Neeb vs Serral PvZ - Quarterfinals - WCS Summer 2019

[@sintanan469]

Game 1: 1:48 Game 2: 20:36 Game 3: 33:06 Game 4: 1:02:45

[@mustardmagee7342]

Sin tanan god bless

[@LazerQip]

"It's your fault, Tod, how do you sleep at night?" "I don't."

[@toffeelatte6042]

"Serral what are you going to tech into?" "Yes"

[@borysco]

31:38 run scarlett! ruuuun

[@ullabritta8435]

borysco don’t you mean serral? Btw forest gump is a really good movie

[@jrome1771]

I changed my mind about how I think Life will dominate the game right now. His game centered around constant aggression. Unlike Serral who centers around try to win early, if it doesn't work, defend the midgame and rush to hive tech to do late game. Late game Zerg is almost unbeatable right now, specially by toss.

[@bananian]

Life zerg is so exciting. I miss it tbh.

[@hiroki_rinn]

Whenever I watch a PvZ, once Zerg gets to infestors, it's basically over for 'toss. The only exception is if 'toss is good with Distruptors.

[@ryanaegis3544]

Infestors are the Zerg carriers. Except that infestors' interceptors cost energy instead of minerals. And infestors get cloak. And infestors have the ability to abduct. And infestors are smaller and sleeker and move twice as fast. Hmmm. Yeah, good job with the balance Blizzard. Perhaps they are trying to emphasize the fact that the Protoss Golden Armada got defeated by Zerg in lore, so late game Zerg should defeat late game Toss as well.

[@seanlewis3381]

Can you charge a Tesla with a shield battery?

[@nizahe2731]

Yes.

[@mattr791]

Probably

[@DemonCore618]

Shield batteries are most useful when your purple or blue shield is fully depleted. If you're missing a lot of health as well, use Phoenix kit.

[@ChunkZeah]

It's called a supercharger.

[@doom_heit]

Only model X

[@mattr791]

Lol skytoss in 2019

[@slycooperscane]

Another great series with excellent casting. One recommendation though is could you add a end card at the end for a random amount of time. The reasoning is when you are watching on KZbin and one player is on match point and the video only has 15 minutes left you can already see who is going to win without even watching the match.

[@allmhuran]

Neeb could have GG'd at minute 50 in the video. From that point forward all he could do - all I've ever seen any P do in this situation - was throw away resources on attempted runbys which were never going to work, and hope that the zerg did something amazingly stupid. Not just a "bad engagement", some kind of absolute blunder, like sending the infestors over to the P side of the map. That's what he's waiting for, and it's not going to happen. I don't know how to prevent infestors from just being an absolute win button. Feedback got nerfed for reasons I don't understand, but OK, whatever, not feedback. Maybe nerf infestor hitpoints. They keep all their utility, and you have to commit through the Z army to get at them, but if you succeed then they go down super fast and, if Z has 2/3rds of their army supply in that one unit, they lose as they should. It might make Z diversify their army supply a bit more and not just bank thousands and thousands of mana.

[@vo1umin]

First of all, the take 2 supply and that is a joke. Second, Neural Parasite have insane 9 range (14!!! when casted), and it lasts for 11 seconds. There's simply no T or P army composition that can beat that. Make them 3 supply and nerf neural, that's all. People complain about infested terrans, but they're not that big issue without so OP neural. I watch GSL, WCS, HSC etc. and in the last few months there was simply not even one game that Zerg lost when going Infestors. That's ridiculous.

[@Skorpion1991]

@@vo1umin exacly, at the normal league like platinum/diamond/master most of zergs play like a horses; dont know what micro is, just A-move whole army so there are equal chance and they cry that protos is op, but if zerg player is better - infestors are just op in good hands, with using neural and fungal while being invisible

[@eldiagrama]

allmhuran neural has such a long range

[@jamesdi7261]

Disruptors

[@vo1umin]

@@jamesdi7261 We've seen Protoss try this many times. You can make a coffee, smoke a joint and then neural before nova hits.

[@moaiadaljamal4422]

If a match goes late game, with Serral in charge, you gotta automatically give him the win

[@menpower1]

The best zerg player in the world and the current world champion wins a series. Zerg is obviously OP.

