587]

11:21 You cannot deft focus enhanced spider-sense because deft focus hero action. I think every aspects being able to do everything is fine. You have to jump trough hoops on each aspect to do what other can. It’s also still significantly weaker than what other aspect has to offer

[@monoludico6166]

Well, except for Turn the Tide, wich is a better aggression event than 90% of aggression events 😅

[@pietrorasputin52]

I think Spiderman Protection Taunt is a blast and I love playing him that way! 😁

[@jongahimer5338]

I’m always torn on taunt. So taunt is 2 effective cost by itself. But you only want to play it when you have otherwise unusable damage mitigation (Backflip). Backflip is an extra cost making it effectively 3 cost altogether to draw 3 cards. So you end up just breaking even best case. Is there some other value that just deck-thin that I’m missing?

[@Webhead123]

House ruling to give Spidey the Web-Warrior trait really smooths out a lot of the issues he has in present state. Such a small fix makes a large impact.

[@Bumbum_Inspector]

I wish they would consider reprinting the old heroes in their own hero pack. Like imagine if we got a Spiderman Peter Parker hero pack where he has the web warrior trait printed on his card, new aspect cards for whatever aspect they choose for his pack to come in, and maybe even optional identity specific cards that you can use in place of some of his old identity specific cards, etc.

[@rickmel09]

i'm not sure how their licensing works, so that might be an issue

[@royaviles5004]

I’d be concerned they end up nerfing his kit if they did a revised hero pack. He has some stupidly good cards. They just need to errata him to be a web warrior

[@Bumbum_Inspector]

@@royaviles5004 My idea would be keeping the hero exactly the same as his old kit but adding new identity specific cards that you can choose to swap out with old ones if you want to, as well as new aspect cards for whichever aspect they chose to reprint him for the hero pack. Only things I would like to see actually change are things like the web warrior trait being actually printed on his hero side.

[@monoludico6166]

Those are just dreams. FFG never do that kind of "revisions".

[@royaviles5004]

Looking forward to this series! I’m still working through the first wave so it’s cool to see some more recent comments on the old heroes

[@boardgametime3727]

Love the format!! Thanks, D20!😊

[@monoludico6166]

Nice idea for a series of videos. So, the problem with Peter Parker is that he's too strong? Great 😊

[@vizhyn8578]

This video was great. I’m looking forward to the rest of the series if you keep it going. Thanks!

[@pietrorasputin52]

Spiderman with taunt gets you net 2 from the card, but you get another card from his ability. So, it's still a net gain of 2 and even more if you plan to just take the attack or do a basic defense. Plus, it thematically fits with Spiderman so we'll.

[@boosbeau5767]

17:12 *puts dukes up* Andrew Garfield.

[@TheMBobbo404]

I really enjoyed the video. Could you break Ghost Spider down like this? This was a great way you've described how the cards work, and Ghost Spider has really gotten me confused

[@D20Woodworking]

Absolutely

[@candle8389]

What a great video! This definitely makes me wanna go back to the core box and do a "old heroes new tricks" with all the great aspect cards weve received over the years Looking forward to your next one!

[@allmyguitars28]

Played a game yesterday with Spider-Man with friends playing Captain Marvel and Ant-Man. I really enjoyed Spider-Man, Backflip is crazy strong. We were debating if the Web-Shooter could be used on Captain Marvel's turn to power her energy blast cards. We didn't end up needing it but it wasn't clear if the wild resource could be used by any other player as long as Spider-Man is in hero form.

[@Dreadnote-pf7of]

I am pretty sure that you can't giv other player resources through cards like Web-Shooter. Only way to do this kinda - is by giving other players cards (so they could discard them) or using cards like Helicarrier that allow you to discount cards played by other players.

[@mattvoegtli9928]

A few points: Webbed Up actually works against Spidermans core gimmick of drawing cards, potentially twice. Its an odd card for his deck, though it is good. Enhanced spider sense is not a great identity specific cancellation. Compare it to Dr Strange, which cancels the cards. Enhanced spidersense only cancels the when revealed, which in most cases is the cards, but a lot of the worst treacheries, especially in expert, will still surge. And Scarlet Witch can just cancel am entire encounter card, regardless of what it is. Black Widows grapling hook, though more expensive, sits on the table and still cancels all effects, allowing it to be used at the perfect time. Haven't tried it yet, but I've been thinking Suit Up and warrior of the great web could really round out his trait issue if teying to run a web-warrior deck.

[@mosermi443]

11:00 you can't use deft focus to play enhanced spider-sense as deft focus is an action, not a resource

[@jeremyvanderhoek3921]

Literally just started playing yesterday and am reading Spider-Man comics. Great timing of the video, thanks for the videos getting me into the game!

[@Doc4LC]

The Black Cat volton deck is one of my favorite decks in Champions. Will probably be a while before she gets her own hero pack if at all so this is the next best thing! Sidearm is another great attachment for her to avoid retaliate damage.

[@marvinp90]

Since it has become apparent that Emma Frost won't likely get a hero deck (or even an ally card) I have turned to fan creations. Over at Board Game Geek forums I found a BUNCH of fan hero decks (3 for Emma!) there are 2 Black Cat decks. One looks really interesting. It is all about "stealing" threat. I have one of the Emma decks being made at a pnp printer. Once I confirm I set them up right I will be ordering more

[@Doc4LC]

​@marvinp90 My friend who got me into Champions actually printed me out a set of fan made Black Cat cards when I really started to get into the game. The one he found utilized a separate dice board that has 3 dice slots so she has some luck built into the design. I've played it a few times and it's actually really pretty fun, doesn't feel too powerful or weak.

