STARCRAFT 1 vs STARCRAFT 2 - Dark (Zerg) vs TY (Terran)

[@AnonJuggerbot]

"3 spider mines costs 75 minerals AND you get this cool bike!" Yep, that basically sums up BW

[@UltraAlex2000]

When i opened the video i never expected Dark to be in a tournament like this. This man is such a popular final boss that the organizers made a collab and decided to add him in. At this rate, if Starcraft 3 ever comes out, i expect him to be in the campaign in one way or another.

[@AZ3rgling]

Starcraft 3 will never exist

[@phillgizmo8934]

@@AZ3rgling If you knew the future, you'd say "S3 never existed"

[@OGCovertKaos]

You dont beat the campaign until you beat dark in a 1v1 🤣🤣🤣 the real final boss lol

[@CelestialDesign]

He is the only consistantly fun player to watch play zerg... so id hope he's there for everything.

[@enriquegarciacota3914]

He already is in SC2. There’s a Protoss building dedicated to him

[@Haxses.]

This mod is so much fun to watch. Thanks for casting it!

[@leaf241]

Hell yeah, I hope we get to see more!

[@jonsolo32]

Lore wise… the cloaking tech was retrofitted from the decommissioned Wraiths to the Banshees.

[@danteprokrustes4795]

Debuff

[@badshootykat5574]

I miss the Terran Goliath

[@Azsunes]

Broodwar was the first game I played online. When I was in Elementary school almost every boy in my class had it. I remember my first tournament with friends. I couldn't believe that they were worse than easy bots. I rushed the player in the top opposite corner and took the top half of the map. I had battlecruisers and flew down to find the two southern players building mass cannons. Trying to fit as many cannons on each pylon as possible. The highest tech they had was Dragoons. I remember blasting the single pylons with Yamato and destroying everything without losing a BC. It was a 1v1v1v1 tournament thing between 12 of us, played on lan at my friends house. His house had 5 computers all in different rooms all connected by Ethernet, which blew my mind at the time. Never seen someone with a network at home before going to his house.

[@motor56]

5 pcs in the 90's damm boi

[@jasonlynch282]

I remember lan parties. Each friend would come over with their tower and monitor or tv screen for a monitor.

[@luisg8873]

You had it all that day

[@finnereacts]

Nah, Sir. Playing this replay on mute is a crime I love your commentary in this game. It is actually so insightful, SC educational, and contextual. It does not only tell me what is happening, but it also tells why things are happening.

[@duszan2]

Brenda: "I waited 14 years for revenge, 14 years...!"

[@Gronnthabomb]

I love him just going insane while commenting lol. Favorite SC2 commenter

[@duszan2]

@@Gronnthabomb yeah, and f... anyone hating Winter for having a sense of humor and for being goofy

[@FranciscoGarcia-jp1hp]

I love that Hellbats are viable (if a bit weak) in at least one matchup. Nice match, thank you Winter.

[@jonsolo32]

Ps dark. Hydras are tier one tech. Use them.

[@AtillaTheFun1337]

I think Broodwar Queen’s ensnare ability is probably more notable here than in Broodwar itself, thanks to army clumping. Quite comparable to Fungal Growth. Trades damage for a small attack speed debuff, not to mention a faster flying caster.

[@jasonlynch282]

Not to mention a longer duration as well and reveals cloaked units.

[@enriquegarciacota3914]

@@jasonlynch282fungal also reveals cloaked units, for its entire 3 seconds of duration :)

[@AtillaTheFun1337]

@@jasonlynch282 fungal reveals cloaked units too

[@qverk1427]

i LOVE watching this. ive played so much sc1 by myself, with siblings, at lan parties. my dad got us into it when we were kids and we played so much. its so refreshing and cool to watch the clash of sc's

[@MrGeorgeFlorcus]

If you thought the SC2 Ultralisk was bad, wait until you see the SC1 Ultralisk!

[@AlphaSqad45]

just a big pile of minerals that could have been spent elsewhere xD looks good on paper but in practise its so bad its laughable

[@100thMkey]

My fav Part was when IIIIIIIIIIIIIIII attacked IIIIIIIIIIIII but IIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIII was able to counter IIIIIIIIIIIIII's overextension!