[@mhfcraft9969]

menpower1 Well everyone is OP depends on perception

[@DMSG1981]

@@mhfcraft9969 Didn't you hear menpower1 screaming "sarcasm" between the lines?

[@victorngrt8800]

I've never seen a protoss win against a Zerg once the Zerg got broodlords.

[@MIGKTYPS]

I've seen it once. :( Serral is God.

[@matrixxART]

watch game 2

[@abyssalzei552]

Well of course not. Think of brood lords and Infestors as the compensation for making the Zerg a punching bag the entire early game. Srsly if you can't shut down a Zerg in the early game then honey git gut

[@skychaos87]

Dude, broodlords are fine, its the infestors that render protoss units useless.

[@victorngrt8800]

@@matrixxART Yes, you're right, the only way to win is to do a timing push at the exact moment the Zerg do his Broodlord. So he only have few, and don't have his "real t3"

[@麥馬校草]

That timing from neeb in g2 is so sharp and crisp right before blords are out it gives me shivers. how did he know? map hacks confirmed?

[@alwaysturnonaircon]

Yea was a great execution. Probably thousands of hours playing had his instincts telling him if he prolongs the game. Broodlords are coming

[@Skorpion1991]

dude he cannot map hack because he is observed.. there is a peoples and cameras set on his screen... so stop that bullshit and understand that some peoples has a brain and use them, your head is probably only for covering the neck to not let rain fall inside and , belive or not, but some peoples use it also for thinking :)

[@fredstercooney5497]

Skorpion1991 r/wooosh

[@mattr791]

@@Skorpion1991 r/woosh

[@mattr791]

He scouted the timing of the hive with halluc phoenix so knew exactally what was going on set up a +2 timing

[@mfranco25881]

That Game 3. Blizzard, infestor is broke . 10,000 difference in resources lost?! There is no counter. Not to mention they just finally fixed the infested Terran ignores armor bug... smh

[@Shattered-Realm]

winfestors strike again.

[@KM-us1nc]

Pretty sure not having carriers is the answer.

[@GreenestGanja2]

@@KM-us1nc Cus fungel doesn't work on ground units right... lol..

[@imp3r1alx]

The Golden Armada is a joke now

[@gofeelgreat]

Just wait for the next patch. Interceptors spawn time is 9 secs instead of 11..... ;) lmao

[@fredstercooney5497]

gofeelgreat yea but insane nerf to zealots and warp prism, also scouting for Zerg is so much better in new patch + overall buff to Terran basically

[@imp3r1alx]

@@gofeelgreat Doubt going to do much.. the problem lies at the carrier it self... a "Carrier" is supposed to attack from a "relative" safe point.. and those interceptors they are really under spec right now.. a few hits and they are dead

[@schierlingsbecher7778]

@@imp3r1alx ​ Fredstercooney goofeelgreat was ironic guys

[@fredstercooney5497]

Descartes von Aquin oh oof... lmfao when could I not take a joke this is new

[@TheNerdForAllSeasons]

Late game Zerg is an actual problem.

[@francisbryan2]

Im beginning to realize, maybe blizzard got it wrong. Maybe zerg is much stronger race than terran and protoss regardless of the players skill.

[@pursutruth]

Right, because Serral's skill level is clearly no better than anybody else.....?

[@Skorpion1991]

@@pursutruth of course, but most pro players are zerg, final match was zvz (serral vs reynor) it is not incidental case that is so many zerg in top, they just do winfestors and win ;D

[@cillajendar4378]

Also Dark win GSL this season

[@pursutruth]

