STAR TREK DS9 6x13/6x14 Far Beyond the Stars + One Little Ship REACTION!! FIRST TIME WATCHING!

[@MrDeathpilot]

Aww, Ollie! You completely missed Nog as the paperboy at 3:48 😂

[@trekkiejunk]

Hey, i was convinced he was going to miss ALL of them. The fact that he actually got everyone else made me happy.

[@SquiresIsle]

There's a reason Far Beyond the Stars is always in the conversation for "best episodes of Trek ever." I think it's exactly what Roddenberry was trying to do when he made the show. The compromises he was forced to make in order to push the envelope of what was possible. It's a masterpiece.

[@markbade565]

@@SquiresIsle agreed. It is easily my no.1 episode of deep space 9 followed by in the pale moonlight. That scene of benny breaking down will always make me tear up and leave me speechless

[@samuraiwarriorsunite]

When Avery Brooks was on the floor sobbing uncontrollably and the director yelled cut, he kept going. Nana Visitor said Sometimes as an actor you get so wrapped up in your role that it ceases to become acting, and when you're in the moment, nothing else matters. It's my second favorite episode of the entire franchise. The first, also comes from DS9, involving the father-son relationship, enough said.

[@sarcasticstartrek7719]

It was Nog at the beginning selling the paper...

[@adamplace1414]

Far Beyond The Stars is one of those magic episodes that is so perfect and compelling, you forget how badly wrong it *could* have gone. And if they'd handed the reins to any other director it might have. The amazing double of acting and directing Avery Brooks displays here, to me, make it in my highest top tier of any Star Trek episode ever.

[@BillinHungary]

Nana Visitor said that Avery Brooks almost morphs into his character when he is acting . and she said they were worried when "Benny" was having his nervous breakdown - they were worried that he might actually be having one! Also, Armin Shimmerman (Quark) said that he was uncomfortable being without his make-up on! He feld unclothed..

[@Joy1904]

tell that Principal Snyder from Buffy;)

[@kennethspears22]

You be happy to know even Morn(Frank) was one of the people sitting at the restaurant.

[@1978rharris]

Sorry. Morn played by Mark Allen Shepherd does NOT appear in this episode in or out of make up.

[@kennethspears22]

@@1978rharris Okay I thought I read an article stated the actor appeared in without makeup. This was years ago.

[@johnheale6000]

chatGPT Obviously it's not always correct but here it is Yes, in the Star Trek: Deep Space Nine episode "Far Beyond the Stars" (Season 6, Episode 13), Mark Allen Shepherd, who played Morn, appears out of his usual makeup. In this episode, many of the DS9 cast portray 1950s-era human characters in a story set outside their usual sci-fi roles. Shepherd appears as a staff member at the office where Benjamin Sisko’s alternate persona, Benny Russell, works, allowing viewers to see him without Morn’s distinctive alien prosthetics. It’s a rare treat, as he’s almost always seen as the silent Lurian in the series.

[@TroyConvers5000]

3:44 the cover of the magazine is a matte painting from the TOS episode 'Court Martial'.

[@ShalooNoir]

Far Beyond the Stars is one of my absolute favorite episodes. Even 25 years later, it still hits.

[@JohnSmith-rm1po]

The way Douglas does his job of defending and enforcing an unjust status quo really reminds me of Odo during the occupation.

[@MrJerks93]

Great performances all around. Douglas is kind of a thankless job, as he doesn't have a hero turn within the narrative. Rene nailed it though. His avoidance of eye contact when he fired Benny was great work.

[@joonaa2751]

Implicitly why Benny models Odo after him

[@zatoichi1]

All the characters were subtle reflections of how Benjamin views them in the "real" world. Consciously and subconsciously.

[@markbade565]

8:43 when i saw this episode back in the day my mom was in the room. She would sometimes watch tng and ds9 with me and became familiar enough with the characters. She has fun seeing the actors out of makeup. When Michael Dorn stepped into the diner, she asked who that was. I told her Worf, and she said incredulously: "THAT'S WORF? BUT HE'S SO HANDSOME!!" 🤣

[@JohnSmith-rm1po]

"Far Beyond the Stars" rightfully gets a lot of praise for the way it handles racial issues, but I've always also been impressed with how accurately it portrays the mania of inspired artistic creation.