[@MachinedFace88ttv]

Agent 42 plays starcraft agaisnt himself for the 4893982349th time.

[@sirtalkalotdoolittle]

Today is my turn to say that these casts do make my day a bit better. Thank you for the hard work. You make it look easy.

[@FlokiTech]

The mod team removed siege upgrade from BW tanks for obvious reasons, but apparently so many people complained about it being removed that they added it back into the game ruining the balance...

[@luishurtado2170]

at this point this can become the main sc2 game with 3 variants... same as AoE 4. Rebalancing VALUES, NOT DESIGN for the new "variants" and all should be good no?

[@mitang7508]

@@luishurtado2170 yes

[@billcynic1815]

Trying to look at balance and see how much of the four SC2 wins was due to SC2 superiority vs other issues. For the ZB, Dark is obviously more comfortable with Z2 In both games where Dark was Brood War, which significantly changes things. In both games Dark's ZB lack of anti-air crushed him. But Brood War zerg has an incredibly obvious mid-game anti-air unit he never used: scourge. It may be that early spire is just necessary in T2 v ZB to counter air play. Or maybe he needed a stronger hydra investment and more back home. So players have to choose between mutaling or hydra lurker. So I don't think this necessarily means ZB is UP, just that Dark didn't fully account for what the lack of Z2 queens means for changing his strategy. Now for TB. For the first game, a roach-ravager all-in from Dark is always hard to hold, so it's hard to see what that means for balance. The spider mines make it much more risky to move them across though; maybe if TY had more aggressively zoned out the zergling triggers and harrassed on the path. Or maybe if he'd walled off on the low ground. I know it departs from BW, but allowing add-ons to be built on either side might be something for the modders to consider; would have made factory walls more viable. Second game, again, Dark's multitasking is hard to account for. TB doesn't seem to have a good counter to nydus. But the valkyrie is potentially a very good counter to locusts in-flight, just have to be more aggressive before they land. Lack of sensor towers also hurts in spotting them though. Maybe wraith valk squads to hunt down spotter overseers and zerglings? And some BCs to counter queens? Wraiths are mediocre against ground, but they're still decent against targets that can't shoot up. I am curious how valks would fare against corruptors. Vipers may be an issue though. I do want to know what happens if an irradiated unit enters a nydus worm.

[@FlokiTech]

The answer to every BW race is pretty much to use their op spellcasters. ZvT turtle up, make spores and lots scourge since they are cheap as hell and are good against not only liberators but you also use them to counter drops. And with the air covered you can now make lurkers and the most broken spell ever dark swarm to keep the ground army from killing you. Could still be hard for the Zerg but I feel this is the way you have to do it. TvZ they need to remove sige upgrade again. But what he could have done in the first game was to pull the boys a lot earlier and only siege 1-2 tanks on the highground and keep the lowground unsieged. and in the game agianst swarm host the answer is yet again BW spellcasters! Mass tanks with some goliath support and mass the ever living shit out of the science vessels and irradiate everything the zerg has for massive value.

[@martin-dw]

Valkyries would eat with fries the corruptors

[@ark7395]

A little late but iirc when this mod came out, I think they removed some BW units like the Scourges just to bring in some balance

[@armoredjoey]

I love getting to watch this every morning while I'm trying to wake up.

[@geedeebeejay]

I want to point out that in SC1 on the N64, you could select 18 units at once not 12 lmao

[@nolalb824]

Dude, so glad brood war won. Maybe siege tanks do need the siege upgrade from the start

[@alexr.138]

Spoilers!

[@shadowpriest2574]

Brood War won once :). It lost 4/5 matches.

[@Appletank8]

I think Mech isn't really the answer against Sc2 Zerg, at least not initially. You can't let them just drone all day, just like in SC2Z matches, you need to force them to waste resources on defense, and Factory tech takes a bit longer. Maybe if TY massed enough Vultures and mines to contain Zerg, he'd had a chance, but he didn't. In which case, Bio has the better mobility to keep up with Zerg's mobility, and also he really should've gotten Science Vessels earlier. T2 may be able to fight toe to toe with Z2 on just Bio Medivac, but T1 relies more on spells for their pushing power.

