Sports Science: Tests the benefits of doctoring a baseball

The Sports Science Team wants to know how much do "doctored" baseballs really break? Read about more amazing athletic feats: www.amazon.com/...

[@ChimpFromSpace]

Good example of an over produced video.

[@rbnzo25]

Exactly what my only takeaway was as well

[@Mafaldine]

So........obviously let's slap on 3 ounces of peanut butter? Cut out 15% of the ball itself? This is cartoonish. That's like testing downforce on the rear of a racecar by welding a half ton anvil to the back of the chasis.

[@stefangiudici5547]

So the idea was to test how much doctoring a baseball impacts breaking pitches by observing...fastballs?

[@nickw22689]

+Stefan Giudici Yeah they probably should have explained the difference between a 2 seamer and a 4 seamer to help those who are less educated about baseball

[@acsk.25]

Stefan Giudici I agree . Cause even though 2 seams move more it seems more ideal to test with a curve or slider

[@Cheesefist]

He actually throws a cutter, minor difference from a two seam, cutter is barely considered a fast ball

[@Slippindisc]

Stefan Giudici a scuffball is thrown like a fastball

[@desmondtoomer9517]

Austin Williams he throws a two seamer

[@DeepSkyObserver115]

I like how they get these actors in labcoats to make it seem "sciency."

[@NikkiKrissoff]

I feel like Greg from diary of a wimpy kid would say that It’s kind of a random thought

[@coreyrush8894]

Nikolette Krissoff you commented on a 3 year old comment

[@tomitstube]

@@coreyrush8894 is there a rule against commenting 3 years later?? and the idea george w. bush and donald trump could win the white house is PROOF america IS NOT the greatest country ever. we had some moments but it's over, the fat obese privileged white narcissist is singing.

[@coreyrush8894]

tomitstube no rule, not logical yes, and that’s an opinion based thing. I’m all in for trumps second term.

[@tomitstube]

@@coreyrush8894 have you started a hydroxychloroquine routine yet? you're not wearing masks amiright? trump doesn't… going to the beach and bars? getting out there and helping trump's stock market are you? sure hope trump starts up his rallies again, you going? i think you should, did you got to church again? so you think trump is just wonderful... how are you handling trump's re-opening, going to the beauty salon? curious.

[@skyy256]

That's almost 8 min of my life I'll never get back ...

[@jaedenbraga5098]

Thanks you saved me 6 mins

[@MrSpyman101]

Watching this in 2021, and it’s amazing how backwards they had this. Pitcher want the ball to stick, not slip. Crazy stuff.

[@dangelo1369]

Different side of the coin; now they want higher spin rates. That would suggest getting a tighter grip. I agree with the late Dr. Mike Marshall; what coaches should look for is a greater difference between the fast ball and the change up. That's what fools batters. Also important is pitch location. It's no accident that Greg Maddux was such a dominant pitcher despite having a below average fastball. He had command of his pitches and pinpoint control.

[@ccrespin34]

If they only knew they should've looked at spin rate instead of break!

[@spittindatruthaboutrecords9421]

@@ccrespin34 they knew,,,, they were keeping it a secret, tom house used pinetar ,sunscreen and rosin he was a junk ball pitcher back in the day,,, they didnt want to expose their secrets,,,,, smoke and mirrors

[@ccrespin34]

@@spittindatruthaboutrecords9421 spin rate wasn't measurable then the scientists looked at break in the ball. The real science was the spin. Spin rate is newer. Yeah they players then might have known ehat they were using it for in a sense of making a better pitch but not necessarily the specifics of spin rate.

[@spittindatruthaboutrecords9421]

@@ccrespin34 no spin rate wasnt a thing,you couldnt measure it,,, but using sticky stuff to make a ball break was, spitballs shineballs all have been around for 100 years, this show is making it look like putting substances on a ball wouldnt help,,, which is bogus considering tom house has used vasoline pine tar you name it, , why have pitchers been using pine tar on the ball for over 50 years? because it gave them ungodly breaking shit,,, yeah they couldnt measure it, but they could see a differnce in movement or the wouldnt have used it,,shit in the 90s i used pine tar in twilight league on my curve, slider and change up,,,, i knew it made my stuff break more,,,

[@1eaglesfan966065]

Lmao "is it worth it?" Idk let's ask Pineada hahahaha

[@lucashogberg9336]

Bryne Mumbauer 💀

[@Aaron-tu5lt]

💀

[@brendanbrunette5613]

Who’s here after the MLB began suspending pitchers for 10 games if caught using foreign substances?