Just because you only watch the finals doesn't make zerg OP. You can't look at 2 or 3 players, or JUST the finals, and decide the balance is off because of them. You guys want to look at the most recent gsl and wcs? Great. Let's look at the actual numbers from the earlier rounds. There's a 1 in 3 chance that any particular finals will be a mirror matchup; if you decide balance is off because of that, you clearly don't understand probability (or again, that Serral is actually highly skilled). If you really want to prove a race is OP, they should appear in numbers significantly higher than 33% in every round of the big tournaments. The following is the number of zerg players there were in each round. WCS Summer: Group Stage 1: 26/64 = 40.6% Group Stage 2: 13/32 = 40.6% Group Stage 3: 10/32 = 31.3% Ro24: 9/24 = 37.5% Ro16: 8/16 = 50% (only round that's much higher imo) Ro8: 3/8 = 37.5% Ro4: 2/4 = 50% (Serral and Reynor) GSL Code S Season 2: Ro32: 11/32 = 34.4% Ro16: 4/16 = 25% Ro8: 2/8 = 25% Ro4: 1/4 = 25% GSL Code S Season 3: Ro32: 8/32 = 25% Ro16 (so far): 3/14 = 21.4% Where did Blizzard "get it wrong"? The only thing you might convince me of is that foreign zergs seem to be playing somewhat better relative to Korean zergs.

[@ldgarnett777]

Binyamin Friedman zergs total win rates might not be abnormally high but I think their win rates in games that reach late game are much higher.

[@obliviouslich1722]

Late game Protoss is a joke. Carriers are worthless now, Tempest just don't have punch, and Voidrays are squish. Remember the day where Skytoss was the scarier thing in the game. I play zerg, but i can see why the late game protoss is dying.

[@marchelandersen6839]

Super nice with the eye tracking

[@Happymars24]

*That moment when the "up next" video spoils the ending....*

[@aaronburnett1131]

Infestors....... can cost a fraction of a carrier or tempest and hard counter them both.

[@shiinondogewalker2809]

just feedback them

[@ryanaegis3544]

Anybody notice that Toss has two more units than Terran and Zerg have? This is actually a disadvantage for Toss. Toss has to spend more supply building less flexible units, meaning their army composition is far more brittle and has to be much more exact in order to counter, let alone survive. Perhaps another unit or two needs to be created for Zerg, and arguably so for Terran, to spread the abilities around more evenly. Infestors are a great example of a broken unit, with four possible attack options, speed, cloaking, great shields, and low supply cost. Perhaps take away fungal and increase the supply cost, or decrease the number of infested units, or make infested units cost minerals or gas instead of just energy. Oh, and abducting a unit should definitely cost supply, so an Infestor should first not be able to abduct a unit unless the Zerg has enough supply for it, and any unit that is infested should count towards a Zerg's supply, so a Zerg cannot build more units until they increase their supply.

[@heyrea]

Razorbacks? SC1 Queens? MUAHAHAHAH

[@McCallaFilms]

Wow, Carriers are absolutely useless against Zerg these days. I really wonder why Neeb kept on pushing for that big Carrier-Count, as it was clearly not working because of those infesters!

[@manaba0087]

i know this is dumb but i just had to ask: is neeb and neebs gaming had any relative?

[@giacomolomi8331]

31:40 is it Scarlett running? 🤔

[@jl7487]

I don't understand the end of game2, why did Neeb win?

[@WheeloveTravelUNDEADRuNE]

Winfestors,........

[@mikaelm5367]

He dumped infested Terrans when the fight was won already....

[@麥馬校草]

Disgusting

[@abyssalzei552]

Lol then give them an alternative to Infestors

[@skychaos87]

@@abyssalzei552 They don't need alternative, they are already very strong if not the best in late game. This is why all protoss players had NO CHOICE but to do immortal all ins. What they need is early game buff so they can deal with immortals all in. The new patch is already addressing that. However, they nerfed protoss early game to achieve that. This means protoss has an even game against zerg in early game and literally zero chance in late game. Either they should nerf zerg late game since they have good early game now, or they should buff protoss late game against zerg.

[@ryanaegis3544]

Abducting a unit should definitely cost supply, so an Infestor should first not be able to abduct a unit unless the Zerg has enough supply for it, and any unit that is infested should count towards a Zerg's supply, so a Zerg cannot build more units until they increase their supply. I am also a big fan of interceptors costing energy instead of minerals. Either that or infested units should cost minerals.

[@pursutruth]

Do you mean neural?

[@ryanaegis3544]

Yes, my apologies. Thank you for the correction.

[@scrungodolphin2869]

This game is so broken right now. When is Blizzard going to nerf Serral? He just counters everything, they need to nerf his move speed and vision at the very least.

