Spinlaunch: BUSTED!

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[@DiahRhiaJones]

"1000 hours of flying and a serial entrepreneur" translation: trust fund baby with nothing but time.

[@JakubChalupnik]

Jolly sporting, indeed.

[@KenS1267]

Can't find pretty much anything about him anywhere so if he's a trust fund baby he's very small time. I think he could be a straight grifter.

[@Albtraum_TDDC]

Trust fund baby? Don't be so judgemental. Maybe he's a clever scammer/grifter con-artist :P

[@yoghurt3643]

I‘m a cereal entrepreneur every morning, who is going to fund me?

[@zenmode88]

Zoom in on ''The investors that fell for this'' are dumb AF.

[@SpecialEDy]

When you unlock all the cheat codes, and your trebuchet has infinite range.

[@Nine-Signs]

Leave my stronghold alone you pleb.😭

[@leparfumdugrosboss4216]

And ironically, an infinite range trebuchet is f***ing useless, because all your targets are at finite distance 😭

[@randompheidoleminor3011]

@@leparfumdugrosboss4216 aim it at a target and you'd get a pretty dang good superweapon

[@SpecialEDy]

@@randompheidoleminor3011 "Rods from God"

[@leparfumdugrosboss4216]

@@randompheidoleminor3011 true. But we're shooting at escape velocity, so our trajectory is practically straight at the scale of the planet and it's not very useful as a trebuchet. You'd have to mount it on a plane or as a satellite. 🤔

[@jrm78]

The latest spin (no pun intended) is that the centrifuge will throw the launch vehicle up to an altitude of 30,000 feet (~9,000m) where a regular rocket propulsion system can finish the job. For whatever reason, I am reminded of when younger me would launch bottle rockets by throwing them into the air .

[@ddopson]

What a waste. Getting a rocket to 30,000 ft helps only slightly. Imagine trying to spin-launch an orbital class booster. Because that's what you'd still need to achieve orbit even when starting from 30,000 ft. Orbit is about moving fast (8 km/s), not about being high up.

[@haph2087]

​@@ddopson To be fair, if you are just trying to get to space, most of the work a rocket has to do is in the lower atmosphere because of the thicker air. In contrast, if you are trying to get into an orbit, circularization is most of the work, which... Spinlaunch has never been good for. Still, 30,000 ft is kinda lame. Make bigger, shoot faster.

[@saeidemami5540]

I guess that might be somewhat useful, no? Admittedly probably not in the top 5, but one of the issues with current rocket launches is the launcher platform and its maintenance, inspection, reuse, etc. If the rockets are lifted 1km above the ground, it might not save much in the energy but at least we can save a launcher platform.

[@haph2087]

@@saeidemami5540 That runs into the same sort of scaling issues. It’s large rockets with heavy payloads that do lots of damage to launchpads. If they could scale up enough to throw big rockets, they could also throw small rockets faster, which would be much more effective. Whether or not it can be scaled is basically the central issue of whether it can be an efficient strategy. If tomorrow, they could spin one with 4x the dimensions at double the RPM, classical rockets would be abandoned for non-human payloads. If material science (particularly tensile strength) limits them to the current scale and RPM, well, it was probably a waste of time. It’s impossible to know what breakthroughs do or don’t exist beforehand though.

[@ddopson]

@@saeidemami5540 A launch platform that could handle the kinds of rockets that Spinlaunch is capable of throwing (ie, ~200 lbs) ... would cost about $50.

[@mawilkinson1957]

Another thing you didn't address is that barrier that the missile broke through doesn't seem to be capable of holding a vacuum. Not was it concave from the vacuum. Nor does it seem like it was a vacuum at the time of penetration. Nothing seemed to have been drawn back into the vacuum chamber. Edit: Oops. It looks like many others noticed it too.

[@2ndAmendmentMF]

You can explode them instantly with charges. Like something similar to what special forces used to breach doors many solutions to that problem 😂

[@mikerentiers]

this video is super misleading to the point of lying There is an inner sliding door that it timed with the projectile and slams shut fast as hell. There is an actuall docuentry here on YT about the project that adressea the reality of the project. This video is essetially bullshit

[@bastiaan7777777]

@@Weincraft Like an (series of) airbag (s) exploding in that tunnel? Dust?

[@realdragon]

They wanted to replicate those missiles that launch from underwater submarine so badly

[@bastiaan7777777]

@@Weincraft Door @ end of the launch tube: it is a membrane. If they have the capabilities of putting in fast closing doors in the launch tube, why not use 1 of those doors at the exit?

[@alienhoboszombies]

'Serial entrepreneur' sounds like a fancy way of sayings 'has startups that fail regularly'

[@honeysucklecat]

Smells like bullshit!

[@reignman30]

Sounds about right. I was thinking maybe he ran a lemonade stand or 2 as a kid.

[@duskyjackal1699]

Just in general, i hate "business" jargon that doesn't serve to inform people what level of competency the candidate has, but rather, just serves to feed their glutinous ego. One of those: "If you have to state it, its probably not true", kind of scenarios.

[@Maserati7200]

@@duskyjackal1699 welcome to linked in. Unfortunately I’ve been guilty of this, but only because every does it on their resumes when applying to jobs, so I kind of have to do it too

[@guncolony]

Exactly, if any of your previous companies succeeded, you wouldn't be busy founding another one

[@CoolHardLogic]

The other thing to consider is that the centrifuge has to be perfectly balanced. That becomes a huge problem when you let the mass on one side disconnect. What's left of the centrifuge is no longer perfectly balanced and will destroy itself virtually instantaneously.

[@HeroofTime55]

Could release a counterweight straight down into a very deep collection shaft. Doesn't seem that huge of a problem.

[@fortissears5388]

@@HeroofTime55 I do believe that no matter how you try to release the counterweight, the whole system is NOT safely reusable.

[@beyondEV]

@@HeroofTime55 except they don't even consider it. shows exactly why this is vaporware. possible yes, but they so far only demonstrated that their prototype isn't even designed correctly. once you turn vaporware into something actually working, costs pile up. in the end it's going to be to expensive and can't match rockets.

[@HeroofTime55]

​@@beyondEV The beauty of the naive solution of launching a counterweight downward, is that you will just need 180 degree rotational symmetry of whatever mechanism is launching the payload. The harder part is building energy dampening systems in any such collection shaft.

[@whiterottenrabbit]

Hey! Any new World of Batshit videos planned?

[@pspicer777]

TF please do an update on this. It sounds as if their latest tests have had some success. Thanks

[@paavobergmann4920]

I work with vacuum systems. Let´s say...I didn´t buy stock yet, and I sure as hell won´t.

[@pspicer777]

@@paavobergmann4920 I have to confess I was wondering about the vacuum dimension. It seems that a barrier strong enough to hold the type of vacuum they described would be too tough just to punch a hole through. But I do not work in the field and this might be totally possible. What do you think about this?

[@paavobergmann4920]

@@pspicer777 The thing is, that vacuum is not negative pressure, it is the difference between ambient pressure (~1bar) and nothing. So the strongest a vacuum can be is around 1 bar. Think of a container that can hold 1 bar of overpressure. That´s all you need. Bicycle tyres hold sevral times that. So there are many serious issues with Spin Launch, but the punchable seal I think is none of them. Klapton foil or several layers of laboratory aluminum foil (slightly thicker) should do the trick. Evacuating a chamber that large to sufficiently low residual pressure to be able to get the necesssary rpm is much more of a problem, it will take a long time because below ~10^-5 hPa, gas (air) doesn´t flow anymore, the molecules move on their own, and catching the last few takes ages. It´s basically a game of molecule billard. Also, as Thunderf00t noted, high vacuum chambers need to be squeaky clean. Theirs is not, so they will only reduce the pressure to a mediocre vacuum, limiting the efficieny of the centrifuge. I am also much more concerned with what happens once the projectile pops the seal. There´s a lot of air slamming into both the projectile and the chamber, and air is frigging heavy at normal pressure. My worst nightmare however, is the centrifuge. Spinning something up to these insane speeds and then detaching a huge mass from one side is a recipe for desaster. Google "centrifuge accident" or "centrifuge failure". A standard, pesky lab centrifuge can absolutely obliterate a room if loaded slightly unbalanced. By like a few grams, and the thing rips itself apart and everything in the vicinity.

[@pspicer777]

@@paavobergmann4920 I see what you mean. I will look up the centrifuge accidents. The sad thing about all of this is the deception. Be well PB and thanks again.

[@AmxCsifier]

@@paavobergmann4920 There's a new documentary about this, they talked about the vacuum and it's interesting

[@jasondads9509]

10 months later, real engineering has made a video supportive of them. Is it worth taking it a second pass?

[@gwho]

This

[@iggi3985]

Real Engineering isn’t critical of anything..

[@DerUnglaublicheFrank]

@@iggi3985 exactly the guy just took anything at face value while ignoring most things pointed out in this video.

[@rajgami8893]

@@DerUnglaublicheFrank because most of these are just random things.. 1) for the balance they are planning to launch two satalite at once. So I guess it is not an issue 2) trajectory will not going to be straight at the start because it is going from vaccum to air, so it's obvious.. even rockets don't aim for straight trajectory. 3) heat convection is needed as he said and that's what they are planning with alluminium and copper as per Real Engineering video. 4) Also, they have air tight doors to hold the vacuum. So as he said in the video it is not true that they have to build up the vacuum everytime.