[@jondbm]

So funny seeing Ollie take ages to notice most speaking roles are existing characters.

[@antarfodoh]

These DS9 reactions are one of the few genuine joys in my life right now 🖖❤

[@reggiebrown9508]

There's one reactor still going thru Next Gen and I hope they continue to DS9. And another reactor that just finished Next Gen series and movies and now doing Abrams Trek start doing DS9.

[@benprowett9155]

Far Beyond The Stars goes hard, man! It goes old school Star Trek and delivers a dose of truth about us all! See the faults within us all and be better than that!

[@markbade565]

13:22 not really a spoiler because it never happened, but the showrunners of ds9 heavily considered and wanted ds9 in the end to actually be Benny Russell's dream. But the producers at Paramount absolutely wouldn't allow it. And i kinda aee their point. If ds9 was a standalone then it works, but it would have gutted TOS, TNG VOY, et al.

[@theadamabrams]

Yeah, if it weren't a Star Trek show but rather an unaffiliated sci-fi series, that could have been a cool ending. Very glad they did _not_ actually do that for DS9.

[@rocketdave719]

I'm relieved the powers that be nixed that idea. With the exception of Newhart, I don't think the "it was all a dream" ending is ever a good way to finish a TV show. Obviously, it's all fiction, but to say that ever within the Star Trek universe, Star Trek isn't real, is a depressing message to send the fans who have devoted year to following these adventures.

[@antoinetteserrano3082]

You didn’t recognize Nog (the newspaper boy) in the beginning of Sisko’s transition into the past. 🫨

[@JustBen81]

Kira's character was loosely based on the writer D. C. Fontana who wrote (among other things) for Star Trek (mostly the original and the animated series but also a couple of TNG episodes and one DS9 episode). Like Kira's character she went by her initials to hide the fact that she was a woman and get her work published.

[@exhistoriascientia]

Each of the writing/editorial staff at the magazine is loosely based on real-life science fiction writers from the 1930s-1960s. Nana Visitor's (Kira) character is based on Dorothy "D.C." Fontanta. Colm Meaney's (O'Brien) character is based on Isaac Asimov. Rene Auberjonois' (Odo) character is based on John W. Campbell. Armin Shimmerman's (Quark) character is based on "The City on the Edge of Forever" writer Harlan Ellison.

[@kathyastrom1315]

She’s also inspired by CL Moore, one of my favorite SF writers. She started out writing by herself, then after marrying Henry Kushner, they worked together, just like the Kira and Bashir characters do here.

[@tofersiefken]

Two very fun episodes. One focuses on the "writing" from a literal standpoint. The other is "Honey, I shrunk the franchise", or a "Fantastic Voyage" (1966) throwback.

[@jasoncaldwell5627]

I actually had that voice thing happen to me! I was at a small convention that was to have Nana Visitor (Kira) and Casey Biggs (Damar) as the guests but weather sucked and both guests were running a bit late. I started shopping for models at the dealer tables and wondering if I'd have to leave for work before meeting the guests when that "Damar" voice piped up from the guy standing right next to me! He had blonde hair! I was floored. Very cool guy though. I had to leave soon after but I got to hold the door open for Nana Visitor as she was coming in and she gave me that big smile of hers...(WOW.)

[@chrisfraser5088]

Avery Brooks, man…. 👏👏👏 What an actor! Most of the DS9 crew’s alternate egos were actually based on real life people. Can you figure them out? 😏

[@cecil80]

Im sure you’ve been told this already, but there is a documentary about this show called What We Left Behind, where they bring back the cast and some crew to talk about the different things that happened during the show. In the episode Far Beyond the Stars, some of the cast (i believe it was kira or dax) said that when they called cut on the scene of Benny's breakdown, Avery brooks kept laying on the floor crying for like 10 minutes after that scene. It takes a special kind of actor to get that deep into a performance. And they also address the amount of criticism the show got during this time, not just for being serialised (which they had to fight for) but also for having prominent black characters. I would highly recommend you check out the documentary once you have finished the show! It really digs in deep to the show, and its really nice to see the cast come back together. Also, love your reactions as always! I wish more people our age watched this show lol

[@VolrinSeth]

Far beyond the stars is a gem.