[@juicemannkam]

Why u wanna fastball to break 8 inches?

[@yodakazam]

Because a pitch coming at 95 mph and moving 8 inches would be near impossible to square up on the bat. That's why when the ball hits the dirt the umps make sure the ball is thrown out and a new one is used

[@candykanefpv]

@@yodakazam you don't want a fastball breaking like that, you want it "floating" and not breaking, because a fastball imparts backspin on the ball. A cutter or sinker is what jake was throwing in this video.

[@jessicacasteel7778]

That what I'm aaying

[@pohorex6834]

@@candykanefpv a 4 seamer breaks up, resisting the force to move downward. The 2 seamer moves towards the throwing hand, while the cutter moves away from the throwing hand. A sinker moves down. All of these pitches are considered fastballs

[@dawgsfan1196]

Because if a fastball is flat, it'll get hit a long way

[@trevorhubbard6006]

They used way too much substances on the ball with Vaseline for example they should have put it on the bill of his hat then rub his fingers in it. Not to mention they should be testing this on breaking balls.

[@alloreverythinghistory4182]

Ten years after this was uploaded...

[@Folse]

Imagine casually watching a MLB game and all of a sudden peanut butter flies off the pitchers hand after a pitch lol

[@derekwalker4623]

They showed him with that cheese grater like 10 times!!! Why?

[@Greg-ys2gy]

Cause the cameraman found out Jake uses a cheese grater when rubbin 1 out...

[@KingBueno619]

It’s awesome that everyone are watching this in 2021 after Cole used spider tack

[@lukasbekcic]

I wanna see a video like this with spider tack

[@tuck1726]

You mean after every pitcher used sticky substances

[@CapNKevProduction]

It's actually a 2-seam fastball. They drop sort of like a 12-6 depending on the release angle of the pitchers arm. I can see how you'd think it's a curve, but the position of his fingers should have given away the pitch type.

[@sismaili31]

Jake Peavy seems like a cool dude

[@1234KeithB]

Not cool enough to say no to this lame video though

[@tankeater]

It's not the "turbulence"... It's the grip on a ball, making it spin faster. That's what causes the "turbulence" yes, but the spin could of gave us numbers. Not MUMBOturbulenceJUMBO

[@Kane-ib5sn]

I bet these guys don't even know the science behind how to optimize a 'dirty ball'...I'll break it down for y'all...a vaseline ball is going to slip; you'll get less grip, as evidenced above...and of little to no help. A scuff ball will slow down, and grip the air more; useful for curve balls, sliders, splitters, forks, and sinkers, two seam fastballs...Don't use for four seam fast balls. Use for knuckle balls.

[@cowboyvalley]

This was done way more for a TV audience that scientific results. It wasn't done well at all. Using too much "stuff" and why would you load up a fastball and risk losing control when you have a great fastball to start with. You'd use it on off-speed pitches. DUH.

[@davidluchsinger7377]

I thought the scuff helps them get a better grip so they can impart more spin, and more spins results in lower pressure along the bottom of the ball, causing it to drop more. No?

[@georgejetson3702]

How did they fit that in under eight minutes? They could easily have dragged it out into a 12 hour six part mini-series. Geeez...two thumbs way down.

[@robinaboy]

The fact pine tar wasn’t tested, or even spit, is why I downvoted this video. Ridiculous.

[@selahforever8388]

Dude there are sooooooo many uncontrolled variables in this experiment that I would most definitely label this as junk science. There are so many different things and ways guys using those substances manipulate the ball including the way the actual guy throws it. Even if nothing worked for him, which it would if they just didn't over exadurate the substances, it would work for a different pitcher. Height, pitch type, velocity and a million other things would change every single outcome.