[@randybobandy9828]

I'm sure he will make a follow up.

[@mattmgmhs]

3:12 “slow motion resting ‘gasm face”. This made me laugh so damn hard, thank you for that!

[@kennethferland5579]

Yes, best new term.

[@Chris-hx3om]

Is nobody going to talk about the tensile strength required for the arm not to break? Using the scale of SoL, the arm needs to be around 60m long (30m radius). An object of around 1,000kg (which is REALLY REALLY small) will need to be spun at over 600rpm, and will exert a force on that beam of over 130 MILLION newtons. It'll need to be made of unobtainium. Just saying...

[@fredlaroche6969]

excellent point

[@michaelbuckers]

Plain old steel has enough strength for this. Look up some tensile strength tables.

[@antonioliles5027]

Tesla's impossible turbine would be made stable long before this thing even thinks about not flying apart.

[@01DOGG01]

Even if it were to do its thing, imagine the chaos after the release. They'd need to release the counterweight simultaneously as well for it to stand a chance of working.

[@bennettsampson5789]

Steel has a tensile strength of about 60k PSI. So for 130M newtons, or ~30M lbf, you would only need a beam with a cross sectional area of 500 square inches or about 3.5 square feet. Completely reasonable. That being said, there are far more severe problems with this design.

[@Manta_GTJ]

my favourite bit is where all the blokes hugged each other

[@lawrencelopez9839]

if the rocket has to be spun for an hour that means the astronauts will be spinning for an hour too

[@russellk.bonney8534]

It's not for astronauts. It surely wouldn't be spinning more than that required for acceleration to terminal velocity. I'm not going to do that calc here but it involves E=MV or some derivative. Friction has to be overcome and that will be by inverse square law with velocity all relatable to piR squared etc. It's a lot of calculations for them to get wrong. There are no no real world engineering tables for them to go to. This is their chance to make some

[@tbk2010]

My heursitic for spotting BS like this is: The more "inspirational" music and "slick" CG the more likely it's not going to work anytime soon.

[@Bacteriophagebs]

Similarly, the more they focus on ideas and feelings rather than on the actual design/construction, the more likely it is to be vaporware.

[@Darkshizumaru]

I think you could safely remove the soon from the end and have a more correct assessment. Put that thing in space, maybe we got something fun to launch at asteroids in our spare time

[@smokingsix]

Just the Music stuff? You dont object to a crowd of 20 year olds operating and designing this sort of stuff instead of old farts which would normally be doing this for organizations like NASA or Boeing?

[@aperturemichelle]

love the sleepless Eyes display pick

[@chaosryans]

@@Darkshizumaru i would agree, this seems more viable in a lower atmosphere, and hurl something dense to redirect something on a collision course with earth. But it'd probably lack the oomph of a simple boom rocket.

[@chrisose]

While the common meaning of the acronym CGI is "computer generated image", in cases like these it also stands for "con gullible idiots".

[@Mehrunes86]

Nice one👍😁

[@DeputyNordburg]

The Billionaires at Kliener Perkins are so dumb for funding this. And Amazon, and other hopeless start-up companies. Google, Sun, AOL... Fools!

[@chrisose]

@@DeputyNordburg If they are throwing millions at projects like this without doing basic research, then yes, the are absolute idiots. But then history has proven you don't have to be smart to get rich.

[@DeputyNordburg]

@@chrisose Do we have any reason (aside from its way more fun) to think they are not doing basic research? I mean thunderfoot did not even bother to read the patents held by the company so we know he is not doing basic research. I can't imagine having an opinion on this without 15 minutes of reading.

[@chrisose]

@@DeputyNordburg A basic understanding of engineering and physics is all that is needed to see through this vaporware.

[@Psycandy]

There's a lot more. The vacuum would haul enough air past the conduit to seriously affect the trajectory, and ascent would generate vast amounts of leading edge heat which the projectile would have to dissipate. To launch a projectile straight, it needs to be able to spin, making the idea shape more like a discus.

[@nicksomingenhar]

Sorry to pop by this late, but i saw a new "Documentary" on KZbin channel Real Engineering named Can We Throw Satellites to Space? - SpinLaunch What is your thoughts about it now 8 months later? will they mange it to throw rockets like they are planing, or perhaps will it be usefull for any other low orbit stuff? I'm just wandering if its just a Big paperholder or maby something thay can be used if improved and more testing

[@stig2704]

Well, just from a physics standpoint, the amount of centrifugal force exerted on the payload immediately excludes crewed missions, since no human can survive being spun around that fast, that long. Unmanned missions unfortunately can't deal with so much lateral acceleration without seriously reinforcing sensitive components that are nigh impossible to reinforce without compromising their functions. Just the difficulty of preparing them for a regular vertical launch, where the strong acceleration is just a couple seconds long, is already very high, and so are the costs associated. Maybe thunderfoot disagrees, but the whole premise looks unfeasible

[@christopherg2347]

@@stig2704 "Unmanned missions unfortunately can't deal with so much lateral acceleration without seriously reinforcing sensitive components that are nigh impossible to reinforce without compromising their functions." This too is adressed in the video by Real Engineering It is a lot less insane once you understand they only want to shoot a small rocket up there, which makes the whole math a lot less insane. And you still get around a large part of the Rocket equation.

[@christopherg2347]

You beat me too it, asking this. Real Engineerings video at least for me moved it from "completely batshit crazy idea or scam" to "a massive engineering and economics challenge".

[@chadst0r]

just saw that doco aswell, haven't watched it but would love thunderf00t to do another video inline with the new doco. just to see weather they have bought any new information into play.

[@bagofnails6692]

@@chadst0r I watched the thunderfoot video, but I can't really remember his arguments about why it will not work, and unfortunately he takes a long time getting to the point, so I can't be bothered to watch it again. I can think of many reasons why this is difficult or economically unfeasable, but no reasons why it simply will not work. Obviously human payloads or sensitive payloads are unlikely to work, but what about grunt work, such as getting kilos of water into space ?

[@Leoappeared]

They werent lying about the spinning part, their rockets are spinning really nicely after the launch :D

[@TexasCat99]

Spinning and flipping are two different things, aren't they? Aren't they?

[@ivyg6178]

@@TexasCat99 Details :P

[@JustBadly]

Yes, the rotational inertia has no means to be dissipated. Never mind being released at 430rps.

[@fuhishva]

The rockets are not spinning. Thunderf00t is simply tracking the rocket's shadow at 11:07, not the rocket itself. Still a stupid concept though...

[@JustBadly]

@@fuhishva They are.

[@hans-joachimbierwirth4727]

Rockets: slow when low, fast when high - let's do it the other way round in order to experience what pressure can do!

[@johncrunk8038]

Kind of like diving into a lake at mach 1. Kersplat!

[@Roxor128]

@@johncrunk8038 Think about the paste on the walls that used to be the astronauts before it got anywhere near release.

[@Dr.JustIsWrong]

Well, it looked like their CGI rocket had quite some air space between the payload and shell.. If they put this merry.go,round at the bottom of the ocean then that airspace would be buoyant! Just imagine how fast it would be going with 7 miles traveling time of water buoyancy acceleration!! Probably like eighty times the speed of light! That would cause time dilation! The satellites would be operating a week before even launching them!!

[@PemboCycling]

This video will be getting a lot more views following Real Engineering's debunking of the debunk.

[@woodrobotics]

good

[@Colstah]

Still waiting

[@enigma9273]

@@Colstah still waiting

[@dmoonmaster1653]

So if it was a vacuum inside their centrifuge thing and they got their projectile up to escape velocity then as soon as it left their centrifuge vacuum and into the atmosphere it would immediately heat up a lot, like a reentry. Kind of like bellyflopping into water going from air to water abruptly except going from vacuum to air abruptly.

[@haph2087]

Yep. This was always a problem people knew about. You probably *have to* strap an ablative heatshield to the front of the projectile and just let it get burnt off. Re-usable projectile tips are out of the question.

[@SF-fb6lv]

More to your point, it would be similar to a spacecraft just blowing off the idea of gradually reentering the earth's atmosphere from space at a shallow angle, and instead just crashing directly into the atmosphere...

[@everythingisalllies2141]

give them some credit, all they have to do is simply extend the escape tube a bit, (out into space) and include that tube in their vacuum. solved simply, and I did it on my head! I'm an entrepreneur now.

[@haph2087]

@@everythingisalllies2141 Ooh. now I want a space elevator that’s actually a pneumatic tube system. (Obviously impractical, but it’d be so cool. Good sci-fi idea in a semi-serious setting)

[@heyitsvos]

No no, there'll be a tube that will extend up to about 75,000 ft through the thickest part of the atmosphere. That's where it will ultimately exit assembly. Have some faith. 🎉

[@MakersMuse]

Doesn't seem to be much of a vacuum behind that thin film though they might be venting just before release like a vacuum cannon. I was pretty excited about the idea but I've built enough KE spinners to know how chaotic the energy releases can be. We lost a vertical spinner tooth through the roof once and never found it again, maybe it's in orbit?

[@TheCommanderNZ]

Did you notice his 3D printed mock up. Lol

[@HelenaOfDetroit]

Came here to say the same about the vacuum

[@Hagar76a]

First thing I noticed was the membrane being pushed out, not being pulled in.