[@andrasfauszt1693]

Give him a 18' 4:3 40Hz monitor so he can see less

[@juanwick2726]

God nerfed his height already.

[@vmangman6477]

Blizzard needs to do something about this. Late game Zerg is so busted and honestly very boring and unsatisfying to watch

[@fettarmehaarmilch4028]

Like zerg late game much more than protoss. ( most boring race)

[@Mark-hn1vu]

The amount of people salting Zerg is great.

[@Nerak516]

The infestors seems so strong. How do you even counter that?

[@RandomDude-bo1lg]

Maybe colossus?

[@chottabeamm]

These players going up to 700ish apm Me: crying 48 apm on average

[@kondzio2062]

apm isn't that important I have an average apm of about 300 and I'm in diamond league

[@Qichar]

Sometimes these players tap out before I think they should... Game 1, I feel like the player who tapped out had a better position than he thought he did when he typed GG.

[@michalkajan5135]

No, he wasn´t, it is a chess thing. Yes, Protoss would defend good against what Zerg have at the moment, but Zerg would remax quicklier than Protoss and meantime Zerg would expand to other bases so in 2-3 minutes later would Zerg have 3 more bases, max army and lots of infestor and broodlord and Protoss maybe 6-7 tempests however to fight this composition you would need sky and not gate composition and with 2 or 3 stargates you would have no chance in next big clash.

[@Qichar]

@@michalkajan5135 I agree he had a losing position. No argument there. I just mean, his position was better than he guessed it was from his incomplete information. I think maybe there was a still a tiny chance of victory. I know everyone at this level is a pro but I've seen games turn around really quickly from just one bad engagement. In that way it's not quite like chess; the chance of a blunder by your opponent is quite a bit higher in a real-time strategy game vs. a timed turn base one (in my opinion).

[@nickmcnickable]

another comment, but am i the only one who stopped playing as prottoss because ravagers hard counter forcefields n always lost to a flood of units n no way to defend againts them, than might actually hold n lose to winfester BL late game anyway

[@Falorik]

Protoss gameplay is focused WAY too much on high templars. It almost doesnt matter what else is around. If you have no high templars = lose. If storms dont hit = Protoss cant attack, if storms do hit = Zerg cant attack. This needs to be changed, it is very obvious bad game design.

[@kokjonglai762]

LOL was that scarlett at 31:42 ?

[@jankroutil9842]

Yes. ;)

[@RandolphTheWhite1]

18:16 - don't do it neeb; I've got the high ground.

[@johnktejik9847]

How the heck can you beat serral? He scouts everything. Creep everywhere. He can make so many units so fast. He’s constantly attacking in all fronts. He can steal carriers.

[@xilunjiang2558]

why does Serral look like a Zombie?

[@SuperG0alie]

Thoughts on how Neeb could have taken the 2nd last game? I knew what was coming... those infestors are OP at this point

[@bananafrenzyTV]

Carrier > Disruptor > Archon I feel like the Carriers are your core unit. The Archons frontline a bit, but mainly kill corruptors. The Disruptors Kill Infestors when they try to Neural. good comp or no?

[@cbanczak]

@@bananafrenzyTV great comp, but very hard to control. We saw stats do this against serral, using disruptors to blow up infestors.

[@shavais33]

"The Gray Council of drones"! So gratifying to know that Babylon 5 yet remains in the general public nerd consciousness. How about Daleks, are they still well known? (I want to make sure my great great grand kids know all about Daleks.) Who can answer this: "What has yellow skin and writes?" (Ridiculous Give-away Hint: "Holy hole of a donut, _______ !") I know I'm in my crowd when they couldn't pick Kim Kardashian or Katie Perry out of a line up, but would have no trouble at all with the 4th Doctor, and that while only being able to see their scarves.

[@notbrandon2888]

Protoss never wins it all. It’s hilarious how nobody cares about them. Everyone wants ZvT and blizzard makes them the better races

[@Claizen99]

Brandon Koontz wahhhhh

[@adityarajan592]

Stats beat serral in ASUS ROG

[@zen23ish]

Alright, I love watching Serral LMAO :D

[@legasius9358]

Welcome to the club

[@demifire2318]

The Aquiline Neeb will rise again

[@DarthNihilusKorriban]

OH GOD WE ARE NOT ATTACKING UNIT!!!! xDDDDDDDDDD

[@Xgourouneitor]

Haven't been around in ages. How come the world champion is a foreigner?