[@killator3421]

@@Appletank8didnt he try that on game one and it backfired?

[@jasonlynch282]

Brood war terran can't push out bio fast enough with no fusion reactors.

[@reishiki8682]

Artosis : *sees the name Fighting Spirit* -makes incomprehensible angry Terran noises-

[@colinfraser7150]

I watched this so much when I was detoxicing from booze.It's like comfort food watching through one bluurred eye. I still love the voice.you're top....7 youtube commentators in youtube history. (FYI; for me it was TB at one so 7 is damn good).

[@binkibonko69]

glad ur off booze colin keep it up 💪💪💪💪💪

[@genesises]

@@binkibonko69 i think what he meant is that he was hung over, not that he quit drinking

[@47StormShadow]

Dark didn't understand that rushing up tech wasn't the answer

[@alanevans5353]

I definitely think Firebats are the move for SC1 Terran in the early game. maybe super early hydras are viable to deal with reapers, but it might be too expensive to get to.

[@chrisa.4384]

These maps are so miserable for sc1 terran. Siege tanks were so much better when they had open fields so they could long wall concave. But in all of these insanely tight corridors, they are basically just more hazardous to themselves against zerg. hell, people could probably just build dropper lords and plop them on tanks to troll win the game. Artosis would really love seeing that

[@juny9445]

Just play better

[@falblinger7015]

please keep SC2 Evo coming!

[@zacharyhutchison4006]

If I place my phone 10ft away I can almost remember StarCraft 64

[@pinaxon]

Im only here for the Queen's impressions.. never gets old

[@paulgazeley4059]

Here we go again. On the train watching Winter, happy days!

[@samihawasli7408]

The “I waited 14 years” bit with Brenda was awesome.

[@djryken]

Finally a sc1 terran match thats not just tanks and vultures

[@junhaozhang6915]

love pros playing! High skill cap is what makes this interesting to watch! The lower elo plays just doesn’t tickle the spot

[@jakesandman8409]

That lore friendly surround at 12 minutes

[@vitorh3568]

I wish I could have seen those SC1Terran air units with upgraded attack.

[@_Wai_Wai_]

15:00 going 7 bases, plus one macro hatch in main. WTF was Dark thinking?

[@holz_name]

Actually quite right thinking. SC1 have no egg inject. Getting mass hatches for production is standard in SC1. Rushing Hive is also standard. But then Dark don't get Defilers, the single most important unit for Zerg.

[@Appletank8]

More hatches makes sense for BW Z, but maybe not going across half the map with them, considering the much larger territory he has to defend. Maybe 6 hatches on 3 - 4 bases, with Spores or Hydras in the mineral line. Instead of, uh, absolutely nothing.

[@JoeMustache321]

need MOAR of this

[@Commander120]

"I only played Big Game Hunters" hits hard

[@viper440]

love the sc1 v sc2 content winter! Also love that sc1 music

[@josepriospanti5432]

Esta bueno.. no sabía que había este modo de juego. Sigue subiendo más videos de 2 vs 2. Saludos desde PERÚ

[@Boots43096]

this mod is the most fun I've had with this game in a while

[@ZC.Andrew]

I feel like comparing Sc2 units to Brood War units is like comparing vehicles. The newer units have more features and are safer, but the old ones are better built.

[@maurimat]

OMG I remember the gold old days of SC2 and yes definitely remember MVP one of the best Terran players...

[@phillgizmo8934]

It's very noticeable that SC1 builds are not balanced for 8 workers start and lack defense early on. The mod makers should consider a 5 workers start toggle option for more interesting early games between SC1 and SC2 units and eco.

[@L-uu7fq]

Please bring more TY content. He's the og Oliveira, 'I'm just a normal man'

[@RyanPassek]

I would love to see brood war maps, they are kinda wild lol.