[@donamills]

Im subscribed to your channel too, and I can almost hear the Aussie in your comment. 😁 👍

[@oldmech619]

If you release mass on one side of a spinning arm, you will have to be a release of mass on the opposite side and opposite direction down. And that is a lot of power. Huge. A central hub could never take those forces. Also, what happens when in flux of air hits the hypersonic spinning vibrating arms. Boom. This is a scam.

[@theCodyReeder]

Hold on, ima need some popcorn.

[@typicwhisper6569]

cody lab

[@YounesLayachi]

Here Cody 🍿🍿🍿 😁

[@theCodyReeder]

Yup. Holding the missile stationary to the rotor arm isn’t going to work. It will need to be on a bearing at the end of the arm so it can counter rotate to maintain pointing at the same point in space. Otherwise it’s always going to tumble coming out.

[@heroinmom153]

Sup Cody! Nice to see you here. Didn't know you were also a fan

[@GunFunZS]

@@theCodyReeder I think of how much shock is being transferred to that arm and bearing when you release weight from one end of the system!

[@seasong7655]

They've already reached 9km height with their test device only. So much for being "busted".

[@pyrolopez854]

Like granted yes there's going to be problems on the road that they're going to have to solve when it comes to putting actual objects out there not saying that you know solid base rockets aren't out of the picture but you would figure how much rocket fuel is needed just to get off the ground that right there would probably be taken care of I think the harder part is once it's in the air is just trying to make sure you have something efficient enough to get it up there the rest of the way but yeah I think the biggest thing is going to be as he was saying is package stress so how much stress can a certain package satellite take during the startup but yeah I'm looking forward to see what they do.. I think we shouldn't really scorn people out of existence just because we think the idea is stupid especially if they have a working model of it I'm curious to see how it continues but yeah

[@Deontjie]

I thought using this system to save fuel and using rocket fuel for the rest of the trip?

[@jackwardrop4994]

It’s the middle of 2023 and they done anything since 2021

[@reader111089]

Forget the rocket crap. That membrane that can perfectly hold back 40something tons of air pressure and not even warp is your real money maker!

[@peterebel7899]

This membrane is just one of some more miracles to be detoured in this concept.

[@JunkCCCP]

Carbon nanotubes and bucky balls are involved somehow, I can feel it

[@alastair9446]

Unless something gets removed seconds before and membrame only has to last for a few seconds.

[@JellyJonesey]

@@JunkCCCP Honestly a fabric of carbon nanotubes theoretically could do it, but then you run into the issue of slamming your projectile into it.

[@namibjDerEchte]

Why would it be not allowed to warp? This is essentially just a piece of a 1 bar (g) pressure vessel, and any rocket that can punch through air at hypersonic speed won't have a problem with a thick plastic foil that can only handle one bar differential pressure. Frangible vacuum chamber facings aren't a new concept. Their special sauce is more in the centrifuge being reusable and the rocket stages not getting squished in the centrifuge.

[@drkastenbrot]

All they need to do is build the vacuum tunnel all the way to the stratosphere. Like a hyperloop to space.

[@ER1SCO]

And if they leave one end open to space it will suck all the atmosphere out and solve the vacuum problem

[@kenlogsdon7095]

@@ER1SCO Uuumm, no. Space doesn't suck. You'd still have to pump the atmosphere out of the tunnel.

[@ER1SCO]

@@kenlogsdon7095 Well if some atmosphere gets stuck then you could blow it out

[@kenlogsdon7095]

@@ER1SCO With what, more atmosphere? LOL! Actually you maybe could push it out using a piston that runs all the way to the top and then falls out.

[@Circuitssmith]

Powered by spinning thorium solar roadways.

[@donaldasayers]

And yet, despite your doom and gloom trashing of the project, they continue to develop the system, with several successful launches with onboard cameras. Just look for the videos here on KZbin.

[@philosopherhobbs]

Really nice video. I love how much more compact/short it is and every minute is new content contributing to an objection.

[@noahway13]

I seldom watched him because of time. And his arrogant attitude.

[@leparfumdugrosboss4216]

"serial entrepreneur" = "person who has failed dozens of projects so far, or can't work in teams and has been given the boot, or is not emotionally stable enough to actually follow a successful idea past the first 1 or 2 years, and really would like you to trust them with your money" 💰

[@NeverTalkToCops1]

Yeah, I guess they figure he's the Right Stuff, having 1000 hours in some damn Cessna airplane or somepin'.

[@annarboriter]

The VC crowd love the serial prefix because it reminds them that they are backing another serial type operative. Deadly is profitable

[@leparfumdugrosboss4216]

@@annarboriter VC people are so drowning in money due to the leniant monetary policies of central banks around the world that there is probably a shortage of silly ideas to sink money into.

[@annarboriter]

@@leparfumdugrosboss4216 Shorter answer: there is too much stupid money because well connected elites get away without paying taxes

[@svampebob007]

the sad part is that he's actually getting the money. That white room screams bullshit project that is way over funded.

[@No-uc6fg]

Reminds me of that one Jules Verne book "From The Earth To The Moon" where they launch a pod to space thanks to a gigantic cannon.

[@GenghisKhanBruseySkyz]

except the cannon is viable, at least for transporting equipment that is.

[@TheFirebird123456]

There was one attempt at that; the chief designer was killed by mysterious ppl bc he was building it for Iraq and a bunch of power in that region didn't like the idea of a supergun able to land shells on their territory at any time.

[@katenunyabizness9221]

More than one attempt. First was Hitler's V3 cannon. Non mobile, costly and could only toss a 310lb shell 165km. Then gerald bull designed the "space cannon" aka Project Babylon for Iraq. Project Babylon was three superguns; two full-sized Big Babylon 1000mm calibre guns and a prototype 350mm calibre gun called Baby Babylon. The full-size Big Babylon barrel would have been 156m in length with a one metre bore. In total it would have weighed 1,510 tonnes; far too big to be transportable, and so instead would have been mounted at a 45 degree angle on a hillside.

[@neonwired4978]

which has also been done, incredulity is not a valid position.

[@davidhollenshead4892]

@@TheFirebird123456 He was probably killed by Mossad, who he was also working for...

[@YuriyMironenko]

I should admit that you track a _shadow_ of the shell instead of shell itself (which is also visible on same frames). Twist of visible path of _shadow_ is caused by earth surface non-flatness.

[@XPLAlN]

It is astounding how many people like you are thick enough to think Thunderf00t is tracking the shadow instead of the projectile. This moronic idea is simply rebutted by looking at the shadow of the exit tube and realising that the thing Thundef00t tracks does not come from there, but instead comes from the real exit tube.

[@c0der1020]

4:57 - One of the main points of a system like this is that the quality of the vacuum is actually not that important. Unlike huge vacuum chambers that are for simulating outer space all spin launch need is to bring down drag to an acceptable level which is only 1 million the vacuum intensity as a simualution vacuum chamber.

[@unglaubiger5645]

"The hyperloop, the most stupid idea ever" Spinlaunch "hold my beer"

[@davidbrayshaw3529]

Hold my beer. Its bubbles are made from a vacuum.

[@theussmirage]

Nah, hyperloop is still the dumbest concept. Spinlaunch is small beans compared to a miles long vacuum tube with tiny pods containing fragile humans.

[@unglaubiger5645]

@@theussmirage but spinning with 2000m per second and generating 10.000 g on a satellite isn´t less stupid

[@FourthRoot]

TF: Hey guys, let's put sodium metal in jet fuel.

[@deth3021]

@@unglaubiger5645 the g load at least isn't a major issue. Just look at cannon launched projectiles that can withstand an over 30000 g load. E.g. m982 Excalibur. And that is a shock load as opposed to the built up load here..

[@AdamSomething]

The Spinlaunch is a simple and intuitive idea that will revolutionize aerospace engineering. It's only a coincidence that nobody has tried it, or even seriously considered it before. What thousands of scientists and engineers couldn't do over decades, some Le Epic 420 Pickle Rick "serial entrepreneur" will accomplish now. Right.

[@DeconvertedMan]

Also this golden hammer for only 99.95!

[@anomaly_echelon7994]

Yeah but what if they can perfect it to a point where it actually works and is cost efficient at the same time? This is just the first iteration and after all the first rocket ever launched surely didn't reach reach outer orbit nor did fly straight.

[@forloop7713]

Same logic could be applied to propulsive landing and starship

[@terloriaslolx3869]

This makes warthunder 30G force overloads look like childs play XD

[@DeconvertedMan]

@@anomaly_echelon7994 nah.

[@russellk.bonney8534]

I have to laugh at the idea of a thin membrane holding the vacuum.🤑🤑🤑🤑😂😂🤣🤣

[@Avman20]

Can't imagine how a useful payload could be designed that could withstand over 11,000 Gs. To begin with there can be absolutely no cantilevered parts. Any part that's not supported through its entire length will be warped or flattened. Hinges, connectors, gyros, and conduit will all be toast unless they're supported in a solid medium, which would add prohibitive mass to the system.

[@hamstsorkxxor]

Actually, a lot of really mundane stuff handle g-forces really well! From what I understand, even consumer products like go-pros and iPhones can tolerate it, without modifications. Basically, small-ish objects can take a lot of g-force, because of the nature of the square cube law, ie. structural integrity parameters scale with area of cross section, while mass scales with volume.