[@Bobishkisan]

Another "little" gem of a reaction. Thank you so much, and I hope you and all your family have a lovely festive season.

[@tofersiefken]

There actually was a television series from the late '70s to the early '90s, (13 seasons in all), that did turn out to be just a dream. It was hugely popular and a several iconic figures emerged from the cast of actors / characters.

[@crownprincesebastianjohano7069]

*_St. Elsewhere_* I believe. It turns out, since many shows occurred in the *"Tommy Westphall Universe"* (played by TNG guest-star Chad Allen 'Jono'), that many shows in the 80s and 90s were just part of a dream.

[@jbdragon3295]

How about Dallas? The whole season was a dream. The whole Who Shot J.R.? in 1980. It was a huge deal back then that I still remember it as a young kid. Around 6th grade. Go Google it. You’ll see magazine covers and stiff all about it.

[@sarcasticstartrek7719]

I like how there's a super heated gas/plasma a few inches from the warp core and the only thing between it is a 1mm plating with a hinge on it. This is why consoles explode - literally, this is the reason - they run high powered plasma all over the place with no circuit breakers.

[@MrJerks93]

Ensigns are cheaper to replace than a full fleet redesign.

[@SB0780]

Far Beyond the Stars blew my mind when I saw it at age 17 when it first came out. To this day, remains the most powerful episode of television ever.

[@607995]

been waiting for Far Beyond the Stars!!

[@jeffd.6498]

I love that O'Brien likes robots.

[@jasoncaldwell5627]

Maybe his novel was about Data.

[@pierrevaillancourt1803]

No shots Oliver we all remember the Batman and Robin reaction

[@tofersiefken]

Ollie is going to kick himself for not catching Nog at the beginning of the episode at the magazine & newspaper kiosk. (RIP Aron Eisenberg.)

[@Raitdj]

Far Beyond the Stars really shows what a great actor Avery Brooks is! And I really like how Worf is trying to flirting with Kasidy Yates in this episode but still respects Sisko and never crosses the line 😄

[@derekwhittom1639]

The Prophets work in mysterious ways. Many events that happen in the backstory “before” Emissary 1&2, actually happen as a consequence of The Prophets learning of linear time (and the outside universe) when they first meet Sisko. This was made somewhat apparent in Accession.

[@gregsaum1701]

Not sure if you caught that the paper boy was played by Aron Eisenberg (Nog)

[@RolyPolyOllieReactions]

I didn't!

[@filigrant]

In "Far beyond the stars" it's so fun how they've switched everyone's characters into the opposite of what they usually play... Quark brave and outspoken - never saw that coming

[@auntvesuvi3872]

Thank you, Oliver! 🖖

[@skywaymanaz]

There is a great novel I came across during the pandemic. Ironically it was flying off the digital shelves then. A pandemic wipes out 99%+ of the population within weeks. The main male character has Dutch ancestry. He meets a woman he falls in love with on a winter day seeing smoke from another chimney. She couldn’t understand a man like him could love her because of her skin. It was so vague the way it was mentioned I thought she was implying she was too old for him. Then near the end as the main character nears death he has a thought. That one day he and his late wife will be a legend. A white father and a black mother and how they raised their children. I was stunned reading that line. This was published in 1949!!! That is crazy it even got published. There were hints some other members of the community that came together in Berkeley were Asian. A line mentioned the children sometimes played mahjong. That wouldn’t have raised many eyebrows. But can you imagine how racists would react to this white man and his black wife repopulating the world. I’m sure the publisher had to have made demands to sneak that in as subtlety as possible. Just like in this DS9 episode. The novel is called Earth Abides. It is currently under development for a streaming adaptation. Maybe you can review it.

[@ThomasReeves-s7u]

And I'm almost completely unsurprised to see the show get a comment online calling it "woke" or "pushing an agenda" because it has an interracial couple. But yeah it was really bold to do that in 1949. California had only legalized interracial marriage in 1947 I believe. Oh and despite the reputation it has now California had lots of Anti-Asian sentiment too. Its previous laws against interracial marriage said (and forgive this but it's the language they used) "All marriages of white persons with negroes, Mongolians, members of the Malay race, or mulattoes are illegal and void". Mongolians was an old-time word for East Asians.