[@Xgourouneitor]

@@diamondleaguedisaster were the Koreans playing?

[@Xgourouneitor]

@@peterwestenthaler7954 what?

[@Xgourouneitor]

@@diamondleaguedisaster What about the old monsters? Innovation, MC, Life, MarineKing, Flash, PartinG etc? Did they stop playing?

[@peterwestenthaler7954]

@@Xgourouneitor PartinG ain't a monster. MC ain't playing, Life went to jail, Flash plays sc1 and Inno still going strong, except for dropping out in the Ro32 recently.

[@miniwaern]

24:14 What is he joking about? I cant make it out, lol!?

[@matrixxART]

He was joking that Recall needs to be buffed. In reality, it needs a longer cooldown.

[@max917]

Epic matches between these 2.

[@SuperG0alie]

erm..... a warp prism doesnt siege

[@keyboardrambo]

The European commentator sounds just like Nandor from What we do in the shadows

[@michaelschwarz3175]

Who can win against mass infestor+bruteloards late? 😂😂😂

[@JD-hm2wo]

easy, just knock the player out, since hes already sitting next to you

[@Saliiraan]

broodlord

[@thomasbummer4361]

@@JD-hm2wo i would looooove to see that just one time lol

[@mathieuchoquette5606]

Dont make skytoss

[@michaelschwarz3175]

@@mathieuchoquette5606 make winfestors 😂

[@Zeuts85]

Serral is amazing, but late game PvZ doesn't feel balanced at all. I don't really agree with the argument "why did you let them get 30 infestors in the first place?" because it's not like the other races have some strong inherent advantage over zerg in the early and mid game. Two players of equally high skill will generally go to late game, and then zerg wins with the inherent race advantage. I'm not saying it's easy for zerg, but it feels a little too inevitable to be fair.

[@Lermoth]

30 infestors is 3000 minerals and 4500 gas. If you let the zerg get an economic lead he will have more stuff. If you are on equal economy your opponent can't afford that many infestors. That's what is meant.

[@zayrex5931]

@@Lermoth Just my opinion as a noob SC2 player, but after watching a bunch of these finals, Zerg seem way stronger at forcing that resource imbalance with how they can massacre work units with baneling drops. The other races seem to have a harder time inflicting that economic damage.

[@Lermoth]

@@zayrex5931 terran marine drops is a lot easier and as effective as bane drops. Protoss has warp prisms with dts or oracles for the same thing. Both faster than overlords.

[@zayrex5931]

@@Lermoth I see, but every baneling drop I've watched seems so devastating compared to any other combat unit. Then again it IS Serral and he's insanely good.

[@Lermoth]

@@zayrex5931 yeah, Serral is amazing. When mortals do it, it mostly looks sad

[@KCal25]

Neeb should’ve stayed patient and made the first of Neeb

[@Zeuts85]

Did you watch game 3?? Close enough.

[@pingkai]

Did anybody see Protoss mass carrier winning lately?

[@transparent91]

Zerg is (was when this was filmed at least) so imbalanced in terms of late-game. Nothing can beat mass inferstors. Broken meta for sure.

[@dragonslayr6493]

transparent91 mate this vid was posted 10 months ago. Not only that but, the game was probably 1 month before that.😂 im replying to you months later just cause u have a small brain

[@croec]

Sweet whine of tosstards is what keeps me going.

[@cowfishblobfish]

Bring the mothership core back

[@The_Scouts_Code]

painful to watch.

[@bayanmunkhbatmunkh1811]

Well caster with round tongue sounds f*cking awful. He doesn't even finish his words like 2 y/o

[@kakapoleon]

@@bayanmunkhbatmunkh1811 if it's only the audio part that bothers you, just mute it and play some music that you like, it's quite enjoyable!