[@user-nz8rv8ft5q]

@@hamstsorkxxor yes, but not 11K of g.

[@EvanOfTheDarkness]

That can be somewhat mitigated by making the radius of the circle bigger. Of course, that adds more problems with the vacuum system, but a 2 km diameter wheel, could spin up to Mach 1 with just 10G or Mach 3 at a 100G. To build something like this it needs to be *big.*

[@Whiteknuckle157]

@@EvanOfTheDarkness Isn't that what the space industry is doing? Using the earth's rotation to help get space rockets faster?

[@istherenofreename]

@@EvanOfTheDarkness And to reach 2200m/s at 10G you need a 40km radius?

[@andresvillarreal9271]

I am a lot more interested in the membrane on the end of the barrel, that keeps the vacuum from escaping until the vehicle rips its way to the atmosphere. I can only guess that this opening is at least two meters by two, for a total of four square meters of area. The force that comes from the atmosphere outside is a bit more than one kilogram per square cm, so that membrane has to withstand more than 40 tons! It is like parking an 18-wheeler on a membrane! And in the "test" they did, it did not even warp! And the pieces of the membrane flew away from the vacuum, not towards it!

[@sqeeye3102]

I was initially pretty impressed with the membrane cover too but I think there is something else going on. I believe they are using some kind of bleed down valves just before launch so that the in-rush of pressure doesn't damage or otherwise distort anything. Not to mention that a material that strong would cause the payload a ton of resistance to penetrate and affect the trajectory during the most important part of launch.

[@andresvillarreal9271]

@@sqeeye3102 I really would like to know of any solution to the problem of a membrane that survives a 40-ton weight, even for a hundredth of a second, and does not obliterate the satellite when it perforates it. Even if there are valves that let air into this contraption, equalizing pressures so that a membrane can survive, the air itself would enter at the speed of sound or more, in what is effectively a building-shattering explosion. Any advantage that you might have achieved by accelerating the vehicle in a vacuum will be lost when the vehicle is suddenly confronted by air at Mach-7 speed and one bar of pressure, no matter what you try to do with bleed valves or any other valve.

[@sqeeye3102]

@@andresvillarreal9271 All I am trying to do is give small amounts of plausibility to an already absurd idea. I have two ideas so far. One; the bleed air is slow and over time (reducing the air hammer effect), after a certain rotational velocity is reached. You wouldn't need full 14.7PSI, just enough for the pressure delta of the membrane to handle it. But then it wouldn't look flat, which is what we saw so *shrug* Two; Perhaps a blast shield is removed from behind the membrane based on the millisecond timing necessary for the swing arm/payload release. Possibly more trouble than it's worth but you could just say that for the whole project.

[@andresvillarreal9271]

@@sqeeye3102 Yes, I also thought of similar solutions. But no matter what you do, you will have to have objects or gases instantly reaching Mach speeds. The only thing I can think of is that non-engineers might fall into the mistake of underestimating the forces and energies involved in moving enormous amounts of gas to breathtakingly fast speeds in the blink of an eye. Someone thought that propelling a small missile to a few hundred kilometers per second in normal atmospheric pressure is the same as working with astounding pressure gradients and hyper-sonic speeds.

[@sqeeye3102]

@@andresvillarreal9271 I'm imagining a charismatic leader and some venture capitalists looking at fighter pilot G-training sleds and asking "but why not orbital insertions doe?!"

[@Bryzerse]

How do you feel about Real Engineering's video on this?

[@cursed_multicel]

Ever seen an unbalanced centrifuge spinning at high RPM? It never ends well.

[@volvo09]

Oh no, they'll just adjust the center of mass real quick with ultra fast computers 😆

[@petermirtitsch1235]

@@volvo09 What, you mean a hopper releases a couple of tonnes of computer carcasses from the other end at the same time?

[@19822andy]

Hell even a washing machine with a brick inside shakes itself to pieces.

[@tomf3150]

While air is rushing in. Yeah, nothing can go wrong.

[@OnlinePhenome]

Higher speed centrifuges need to have their samples balanced to within 0.1 grams. 🤣

[@stevgreaty7541]

I actually shouted “no fucking way” when I saw that intro. Absolutely unreal. I loved every minute of this

[@volvo09]

I barely saw anything on this but said "no fucking way" when I saw the concept and imagined the stresses... Can't wait to see what's here!

[@mateuszbugaj799]

My no fucking way moment came when I saw this seal which sadly was not covered in the video. What kind of material do you have to use if small vacuum tubes are made of thick steel? Wouldn't it damage projectiles on impact? Why this thin piece is not even a little dented by atmosphere?

[@richardbetances9096]

Thank you for the educational understanding of this spinlaunch venture.

[@michaelzlprime]

One of the worst debunkings of thunderfoot... 1. a better vacuum-proof bearing can be designed 2. the level where aerodynamic drag is insignificant at Mach 8 may be much above the level that thunderfoot is used to in vacuum chambers in the lab, and so leakage problems are not as problematic 3. the tilt in the experiment is obviously from a slightly late release, again, this can be overcome with better engineering... 4.obviously the entire chamber needs to be evacuated each launch...this is still pennies compared to current launch costs. the real challanges are in the scale-up to real weights and real speeds, the possible harmonics, and whether a precise enough mechanism can be achieved...not the the vacuum.

[@wb6wsn]

I would imagine that the centrifuge pivot and arm would self-destruct (due to some really destructive forces from harmonic oscillations) as the projectile mass is suddenly released. Also, the force of the outside air rushing into the vacuum chamber just after the projectile breaks the chamber burst diaphragm would cause rotor arm and chamber damage. And lastly, the projectile would be subject to serious oscillations as it tries to straighten its flight path after release. I wonder what the sonic boom intensity will be as the projectile punches through the diaphragm?

[@henrik.norberg]

The weight loss is their easiest solvable problem, "just" add a counterweight on the other side of the arm and release at the same time in to the ground (yeah horrible solution but possible) but the best solution is the shift a counterweight alongside the arm. I see other problems that is not as easy to solve.

[@Bourinos02]

I agree, what would make sense is to release another mass exactly identical in opposite direction trough the ground in a sacrificial tunnel. But good luck with cleaning it up and pumping it down every time xD

[@Stepcloserr]

@@henrik.norberg "easy" sounds like the typical engineer solution then you start to think about all the steps on how to apply such problem solving then it becomes a logistical nightmare.

[@henrik.norberg]

@@Stepcloserr Absolutely. But I mean easy for a space launching company, not easy for you or me. It is only moving at 120 rpm so they should have plenty of time to balance it before any vibration amplify to a destructive problem.

[@henrik.norberg]

@@Stepcloserr And as I'm not that kind of engineer I cant tell if harmonic oscillations even is a problem in a system that spins 120 rpm and constantly slowing down. If I would to guess (and I really mean guess here) I'd say that if you are able to slow if down fast enough (1 rpm should be enough) no harmonic oscillations will happen even without fixing the uneven mass distribution. Uneven load on bearings at those forces and everything else is another matter.

[@avi8r66]

This is fine for a projectile, artillery shell kind of thing, but for a working launch system to get a functional satellite with an orbit insertion rocket engine into orbit... not so much. Ultimately this is another investor honey pot. They suck in venture money, deliver enough to build excitement, and then the founders bail with profits.

[@nottoday3817]

It's not fine even for that.

[@kennethferland5579]

Yep, their really needs to be more fraud investigation on this stuff. And technically their are no 'profits' the founders just give themselves bloated salaries for as long as possible. It's right in his job description 'serial entreprenour'.

[@alastair9446]

You could just build a cannon and get better results. Shells have electronics, you have shells that are rocket assisted.

[@avi8r66]

@@alastair9446 Yep, and that's actually been done, long ago. Look up project HARP.

[@fabulousdick]

All the problems can be solved. The idea is reasonable.

[@ra2186]

Some of these arguments in this video are ridiculous, which makes me think other areas I'm not knowledgeable of may be equally ridiculous. Saying that the area would have to be evaluated before a lunch is silly. We already do that for every single space launch. Of course the area has to be evacuated before a launch. How is this a fault?

[@Zarastro54]

Because they… didn’t evacuate the area before launch? The whole concept is ridiculous on its face. It’s like early 1900’s ideas of space travel where you could just fire someone out of a cannon to the moon.

[@generalralph6291]

Sometimes I think I could have been a pitcher just for Musk: “How about mid-launch refueling?” “And every car has hundreds of solid tungsten balls…” “A paper that can’t tear or burn, and it doubles as body armor.” “The commercials pause playing when the user looks away!” “And basically just a super sorter in every house, where nothing goes to the landfill.”

[@Mehrunes86]

What about Solar freaking stairway to space😂

[@TeddyKrimsony]

actually a trash sorter isn't that terrible of an idea

[@spacejunk2186]

"Mid launch refueling" This makes me think of a rocket with no fuel tank but instead a kilometers long fuel tube attached to the engine that just gets draged along into space while a ungodly super pump on the ground pumps fuel all the way up to the rocket which it is leaving the earth at mach 20.