[@jonbolton3376]

Two great episodes i love. One Little Ship is one of my favourite 5 of DS9.

[@MrTbk1701]

As someone who always loves to build models One Little Ship is always fun because you always want to be there flying it around. On a different note Beyond the Stars……such a beautiful story. This episode is one of the reasons I love Star Trek. 🖖

[@heather9857]

Far Beyond the Stars is such ballsy TV, love it.

[@quoniam426]

Ah Far bzyond the Stars where you see every usually make up actor without make up. Very well written episode. One Little Ship is so fun. That mini Runabout throwing mini quantum torpedoes at the Jem'Hadar is so fun to watch.

[@kathyastrom1315]

Kira’s alternate character in FBTS is partially based on one of my favorite classic-era SF writers, CL Moore. I highly recommend two of her short stories, Shambleau and Black God’s Kiss. The latter is the first sword-and-sorcery work to feature a woman as the main character.

[@ThomasReeves-s7u]

Vintage Season I remember as awesome too though her husband may have co-written it.

[@ThomasReeves-s7u]

Far Beyond the Stars is one I was waiting for you to see. Cirroc Lofton (Jake) I think indicated, in retrospect, that they maybe should have set in the then contemporary 1990s as setting in the fifties could maybe make the audience feel too comfortable about this being "past times." Still I'm glad they didn't for the other aspect of it. I was subscribed to Asimov's Science Fiction Magazine at the time and I'd read some about the history of Science Fiction magazines. Seeing "Galaxy" magazine be mentioned in a TV show made me squeal a bit. This isn't particularly accurate to how magazines worked even then, but it was just neat seeing anything like the world of classic science fiction authors be visualized. A few things on that Colm Meaney is presumably a bit like Asimov as he writes about robots, but Asimov I think had very much overcome his shyness by the time of his mid-20s. He was kind of fresh even or as we would call it now a sexual harasser. (One of my favorite writers, but doesn't mean he's one of my favorite people.) Meaney's character is a bit of a sweetheart. Unlike what it says there were women writers, using their own name, in 1950s science fiction. However with some exceptions, like Katherine MacLean, women science fiction writers often got relegated to more "women stories" if they used their own feminine name. Stories of mothers, teachers, and the like. If they wanted to do something more action or techie it helped to have a name that wasn't as feminine, like Leigh Brackett, or use initials (C.L Moore, DC Fontana), or just use a man's name. Like I said Katherine MacLean, who did fairly sciency stories with a female name, was an exception and there were maybe others. So it's not an absolute, but pretty common then. Armin Shimmerman, who is very Capitalist in real life and plays Quark, amusingly plays a Left-wing writer accused of being "a Red." Although a good deal of science fiction writers were Libertarian or Right-wing there was a surprising number who were Trotskiyites and Socialists. In the 1930s and 1940s The Futurians fan-group contained many who flirted with Communism though it also had some more conservative members like James Blish. (It's okay if people know none of the names I'm mentioning, but I'll mention that Blish has relevance to Trek as he wrote one of the first Star Trek novelizations. Or maybe the first.) I think we are supposed to take the writer Siddig plays as being a white guy. That feels a little weird, but my memory is there is no concern about his ethnicity. When in reality I think part-Sudanese or Arabic writers were basically non-existent in the magazines of this era. Speaking of there have been Black people writing science fiction since the 19th century, but so far as I know there wasn't a notable Black author in the science fiction magazines until the mid-1960s. I know of an interracial couple, Black husband, who were active in fandom in the 1950s but science fiction was mostly White and Jewish at this time. By the 1950s you had more "liberal" magazines, like Galaxy and FSF. I don't think they would have objected to a Black character running a space station. So the attitude is maybe a shot at a controversial editor named John W. Campbell. Campbell I think is a bit too lambasted now, but he did have attitudes that were odd or even offensive even by the standards of the 1950s. He toyed with the idea that slavery, of any race, might be good or natural. That people below a certain IQ might not be truly human. That racial integration was a bad idea. And that Dianetics, which became Scientology, was going to change the world. Would Campbell have objected to a Black space captain? I actually feel like "no", I think he let Asimov have Black characters, but I think he would maybe have preferred Black characters not be "too Black." Like you briefly have a physical description indicating Sisko is Black and that's it. The episode was maybe a bit "ahead of its time" in how it indicated his white-allies don't exactly understand what he's going through. Although unlike some modern stories they don't indicate that makes them bad or anything. They're good friends who want to help, they're just not going to entirely understand it the way a Black person would. That idea was out there in the 1990s, but I think it was seen as a bit "militant" by some to have a Black character basically tell his white-ally (because Siddig's character I think is coded white here) to shut-up. Boy I sure did go on! I didn't even get to "One Little Ship" which was cute. Or how I briefly was like "Kids don't know American history these days" to myself and then remembered Ollie's Canadian.