[@adarmarcus7168]

I think I have a different perspective on this video having witnessed the whole foreign substance debacle a month or two ago- what is now widely known, but wasn't when this episode was published, is that the most effective way to doctor a ball is to increase spin rate, not vertical or lateral break. When a fastball is thrown, increased backspin will cause the ball to go straighter, not break more, hence why the peanut butter and many of theses substances actually reduce the break on the pitch. Were he throwing, say, a curveball, which relies on top spin to generate its movement, the sticky substances would have increased both his spin rate and break, making the pitch more effective.

[@Brockbuiltmore]

You know sports science is old when jake peavy is brought in

[@kalenbogart4482]

Why do they keep calling a wood rasp a cheese grater?

[@brendanstanford5612]

kalen bogart. Cause they arn't real men. They're a bunch coddled, wimpy city boys that doesn't know how to build anything

[@unclematt3]

Shook my head when he said that. I was also always taught that the goopy substances applied to balls were applied to do the same thing the rasp did, to disrupt airflow. If good can get you an extra 25% of deflection on a curve ball, that's huge. Putting all that Crisco on there so it would slip out of the pitcher's hand--how in the world is he supposed to goop all that crap all over the ball and keep it somewhat hidden? A tiny blob of Vaseline on the glove or on the pitcher's neck, though, would be enough to just slightly doctor a ball for one or two key pitches. For a story about doctoring baseballs to increase movement, the people who made this show have very little knowledge of how to doctor baseballs to increase movement.

[@InVivoRL]

Brendan Stanford true fake men spell aren’t properly and know what grammar is, they also have above a 1 GPA.

[@candykanefpv]

@@unclematt3 airflow and grip, the more spin the pitcher can impart, the more the ball breaks.

[@97_stepside87]

That’s one big cheese grater lol

[@jimscobie6646]

6:32 that is a curveball.

[@candykanefpv]

it's actually a slider...

[@cooperdec]

Slider

[@theofficiallongggchicken1734]

Echo shut the fuck up most of the time they are used interchangeably

[@theofficiallongggchicken1734]

Lil Coop same with you bub

[@jimscobie6646]

Still a curveball and not a fastball a year later too.

[@tomservo5347]

Get Gaylord Perry in there for some expert professional advice.

[@rjvsmb]

This only would be useful if you had Gaylord Perry showing how to do it and coaching a pitcher. Then you might have measurable results.

[@kevinmoore4887]

Gaylord Perry and a mechanical arm pitching machine.

[@collinrichardson1184]

So...how do they do this if it's a human as an independent variable?

[@mehoymenoy8841]

I wonder why they didn't use spider tack...

[@rayzr1120]

How about doctoring the ball in a way that can be done on the mound because I highly doubt you’ll be able to with a cheese grater in your pocket

[@StanleyMacel]

nail file will have a similar effect

[@joshuabarosin779]

Funny how they called a curve a fastball

[@judsss7960]

He is actually throwing curveballs for people who are less educated about baseball

[@aircrazy98]

2:31 We took our machete and made the ultimate "cutter" LOL

[@MrCaLiBoNeZ]

Ok... I laughed at "praise the lard." 😆

[@willer3399]

I would have found it funnier if they had used lard instead of shortening.

[@jsj297]

Maybe.....they should've had a pitcher known for their doctoring skills, maybe have gaylord perry moderate this experiment.

[@Redsoxking]

jsj297 or whitty ford

[@jsj297]

Redsoxking I didn't realize he was still around, good call!

[@dfgccgggff7963]

Why is this recommended to me now

[@baroqueguitarist5673]

I would love to see a study on old school methods like spitballs and the kind of doctoring gaylord perry was famous for. It seems pretty obvious thanks to spin rate what modern illegal substances like spider tac can do. I'm more curious about the older methods because I would imagine similar to corked bats alot of them weren't that effective other than giving pitchers additional mental confidence on the mound. Which I do believe a pitchers confidence must affect a pitchers numbers just on the pitch choices alone that would be different. Confident pitchers no matter there talent level choose there pitches and stragedy much differently which certainly has to have an effect. Confident pitchers attack hitters more. I would love to see a study on that. Confident pitchers going right after hitters vs non confident pitchers of the same talent levels pitching carefully around hitters and not challenging hitters that often. Honestly I'm not sure which style would be superior I guess it depends on the pitcher and there pitch selection, velocity and movement but my gut tells me going after hitters chancing a big hit over a large enough sample size gets more hitters out. I guess each situation could be different depending on the score, outs men on base and hitters history against a pitcher where the probability changes each batter. But since pitchers usually get batters out 7 out of 10 at bats making a 300 average top tier for hitters to me it makes sense to always go right after hitters.