[@Dax3s]

I'd really like to see some changes to make it more balanced this is really cool to watch and i'd like to see it retain popularity

[@SamGray]

Just out of curiosity, I dug out my original Starcraft CD, and yep, it's version 1.0. So I guess I get to join the nostalgia crowd.

[@alanevans5353]

what was that thing you put up on the screen at 41 minutes? I've never seen that before.

[@brocktimusprime8549]

Does anyone remember how cool that green CD of Star Craft Brood War was?

[@manopeace9175]

I like the new overlay setup duder. Peace.

[@manopeace9175]

Appreciate your channel in general. You could be anywhere, doing anything. And here you are, being rad as hell. Mad respect m'dude.

[@betlogboy3]

Dark's Player card is truly final boss worthy.

[@shabeasanravi632]

This one sparks joy!

[@jg1093]

You will cast more of this content. You will like casting this content, I will like this content, you will become the epitome of SC1 in SC2, you were born for this.

[@andydennismontoyahernandez2412]

I'm starting to think that this is the future of Starcraft. The next game should have the BW ZTP, SC2 ZTP and SC3 ZTP and the option to play mixed and monogen matches

[@DarkWestYT24]

Apesar de que amo ambos juegos, creo que los VS son algo injustos para Broodwar, tomando en cuenta que SC2 tiene las mejoras económicas en todo sentido, tienen el Cronobust, la inyección de larva y las mulas. Espero que pronto encuentren el mejor balance

[@Nazz-b7p]

I've tried to download SC Evo, where do you do it?

[@jinku77]

You don't download it. Just go to customs/melee. Then, select a map and there is an option that says "create with mod", select the mod "SC Evo Complete"

[@Star188Ash]

there was a map called starbound that was more sc1 like with sc1vsc2 stuffs many many years ago

[@malachite9071]

Blasted “Terran One” in discord last night, never forget where you came from!!

[@JSwiftBlade]

22:22 was that am scv repairing a marine? or attacking it?

[@QJrocks]

A bit late, but it's repairing the Wraith above the marine

[@hexaquras9374]

I'd be more surprised if TY doesn't have the worker lead 30:49

[@HolyBunny]

When's the SC 2 and 1 tournament?

[@AnyOneGamingTV]

Hey! Anyone knows where can I find replays of this mode?

[@heliobilaccarneiro5977]

How i take bonus for units? It's a mod? Or vanilla game make this?

[@MrCreed145]

Terran makes liberator. "GG" BTW, all we ever played in brood wars was fastest map possible variations.

[@fernandocanon7828]

I would pay to see Clem vs any top tier Broodwar Z or P

[@BrianBrian-w2n]

So much fun, than you ❄️☃️

[@davidstud3952]

need to see Defilers and Guardians!

[@madjackgamingandfitness498]

I notice SC1 terran really shines with infantry and players do much better when taking the initiative, instead of doing vulture tank 2 base camp.

[@jinku77]

How do you people think they can balance the BW Zerg vs Sc2 Terran? The reaper is impossible to deal with in the early game. I think the only solution is to make zerlings speed only cost minerals and make it very fast to finish. What do you think?

[@Cawfeesomething]

Hydras and/or sunken colonies

[@demacry]

idk how he'll do it but can we get the Dark mirror match with SC2 vs BW

[@general_armstrong]

controversial take : the only balanced game mode is mirror matchup or teamgame where both sides have all races

[@MyriadColorsCM]

TY winning by a classic bw cheese is so poetic.

[@normanharrison8215]

The last one is so dope

[@THAC0MANIC]

flash vs maru but the twist is there playing the other game, so maru is SC1 terran, Flash is SC2 Terran.

[@philipwalker3868]

The wow comment gets a wow , I didn't do star craft but dota 2 took a lot of time

[@prismaticbeetle3194]

me: long have I waited

[@attractivegd9531]

Winter we need 4K res, would be awesome :p

[@cathulionetharn5139]

Thank You Om nom nom

[@gamertyper6476]

im so confused - I had no clue you could use brood war units in SC2 - how is this achieved?