[@wrorchestra1]

An elder Jem'Hadar would be at least 20 years old. It is mentioned in "To The Death".

[@marydodsonmt]

There was a movie from the 1960s called Fantastic Voyage in which some scientists shrunk down in a ship and entered the body of another scientist to prevent him from dying of a blood clot. It might make for an interesting reaction.

[@peterjohnson1091]

Avery Brooks was utterly magnificent in this episode.

[@sarcasticstartrek7719]

Worf's "small" comment was about his willy. There's one in Star Trek Nemesis as well.

[@MatthewBluefox]

It's REEEEAL! =D

[@JohnSmith-rm1po]

I cree-AYT-ed it! And it's REEAL!! 😭

[@MrDeathpilot]

KHAAAAAAAN!

[@jpwphoenix1701]

Two of my favourite episodes of the season, especially the first one. It still remains one of the all time best episodes of Trek. While it’s obviously cool seeing the actors out of their usual character makeup, it’s more important and powerful for the social commentary (not just for racism but also communism and sexism too). Avery Brooks pulled an absolute blinder of an episode, both as actor and director. The breakdown at the end is still absolutely gut-wrenching and a massive tearjerker. 👏😭

[@randallwong7196]

"I could beam a bubble of compressed air in front of you, then it would expand to fill the housing' Science wins again

[@haloboy456]

You might be the first KZbinr so far that I've encountered to react to this episode far beyond the stars. I don't know if anybody else has reacted to the whole of DS9 for example and has thrustly done so, but I very much appreciate this. Frontier that you're forwarding and no less these hallmarks of the franchise one that I exposed morality for all sentient life forms far before modern decries of wokeness

[@sarcasticstartrek7719]

"How can he be a writer, he can't even speak" - woah, as an up coming teacher, think hard about that. I know you don't mean it, but people with disabilities can write perfectly well. Maybe his character is shy or has ADHD and can't find the right words.... That cut hard.

[@607995]

beethoven composed when he couldnt hear!

[@VolrinSeth]

In fact writing is often a way for people to communicate who struggle with verbal communication.

[@heather9857]

I've found it works out better in life if you believe people mean what they say. Every so often you're pleasantly surprised that they didn't.

[@ThomasReeves-s7u]

That hit me too a little, but I agree that he probably just wasn't thinking much. And I could sort-of see if a guy is that nervous he might have trouble making it in the industry. Or maybe be the kind who uses a pen-name and does not interact with other writer. (Several science fiction writers did not want to interact with "science fiction people" as they feared the fandom might be weird, invasive, or they were just private people that would have disliked any kind of fandom of anything.)

[@EricGregory-b7j]

I think in the pale moonlight is my favourite DS9 episode once you see it you will love it to

[@JustBen81]

I hope this isn't considered a spoiler since it's an idea they didn't follow up: They actually considered ending the show with an aged Benny russell on the set of the TV-show. I'm not sure how serious they where and I'm glad they didn't do it. But you where into something with your comment. As for the Deep Space 9 writing process wit a black captain: The show wasn't pitched with a black Commander. Avery Brooks just got cast and I was that moment the Commander became black.

[@BEBruns]

At one point they considered casting Alexander Siddig as Sisko after seeing him in a British TV production about Lawerence of Arabia. Then they found out how young he actually was.