[@tromdial7719]

The new aggression pack with Iceman really helped flesh out Spider-Man's Spider Tracers, along with Cyclops pack's Marked.

[@Lon3lyMuffin]

Looking forward to this series, thanks! Love Spider-Man - he’s my favorite hero in the game.

[@KaturianKaturian]

I’m surprised you didn’t talk about sidekick/suit up with him and black cat! Maybe not the strongest but a great way to buff black cat and feels very thematic with a “black cat spidey team-up”

[@D20Woodworking]

Yeah I have been doing so much on sidekick recently didn’t want to talk about it more but obviously a great option

[@KaturianKaturian]

@@D20Woodworking I know that’s why I was surprised! Card is just too good/fun. Love your content man helps get me through many an overnight at work. Really excited for more of this series!

[@Dreadnote-pf7of]

Is it worth it on Blackcat? My main reason to use Sidekick is to allow all to stay in play longer due healing, but BC doesn't take cons.damage on attacks... Do you use her to thwart or just ability to doesn't care for sudden indirrect damage or retaliate and ready from event worth it?

[@D20Woodworking]

@Dreadnote-pf7of there are some situations it makes sense. Sometimes an enemy does indirect damage (or something else does) then you can put some on there

[@KaturianKaturian]

@@Dreadnote-pf7of I usually do it because it lets me voltron the heck out of her, have her swing for massive damage and never worry about her dying and it keeps her and her upgrades out of my deck and I can cycle through my web kicks/back flips faster. She is also a pretty ok thwarter (better than Peter at least ) so there are definitely times where the extra hp let’s me thwart with her more. I tried sidekick/suit up stuff in a bunch of decks when it dropped and I found it surprisingly fun with Pete. I know web warrior dropped his version which is almost certainly more efficient and doesn’t run sidekick.

[@radamescorujo5578]

FFG SHOULD DO A EXPANSION PACK THAT IS NOTHING BUT ALTERNATE HERO/ ALTER EGO CARD FOR EACH HERO. SO THAT THEY PLAY DIFFERENTLY AND HAVE NOW EFFECTS. I COULD SEE A Gray HULK OR O.G. HAWKEYE COSTUME..... MAYBE EVEN CAPTAIN AMERICA FLACON OR BUCKY.... JUST A THOUGHT.

[@CoyotesOwn]

Just limit te use of Backflip to one per turn and you basically have Shield Block.

[@DMTip]

I've seen some great Spider-Man protection decks that work really well to defend for the table He's a great team player. Backflip is already Fantastic, so why not double down with Jocasta?

[@cubsnextyear17]

He is still my favorite hero to use

[@atigerforever1]

The argument for,which mirrors yours to a point is,mho,even though the game has progressed ,and your player level has raised to the point of Spider- Man being,maybe ,not as much of a challenge,played as is Precon Deck, which leads you to not wanting to play him AS much .I will STILL play characters I loved as a kid reading comics...Spidey and Cap...I just use the better(?) upgrades,better Alleys,ect.I use him as a Avenger as well as Spider Family,pick your Spider character),which I like.The gameplay when you can play ,what,5 Allys,I haven't tried,but want to. I think you can damage the older versions if your newer cards make the older ones...redundent? Sometimes I like playing a ," light ,basic game that I don't have to question an action,and keep up with a lot more going on in the game. K.I.S.S.,sometimes. I still like playing the original game ,as is. My take.Love the content and this sort of analysis.

[@jullianaubrey8401]

I think we’re overrating Backflip. It’s an incredibly solid card that may have seemed ‘broken’ in the early days of the game but now I don’t know if it really moves the needle much on Spider-Man’s efficacy. Captain America basically has the same card in Shield Block that isn’t restricted to only attacks (it’s just any damage), has the same cost and due to Cap’s retaliate also does damage in return. Rogue’s Bulletproof Belle costs 1 more, also prevents all damage and gives her a Tough status card. The way Quick Shift works with Shadowcat’s hero ability also makes it a better Backflip ; at worst, it’s the same card and at best it’s the same card and draw 2.

[@rickmel09]

ronan: attacks for 12 with piercing and overkill peter: lol, lmao

[@marvinp90]

Darn it D20 spoilers geez. Half the fun of Spiderman is wondering who he is ;) I have always felt he was while not flashy he is a fun solid hero. About his thwarting I think if he was a good thwarter he would approach Dr Strange levels of OP. One of my fav house rules has always been to say I can switch out a hero's trait for a comic accurate one. Then use the honorary whatever to give them it back. So I would say instead of Avenger Spiderman is Webwarrior first thing then put the Honorary Avenger card to give it back so I can try him with a thematic deck and not have the clunkiness you mentioned. I do this with other characters who were on other teams like Rogue and Wolverine and the Avengers, Kitty and the Guardians, Black Widow and the Posse (though that is really only effective when dual handing with Domino since several important Posse cards are in her Hero deck)

[@zachwild2178]

I won't fight you on spider man Toby unless you say 3 is the best of Toby's spider-mans.