[@Damienn1776]

That fourth one is just straight up evil

[@ilovefunnyamv2nd]

@@TeddyKrimsony Please tell me you're joking? Its not a terrible idea, but the implementation would be a nightmare, sensors, cameras, and AI powerful enough to identify half eaten chicken wing from balled up plastic cling.... You'd be better off paying someone a lifetime to sort your garbage than try to have a machine take away their job

[@sarkybugger5009]

If there is a vacuum inside the launch chamber, how come the debris from the seal blows out, rather than being sucked back inside? How do they balance the rotating arm once the payload detaches? How do they plan on getting rocket engines and fuel tanks past 1,000 Gs? It's all BS. Anyone who invests is a feckin' eejit.

[@ananousous]

The answer's really simple if you stop and think for a second about just how much energy gets radiated from the sun Yeah that's right, they just need to add solar panels

[@SerunaXI]

@@ananousous Brilliant. Let's add a solar sail after launch.

[@ItsMrAssholeToYou]

@@ananousous Hmmm...I think you're 50% there. I bet if they also employed a dehumidifier, that would make the air thin enough to really reduce the amount of needed vacuum pumping. Added bonus: the water can then be sent to starving children in Africa, thus solving global warming!

[@peterl1365]

Pretty obvious that they didn't bother to evacuate the chamber for this test launch. Same way the hyperloop test track wasn't really evacuated (or else it would have asphyxiated the riders). Just a minor engineering detail to work out. /s

[@zwerko]

How you ask? Well, easy, they'll just concentrate really, really hard on wishing that these questions don't pop up before they find enough gullible investors to give them moneyz.

[@fredrik3685]

January 2023: They still have this exact video clip on their website. People are commenting about new successful launches. Obviously not successful enough to show.

[@brandonjohnson8880]

They have shown multiple launches on their KZbin page. Have you discovered the search bar yet?

[@XPLAlN]

…end of June still nothing since last September. Seems like they stalled at the sub orbital test of customer hardware.

[@cellmaker1]

Your main objection seems to be a simple one: As soon as the projectile leaves the partial vacuum of the chamber and hits regular atmosphere at launch altitude, the forces at 5000 mph will create so much friction that it will effectively significantly deform or destroy the projectile. Seems reasonable. But wouldn't sophisticated venture capital firms like Kleiner Perkins or Airbus Ventures have looked into this before pouring millions into it? (Yes, venture capitalists are gamblers, but they are not idiot gamblers.) Wouldn't a boatload of physicists and engineers have pointed this out? Pointing to cases of fraud (Theranos) or lack of success (Hyperloop et alia) seem like strange comparisons. Those investments were were not ruled out on fundamental issues of physics or material science. I guess we'll all wait and see how far these guys can take it. I would be very surprised if, in a couple year's time, a bunch of scientists and engineers said, "Well, it was obvious from the beginning this wouldn't work." Even if it doesn't end up working.

[@SioxerNikita]

The board is not necessarily this smart. Getting a boatload of physicists and engineers to point it out costs money. Money that could be spent on gamb... I mean investing somewhere else. The physics for spinlaunching something into orbit doesn't make sense. The amount of energy needed is quite a significant amount of energy, and... that'd leave the projectile essentially burning up as if it was reentry. You need to launch SIGNIFICANTLY faster than 7.8 km/s (28080 km/h), so not realistic. Having a secondary propulsion system on your projectile that initiates afterwards... I wouldn't trust a propulsion system that has gone through the required G-Forces.

[@keithrobinson6511]

There are idiot gamblers. Theranos being one example where they didn't check the technology.

[@aSinisterKiid]

"Serial Entrepreneur" has an awful ring to it. The only other profession to use that word is "Serial Killer". So on an intuitive level it sparks the images of dozens of failed business's.

[@hans-joachimbierwirth4727]

Trust me, you're not the first to get scammed by me ;)

[@appa609]

I'm a cereal enrepreneur. I present: cheez-its in milk!

[@morpheas768]

It basically means professional scammer. Nowadays, nearly every "Serial Entrepreneur" is someone who comes up with some nonsense, pays for some impressive CGI work to be done, creates a Kickstarter page and then enjoys whatever money people throw at them. Rinse and repeat and you got the "serial" part done.

[@thargoid666]

I guess Serial Entrepreneur is the new MLM

[@drakemallard1486]

@@appa609 I know you're joking, but I would bet money that Cheezits would be great in milk.

[@16v15]

I was waiting for this, because even my back of the brainpan calculations showed this as mechanically ridiculous.

[@frbe0101]

What? No it super easy to spin something to mach 5 and keep it in one piece, any baby engineer could do it duh!

[@Alondro77]

Yeah, the forces required to achieve escape velocity acting upon the structure would rip it apart. Now, MAAYYYYYYBEEEE they could use this strategy to give a small vehicle a starting speed boost and achieve low-earth orbit with less fuel. It'd be a similar idea to flying the space planes as high as possible beneath a huge carrier plane and then launching near the stratosphere. So much fuel is used just to get a rocket moving, that it might help lauching microsatellites upon a tiny rocket pushed up to a few hundred miles an hour already. But this design is NOT the one that will do it. It would likely require a very different designed vehicle which also takes advantage of atmospheric lift and launches from an angle, not straight up.

[@mor4y]

You should read up on the exploits of Dr Gerald Bull.... it might make you scratch your chin and wonder 🤔 "You can't shoot things into space" "You can't double, then triple the howitzer range" "You can't build a 1m bore supergun!" 👀 Thankfully the last one was stopped during production! But the moral or the story is Ballistics Is Mad Yo.... don't underestimate some geeky so-and-so's crazy idea if it has maths behind it.

[@akulkis]

@@Alondro77 Sadly, even that idea requires more fuel and bigger engines than the curret methods of launching from the ground, or dragging sections up to the carrier and assembling there....but that would require your carrier to be in a stable orbit, and thus launching your components into orbit to be assembled on the carrier.

[@markmatthews1802]

Let’s not forget that you now have to design your payload and the rocket you will need to actually achieve orbital velocity to withstand the incredible side acting g-forces the centrifuge is imparting. That’s going to add weight.

[@sapiosuicide1552]

This is the NASA mars helicopter all over again. Stick to debunking Kickstarter dehumidifiers instead of teams of actual engineers working out kinks in new technologies you don't know nearly enough details about.

[@Spolt_main]

Tbf to thunderfoot he never said the mars helicopter wouldn't work, he said it would be a high risk bet that if successful wouldn't really change that much.

[@MrZooBreak]

"Vague Motivational Poster Fluff!! LOL!!! I love this channel!!!

[@akulkis]

Nevermind that as soon as the spinlaunch projectile hits the air, it starts losing velocity due to aerodynamic drag, whereas a rocket is still accelerating even after hitting 5000 mph at a much higher altitude with much thinner air. Therefore, 5000mph isn't fast enough to put ANYTHING in orbit around the earth with our current atmosphere.

[@livefree1030]

TF00T jumped the gun. Spinlaunch has already stated "while the first test flight vehicles do not have rocket engines onboard, SpinLaunch plans to add that and other internal propulsion systems in later suborbital test flights". Basically SpinLaunch is using kinetic energy to gain velocity as it is a cheaper approach than to use chemical rockets to build the velocity from zero.

[@jeffreyblack666]

They are not designed to put things into orbit directly. No device is capable of directy orbital insertion (unless you want it to crash back down after a single orbit); and the speed is too low. You need ~8 km/s for LEO. The idea for this is to effectively replace the first stage of a rocket. After it travels through the air for a short period of time it will ignite a rocket to get the rest of the way.

[@FeedMeMister]

@@livefree1030 how are they going to protect a chemical rocket engine from an hour of lateral G force?

[@azargelin]

@@FeedMeMister wats the worse that can happen, yea they need to innovative on alot of small and big things

[@DreadX10]

@@FeedMeMister Pulling about 10.000 g's before launch and they need to arrest its spinning during release so that also puts a load on the frame of the rocket.

[@Fuckthishandlebullshit]

I am surprised you didn't even touch on the problems that even they called out with how the centrifuge would have to handle a sudden millisecond change in weight with the release of the projectile and how it would shred the entire system. Also, not only would they have evacuate the entire area for the chance of failure, but how far away would a projectile go if released in a way that it was flying horizontal to the ground when it punched through the side of the structure?

[@commonsense7754]

Not only that, what bearing system could support an arm of that weight at those speeds without melting?

[@avi8r66]

Ideally, if such a system could work, i would expect it to be mostly underground to contain any such high energy failures. As it now the shrapnel would go in all directions, buried only some would escape out the top portion. But they have a long list of other problems to solve first, some of which arent likely to be solved.

[@petermirtitsch1235]

Have you ever seen a laboratory centrifuge when it's slightly unbalanced? It's like a bucking bronco. Imagine a washing machine mid spin cycle, and you disconnected the concrete weights... 😂

[@NeverTalkToCops1]

@@commonsense7754 cryomagnetic bearings, the surfaces are never touching.

[@meferswift]

I dont that in self a problems. They can have the counter weight to detach and destroy itself into a dumping channel

[@charlesvan13]

A problem I haven't heard addressed is that the rocket will be spinning at 450 rpm. So when it's released out of the centrifuge it will be spinning head over tail 7 times a second. It wont be aerodynamically stable.