[@joeeyaura]

far beyond the stars is one of those great episodes, and not just a one off that doesnt connect to the greater story either. we dont know it yet, but it fits in. i bet its real fun for the actors to get out of their characters too, just like the mirror universe episodes/

[@williamjackson6705]

I wished Roddenberry could have seen "Far Beyond the Stars". He would have loved it. And yes, this was reality for Black Americans in the pre-Civil Rights era. This would have been the 1950s. And Avery Brooks is a singer. An Operatic Bass-Baritone. He even appeared in an opera written about Malcon X in the title role.

[@sarcasticstartrek7719]

Brooks is a semi professional jazz singer / composer IRL. Watch some interviews with him some time - he's also a bit... um... "coocoo".

[@TroyConvers5000]

Or maybe you're talking with your mask off.

[@ThomasReeves-s7u]

"Coocoo" feels a bit harsh but plenty of jazz artists are a bit eccentric. Yusef Lateef, Sun Ra, Thelonious Monk, Rufus Harley, Pharoah Sanders, etc. Or educators for that matter. He is a highly educated man and looks to be "the first African American to receive an MFA in acting and directing from Rutgers". I think it says he is still associated to Rutgers.

[@jasoncaldwell5627]

Far Beyond The Stars really gave all the actors a chance to stretch their creative legs a bit and become entirely new characters. It's a bit of a shock to see it the first time. One little Ship for me is a fun episode but kinda a clunker. Probably the episode I'd rate lowest of the season. The big moment, story wise, is the introduction of the Alpha Jem Hadar. Interesting that such a homogeneous species still has this almost tribal need to divide into rival groups.

[@josephwongjr617]

Best trek of all time if ya ask me

[@wrdreacts4247]

two great episodes! Social commentary like that has always been the core of Trek. Avery's acting in this is so amazing. I've frequently quoted the "it's real" scene, usually not as serious...lol. The emotions played by Avery and Patrick Stewart in TNG, so incredible. (semi spoiler for other Treks: I haven't yet decided if I'm glad Janeway doesn't get these emotional scenes..... The emotion of TNG and DS9 are so good, and Discovery's emotions just aren't played as well.) And then Nog and Worf...lol! Too bad you cut out the rest of the scene after the Nog covers for Worf's poem, my favorite scene. lol! One Little Ship is probably my most rewatched episode of DS9.

[@empirejeff]

I have fought the good fight, I have finished the race, I have kept the faith.

[@tofersiefken]

Admiral Cartwright / Joseph Sisko. Who said there is no reincarnation in the Trek cinematic universe?

[@silikon2]

One of the best things about DS9 is they really started to let their hair down in the final seasons.

[@sarcasticstartrek7719]

Sadly the Alpha vs Gamma thing is never mentioned again :(

[@brooos]

The "dream" looks like it was in the 1950's or earlier.

[@ThomasReeves-s7u]

The reference to the death of Stalin means it's 1953 or later, but I do think it's probably the 50s rather than 60s.

[@takerdust]

I remember reading somewhere it was supposed to be around 1960-61. Doo-wop music was a popular genre for several years by then.

[@takerdust]

That episode should have been at least 2-parter, or maybe even 3.

[@marcushart3360]

Fbts is set around 1930s not 60s

[@C76Caravan]

It's 50s because of the cars, and because a newspaper is shown in the show (made it even in Ollie's cut at 4:48) mentioning "Reds (Soviets) test H-Bomb" which took place on 22.Nov.1955 (en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/RDS-37)

[@martinfehringer6408]

@@C76Caravan I wonder how you not can tell a decade seeing all the cars and hairstyles ^^ It's so obvious this is the 50s And I was born 79 :)

[@martinfehringer6408]

Brooo a fly does not perceive time moving slower because it is tiny! A fly just has another image processing rate and quicker reflexes.

[@majkus]

When the shrieking class scream about how Trek has 'gone woke' recently, they show how little they know of the show.

[@antoinetteserrano3082]

@@majkus TRUTH

[@corneliusoverton2617]

The difference is not so much the message, but the quality. Nobody really complained about Sisko back then, because DS9 was awesome. The awesomness outweighed the preachiness. Now, when a modern movie or TV show fails, the producers blame it on racism rather than the fact that their writing sucks. The more "woke" they make a movie, the more excuses they have for when it fails, and it becomes a self-perpetuating cycle.