[@kentrunenordli2189]

Sc evo mode on melee on sc2 😊

[@prismaticbeetle3194]

a lot of games lost because the SC1 race pickers refuse to use turrets early game because they still think they are playing SC2 races

[@blooddumpster3427]

why are the shuttles healing?

[@blooddumpster3427]

i got the 1 and 2 races mixed up -_-

[@doctorstainy]

Roaches just laughing as they get tickled by wraiths , then walks into 50 mineral worth of spidermines and get obliterated . Broodwar has such different type of units, it creates very good games.

[@jasonlynch282]

I feel like Devourers would destroy just about everything sc2 air has. XD

[@hunterclark5345]

Game 2- one spire with scourge would have made all the difference .

[@unnamedlegeon]

Does Dark know Nydus Canals in SC1? 🤔

[@marionicolais3024]

Said it in another game, but STIM TO WIN!!!

[@christopherscott6383]

Love this 😀 let's go

[@screes620]

SC1 vs SC2 with Dark? Yes please. PLEASE get Clem to play BW Terran bio.

[@rocketrelm1125]

I've yet to, in any of these matches, see a Plague drop or even really the use of Defilers. Even in matches like against Terran Bio where it's a literal I-Win button, and I'm starting to get triggered. It's great content and show, but I want to see the game deciding plagues at least once.

[@kdragon-_-698]

I don’t get why the tin man who’s playing Zerg said I don’t have a heart. WHAT ABOUT THE HEART OF THE SWARM!!!

[@Ole_Rasmussen]

It felt in that game like sc2 terran is just stronger than sc1 zerg with hellbats vs no banelings

[@holz_name]

this is so frustrating to watch... First the SC1 Terra. Build Science Vessels you can kill SC2 Zerg easy. Then the SC1 Zerg, why no Defilers and no Spire for Scourge. SC1 Zerg can easy win, build the cheap Scourge as anti air and Defiler with Dark Swarm to neutralize all Terra units. So frustrating!

[@unclenchasbestos]

There's never a bigger twist than Dark losing the series

[@markmuller7962]

Cartooned has quite a bit of pixels :D

[@dogfoot1874]

Terran roasting but what about the counter to Dark Swarm? No other unit besides the bat can combat the bat under the DS

[@forthgoever]

I DON'T WANT TO SAY TOO MUCH , BUT I PREDICTED ALL THIS WOULD HAPPEN IN 2022-2023

[@CatzyCatzy]

Well done.

[@forthgoever]

@@CatzyCatzy TY

[@CatzyCatzy]

@@forthgoever here's a question...will the mod devs make the Reaver imba? If so...how?

[@forthgoever]

@@CatzyCatzy THE REAVER IS GOING TO BE NATURALLY KIND OF IMBA IN 'SC:EVO' AS A DIRECT PORT , SOME BALANCE CONSIDERATIONS WILL LIKELY BE NECESSARY DUE TO THE EXTRA-CLUMPING OF UNITS IN SC2 ENGINE . THINGS LIKE COST OF THE UNIT , TIME TO FIRE , DAMAGE OUTPUT CAN BE LOOKED INTO AND CHANGED ACCORDINGLY , WHILE THE OVERALL FUNCTION AND ROLE OF THE UNIT CAN BE INTEGRATED SEAMLESSLY . I HOPE THAT ANSWERS SOME OF YOUR QUESTION .

[@cyan8237]

yall gotta get out the hydras when you're on the classic zerg.

[@guilhermeportugal6389]

They aren't using the powerhouses that the casters are in Broodwar!

[@commandertex4389]

This was really cool but maybe they should buff the BW workers a little more, maybe 13 percent acceleration instead of 10 cause with the exception of a unscouted 1 base all in they got stomped. people are still getting used to the mod and ty has been in gsl and asl but dark is the best player in the world according to dark so maybe this isn't the best test case but they still feel underpowered. I bet if you let BW Zerg max out with the f2 key they would win but they just have nothing at thee beginning, likewise BW Terran gets fucked up by roach/ravager1

[@Ocean_magic_om]

we need ladder we need this to be official