[@iamthegreatest861]

The duel of the Archnerds xd

[@1872T701206]

唉唷威 看星際卻沒有雙狗解說只聽英文好不習慣阿 SERRAL這年是真正統治星際2 打誰誰死 打星際是很累的 我每次都信心滿滿熱情十足的上天梯玩 但每次都打個2~3場就累到不想動了

[@remyprimeon7003]

ta gueule

[@nickmcnickable]

Pvz is broken in late game

[@callumbolitho6095]

What did he say at 24.12?

[@saus17]

Personal Top 5 Favorite Players 1. Taeja 2012-2014 2. Neeb (American Savior) 3. LiquidHero 2012-2014 4. Startale Squirtle 2012 5. MMA > MvP > MKP

[@langanderson8311]

Morpheus vs Neo, ok Sengoku vs Vegeta? wut uhhhhh 19:15

[@largehamburger]

Goku's full name is Son Goku

[@wabashstudio]

How to win a game as zerg: 1. make infestors 2. win.

[@ZC.Andrew]

It's a bit sad that a fleet of ten expensive, powerful warships is running in fear of this tier 2 wnfestor army.... I think we need a bit of a lategame adjustment here.

[@markotasevski6763]

zerg is ruining the game haha

[@Ggma8989]

Serral makes zerg OP

[@BeKindToBirds]

He did it playing terran too

[@brettjaniec3933]

I wouldn’t like them talking about me, like that... You’d think they way they talk about him, Serral, that they want to get into bed with him! No THANK YOU! Sorry... Serral! I think I’m in pants for the RIGHT guy! Which isn’t YOU!

[@Snowball33333]

love to see lowbob neeb get crushed by the night king!

[@MrCarlos0435]

get real, it was not serral it was the winfestors

[@dannymachin5301]

Neeb looks like Dendy

[@rev9115]

second vid serral 9 min = me 13 min...plus he harass

[@neverworld8815]

Мда.. адепт это самый неудачный юнит для хараса

[@2Sor2Fig]

Leto... I mean Serral, the God Emperor. Zerg needs sand-worms, now, it's the only way forward.

[@MrkBO8]

Paul Atreidis is the emperor, Leto was his father

[@2Sor2Fig]

@@MrkBO8 Lies!

[@MrkBO8]

@@2Sor2Fig Heresy!

[@ryanaegis3544]

Great example of how weak storms acutally are. The announcers freak out every time a Templar shows up, but even they couldn't hide their surprise when two sequential storms blanketed a mass of hydras and the hydras did not try to avoid it, kept pushing through it, and drove the Protoss back. Watching storms vs. armored units is even more of a joke. How many storms does it actually take to kill things? One storm cannot even reliably kill the workers at a mineral line.

[@thomasbishop3494]

Yeah I would agree with you that storm needs a bit of a buff. So long as it’s never near Brood War levels of busted. Two of those could kill battlecruisers.

[@jasonfreddy6372]

storm destroys marines, its a joke

[@darkphoenix00001]

storm is the most OP spell in the game. straight up area damage. but bronze league protoss aren't happy unless it can kill every unit it hits instantly.

[@srenderplay1711]

"I love you serral, f*%# me" :v

[@patrickb1303]

Simulated Zerg so dope.

[@ruidasilvamartins]

Yoan the badest and most angry guy in e-sport ! His stream is very very disgusting !

[@sinisadabic5371]

I'm watching these SC2 matches since the beginings and have no favourite race and a big fan of SC game, but I really think that zerg is overpowered

[@Qichar]

My takeaway from this series is that Winfestors are really overpowered. Yay. Nothing we didn't all already know.

[@xxjeshuaxx5696]

wow

[@craigkoeneful]

Neeb wins, this is bullshit

[@MrRousina]

Kuningas

[@blanknblank1]

I don't like these casters' play by play casting. They can really learn something from tastosis. In the mean time I will mute the sound.

[@deangelowilliamsbeas]

Especially how whenever one of the casters counters his point, the round guy just says something snarky and tries changing the topic really quickly.

[@hoangleminh7060]

Zerg too.imba with infes can control mass unit. Unbalance game.

[@Davsan1]

Why does zerg look awful

[@guillermocasavilca7876]

serras nuub player...zergling rush in minute 1 wow its tooo interesting

[@blanamaxima]

Poor Protoss, 1a did not work.