[@silikon2]

@@majkus No, while Trek always had the occasional woke-ish eps. The complaint against nuTrek shows has been they’re completely driven by woke and in such a heavy handed way they’re impossible to criticise without sounding cist or phobe or whatever. TOS had many woke-ish elements- quite noticeably with the main crew- but still had a great variety of stories. For the most part, it addressed issues in nuanced and abstract ways… though, lol, “Let That Be Your Last Battlefield” being one of the least nuanced in Trek history. TOS and TNG era Trek usually avoided being so on the nose by using allegorical framing to raise issues. An entire series being on the nose woke removes any possible discussion and comes across as some sort of preachy leftist Sunday school. This episode allows at least a bit of critical discussion for this ep though because it’s allegorical, if a bit heavy handed. For example, why is it considered so outrageous for a magazine to cater to a specific audience? I completely disagree this ep is woke though. I do think it’s a bit too on the nose and over the top. However, that does at least work perfectly in universe because The Sisko is having a vision after all.

[@silikon2]

@@majkus And btw, even Let That Be Your Last Battlefield was allegorical, albeit way on the nose. One race is black on one side of the face and white on the other and vice versa. (And if you haven’t seen the ep, google an image, this is extremely literal.) The main point there is that the Enterprise crew is utterly baffled by what they can’t even see as a distinction between the races, while the two species are locked in a bitter war. This allows discussion because while it’s clearly about cism, the audience also can’t tell which (if any) character is the hero. Lol, now I want to watch the ep again.

[@GeorgeEugeneBarrett]

False. Progressive storytelling isn’t the same as woke. Wokeism is self-righteousness incarnate. The woke preach and beat their audience over the head with an agenda. Progressive storytelling like classic Trek simply wanted their audience to think. NuTrek tells you how to think. Woke TV uses diversity as a virtue signal. They place it above the story itself. Classic Trek used diversity but didn’t feel the need to congratulate themselves for it. Those that can’t or refuse to differentiate between the two eras of Trek messaging are just being intellectually lazy.

[@patsk8872]

No one said ST wasn't liberal & progressive. There's a huge difference between that (which most people are fine with including me) and the modern plague of "woke." And comparing this amazing episode of DS9, as well as so many others in Trek such as Rejoined, The Outcast and more, against the crap being pushed as Star Trek nowadays is the greatest way to demonstrate the difference. Because all of the aforementioned stories had the goal of presenting a narrative to make you THINK, to appeal to both your intellect and your heart, to present things tastefully, more or less accurately and most importantly to present them without contempt for the audience. Whereas modern day "woke" stories inflict their message on you without being thoughtful, without presenting any other side or perspective, without allowing reasonable discussion or conversation or any dissent from The Message, and without respecting the audience.

[@jawbone78]

That's a whole lot of words just to say "I don't want gays in my Star Trek".

[@ThomasReeves-s7u]

I think one reviewer I read indicated they are just reflecting what progressivism is now and in the past they reflected what progressivism was then. So original Trek is fairly progressive on race, but maybe a bit "color-blind" and sexist by later standards of progressivism. In the 1990s, going by memory, progressive was very much about tolerance and empathy to the point some progressive shows (Like Northern Exposure, which I love and I am conservative) tried to avoid judging even the bigoted characters. At the time I think I disliked that kind of progressivism because it seemed to enable bad behavior or not say much. But I did like that it meant it was tolerant of even me and my reactionary religious self. Hence DS9, unlike TNG, didn't have an "all religion is stupid" episode. "New Trek" came in an age when progressivism has lost a bit of faith in the value of toleration and non-judgmental discussion. Worries about "False equivalency" and "The Paradox of Tolerance" have a good deal more buzz on the Left than they did in the 1990s. So whereas in the 1990s a progressive show might be a bit patronizing to a conservative I think now it's often going to be more hostile.

[@kirishima638]

It’s interesting how the culture of racism is perpetuated by the people who aren’t racist.

[@ericstarkey551]

Nog is the news boy,

[@Renegade2786]

11:08 - 11:14 And folks of today complaining about characters being race swapped. I think Gerry Anderson's show *Supercar* was going to have black characters in there, but they race swap them to whyte to cater to the Southern audience.