[@freshrockpapa-e7799]

wtf are you saying, no it won't lol XD

[@freshrockpapa-e7799]

Go back to high school and take physics again

[@frankpeletz1818]

Here it is ,may 2nd and spin launch is at launch #8

[@Equiluxe1]

The problem staring me in the face is when they show the projectile breaking through that membrane is that the membrane is flat whereas it should be curved inwards due to the pressure differential further more I would expect the inrush of air on breaking the membrane to push the pieces inwards. So they either had no vacuum or very little. But such a system may very well be of use to send containers of mined minerals or the such back from the moon, very little gravity and atmosphere to cause problems get the timing right and the earth gravity brings it home.

[@cr10001]

Actually, that's a good point. Might work on the Moon (also, less gravity to overcome). BUT - what's the container going to do when it hits Earth (or Earth's atmosphere)?

[@aruspice]

​@@cr10001 it's going to do what any deorbiting object on earth does, get really hot and under a lot of stress Assuming its built tough it could survive reentry and land on parachutes or something, not like raw minerals are particularly sensitive cargo

[@cr10001]

@@aruspice I wasn't so much concerned with the welfare of the cargo, as to whatever it happens to land on at random.

[@orkhepaj]

clearly it was a no vacuum fire

[@Albtraum_TDDC]

on the Moon you just need a cannon or a very long tube with magnetic accelerators. There's no air or drag too. Safe and simple and cheap. This idea is not needed and not efficient or safe.

[@Nachtmahr79]

Hm... A rotor, with several tons of weight, spins at 7 times the speed of sound (at the tip) and when the rocket is released, the vacuum-chamber is pressurized within the fraction of a second - at the same time the rotor becomes unbalanced by the release of the rocket... sounds totally viable and secure - nothing to be concerned about.

[@herpderp7114]

Hey, I'd watch live feed of that happening any day of the week. It's gonna be biblical.

[@williamrobson4998]

This doesn’t sound any more complicated than a car engine coordinating hundreds of explosions

[@JDMKEV]

@@williamrobson4998 ...

[@user-be5ko4wz8j]

BoOoOoM

[@gabriellang7998]

Right? Good thing they did not promised manned missions, only to launch some fragile and expensive equipment!

[@imresandor4664]

I think you mistook the missile for its shadow. When you plot the trajectory of the missile and follow frame by frame the missile you are actually following its shadow.

[@BoGy1980]

and check the breaking of the seal... it's just not how it should break...

[@texmex9721]

@@BoGy1980 How should it break? Also it's not holding back vacuum or anything. that is a dust cover or more likely just there to keep you from seeing the real tech inside.

[@BoGy1980]

@@texmex9721 watch the debunk video of thunderf00t, he shows it frame by frame

[@anonymous-rb2sr]

I thought he was doing this intentionally, since the shadow remains in frame a lot longer than the projectile itself and considering the ground the shadow is being cast on is flat, the trajectory of the shadow and it's shape is identical to the projectile anyways, so unless he did half and half using the projectile then it's shadows, then there is nothing wrong with using the shadow (assuming the ground is flat, I didn't bother rewatching the video)

[@texmex9721]

@@BoGy1980 thunderf00t says the missile emerges with an angle. He does not mention the cover breaking wrong.

[@tecgunner]

I worked at a destructive lab years ago. We had a very large centrifuge in a sub basement. We are talking about several inches of steel, five feet of concrete, and several more inches of steel. It was used to test various parts for space vehicles. If even a small nut or rivet came off you could feel the bang through the next building. I don't even want to think of what would happen to that chamber if something failed under that much stress.

[@XPLAlN]

I actually started off in centrifugal engineering. These were massive industrial machines not the centrifuges common in lab work. One time a main bearing support failed and the 4 tonne cylinder assembly went through the thick walls of the test cell. That was before my time but folks were always a little on edge when one of those things was being run. The revs would’ve been in the order of 2k, so very low compared with this spinlaunch nonsense.

[@eightsprites]

Rapid decompression.. that’s what would happen.. then you need to build a new one.

[@colossalbigfoot256]

I had an airplane back in the 80s that did the same thing on a string. I should be a billionaire by now.

[@andreahughes1155]

You win the internet today for me. That made me laugh so hard.

[@pluto8404]

You launched a paper air plane to space? Lol, you are no where near the intellect of these visionaries and these scientists. You couldn't even dream of producing the same quality of animations and white papers as marvelous as they do. Truly revolutionary and market disrupting.

[@deadlygaming781]

@@pluto8404 who needs science when you have animations ;)

[@andreahughes1155]

@@pluto8404 "visionaries" that fails if they had asked a scientist to see if its possible? Maybe do that before wasting what is more than likely other peoples money duped into giving them money.

[@elmartillo7931]

Lol I had a super chipmunk that was string controlled as well! You just brought back some memories lol

[@plebpunk]

As the film covered tube is in a vacuum, the membrane would be depressed, concave. When the projectile pierces the membrane under vacuum, the external air would rush in, taking the tattered membrane inwards, not outwards, as shown. One of the problems this proposal faces is the inbalance of the spinning release arm on release of the projectile in the millisecond of release, as the proposed projectiles mass is timesed many many times, at the speed (of sound) it is traveling will put the arm out of balance, and tear itself apart. The load on the bearings would be immense. Unless another weight, equal to the projectile is released on an opposite arm, to keep it balanced.

[@markevans2294]

Firing a hypersonic projectile into the ground may well destroy the structure even more effectively than the arm breaking apart or rapid depressurization of the vacuum chamber.,

[@danbee6407]

@cqxmrvcoy I like where you're going with that.

[@halipatsui9418]

@@markevans2294 Well it could be tossed down into a tunnel but its still risky

[@TheyCalledMeT]

had the same thoughts. what about a mechanism which moves an appropriate weight towards the middle of the centrifuge? (if such a thing is possible)

[@halipatsui9418]

@@TheyCalledMeT way harder than just letting the eccess mass go

[@tribeofnan888]

'Static in the attic' brought me here and thank you for that a new subscriber is here. I like what I see can't wait to delve in.

[@Handstr]

I noticed an error in your tracking analasys of the projectile. You are plotting the shadow's path rather than the actual projectile.

[@gwho]

Lol. Debunker debunked.

[@gwho]

The launch instability is a lot like criticizing SpaceX for failing to land the rockets. It's an engineering problem that can be solved by good execution and a lot of smart thinking... It doesn't make ti a dumb idea. The company knows about the sudden change in air density. They know about the irregular forces that the launch would cause. Solutions can be developed.

[@XPLAlN]

You have to be joking. You need only look at the shadow of the chamber and exit tube to see where the shadow of the projectile should be. And if you think what TF plotted was the shadow then that projectile must have exited the bottom of the chamber and flown off at about 45 degrees from the vertical. Moron.

[@analkalinne]

Look at the tip of the shadow of the tower 11:17

[@alanwatts8239]

That makes zero sense, honestly. If you look at the tower's shadow it is way ahead your actual supposed shadow, and how exactly can we see the shadow, which from this angle would be hundreds of ft below, and not the actual projectile? That's not the shadow.

[@stevenwarner9156]

We've got a new way of putting satellites into space! You just still need a rocket; your payload (and the rocket) has to be able to handle 10,000 Gs of acceleration that suddenly stops at the moment of yeeting; and you need materials that can stand up to the heat of hypersonic flight barely above sea level. Trust me; I am a great (over)engineer in Kerbal Space Program.

[@dominicdelprincipe2583]

"Moment of Yeeting" should be implemented into physics jargon

[@Ealsante]

We're going to need more struts, my friend. More struts.

[@djaydeved]

i mean... given the load is spread out enough, 10,000 g's is still aparently in the realm of a action cam to handle...

[@sanjaymatsuda4504]

To reduce the problems with air being too thicc, they should build the launch facility on the summit of Mt. Everest, and dig a hyperloop-only tunnel to haul the payloads in. The vacuum of the spinlaunch and the vacuum of the hyperloop could work together, now that's what I call synergy!

[@milhousevanhoutan9235]

Sure! There's absolutely no value at all in decreasing the fuel required to get X amount of weight into space, that absolutely wouldn't bring down the cost of launching payloads. The electronics required to handle the slow loading of Gs already exist in your smartphone so the payload would need to be designed for the launch system and it won't necessarily replace rockets but I don't think that claim was made. As for the rocket, man it'd be really cool if NASA, which conducted serious hypersonic flight research in the 1970s, and Dynatech at MIT figured that Barium peroxide and Cobalt(II,III) oxide decayed at high temperatures in endothermic reactions that produced O2 and decayed to Barium Oxide and Cobalt(II) oxide, with the key word being endothermic meaning they were cooling reactions. Obviously that never happened though otherwise you'd be able to google it, possibly even get the exact publication number since it's public record, it would probably look something like SP-2007-4232. That's if it existed of course, nobody ever actually did research into how one might deal with heat in hypersonic flight in the 70s especially not NASA or Dynatech and they definitely didn't discover the properties of Barium peroxide and Cobalt(II,III) oxide, that surely never occurred.

[@westherm]

And that’s just the launch portion. Payloads are going to have to be way more robust to survive the centripetal acceleration of the spin and the deceleration and thermal shock of hitting sea-level atmosphere at Mach Jesus. It’s difficult enough to get a payload with any mechanical complexity to survive a routine SpaceX launch. From the spin launch rough numbers for their full scale platform (300’ dia, 5000 mph exit speed), I calculated that the centripetal accel experienced by the payload would be a lowly 11,139 G. For reference, the worst G-load you’d ever design a part to on a Class-D satellite mission using a MAC is on the order of 80 G. That’s the smallest cantilevered components in the system. This is 11k G on all comps everywhere in the system. Every circuit board. Every stowed antenna and solar panel. Every fin in the turbo pumps. Every calibrated piece of scientific instrumentation. All of it experiencing eleven thousand times its own weight. As an engineer in the space industry, I can tell you that we all think these guys are complete jokers.