[@connorsenne1056]

Why did you use fastballs???? TEST CURVEBALLS

[@ironboxfilms]

Where's the 'science' part in this video? ... wow. This video didn't educate whatsoever.

[@rixendaleykaaihue]

Magnus effect

[@JackRose113]

These videos are always so old

[@45BRush]

Shoulda been testing rpms 😂😂

[@spelunkerd]

Wait, a fastball backspin holds the ball higher for longer, so gravity induced break should be less if the spin is more effective, not more! If you're simply measuring break as the distance it moves downward, you're using the wrong test. Even if you're only measuring sideways break for his cutter, the test would be woefully difficult to perform with any kind of scientific accuracy. The only way to do this well would be to compare scattergrams with and without the scuff, and probably use a mechanical pitching device to minimize the pitch to pitch variance.

[@GVGames1986]

Just FYI. Cricket is England's version of Baseball and with a cricket ball bowlers often rub the ball on the left or right white trouser leg, or sometimes a pieace of fabric tucked into their trousers. Because most cricket is played in all white uniform. Oftentimes the bowlers have red marks where they were shining te ball (cricket ball is red). That is legal, what is illegal is messing with stitches, picking at them with the thumb. Some people have even been caught with small strips of sandpaper within the palm of their hands. Cheating sucks, although it can be entertaining to hear about cases of it.

[@gradyjones7017]

If they insisted on measuring fastballs instead of breaking pitches (which would be a better experiment), why would they measure it to the glove side? He’s not throwing a cutter, he’s throwing a 2 seam, which is supposed to be break to the glove side, so what are they talking about?

[@RustyBeez]

Ummm.. everyone knkws pinetar and sticky substances are the best. Why were they literally using the opposite on everything but the file? 🤷‍♂️

[@trollerskater]

Why did they dismiss lard ball? If you go from seeing fastballs with 4 inches of break to all of a sudden having no break, that's huge. Especially if they're slower, which makes you think breaking ball, then you get no break at all. Seems like the perfect changeup. Lard ball! Lard ball!

[@DLeethal22]

how about making the ball sticky and maybe using the cameras to get a RPM haha. SPIDER TAC BABY

[@maitland1007]

This was a cool idea but they totally wasted the opportunity for a good video by doing silly stuff and being very vague about pitch types- (topspin fastballs?) Too bad. I'd love to see a realistic version of this, given the new substance enforcement rules.

[@bryanwinchell8065]

Tim Wakefield throws a knuckleball...calls it a slip pitch curve.

[@ross121111]

When be throws the ball cut by the machete it looks like it could be a lethal delivery in cricket

[@FrankB69]

ross121111 I was think that! you would have to get Forward and play Straight

[@harrisonbaylor1432]

Spitball breaking 3 1/2 inches less would actually be good for the pitcher. The hitter is going to naturally anticipate the ball to drop some but when it hardly drops at all they will be swinging under the ball.

[@MBerish]

11 years later you should have been using sticky substances not slippery substances. More rpm=more movement.

[@tjhancock85]

I fell dumber after watching this...sports science or Nickelodeon

[@jameswestman6243]

I love they put a half a can of peanut butter on it & say it doesnt help.. like no shit. You put enough peanut butter to make sandwiches for a week & enough lard to make a slip n slide.. like cmon man these pitchers are trying not to get noticed, not blind the batter with peanut butter or lard. Awful example

[@stewartj3407]

This could’ve been a good episode if they wouldn’t waste time on stupid stuff, and used real life stuff like pine tar and explained where the ball is scuffed and how it works.