[@toddprit]

There was only ONE CGI shot in the ENTIRE run of DS9 and that is the very last shot of the very last episode, every other special effect in the show is practical.

[@dkocuj]

Not true. This is true only about model of DS9, that only in last episode it was CGI. However, many effects in later season of DS9 are CGI, not practical. Only model of station was no CGI until last shot.

[@dargron7614]

Not sure what you are referring to. Every time Odo shapeshifts, it's a CGI shot.

[@toddprit]

@@dkocuj where are you getting this information and what effects then are CGI? Because it's been widely said that only that last shot was CGI and everything else was practical so if that's not true where are you getting that info? Do you have some interview saying this? Some article showing this? Or are you just speculating without any actual evidence? I'm fine with being wrong but from everything that's been said over the years it's been stated over and over that that last shot was the only CGI shot in the show.

[@johnheale6000]

I wanna say there were more issues with Star trek Voyager than DS9, with a female captain, a lot of suits on the set for a while.

[@dargron7614]

Sisko had a bit of a buffer by being only a Commander. It was easier for the suits to accept him if he was a lower rank, and he was well ingrained and accepted by the time they promoted him to the rank of Captain. It probably also helped that DS9 was viewed as a spin-off rather than a flagship show, unlike Voyager which had the added expectation of filling the gap left by Next Gen.

[@Kameleon676]

*Vibrato

[@carlazaz1690]

Will we see Benny again?

[@notsyzagts7967]

No, this is his only appearance.

[@dkocuj]

@@notsyzagts7967 Better not spoil anything so I only say that this statement about his appearance is not true.

[@shauncraigparkinson8165]

2 Stella eps

[@empirejeff]

They we so small.

[@SB0780]

I hate it how they changed all the 50's music from the original airing and DVD release for streaming. The music isn't as good.

[@sarcasticstartrek7719]

"Benny Hill" does exist in the ST universe as a person - it is *possible* DS9 is actually just a script written by a Scifi Writer. It doesn't 100% rule it out that the entire show of Star Trek is in the mind of someone from the 50s.

[@silikon2]

The Motion Picture novelisation veered close to this. There’s a preface by both the “real” Kirk and the writer… Gene Roddenberry. They basically state that TOS is a wild dramatization of real events. “Kirk” himself agreed to do this on the condition he got to verify the accuracy of the novel.

[@notsyzagts7967]

What is it with fans attaching multiverse junk to franchises? Is there some desperate need to have a show "actually" be an illusion/creation of an outside source? Why can't a universe within a show be its own thing; is there something wrong with simplicity? Thank goodness these external creation ideas aren't canon.

[@wrorchestra1]

Do you mean Benny Russell?

[@sharpeslass5452]

​@@wrorchestra1I certainly hope so. Benny HILL has no place in Star Trek!! (Or on television at all, imho.)

[@silikon2]

@@notsyzagts7967 Meta spoiler follows, if you haven’t seen the show beware: xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx spoiler warning Behr wanted to end the series with it being revealed that DS9 was indeed written by a real life Benny Russell but was overruled. This was why I made the oblique reference to The Motion Picture novelisation doing something similar. That book was literally written by Roddenberry, so in canon, the original series at least is considered fiction, albeit loosely based on “real” events. Xxxxxxxxx.

[@tofersiefken]

Yep, Police brutality goes hand in hand with racism. It did in the era when this episode was set, it did during the BLM & George Floyd uprisings, and it is still an issue to this very day.

[@advienne6316]

Will you react to Alien romulus?

[@jeffd.6498]

I saw it. There were no Romulans in it. ☹️

[@silikon2]

“Far Beyond the Stars” is difficult to criticize at all without sounding cist. But “The Exorcist” movie of all things did drastically more to integrate fiction then any heavy handed thing like this. Prior to The Exorcist, movies were segregated as discussed here. There were literally white movies and black movies. The Exorcist was 100% targeted at whites but the religious themes led to it being an enormous hit to black audiences. It wasn’t even released initially in black neighbourhoods.

[@jawbone78]

If your criticism isn't racist, just say it.

[@AdityaChandra-d9s]

Why don't you watch more Indian movies?

[@rockeyrocket1224]

kiss me bro