[@MattTrevett]

Why launch at sea level when you could take advantage of the thinner atmosphere?

[@blammers]

Thank you. This was my initial thought when watching the demo.

[@GeeKayKayGee]

Oooo... don't say "SpaceX around here. Thunderf00t has already debunked SpaceX and proved that all SpaceX launches are holograms and that Elon Musk is just operating a pyramid scheme.

[@kantoros]

They've actually built smaler vacuum chambers for testing and claim most modern electronics can already survive 10.000g, and since weight isn't as important as in normal rockets, reinforcing satellites for the g's seems doable to me

[@Sirlix89]

​@@kantoros But as mentioned, a satellite is not just electronics but also mechanical components. I have no insight when it comes to the space industry, but the mechanical components are probably designed to withstand those accelerations in only one direction. Now they need to be designed with two directions of acceleration.

[@Goldo97]

I’m so glad I found this channel again!!!

[@kimkeam2094]

Did you notice that the membrane that the projectile goes through does not implode back towards the vacuum, and even then is not curved under tension before it is pierced! A total vacuum with such a large hole would be obvious. Thanks for bringing this to our attention.

[@andrewk8636]

It's possible they let air back in once it hits that tunnel so the suction doesn't pull it back any

[@old_seadog]

I can just imagine the sudden imbalance of a very high speed perfectly balanced rotor releasing a mass for which there is no compensating for in a simple rotating system firing the mass through a seal which induces a vacuum collapse in a huge void will be something to see if you enjoy watching massive catastrophic failures.

[@jimmatheson9125]

Its supposed to have a weight on the other arm that can somehow move to maintain balance fast enough for the thing not to do a "tombstone flip out" on itself

[@old_seadog]

@@jimmatheson9125 I had thought about a movable counterbalance, but the problem is the once the thing has been launched & the instant it becomes unbalanced, the forces & torques to correct the out of balance rotor by a counterbalance are going to be huge, especially so at such a high speed. Which says nothing about the sudden eccentricity on the rotor shaft which under those enormous forces & torques will destroy it almost instantly. It certainly would be worth watching. At a safe distance that is.

[@kurtilein3]

@@old_seadog You could release a counterweight at exactly the same moment, which would go through another seal opposite the first seal and just have it smack into a tunnel going down. That solves the imbalance issue. Not elegant, you need to figure out what to fill the bottom of the tunnel with so that it does not throw debris back up. Maybe have a vacuum in the tunnel as well so that air coming in through the broken seals helps suck junk into the tunnel instead of out of it. But elegant or not, they seem to have no solution at all.

[@ogi22]

@@kurtilein3 Actually, this could serve 2 purposes at the same time? A movable spin launcher to start digging big holes in the ground for hmm... oil search perheaps? or some geological tests? :D That counterweight could dig a pretty nice crater there if released :D

[@old_seadog]

@@kurtilein3 Like you said, it's a solution........ in real life though, I suspect this thing will never get built beyond the kid's toy it is now.

[@SpecialEDy]

Hey now. It works in KSP with the unbreakable joints and no crash damage cheats enabled...

[@peterpain6625]

My thoughts exactly ;)

[@marcelo.pastorelli]

lmao

[@exploatores]

I kind of think you still will. get a totaly random orbit and the craft spinning like crazy.

[@JohnDlugosz]

@@exploatores It can't be thrown into an orbit. It's thrown to a high altitude where the air is thin, and then the final stage rocket ignites.

[@zimtak6418]

Now that put a smile on my face.😆👍

[@owls6514]

It’s not actually a vacuum system. It’s more accurate to call it a high atmosphere system. The vacuum is to reduce friction, not to replicate space. It’s possible to go Mach 7 on earth due to said high atmosphere chamber. I must say this again; vacuum = no atmospheric burn up

[@canadianguy28]

Jonathan Yaney is probably besties with Elizabeth Holmes, Sam Bankman-Fried and Billy McFarland

[@jeffreyblack666]

Serial entrepreneur sounds like a fancy way of saying "give me lots of money to come up with ideas that will fail so I can move on to the next one"

[@RaspberryBang]

I gotta figure out how one gets in touch with the dumbass millionaires that invest in these middle school science projects. I've got medical bills I need to pay off.

[@Darkshizumaru]

More unicorn culture

[@unarmored9973]

"Serial Entrepreneurs" should probably stay away from really fast spinney things. I'm more impressed with the fact that they have the confidence to build the world's first hypersonic propeller, Oh god, can you imagine the sound? I mean, it's not like the atmosphere is just gonna wait patiently outside for the thing to stop spinning at mach 7.

[@Mehrunes86]

My Dewalt saw, got a breaking system, just scale it up🤔😂

[@arbitterm]

Not the first. The XF-84H was prop driven plane designed to break the sound barrier. The propeller gave off it's own sonic boom when it got up to speed. Ground crews nearby repeatedly fell I'll from the oscillations, and the sound was so deafening the plane earned the nickname "Thunderscreech"

[@unarmored9973]

@@arbitterm Yeah that thing is really cool, but that was a SUPERsonic propeller. They intend to get this thing to Mach 7 at the tip which is in the HYPERsonic regime. Some challenging issues at that speed.

[@citetez]

@@Mehrunes86 - "a breaking system..." - I think it's safe to say they've already achieved that particular goal.

[@Mehrunes86]

@@citetez Yep, imagine when the rotor destroys itself, all the people in controlroom below. Last witness is dead, bounty 0 gold😁

[@chocomojo9552]

Thunderfoot: destroying Bullsh!t, one company at the time.

[@deanwin9973]

just remember: escape velocity from earth 11.2 km/s - 40320 km/h, there is no way to fly at cosmos with 5000 mile/h with falling acceleration and speed through atmosphere

[@brandonjohnson8880]

There is a two stage rocket inside the projectile Einstein.

[@deanwin9973]

@@brandonjohnson8880 very big rocket carrying many fuel

[@fakshen1973]

So you instantly lose the counter-weight on a rotating arm moving at mach 7 at the tip as it suddenly hits air rushing in against it to fill the vaccum instantly to one bar. A sonic boom at seven times the speed of sound. The air will be compressing seven times faster on the arm and on the projectile.

[@NeverTalkToCops1]

1 millisecond! Tons of forces translating in 1/1000 second, like old 35 mm film camera shutters.

[@snfn7847]

Wouldn't it also become horribly out of balance? This was the first thing that gave me a big think

[@kniefi]

@@snfn7847 My guess is - at the proclaimed speeds they intend to reach - the whole thing would undergo a "rapid disintegration".

[@JohnDlugosz]

@@NeverTalkToCops1 dSLR cameras still do it. And they've gotten faster: X-sync speed is 1/250 second on even the cheapest focal plane shutters.

[@minerscale]

I still don't understand how the whole thing won't destroy itself the moment the launcher is fired. Unless the counterweight is also fired straight into the ground...

[@EnderCrypt]

this spin idea is the kind of thing you'd come up with as a 10 year old and think it'd be unbeatable

[@pierdzioszek]

@@katrinasinkins hey, it's an insult for the laudanum/opium to associate it in any way with these con-men and their ideas lol

[@knownas2017]

I actually created this design in KSP a long time ago. It wasn't very good.

[@sammie9999]

East German Olympic female hammer throwing gold medallist was the first to try this concept. Russia used a propeller and rubber band

[@daszieher]

Me and another nerd friend invented the variable camber wing profile as sophomores during history class back in the 80's. Of course we never followed it up and probably many others came up with the same idea before us. Point is: never discount the ingenuity of bored high school kids 😉

[@bsadewitz]

@@katrinasinkins Coleridge would slap you. 😆

[@AmxCsifier]

This video will either age very well or very badly, no middle ground

[@jesuss5721]

Well they already put a payload in orbit 5 monthes ago, this guy doesn't sound like someone knowledgeable on physics, but I don't know this channel I could be wrong. But he made a great advertisment either way

[@ryan_niemi]

@@jesuss5721 In orbit? Point to a news source that says this.

[@ryan_niemi]

@Zigest I'm not quite following. I just asked the other guy for a news source that says Spinlaunch put a payload in orbit.

[@electric7487]

It's aging quite well, despite some True Believers claiming otherwise.

[@j.brendenstookey3437]

My moneys on Spinlaunch succeeding….at mauling someone terribly.

[@calvindibartolo2686]

Whats really impressive that Kyle Hill pointed out is the fact that it didn't self destruct when the payload was released now that the balance was suddenly very different at ~150 RPM (for their test launch, apparently 450 is the planned max)

[@Dream146]

Yeah that's impressive, now all they have to do is scale it up to handle 50x the energy to do what they're advertising.

[@dimitar4y]

it needs to have two payloads released simultaneously, one heavy dud on the bottom end and the rocket on the main end. Otherwise this device would instantly self-destruct due to the imbalance.

[@satoau1]

yeah surprised me too. wanna know how they did that, or if they didn't and the machine was damaged by the counterweight suddenly having nothing to counter, how much damage was there?