[@marcorubio3496]

some are just unrealistic like using a machete to cut open a ball. The cheese scrapper is more near to scoffing the ball. All of these have been illegal almost 100 years ago. Including the spitball.

[@tannermartin3103]

This was dumb. Would have been good if they’d actually used substances that are practical to use while pitching in a game

[@daltontannery3243]

Damn you people in the comments are salty as fuck, my first thought was "an 8 inch break is the exact same as a 12 to 6 curve that's a hell of a pitch."

[@ben-jam-in6941]

Sticky stuff not slippery stuff. Pitches that actually move a lot not fastballs and then you got a show.

[@tylermabey3828]

Why wouldn’t they test a slider or a curve? They could have gotten really creative and tried some really odd pitches instead of jut a peanut butter fastball

[@1shotpro69]

Never heard of vaseline, they want it sticky not slippery

[@davidtieman4102]

This is why the emery ball is illegal and used only reportedly for one season only, 1914.

[@giannitesta3955]

I must have missed the part were they “tested the Benefits of decorating a baseball”

[@tomitstube]

i'd hate to think a 95 mph fast ball with 4 inch movement wouldn't be enough.

[@AGrrrr10]

This is why ANY foreign substance is against the rules of baseball

[@jacobsimmons2212]

What started out as a very promising video, just turned out to be absolutely silly

[@captlucky2320]

Pitcher throws pitch ask for a new ball, pitcher throws pitch hitter hits it and pitcher keeps ball in play always wondered why

[@tysonrinker5958]

Why dont you do this and throw some actual breaking pitches. What the hell

[@brandonyankees1]

This segment was so bad. Jake was throwing like half effort too

[@user52210]

1:54 he froze, my guy hasn't moved for 40 minutes

[@gratefulkyle1]

This is stupid. Cause they soaked it in peanut butter and crisco. How about less

[@Lanse1984]

Feel like this was sponsored by MLB to make this seems like a joke

[@il-sungkim9096]

And he's legally blind.

[@cupofjoe2988]

I wish they would have used pine tar to see if that did anything

[@UnderGun81]

There are so many wrong this with this video...

[@llopresti5679]

Now want if you get someone to throw a breaking ball

[@matsujonen]

No one is going to put that much goop on a ball

[@stephenkaake7016]

Pitchers want RPM, and the way to get that is with Sticky Substances, if the ball is slick its hard to control

[@aquarium4812]

nobody knew about spin rate at this time

[@lllllllllllllllII]

Why does he want his fastball to break at all

[@dfgccgggff7963]

The more it breaks, the more likely batters will miss

[@benflikeid962]

No pine tar or curveballs? What a waste

[@zacharypool]

Trevor Bauer proved t works, it's worth it, and that nobody really cares. Kinda sucks but what can you do.

[@freddycalipari4242]

Pitchers were doctoring balls before Bauer he just highlighted what’s going on

[@killerhawks]

11 years later... turns out to be so wrong..

[@AdamS-ut6df]

This video is very relevant right now.

[@LeaveChrisAlone18]

Alright guys we are getting somewhere

[@vektacular]

Try something sticky…not slick

[@jessicacasteel7778]

You don't want your fast ball to brake

[@MVJ1990]

There's no way you can hit a 95 mph curveball...

[@almondjoyt7522]

Martin Vazquez yeah he throwing fastballs

[@brooklynnevillanueva1090]

Who else here cuz of class? Lol just me ok

[@zackgimon9693]

Listen to 2:56 with your eyes closed

[@johnbee6035]

cmon a little vasline not a whole jar

[@goodness6664]

Wow this video didn’t age well

[@tyg.1260]

“The Peanut Butter Ball, one of the greatest pitches ever thrown. It doesn’t move the ball at all, in fact it’s just a little snack for when the pitcher gets hungry.” Anyone sound how stupid this episode is?

[@sk33t_38]

why tf would they test this with a 2 seamer and not a curve or slider

[@Angebro]

Way more consistent

[@doctorstrainlove6318]

Wheres the spider tact wtf

[@gameislife3081]

Horrible waste of time

[@juangotti7]

spider tack anyone

[@liamlaidlaw4464]

Lol he’s got an A200

[@Schebeeeeezy]

Is this propaganda?