[@dimitar4y]

@@satoau1 it was a planned expenditure, they got the marketing made, now they get the investors, grab the cash and run. Typical startup. All startups like this are money laundering scams lol

[@zwerko]

@@dimitar4y The device would instantly self-destruct (at the energies proposed) even with a perfectly executed equal payload released at the other end due to the sudden shedding of the weight-there is no rotor and there are no bearings (short of cryo-maglev) that we know of that would survive such sudden weight change at that loads, at those speeds.

[@HansLemurson]

The more time they spend saying all the reasons "Doing X" is a good idea, the more doubts you should have about whether they can achieve "X" at all. There's so many resources in space, our "hypersonic yeeting" system can't possibly fail!

[@allonyllc1879]

Lol hypersonic yeeting.

[@rupeshknn]

Well, they launched their 1st payload successfully 2 days ago! Kudos to them.

[@martintomasek6097]

They claimed to launch it to 10 km. While I have a hard time believing it, it is still not orbit height. Would love to find an updated debunking.

[@SemperBadBear]

​@@martintomasek6097 it's not supposed to launch equipment into orbit. rockets are still needed for the payload. but this drastically reduces the materials and cost of conventional launch methods. it also allows for rapid launch cadence.

[@sahar1213]

@@martintomasek6097 well, the goal is using electrical energy instead of chemical energy (from fuel) to provide energy to escape the earth's gravitational pull. this way, we can use better ways of producing the energy, such as solar, wind of nuclear. so even if it made it only some of the way, some fuel has been saved.

[@BruceWayne-jk1lr]

@@SemperBadBear Aren't artillery canons cheaper? I mean, those GPS guided excalibur shells handle those extra Gs pretty good. It hasn't rocket fuel tho.

[@luckysevenairammo1217]

@@sahar1213 Most rockets use hydrogen as fuel, pretty much the greenest fuel possible. This doesn't make sense, it's just a new mousetrap to sell.

[@amirhosseinshahriari7247]

With this thing spinning at very high speeds, This is just going to be a time bomb

[@SemperBadBear]

Just dropping by to say that, 10 months since this video posted, spin launch has passed a huge milestone by successfully test launching a piece of equipment from NASA. it is well beyond proof of concept at this point.

[@yesterdayschunda1760]

Lol? They did the same thing as this video with a small piece of equipment inside a solid steel missile shaped spike. The launch is even more wonky than the launch in this video

[@paulgallagher2937]

At a small fraction of the speed required. The forces and problems increase exponentially as speed increases.

[@ikillwithyourtruthholdagai2000]

@@paulgallagher2937 the growth may look expo but surely is not

[@pawelbrzozowski3899]

And they have launched it into space?

[@breakerboy365]

@@pawelbrzozowski3899 I believe their system was supposed to launch things into orbit, but no they haven't even gone that far.

[@jimmatheson9125]

Staying with battlebots, has anyone seen what happens when a large spinner becomes unbalanced? now imagine that thing bounding across the desert with no battlebox to contain it!

[@Vodhr]

Or better yet, imagine that spinner is heavy and large enough that it needs to be able to sustain the load of 200kgs in a centrifugal force outwards at 8000km/h... AND THEN imagine that shit hitting the, figurativley speaking, fan. XD

[@rcelyte]

Breaking news: giant spinning metal pole steamrolls city

[@tterrag1987]

@@Vodhr I'm hoping it hits the control building.

[@FEMBT-yb8rh]

*Valid point. It should be underground. The only place for it to go in a catastrophic failure event is upward.*

[@fact4fiction35]

I've been in the same room as a washing-machine sized centrifuge malfunctioning. I thought i was going to die.

[@elmartillo7931]

I've been an mechanical power engineer for 28 years, and I laughed so hard at this I made dolphin noises. Bravo sir another great debunk. And yeah apparently they didn't take grade 11 physics lol

[@elmartillo7931]

And what is the point of this in the first place? So they don't burn fossil fuels or some BS? It's ridiculous.

[@felixbonneau1834]

You don't even need to be a scientist to it is impossible

[@elmartillo7931]

@@felixbonneau1834 obviously, but the people working for the project think it's possible lol It's ridiculous

[@elmartillo7931]

@@felixbonneau1834 maybe if they just believe hard enough together, they can make their dreams come true like Disney told them lol

[@neonwired4978]

@@felixbonneau1834 except it isn't, it's a well know concept that's been tested. the science is absolutely spot on.

[@HIMPDahak]

where you are talking about the missile leaving the tube and tumbling, the thing you are tracking in the top down is the shadow. Which shows its tumbling, but it didn't come out sideways like that. Its actually hooking over the middle of the tube, indicating a late release. The missile is barely visible in the low quality visuals, but it is there.

[@owyx8608]

I just noticed, they use google chrome tabs to monitor all there data 9:06

[@renderproductions1032]

Thunder foot really is amazing. Also, I can’t wait for more updates about the sodium-fuel project.

[@carnaud]

Extracting sodium from sea water would create too much chlorine waste byproduct for it to be an environmentally sound proposition I think. Neat idea but, I don’t think it’s really feasible in a large scale.

[@carnaud]

@UCk9LPb7T_AHhIxjIcZ5ZnRw Exactly!

[@HanSolo__]

IIRC, it was meant to be a hybrid LPG/CNG-sodium engine, with not much of the Sodium needed.

[@GeeKayKayGee]

Update: Thunderf00t's sodium fuel concept will achieve mass adoption in the year 20never.

[@eyeCU13]

Out of all the scam projects lately, this is one of the most hilarious nonsense I've ever seen. Thanks for the laughs 😁

[@superchuck3259]

Rocket leaves the spinner and boom vaporizes. Like Magic!

[@AverageAlien]

this is the most sane actually, out of everything else

[@NeutralGenericUser]

Theranos literally stated that they could automatically medicate anyone through a tiny little device. Has anyone of the idiots who funded it seen how large a SINGLE gram of amoxicillin is? You sometimes have to take that 3 times per day for a week or more. There are just too many dumb people.

[@peterbrockhoff857]

@@NeutralGenericUser Are rising CO2 levels causing Idiocracy to come true? What the heck?

[@D.D.D.L.]

Is it nonsense I'd like to hear your expert opinion on why 🤣🤦🏽‍♂️, you got stocks in rocket fuels ?

[@Chumblybum]

2:49 The "I've had way too many mushrooms" expression

[@NormReitzel]

I've wondered what spinlaunch id going to do with the (conserved) angular momentum added by the centrifuge.

[@artbyty]

My first thought was about the G-forces applied to the delicate electronics of the satellite inside. I can't fathom how it would survive the spinning.

[@northernnaysayer1240]

To be fair, most mobile phones are rated to take the relevant g forces..... Scientific equipment though, I very much doubt will survive...

[@Darkshizumaru]

​@@northernnaysayer1240 Satellites have large, precision instruments meant for things like filming from space or communicating from space. Most rocket Engineers will tell you it's a miracle that a regular rocket doesn't spoil the payload. They were lucky that the mars rover was able to take the abuse and it's fairly well documented how satellites are built these days. It's not unreasonable to have a way to protect the cargo from lower speeds, but eventually the spinning force stops, rockets don't do that. You can prepare for the spin but then you lose the payload when it now must take the full force straight up.

[@minerscale]

did some quick maffs. If the spinner is really the height of the statue of liberty (93m) then the radius is about 46.5m. If the exit velocity is 2235.2m/s then the acceleration is 107443.42 (as per a = v^2/r). That's a G force of 10,952Gs. Is that a lot? Yeah probably, I'm not sure what that would do to a device. It would turn any living thing into goo though.

[@drscopeify]

@@minerscale Rocket launch is around 3G so 10,952 is a little bit more :)

[@artbyty]

@@minerscale Haha your math could be correct. Even if it was 20G it would seriously impact electronics and there is no doubt the forces would be astronomical. Pardon the pun.

[@miroslavhoudek7085]

I had this exact idea about 20 years ago with my friend, mechanical engineer. He then crunched the numbers quickly and we were instantly done with the idea. If you just came to Earth, you may be wondering why we are still poor while people who do not do their due diligence are getting rich of off it, but I've been to Earth my whole life and still can't quite explain it.

[@dwaynezilla]

reading this comment was a delight! Something about its pacing and delivery!

[@JellyJonesey]

Selling dreams to investors is how you make money. It just has to sound like it will work.

[@herbert164]

@@JellyJonesey i got my B.S. in BS and i am planning to go back for my masters

[@b.ghould8077]

I am absolute no technician. But is has something to do with literacy and hinduism. And communism has been quite literate in certain points.

[@Johnny2Feathers]

@@JellyJonesey yes like Tesla .. That’s how I made my millions 🤣

[@ryanroznowski2263]

working my life in a papermill that operates multiple 700 horsepower vacuum pumps just to make paper flat, you are always right about how much power it takes to make the vacuum these people want. it would take nuclear power plants to power hyperloop or multiple spin launch sites vacuum needs

[@BoatRocker619]

They raised 150 million dollar for this canon. Dumpster fire 🔥

[@christoucoucou69]

Saw the spinlaunch video today and was wondering if you were going to make a video about it . I’m not disappointed :) Thanks for the great content as always !

[@promufa]

Had the same thought as soon as I saw the article. This is most def. Thunderfoot material xD